Alison in KY Posted April 28, 2009 Share Posted April 28, 2009 If you want to combine all ages for history/science and go all the way through high school is TOG really the only option? Are you not still having to read multiple books/areas within TOG to fit it to your different ages (if so does it feel like you are doing more than one program, within a greater program)? IF this is the case, then is there really a benefit to a prog. like TOG vs prog.s like Sonlight, HOD, MFW, and WP where there is some age breaks for the different programs? Also, a couple people have given me the impression that TOG is better for older students, middle and high school level, and that it takes a while to figure out how to use it (I know that their website takes me awhile to figure it out :)). In your opinion, is this true? Thank you for any help. Alison in KY Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrsrevmeg Posted April 28, 2009 Share Posted April 28, 2009 TOG really isn't science, just history/Bible/lit/art. Yes, you are using different books for different age groups. That is so each child is learning on their level. Would you really be able to teach a 1st grader with the same book as a 12th grader? The difference in using TOG compared to something else is that you are only having to prepare for one time period/subject at a time rather than having one child in ancient history, one in Civil War era, and one in WW2. I know there are a lot of people who talk about it being better for the older crowd, but my younger ones are loving it! They have picture books and short, easy chapter books. There are a lot of hands on options for the youngers, too. I wish I had known about TOG when my oldest was younger so he could have done it all the way through school. The younger years are building blocks for the older years. By the time my youngest son gets to high school, he will have a strong foundation of all time periods to build on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alison in KY Posted April 28, 2009 Author Share Posted April 28, 2009 Thanks Kelli, I understand that you couldn't be teaching the same book to an older and a much younger, but I think my brain was going haywire when I typed my question. What I haven't been able to see is if TOG has book packages that go along with each level. I'm having a hard time navigating the site. Is the easiest way to figure it out, just to order their sample and pay the small shipping fee? Do you basically hand over your older kids assignments to be done independently, but do read alouds for your younger ones? Is there a way that your older kids can use the TM or something like that to just do it totally independently? Alison Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annabel Lee Posted April 28, 2009 Share Posted April 28, 2009 Alison, I've had a hard time figuring out the book package thing w/ TOG too. They have their Bookshelf portion of the site, but it seems like there should be a "necessary books for Year 1" package for ea. age level. Anyone know if there is something like that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melissa in CA Posted April 28, 2009 Share Posted April 28, 2009 If you want to combine all ages for history/science and go all the way through high school is TOG really the only option? No TOG is not the only option. MFW does this as well. Also, TOG does not contain, or schedule, science. It is only History, Worldview, Art (crafts, art appreciation), Literature, Geography, Writing, plus a smattering of vocab, timeline work, etc. In the older grades you'll find Philosophy and Government included as well. Are you not still having to read multiple books/areas within TOG to fit it to your different ages (if so does it feel like you are doing more than one program, within a greater program)? I'm not sure what you're asking here. TOG contains four grade level schedules in each year plan. In each of these grade levels you will find books suited for that grade level. The Dialectic and Rhetoric levels, I believe, are to be completed independently. Meaning your child schedules out his history on a separate weekly planner and he completes all of his reading assignments independent of you. The younger grade levels, LG and UG, are best suited for the parent/teacher to read aloud many of the books to the child. This, of course, varies from child to child. My son began this last year in UG and has read all his history independently. He was on the upper side of the UG level though. About mid-year I moved him to D level books. He is able to read all of these as well, except for the Philosophy book...this one we read together. ...is there really a benefit to a prog. like TOG vs prog.s like Sonlight, HOD, MFW, and WP where there is some age breaks for the different programs? The difference is that you can have all your children, regardless of age, learning about the same time period. It keeps you all on the same page so-to-speak. Yet, each child has books scheduled for them at their level. This is definitely a different approach than SL, but not so different than MFW which does offer a multi-age/grade approach. Also, a couple people have given me the impression that TOG is better for older students, middle and high school level, and that it takes a while to figure out how to use it (I know that their website takes me awhile to figure it out :)). In your opinion, is this true? No, actually I don't think this is true. I love the books that TOG schedules for the LG and UG child. Great colorful interesting books! I believe why people say this is because the majority of the Student Activity Pages are geared toward the UG-RH levels...progressing in difficulty and length with each level. Most of the Teacher's Notes are geared toward the D and RH levels as well, when your child is most likely to be completing his work independently. In the lower levels, I believe, it is assumed you will be reading the history with your child. In that case the TNs are usually not needed. I think that when people purchase a TOG year plan for a Lower Grammar student, and see all the great TNs and SAPs for the older child, and not so much for the younger, they feel TOG is better for the older child. TOG has more to do for the older child, because the older child should be doing more, but that does not mean in any way that what they schedule for the younger child is not very, very good. I think that if one knows they want to use TOG at some point in time, they would be better off purchasing and using it while their child is young. Once you own all four year plans, you have all...all...of your elementary, jr. high, and high school history planned and scheduled out for you. Also, I never once experienced "TOG fog." I think if one attempts to have their child do each and every single thing that TOG offers...then you may experience foggy thinking due to the fact that doing it all is just NOT possible to attempt and remain sane. TOG is a buffet of choices, but all you really need to do is what is listed on the Primary Resources page. That's the meat and potatoes of the program...the rest is the gravy; good and tasty...but not needed for overall health. ;) . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stansclan89 Posted April 28, 2009 Share Posted April 28, 2009 Truthquest has history for all levels on the same subject at the same time (and is only $25-$35). It doesn't have anything but history (commentary and book lists) and writing assignment suggestions--But I don't like to have all our curriculum for the year based on one program. What if we don't like it? For science we are all doing Biology, but completely different programs. Definitely doesn't line up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melissa in CA Posted April 28, 2009 Share Posted April 28, 2009 Alison, I've had a hard time figuring out the book package thing w/ TOG too. They have their Bookshelf portion of the site, but it seems like there should be a "necessary books for Year 1" package for ea. age level. Anyone know if there is something like that? Yikes! I just went to the new Bookshelf Central site and see that they have changed it considerably! It's pretty and all that, but is set up to make it even more difficult to see the "whole package." :confused: You used to to be able to see all the books needed at one time for each grade level or year plan and even print it out. Now you'll have to piecemeal it together. Ick. I don't like this at all. :glare: All I can tell you is you'll want to definitely purchase the Multi-Unit books (MU) as these are used for longer periods and often for more than one year plan. As for the rest...I would get my year plan first and then decide what books you'll want to actually purchase. How frustrating. The Bookshelf is no longer owned by TOG so we can't blame them...but I really, really don't like this new set-up at all. :tongue_smilie: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melissa in CA Posted April 28, 2009 Share Posted April 28, 2009 Truthquest has history for all levels on the same subject at the same time (and is only $25-$35). It doesn't have anything but history (commentary and book lists) and writing assignment suggestions--But I don't like to have all our curriculum for the year based on one program. What if we don't like it? For science we are all doing Biology, but completely different programs. Definitely doesn't line up. Truthquest is great if you like a long list of books and are able to choose what books you want to use, and then schedule them out yourself. I tried it and personally hated it. I like having a schedule telling me: Read pages 25-35 of this book, this week, etc. Having a long list of books per time period was not helpful for me. There were too many choices and I could not decide what book to have my son read and how many of them (books) per time period. :confused: Too much scheduling and decision making for me. I'll pay for the convenience of someone else's hard work thankyouverymuch. :D I do agree though that I don't like all of my curriculum tied up in one program. I like that TOG is history related and does not try and schedule my Science, Math, or Grammar...I would not like that. :tongue_smilie: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stansclan89 Posted April 28, 2009 Share Posted April 28, 2009 Truthquest is great if you like a long list of books and are able to choose what books you want to use, and then schedule them out yourself. I tried it and personally hated it. I like having a schedule telling me: Read pages 25-35 of this book, this week, etc. Having a long list of books per time period was not helpful for me. There were too many choices and I could not decide what book to have my son read and how many of them (books) per time period. :confused: Too much scheduling and decision making for me. I'll pay for the convenience of someone else's hard work thankyouverymuch. :D I like the flexibility this gives me. I don't feel bound by the schedule they give me since there isn't one :). We will go through history sequentially, but can stay in one spot and study in depth if we want and not feel behind. I don't exactly schedule ahead. We just take it as it comes--go get the books from the library that I can find and read what looks interesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siloam Posted April 28, 2009 Share Posted April 28, 2009 Thanks Kelli, I understand that you couldn't be teaching the same book to an older and a much younger, but I think my brain was going haywire when I typed my question. What I haven't been able to see is if TOG has book packages that go along with each level. I'm having a hard time navigating the site. Is the easiest way to figure it out, just to order their sample and pay the small shipping fee? Do you basically hand over your older kids assignments to be done independently, but do read alouds for your younger ones? Is there a way that your older kids can use the TM or something like that to just do it totally independently? Alison Alison, No you are not going to get a whole package from TOG with the books. The book shelf ships from another location and they are separate companies. Thus I would recomend you order TOG (if you chose it) then once you have the guide you can sit down and buy books. It is MUCH easier IMO when you have it in hand. You can see where books overlap. For example in year 1 they recommend a craft book that covers ancient history and a craft book that covers Greece. You don't really need both, so in seeing the activities you can tell which one you would use. The only other think I could think of to recommend is ask them if they still have the mail in order form. Not that you can use it to place an order anymore, but it was the BEST layout of the books I have seen other than what is in the program itself. If you are trying to figure out your yearly costs, I do find TOG more expensive than both WP and SL...but I buy a lot of books, way more than I would have with either of the other programs. I am using classic and the books choices are a little different. For example in classic it gives you a choice to buy a spine to cover the presidents or individual books. I buy the individual books, which costs me more. Heather Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alison in KY Posted April 28, 2009 Author Share Posted April 28, 2009 No TOG is not the only option. MFW does this as well. Also, TOG does not contain, or schedule, science. It is only History, Worldview, Art (crafts, art appreciation), Literature, Geography, Writing, plus a smattering of vocab, timeline work, etc. In the older grades you'll find Philosophy and Government included as well. I'm not sure what you're asking here. TOG contains four grade level schedules in each year plan. In each of these grade levels you will find books suited for that grade level. The Dialectic and Rhetoric levels, I believe, are to be completed independently. Meaning your child schedules out his history on a separate weekly planner and he completes all of his reading assignments independent of you. The younger grade levels, LG and UG, are best suited for the parent/teacher to read aloud many of the books to the child. This, of course, varies from child to child. My son began this last year in UG and has read all his history independently. He was on the upper side of the UG level though. About mid-year I moved him to D level books. He is able to read all of these as well, except for the Philosophy book...this one we read together. The difference is that you can have all your children, regardless of age, learning about the same time period. It keeps you all on the same page so-to-speak. Yet, each child has books scheduled for them at their level. This is definitely a different approach than SL, but not so different than MFW which does offer a multi-age/grade approach. No, actually I don't think this is true. I love the books that TOG schedules for the LG and UG child. Great colorful interesting books! I believe why people say this is because the majority of the Student Activity Pages are geared toward the UG-RH levels...progressing in difficulty and length with each level. Most of the Teacher's Notes are geared toward the D and RH levels as well, when your child is most likely to be completing his work independently. In the lower levels, I believe, it is assumed you will be reading the history with your child. In that case the TNs are usually not needed. I think that when people purchase a TOG year plan for a Lower Grammar student, and see all the great TNs and SAPs for the older child, and not so much for the younger, they feel TOG is better for the older child. TOG has more to do for the older child, because the older child should be doing more, but that does not mean in any way that what they schedule for the younger child is not very, very good. I think that if one knows they want to use TOG at some point in time, they would be better off purchasing and using it while their child is young. Once you own all four year plans, you have all...all...of your elementary, jr. high, and high school history planned and scheduled out for you. Also, I never once experienced "TOG fog." I think if one attempts to have their child do each and every single thing that TOG offers...then you may experience foggy thinking due to the fact that doing it all is just NOT possible to attempt and remain sane. TOG is a buffet of choices, but all you really need to do is what is listed on the Primary Resources page. That's the meat and potatoes of the program...the rest is the gravy; good and tasty...but not needed for overall health. ;) . Thank you, this was most helpful:001_smile: Thanks to everyone, now I feel like I have three great choices for our schooling...HOD, MFW, and TOG. I'm sticking with HOD for now, but they do not have a high school plan. IF I have a bad year with HOD, I want a back-up. OH, so many good choices!! Alison Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alison in KY Posted April 29, 2009 Author Share Posted April 29, 2009 I'm not sure how many more levels she will be writing, she's just finished an ancients program which goes into middle school. Alison Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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