State requirements for hs diplomas

[Mama Lynx]

This may be a stupid question; if it is, be patient with me :)

 

I notice that many homeschoolers here who homeschool through high school follow their state's course requirements for a hs diploma.

 

What is the reason for this?

 

I can understand checking with the colleges to see what they might require, and covering your bases that way. But I am not clear on what the benefit is of following state requirements, if the state does not issue the diploma.

 

Can you clue me in, please? I have not been planning on following my state's requirements. What are the reasons I might want to change my mind on that ... or not?

[nutmeg]

I won't try to change your mind. :) I've been trying to get our support group leader to quit saying "homeschooled high schoolers are required to...." as there are absolutely no requirements placed on these students in our state!

 

Most parents here look to what various colleges require for admission, then add in their own specific family goals.

[Ellie]

I'm not much help, either. I figured we'd keep hsing until my dc had learned as much at home as they were gonna. :-)

 

As it was, both dds began taking classes at the c.c. when they were 14ish; I always say we did c.c. instead of high school. :-)

 

IMHO, it's more productive to work backward: figure out what the dc want to do as adults and be sure they are prepared for *that*.

[NCMom]

The people do it here to ensure admission to the state university system. Many, many homeschoolers here go to state schools.

 

Georgia

[Kris in Wis]

For us, the DPI (Dept. Public Instruction) specifically states on their website that:

 

"A board may not grant a high school diploma to any pupil unless the pupil has: . . . "

 

What follows is a breakdown of the minimum credits required to earn a diploma.

 

In our state, this applies to any private or public school, and homeschools are considered private schools here.

 

That said, you don't have to follow these requirements, but then you can't "technically" graduate your student. However, it isn't hard to fulfill them in the homeschool - we would do it anyway.

 

Depending on your state's requirements, as well as your student's abilities and interests, you probably would fulfill most of them anyway, wouldn't you?

[Brilliant]

Personally, I think it's a good guideline for a minimum standard.

 

I think some homeschoolers in my state might be confused that they *must* follow it. (I heard a former PS teacher who's now homeschooling announce to a group of moms that they should make sure their curriculum matches up with CA state standards by grade. Umm, no...) But I think most homeschoolers I know talk about "requirements" because it's just a minimum. For example, the non-mathy student taking at least Alg 1 and Geometry.

 

Some of the standards are a waste of time. My dd did a semester of health which I wish we hadn't done. Really, most of it was common sense which she learns just by living in our home. Wash your hands frequently; don't smoke, drink or do illegal drugs; exercise and eat a balanced diet; don't have sex with someone you're not married to. She did do a fascinating paper on childhood obesity rates.

Edited May 9, 2009 by OC Mom

[Mama Lynx]

For us, the DPI (Dept. Public Instruction) specifically states on their website that:

 

"A board may not grant a high school diploma to any pupil unless the pupil has: . . . "

 

What follows is a breakdown of the minimum credits required to earn a diploma.

 

In our state, this applies to any private or public school, and homeschools are considered private schools here.

 

That said, you don't have to follow these requirements, but then you can't "technically" graduate your student. However, it isn't hard to fulfill them in the homeschool - we would do it anyway.

 

Depending on your state's requirements, as well as your student's abilities and interests, you probably would fulfill most of them anyway, wouldn't you?

 

Yes; on the other hand, my state requires state history, and I don't plan to do that. I don't plan to halt our history plans to spend a semester just on state history. There are a few other items I don't consider important, as well.

 

It is my understanding that in my state, to get into a state college, you still don't need that requirement. So perhaps each state differs on that.

 

This is confirming what I thought; we'll do our own thing, keep an eye on what colleges like to see, and ignore the rest.

 

Thanks! :001_smile:

[FloridaLisa]

Not a dumb question. It's given me pause as well when I continually hear folks referring to our state-mandated diploma requirements for public high school. In Florida, it's important to keep two standards in mind: 1) what do the colleges want and 2) what is required for the state scholarship.

 

Lisa

[Kathy in MD]

It's my understanding that at least 1 state does offer a state issued diploma for homeschoolers if certain guidelines are followed. I use the term guidelines because it's my understanding that the curriculum or specific classes aren't specified, it's just that x number of classes in things like math or science are required for the diploma.

[Chris in VA]

HI MamaLynx

 

Va doesn't issue homeschooling diplomas, so you don't have a bit to worry about. Do whatever you want, since you'll be issuing it yourself, unless you use an umbrella organization (in which case it comes from them). Now, VCU does require homeschoolers to take and submit a passing GED--but there's nothing but the basics on that test, so you still don't have to worry. I don't think any other VA state college requires it.

[Mandy in TN]

It's funny that this should be brought up here! I just responded to a homeschool group meeting. The e-mail send to me said-

 

"We will talk about transcripts, how many required credit hours in each subject are needed to graduate, the general timeline of when subjects are taken, etc."

 

 

I responded-

 

Credits- this is one of those topics that infuriates me when the "school at home" bunch gets rolling. Although I will not be able to attend, please, please let parents know that the credits needed to graduate have NOTHING to do with the credits required in the TN public schools. Lying to a group of new high schoolers and telling them that they must do school at home and follow the same path as the students at the public school is just hateful. Here is my rant on homeschooling high school. A short list of references follows.

 

In the state of Tennessee if a family home educates through a church related school under the Jeter Memorandum, they only need to be concerned with the graduation requirements of their church related school. Church related schools operating as a Category IV school and according to TCA 49-50-801 are exempt from regulations regarding faculty, textbooks, and curriculum.

Children enrolled in these schools are NOT receiving an accredited diploma. Rather than specific coursework to receive the TN HOPE lottery scholarship these children must have a minimum 21 ACT score and must have been enrolled in the same church related school for 2 years immediately preceding graduation.

To receive the General Assembly Merit Scholarship a Jeter Memorandum, home-educated children must meet the HOPE requirements, but with a minimum 29 ACT and attend at least 4 college level courses totaling at least 12 semester hours and achieve a cumulative GPA of 3.0 at an eligible postsecondary institution.

To say that these children must meet the same minimum requirements for graduation as students in public schools is simply untrue! Church-related schools are exempt from specific coursework regulation. The only guidelines Jeter Memorandum homeschoolers must follow are those placed upon them by their church related school. If a family is enrolled in a church-related, category IV umbrella school, they are home educating under the Jeter Memorandum.

Also, there is a new option to homeschool in the state of Tennessee . Per this news release from Homelife Academy in Memphis :

According to HSLDA, " Tennessee parents now have an additional option for conducting home instruction of their children. The Tennessee Department of Education has decided to recognize enrollment in the distance learning program of an accredited private school as a means of complying with the compulsory attendance law."

“An example of one of these types of schools include, but is not limited to, Abeka Online Academy , or Alpha Omega Academy . (Contact the state for a complete list of distance learning programs which meet this new option.) Although HLA as a large number of parents using curriculum such as Abeka, HLA has less then 3% of parents using a full "distance learning program" as their educational plan.

 

IMPORTANT: Using curriculum such as Abeka or Alpha and Omega on your own does not satisfy this additional option. Parents much be fully enrolled in their distance learning program, such as Abeka Online Academy . What this means for HLA is basically, nothing changes. Those 3% of parents who use the online distance learning programs no longer need HLA for legal covering, but may want to maintain enrollment for our transcripts.

 

Options in TN, in a nutshell:

 

• <LI class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0.5in 0pt 0in; COLOR: black">Option I: Home School Statute-Notify the Public School. Independent "homeschoolers" registered directly with the local school district. <LI class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0.5in 0pt 0in; COLOR: black">Option II: Home School Statute-Associate With a Church-Related School . This is option I and option III below combined. HLA does NOT use this option. <LI class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0.5in 0pt 0in; COLOR: black">Option III: Alternative Statute-Operate as a Satellite Campus of a Church-Related School . (This is HLA's option.)
  
• Option IV: Alternative Statute-Enroll in the Distance Learning Program of an Accredited Private School. (This is the new option.)
  

HLA continues to be an Option III, Category IV school. Nothing changes. This does not impact the Jeter Memo or the Church-related laws. But according to HSLDA , TN homeschoolers now have another option, which is an Option IV, Category III school. Quote: "A Category III non-public school is one that is accredited by one of the five regional accrediting associations, e.g. the Southern Association of Colleges and Schools. Each school establishes its own admissions and academic standards consistent with its accreditation."

 

This means a family could now use Clonlara’s accredited Walkabout program for their child’s high school diploma! Instead of textbook work for high school, a child would receive high school credits for up to six self-designed projects completed in any of the six Walkabout areas. However, if using this new option remember that currently a Tennessee resident must attend school in Tennessee or one of the school districts with which Tennessee has a reciprocal agreement in order to qualify for the TN Hope lottery scholarship. One way around this is to enroll with a local umbrella and with the accredited distance learning institution knowing that the distance learning institution will be the one granting the diploma.

Who cares what credits are being issued at the public high school down the road? If a child is interested in a specific university, it is best to look at that institution's entrance requirements! If I had wanted my children to follow the same coursework path as the failing public school system, I would have enrolled them there!

http://www.tn.gov/CollegePays/mon_college/lottery_scholars.htm

http://www.state.tn.us/sos/rules/0520/0520-07/0520-07-02.20090228.pdf

http://tnhomeed.com/CategoryIII.htm

http://www.hslda.org/hs/state/tn/200903020.asp

http://www.clonlara.org/walkabout

 

AARGH!

Mandy

[ereks mom]

Not a dumb question. It's given me pause as well when I continually hear folks referring to our state-mandated diploma requirements for public high school. In Florida, it's important to keep two standards in mind: 1) what do the colleges want and 2) what is required for the state scholarship.

 

Lisa

 

I'm in Georgia, and I also keep hearing people referring to requirements for a diploma from a public high school, although we homeschoolers are not required to meet those. Georgia homeschoolers are required to give students instruction in reading, language arts, math, social studies, and science. The law does not specify which courses must be taught within each subject area. The law also does not mention health, P.E., foreign language, technology, nor any other course in particular, although the Georgia graduation requirements for public schools include most, if not all of these. For my ds who graduated last year, I chose his course of study, and tailored it to what I knew colleges would be looking for on his transcript. He was readily accepted into each college to which he applied.

[Janet in WA]

I can't speak for every other state, but our state's high school graduation requirements are quite low. I looked them up out of curiosity, but found them pretty much useless. Instead, I used prospective colleges' admissions requirements to plan our high school requirements. I would have done so whether our sons planned to attend college or not.

[Janet in WA]

The people do it here to ensure admission to the state university system. Many, many homeschoolers here go to state schools.

 

Georgia

Our state's high school graduation requirements fall short of our state's universities' admissions requirements. That may not be true for NC, but I'm betting it is.

[catsluvsushi]

If you live in a state that does not issue a state-recognized diploma, then I'm not sure I see any benefit in checking. However, one or two states do offer state-approved diplomas (not to be confused with accredited diplomas) and the one benefit I've seen is colleges in these states relax a little when they hear that your student is doing XYZ diploma program, as they know what the guidelines are without further research on their part.

[nutmeg]

Our state's high school graduation requirements fall short of our state's universities' admissions requirements. That may not be true for NC, but I'm betting it is.

 

That is true here, too. Local public universities requires incoming freshman to have completed 2 years of foreign language study, while the high school requires 3 years of Second Language, Fine or Practical Arts, and/or Career & Technical Education. Whatever that is. :confused:

[Mama Lynx]

HI MamaLynx

 

Va doesn't issue homeschooling diplomas, so you don't have a bit to worry about. Do whatever you want, since you'll be issuing it yourself, unless you use an umbrella organization (in which case it comes from them). Now, VCU does require homeschoolers to take and submit a passing GED--but there's nothing but the basics on that test, so you still don't have to worry. I don't think any other VA state college requires it.

 

Thanks, Chris!

 

Now, er ... what does VCU stand for?

 

And as long as I'm here and you're here <g> I think I have heard that if a student take community college classes during high school, the VA state colleges are required to accept those classes? True?

[Janet in WA]

 

Now, er ... what does VCU stand for?

Virginia Commonwealth University, I assume.

[Ellie]

For us, the DPI (Dept. Public Instruction) specifically states on their website that:

 

"A board may not grant a high school diploma to any pupil unless the pupil has: . . . "

 

What follows is a breakdown of the minimum credits required to earn a diploma.

 

In our state, this applies to any private or public school, and homeschools are considered private schools here.

 

That said, you don't have to follow these requirements, but then you can't "technically" graduate your student. However, it isn't hard to fulfill them in the homeschool - we would do it anyway.

 

Depending on your state's requirements, as well as your student's abilities and interests, you probably would fulfill most of them anyway, wouldn't you?

But which "board" issues diplomas to homeschoolers?

[chanda7]

If you are registered with your LEA (school board) instead of an umbrella school in TN, you are required to cover certain subjects in 9-12. No specific subjects are required for K-8.

[Quiver0f10]

In Arkansas we sign a waiver stating that we don't hold the state liable for our children's education and that we assume all responsiblity ( something to that effect). I called our state homeschool allaince and they confirmed this and that we are on own own as far as how many credits, when we can graduate them etc. I also called the local university to find out thier requirements for admittance and that is the minimum standard my family goes by.

Edited May 10, 2009 by Quiver0f10

[Liza Q]

In NY we are required to teach certain classes and a certain amount of electives during High School. This will not lead to a diploma but it is required by law.

 

The required courses are not enough for admission into state/city college here, only community college. At least in this area of the state!

[Tammyla]

Each state can differ, ours wont recognize or accept a diploma awarded in our state that doesn't meet the state requirements. College admissions, student loans, grants and scholarships can be at risk here.

Edited May 10, 2009 by Tammyla

[NCMom]

Our state's high school graduation requirements fall short of our state's universities' admissions requirements. That may not be true for NC, but I'm betting it is.

 

It isn't, if you're on the college prep track. :001_smile:

 

Actually our high schools in NC require the following for the College Prep Diploma:

English -- 4 units (I, II, III & IV)

Foreign Language -- 2 units (Both must be in same language)

Mathematics -- 4 units(Algebra I, II, Geometry & one beyond Algebra II)

Science -- 3 units (A physical science, Biology & Earth Science)

Social Studies -- 3 units (Government & Economics, United States History, World Studies)

Health & Physical Education -- 1 unit

Electives -- 3 units

 

Minimum Admissions Requirements at the 16 Institutions of the University of North Carolina are:

-Six course units in language, including four units in English emphasizing grammar, composition, and literature, and two units of a language other than English.

-Four course units of mathematics, in any of the following combinations:

algebra I and II, geometry, and one unit beyond algebra II,

algebra I and II, and two units beyond algebra II, or

integrated math I, II, and III, and one unit beyond integrated math III.

(The fourth unit of math affects applicants to all institutions except the North Carolina School of the Arts.)

-Three course units in science, including at least one unit in a life or biological science (for example, biology),at least one unit in physical science (for example, physical science, chemistry, physics), and at least one laboratory course.

-Two course units in social studies, including one unit in U.S. history, but an applicant who does not have the unit in U.S. history may be admitted on the condition that at least three semester hours in that subject will be passed by the end of the sophomore year.

 

Pretty close, anyway.

 

I think it is amazing bright of them to match up the requirements. But really here the PS is hugely tied into the university system. It's kinda eerie. The only place I have lived where this is the case, that's for sure.

 

Georgia

[Chris in VA]

Hi MamaL

You can look on Northern Va Community College's website and see which of their classes transfer to which Va colleges/universities. They have a great list that shows what NOVA course corresponds to or can be taken in the place of, which course at the universities with which they have reciprocal agreements. There is also a law that says you will be accepted at any public university with an AA degree from NOVA. (I think it's ANY, but I could be wrong and it's only SOME...the website would tell you for sure.)

[Mama Lynx]

Each state can differ, ours wont recognize or accept a diploma awarded in our state that doesn't meet the state requirements. College admissions, student loans, grants and scholarships can be at risk here.

 

 

 

Thanks. I've never lived in a state where that was the case, so did not realize.

 

Although ... so as a homeschooler, you cannot apply to a state college, or scholarships, unless you have a diploma from the state? You don't have the option of doing your own diploma?

 

I'm just curious, here. I've never lived in a state that issued diplomas for homeschoolers, no matter what requirements they met.

[Ellie]

If you are registered with your LEA (school board) instead of an umbrella school in TN, you are required to cover certain subjects in 9-12. No specific subjects are required for K-8.

Should've clarified my question. :-)

 

Kris said:

For us, the DPI (Dept. Public Instruction) specifically states on their website that:

 

"A board may not grant a high school diploma to any pupil unless the pupil has: . . . "

 

What follows is a breakdown of the minimum credits required to earn a diploma.

 

In our state, this applies to any private or public school, and homeschools are considered private schools here.

So I wanted to know if a board of some kind granted a diploma to private school students in WI. If there isn't one, then personally, I would have no qualms about graduating my dc, based on my own requirements, and would consider it technically valid.

[Ria]

Here in PA one can issue their own diploma to their high school graduate, or they can meet the state homeschool diploma requirements (the student must be in a program approved by the state to oversee that the requirements are met) and receive a PA homeschool diploma. Unless something has changed recently, I believe that PA is the only state that will issue a state-recognized diploma to homeschoolers.

 

Depending on the student's post-highschool plans, a state-issued diploma would be of considerable value (ie, a student applying to competitive colleges) because the requirements and oversight are more stringent and the colleges are aware of this.

 

Ria

[Alyce]

That's not my experience. I set my own requirements based on requirements to get into the colleges we wanted. We did not follow PS requirements. We only applied to the NC State colleges and I didn't encounter any problem doing it this way except for UNC-Chapel Hill. The only problem with them is that they wanted course descriptions and a portfolio but we didn't have to meet PS requirments. My dd was excepted at ECU and UNC-Charlotee. We decidend to attend UNCC because they had a better dance program in ballet which is my dd prefernce in dance.

[Alyce]

Again this was not my experience. Although these are the suggested scheduling when I contacted the individual schools they had very different requirements than this states most much more basic than these. I applied to UNC-Charlotte, ECU and UNC-Wilmington. I also looked at Appalachian State. The only requirements that they had was 3 courses in math which we consecutively higher. They also required a lab and a physical science but nothing else. They did suggest that students have 2 years of foreign language in the last 2 years of school

[iluvmy4blessings]

Does anyone know about these issues regarding Texas? I don't know if they issue a state diploma.

[Piano&ViolinMom]

Unless something has changed recently, I believe that PA is the only state that will issue a state-recognized diploma to homeschoolers.

That is not accurate.

[Ellie]

Does anyone know about these issues regarding Texas? I don't know if they issue a state diploma.

Because of a Supreme Court decision in 1994, homeschools in Texas are considered to be private schools; as such, they are completely unregulated by the state, which means that the state does not issue diplomas. Homeschoolers here issue their own diplomas and generate their own transcripts (although of course some enroll their dc in various distance-learning programs, so those programs would issue diplomas/transcripts).

[Piano&ViolinMom]

I'm sorry. When I said "That's not accurate", I meant was on quote as below.

Here in PA,..., or they can meet the state homeschool diploma requirements (the student must be in a program approved by the state to oversee that the requirements are met) and receive a PA homeschool diploma.

There is NO diploma from the PA state to homeschoolers. Thus, there can not be any requirements for the diploma.

[QueenCat]

The state run colleges in TN have admission requirements that are closely aligned with the state's college prep diploma requirements. Plus, if you use an umbrella here, their requirements are similar. By using an umbrella, it is much easier to get the state's Hope Scholarship, which is worth $4000/year.

[K-FL]

Here in FL, if you are a "regular" homeschooler, registered w/your school board then the state has no say/requirements on your curriculum or credits. If you've registered w/a "600" school, you're legally a private schooler (although it may look like homeschooling to all concerned) so you fall under that school's requirements.

 

As others have said, it's best to look at what the universities are looking for for admissions, along with what Bright Futures Scholarships (although your SAT/ACT score can be used instead of a transcript) and, if applicable, NCAA require.

[Guest WrestlerMom]

Here in Vermont, my amazing husband is home schooling both our kids, and our daughter will be taking PSATs, SATs and some of the other exams that colleges look at. She'll also be taking some online college courses once she hits high school. I have seen some college scholarships geared specifically toward home school students, so I have no worries about her ability to get into the school of her choice, if that's the route she wishes to go when we get there.

[FaithManor]

Here in Vermont, my amazing husband is home schooling both our kids, and our daughter will be taking PSATs, SATs and some of the other exams that colleges look at. She'll also be taking some online college courses once she hits high school. I have seen some college scholarships geared specifically toward home school students, so I have no worries about her ability to get into the school of her choice, if that's the route she wishes to go when we get there.

 

 

I'm not worried either. DD applied to 12 or 13 (can't remember the exact number anymore) uni's, all tier 1 schools except one, and was accepted at all of them as well as awarded merit money of significant nature at each one. Those schools, through their prospective student surveys, are aware that there is another homeschooled high schooler in the home and have begun courting ds though he is only a 9th/10th grader.

 

We exceed, by a long way, the graduation requirements of the public schools in Michigan.

 

Faith