s/o: Retiring vs Back to Work: What about Dad?

[Ausmumof3]

13 minutes ago, Melissa Louise said:

I wish I could volunteer. I'd like to do adult literacy programs for women recently released from prison. And I'd like to do twice weekly literacy sessions at the indigenous school in town - they need as many volunteers as they can get at the moment. There isn't enough $ to pay people to do these things. Anyway, in my ideal life, that's what I'd be doing. Writing, yoga and volunteering. 

There's a really unique sense of purpose that comes with volunteering, I reckon. 

 

Yes for sure. And then it can also be abused because people are much less careful about how they spend free labour. It’s a funny world.

[Ausmumof3]

17 minutes ago, Carrie12345 said:

It’s a mess. 
My township can go weeks without a call. It’s hard to pay for a full time staff with no calls!

But we can and have gotten 3 calls in a day, so…

Just a big mess. 

Yeah same. I feel like it’s a bigger problem for places like Australia and parts of the US where the population density is too low to justify a full time station but they are through places that get a lot of road trauma etc. and that’s the other part of it. A lot of people sign up because they want to fight fires etc but most of what they are doing is road trauma. Some of the guys can’t do road trauma anymore because of stuff they’ve experienced and seen and not having adequate training to deal with it.

[teachermom2834]

My mom went back to work for peanuts when my youngest sibling was in high school. It was kind of a mess. We had to eat out every single night. The house, which was never her strongest skill, went to absolute crap, my dad couldn’t get used to her not keeping up with all the laundry, etc she always had and they fought all the time. She was always angry. 
 

I had never, until just now, connected that to my own reluctance to take that path. It just was not a smooth transition at all. 
 

[Melissa Louise]

I feel like ds (my youngest) really got the short end of the stick when I went back to work. It would be ok if his Dad had stepped into my role, but he didn't/couldn't. 

The house is a mess, I rarely cook, but more than that, it's like I've run out of energy to help ds with the kind of guidance my oldest kids got. Stupid work gets the best of me, then I save some time for me, then ds gets the dregs. 

 

 

[regentrude]

17 minutes ago, teachermom2834 said:

My mom went back to work for peanuts when my youngest sibling was in high school. It was kind of a mess. We had to eat out every single night. The house, which was never her strongest skill, went to absolute crap, my dad couldn’t get used to her not keeping up with all the laundry, etc she always had and they fought all the time. She was always angry. 
 

I had never, until just now, connected that to my own reluctance to take that path. It just was not a smooth transition at all. 
 

Thank you for mentioning that. It raises the important issue how our own upbringing has shaped our expectations.

I grew up in a country where almost all women worked outside the home. SAHM were very, very rare.

My mother worked while my sister and I were little; my maternal grandmother lived with us (she was 72 when I was born). Mom ended her stage career and stayed home once my brother was born; he acquired brain damage as an infant and ended up mentally disabled. She was home for about ten years and then slowly started teaching part-time. The year she turned 49, I moved out, my brother moved into an institution with sheltered workshop, my grandmother died, my teen sister became pregnant, and the country collapsed and was reunified with it's Western half. 
Overnight, my mother could finally become a professor (which she had been denied because she was not a member of the communist party). She was elected Dean of the conservatory a few years later and had her steepest career in her 50s - while also helping my sister, who was a single mom going to med school, raise her severely disabled preemie.

Compared to what my mom accomplished, I feel like a slacker with just my teaching gig.

ETA: As a war widow, my paternal grandmother had no choice but to work full time t support herself and her kid. She continued working part time in her business from home until she was 85.

Edited April 4, 2022 by regentrude

[Ausmumof3]

2 minutes ago, regentrude said:

Thank you for mentioning that. It raises the important issue how our own upbringing has shaped our expectations.

I grew up in a country where almost all women worked outside the home. SAHM were very, very rare.

My mother worked while my sister and I were little; my grandmother lived with us (she was 72 when I was born). Mom ended her stage career and stayed home once my brother acquired brain damage as an infant. She was home for about ten years and then slowly started teaching part-time. The year she turned 49, I moved out, my brother moved into an institution with sheltered workshop, my grandmother died, my teen sister became pregnant, and the country collapsed and was reunified with it's Western half. 
Overnight, my mother could finally become a professor (which she had been denied because she was not a member of the communist party). She was elected Dean of the conservatory a few years later and had her steepest career in her 50s - while also helping my sister who was a single mom raise her severely disabled preemie.

Compared to what my mom accomplished, I feel like a slacker with just my teaching gig.

Definitely childhood experiences play a part. Both DH and I lost a parent at just over 40 and just over 50. That has definitely tipped the balance as far as how much we think about saving for retirement versus quality of life now.

I’m curious to know if the division of domestic work is more equitable in somewhere like Germany where there are less SAHM? Or whether house sizes, lifestyles etc make the overall workload less. Most women I know under 50 now work part time but very few are full time. 
 

I also think the career matters. I suspect Its easier to feel a lot more enthusiastic about returning to work pursuing an interesting academic career versus getting paid peanuts to do childcare or clean etc

[maize]

If I ever go back to work full-time it will likely be because dh has become too disabled to work.

I just hope that doesn't happen while we still have young children, because no-way is he able to fill my shoes at home even now. 

The idea of staying home as an easier path than work is so far outside my experience I can't even fathom it. Our entire marriage I have put in twice as many hours of work as my husband has, mine is just unpaid. So if I do end up staying home after kids are grown it will be time well-earned, and I'll still have plenty of work to keep me busy.

[Rosie_0801]

50 minutes ago, Melissa Louise said:

I wish I could volunteer. I'd like to do adult literacy programs for women recently released from prison. And I'd like to do twice weekly literacy sessions at the indigenous school in town - they need as many volunteers as they can get at the moment. There isn't enough $ to pay people to do these things.

So would I, but I don't have a teaching degree so I'm not wanted.

[Ausmumof3]

I need to step away from this thread and get on with some stuff but the other thing I haven’t seen mentioned is the impact health and well being has on these decisions. If one of both partners have ongoing health issues it’s much harder to manage two full time jobs. On the flip side some mental health issues can definitely make it better for people to be in paid work 

[Melissa Louise]

Just now, Rosie_0801 said:

So would I, but I don't have a teaching degree so I'm not wanted.

What a bugger. Hate credentialism. 

Some places will accept volunteers with literacy training - something like Spalding/Speld. 

[Rosie_0801]

1 minute ago, Melissa Louise said:

What a bugger. Hate credentialism. 

Some places will accept volunteers with literacy training - something like Spalding/Speld. 

A few grand for that, plus petrol money to get around and it becomes unworkable.

Ah well.

[Melissa Louise]

Just now, Rosie_0801 said:

A few grand for that, plus petrol money to get around and it becomes unworkable.

Ah well.

I know, it sucks, esp when you know you could do a great job. 

[KungFuPanda]

A small note about having a boss while being middle-aged.  I've gone back to work (only 20 hours/week) and I have a boss.  I love NOT being the boss.  I ADORE not being in charge of every-damn-thing.  It's delightful having a narrower range of topics/tasks to focus on because at home, the sky's the limit. 

It's also kind of fun to have a boss at a stage in life when you are not intimidated by said boss.  I love being old enough to have very healthy boundaries after being a people pleaser until well into my thirties.  I've used phrases like "That's sounds like a problem that's above my pay grade" and "You can't afford my Friday/Saturday rates" and "That is not a service I provide" and "Wantin' ain't gettin'." It's awesome and my boss just backs down!  NOBODY at my house is this easily persuaded by me.

I'm not actually being a jerk at work or anything.  I keep all of the plates spinning and I'm really very pleasant.  It's just that sometimes my boss thinks he can get an executive assistant for the price of an office administrator and I need to talk him off that ledge.   

 

[regentrude]

12 minutes ago, KungFuPanda said:

A small note about having a boss while being middle-aged.  I've gone back to work (only 20 hours/week) and I have a boss.  I love NOT being the boss.  I ADORE not being in charge of every-damn-thing.  It's delightful having a narrower range of topics/tasks to focus on because at home, the sky's the limit. 

Yes! 
The thing that stresses me most in my job is being in charge of a large course and coordinating a team of instructors and TAs and being responsible for every.damned.thing anybody does. 
It would be blissful to just have to teach my own classes and not have to remind people of stuff, answer everyone's questions about things I had clearly explained in an earlier email, orchestrate collaboration, deal with people dropping the ball.
I just want to have to deal with my own assigned ball and do my own stuff to my own high standards. And not have to be responsible whenever somebody else screws up.

So, my retirement fantasy isn't even total retirement... I'm just burned out from being in charge. It's way overrated.

Edited April 5, 2022 by regentrude

[teachermom2834]

16 minutes ago, KungFuPanda said:

A small note about having a boss while being middle-aged.  I've gone back to work (only 20 hours/week) and I have a boss.  I love NOT being the boss.  I ADORE not being in charge of every-damn-thing.  It's delightful having a narrower range of topics/tasks to focus on because at home, the sky's the limit. 

It's also kind of fun to have a boss at a stage in life when you are not intimidated by said boss.  I love being old enough to have very healthy boundaries after being a people pleaser until well into my thirties.  I've used phrases like "That's sounds like a problem that's above my pay grade" and "You can't afford my Friday/Saturday rates" and "That is not a service I provide" and "Wantin' ain't gettin'." It's awesome and my boss just backs down!  NOBODY at my house is this easily persuaded by me.

I'm not actually being a jerk at work or anything.  I keep all of the plates spinning and I'm really very pleasant.  It's just that sometimes my boss thinks he can get an executive assistant for the price of an office administrator and I need to talk him off that ledge.   

 

This is funny because I have told  a few friends that I really can't see myself having a boss. I haven't had a boss since I was 25 yo and my dh is not about to boss me around.

I really can't imagine someone having the nerve to give me a performance review. I'm supposed to just accept criticism of my work? Take suggestions I think are dumb? I'm just not seeing it. 

 

[wintermom]

6 minutes ago, teachermom2834 said:

This is funny because I have told  a few friends that I really can't see myself having a boss. I haven't had a boss since I was 25 yo and my dh is not about to boss me around.

I really can't imagine someone having the nerve to give me a performance review. I'm supposed to just accept criticism of my work? Take suggestions I think are dumb? I'm just not seeing it. 

 

It depends on the context, of course. I'd probably not appreciate a 'critique' of my teaching my own dc. But not having to do all the scheduling, finances, grant proposals to make sure there's money to pay the bills, hiring, firing, etc. is bliss! I'm kind of hoping I don't climb up the corporate ladder too quickly. I'm enjoying being at the low end of the responsibility pole. 😉 

Edited April 5, 2022 by wintermom

[KungFuPanda]

11 minutes ago, regentrude said:

Yes! 
The thing that stresses me most in my job is being in charge of a large course and coordinating a team of instructors and TAs and being responsible for every.damned.thing anybody does. 
It would be blissful to just have to teach my own classes and not have to remind people of stuff, answer everyone's questions about things I had clearly explained in an earlier email, orchestrate collaboration, deal with people dropping the ball.
I just want to have to deal with my own assigned ball and do my own stuff to my own high standards. And not have to be responsible whenever somebody else screws up.

So, my retirement fantasy isn't even total retirement... I'm just burned out from being in charge. It's way overrated.

The sheer novelty of only being in charge of my own work and nobody else's has me positively giddy some days.  😆

[regentrude]

1 minute ago, KungFuPanda said:

The sheer novelty of only being in charge of my own work and nobody else's has me positively giddy some days.  😆

Heaven!!!

[Melissa Louise]

The flip side of the type of job where you're not in charge is the lack of autonomy, and ability to effect change. 

[Guest]

34 minutes ago, KungFuPanda said:

A small note about having a boss while being middle-aged.  I've gone back to work (only 20 hours/week) and I have a boss.  I love NOT being the boss.  I ADORE not being in charge of every-damn-thing.  It's delightful having a narrower range of topics/tasks to focus on because at home, the sky's the limit. 

It's also kind of fun to have a boss at a stage in life when you are not intimidated by said boss.  I love being old enough to have very healthy boundaries after being a people pleaser until well into my thirties.  I've used phrases like "That's sounds like a problem that's above my pay grade" and "You can't afford my Friday/Saturday rates" and "That is not a service I provide" and "Wantin' ain't gettin'." It's awesome and my boss just backs down!  NOBODY at my house is this easily persuaded by me.

I'm not actually being a jerk at work or anything.  I keep all of the plates spinning and I'm really very pleasant.  It's just that sometimes my boss thinks he can get an executive assistant for the price of an office administrator and I need to talk him off that ledge.   

 

I feel exactly the same way about my job and my boss. I sass him with aplomb. I never did that when I was in my twenties and I was scared to death of the senior partners. 
 

Middle Age has its perks. So does medication that tamps down Estrogen and Progesterone. Who needs those feely hormones, anyway? 

[Grace Hopper]

11 hours ago, Faith-manor said:

Same here. But the difference for me would have been mental health. I never enjoyed domesticity. It was something I endured for the sake of my family. We had a son with a health issue, we circled the wagons, needed to keep him healthy and out of school, etc. and it made the most sense for me to be the one to do it. However, I was carving out a serious career in piano performance right up until that time. It was VERY hard on me to give that up knowing that it would end any chance of doing the thing I had been obsessed with doing since I was four years old. I eventually came to grips with it, however I spent a lot of years soldiering on, doing it because it needed to be done, putting homeschooling well at the forefront, and doing all the tasks alone that prior to leaving my career, dh and I had shared, and getting exactly zero fulfillment and satisfaction in life because it did not fit my personality at all to be the sahm. And of course the outcome is that now, facing an empty nest, I have no career to go back to, and exactly zero way of rebuilding it because if you don't have your career as a pianist carved out when you are young NO ONE is interested in you 2-3 decades later.

I sacrifice big, and in a way that my husband can never understand, and watched him climb up the ladder of success for years while crying into my pillow. He is a wonderful, wonderful man and my best friend so the relationship is solid despite this. But weighed down now with elder care stuff while he keeps working just makes me depressed. I hate it with the fire of a thousand suns, and resent it. I am seriously considering going back to work full time, to do ANYTHING not even sure I care, and then use the money to pay for care givers and drivers for the  elders so I can have a few years of doing something that challenges my brain and isn't entirely counterintuitive to my own natural personality.

Similar situation here, my exciting career  sacrifice was also in a super niche field that I cannot possibly go back to. I’ve done my share of elder care and I cannot physically or emotionally do it again when it’s the in-laws time, my counselor has specifically recommended against it (PTS trigger - my other caregiving experiences were nuts, so hard). 

[Clemsondana]

Some of the differences in thinking probably come from what type of income people will earn with their work.  I like teaching.  To be certified to teach in the public school, the easiest path would be to spend 1-2 years and $15K to earn a masters.  I'm not going to do this.  I have a PhD in genetics and will have taught at a CC or homeschool co-op for 20 years by the time both kids are done with school.  I'm not starting over to be able to do a job that I'm not sure that I want.  So...I could pick up several classes as a CC adjunct, or I could teach at multiple co-ops, or I could teach at a private school.  But, I'd be doubling, or at the most tripling, my modest part-time income by doing that, at the cost of losing a lot of schedule flexibility.  And then I'd likely lose 1/2 of it to taxes due to spouse's income. 

The places that I've volunteered, which are afterschool programs where I tutor, have offered to hire me if I'm ever interested.  I'd rather keep it as volunteer work because I have flexibility.  I pick which day(s) I go - instead of being told what to do, I tell them what I'm able to do and if it fills a need, I do it.  I'm likely to look to volunteer in a public school once the kids are grown, and I don't want it to be paid.  As a volunteer, I can say that I'll do 1:1 tutoring, but as a paid employee I could be asked to teach groups or substitute in full classes or some other task that doesn't match my skill set or interests.   And as a paid person, there may be credentials that are required that aren't required for volunteers. 

The reality for me is that, like some others in this thread, I knew that when I left academic research there was no going back.  When my mom had an injury a few years ago that required me to help get her back and forth to PT until she was cleared to drive, and recently when I've helped a friend with childcare while she's had some stuff to deal with, it's really emphasized how much we need for some people to have some flex so that they can help.  So for me, when I'm unlikely to make a lot of money anyway, don't have a job that I'm particularly wanting to do, and have useful ways to use my time (volunteering, reading, and gardening for food that we eat and give away), it doesn't seem to make sense for me to look for a paid job.  

[Bootsie]

1 hour ago, regentrude said:

Yes! 
The thing that stresses me most in my job is being in charge of a large course and coordinating a team of instructors and TAs and being responsible for every.damned.thing anybody does. 
It would be blissful to just have to teach my own classes and not have to remind people of stuff, answer everyone's questions about things I had clearly explained in an earlier email, orchestrate collaboration, deal with people dropping the ball.
I just want to have to deal with my own assigned ball and do my own stuff to my own high standards. And not have to be responsible whenever somebody else screws up.

So, my retirement fantasy isn't even total retirement... I'm just burned out from being in charge. It's way overrated.

I taught at a school where I served as a coordinator for the introductory class; my experience was it was exhausting.  Trying to coordinator professors and PhD students is next to impossible--it is like herding cats.   I was really burned out.  It was a level of responsibility but I had no authority--which is a recipe for disaster. I was ready to retire!

I changed universities and have a heavier teaching load, but I do not have to coordinate anything!  It is so much more rewarding and so less stressful.  

[Rosie_0801]

2 hours ago, Melissa Louise said:

The flip side of the type of job where you're not in charge is the lack of autonomy, and ability to effect change. 

Knowing that "use your initiative" means having to know how to use *their* initiative when you're not a sodding mind reader.

The obligation to use "best practice" even if the recipients find it ineffective or worse.

 

[Faith-manor]

11 hours ago, Grace Hopper said:

Similar situation here, my exciting career  sacrifice was also in a super niche field that I cannot possibly go back to. I’ve done my share of elder care and I cannot physically or emotionally do it again when it’s the in-laws time, my counselor has specifically recommended against it (PTS trigger - my other caregiving experiences were nuts, so hard). 

I have PTSD too. My dad was positively evil and abusive to care for in the 18 months prior to his death. My mom refused to put him in a facility which probably would have drugged him, but I would have been fine with that. My sister lives in France so no help, my brother who was two blocks away became a ghost, and I got guilted into taking care of him because due to his cancer, though he should have been incarcerated for what he did, the law looked the other way so he could be dumped on us. So doing more care giving now, even though the mothers are not abusive or anything, is sucking the life out of me. This is why I have considered full time work and using the money to hire housekeepers, CNA's, companions, and drivers. It would probably end up taking every cent I make, but I do wonder if that would be better for my health.

[Jenny in Florida]

12 hours ago, KungFuPanda said:

A small note about having a boss while being middle-aged.  I've gone back to work (only 20 hours/week) and I have a boss.  I love NOT being the boss.  I ADORE not being in charge of every-damn-thing.  It's delightful having a narrower range of topics/tasks to focus on because at home, the sky's the limit. 

It's also kind of fun to have a boss at a stage in life when you are not intimidated by said boss.  I love being old enough to have very healthy boundaries after being a people pleaser until well into my thirties.  I've used phrases like "That's sounds like a problem that's above my pay grade" and "You can't afford my Friday/Saturday rates" and "That is not a service I provide" and "Wantin' ain't gettin'." It's awesome and my boss just backs down!  NOBODY at my house is this easily persuaded by me.

I'm not actually being a jerk at work or anything.  I keep all of the plates spinning and I'm really very pleasant.  It's just that sometimes my boss thinks he can get an executive assistant for the price of an office administrator and I need to talk him off that ledge.   

 

While I don't have the same kind of issues with my boss, I agree that there is something kind of lovely about working during a stage of life in which I feel more confident and able to speak my mind. I am very aware that I bring to the table a ton of life (and work) experience that others in my department do not and that I have a lot to offer. I also appreciate knowing that I don't actually "have to" work, which gives me a lot of freedom to speak up and make choices I would have found really scary when I was younger and needier.

Plus, I truly love getting to hang out with a whole bunch of younger people, to hear about their kiddos and see the pictures on Slack. 

My boss and I get along really well, and our relationship is an interesting mix of her being in charge and me being motherly.

[Frances]

13 hours ago, wintermom said:

It depends on the context, of course. I'd probably not appreciate a 'critique' of my teaching my own dc. But not having to do all the scheduling, finances, grant proposals to make sure there's money to pay the bills, hiring, firing, etc. is bliss! I'm kind of hoping I don't climb up the corporate ladder too quickly. I'm enjoying being at the low end of the responsibility pole. 😉 

Well you can just say no to promotions, both my husband and I have, in order to reduce stress and keep work hours at or below 40 per week. At both of our jobs, perhaps because they are fairly technical in nature, it’s quite common for otherwise qualified people to choose not to ever get on the management track or even to hop off after giving it a try and realizing it’s not what they want. It’s not uncommon for people to realize they miss doing the actual work they trained so long for and that dealing with management bureaucracy is not worth the minor pay bump (which is sometimes less money per hour depending on how much overtime is needed).

[Frances]

13 hours ago, Melissa Louise said:

The flip side of the type of job where you're not in charge is the lack of autonomy, and ability to effect change. 

I think it depends on the job. I think every single person I work with would list the high degree of autonomy as one of the things they most like about their job. If anything, our manager probably has less autonomy because of the requirements of their job.

[wintermom]

13 hours ago, Melissa Louise said:

The flip side of the type of job where you're not in charge is the lack of autonomy, and ability to effect change. 

Yes, but when you're not "in charge" you don't get blamed for anything either. Don't most politicians plea this? It's always the previous government's fault. 😅

[KungFuPanda]

1 hour ago, Jenny in Florida said:

While I don't have the same kind of issues with my boss, I agree that there is something kind of lovely about working during a stage of life in which I feel more confident and able to speak my mind. I am very aware that I bring to the table a ton of life (and work) experience that others in my department do not and that I have a lot to offer. I also appreciate knowing that I don't actually "have to" work, which gives me a lot of freedom to speak up and make choices I would have found really scary when I was younger and needier.

Plus, I truly love getting to hang out with a whole bunch of younger people, to hear about their kiddos and see the pictures on Slack. 

My boss and I get along really well, and our relationship is an interesting mix of her being in charge and me being motherly.

OMG, I have a young coworker in the middle of a custody situation.  He is getting terrible advice from people his own age.  The ex is walking all over him and nobody pointed this out to him.  I'm not getting overly involved, but he needed to be told general information like "document everything" and "make sure that phone conversation is reflected on the monitored text thread."  She's weirdly sneaky and she's goooood at it.

[Jaybee]

19 hours ago, Alte Veste Academy said:

what's left basically amounts to puttering around the house. 

And this is what I really enjoy doing now, lol. After homeschooling six kids (they all went to a b&m school somewhere along the way for a year or so here and there) over 25 years or so--can't remember exactly, I just want to putter. I feel guilty sometimes. I was hired for a job after 31 years of being a SAHM, and worked 30 hrs/wk for 3 years. I quit as things were developing and changing at work to make the atmosphere untenable to me. I mostly enjoyed the work and I had a great working relationship with my boss, but the overall attitudes and practices in the workplace became something I didn't feel like I could support any more. That was over a year ago. I have enjoyed being home again, and I do keep checking a few sites for employments. I am now even older and don't know if anyone would hire me, and I just don't have much of a heart for it, to be honest. I worry about retirement, but it's doubtful I would make much if I worked.

19 hours ago, Alte Veste Academy said:

I can think of literally a dozen things that would interest me as a career right now, but it's almost like I'd rather just learn the stuff and then not do them.

This is me. I am 62, so it wouldn't really be beneficial for me to go back to school. But I think of one thing or another I would like to train to do, but then I think about working that job, and then, nah, I'm good.

[SKL]

Interesting discussion about being a boss or not.  I don't think I've ever really been my own boss, though I've had time periods when I was pretty autonomous, if that makes any sense.  🙂

This year, I am planning to get trained in some of the lower-paid jobs in our business, so that it isn't a disaster if someone flakes out on us.  I will be trained and supervised (up to a point) by folks who are my employees.  I just hope I do a good job so as not to get dressed down in front of anyone, LOL.  (I've done this before with cleaning and assisting our bar-tenders, but on a more casual basis.)

I have a like-hate relationship with being/having a boss.  I am not thrilled when "the buck stops here."  I don't love the kinds of surprises we often have to deal with.  But I also don't love having to answer to others about how I've spent my time.  And I certainly don't miss goal-setting and annual reviews [which I thankfully don't have to do in my current situation].  😛  Ugh just writing these out makes me want to retire.  😛

[Melissa Louise]

5 hours ago, wintermom said:

Yes, but when you're not "in charge" you don't get blamed for anything either. Don't most politicians plea this? It's always the previous government's fault. 😅

Swings and roundabouts then, but one set of problems comes with higher renumeration than the other. 

[maize]

8 hours ago, Faith-manor said:

 It would probably end up taking every cent I make, but I do wonder if that would be better for my health.

It might be. I think it is hard to overestimate the damage done by stress.

 

[SKL]

Maybe I'm crazy, but I've never had a job where I didn't feel like I was being blamed for things.

When I took a job as a tax return preparer at a CPA firm, I was told I was overthinking; that I should just chill out and do what the manager told me to do and not worry about it.  Submit the work even if I wasn't sure it was right, and the manager would correct me, NBD.  The managers said, just ask questions, don't try to figure things out.  I couldn't do this.  I would stay all night trying to teach myself while still meeting the timelines, chargeability, and efficiency targets.  It wasn't possible.  I was a mess.  I was called in the office to be fired, but then a specialty manager arranged a transfer to a more responsible job, where I stayed for 12+ years.

I don't even think I could flip hamburgers or scrub toilets without stressing.

[katilac]

9 hours ago, Faith-manor said:

This is why I have considered full time work and using the money to hire housekeepers, CNA's, companions, and drivers. It would probably end up taking every cent I make, but I do wonder if that would be better for my health.

That sounds like a fair trade. Being a full-time caregiver would be a nightmare for me. 

7 hours ago, Frances said:

Well you can just say no to promotions 

You actually can't always do this. Some companies have a definite "up or out" way of doing things. 

If you can do it, it's great to make the choice you want and not the choice other people think you should want. 

[Clarita]

55 minutes ago, katilac said:

If you can do it, it's great to make the choice you want and not the choice other people think you should want. 

My favorite job had a check box on the performance review for I am happy where I am I don't need to go anywhere. (Essentially, I don't want a promotion line.) It was a breath of fresh air instead of having to put essentially my bosses' jobs down every time for "where I want to be in x years."

[wintermom]

3 hours ago, Melissa Louise said:

Swings and roundabouts then, but one set of problems comes with higher renumeration than the other. 

I have actually no idea what this means. 

[Lecka]

Nm

Edited April 5, 2022 by Lecka

[Rosie_0801]

4 minutes ago, wintermom said:

I have actually no idea what this means. 

You win some, you lose some and it works out roughly even in the end.
"What you win on the swings you lose on the roundabouts."

[wintermom]

1 minute ago, Rosie_0801 said:

You win some, you lose some and it works out roughly even in the end.
"What you win on the swings you lose on the roundabouts."

That's just brilliant! Never heard that expression before. 😄 

[Ellie]

On 4/3/2022 at 8:23 PM, teachermom2834 said:

My dh actually likes to work. His work has not exhausted him. He feels challenged and fulfilled and he has advanced in his career and has no desire to give it up to recreate. He is fine with me making his life easier by picking up more slack around the house now that my kids don’t need me so much. I have so little earning power he is just as happy to have the home support as what my small paycheck would be. But I realize my dh liking work is not standard.

Same for Mr. Ellie and me.

[Ellie]

23 hours ago, Clemsondana said:

 So for me, when I'm unlikely to make a lot of money anyway, don't have a job that I'm particularly wanting to do, and have useful ways to use my time (volunteering, reading, and gardening for food that we eat and give away), it doesn't seem to make sense for me to look for a paid job.  

This, exactly.

[Meriwether]

I worked a lot harder than my husband did when the kids were younger. I feel a little guilty that he works harder now. Or, at least harder some days. But I don't feel very guilty. He still has some catching up to do. lol I have asked him any number of times about me taking a part time job. With 20 years of college to pay for in a 15 year period, extra money would be helpful. He doesn't want me to work. I couldn't even earn the equivalent of his yearly bonus working part time, and he doesn't feel like the stress to the family would be worth it. At some point as the kids get older, I probably will do some part time work. I would like to work full time for a few years after our youngest graduates. If we can put enough back over 4 or 5 years, Dh could retire 4 or 5 years early. That is my hope because I care for my husband and would like for him to be able to retire early if he chooses to. I do not feel like I owe it to him, though, and he doesn't care if I ever go back to work.

[Dianthus]

5 hours ago, Rosie_0801 said:

You win some, you lose some and it works out roughly even in the end.
"What you win on the swings you lose on the roundabouts."

You're all so clever. I still don't get this. Roundabouts for cars or merry-go-round? And why because jumping off a swing is a win and jumping the merry-go-round is a loss? Too late, maybe. Don't get it.

[Arcadia]

13 minutes ago, Spirea said:

You're all so clever. I still don't get this. Roundabouts for cars or merry-go-round? And why because jumping off a swing is a win and jumping the merry-go-round is a loss? Too late, maybe. Don't get it.

The win and lose is switched but meaning remains the same.

 https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dictionary/english/what-you-lose-on-the-swings-you-gain-on-the-roundabouts

“what you lose on the swings you gain on the roundabouts

UK saying

said to mean that the positive and negative results of a situation or action balance each other: 

"The route through town would be shorter, but there'll be more traffic." "Well, it's just swings and roundabouts."“

[Dianthus]

20 minutes ago, Arcadia said:

The win and lose is switched but meaning remains the same.

 https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dictionary/english/what-you-lose-on-the-swings-you-gain-on-the-roundabouts

“what you lose on the swings you gain on the roundabouts

UK saying

said to mean that the positive and negative results of a situation or action balance each other: 

"The route through town would be shorter, but there'll be more traffic." "Well, it's just swings and roundabouts."“

What are the swings? Is that another traffic reference? Or playground?

We call our traffic circles "roundabouts". We don't have swings in the road (that I know of).

Edited April 6, 2022 by Spirea

[Arcadia]

11 minutes ago, Spirea said:

What are the swings? Is that another traffic reference? Or playground?

We call our traffic circles "roundabouts". We don't have swings in the road (that I know of).

Fairgrounds apparently 

https://www.phrases.org.uk/bulletin_board/62/messages/97.html

“The whole saying is "what you lose on the swings, you gain on the roundabouts". It's originally a saying of fairground folk, and it means that a loss in one field [selling tickets for the swings] is balanced by profit in another [selling tickets for the roundabouts]. An early citation is "What's lost upon the roundabouts we pulls up on the swings" from a novel by P Chalmers, "Green Days & Blue Days", published 1912.”

[Dianthus]

7 minutes ago, Arcadia said:

Fairgrounds apparently 

https://www.phrases.org.uk/bulletin_board/62/messages/97.html

“The whole saying is "what you lose on the swings, you gain on the roundabouts". It's originally a saying of fairground folk, and it means that a loss in one field [selling tickets for the swings] is balanced by profit in another [selling tickets for the roundabouts]. An early citation is "What's lost upon the roundabouts we pulls up on the swings" from a novel by P Chalmers, "Green Days & Blue Days", published 1912.”

Got it. Thank you. Now I can sleep.

Edited April 6, 2022 by Spirea

[wintermom]

On 4/4/2022 at 7:34 PM, Melissa Louise said:

I feel like ds (my youngest) really got the short end of the stick when I went back to work. It would be ok if his Dad had stepped into my role, but he didn't/couldn't. 

The house is a mess, I rarely cook, but more than that, it's like I've run out of energy to help ds with the kind of guidance my oldest kids got. Stupid work gets the best of me, then I save some time for me, then ds gets the dregs. 

 

 

That's too bad you didn't have more support. It really does help when one or more people are able to step up and take on some of the tasks I did before working full-time. My dh has been amazingly supportive, which makes a huge difference. My older dc help out a lot as well. Their uni courses are online and they're living at home.

It's also helped that I work from home, rather than extending the work hours due to a long commute. Dh works mostly from home now, too. Things may ramp up more as we have to transition to working in an office again. I'd much prefer 100% working from home.