How soon is 'too soon' after the death of a spouse?

[mazakaal]

I have a friend who has recently become engaged to a widower. His wife passed away in the middle of June, 2007. When they were talking to their pastor about dates for their wedding, he said that he wouldn't marry them in early July this year because it was too close to the anniversary of C.'s death, that it would upset people in the church. I'm not sure if he meant that the date on the calendar was too close to the other date, or if it was only 2yrs since her death and they should wait longer. I can't really understand it. I was a friend of C, though we weren't close, and I would have no problem with her widower getting remarried. They've been dating for over a year, so this isn't some snap decision that they've made. And I can't believe that the pastor would base his decision on how others in the church would feel about it. It's not my church, so I haven't heard the grumblings, so I don't really know the situation over there. But it all seems a bit odd to me.

 

So, if you were a friend of C's, would you be very upset that her widower was getting married only two years later and so close to the anniversary of her death, or would you accept that they are adults and let them move on with their lives?

[Catwoman]

The pastor has no right to tell this couple when they can get married. Whether or not he agrees with their timing, it's not his decision to make.

 

As far as the other members of the church are concerned, it's their choice whether or not they are upset about the wedding date, but again, there is no reason why they should be consulted about it.

 

I could understand the pastor suggesting a different date if there were a conflict other weddings that were already scheduled for that day, but as you described it, that's not the case. I think he has a lot of nerve to think he should have a say in when this couple gets married, and to suggest that they need to consider the church members' feelings as well seems more than a little presumptuous on his part.

 

I could understand if he gently pointed out the potential awkwardness of the date, in case the couple hadn't considered it, but to refuse to perform the wedding (on the date they chose) seems pretty extreme.

 

Cat

[mazakaal]

This is exactly what I thought. I couldn't believe he would refuse to marry them because of what others might think. Crazy.

[dangermom]

The pastor has no right to tell this couple when they can get married. Whether or not he agrees with their timing, it's not his decision to make.

 

As far as the other members of the church are concerned, it's their choice whether or not they are upset about the wedding date, but again, there is no reason why they should be consulted about it.

 

:iagree:

 

In any case, I think two years is entirely unobjectionable. I cannot see why anyone would think that is too soon. Six months is probably too soon. Two years is just fine.

[CactusPair]

i don't see a problem with the date or timing and I bet a lot of people in the church wouldn't either. Perfectly acceptable. I wish them happiness.

[mazakaal]

I bet a lot of people in the church wouldn't either.

 

Apparently some people (I don't know how many) do have a problem with it. When I called my friend to congratulate her (her fiance had told my dh a few days earlier) she was really appreciative, saying that it means a lot because not everyone has been supportive.

 

I felt really bad for them because they both have been through so much. His first wife had lupus which was under control for years, but very suddenly worsened and quickly deteriorated. It was a very difficult time. She had a very bad first marriage and has been struggling as a single mom for years. I was so glad that she's found a good Christian man who loves her and will treat her right. It really frustrates me that they're having such a hard time.

 

When she told me that some people weren't so happy about their marriage, I thought it could be because she is a divorcee. I know some people have very strong feelings about remarriage. But it seems the controvercy is over his previous marriage, because people in the church were very close to his first wife and are struggling with the idea of his remarrying. She was a lovely person, but she's gone. He has to move on. And so do those so called friends.

 

Sorry. Rant over. I just really feel for my friend. I've recently seen so much garbage in churches that I really can understand why people feel so 'burned' by the church that they walk away from it. I just hope it doesn't happen to these two.

[BamaTanya]

here.

 

It's no one's decision but their own.

 

My dh's dad remarried 6 mos after his mother died. The dc (all grown) were still in shock from her sudden death when he met someone at 5 mos and married at 6 mos.

 

None of them attended the wedding.

 

It WAS sudden, but my fil absolutely could not stand the loneliness. It may not have been the wisest decision, but it was his decision, and it pulled him into a new life without constant, crippling grief.

 

 

When we passed the 6 mo date of my mom's death, I remember thinking -- Wow, it IS still fresh. I don't know how I would handle it . . .

 

Now that a year has passed (during which I braced myself for every milestone without her), I still feel her loss acutely. However, I found out my dad took someone he'd met at a support group out for coffee yesterday. He's not telling much. I don't know if he'll spend more time with her, if we'll meet her, if he'll get serious . . . but I've mentally prepared myself with a blessing for him.

 

My parents were/are the world to me (plus my dh and dc, of course!) They deserve happiness. We can't do anything for my mom anymore. We loved her and cared for her until she died. Now, to love my dad, I have to support what will be good for him, too.

 

I cannot understand the pastor's objection to marrying this couple. Two years wouldn't be considered too soon by societal standards, so it must be a personal thing. Maybe he doesn't approve for some other reason?

 

Just because people in their church loved his first wife doesn't mean he must be celibate after her death.

 

Just my 2c.

[mazakaal]

here.

 

It's no one's decision but their own.

 

My dh's dad remarried 6 mos after his mother died. The dc (all grown) were still in shock from her sudden death when he met someone at 5 mos and married at 6 mos.

 

None of them attended the wedding.

 

It WAS sudden, but my fil absolutely could not stand the loneliness. It may not have been the wisest decision, but it was his decision, and it pulled him into a new life without constant, crippling grief.

 

 

When we passed the 6 mo date of my mom's death, I remember thinking -- Wow, it IS still fresh. I don't know how I would handle it . . .

 

Now that a year has passed (during which I braced myself for every milestone without her), I still feel her loss acutely. However, I found out my dad took someone he'd met at a support group out for coffee yesterday. He's not telling much. I don't know if he'll spend more time with her, if we'll meet her, if he'll get serious . . . but I've mentally prepared myself with a blessing for him.

 

My parents were/are the world to me (plus my dh and dc, of course!) They deserve happiness. We can't do anything for my mom anymore. We loved her and cared for her until she died. Now, to love my dad, I have to support what will be good for him, too.

 

I cannot understand the pastor's objection to marrying this couple. Two years wouldn't be considered too soon by societal standards, so it must be a personal thing. Maybe he doesn't approve for some other reason?

 

Just because people in their church loved his first wife doesn't mean he must be celibate after her death.

 

Just my 2c.

 

 

Thank you for sharing from your personal experience. I'm sorry for your loss, but it's good to hear from someone who has some personal experience with this. It sounds like you are a wonderful, supportive daughter. :grouphug:

[elegantlion]

I personally wouldn't have a problem with it and I don't think it's the pastors position to tell them no. I think he could offer advice, but their wishes should come first.

 

I have two family members that are widows. One chose to remarry quickly because she didn't want to be alone. The other has never remarried as her husband was her one and only true love. They were personal choices.

 

If it were me I would not want to get married so close to the anniversary of the death of someone I loved. Grief is a funny thing. I've seen my dh deal with that about his dad and some years he's great, some years he's an emotional mess. However our anniversary is less than a month from that date.

 

But if both of your friends are okay with that church members shouldn't play a role in choosing the date. :confused:

[bettyandbob]

I think the minister is trying to apply a formula to a situation where a formula is completely inappropriate. There are factors--was the death expected. Did it occur after a long illness, or was it sudden as in a car accident or seemingly healthy young person having a heart attack? When a death occurs after a long illness, often close family, including spouses begin the grieving process before the death occurs. And so close family is ready to move on seemingly before others think they should. This is especially true of family members who do the day to day care of a dying loved one.

 

Another factor is the presence of children who are not adult age yet. I would expect the widow/widower to be careful about visibly moving on, even if they are done grieving.

 

The minister should not impose his perception of the general feelings of the members of the parish as a reason for not performing a wedding. Perhaps the minister has other reasons he has not given.

[mazakaal]

There are factors--was the death expected. Did it occur after a long illness, or was it sudden as in a car accident or seemingly healthy young person having a heart attack?

 

The death was after about 3 months of severe illness, following years of her having lupus.

 

Another factor is the presence of children who are not adult age yet. I would expect the widow/widower to be careful about visibly moving on, even if they are done grieving.

 

His children are grown, and, oddly enough, the dd is getting married this June, very close to the anniversary of her mother's death. Not that I think that's odd, but I believe the same pastor is marrying the dd. Why does he feel that it's okay for the dd to marry, but not the dh?

 

Perhaps the minister has other reasons he has not given.

 

Perhaps.

[Prudent]

A widow in our church remarried less than 2 years after her 1st husband died.

 

It did raise some eyebrows, but it wasn't a viewed as a scandal.

 

But this situation was very different than the one you are describing.

 

The woman, at 30, had married a 65 year old. He died less than 2 years later. He was a wise, successful, beloved minister at our church. Her 2nd husband was, well, the church flake to be honest. I think she raised eyebrows because her very different choice in a 2nd husband made her 1st marriage look less sincere, and more like she was a gold-digger.

 

All in all, 2 years is perfectly fine if the widow has healed.

[OnTheBrink]

I am floored that a pastor would consider the opinions of others in the congregation and hold those as more weighty than the desires of the engaged couple. There is no evidence of a sinful situation taking place here. There is no reason to be scandalized or upset. These are two adults making a conscious choice to marry after a respectable amount of time after the woman's death.

 

IMO, if the pastor is that concerned that his congregation is upset, then he needs to stand at the pulpit and give a severe sermon on gossip in the church. Seriously, this is ridiculous. There is NO reason people should be upset over this. If it were me, I'd be church-shopping. And fast.

[Pip]

I find this a little strange. I can understand not wanting to marry around the anniversary date of the death, but 2 years is more than enough time, IMO.

 

I have often read that those who are the most happily married are the ones mose likely to remarry after the death of a spouse. Also, I don't know the ages of the people involved, but if I were the remarry, it would be for a different reason than I married my dh. I married him to build a life together, to raise a family, etc. IF I got remarried if he died, it would be purely for companionship. But then again, I don't know the circumstances I would be in if, God forbid, that happened.

 

As for the other church members, I would think they would be happy for these people. If they are not, they should find another hobby than worrying about this couple.

[kalanamak]

I

 

So, if you were a friend of C's, would you be very upset that her widower was getting married only two years later and so close to the anniversary of her death, or would you accept that they are adults and let them move on with their lives?

 

The Old Nick in me would tell the pastor "oh, I guess we'll just have to live in sin."

[Halftime Hope]

as she grew up as a pastor's kid. To hear her tell it, it used to be the custom, both in traditional America and in the (very conservative) Southern Baptist church, that a widow/er would let a year go by before becoming involved with another person.

 

My uncle, also a Baptist minister, married a year and half after his wife suddenly passed away from an aneurism. His church family rejoiced with him, because God had seen fit to give him two loves in his life. (His second wife, a divorcee who had left a physically abusive marriage, had been a faithful member of the church and was also very much loved.)

 

Two years is certainly enough time, by any "standard." However, if I were the couple, I'd want to get to the bottom of it with the pastor. And then tell everyone to grow up, if it was just people being opinionated.

 

Sending hugs to you and your friend.

[BeckyFL]

Wow! How sad! If people are having problems with it, I almost think it would be better for the pastor to address the situation and confront the people who are upset. The widower and his fiancee are the victims to be protected, not those standing in judgement over a potential wedding. Again, very sad!

[G5052]

I have two friends who married their departed spouse's best friends at about the six-month mark. They knew each other very well and the best friends had been very involved in the last days and helping afterwards. In both cases the ministers who married them were completely supportive even if some relatives and friends were unsure. You know what they say about weddings and funerals -- everyone has an opinion and you can't please everyone. When a widow or widower remarries, it's twice as hard.

 

FWIW both marriages are very happy and involved children that were still at home at the time.

[LibraryLover]

My SIL married last week. Her dh has been dead two years, but was sick for a year before he died. He was an incredible guy, and sometimes I think I loved him more than I love my own father...but that's a different issue. heh.

 

I am thrilled for her, and so is my dh. Some other families members, not so much. I don't get that. She was a wonderful wife and they had a wonderful marriage. She deserves to be happy again. I think some people in the family are jealous; maybe their own lives aren't happy, but she gets to fall in love twice? Or perhaps they want her to be a professional widow or something. She's on her honeymoon as I type. Yeah for her.

Edited May 8, 2009 by LibraryLover

[katemary63]

i don't see a problem with the date or timing and I bet a lot of people in the church wouldn't either. Perfectly acceptable. I wish them happiness.

 

 

:iagree::iagree:

[abreakfromlife]

I'll think about this off and on in a 'what if' type of scenario, and in the Karen Kingsbury books, I loved how she dealt with it and used the verse in Deuteronomy about how God wants us to choose life. That's what these people are doing - they are choosing to live life b/c they are still here and God still has life for them. If I were them, I would be very strongly considering moving to a new church. It sounds like it might be time for a fresh start as a couple.

[sadiegirl]

I think that the pastor is wrong. It is nobody's business when they decide the time is right to marry. I think so many people waste time being happy because of what other people think they should do and when. If I pass before my husband, I would hope my husband would remarry whenever he finds someone that can bring him happiness and enjoyment for the rest of his days. BE HAPPY that someone gets a second chance with love...it is hard enough to find a great spouse the first time for many people but to find love again....GO FOR IT! I think people also tend to have differing opinions on things like this unless they are going thru it themselves.

[katemary63]

 

IMO, if the pastor is that concerned that his congregation is upset, then he needs to stand at the pulpit and give a severe sermon on gossip in the church. Seriously, this is ridiculous. There is NO reason people should be upset over this. If it were me, I'd be church-shopping. And fast.

 

:iagree:

[StaceyinLA]

I agree with those that say it isn't the pastor's, nor anyone else in the church's, right to decide when it's okay for him to remarry.

 

I want to add that I believe men remarry, as a whole, sooner than women after the death of a spouse. My dad has been gone nearly 14 years and my mom has never even considered dating. However, I believe if the tables had been turned, my dad wouldn't have lasted a year or two single. I know he loved my mom and they were married 41 years before his death. She still grieves daily - he was the world to her. In fact, I think she dwells too much, even after all this time. I'd love to see her move on. At 81, I know that won't happen. I just know he would've, and I think (though I can't say for sure) that we all would've supported him, especially after 2 years.

[KarenNC]

It sounds on the surface to me like the minister is saying "can we pick a date that is not so close to the date of your first wife's death" not "it's only been 2 years, how callous and unfeeling can you be". There are all kinds of factors at work in these situations. Is it a small church? Was it the first wife's family church and the husband came into it, so that she still has lots of relatives in the church? Do her siblings, parents, etc possibly attend that church and the pastor is attempting (albeit clumsily) to be considerate of them? Are weddings at that church typically things in which the entire church is involved rather than just the folks the couple invites? Has the new woman become involved in and accepted as part of the life of the church or are they just having a wedding there? Has the pastor seen other couples who married close to the anniversary of a former spouse's death and seen it cause difficulties in the marriage?

 

In my situation, my mother had had several serious health issues for a couple of years but died unexpectedly. My father met someone (a widow whose husband had died 7 months previously of cancer) a month after she died, they were engaged 3 months later and married 4 months after that in her home church (so 8 months after my mother's death, 14 after my stepmother's first husband's death). My younger sister and I were both still at home, though I was newly in college, my stepmother's children were grown and had children of their own. The church my family had always attended was the one in which my mother had grown up, a very tiny church so most folks were related to my mother in some way, and this was also my maternal grandmother's church. My stepmother lived out of town and did not try to become part of the congregation (in large part because her beliefs and worship style did not fit with that version of Christianity and my father's had been shifting away from it for years and he had not been quiet at church about what he felt was a more true form of worship).

 

I would suggest that the couple explore more fully with the pastor exactly what his reasons are for suggesting a different date. If he is adamant and they are adamant, then sounds like they need to find a different option.

[MrsMe]

I have a friend who has recently become engaged to a widower. His wife passed away in the middle of June, 2007. When they were talking to their pastor about dates for their wedding, he said that he wouldn't marry them in early July this year because it was too close to the anniversary of C.'s death, that it would upset people in the church. I'm not sure if he meant that the date on the calendar was too close to the other date, or if it was only 2yrs since her death and they should wait longer. I can't really understand it. I was a friend of C, though we weren't close, and I would have no problem with her widower getting remarried. They've been dating for over a year, so this isn't some snap decision that they've made. And I can't believe that the pastor would base his decision on how others in the church would feel about it. It's not my church, so I haven't heard the grumblings, so I don't really know the situation over there. But it all seems a bit odd to me.

 

So, if you were a friend of C's, would you be very upset that her widower was getting married only two years later and so close to the anniversary of her death, or would you accept that they are adults and let them move on with their lives?

 

 

It's not for the pastor to say. Two years is a long time, and who cares about the "anniversary". Yes, they're adults, let them move and stay out of it.

[Rhonda in TX]

Mom had been gone about a year before he was ready to date again. He met my current step-mom a couple of months later and they married a few months after that. That was a couple of years ago.

 

My mom and dad were very, very involved at their church. Dad was an elder and I think they had every single family in that church in their home at some point or other. When Dad remarried, he moved about a couple of hours away, where his new wife has a house. I'm glad, because as nice as his wife is, she would have inevitably been compared to my mom, and I'm sure there would have been people who would have had a hard time accepting her.

 

I'm also glad his wedding was not close to the anniversary date of her death. That date is still hard for us kids, and would have made for a more difficult celebration at the wedding. I also know that my dad has not forgotten my mom and, while he loves his current wife, my mom will always be in his heart. Having a wedding anniversary near the anniversary of her death does not seem like a good thing to me.

 

In the end, though, it's their decision. Not the pastor's. Not the members of the congregation. Theirs.

[Halftime Hope]

I agree with your premise, in this day and age, but I was posting with "traditionally..." in mind.

 

I have two friends who married their departed spouse's best friends at about the six-month mark.

 

The thought of this (marrying dh's best friend)...aaack....not in my case!! (The feeling is probably mutual!) You've had me laughing for the last three or four minutes. :lol:

 

GVA, I always appreciate your posts and read them with great interest. But this one, aaack! LOL! (Just kidding!!!)

[Tree House Academy]

Two years is a good amount of time, IMO to wait to remarry. He has given himself time to deal with her passing, meet someone else, and fall in love. It wasn't a rush decision. It is not like he got married 3 months later.

 

I agree that it is not the pastor's business to decide when they are married and it is not the congregations's business either.

 

A widower in our church lost his wife last spring and married another church elder (who sat in the same row that he did each Sunday) and no one batted an eye. The man is in his 80's. It is not like he has all the time in the world to hunt around. He just wants someone to spend his days with...

Edited May 8, 2009 by Tree House Academy

[Ellie]

There is no "too soon." It's whenever the still-living spouse feels comfortable. Otherwise it's no one else's business.

 

....although I did sort of flinch when a friend remarried less than a year after her dh passed away. But it's still not my business, nor that pastor's, nor anyone else's.

[Impish]

Personally, I'd be looking for another church, or heading to the Justice of the Peace. A pastor that is more concerned about what others think than about the couple in front of him wishing to be wed...yeah, I don't think so.

 

Sounds like this couple might be better off in a new church, far away from gossips anyways.

[Danestress]

As someone who has married a widower myself, I'm surprised at all the "none of their business" type answers. Technically, I guess it's not their "official" business. But your friend needs to understand that for some people, this is going to be very painful. If she's moving into his home, she's going to redecorate and some people will shed tears. When she sends out a family Christmas card, some people will feel very sad when they open it. And yes, her wedding day is going to be bittersweet for many people, perhaps even her husband. It's just a fact of life. Even people who really love her and are happy to see them married are going to feel very sad at times, and it's not a rational kind of sad. They can feel two things at once - thrilled for the newlyweds and very very stabblingly sad.

 

I'm assuming that the pastor has that kind of sadness himself and is projecting it on other people. So I would ask him if that's possibly the case, and I would give him the benefit of the doubt. Perhaps he's just an extraordinarily sensitive person and he feels odd *himself* about this.

 

Anyway, I'm not saying that they shouldn't get married or that they should change their date. But I think it's a mistake to go into this with a, "None of your business, we will please ourselves" attitude. I've been there, and being the next wife isn't easy. But it's not made easier by getting defensive in the face of other people's emotional reactions to things.

 

By the way, we got marred 3 1/2 years after my husband's fist wife died. It was a respectable amount of time and everyone was very happy for us and positive about it. But of course it was painful for some people too. 15 years, 2 more children, and 7 houses later, I think everyone is used to me:) But I really can't begrudge how people feel because mostly they don't choose to feel it. They just do.

 

And I've learned as I have gotten older and seen a generation pass away that for many people, every wedding is sort of sad, as is every graduation and every birth. There is always that, "Oh wow, isn't this wonderful" and then a, "I wish his grandfather could have lived to see it" feeling. If that bothers her, she actually might want to consider moving the date voluntarily, because while she can insist on getting married when she wants and tell the pastor to pound sand, she' can't actually control the way people feel on the inside, and people probably are more prone to think, "wow, just think ... two years ago...." in the weeks right before and right after the anniversary of the death.

[Joanne]

Hm. I guess I need more info on the nature of the "objections".

 

There is a world of difference between a gentle nudge to keep the 1st anniversary date and the date of the new marriage apart vs. issues with remarriage in general.

 

The fact is that grief is not formulaic. Although Kubler-Ross gave us much needed insight into the *process* of grief, it is not something that ever ends. Two things can co exist: he can be ready for a healthy remarriage and still in grief over losing his first love. A mature couple can navigate any complications that come from that reality.

[mazakaal]

If that bothers her, she actually might want to consider moving the date voluntarily, because while she can insist on getting married when she wants and tell the pastor to pound sand, she' can't actually control the way people feel on the inside, and people probably are more prone to think, "wow, just think ... two years ago...." in the weeks right before and right after the anniversary of the death.

 

 

Actually, she isn't fussing about it. I just thought it was really strange.

 

It's good to hear a different perspective, though. Thank you for sharing your story.

[*********]

As someone who has married a widower myself, I'm surprised at all the "none of their business" type answers. Technically, I guess it's not their "official" business. But your friend needs to understand that for some people, this is going to be very painful. If she's moving into his home, she's going to redecorate and some people will shed tears. When she sends out a family Christmas card, some people will feel very sad when they open it. And yes, her wedding day is going to be bittersweet for many people, perhaps even her husband. It's just a fact of life. Even people who really love her and are happy to see them married are going to feel very sad at times, and it's not a rational kind of sad. They can feel two things at once - thrilled for the newlyweds and very very stabblingly sad.

 

I'm assuming that the pastor has that kind of sadness himself and is projecting it on other people. So I would ask him if that's possibly the case, and I would give him the benefit of the doubt. Perhaps he's just an extraordinarily sensitive person and he feels odd *himself* about this.

 

Anyway, I'm not saying that they shouldn't get married or that they should change their date. But I think it's a mistake to go into this with a, "None of your business, we will please ourselves" attitude. I've been there, and being the next wife isn't easy. But it's not made easier by getting defensive in the face of other people's emotional reactions to things.

 

By the way, we got marred 3 1/2 years after my husband's fist wife died. It was a respectable amount of time and everyone was very happy for us and positive about it. But of course it was painful for some people too. 15 years, 2 more children, and 7 houses later, I think everyone is used to me:) But I really can't begrudge how people feel because mostly they don't choose to feel it. They just do.

 

And I've learned as I have gotten older and seen a generation pass away that for many people, every wedding is sort of sad, as is every graduation and every birth. There is always that, "Oh wow, isn't this wonderful" and then a, "I wish his grandfather could have lived to see it" feeling. If that bothers her, she actually might want to consider moving the date voluntarily, because while she can insist on getting married when she wants and tell the pastor to pound sand, she' can't actually control the way people feel on the inside, and people probably are more prone to think, "wow, just think ... two years ago...." in the weeks right before and right after the anniversary of the death.

 

 

How wonderfully said. :001_smile:

[AuntieM]

Okay, I have not read all of the responses, but I am going to chime in here.

 

My mother recently remarried, my father passed away two years ago. She remarried on the 19th, he died on the 29th. I can tell you that for a number of reasons this remarriage is difficult for me, but on top of those things, I felt it was too close to the anniversary of his death. Like a weird celebration of that day. It was weird and I felt like it was in poor taste.

 

I confess that there are other circumstances that probably influence my thoughts on this. However, it was pretty tedious to repeatedly respond to those who got the dates mixed up and called me, mortified, that she would schedule her wedding on the anniversary of her first husband's death.

 

I do not believe the pastor has the right to dictate a date. But I do believe that he has seen this type of situation more than once and is speaking on behalf of those that still mark the day of their loved one's passing. I do not believe he is saying two years is too short a time to wait to remarry, I believe he really means the *date* is not appropriate.

 

Just my pair o' pennies.

[Yolanda]

I would suggest directing them to GriefShare.org. I facilitate this ministry and it's wonderful. In one of the sessions they address this with more detail than a simple time of 1 year, etc.

 

Check it out.