Really need some outside perspective here regarding ds' reckless friend...

[Julpost]

Last weekend, 13yo ds went on a scout camping trip nearby. One of the boys was chopping wood w/another boy and I guess started swinging at a moth or something....he ended up hittting the other boys thumb and the boy had to go to the ER for 6 stitches. This boy has always had poor impulse control. Anyway, dh does not feel comfortable having ds go on anymore scout camping trips w/this kid around (he feels like he would be putting ds in potentially life threatening situations) and wants to find another scout troop. We live in a rural area, the troop is very small, I think it maybe has a total of 10 boys.

 

I'd like some outside advice on how to deal w/this. We're going to talk to the troop leader and the boys dad, who is also the boys patrol leader. I'm not quite ready to leave the troop and I'm inclined to allow ds to go on this weekends camp-out but dh is pretty livid and I'm wondering if I'm under-reacting. I'm pretty maxed out w/things at home right now and my brain is in perpetual brain fog.

[Pajama Mama]

Umm...Was this boy supervised with the ax? I really hope so. If not, then *I* wouldn't want my ds with a troop like that. He was swinging the ax in the air at a moth and no one yelled at him to stop it?!? It's fortunate that the boy ONLY needed 6 stitches. It could have been much worse. I agree that the boy is careless but I'm more concerned that he was using an ax unsupervised.

[In the Rain]

Umm...Was this boy supervised with the ax? I really hope so. If not, then *I* wouldn't want my ds with a troop like that. He was swinging the ax in the air at a moth and no one yelled at him to stop it?!? It's fortunate that the boy ONLY needed 6 stitches. It could have been much worse. I agree that the boy is careless but I'm more concerned that he was using an ax unsupervised.

 

:iagree: with everything she said. I don't think you are overreacting!

[dangermom]

Seriously, he was swinging an ax around? (Is anyone getting a mental picture of the Tin Woodsman here? Remember how he got all those tin parts?) That's extremely dangerous. I would not be inclined to allow a camping trip--

 

a) This boy clearly cannot be trusted with dangerous tools or situations.

b) He needs to be supervised at all times, which evidently he was not.

c) Therefore, you cannot trust the troop leaders to properly supervise this boy.

d) They will need to earn that trust by demonstrating over time, in safer circumstances, that they have the situation under control. (Or you could just cut right to leaving the troop.)

e) Therefore, at this time it is not appropriate to allow your son on a campout that includes this boy and those leaders.

 

That's my take on it. I'm all for letting kids take risks and whatnot, but a kid who is prone to swinging axes around as though they are toys is not mature enough for the situations he is being put into.

[Stacie]

Were there no consequences to ax-boy's actions? I would think any troop worth it's charter has a discipline plan in place. The boy should be put on probation and not be allowed to attend a certain number of upcoming events. Letting him continue to participate perpetuates his immature behavior. Scouting involves character training, which includes self-control.

 

If the leaders of the troop do not follow through with their policies, or have none in place, regarding discipline, I would leave and find another. Your son's well being is more important than the camping trip.

[Impish]

Seriously, he was swinging an ax around? (Is anyone getting a mental picture of the Tin Woodsman here? Remember how he got all those tin parts?) That's extremely dangerous. I would not be inclined to allow a camping trip--

 

a) This boy clearly cannot be trusted with dangerous tools or situations.

b) He needs to be supervised at all times, which evidently he was not.

c) Therefore, you cannot trust the troop leaders to properly supervise this boy.

d) They will need to earn that trust by demonstrating over time, in safer circumstances, that they have the situation under control. (Or you could just cut right to leaving the troop.)

e) Therefore, at this time it is not appropriate to allow your son on a campout that includes this boy and those leaders.

 

That's my take on it. I'm all for letting kids take risks and whatnot, but a kid who is prone to swinging axes around as though they are toys is not mature enough for the situations he is being put into.

:iagree:

I wouldn't allow my kids back. It sounds too much like Lord Of The Flies waiting to happen to me, and the adults are nowhere to be found as far as supervision goes if a kid was swinging an axe around at a moth.

 

I'm siding with your dh on this one. Its sheer luck/God protecting that nobody was more seriously injured or killed.

[abbeyej]

It wouldn't necessarily concern me that a 13yo wasn't directly supervised while using an ax. A young teen with proper training (regarding using the ax and safety) who is generally trustworthy might not need an adult standing over him at all times.

 

*But* this *particular* teen has a history of reckless behavior. And yet the leadership of the troop allowed *him* to use an ax unsupervised. And the child put his fellow scouts in severe danger. (And as someone else pointed out, with him swinging an ax wildly, they're lucky stitches were all that was necessary!)

 

So I think I'd agree with your dh on this. The leaders of the troop knew this boy was a danger to himself and others, and they did not take appropriate steps to reign him in or provide some external "impulse control" (since his internal measures are clearly inadequate).

 

I'd look for another troop.

[In The Great White North]

Ds tells me that there should be a roped off area, with only one boy using an ax in it. The area should be large enough that swinging the ax around can't reach anyone else (for just this reason.) Was it? Why was another boy in it?

We're going to talk to the troop leader and the boys dad, who is also the boys patrol leader.

 

I was under the impression that Patrol Leaders were boys ( at least that's what the patch on ds uniform said a few years ago.) If the dad was the Patrol Leader, it sounds like they were already trying to provide more supervision. Which obviously wasn't too successful.

 

However, accidents can happen really quickly, and this one could have happened even if the dad were standing right there. By the time he told his son to stop swinging the ax, it would have impacted. (Where was the dad when this happened?)

 

What was the follow-up on this incident? Was there an investigation? Did the boys get a safety briefing? What procedures in the troop have changed to prevent a recurrence?

 

Has the other troop you could join had any issues? (You will want to make sure you're jumping out of the frying pan into the fire.)

 

Would you dh consider going on camping trips? That may give him a better feeling that your ds will be safe.

[Julpost]

Well I spoke to ax-boy's dad, it sounds like he was using a hatchet to cut bark off a tree, kind of scraping it off, and the other boy reached around the tree and got into his "cutting zone" and only req'd 2 stitches, not 6. The ER was empty that night so they wrapped it up in a "funny" dramatic fashion and the boys concocted a story to tell the others that it req'd 6 stitches. Ds says that ax-boy told him that he was trying to get a moth on the tree, but of course that's not what he said when explaining to the adults. It was about 11pm and it was hard to see w/only a lantern. The other adult called me and explained he felt that neither boy was messing around and it was just one of those things that happen. It wasn't like ax-boy was flailing the ax around wildly, chasing a moth, like ds made it sound. However, I'm still leery because I know this boy can lack serious impulse control & the adults in this troop believe that the boys should have their space....which I agree w/ to a certain extent but I don't know. Anyway, they had a serious discussion about safety and I guess that was the end of it.

 

I seriously want to change troops though because ds told me that at one of the camping trips, he woke up from a nap to find one of the boys standing over him w/ an ax, pretending like he was going to hit him w/it. Scared him to death! The boy was joking but I think that's kind of freaky. No, just kind of freaky, creepy scary and just weird....makes me seriously cringe and feel sick. That's not normal boy humor, is it? Ds doesn't want me to say anything to the adults and doesn't want me to make a deal out of it. Ax-boy makes jokes about threatening w/an ax or hatchet but I guess it's common knowledge that it's a joke and ds doesn't want me to say anything about that either. I don't know why ds wants anything to do w/this troop but he says that some of the boys are pretty nice. There's just a few weird ones. I'm glad this whole situation was brought up because ds had never told us about some of these other things.

[Ravin]

I don't think I would pull him from the troop. I think I would tell him, however, that if he's not comfortable with the situation, I would support him finding a different troop. I would also encourage him to continue talking about things, and why he feels the good outweighs the bad in the group.

 

Accidents happen, and I've know grown adults who shouldn't be trusted with an axe, whether because they're clumsy, impulsive, or just have a lousy sense of humor.

[dirty ethel rackham]

I seriously want to change troops though because ds told me that at one of the camping trips, he woke up from a nap to find one of the boys standing over him w/ an ax, pretending like he was going to hit him w/it. Scared him to death! The boy was joking but I think that's kind of freaky. No, just kind of freaky, creepy scary and just weird....makes me seriously cringe and feel sick. That's not normal boy humor, is it? Ds doesn't want me to say anything to the adults and doesn't want me to make a deal out of it. Ax-boy makes jokes about threatening w/an ax or hatchet but I guess it's common knowledge that it's a joke and ds doesn't want me to say anything about that either. I don't know why ds wants anything to do w/this troop but he says that some of the boys are pretty nice. There's just a few weird ones. I'm glad this whole situation was brought up because ds had never told us about some of these other things.

 

Now THIS is more troubling that the original axe incident (especially as you explained it further.) This behavior is SICK. The fact that axe-boy makes threatening comments (even if joking) should be cause for concern. I would definitely talk to the leaders about this. While I am all for giving boys their space, they still need leadership and consequences when they behave inappropriately. The boys that have impulse control should have more supervision that boys who have proven themselves trustworthy. Leaders have ways of making this happen. The axe would be locked up and only given to boys who are responsible. Axe-boy would be given lots of chores to keep him busy and occupied and in sight.

We had similar problems in my son's old troop. There was a serious void of leadership. I went on a camping trip because I had expertise in what they were doing that weekend (climbing.) I could not believe the disrespect shown to me (a mom, climbing instructor, guest.) I could not believe the safety rules that were ignored. I especially could not believe the behavior after lights out. When I complained, the leaders shrugged it off as "boys will be boys." I'm sorry, but I want better. I want my son to learn to be a man, not an immature, ill-behaved hellion. We found another troop that was much better run. While it is "boy-led", the leadership is strong and involved. Dh is an ASM and has been invovled in discipline for boys who didn't have much self-discipline. He has sat in on committee meetings were these types of problems were discussed. It is not a perfect troop, but we think the good outweighs the bad.

[Stacie]

Well I spoke to ax-boy's dad, it sounds like he was using a hatchet to cut bark off a tree, kind of scraping it off, and the other boy reached around the tree and got into his "cutting zone" and only req'd 2 stitches, not 6. The ER was empty that night so they wrapped it up in a "funny" dramatic fashion and the boys concocted a story to tell the others that it req'd 6 stitches. Ds says that ax-boy told him that he was trying to get a moth on the tree, but of course that's not what he said when explaining to the adults. It was about 11pm and it was hard to see w/only a lantern. The other adult called me and explained he felt that neither boy was messing around and it was just one of those things that happen. It wasn't like ax-boy was flailing the ax around wildly, chasing a moth, like ds made it sound. However, I'm still leery because I know this boy can lack serious impulse control & the adults in this troop believe that the boys should have their space....which I agree w/ to a certain extent but I don't know. Anyway, they had a serious discussion about safety and I guess that was the end of it.

 

I seriously want to change troops though because ds told me that at one of the camping trips, he woke up from a nap to find one of the boys standing over him w/ an ax, pretending like he was going to hit him w/it. Scared him to death! The boy was joking but I think that's kind of freaky. No, just kind of freaky, creepy scary and just weird....makes me seriously cringe and feel sick. That's not normal boy humor, is it? Ds doesn't want me to say anything to the adults and doesn't want me to make a deal out of it. Ax-boy makes jokes about threatening w/an ax or hatchet but I guess it's common knowledge that it's a joke and ds doesn't want me to say anything about that either. I don't know why ds wants anything to do w/this troop but he says that some of the boys are pretty nice. There's just a few weird ones. I'm glad this whole situation was brought up because ds had never told us about some of these other things.

 

 

I don't mean to get bogged down in the details, but I still have to question the supervision of this troop. Why did ax-boy, well known for his immature antics, have access to an ax (hatchet?) at 11:00pm? And if the hatchet was actually his, as some boys do carry one as a camping tool, why was he using it to de-bark a tree--by lantern light? What is the purpose of defacing a tree? And how does this fit into the "Leave no trace" rule?

 

I understand that scouts should be given plenty of room to grow, mature, make mistakes, and learn from them. However, scouts have to earn the trust of the leadership to be given more freedom and thus more responsibility. The leadership should be more proactive and work with those that do not yet have the maturity so they may grow into more independence. Boys should not be given equal footing without consideration of their abilities and common sense.

 

I would try out a few troops before deciding to change since some may be more lenient than the one you are in. But I would still consider changing. The act of standing over my son with an ax during his sleep speaks volumes about the character and self control of one member. The fact that others may have found it humorous speaks even more. That behavior would NEVER fly in our troop.

Edited May 6, 2009 by Stacie

[scrappyhappymama]

I am all for the idea that sometimes accidents happen, and even that boys will be boys to an extent. But several parts of this story really disturb me.

 

First off, the fact that the young man involved lied to his father about exactly what happened during the accident, and that his father is accepting this story and basically brushing off the incident is worrisome. I wouldn't pull a child from a troop if an accident happened- if it were openly discussed and used as a safety training opportunity. But that doesn't seem to be the case here.

 

Why was an axe being wielded at 11pm by lantern-light? Why did the children even have access to axes at this time of night? What is the point of stripping bark from a tree anyway that makes it a more acceptable use of the axe than chasing moths? And the story about playing around with the ax and joking about hitting others with axes is the last straw. Really, this sounds like the early stories of a child who grows up to be a very scary character. The lack of supervision and guidance here is appalling, and I would not want my child involved in this at.all. It sounds to me like the boys and the troop are very lucky that this was only a minor accident. I would not leave my kid to find out what happens next.

[wagnfun]

Last weekend, 13yo ds went on a scout camping trip nearby. One of the boys was chopping wood w/another boy and I guess started swinging at a moth or something....he ended up hittting the other boys thumb and the boy had to go to the ER for 6 stitches. This boy has always had poor impulse control. Anyway, dh does not feel comfortable having ds go on anymore scout camping trips w/this kid around (he feels like he would be putting ds in potentially life threatening situations) and wants to find another scout troop. We live in a rural area, the troop is very small, I think it maybe has a total of 10 boys.

 

I'd like some outside advice on how to deal w/this. We're going to talk to the troop leader and the boys dad, who is also the boys patrol leader. I'm not quite ready to leave the troop and I'm inclined to allow ds to go on this weekends camp-out but dh is pretty livid and I'm wondering if I'm under-reacting. I'm pretty maxed out w/things at home right now and my brain is in perpetual brain fog.

 

Quick answer here, boys are boys, kids are kids-- where was the adult in charge b/c hes the one to blame?

 

Last week my kids got a ball caught in a tree. My 13 yr old & his 14 yr old friend threw a push broom in the air at the stuck ball. Neither one thought about the 6 yr old under the street looking up at the ball.

 

6 hrs & 3 stitches to the 6 yr olds head later, I blame myself for not being out there watching instead of just listening from the kitchen while cleaning up.

 

I do not blame the 13 yr old for not thinking like an adult.

[joannqn]

Even if there was no other scout troop in the area he could go to, my son would never attend another meeting with this troop.

 

The kid shouldn't have had the ax at 11pm in the first place.

The kid shouldn't have been defacing the tree with an ax at any time.

Kids should not hold axes directed at people, let alone sleeping people.

Kids should not be making threats with an ax, even as a joke.

There seems to be a serious lack of discipline and supervision in this troop.

 

Just think...what would have happened had another kid accidentally bumped into the kid holding the ax over son's sleeping head, causing him to accidentally drop it. Your child could be dead right now. No troop is worth that kind of risk.

 

Axes and hatches must be reserved solely for those who have demonstrated the maturity to handle them properly at all times.

[Sebastian (a lady)]

There are several things in your posts that are violations of BSA policy.

 

Axes are for use in an axe yard, a controlled area that is typically roped off with only one entrance, exactly so that people don't accidentally walk into where one is being used. Only scouts who have a card certifying their understanding of the safety rules and proper use of an axe can even use one. The use described should result in his losing this card and having to go through the process to earn it again.

 

You are not supposed to strip bark, break off branches, carve, notch or otherwise harm living trees.

 

There is no hazing allowed in scouts. The nighttime incident you describe in the later post isn't even in a gray area. It is well into the hazing zone (for comparison, having kids sing a song to get lost items back is also considered hazing).

 

11pm is quite late for boys to still be up and about. It is well past even the cracker barrel time for patrol leaders and adult leaders.

 

The boys came back from the ER and were deceptive about how bad the injury had been. (Is this a harmless prank or does it fly in the face of A Scout is Trustworthy?)

 

There are possibly excuses, I mean reasons, for some of what happened. And I know that my own scout son is not always the most accurate source of information on what has happened at meetings. But it sounds like there is a lot of not following BSA rules, which makes me wonder what else is being done just because it sounds like a good idea. Patrol method and boy run is not a license to do harm to other scouts, either through foolishness or intent.

 

I spent several hours reading scout stuff last night. I particularly found the Ask Andy column helpful for thinking about issues with troops and troop leadership. If you have an issue with the practices of this troop, you pretty much have two choices, in my mind. Get very involved with the troop (committee, making sure that the boys and leaders have the right training, etc) or look for another troop. It just isn't going to be very effective if you or dh come in angry without also coming in willing to help provide leadership to the troop. You might look at the last question on this column as you're thinking about your options.

[amy g.]

Well, my son has had some pretty dangerous kids in his scout troop. I insist that Dh or I are present at every scout function. Dh even spends a week at summer camp. He really stays in the background, and helps other kids, but Ds knows he is there if needed, and so do the bullies.

 

Because we are there, and helping, we have succeeded in getting one very dangerous child changed into a "special needs" troop. We just had to keep documenting events until the scout master did not have a choice but to take action.

 

There will probably be more kids like that who join, but we will just deal with it when the time comes.

[mcconnellboys]

Well, having been there and done that, I'd say pull him now. I won't go into the gory details of our bad to worse experiences as I have in past several times, but will just say that a troop is only as good as its adult leaders. If they can not or will not keep the boys safe without the need of other parents having a fit *after* an incident, then I would absolutely not trust that there won't be a next time.

 

For us, there were incidents for every single camping trip but one leading up to the first summer camp (thumb sliced with axe requiring trip to hospital an hour away; third degree burns to hand resulting in permanent nerve damage, etc., etc.), where some of the boys were lighting their spray deodorant cans to make flame throwers.......And then there was the bullying of my son, on and on, endlessly, by both the adults and other boys.

[Julpost]

After talking further w/ds and hearing that the hatchet was about 2" from his throat, I called the scout master-who I felt completely minimized the entire situation. It wasn't until I asked him how he'd feel if it were his son that he took it a bit more seriously and said he'd call the mother. She called me, told me she talked to her son, he denied it, so he didn't do it. I just thanked her for calling me and let it go. I certainly wasn't going to argue w/her but I do believe her son has more motive to lie than my son does. In fact I see no reason whatsoever for ds to make up such a story. I also see no evidence of lying in his daily life here at home, so I'm inclined to believe him. Anyway, dh and I have decided that he can go on the camporee this weekend because the hatchet-boy won't be there but after that, we'll find some troops for him to visit. He's bummed, mostly because this is the group he's familiar with, it's the unfamiliar that unnerves him. I hope we can find a decent group of guys in a scout troop for him.

 

As if this weren't enough, while I was talking to the patrol leader, he referred to the ax injury as a nick! Do I need it any plainer that this group doesn't take safety too seriously? That's the first I've heard of a "nick" needing stitches.

 

Crazy.

[katemary63]

Well, my son has had some pretty dangerous kids in his scout troop. I insist that Dh or I are present at every scout function. Dh even spends a week at summer camp. He really stays in the background, and helps other kids, but Ds knows he is there if needed, and so do the bullies.

 

Because we are there, and helping, we have succeeded in getting one very dangerous child changed into a "special needs" troop. We just had to keep documenting events until the scout master did not have a choice but to take action.

 

There will probably be more kids like that who join, but we will just deal with it when the time comes.

 

This is what I was going to say - Don't take him out of scouts - just be there. If that's not possible, then maybe he has to get out of the group, but that would be sad for the sake of the good kids and the friendships he does have and the things he could learn.

[Julpost]

This is what I was going to say - Don't take him out of scouts - just be there. If that's not possible, then maybe he has to get out of the group, but that would be sad for the sake of the good kids and the friendships he does have and the things he could learn.

 

 

Dh goes camping with the troop when he can but often he just can't make it. He feels strongly that since we can't trust the leadership, we need to look for a troop w/ hopefully more level headed boys and better supervision. We just don't see any other way.

[Julpost]

My brother-in-law, who is a 6th grade teacher, thinks we should sit down with hatchet-boy, his mom, and ds and try to get the truth out of this boy. He doesn't like the idea of the boy getting away with saying he didn't do it. He thinks if we grill him long enough, he'll crack. He said to threaten to bring in the cops and file assault charges if we need to, that this boy needs to feel the seriousness of the situation-putting a hatchet to ds's neck is serious business.

 

Is this going over the top?

[Danestress]

My brother-in-law, who is a 6th grade teacher, thinks we should sit down with hatchet-boy, his mom, and ds and try to get the truth out of this boy. He doesn't like the idea of the boy getting away with saying he didn't do it. He thinks if we grill him long enough, he'll crack. He said to threaten to bring in the cops and file assault charges if we need to, that this boy needs to feel the seriousness of the situation-putting a hatchet to ds's neck is serious business.

 

Is this going over the top?

 

 

I think it's a bit over the top, and if I were this child's Mom I would never take my child to a meeting where his father was not asked to be present and where the goal was to get him to "crack."

 

Sometimes kids get away with saying they didn't do things when they really did. If you think you have a reason to call the cops, call the cops. I wouldn't use that as a way to try to leverage a confession. You are not this child's parent, nor, if I understand correctly, are either you or your son the victim. Nor are threats of calling the cops, when that's not something you actually intend to do, a good way to get what you want in life.

 

You have the right to make decisions for your child. I would not allow my son to attend overnight events with a boy scout troup if I didn't trust the leadership. Period. Listen to your husband and do what is best for your family, and bow out gracefully. If you really think this is worth "grilling" a child over until he "cracks," get professionals in to do the job (they won't do it, of course, because they won't see any reason to think a crime was committed, nor do I).

 

I think this boy sounds like potential trouble. But you can't make the world trouble free. You just have to protect your child. It sounds like maybe the leadership is a bit sloppy (though I personally wouldn't think twice about letting a kid use an ax to remove some bark from a log and wouldn't feel the need to supervise that closely, though I guess the nighttime thing is worrisome). An accident happened. Leadership was sloppy. The kid sounds super weird. If you honestly believe he's a threat to your son, though, setting up a "grilling" session with your son there is probably not a good idea. It might just make the kid want revenge.

[Julpost]

I think it's a bit over the top, and if I were this child's Mom I would never take my child to a meeting where his father was not asked to be present and where the goal was to get him to "crack."

 

Sometimes kids get away with saying they didn't do things when they really did. If you think you have a reason to call the cops, call the cops. I wouldn't use that as a way to try to leverage a confession. You are not this child's parent, nor, if I understand correctly, are either you or your son the victim. Nor are threats of calling the cops, when that's not something you actually intend to do, a good way to get what you want in life.

 

You have the right to make decisions for your child. I would not allow my son to attend overnight events with a boy scout troup if I didn't trust the leadership. Period. Listen to your husband and do what is best for your family, and bow out gracefully. If you really think this is worth "grilling" a child over until he "cracks," get professionals in to do the job (they won't do it, of course, because they won't see any reason to think a crime was committed, nor do I).

 

I think this boy sounds like potential trouble. But you can't make the world trouble free. You just have to protect your child. It sounds like maybe the leadership is a bit sloppy (though I personally wouldn't think twice about letting a kid use an ax to remove some bark from a log and wouldn't feel the need to supervise that closely, though I guess the nighttime thing is worrisome). An accident happened. Leadership was sloppy. The kid sounds super weird. If you honestly believe he's a threat to your son, though, setting up a "grilling" session with your son there is probably not a good idea. It might just make the kid want revenge.

 

I can totally see what you're saying except for 2 things: my son was the victim, he's the one who woke up to a hatchet being inches away from his throat and yes, I think that is a crime. Maybe threat of assault or something, I don't know. I know the boy backed off, laughed and said it was a joke but you know what, that was a serious, serious offense. I think it's akin to pulling a knife on someone, even if that person says, oops, nah, just kidding....that doesn't undo the emotional trauma.

[Tree House Academy]

In your first few posts, I didn't take it that axe-boy was one and the same as hatchet to the throat boy. I am guessing now that it was the same kid?

 

The whole "while he was asleep" thing bothers me. Was someone else watching? Were they playing around? I mean, if there were other kids there and such, then it may have been a joke (an ignorant and horribly distasteful/dangerous joke..) However, if it was just your son and the other kid, then that is just...well....psycho.

 

I am not sure I would get the cops involved. It is your son's word against the other child's. There is really no way to "prove" anything unless others saw the incident.

 

I had an incident at my son's school last year (when he was in ps). He had a bully all year and that child was a total LIAR. All year long, my son would tell the teacher something the other boy did and he would lie his way out of it...to the point the teacher thought he was a freakin' saint! Well, on the last day of school, I was in the hall waiting on my son and the bully came out first. He slowed his pace, waited on my son and punched him...with me WATCHING. Of course, I should have said nothing and gone straight to the principal, but I didn't. I grabbed my son's hand, glared at the other kid, and said, "DO NOT TOUCH MY SON AGAIN! I AM TIRED OF THE BULLYING! THE NEXT TIME, WE ARE GOING TO TALK TO THE PRINCIPAL." I was in a hall full of adults and other kids. Lots of people heard me. However, this little liar went and told his grandmother (with whom he lives) that I said...and I quote here, "Get out of my way you little fat bastard or I will smack you." (SORRY, I now find it amusing since 1. I would never say that to a child and 2. that was probably more along the lines of what I was thinking at the time than what I ACTUALLY said. LOL) Anyway, the child was brought into the office for intensive questioning. He never "cracked." And remember, this lie was about an ADULT - with witnesses who were also adults! It came down to the principal of the school finally determining that I obviously did not say that...and telling the child she did not believe him. He still never told the truth. To this day, he swears I said that to him. Talk about wishing I could smack him.....

Edited May 7, 2009 by Tree House Academy

[Danestress]

If you believe that was a crime and that you want to pursue it as such, call the police.

 

If you think it's just really creepy and don't want your child around the boy, then withdraw him from the troop and perhaps write a letter explaining what happened. Let them know you are keeping the letter in case there are any other problems. If you have fully explained what happened to everyone in troop leadership and they are not willing to do anything about it, and if you don't want to call the police, then at least do this because it will create a record of the fact that they were alerted to the potential problems with this child.

 

I just think it's a really bad idea for Mom to decide to grill a confession out of someone else's 11 year old. It's really not the most professional or even the smartest way to handle a problem like this. It puts your child in a truly horrible situation - being in a room confronting someone who ... what? Who he believes wanted to kill him? Or just hurt him? Or just scare him? Anyway, I would not subject my child to that. If I really wanted to do something more about it, other than work through boy scouts leadership, I would call the police.

 

I would not send my child on another overnight with this other kid *ever* and I probably wouldn't send my son on another overnight anywhere until I was sure that if something like that happened, he would call me immediately and report it to those in authority immediately. I think it's hard for kids when something like that happens. Take this opportunity to talk a lot to your son about how if anyone makes him uncomfortable, acts weird like that etc, he is to tell you right away. I know from my own childhood experiences that that's a talk I needed and didn't get!

[amyco]

I talked to my dh about this and he said if this ever happened to our son, we'd be looking for a new trip immediately. Hatchets should be secured for the night and not available to boys or kept in their tents. It sounds like the leaders are asleep on the job so to speak here. My dh is a trained leader and he says that the Boy Scout insurance will not protect leaders who knowingly didn't follow their training (as in letting a boy wield a hatchet under the wrong conditions), if God forbid something even worse should happen.

 

Granted, as it's a small troop, the leaders might not be trained properly, but somewhere up the line someone will have had to be trained.

 

I agree with some previous posters that too many Boy Scout code violoations are happening with this troop, and the leaders are minimizing it, that I would look elsewhere. If it were me, I wouldn't even bother with trying to talk to ax-boy's mother again, but I might let the Scout master know why you are leaving. I and my dh also agree that ax-boy should have some kind of consequences--if he doesn't, that's another reason to go. My dh pulled some stunts in his youth and had to pay consequences such as community service, etc., to prove that he really did want to be a Scout. A lecture on safety is not enough.

 

Not to mention the fact that waking up with an axe at your throat just isn't funny.

[Unicorn.]

If the scoutmaster isn't doing anything about the boy who held the axe to your son's throat, then it is time to call your council rep. Regardless of whether or not you switch troops, you need to let council know the things that are going on in this troop. The thumb incident doesn't worry me, but the axe to your ds while sleeping is a Huge concern!

[mamaof2andtwins]

There are several things in your posts that are violations of BSA policy.

 

Axes are for use in an axe yard, a controlled area that is typically roped off with only one entrance, exactly so that people don't accidentally walk into where one is being used. Only scouts who have a card certifying their understanding of the safety rules and proper use of an axe can even use one. The use described should result in his losing this card and having to go through the process to earn it again.

 

You are not supposed to strip bark, break off branches, carve, notch or otherwise harm living trees.

 

There is no hazing allowed in scouts. The nighttime incident you describe in the later post isn't even in a gray area. It is well into the hazing zone (for comparison, having kids sing a song to get lost items back is also considered hazing).

 

11pm is quite late for boys to still be up and about. It is well past even the cracker barrel time for patrol leaders and adult leaders.

 

The boys came back from the ER and were deceptive about how bad the injury had been. (Is this a harmless prank or does it fly in the face of A Scout is Trustworthy?)

 

There are possibly excuses, I mean reasons, for some of what happened. And I know that my own scout son is not always the most accurate source of information on what has happened at meetings. But it sounds like there is a lot of not following BSA rules, which makes me wonder what else is being done just because it sounds like a good idea. Patrol method and boy run is not a license to do harm to other scouts, either through foolishness or intent.

 

I spent several hours reading scout stuff last night. I particularly found the Ask Andy column helpful for thinking about issues with troops and troop leadership. If you have an issue with the practices of this troop, you pretty much have two choices, in my mind. Get very involved with the troop (committee, making sure that the boys and leaders have the right training, etc) or look for another troop. It just isn't going to be very effective if you or dh come in angry without also coming in willing to help provide leadership to the troop. You might look at the last question on this column as you're thinking about your options.

 

:iagree:

 

I was also going to recommend that if you chose not to find another troop that you and your dh be present for everything and dh goes camping with his son.

 

Jennie

[katemary63]

I can totally see what you're saying except for 2 things: my son was the victim, he's the one who woke up to a hatchet being inches away from his throat and yes, I think that is a crime. Maybe threat of assault or something, I don't know. I know the boy backed off, laughed and said it was a joke but you know what, that was a serious, serious offense. I think it's akin to pulling a knife on someone, even if that person says, oops, nah, just kidding....that doesn't undo the emotional trauma.

 

You know, I've been thinking about this. I do not LIKE what happened. I think it is foolish to have "jokingly" held a hatchet up to someone....and if I were your son's mom I would be mad too. However......I actually think my son would do this. He is 22 now, but I think this is something he would have done when he was younger. He does have ADD and very little impulse controle, but he was NOT a bad kid and would never actually hurt someone. He had lots of freinds and was always very popular. But he also was/ is a little on the cooky side and I can see him doing this to one of his freinds just to freak them out and then laugh. Foolish and stupid, I agree. Requiring discipline, I agree. But...not NESSECCERILY a sign of something sinister IMO, maybe just immaturity and lack of common sence.

[2cents]

Even if there was no other scout troop in the area he could go to, my son would never attend another meeting with this troop.

 

The kid shouldn't have had the ax at 11pm in the first place.

The kid shouldn't have been defacing the tree with an ax at any time.

Kids should not hold axes directed at people, let alone sleeping people.

Kids should not be making threats with an ax, even as a joke.

There seems to be a serious lack of discipline and supervision in this troop.

 

Just think...what would have happened had another kid accidentally bumped into the kid holding the ax over son's sleeping head, causing him to accidentally drop it. Your child could be dead right now. No troop is worth that kind of risk.

 

Axes and hatches must be reserved solely for those who have demonstrated the maturity to handle them properly at all times.

 

All this! :iagree:

 

There is just too much that is strange about this situation and what they are telling you. I would lean on the side of caution and find another troop before you are in the position of saying that you wish you had trusted your instincts earlier. Ax-boy sounds like he is bordering on unstable and clearly unsupervised and since his parent in in the troop it sounds like he has a ready excuse for what he does.

[Tree House Academy]

You know, I've been thinking about this. I do not LIKE what happened. I think it is foolish to have "jokingly" held a hatchet up to someone....and if I were your son's mom I would be mad too. However......I actually think my son would do this. He is 22 now, but I think this is something he would have done when he was younger. He does have ADD and very little impulse controle, but he was NOT a bad kid and would never actually hurt someone. He had lots of freinds and was always very popular. But he also was/ is a little on the cooky side and I can see him doing this to one of his freinds just to freak them out and then laugh. Foolish and stupid, I agree. Requiring discipline, I agree. But...not NESSECCERILY a sign of something sinister IMO, maybe just immaturity and lack of common sence.

 

Sadly, I could see my ADHD son doing about the same thing. The other day, the were in the garden and I drove my car around on the wet grass to tell dh something before I left. My older son walked right in front of my car and stood. It was all I could do to not hit him when the tires slid a bit on the grass. We gave him LOTS of reasons that was the most ignorant thing EVER.

 

He also has no impulse control and when he was 5, he stabbed another child in the head with a pencil. He wasn't trying to hurt the child...he was trying to be the "mom" and he was telling the child it was circle time. He just happened to have a pencil in his hand at the time. He is still not a mean kid and he doesn't do things purposefully to hurt people...he just does things without THOUGHT of what it may or may not mean/represent/do to himself or others. Someone once described it as "he doesn't have that 'UH-OH' button. And it was true...he doesn't. :(

[CalicoKat]

Last weekend, 13yo ds went on a scout camping trip nearby. One of the boys was chopping wood w/another boy and I guess started swinging at a moth or something....he ended up hittting the other boys thumb and the boy had to go to the ER for 6 stitches. This boy has always had poor impulse control. Anyway, dh does not feel comfortable having ds go on anymore scout camping trips w/this kid around (he feels like he would be putting ds in potentially life threatening situations) and wants to find another scout troop. We live in a rural area, the troop is very small, I think it maybe has a total of 10 boys.

 

I'd like some outside advice on how to deal w/this. We're going to talk to the troop leader and the boys dad, who is also the boys patrol leader. I'm not quite ready to leave the troop and I'm inclined to allow ds to go on this weekends camp-out but dh is pretty livid and I'm wondering if I'm under-reacting. I'm pretty maxed out w/things at home right now and my brain is in perpetual brain fog.

If my DH were concerned to the point of making a change I would step aside and let him. Your son's safety is a priority.

[dirty ethel rackham]

Requiring discipline, I agree. But...not NESSECCERILY a sign of something sinister IMO, maybe just immaturity and lack of common sence.

 

Yes, we do not need to read to much into this child's actions. However, the situation speaks VOLUMES about the quality of the supervision, procedures and training of the adult leaders. That, alone, would be reason for leaving the troop, in my opinion. No matter where you go, there will be kids who have impulse control and do stupid things. But good troops will not tolerate the behavior and have safety procedures in place to prevent dangerous behavior as well as the bullying mentality.

[dirty ethel rackham]

If the scoutmaster isn't doing anything about the boy who held the axe to your son's throat, then it is time to call your council rep. Regardless of whether or not you switch troops, you need to let council know the things that are going on in this troop. The thumb incident doesn't worry me, but the axe to your ds while sleeping is a Huge concern!

 

Also, the fact that proper procedures were not followed about using and storing the ax as well as the unwillingness to enforce the "leave no trace" rules are reasons to call the council as well.

[dangermom]

I don't think it's a good idea to try to pressure the kid into confessing. Bad, bad idea.

 

I also think the problem really is largely with the leadership. The boy is immature and thoughtless--he's a kid who needs supervision. The leaders are responsible for making sure that thoughtlessness and immaturity don't lead to serious accidents, and they're not doing their jobs.

[mcconnellboys]

LOL, when the boys at my son's camp were making the flame throwers and he was trying to tell the adults what was occurring, the father of the two ring-leader boys kept sending him away, saying, "They didn't bring spray-on deodorant to camp with them, so they couldn't be doing that...." Ummm, hello? It didn't have to be *their* deodorant....

 

One adult finally went to see what was going on and stopped it. They called all the boys together to talk to them. The boys said that my son was just tattling because they wouldn't let him join in. SO???? They were still making flame throwers that could have burned any/all of them up and set the woods on fire, as well....

 

So the adults gave him the same punishment as the other boys. They were all awakened at dawn to scrub the floorboards in an unused tent with toothbrushes. All the boys spent their time threatening my son while they scrubbed. No adult interaction to stop any of it. It was his eleventh birthday.....

 

He had a panic attack when I tried to take him to the next meeting after they all got back home. He has auditory and other processing issues and couldn't even really begin to tell me what had happened for weeks afterward.....

 

The man whose sons caused most of the problems and did the bullying of my son later was the leader for all the CIVICS merit badges. He's still with scouting....

[mcconnellboys]

I called the salaried person in charge of scouting for our area to report the many, many things that occurred with my son in the awful troop he got into. He didn't want to hear it. Didn't care one whit about a thing that had happened.

 

I'd been hearing about Lone Scouting from some men working with homeschoolers in Indiana and had been given a lot of literature about it by them. He would not support allowing my son to even attempt to do that.

 

The only option I was given was to "find another troop". My son was too fearful and distrustful by that time to give anyone else a chance - and I quite frankly didn't blame him....

 

I have been HUGELY disappointed by scouting in our city.....

[Renee in NC]

I called the salaried person in charge of scouting for our area to report the many, many things that occurred with my son in the awful troop he got into. He didn't want to hear it. Didn't care one whit about a thing that had happened.

 

I'd been hearing about Lone Scouting from some men working with homeschoolers in Indiana and had been given a lot of literature about it by them. He would not support allowing my son to even attempt to do that.

 

The only option I was given was to "find another troop". My son was too fearful and distrustful by that time to give anyone else a chance - and I quite frankly didn't blame him....

 

I have been HUGELY disappointed by scouting in our city.....

 

As a homeschooler, he can't stop your son from being a lone scout. Go up another level and call HIS boss.

[Karen sn]

Well, if you leave you also leave all those other boys in danger, but I definitely see there IS that danger and for your son it is a threat to his safety. I have kept my dd from dangerous kids.

 

The boy needs some serious safety training and if he can't respect the tools and he's not safe - he loses privledges. PERIOD.

 

You owe it to the entire troop and you shouldn't have to leave.

It's time for a pow-wow.

Safety comes first.

 

ETA - You are not in a fog on this. I would nip in the bud whatever way necessary.

[mcconnellboys]

You know, at the time, I intended to, but it became obvious that my son had lost all interest in doing the programming after all that went on in his group. And he's my mega-socialite, too - so the main reason he wanted to do scouting was to be with all the other boys! I was SO disappointed.....

 

We're trying very hard not to make the same mistakes with our younger son....

[Sebastian (a lady)]

As a homeschooler, he can't stop your son from being a lone scout. Go up another level and call HIS boss.

 

On a practical level, it would be hard to justify anyone not joining as a Lone Scout. We registered our oldest as one when we moved in order to move him up into Boy Scouts and maintain his scouting continuity as we moved.

 

However, it is not a widely used program outside rural areas. So don't expect that your District Exec (DE) knows anything about it. If you read the handbook for Lone Scout counselors, you will often know as much as the DE will.

 

Lone Scouting is discouraged when there are other functioning troops, because the point of the patrol concept is for the boys to learn, not just the content of merit badges, but also to be members of a small team and to lead a team and groups of teams. You don't really do that as a Lone Scout. But you don't do it in a disfunctional troop either.

[Catwoman]

From everything I have read here, I would suggest you leave this troop immediately and find another (or find another activity for your ds.) The leadership of the troop is sorely lacking, and to have had any "axe-related incidents" is frightening, but to have had more than one is nothing short of inexcusable.

 

To those who suggest that kids who have trouble controlling their impulses should be allowed to remain in organized group settings because they would never hurt another child on purpose, I have just one thing to say, and I know it might be a bit harsh, but here goes:

 

If you can't control your kids' behavior, and your kids can't control their own aggressive behavior (no matter how unintentional it may be,) please keep them out of the groups my ds is in. I don't really care whether there is intent to harm, because once a child is injured (or worse,) it really doesn't matter whether or not the other kid did it on purpose, or if he just "couldn't help it" or "wasn't thinking clearly" or "melted down." I don't really care. I don't want my child to have to worry about some kid and his anger management issues or his inability to control his actions, and I don't think it's fair that moms like Julpost have to fear for their children's safety because parents and group leaders don't control the kids' behavior.

 

The very idea that a boy held an axe to another boy's neck is absolutely terrifying to me, and I don't care whether or not it was "a joke." It sure wasn't a joke to the poor boy, and it wouldn't have been a joke to me or my family, either.

 

Sorry if I sound mean about this, but I've seen too many groups end up losing nice members because they were terrorized by other kids who "didn't really mean any harm."

 

Cat

[Brilliant]

...If you can't control your kids' behavior, and your kids can't control their own aggressive behavior (no matter how unintentional it may be,) please keep them out of the groups my ds is in. I don't really care whether there is intent to harm, because once a child is injured (or worse,) it really doesn't matter whether or not the other kid did it on purpose, or if he just "couldn't help it" or "wasn't thinking clearly" or "melted down." I don't really care. I don't want my child to have to worry about some kid and his anger management issues or his inability to control his actions, and I don't think it's fair that moms like Julpost have to fear for their children's safety because parents and group leaders don't control the kids' behavior.

 

Cat

 

I agree with you, to a point. We knew a child a few years ago who was a junior sociopath - completely unable to control his impulses or have any understanding of what others might be thinking or feeling. The last straw with that kid was when he picked up a very large rock (several inches in diameter) and threw it at my daughter's back. It hit her between the shoulder blades and left a large bruise. I shudder to think what would have happened if it had hit the base of her neck, or her head. Both his dad and my husband SAW him do it (but didn't stop it, because how could they have known he was going to hurl the rock at my dd?) He DENIED doing it. He had done it for NO reason - no disagreement with my dd that anybody knew of.

 

There had been other, less serious incidents before that...hitting and lying. After that incident, we stayed completely away from that family. I'm still upset when I think about it.

 

But we know another child who has some impulse control problems...he says and does things unintentionally, I think...We've never seen anything intentional from him, and he's never hurt anyone. But I just keep a closer eye out when he's around, just in case. I wouldn't keep my kids out of a program just because of him. His parents are very involved with supervising him, and trying to get him out of situations before he gets too stressed out.

[Julpost]

Well it has turned into quite a fiasco!

 

I spoke to the Scoutmaster, who reassured me that not only does he have major issues w/the way our patrol leader does things, but he also 100% agrees that there should never have been hatchets at that trip, that the boys need more supervision than the patrol leader believes, he gave me his word that he will keep a close eye on ds's interactions w/the other boys and make sure safety is top priority. He has been talking to the patrol leader emphasizing the need for close supervision and not leaving the boys alone. They seem to be working out some differences of opinion.

 

I then spoke to the patrol leader, that didn't go quite as well. He thinks that everything has been blown out of proportion, and while he didn't come out and say it, he alluded to the fact that he thinks it's ds's fault for creating this exaggerated idea that hatchets were flying around everywhere and there was no supervision. He doesn't believe that the hatchet incident happened, he thinks ds made it up-for whatever reason. He says the reason he believes that is because when I first called about the ax-moth-thumb incident, I said my impression was that his son was chasing a moth w/an ax. Ds had said that the boy had been using a hatchet and was trying to get a moth. That created a picture in my head of the boy waving the hatchet in the air after a moth. When I found out the whole story from the patrol leader, I put 2 and 2 together that ax boy was using the hatchet on bark and was trying to get the moth on the tree, not flailing around crazily. However, the patrol leader thinks that ds said his son was waving the hatchet around. He won't hear any differently. So he believes ds is lying. He kinda flipped out saying he was considering leaving the troop, that this whole thing is ridiculous, and he doesn't care anymore. Dh is livid that the patrol leader is calling ds a liar. We believe ds and won't allow him to be around hatchet-boy w/out the scout master anymore. We were going to take him out of the troop but ds really, really wants to stay and the scout master really tried to reassure us that something like this will never, ever, ever happen again and he will keep a close eye on ds. He really likes ds, thinks he is a great kid, and said not to worry about what the patrol leader thinks.

 

But I'm nervous that I've made things worse for ds by making it seem like ds was exaggerating when this whole situation started w/the thumb injury. He's going on the camporee this weekend, the scout master will be there, and the hatchet boy won't. The patrol leader will be there, as will his son, and I'm nervous about the situation. I told him that the only reason ds was going was because hatchet boy wasn't going to be there. That seemed to really anger him.

 

I truly believe ds is telling the truth and I feel like the patrol leader is going to go after him in some subtle way. It's just a feeling I have. Admittedly I can't prove whether ds is being honest but I can't remember him ever just making something up...especially something of that magnitude. He just doesn't do that. I feel hatchet boy has more of a motive to lie because of course he wouldn't want to get in trouble. What motive does ds have? He almost got yanked out of the troop and he doesn't want that at all. It's making me a little crazy and I don't want the patrol leader bugging him about it.

 

I guess I'll just trust the scoutmaster because I feel he is a very stable, serious, trustworthy man and wait to hear how this weekend goes from ds on Sunday. I hope we're making a good decision.

[dirty ethel rackham]

If you choose to stay in this troop, I strongly suggest that you volunteer to be on the committee. This way, you have a say in what goes on and you can point out areas where they are not following safety rules and remind the troop leaders that they are jeopardizing their BSA insurance when they do that.

 

I am confused about the "patrol leader." Is this a boy or an adult? My understanding is that the adults (and any boy over 18) are either the Scoutmaster or Assistant Scout Masters or committee members. The patrol leader is a boy who is a leader of a patrol. There may be several patrol leaders if there are several patrols. There is also the position of Senior Patrol Leader - a boy who is elected by the troop and is in charge of leading the troop under the supervision and guidance of the Scoutmaster and the ASM's.

[Julpost]

If you choose to stay in this troop, I strongly suggest that you volunteer to be on the committee. This way, you have a say in what goes on and you can point out areas where they are not following safety rules and remind the troop leaders that they are jeopardizing their BSA insurance when they do that.

 

I am confused about the "patrol leader." Is this a boy or an adult? My understanding is that the adults (and any boy over 18) are either the Scoutmaster or Assistant Scout Masters or committee members. The patrol leader is a boy who is a leader of a patrol. There may be several patrol leaders if there are several patrols. There is also the position of Senior Patrol Leader - a boy who is elected by the troop and is in charge of leading the troop under the supervision and guidance of the Scoutmaster and the ASM's.

 

Yep, I got confused. The patrol leader I've been referring to is actually the Assist. Scout Master. Sorry about that. You're right, the boys are the patrol leaders.

[Catwoman]

I truly believe ds is telling the truth and I feel like the patrol leader is going to go after him in some subtle way.

 

I would feel the same way, and I don't know your ds, but I have to say that I believe his account of what happened. There simply is no reason for him to have made it up, and it sounds like he is a trustworthy boy with no history of lying. There just wasn't anything for him to gain by lying, and even though he's a complete stranger to me, I think he was truthful.

 

That said, I'd be worried about the weekend. Can your dh go with your ds? I would only be comfortable with the trip if dh was there (or I was there, but it sounds like this is a "guy thing.")

 

Cat

[Sebastian (a lady)]

It sounds like there is either some communication problems on various levels or a problem with the way the troop is being run. I wanted to make one last string of comments (and then stop).

 

I think that it would be best for your son with dh's guidance to handle this situation.

 

Neither you nor your dh were there, so the best you can do is try to construct the situation from what you've been told. You have a certain opinion of your own son's reliability, however, you also realize that the first way he presented the situation was not the complete picture. (Getting things out of my own son takes quite a bit of digging).

 

Obviously axe safety was not being followed by one or both of the boys involved. This is a clear violation of the requirements of the Totin' Chip (required for axe use except when training for the Totin' Chip). Since someone was in fact injured, it is appropriate to ask if the boys involved have lost their Totin' Chip and are being required to re-earn it. (I say both boys because depending on the situation, the boy who put his hand in the way of the axe may have some responsibility). The answer that dh gets to this question may indicate a lot about how the adult leadership views the situation. (Totin' Chip requirements are in the Boy Scout Handbook under the 2nd Class Requirements)

 

There is little reason for your son to stay in a troop that he isn't comfortable in. Help him to check out any other troop in commuting range. Help him pick one that has it together. Then, I would really suggest that dh or you or both of you get involved as committee members or merit badge counselors or ASM or some other active volunteer position. If you find a great troop, your son can ask some of his friends from the old troop if they want to join too.

 

As my favorite scouter says, scouts join a troop, they don't marry it.

[Julpost]

When I dropped off ds at the church where everyone meets to drive to the camporee together, we were the first to arrive. The Assist. Scoutmaster (ax-boy's dad) arrive and park way down from us and sit in their car. That was pretty awkward to begin with. Then when the Scoutmaster arrived, he greeted ds and everyone started to load up. They were all standing around the truckbed when ax-boy launches a bungy cord thing toward ds's head! Ds ducks and says "nice shot." Ax boy smirks and his dad (assist. scoutmaster) says, "Well he said to watch out!"

 

I am livid!!! Ds came over later and said quietly that he hoped he wouldn't lose his temper this weekend. He was pretty cool about the whole thing but I feel sick. I wish this weekend were already over.