DVD or Online Classical Latin Class

[Dianthus]

DD did FFL last year for 7th grade.  I think I could ease my workload and improve her enjoyment if I either use a DVD class or an online class. 

I would go ahead with 2nd Form except the DVD is ecclesiastical and I assume the online class with MP is the same.

What online classes or DVDs are classical pronunciation?  I actually would prefer DVDs because it's cheaper and more flexible, but she might really enjoy a class. 

[cintinative]

We used Latin for Children and Latin Alive, which have classical pronunciation

I have heard good things about the forms series--I am hesitant to encourage you to switch. Hopefully others will chime in.  

With Latin, I watched all the videos but there were still things that they needed help with (beyond the videos). YMMV, since I used a different provider.

CAP used to have some sort of tutor service but I am not sure if they still do--it wasn't available when we did Latin, but I definitely would have used it if it was. 

[Dianthus]

We tried LFC A a couple years ago and it didn't work at that time.  I feel like that would be a step down from the form series, which seems very comprehensive to me. I would like to continue, but don't want to switch to ecclesiastical and really feel we need some help. She is passing my Latin knowledge and I don't have extra time with 3 other kids.  

I looked at Lukeion, which uses Wheelock, but the classes are highschool paced and I don't know if it would be too much for her.

CLRC uses Oxford and starting at Middle School Latin I may be more appropriate / gentler.

Logos Online uses Kraken, which I've not seen before and looks like what she did in FFL.

Currently searching... would love to figure things out this weekend. I'm so behind.

[ScoutTN]

A vote for CLRC! Email Anne Van Fossen there with any questions. She is a fabulous Latin teacher! 

[Dianthus]

6 hours ago, ScoutTN said:

A vote for CLRC! Email Anne Van Fossen there with any questions. She is a fabulous Latin teacher! 

Ann isn't the teacher.  Emily is the only one available.

Any experience with the Oxford Course Book? I can't find samples online and the amazon reviews aren't great.

[ScoutTN]

2 hours ago, Dianthus said:

Ann isn't the teacher.  Emily is the only one available.

Any experience with the Oxford Course Book? I can't find samples online and the amazon reviews aren't great.

I like the Oxford text. Balanced. Not mostly forms, grammar, and vocab like some classical programs, nor just reading like some courses on the other end of the spectrum. HW was clear, challenging, and corrected promptly. Solid, not overwhelming. 
 

AVF is the director and can answer any questions about any of their Latin classes. My student had three years with CLRC Latin and three excellent teachers.

[kiwik]

We are enrolled for CLRC MSLatin1.  It was a toss up between that and Latin 1but I went with the one that didn't require 6 AM classes.

We didn't like FFL.  We did like Cambridge Latin but we need structure and although we did self paced MS1 last year I wasn't impressed with the provider.

Edited July 4, 2022 by kiwik

[Quarter Note]

While it works for some families, SFL was what drove us to CLRC, and we've never looked back.  

Emily Wells, who teaches CLRC's Middle School Latin 1, was wonderful for us!  Even though my kid had had several years of MP Latin, we signed her up for CLRC's Middle School Latin 1, just to make the academics easier while she got used to having Not-Mom as a teacher.  Mrs. Wells was very nice and very encouraging, and the class was lots of fun.  

Don't worry about the difference in ecclesiastical vs. classical pronunciation.  I've heard it explained as the difference between an American accent and a British accent.  It's not hard to make that transition.  I believe the only place where it would really make a difference is in vocal performance.

[Bonnie]

Are you interested in switching courses only because you prefer that she use classical pronunciation rather than ecclesiastical pronunciation? If you are happy with MP, I would not switch simply to change the pronunciation system that she uses. As Quarter Note says, it is not difficult to learn both systems. Many Latin students learn both at some point in their Latin studies. Those who know both pronunciations realize that the systems have more similarities than differences.

 

[Dianthus]

13 hours ago, kiwik said:

It was a toss up between that and Latin 1

Who was this one with?

1 hour ago, Bonnie said:

Are you interested in switching courses only because you prefer that she use classical pronunciation rather than ecclesiastical pronunciation? If you are happy with MP, I would not switch simply to change the pronunciation system that she uses. As Quarter Note says, it is not difficult to learn both systems. Many Latin students learn both at some point in their Latin studies. Those who know both pronunciations realize that the systems have more similarities than differences.

 

I am fairly happy with MP FFL. It is structured and thorough and straighforward. I am not happy with the rest of their offerings because they are oh so dry, and I wonder how the classes and DVDs are? I don't know anyone who has used them. I really don't want to move to ecclesiastical. I think it will be easy to move that way if needed but prefer classical pronunciation and read that it is harder to go from ecclesiastical to classical.

A DVD sounds better/cheaper, so MP gets points for that. Hmm now need to decide if my strong preference toward classical is much ado about nothing. I think dd would thrive in a class and get her more excited about Latin. So I should probably splurge.

I am drawn to the way CLRC translates passages so makes it seem more usable more quickly. Dd has only translated one or two sentences at a time.

[Bonnie]

She will be in 8th grade? I would switch to Henle I (done over 2 years) and use the new videos featuring Jon Christianson. He is very engaging. You might check that out on the MP website. Then she could move to Henle II, which will be much more challenging and appropriate for a high schooler than the Forms are.

Happy Fourth and bonam fortunam!

 

[Bonnie]

"I really don't want to move to ecclesiastical. I think it will be easy to move that way if needed but prefer classical pronunciation and read that it is harder to go from ecclesiastical to classical."

Sometimes people confuse the usage of the terms classical and ecclesiastical. These words may refer to the two pronunciations systems -- or instead they may refer to the period of time in which a text was written. If someone wrote that it is harder to go from ecclesiastical to classical, they are correct if they are referring to the time period and subject matter of the text (not to the pronunciation system). It is easier to read an ecclesiastical text like the Vulgate (Latin Bible) than the texts of Caesar and Cicero, writers of the classical period -- and, yes, it will be harder to move to classical texts from the looser constructions of the ecclesiastical time.

Although MP is more oriented to ecclesiastical pronunciation, the focus is on learning to read classical texts. A student can do that with either pronunciation system. It  is very easy for students to learn both pronunciations over the course of their studies. Parents sometimes see this as more difficult than it is.

 

However, I would not spend upper middle school or high school years with the Forms. They are written for younger children. I would switch to Henle I over two years, with the new videos, and then move on to Henle II.

 

 

 

Edited July 5, 2022 by Bonnie

[Dianthus]

@Bonnie Is this Jon Christianson in the sample at the bottom of the page? Henle Latin First Year: Units I-V Guides and Instructional Videos Set (memoriapress.com)

[Dianthus]

I have called MP and they absolutely do not recommend jumping from FFL to Henle. They say to walk through the forms first.

 

[Bonnie]

16 minutes ago, Dianthus said:

@Bonnie Is this Jon Christianson in the sample at the bottom of the page? Henle Latin First Year: Units I-V Guides and Instructional Videos Set (memoriapress.com)

Yes, that is Jon Christianson in the sample.

[Dianthus]

Is Henle an extremely Catholic text? 

[Bonnie]

16 minutes ago, Dianthus said:

I have called MP and they absolutely do not recommend jumping from FFL to Henle. They say to walk through the forms first.

 

It is your choice. But the Forms were written to be started by children as young as 4th or 5th grade. Henle I can easily be done in 8th and 9th grade. It is an introductory program just as the Forms are, written for students with no prior Latin study -- but it was written for older students. It is correct that you would not jump from First Form to Henle II. The Forms allow younger students four years to learn the basic, elementary Latin grammar and syntax, while Henle I moves at a pace more appropriate for older students; they complete the basic grammar and syntax in 2 years. Henle also has a different approach; it is also grammar-based, but is more focused on learning to read Latin. Jon Christianson is a very engaging teacher. It is your call, and you won't really go wrong either way.

[Bonnie]

Just now, Dianthus said:

Is Henle an extremely Catholic text? 

It does have some Catholic content, but most Protestants do not find it offensive. Any Catholic content is more supplementary than essential, and you may always skip any isolated sentences that you do not want to read. It is not anti-Protestant. Henle I teaches the basic grammar and begins to prepare the student to read Caesar. Henle II teaches more intermediate and advanced grammar, and the student begins reading Caesar in the second half of the Henle II year. Then the student is well prepared to read Cicero or the Aeneid in future years.

[Dianthus]

I like CLRC the more I look at it. Dd did not like FFL, and maybe a change would be good for her. I think staying with Classical pronunciation is better to be one less thing for her to have to learn/change. Does anyone have experience with Logos Online's Kraken course?

I wonder if I should be posting on the middle grades forum.