Spy Car Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 And when I ask about reading the Bible, I'm referring to non-expurgated Bibles. Not "Children's Bibles" or Bible stories, but full versions (especially the KJV) and including all books and all passages (especially those with strong sexual content, incest, genocide, end-of-the-world cataclysms, deicide, and other "arguably" adult themes)? What's your feeling? How do you handle this? Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwinMominTX Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 My girls are 7 and we've been reading through the Bible together (real ones) since they were about 5. We've discussed such topics as adultry, incest, murder and rape. I can't think about a better way to approach those topics in a kid appropriate way than using the Bible as starting point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brehon Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 but, I really think that would be entirely dependent on the age/maturity level of one's dc. Some of the passages might be more appropriate for younger children/young adults (i.e. "tweens" -- and I, personally, detest that term) and other passages/books would be more appropriate for older teens. Some people's dc might be ready for the unabridged Bible at much younger ages that other people's dc. I also think that one's "world view" (for lack of a better term) might also play into this decision. So, that's a rather long winded way of saying that there probably isn't an age where every child ought to be reading the Bible. Usual caveats apply here...JMHO and YMMV. And when I ask about reading the Bible, I'm referring to non-expurgated Bibles. Not "Children's Bibles" or Bible stories, but full versions (especially the KJV) and including all books and all passages (especially those with strong sexual content, incest, genocide, end-of-the-world cataclysms, deicide, and other "arguably" adult themes)? What's your feeling? How do you handle this? Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SquirrellyMama Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 My dd is 7 and reading the bible. I feel whenever they can read they should be allowed to read it. I agree with another poster who said the Bible is a great way to discuss many issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newlifemom Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 And when I ask about reading the Bible, I'm referring to non-expurgated Bibles. Not "Children's Bibles" or Bible stories, but full versions (especially the KJV) and including all books and all passages (especially those with strong sexual content, incest, genocide, end-of-the-world cataclysms, deicide, and other "arguably" adult themes)? What's your feeling? How do you handle this? Bill Because my oldest doesn't really question things (I know, she should), she reads her Bible (full text but simpliflied language similar to NIV) on her own and while I don't see her just picking up and reading Song of Solomon because it is not scripture that gets a lot of refences; she generally skims stuff she doesn't understand. I am constantly torn as to how much to expose he to, yet in many other places in the world, children much younger than she are regularly exposed to these things. Think, Tsunamis, earthquakes, wars, pestilenge. So I wonder what we shield them from and what they should see. Because we are Christians and believe in the inerrant Word of God, I feel better about her seeing/knowing the realities of the Bible and the real world for that matter because I have a hope that even though this world will pass away, there is a better one to come. That mindset would color how one feels about the material in the Bible. At least I think so. How's that for convoluted. :tongue_smilie: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cricket Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 non-expurgated I can't hear this word without thinking of that Monty Python sketch where the guy is trying to buy a bird book. :lol: Anyway, I bought our first son a Bible when he was old enough to read. He wanted a real one, not a storybook. Our 7 yo is ready for one now. They really don't read it on their own. We are currently reading through the Bible with the older two. We are using the readings listed at pennygardner.com. It hits all the major stories but leaves out a few verses here and there when it comes to rape/incest and maybe a few other things along those lines. That is all certainly part of life but I'd rather save some of those discussions for when the kids are older. I guess I wouldn't have a problem talking with my 10 yo about those topics but I consider my 7 yo still a little young. It all depends on the kid. Like Twinmom said the Bible is a great starting place for those discussions since it doesn't glorify sin. It shows real men and women who sinned and shows the devastating consequences of their actions. It also shows godly men and women. I have a problem with my kids watching movies that make adultery, stealing, or whatever seem glamorous and cool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FriedClams Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 One of the main reasons I want my kids to read is so they can read and enjoy God's Word. My 6 and 7 year old read daily from the NIV, we use it for school, etc. They both started reading a real NIV around 5-6. We currently avoid things that are age inappropriate (Proverbs 7 comes to mind since we try to read a Proverb a day), but they've been doing R&S bible which edits very little so they have a good understanding of the flow and content of the major bible stories. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chocobean Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 I was given a wordy "children's bible" when I was 5 (actually it was a gift to my older sister but she 'sold' it to be due to lack of interest) and was reading the actual bible probably around grade 1. (Chinese translation which I think is based on the LXX.; sorry no advice on which english translation) It brings up interesting questions. Love and sex is designed to be pleasurable and a celebration of marriage, which is a symbol for Christ and his Church. Discuss the motivation behind adulterers and why it is wrong, and why Romantic Love does not justify all. Discuss violence, and how it destroys relationships instead of building it, like God does. Discuss war and the role of killing all males and destroying temples in cultural survival (bonus points for discussing Jihad and the Crusades at this point). Also, I think it it imperative that children understand the bible is NOT primarily a list of stories and heroes and faithful leaders with right conduct. The bible is the story of the World -- Man is sinful and in need of God's redemption; it is a sad and repetitive story. It would be faith-destroying, I think, for children to grow up in the church listening to Sunday school stories of David and Abraham, and how they are role models. The bible writes about their failings for a specific reason -- God forgives sinners and make great works of them, but even heroes are still prone to sin, especially in old age, in fear, in anger and in temptation. So I guess here's one testimony that reading the bible at a younger age is not soul/faith destroying. Never water down the Gospel and our need for it; never. Your children will trade in cheap salvation for glitter and pleasure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harriet Vane Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 My ds requested his one Bible when he turned 7yo. He made it clear that he didn't want any baby kids' Bibles--he wanted a real one with a leather cover like his dad. He reads it sometimes, but not a whole lot at a time. He reads in two spots--Genesis, because it's the beginning and therefore what he feels is appropriate, or the Gospels, because that's what dh recommended to him. If ever he chooses to veer into other areas of the Bible, I would likely ask him to run it by me first. He is awfully young. On the one hand, I do NOT believe in sugar-coating reality. On the other hand, I'd rather wait till he's older before discussing s@xual violence. Maybe 10ish??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cindy in FL. Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 We've always just let them have the real thing when they can read. My dh has assigned them different books in the Bible to read through and we also read through various books in our devotion time. Cindy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Marple Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 If my child can read it and ask intelligent questions about it, I would allow it. If they read it, don't understand it and don't really care, I'd allow it. All of the ""adult themes" can be explained on some level to a child. I don't find it any different than a child hearing a news report and asking questions or overhearing an adult conversation and asking questions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daisy Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 We haven't really run into this issue. We used Rod and Staff's Bible Nurture Series for 1-4th grade. It is filtered a bit (especially s$xual content). We've used Ergermeiers and other Bible Story books. Both of my children have their own Bible and will read along with the pastor's sermon, Sunday School, Awanas, Dad's reading, but neither is reading huge portions of straight Scripture yet without parental input. When Dh and I read aloud from the Bible we do tend to filter a bit or skip very troublesome passages. I'm by no means prepared to explain to my 6yo yet what the r@pe of Dinah was all about. But my 4th grader understands (to a point) what a concubine is. I guess we try to strike a balance. That said, I feel comfortable with my children reading about 80% of Scripture. Haven't tackled Song of Songs yet and a few narrative passages in the OT. Not really all that much considering how large the Bible is. The thing with Scripture is that very rarely are those types of passages portrayed in a positive light so they are actually excellent teaching tools. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharon in SC Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 All of the ""adult themes" can be explained on some level to a child. I don't find it any different than a child hearing a news report and asking questions or overhearing an adult conversation and asking questions. :iagree: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pamela H in Texas Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 from infancy...however, many adult themes can be left out if one was uncomfortable with them. Just skip those parts for a time. But I think most of them will go over the child's head until they are ready, even WITH explanations given. Also, it depends on how you look at certain accounts and prophesies. Though some of them are scary, they give real hope also (at least to those who understand them). That hope is what is focussed on even when it talks about really scary or icky things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twinmom Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 My oldest two are reading the full, "unabridged" Bible and have been for a year or so. We discuss the topics at their level and it is going just fine. I do think it depends on the maturity of your child as well as their reading level. I think young children can handle it with a parent there to explain whenever needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChemMommy Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 Depends on when they move into reading short chapter books. All but one of them started right at the beginning--Genesis. Honestly, not one of them has asked any uncomfortable questions. The stronger stuff just seems to go over their heads (kind of like when a questionable commercial airs and it doesn't seem to raise questions in the 6yo mind but only in the 12 yo mind). My 11 yo dd DID, though, find a "lovely' passage in Deuteronomy and the consequences of a woman who is r*ped inside or outside a city. It opened up a wonderful opportunity to begin to discuss modesty, r*p*, sin, etc. I fully believe that the Holy Spirit is capable of guiding their reading and protecting young minds. And one of my secret joys is that all four of my kids read their Bible every day now as a habit (one I never got into). All of them remember going to the store to pick out there big-girl or big-boy Bible and Bible cover as a red-letter day.:001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pretty in Pink Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 My ds10 has been reading the Bible (NKJV or NIV) for several years now though he has become much more interested over the last year or so. He reads it independently as frequently as he reads fun books like Eragon or Narnia. I will be honest and say that I prefer to skip over Song of Solomon though we have read excerpts together before. He has a general idea what that particular book is about. "It's about a husband and a wife...you know..." he said one day as he gestured emphatically, giggled, and stared at me with eyes as big as saucers! He doesn't exactly know what "you know" is, but he knows it is sex, whatever that is, and he knows it makes him giggle to hear that word. I'm sure that talk is coming soon enough and then I guess Song of Solomon won't be so mysterious to him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sassenach Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 And when I ask about reading the Bible, I'm referring to non-expurgated Bibles. Not "Children's Bibles" or Bible stories, but full versions (especially the KJV) and including all books and all passages (especially those with strong sexual content, incest, genocide, end-of-the-world cataclysms, deicide, and other "arguably" adult themes)? What's your feeling? How do you handle this? Bill From birth our kids are hearing passages read aloud. From about 7, dd started reading on her own. We don't do KJV. Dh is a pastor. He exposits from the original language. I prefer NIV, to get the jist, and really only depend on the original language for the real meaning. I believe dd has NIrV. Dh prefers ESV. If you depend solely on an english translation, chances are you are not getting the true meaning of many parts of the bible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michelle in MO Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 I'd say as they're able to handle certain passages. There are some passages in the OT which are difficult for my oldest (who is 16) to understand, and I've advised her to stick to the NT for now. I do believe that God gives understanding and clarity as we get older and as we seek Him for that understanding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datmama4 Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 Our children had Toddler's Bibles, Children's Bibles, you name it. They enjoyed the stories and it built a good habit of reading about God and His plan. However, as soon as they were old enough to read chapter books, each of them in their turn requested a "real" Bible like mine and DH's. Their biggest complaint was that they couldn't look things up with Scripture references -- chapter and verse -- in their simplified children's Bibles. One of our children also complained that his Bible kept using dumbed-down words when the "regular" word was not a difficult one to begin with -- and he was only 8 or 9 at the time! We've always read to them from our own Bibles, and I just read what is there and don't try to edit for content. I've found that certain things go over their heads, and if they ask a question I try to answer it as simply but honestly as possible. That early habit helped me a LOT when they started asking the harder questions like what incest was, what a temple prostitute was, etc. Now they're 8, 13, and 15 and they're all well-versed in Proverbs and all the folly of sin involving adultery, etc., and they have a good foundation for their adult lives beginning now. Lynda Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janna Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 My dc are both studying Scripture now. They are 10.5 and 7yo. My 10.5yo started when she was in 1st grade (which is where my 7yo is). She is now in 5th. There is a Bible study that is for adults and children called BSF (Bible Study Fellowship). What the adults study, the children study. They read the exact same passages in an adult Bible. They have study sheets that are broken down into 6 days worth of work, the same as the adult. The adult questions are obviously going to be much deeper and thought provoking, but the children, based on their ages, get the same amount of questions, just geared toward their ages. For example, my ds (the 7 yo) has questions that are mainly "circle the right answer" or "true and false" questions. However there are some fill in the blank. For example, currently they are studying "The Life of Moses". One of his questions for this week is "Read Lev. 17:10-11. Why was the blood such an important part in the sacrifices? Complete the sentence: For the ______ of a creature is in the blood." As the children get older, the questions become deeper. For ex. my dd's question was the same as my ds's, but it didn't give the hint of the exact sentence in the Bible minus the one word. It was just the question left for them to figure out. Another question on her sheet following the instructions to read Lev. 14:54-57; 15:31 is "Write one way these public health regulations helped the Israelites." We have found this study to be an amazing way for them to not only learn Scripture, but to better understand their Maker (as we believe). There hasn't been anything we have shielded from them where scripture is concerned. However. There was a time, when dd was in 2nd grade, that she was studying Genesis. There is a part in Genesis that is pretty explicit where the description of Lot and the company he surrounds himself with is rather disturbing. I remember wishing that there had been a "warning" of sorts for the parent to be sure that they helped their child along at that part (Come to think of it, I meant to contact them about that and never did. Maybe I'll revisit that...). I don't recall how I handled it - maybe I just asked her questions to see what her understanding of it was and then because she really didn't understand what it was implying I didn't help her out any - I don't remember. But that is the only thing I can remember that has been "uncomfortable" at best. Fwiw, so far she has studied Acts, Genesis, Romans, Matthew and now is doing Life of Moses. These studies, btw, cover more books throughout the year than just what is the title of the study. For example, there are many cross references to both Old and New testaments regardless of the study and comparisons to the other gospels when one of them is being studied (in Matt., Luke and Mark were studied too. John is a separate study). In a couple of years, The History of the Minor Prophets will be the topic and you can be sure many books are studied with that (that was my favorite study when I did BSF. I am out of it now. My dh takes the kids with him). Anyway, I am not afraid for them to read anything in scripture. Certainly I have guarded my answer with the above referenced section, but that is the only time. There have been things that she's asked about that have provided an excellent discussion, not only for today's living, but also to deepen her relationship with the Lord. Since this is my ds's first year, I am looking forward to the discussion we have with him. Does that help? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chickenpatty Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 If my child can read it and ask intelligent questions about it, I would allow it. If they read it, don't understand it and don't really care, I'd allow it. All of the ""adult themes" can be explained on some level to a child. I don't find it any different than a child hearing a news report and asking questions or overhearing an adult conversation and asking questions. I agree. Actually, I had never even thought of this as an issue. I grew up reading the KJV as far back as I can remember & I don't remember even thinking about the "adult themes." Reading the KJV was good for me - I remember trying to pass the time during church "translating" the KJV into simpler english. At least I was learning something while not paying attention!:tongue_smilie: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janna Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 I got to thinking more about this after I initially posted and I wanted to add something. I think that it is not an issue for us - when they read/study it - because we always turn around and apply it to our lives as best we can for our ages/circumstances. This is because we believe what we're reading. And sometimes we do struggle to understand, but that only makes it more real and I think it makes our dc appreciate us more - that we're not the intelligent hero types that they can't relate or come to, you know? If there was not belief, if there was not an ability to make personal application, if it were just to read as another book, then I think I probably would wait. I would be coming from a completely different perspective and therefore I wouldn't be able to see Scripture as "His story" that we're a part of. So I'm sure it would come off as unnecessarily violent or sexual or even sexist. Given that scenario, I don't know when I would have them read it. Probably not until they were 13yo or so? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Girls' Mom Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 We are studying Genesis right now, and are in the Sodom and Gomorrah area this week. We read through the real scripture, and then I discussed it with them on their level. As in, stating that the men wanted to do sinful things, and then focusing more on the angels reaction, and the reasons God destroyed the cities. Not glossed over, but not going into detail about what the men wanted either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janna Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 Just out of curiosity, have you seen this chart? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karen in CO Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 I was raised with an "open book" policy toward the bible. The christian classical school that I attended had k4 reading from the kjv version - passages, not just any old place. I vividly remember being shocked as a child by reading about rape and incest and genocide. I would never let my young children read stories that contained such filth. It doesn't matter what book it is contained in. Now, to answer your question, when we begin to read the bible, we will first read selections to cover the main chapters and books. Since we are reading the kjv version, I guess we will start with some of it once we get to the Renaissance. Once my dd is in middle school, we will read it through for the first time from beginning to end with some of the more interesting apocrypha. In high school, we will read it again as part of a philosophy and comparative religious class. I don't think that i will allow free access to it until middle school after we read it together, but ask me again in a few years and see if I still think middle school is old enough. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karen in CO Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 Yeah, that's why I'm waiting. I just can't see that going over very well around here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karen in CO Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 Just out of curiosity, have you seen this chart? that is an interesting chart. I have only seen a few of those translations. I would have never guessed that they would make translations at such low reading levels without adding "Kids version" to the title. Growing up, I never knew there was anything but kjv and kjv red letter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tess in the Burbs Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 my son had to have a full version of the bible for Awanas, so one day he started reading it. I suggested passages he would enjoy over others, but he loves to read it. he was 6 when he started this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hillary in KS Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 Our boys have always heard the Bible read to them at home and at church. They've had various Bible storybooks since they were small. In our home, once a boy begins to read on his own (beginning chapter book level) he gets a Bible of his own. DS #1 started in the New Testament and is on his second read-through of the Bible. When he has questions, he'll ask dh or I and good conversations follow. Ds #2 is 8, and received his own Bible this summer. He has recently started reading it every morning before breakfast, just like his father. He's chosen to start in Genesis. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aubrey Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 You know, as a Christian, it's a funny thing to think about. I'd balk at such topics in any other book, yet when ds was first born, dh & I were kind-of shocked to reread the Bible from a parent's point of view. We have moved forward w/ caution here as we have w/ other sources of information, knowing that we can always offer them more information but that we can't really withdraw it once it's given. Our children have not encountered all of the hard ideas in the Bible. It says to be innocent of evil, & we'd like to preserve that for them as long as reasonable. We haven't gone into very much detail about hell--I was raised in a denomination in which one was scared into salvation. We want our children to choose Christ out of love, not fear. They have briefly encountered virginity, i.e. a woman who is not married, & adultery-- *marrying* more than one person. Ds8 does have his own Bible, an easier translation like others have said, & he does enjoy reading it on his own. For whatever reason, though--his age, I'd guess--he gravitates toward the stories he's already read. He especially likes the gospels. My dc aren't really old enough for me to answer your question yet, Bill. But I guess that's a little bit of an answer in itself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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