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Courtney_Ostaff

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Posts posted by Courtney_Ostaff

    • Logic: Art of Argument & Discovery of Deduction at CLRC
    • Math: Saxon 8/7
    • Science:
      • Fall: Earth Science 
        • CPO Science Earth Science Middle School 
        • TOPS 23 Rocks and Minerals 
      • Spring: ES Astronomy 
    • History: Middle Ages for the Logic Stage at WTMA
    • Geography: Evan Moor Daily Geography 6
    • Spelling: Vocab from Classical Roots
    • Grammar: Grammar for WTM (1/2 speed)
    • Writing: WWS 2 at WTMA
    • Foreign Language:
      • Latin:  some of the Oxford Latin Course Part 1 at CLRC
      • Spanish: Homeschool Spanish Academy?? 
    • Art & Music
      • HFA Grade 6 – Medieval and Renaissance Art and Music 
      • I'm thinking hard about investing in Atelier 
    • Literature 400-1600: I'm working on this list now
    • PE: swim team
    • Like 2
  1. My baby will be 5 next week, so we're starting then:

    • phonics & handwriting: finish memorizing the sounds of the alphabet, then 100 EZ Lessons and OPGTR
    • Math: probably RightStart A, with some Saxon K thrown in for reinforcement
    • Science & Social Studies (required in my state): MP's Kindergarten Supplemental Science & Enrichment read aloud set & BFSU
    • Lit: read-alouds, lots of mythology
    • Foreign Language: my mother thinks it's only fair to sign this child up for Spanish if Big Sis is getting it too, so...maybe Homeschool Spanish Academy??
    • Extras: swim lessons, maybe a Kindermusik class, a substantial art table, Girl Scouts Daisy, 4-H Cloverbuds, the occasional Ivy Kids kit
    • Like 1
  2. I would not be in the least bit surprised if we cut out the extras, the memorization, the logic, and some of the supplemented history--but I like to plan for more than we get done, in case it does all get done.

    • Math: RightStart E, with BA 3D then as far as we get in 4 (daily)
    • Latin: Ecce Romani I (daily)
    • Grammar: maybe Hake again, but I'm looking forward to SWB's new one (MWF)
    • Spelling: Spelling Workout D (MWF) [we skip a lesson if she passes a pre-test with 100%]
    • Composition: CAP W&R III M/W/F, EIW 4 (only the writing) T/R, then some of LToW in the spring
    • Literature: (MWF) -- Heidi (MP guide), Collodi's Pinnochio, HG Wells Time Machine, War of the Worlds, Blue Fairy Book (MP guide), The Secret Garden, Wind in the Willows (MP Guide), Beatrix Potter, MP Grammar Stage Poetry.
    • Memorization: poem memorization, probably with IEW's poetry guide (daily)
    • Logic: Logic Countdown, Logic Liftoff, Orbiting With Logic (daily)
    • History Memorization: US Constitution Preamble, Gettysburg Address, US Constitutional Amendments, US Presidents 1850-present, major US Wars 1850-present (daily)
    • Handwriting: Grace Song's Brush Pen Lettering (M/W/F) and Angela Lord's Creative Form Drawing (T/R)
    • Science: Pandia Press's RSO Astronomy Level 2 (12 weeks), Exploration Education (12 weeks), and Nitty Gritty Earth Science (12 weeks)
    • History: 5 day loop with SOTW 4 (3 days), with AG (questions, maps, some suggested books) supplemented with little bits & pieces from Teacher Created Materials, Inc.'s out of print Thematic Units (Industrial Revolution, Transcontinental Railroad, The Depression, Native Americans, WWI, WWII, Westward Ho, Immigration, Gold Rush, African Americans), looped with Kristin in VA's History of US schedule (1 day -- just read and oral narration), and WV history (1 day -- just read and oral narration).
    • Geography: MP's US States & Capitols (MWF)
    • Extras: 9 day loop of MCT Poetry (2 days), Harmony Fine Arts (3 days), Computer Projects, hand sewing/embroidery, health, and Lynne Seddon's Exploring Nature with Children.
    • G3 Scratch class in the autumn
    • swim gym MWF
    • piano lessons
    • Girl Scouts
    • possibly 4-H if we get a homeschool club going
  3. My DD, at her current age, does much better with a plan, as do I. She needs to make written lists and plans and schedules.  We're both "give me a list and let me be" type people. She enjoys diagramming like other children enjoy jigsaw puzzles. She enjoys comparing languages, and had my mother in stitches the other day by making jokes in Latin. She writes stories constantly -- she needs to create entire worlds in her mind. I am trying to support her strengths.

     

    Here are my thoughts this morning:

    If the four main parts of grammar-stage English language arts are spelling, composition, grammar, and reading, then the progression of those topics would be:

    1) spelling graduating to etymology (programs such as English from the Roots Up) and then more languages 

    2) composition would graduate to

    a) technical writing (a rhetoric progression)

    b) creative (short stories, novels, etc)

    3) literature analysis is a field all its own

    4) grammar would graduate into linguistics

     

    So then, I think, my long-range goals for her, so that she can demonstrate mastery in those four areas are:

    1) Continue to study Latin, possibly pick up Greek, and maybe pick up a modern. Demonstrate mastery in one or more language, possibly through some sort of national exam. 

    2) Composition: 

    a) Continue and complete a rhetoric progression. Demonstrate mastery, possibly through an AP English Language and Composition course and exam.

    b) Continue creative writing and demonstrate mastery by being published (not self-published).

    c) Begin and complete a research project in an area of interest with a substantial formal paper as part of the product. 

    3) Grammar: continue prescriptive grammar, and then successfully take a linguistics class in high school.

    4) Continue to read widely and deeply. Demonstrate mastery through something like the SAT II literature exam. Possibly take Am. Lit. and Brit. Lit. at a college.

     

    Intermediate goals would then be:

    1) Continue to study Latin, and possibly pick up Greek.  

    2) Composition: 

    a) Continue a rhetoric progression

    b) Continue creative writing (and maybe get published in an age-appropriate place)

    3) Grammar: continue prescriptive grammar

    4) Continue to read widely and deeply, with required reading around the history cycle and for the study of literature analysis. "Fun" reading at her discretion. When emotionally ready, tackle more advanced themes.

    • Like 5
  4. Hi! I'm looking for suggestions. My DD is a rising 4th grader, but asynchronous in language arts (not mathematics). She enjoys classical education Well-Trained Mind style for its language-centered focus. Looking forward to middle school and then high school, I'm wondering how I customize a middle/high school pathway that would showcase her language arts talents?

     

    If she was talented in mathematics, it would be easier, I think -- algebra earlier, and then follow some variation on the typical sequence. But I'm having trouble thinking about something similar for language arts.  It's very clear that a student has completed Calculus, for example, but how does one show an equivalent level of accomplishment in the language arts? What goals am I aiming for here?

     

    I feel as though the destination is out of focus, and if I don't know at least what continent to paddle towards, we'll end up in the South Pacific Garbage Patch. :)

     

    MCT just doesn't speak to me, but I'll give it another look.  Suggestions? (cross-posted)

  5. I'm perplexed. Are you joking, or are you serious? I honestly don't even know how to respond... This is certainly enlightening....

     

    I'm not sure what you're responding to. Did my teachers try to drill our accents out us? Absolutely. Still happens. My husband finds it very disconcerting to hear my accent change when I'm tired or upset.

     

    ETA: If you have other concerns please feel free to contact me directly. I'm going to stop following this thread. Too busy.

  6. I'll take a stab at this, Courtney. Giving gifted average work teaches them 1) everything is easy, 2) I'm smarter than everyone else, and 3) I don't have to work hard to succeed. These are terrible lessons. This is why I ramp it up until the work is at a difficult level for my child. He needs to know struggle. 

     

    Socially, having known struggle, he can actually better relate to his peers even if he is working years ahead. 

     

     

    .

     

    Courtney, some kids just aren't average, and no wishing that they were will make them so.

     

    Ruth in NZ

     

    Well, right, there are kids who teach themselves to read, etc. But I thought we were talking about non-gifted kids.  

  7. Courtney, I understand you have a different POV and I won't try to change it. I just don't understand why you feel the need to be sarcastic about or talk down other's different choice in a different situation. As you admitted, you were not just asking out of curiosity. I don't know if it's a cultural thing or just our difference, but I really don't understand why you would only value something "innately better" but not so much the actual hard work and higher achievements as a result. (Actually I'm the one who argued such effort and parental involvement are precisely what made difference in result, and you disagreed. I never said Asian students are innately better at STEM. What do you mean by "for the parents who can afford it"? You mean Asian parents can afford more?) But then... I saw you criticizing others with lower standards, so...

     

    ETA: Ok, you insist you were not criticizing them so I take it back. But look, nobody said there is no value in being average or her way is superior. And saying that I'm sacrificing my son's social skills by doing advanced schoolwork with him seems far-fetched. The same thing can be said about homeschooling kids by PS parents and you don't want to hear it. Can we just not judge each other? Pursuing academic rigor doesn't necessarily come at the expense of social skills or happiness, and being relaxed or unschooling is not the best way for everyone. It really depends.

     

    I apologize if I came across as critical, I really do.  This is a tender subject for me. I really am just confused about the long-term goal here. I have personal experience with advanced coursework and social issues, and it's a long-standing issue for gifted children, especially later in middle school. I'm not trying to judge, and I apologize if I came across that way. I am really just befuddled.  I am aware that PS parents worry about social skills--I make social skills a priority in my own children, because I worry and judge myself on this issue.  

     

    Here's a story this week: I sent my daughter to math camp at the local private school this week, mainly for social skills practice.  First day, we walk in, and one of the other mothers (whose daughter announced on the last day of preschool that she wouldn't be coming back because she was going to a better school) asks the instructor what they're doing that day. Teacher says they're working on place value. Mother immediately turns to the daughter and goes, "X, you know that, don't you?!" Child goes, "I don't know."  Teacher says, "Well, here we do that in kindergarten."  I am so tired of this one upmanship, and parenting (and teaching!) as a competitive sport.   

     

    Funnily enough, like elmerRex, I think that in the long run, "A bright person with good discipline and work ethic may succeed where a genius person with no discipline and sloppy work ethic may fail." AND "I also see many of the genius people amount to nearly nothing."  I totally agree! But, I also see many with good discipline and work ethic (and geniuses with good discipline and work ethic) who flounder at work (and at home!) because they have poor social skills--and that's just unnecessary pain and suffering. 

     

    Prime example: See me floundering here on this thread with my poor social skills?  Here I am, trying to get a point across that I think we'd probably all agree on, and not doing a good job. Instead, I'm :banghead:  when I should be all:  :coolgleamA:

     

    We will try and reply to every ones comments.

    Courtney_Ostaff, on 29 Jul 2014 - 7:26 PM, said:snapback.png

    5th grade is 10/11 years old. So yes, it's advanced, if he's six. By definition. 

    I should be more careful with my vocabulary. My son is not gifted, but his math skills are ahead. We don't know if he counts as accelerated, because he was taught over the same amount of time that other kids would have, but he was taught him in a different way.

    I suspect that you have excellent math skills yourself, if you can teach problem solving without a curriculum.

    Well, yes, compared to the average US adult, both my sons parents do have excellent math skills, but really its just arithmetic. If you understand arithmetic and have a reference guide, then you should be able to teach it. It was not our ideal situation to teach without a specific curriculum, but it was a conscious choice made for our situation.

    a) I don't understand why you would begin math instruction as toddlers.  B) I'm curious as to what you would do if your child said, "No, I don't want to do this."

    a--I don't understand why you would NOT begin math instruction as toddlers, so I don't know quite how to phrase a best-response. It is not as though we are doing something completely unheard of either. Many (but of course not all) Preschoolers and Kindergartners who attend Montessori-inspired schools can do the same math that my son can do and at the same age...

    b--I don't know about all kids and all parents, but WE can not force OUR  child to learn X. This is why my son still can not read well at all, he said to his dad "Baba, I want to read like R." But when we tried to teach him, we didn't do as good of a job and he wasn't ready to learn to read (from an inexperienced teacher). It didn't take long to see that he wasn't sincere in his lessons and he wasn't cooperative so we asked him again if he wanted to read and he said "No, Mama and Baba, I don't like doing letters and words. I don't want to learn to read anymore." So we stopped reading lessons immediately. When he is 7, we will insist he learn to read more seriously, but we may get him a tutor for reading as English isn't our native language

     

     

    Why would you do this? What's the point? Are they going to graduate from high school in the 8th grade, get a job early, and pay taxes earlier?  I disagree that Asian students are superior at STEM occupations, by the way. I don't think the research bears that out.  Time is limited, so all that time spent on academics at a young age is at the expense of something else.  Isn't that "else" important, too? I mean, we all know really smart people who get fired because they can't schmooze with the boss, and we all know complete numbskulls who keep their job because they impress the right people. Personally, I'd rather my child kept the job, even if they didn't take calculus in 8th grade.  But hey, I'm a slacker American parent with mouthy, lazy kids....

    We all have different reasons and one of ours was to teach discipline. A bright person with good discipline and work ethic may succeed where a genius person with no discipline and sloppy work ethic may fail. My son is not gifted, but there are a lot of kids around him who are gifted and tons more non-gifted but bright or very bright kids. Some of them are learning discipline, some of them are not. From my generation and my parents generation, I have seen how the discipline and work ethic is serving everyone who possesses this trait. I also see many of the genius people amount to nearly nothing.

     

    Yes, time is limited, but we can not change that reality for anyone, not even our beloved children. There is an opportunity cost to living. By being on the internet and conversing with you, we can't be in bed asleep or watching TV but that is reality.

     

    We don't know what you are getting at with the "else" because 1) We honestly, don't know what "schmooze with the boss" means, can you explain? and 2) Think about this--3-7 year old kids have nothing but time on their hands. They don't work jobs, they don't have to commute, pay bills, or plan for their future, budget, pay taxes or worry about anything except maybe "will I get chocolate milk and baklava tonight?TV and video games are the biggest waste of time for the 3-7 yo kid that I can think of, our kids don't have the option to watch TV or play video games when they want to.

     

    And anyway who said that because our child does math he doesn't do anything else? ALL the activities available to him are not beneficial, the non-beneficial ones we don't worry about and we give him other activities. Every single child that my son knows attends Kumon and has since they were 3. My son didn't go to Kumon, we didn't want that competition, stress or boredom for him. Everyone in the family was mad that we didn't put him in Kumon, felt he would be behind or not learn math, discipline and be behind when he went to K. Well, you can not imagine the fuss when we did not put him in Kindergarten and instead let him stay home and when his relatives refused to watch him anymore, thinking this would force us to put him in school, we just hired our beloved part time nanny, full time.

     

    All the other kids we know are forced to take music lessons, my kids did the 2 terms of "Music and Movement" classes that the center offered and then we brought them home. They don't have to play violin if they don't want to. WE can't afford it anyway, why force hardship on everyone involved? We don't do a bunch of academics with toddlers--just math and reading. Instead of adding in more topics, our kids go to the park, the cinema, and the indoor pool. My son plays football (aka Soccer) and we buy them board games. Our kids go to museums and theater shows, to story times at the library and the bookstore and the community center.

     

    I really appreciate you taking the time to explain the logic to me.  Obviously, I don't know anyone face-to-face who does this that I feel comfortable asking about their motivations.  I find this absolutely fascinating. It made me laugh to read the "why would you not do this" response, because it's so diametrically opposite of many ideas about childrearing--and yet, I completely agree that A bright person with good discipline and work ethic may succeed where a genius person with no discipline and sloppy work ethic may fail.  I think Think about this--3-7 year old kids have nothing but time on their hands.  a very interesting POV, and one, quite frankly, that never occurred to me. I had and have serious goals for my 3-7 year old that don't revolve around academics. I find this fascinating:  Every single child that my son knows attends Kumon and has since they were 3.  That is a huge cultural difference. Again, I thank you for taking the time to explain this to me.

     

    There is value in not being a special snowflake.  I read that and some of the other quotes I bolded, and I wonder....Were you directing that comment to people in the thread, or were you referring to someone else's children? I have read this post many times. I keep trying to understand your tone. Was a nerve touched? Were you just in a hurry? Did you truly mean to come across this way?  I'm glad you were so open and direct. It's good to see how you truly feel. I'm presuming these are the attitudes you will bring with you to your history classes with the Well-Trained Mind Academy. It is always good to learn more about the instructors of potential schools.

     

     

    Yes, a nerve was touched. Yes, I was in a hurry--I was nursing a screaming baby. I'm not sure which way you took it. I have very poor personal experiences and strong feelings about social isolation and gifted children, and poor social skills, and the adult expectations on gifted children, and the self-imposed expectations that gifted children have.  It's one reason I feel so strongly about making sure my kids have really good social skills.

     

    Furthermore, most families I know who homeschool make financial sacrifices in order to do so, and we're lucky that we're able to make those sacrifices.  If rent money depended on working 2 jobs, it'd be ... well, maybe not impossible, but certainly nearly so.  Just think about that mother who was arrested for leaving her daughter in the park!  She needed her daughter to be in some kind of childcare that public school generally provides. 

     

    I wondered the same thing. Not just because of the tone in this thread, but also the "Yep, Clem done did his larnin' t'day." post in the workbook thread

     

    *chuckle* I'm from WV. When I'm tired, that's how I talk, even though my elementary school teachers did their level best to drill it out of us, on the basis that we'd never get "real" jobs if employers thought we were hicks. 

  8. Why not Bookshark?

     

    Because you could buy or check out the books and simply read them. We used Sonlight off and on for years and most of the time the master schedule got put aside. It's my own fault I didn't use it to its fullest, but life happens. With many of the books becoming available on kindle or audible, it is easier than ever to make up your own list and start reading. Remember that SL originally marketed to missionaries who needed a complete in-a-box curriculum that could be easily shipped overseas. That business model does not work for them any more.

     

    If you want to use Bookshark, or Sonlight, and the price is intimidating, you can still do it very cheaply. At its core, it is a book list.

     

    :iagree:

     

    To me, the value here would be the IGs....and then I read that thread I linked to earlier, and now I'm like..hmmm....Not So Much!

  9.  

    Courtney, have you ever been to Silicon Valley? Or any engineering department at a selective university? Have you ever visited any major electronics company? You'll see a significantly higher rate of Asian population there.

     

    No, I haven't been to Silicon Valley, but I've grown up around engineers and scientists. My SIL is a research immunologist, as is a cousin, my grandpa was a rocket scientist, my husband works in IT... I live in a university town, etcetera. Yes, as a percentage of the population, Asian-Americans tend to have more white-collar jobs. Just like someone said up-thread (I'm on my phone), it bespeaks more the family culture than innate "better" at STEM.

     

    I'm sorry I do not have any statistics in my hand at this moment to support this, but I can testify with all my multinational experience that an average math test score of Asian students is much higher than American students'. Look at this result in 2013 and another result in 2003 and see where the United States stands on.

     

    1) I think there are more reasons than being innately better at math behind test scores, and 2) precisely my point—it's cultural, *for the families who can afford it*.

     

    I mean, why do you think Singapore Math curriculum is so popular on this forum?

     

    I chose it because I thought it was a better math curriculum than Saxon, personally, at least for the first few years. At this point, it's more challenging for my daughter, who is not gifted or accelerated.

     

    ....But there's not so much I can control since doing school is what keeps him satisfied. I don't know why it is hard for you to believe some kids are naturally more self-motivated and interested in academics at a younger age than other average kids are.

     

    Oh, I believe those kids exist. My question is, why indulge them to that extent? What is the end goal?

     

    And they still have 12+ hours a day to do all the wonderful things other kids do. Also, who said these accelerated/gifted kids can't "schmooze" with others?

     

    1) There's a finite amount of time in the day. If they're doing academics, then they're not practicing social skills—and even though it's verboten to openly fuss about social skills on homeschooling boards, I'm saying it.

    2) By the mere fact that these kids are so academically out of step with their peers, they're going to have social difficulties. BTDT.

     

    Look, if you're happy, you go for it. That's the beauty of homeschooling. I just don't get the point of it. I have no doubt that my 6-yr-old could do this "advanced" academics, given the same academic structure and reinforcement—but I'm not doing it. I think she's got more important skills to learn right now. At 35, does it matter if she learned her multiplication tables at age 4 or age 9?

     

     

    I don't understand how you call yourself a slacker parent when you criticized other hs moms on Facebook groups for being slack and not having high academic standards in other thread.

     

    1) sarcasm, and 2) I said they had different educational values. It wasn't criticism to say that they had no interest in academic difficulty, it was a statement of fact. Yes, the accent was a bit of a snark, but my Yankee in-laws are the same way—the first time I met my FIL, he told me that my attending graduate school was a waste of time, that you didn't need a college degree to make a good living.

     

    We all try to do the best for our own children. Isn't homeschooling all about accepting differences and respecting individual choices? What's so special about being just like other kids at the same age?

     

    Well, technically I think homeschool is about not attending public schools full time. But yes, I do try to accept differences and choices. What I was saying is that I don't understand this choice. This does not compute.

     

    There is a value in not being too far out of lockstep with your peers—socially and emotionally. There is a value in being ordinary and average. There is a value in not being a special snowflake.

     

  10. To be fair, I know several families that are veteran homeschoolers and used and raved about Easy Peasy for a season. They aren't uneducated or hicks and neither are their kids. But again, some families have a lifestyle of education that is quite comprehensive, especially in the good, old fashioned basic literacy and reasoning skills.

     

    I suspect that these families of whom you speak have, y'know, books in their house, too.  :mellow:  

  11. People seem to think that Saxon is an especially poor fit for kids who are 'advanced' in math. I don't know if we are 'advanced'....though we are using 5/4 in 1st grade I don't think my son is advanced...we are teaching him basic elementary math skills through problem solving without a curriculum and its a slower process...

     

    5th grade is 10/11 years old. So yes, it's advanced, if he's six. By definition. 

     

    I suspect that you have excellent math skills yourself, if you can teach problem solving without a curriculum.

     

     

    Well to be fair, even though this is "first grade" because he is 6, we begin our kids formal educations as toddlers so my son has had about 3.5 years of actual math instruction. ... It isn't about making them super stars, its because we want our kids to be independent, studious and learn focus, discipline and work ethic but we can't afford instruments!

     

    a) I don't understand why you would begin math instruction as toddlers. b) I'm curious as to what you would do if your child said, "No, I don't want to do this."

     

    And some people don't believe their children are special. They get to do that if they want to. They have their reasons for believing what they believe.

     

    :iagree:

     

    ... the OP's student spends on math seems developmentally inappropriate IMO, especially to the extent that it is not driven by the student himself. I would keep an eye out for resistance lest the current schedule backfire against the student's joy of learning math.....

     

    :iagree:

    ElmerRex, you are not describing a typical American or even Asian 6 year old. Diligence will not result in producing these same results with all 6 year olds.

     

    :iagree:

    ... elmerRex, I agree with you that diligent work and active parental involvement make a huge difference in a student's academic performances, and that's precisely why Asian students in general can master calculus by high school and do better in STEM majors (....

     

    This....plus

     

    ... intentionally advanced their young kids education the way that I did....

     

    Why would you do this? What's the point? Are they going to graduate from high school in the 8th grade, get a job early, and pay taxes earlier?  I disagree that Asian students are superior at STEM occupations, by the way. I don't think the research bears that out.  Time is limited, so all that time spent on academics at a young age is at the expense of something else.  Isn't that "else" important, too? I mean, we all know really smart people who get fired because they can't schmooze with the boss, and we all know complete numbskulls who keep their job because they impress the right people. Personally, I'd rather my child kept the job, even if they didn't take calculus in 8th grade.  But hey, I'm a slacker American parent with mouthy, lazy kids....

  12. I live in West Virginia. I am a certified teacher. As a kind of community service, I did portfolio reviews this spring for HS-ing families, at $25 per student.  Here in WVa, we're required to turn portfolios reviewed by a certified teacher, in in lieu of a standardized test, at the end of every school year, in June. The state standard just says "progress in accordance with abilities." It doesn't say how much progress, or of what kind.

     

    Soooo...  I saw a wide variety of homeschooling. It was eye-opening.  I saw portfolios in which no math work had been done since January. I saw portfolios where the student just answered the reading comprehension questions at the end of the chapters for all their textbooks (we can get public school textbooks upon request, if they're available).

     

    I can certainly believe that someone would pick up a Complete book and use it for the entirety of the child's educational curriculum, without any extra-curricular, unschooling, daily-life-learning activities, or even other books in the house.

     

    In fact, I belong to a number of Facebook groups about homeschooling, and at least once a week, someone asks a question such as: "I decided to homeschool this year because social anxiety/Common Core/bullying/mean teachers/we move a lot/religion. What free curriculum can I get (hopefully online) that my child can do themselves? I ain't so good at math."    95% of the time, I see: "Easy Peasy" "Time4Learning" and "DiscoveryKids" These parents have zero interest in the academic difficulty of the education. They just want to outsource it as a box they can check, "Yep, Clem done did his larnin' t'day."  These parents have just as much right to homeschool as we do, but they have very different educational values.  

  13. Hunh?  maybe it does sometimes, but what about:  tie, riot, science, trier, prion, scion, ionic, -tion words, -cian words...

     

    I guess it works with fiat and Prius and belief, thief--though the latter are ie combination words.

     

    I dunno, I got that out of a spelling FAQ on the Internet.  :huh:   I was hoping that there was something that gives you actual spelling rules. AAS seems to do that.  

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