Tell me that using Classical Writing Aesop B is going to be great

[paulcindy]

I have CW Aesop B. I read through it cover to cover yesterday. I have the following questions.

 

1. The Core book is for both CW A and B, correct? Assuming this, I am reading and following the instructions in the second half of the Core book. This is shown in the instruction in the IG guide, correct?

With this said, it seems to me that the book "assumes" your child knows how to outline. This is what my daughter, who is 10, would be doing. How come there are no examples of outlining? Or did I miss that somewhere in the books?

 

2. Is CW method, as far as outlining, similar to the IEW method of KWO???

 

 

3. Now here comes a dumb question. They have the actual story in the SW, then the model. When it comes time to do the writing assignment, it is from the actual full story? Or the Model?

 

 

4. If the writing assignment comes from the full story, the ones at the end of the book are quite long. Is it still poosible to KWO every sentence in such a long story???

 

 

5. And really, how do you know for sure what they wrote is correct??? I am not a writer and need hand holding. So tell me I can do this program, and I am going to love it.

 

 

I want to "love" it, because I like the idea of it. I am juts afraid that I am not smart enough to teach it, and know that what my daughter wrote is correct. KWIM??

 

Is there an active YAHOO group for CW users???

 

Thanks!!

[partyof5]

I am only 3 weeks into CW here, but I have some thoughts, as I am very familiar with IEW as well.

 

Regarding outlining, I have not seen explicit instructions on outlining (yet) in CW, but since in our house we are pros at KWO with IEW, we use that, and I recommend you do too if it already works. It's a wonderful system.

 

That being said, I wouldn't encourage line by line KWO with longer models. IEW teaches a transition point with story sequence and eventually research and in these cases, you must read longer sections and pull key words. Otherwise line by line will be cumbersome and unrealistic as the child matures in this skill.

 

There is a yahoo group for CW as well as very helpful message boards on their website. One portion of the message board is for posting student work, and the moderators/authors respond...you might try this if you are unsure at first.

 

I know this doesn't answer all your questions, but it's a start. We are loving CW and using both Aesop and Homer. I am keeping some of our IEW skills in use and moving along quite nicely.

[paulcindy]

Hi there

 

Well, I am only familar with IEW somewhat, as my girls took a short IEW co-op class, so that is where I had heard about KWO.

 

So, do you think she should KWO a paragraph maybe then? It really doesn't tell you how many KW to choose if you use the longer stories.

 

The only yahoo group I found was a just a news site, not an actual forum.

 

But I will check out the group on the website.

 

Thanks!!

[paulcindy]

:lurk5:

[partyof5]

CW yahoo group:

 

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ClassicalWriting/

 

CW message board on their site:

 

http://lene.proboards15.com/index.cgi

 

As for kwo, I teach a co-op class in this still... At first, we do line by line keyword of a single paragraph on a single topic, choosing only 3 important words per sentence. From this outline, the students write their own paragraph without referencing the original model.

 

After much practice, we move to other activities, like completing a story sequence chart about a fable. This requires that they find details about characters, setting, plot, etc. without going line by line. I love this transition because it introduces the notion of thinking about the text as a whole rather than sentence by sentence. Finally, we go to longer non-fiction and apply the story sequence way of thinking...working on identifying a few key words for an entire paragraph.

 

Now that we have moved to CW, these are the kinds of skills I am having the transfer from their IEW work to CW.

[partyof5]

And one more thing...:D

 

You mentioned how unsure you were about how to evaluate student writing. I think that as you work through CW with your child, you will be so familiar with the models you will be able to assess whether or not their writing accurately reflects the essence of the model. Essentially, you are first looking for an adequate basic summary. Probably, your understanding of what to expect in your child will grow along with the program because you will be so familiar with the models too!

 

I also recommend trying to do the work alongside your child, (without their knowledge perhaps?) and see what you identify to be the most essential elements to include in your paraphrase. You can probably judge this pretty well in your own writing and it just may provide a bit of a baseline of what elements you can expect your child to include as well.

 

I'm just rambling here, but I hope this helps a little, and I would definitely spend some time in the other forums for more detailed responses from people with actual experience with CW! :lol:

[siloam]

Hello!

 

Well my first question has to be, why not start with Aesop A?

 

B will also assume your child has mastered several of the parts of speech, and starts with the longer models because it assumes the child has mastered the work with the shorter. It will also assume the child is used to dictionary work.

 

1. The Core book is for both CW A and B, correct? Assuming this, I am reading and following the instructions in the second half of the Core book. This is shown in the instruction in the IG guide, correct?

With this said, it seems to me that the book "assumes" your child knows how to outline. This is what my daughter, who is 10, would be doing. How come there are no examples of outlining? Or did I miss that somewhere in the books?

 

Not exactly. The core book is organized by day, then for each day it lists different skill levels. Each level is done to mastery, so even through you are not doing level A, your child will need to do the work of level A. You really need to read the whole core book.

 

2. Is CW method, as far as outlining, similar to the IEW method of KWO???

 

CW doesn't set a specific method of outlining. In Homer it is a little more specific wanting full sentences, but that is for outlining multi-scene narratives. For Aesop key words are fine, and is all we did.

 

3. Now here comes a dumb question. They have the actual story in the SW, then the model. When it comes time to do the writing assignment, it is from the actual full story? Or the Model?

 

They re-write the whole story. Now if the child feels creative they are welcome to change the details and setting as long as they don't change the moral of the story. For example instead of having a rabbit and a turtle having a race you can have a bear and a mouse have an eating contest.

 

 

4. If the writing assignment comes from the full story, the ones at the end of the book are quite long. Is it still poosible to KWO every sentence in such a long story???

 

Yes, we did. Now I am not totally familiar with traditional key word methods, but I still have my dd do a sub headings, so that we can demonstrate paragraphs. If I don't have her do something to designate paragraphs in her outline I get a paper that has only one long paragraph. ;) But yes she did fine with a key word outline of even the really long models. I suppose I can scan one for you. Just know ahead of time my dd's handwriting is, not pretty. :001_huh:

 

5. And really, how do you know for sure what they wrote is correct??? I am not a writer and need hand holding. So tell me I can do this program, and I am going to love it.

 

There is a place on their forums to post them if you like. But really as long as they keep the moral of the story in tact you are fine. If they drop or change anything that changes the moral, then you need to have them correct it.

I want to "love" it, because I like the idea of it. I am juts afraid that I am not smart enough to teach it, and know that what my daughter wrote is correct. KWIM??

 

Is there an active YAHOO group for CW users???

 

Thanks!!

 

Yes there is a yahoo group too, though it is not very active.

 

I got to take the girls to swim class right now, but I will be back later and will try to find one of her outlines (Where did they go?) to scan and also give you the story she wrote to go with. (I know where those are.)

 

Heather

 

[paulcindy]

Heather

 

That would be great if you scan one. And you were very helpful at answering my questions.

 

I guess I am a little nervous, because I don't want to tell her the writing is correct, and move on, then all along she was doing it all wrong, KWIM??

LOL...................

 

Thank you again.

[siloam]

Heather

 

That would be great if you scan one. And you were very helpful at answering my questions.

 

I guess I am a little nervous, because I don't want to tell her the writing is correct, and move on, then all along she was doing it all wrong, KWIM??

LOL...................

 

Thank you again.

 

Cindy,

 

I haven't forgotten, things just got really crazy this weekend. I will get to it, but it might be next weekend.

 

Heather