Covid decision ... please help

[natalie]

Opinions please regarding covid.

Children have orthodontist appointment this week. 

Old building w/poor ventilation.  Front office staff doesn’t mask. No air purifiers visible last time I went in with the kids.  Patients are seen together in one open room, no barriers between at all.  The last time I went in with the kids, one of the assistants doing the adjustments was wearing mask under nose.

Oldest dc (16+) were boosted last Wednesday (just hit 6 months to be eligible).  Middle dc (12-15 yo’s) have booster scheduled for this week.  Youngest dc not vaxxed yet.

I had anaphylactic reaction to my 1^st vax dose (beginning of June) and am therefore not fully vaccinated, let alone boosted. I am higher risk for severe covid. Even a mild cold for everyone else pre-covid could take me out of commission for a couple months.

Rural county (population approx. 30,000), however:  Low vax rates, especially for children. Virtually no one masks (masks not required in schools).  Low testing, high positivity, many covid deniers. Everyone is living life as though covid never existed. Omicron just detected in our county a couple days ago.

Do I keep appointments or reschedule for March hoping that things have settled down by then?

ETA: live in Michigan

 

 

Edited January 10, 2022 by natalie

[regentrude]

I would reschedule. It's just orthodontics, not a life-threatening medical issue that must be addressed immediately.

Edited January 10, 2022 by regentrude

[mommyoffive]

Is this a consult apt or do they have braces on and this will delay their treatment if you don't go? 

[athena1277]

I would take them and wait in the car.  You don’t want to delay treatment.

[catz]

Nope - that would not be worth it to me.  We did this early in covid.  It may have meant another 8 weeks of braces or whatever but that is not a big deal to us.  Mercifully my daughter got her braces off now.  I would reschedule maybe late feb/early march.  And I would tell them why you're rescheduling too.  

I'm sorry your ortho is doing such a terrible job, ours actually did a great job once good protocols were established.  Kids were texted in from the parking lot one at a time.  All staff N95 and shields.  medical grade air puritifers through facility, running at half capacity with faster turnover, kids entered one door, left through back door.  

[WildflowerMom]

12 minutes ago, natalie said:

Opinions please regarding covid.

Children have orthodontist appointment this week. 

Old building w/poor ventilation.  Front office staff doesn’t mask. No air purifiers visible last time I went in with the kids.  Patients are seen together in one open room, no barriers between at all.  The last time I went in with the kids, one of the assistants doing the adjustments was wearing mask under nose.

Oldest dc (16+) were boosted last Wednesday (just hit 6 months to be eligible).  Middle dc (12-15 yo’s) have booster scheduled for this week.  Youngest dc not vaxxed yet.

I had anaphylactic reaction to my 1^st vax dose (beginning of June) and am therefore not fully vaccinated, let alone boosted. I am higher risk for severe covid. Even a mild cold for everyone else pre-covid could take me out of commission for a couple months.

Rural county (population approx. 30,000), however:  Low vax rates, especially for children. Virtually no one masks (masks not required in schools).  Low testing, high positivity, many covid deniers. Everyone is living life as though covid never existed. Omicron just detected in our county a couple days ago.

Do I keep appointments or reschedule for March hoping that things have settled down by then?

ETA: live in Michigan

 

 

This made my stomach turn, covid or not.   Can you just start looking for another dr?  Or do you have to stay with them?   

[YaelAldrich]

My son lost his pre-braces retainer two weeks ago. I can already see his teeth spacing out. They were supposed to call us to schedule scans and a new fitting. We went in on what was supposed to be scan day last week. I didn't really want to go in but my DH said it shouldn't be put off any longer.  They didn't have us on the calendar and couldn't take us anyways because too many staff members were out. I told them to call me when they can get us in. They haven't called yet. I'm guessing they are still short of staff and can't accommodate us. Fine with me! Maybe your appointments will get cancelled too for the same reasons and rescheduled for a better week?  Good luck!

[Tanaqui]

I'm on team reschedule. It's not a dental emergency. Depending on how crooked the teeth actually are, it may not even be a health issue in the long term, and it certainly isn't one in the short term.

[prairiewindmomma]

Reschedule….we had two kids in braces when the initial shutdown happened, all the two month delay did was push getting braces off for one kid by two months. (The other was in Invisalign and just kept going through trays.)

This omicron wave will be trending down in 6-8 weeks, I think. It will be safer then because everyone likely to get it (non-vaccinating antimaskers) will have natural antibodies at that point from omicron.

[Spryte]

I’d reschedule when things calm down again.

Edited January 10, 2022 by Spryte

[desertflower]

I would reschedule if this was just a check up.

i rescheduled my kids Ortho appt for next month. 

[natalie]

1 hour ago, mommyoffive said:

Is this a consult apt or do they have braces on and this will delay their treatment if you don't go? 

They have braces currently so it will delay treatment somewhat, but this orthodontist does adjustments every 6 weeks, so probably only by a month or two.

[natalie]

1 hour ago, athena1277 said:

I would take them and wait in the car.  You don’t want to delay treatment.

My concern is that they may pick up covid while getting their adjustment (omicron is so contagious) and bring it into the household. I am unable to be fully vaccinated, let alone boosted, and am higher risk for severe covid. I have chronic health issues and have 8 children still in the house to educate and care for. Several of the children require extra care/effort (ASD), so I also worry about them getting covid (especially one of the youngest) because of communication difficulties along with other issues.  

[Faith-manor]

1 hour ago, natalie said:

Opinions please regarding covid.

Children have orthodontist appointment this week. 

Old building w/poor ventilation.  Front office staff doesn’t mask. No air purifiers visible last time I went in with the kids.  Patients are seen together in one open room, no barriers between at all.  The last time I went in with the kids, one of the assistants doing the adjustments was wearing mask under nose.

Oldest dc (16+) were boosted last Wednesday (just hit 6 months to be eligible).  Middle dc (12-15 yo’s) have booster scheduled for this week.  Youngest dc not vaxxed yet.

I had anaphylactic reaction to my 1^st vax dose (beginning of June) and am therefore not fully vaccinated, let alone boosted. I am higher risk for severe covid. Even a mild cold for everyone else pre-covid could take me out of commission for a couple months.

Rural county (population approx. 30,000), however:  Low vax rates, especially for children. Virtually no one masks (masks not required in schools).  Low testing, high positivity, many covid deniers. Everyone is living life as though covid never existed. Omicron just detected in our county a couple days ago.

Do I keep appointments or reschedule for March hoping that things have settled down by then?

ETA: live in Michigan

 

 

Michigan? Yup, we are a state in crisis. My guess is this is going to peak by mid February and then start going down. So I vote for a reschedule to March. Plus your kids are not at full immunity yet from the boosters. 

Edited January 10, 2022 by Faith-manor

[Faith-manor]

1 hour ago, athena1277 said:

I would take them and wait in the car.  You don’t want to delay treatment.

Why? She can't be fully vaxed, and orthodontic is not anything in the ballpark of life saving medical treatment. There is no reason to do this, and put herself at crazy risk. Have you seen Michigan's numbers? We have five hospital systems with federal crisis teams assisting now, and refrigerator trucks for the bodies, heated triage tents in parking lots like it is a war zone, and three more hospital systems saying if things do not improve soon, they will need federal help as well.

 

[natalie]

1 hour ago, FuzzyCatz said:

...  It may have meant another 8 weeks of braces or whatever but that is not a big deal to us.  ...

I'm sorry your ortho is doing such a terrible job, ours actually did a great job once good protocols were established.  Kids were texted in from the parking lot one at a time.  All staff N95 and shields.  medical grade air puritifers through facility, running at half capacity with faster turnover, kids entered one door, left through back door.  

This is what I am thinking. Some of the children still have baby teeth yet to lose, so it's not as though they are going to be getting out of them any time soon anyway.

 

When covid started, I felt pretty good about them.  They made you wait in the car for your appointment and fill out a checklist and checked temperatures, so it appeared they were taking precautions. Then, on the occasions I had to go in with the kids to discuss treatment progression with the orthodontist, I was shocked at the lack of actual precautions being taken.  Waiting in the car for your appointment is kind of pointless when they have multiple people in one treatment room being adjusted at the same time. Then there is the staff masking issue and ventilation/air quality issue.

[natalie]

1 hour ago, WildflowerMom said:

This made my stomach turn, covid or not.   Can you just start looking for another dr?  Or do you have to stay with them?   

This is the only orthodontist in our tri-county area.

[natalie]

1 hour ago, YaelAldrich said:

My son lost his pre-braces retainer two weeks ago. I can already see his teeth spacing out. They were supposed to call us to schedule scans and a new fitting. We went in on what was supposed to be scan day last week. I didn't really want to go in but my DH said it shouldn't be put off any longer.  They didn't have us on the calendar and couldn't take us anyways because too many staff members were out. I told them to call me when they can get us in. They haven't called yet. I'm guessing they are still short of staff and can't accommodate us. Fine with me! Maybe your appointments will get cancelled too for the same reasons and rescheduled for a better week?  Good luck!

Glad they made the decision for you!  That is what I have been hoping for, but so far I haven't heard anything so I guess I have to decide myself. I really am feeling I should cancel, but then I feel so confused and like maybe I am just totally and completely overreacting because of everyone else's carefree behavior here.

[EKS]

I would cancel the appointment and find another orthodontist.

[strawberries]

I would reschedule for March. 

[prairiewindmomma]

Fwiw, can I share what good orthodontia  precautions look like? My kids’ ortho does all aerosolizing procedures in a separate room with surgical air scrubbers. The staff and ortho wear N95s and gowns for those. The non-aerosolizing stuff is done in a shared room, but with dividers up and another air scrubber going. No parents are allowed in the back area currently. Anyone entering the office must be masked properly. For a time parents weren’t allowed in the office at all for kids over 12. We are allowed one parent per family in now, and they have HEPA filters going in the wait room.

For patients who are immunocompromised, she has early morning hours where she will see you separately. If you need even more support, she will do Invisaligns for your treatment plan and you can do some appointments by video. 

[natalie]

Okay ... I  called and rescheduled for March (and managed to get the first appointments of the day as well!) Hopefully things will have slowed down by then.

I feel relieved. This was causing me so much stress. I know that sounds silly to some of you, but I just didn't feel good about going right now. 

Thank you all for your input 🙂

 

[natalie]

2 minutes ago, prairiewindmomma said:

Fwiw, can I share what good orthodontia  precautions look like? My kids’ ortho does all aerosolizing procedures in a separate room with surgical air scrubbers. The staff and ortho wear N95s and gowns for those. The non-aerosolizing stuff is done in a shared room, but with dividers up and another air scrubber going. No parents are allowed in the back area currently. Anyone entering the office must be masked properly. For a time parents weren’t allowed in the office at all for kids over 12. We are allowed one parent per family in now, and they have HEPA filters going in the wait room.

For patients who are immunocompromised, she has early morning hours where she will see you separately. If you need even more support, she will do Invisaligns for your treatment plan and you can do some appointments by video. 

I am jealous of those of you that have providers taking so many precautions.  I am so glad that some people have those options available to them!

[JennyD]

Glad that you were able to reschedule the appointment, OP!  

Separately, have you consulted with an allergist about your reaction to the first vaccine?  I have heard that allergists have been developing protocols to safely vaccinate people in your situation.  My dermatologist had a serious reaction to his first vaccine and then participated in some sort of research study at the university medical school where he teaches; he was ultimately able to get fully vaccinated.  There are also other vaccines in development that have different ingredients -- presumably an allergist would know more about what those are and what the expected safety profile is.

Not to belabor what you already know all too well, but unfortunately Covid is not going away and even if prevalence drops significantly you are still going to be at high risk for some time, if not indefinitely.   Hopefully a good allergist could work with you to develop a solid plan on how best to minimize your risk.

 

 

Edited January 10, 2022 by JennyD

[TCB]

3 hours ago, natalie said:

Okay ... I  called and rescheduled for March (and managed to get the first appointments of the day as well!) Hopefully things will have slowed down by then.

I feel relieved. This was causing me so much stress. I know that sounds silly to some of you, but I just didn't feel good about going right now. 

Thank you all for your input 🙂

 

Good decision!

[natalie]

1 hour ago, JennyD said:

Glad that you were able to reschedule the appointment, OP!  

Separately, have you consulted with an allergist about your reaction to the first vaccine?  I have heard that allergists have been developing protocols to safely vaccinate people in your situation.  My dermatologist had a serious reaction to his first vaccine and then participated in some sort of research study at the university medical school where he teaches; he was ultimately able to get fully vaccinated.  There are also other vaccines in development that have different ingredients -- presumably an allergist would know more about what those are and what the expected safety profile is.

Not to belabor what you already know all too well, but unfortunately Covid is not going away and even if prevalence drops significantly you are still going to be at high risk for some time, if not indefinitely.   Hopefully a good allergist could work with you to develop a solid plan on how best to minimize your risk.

 

 

Thanks for your response, Jenny 🙂.

My doctor considered having me get a 2nd dose, but loading me up on benadryl, pepcid, and prednisone beforehand and having me go to his office afterwards to spend the day there so they could monitor me and I would have help nearby (his office is next to the hospital). He decided against it though, saying it wasn't worth the risk.

As far as a specialist, my understanding at the time was that they were breaking the vax into teeny tiny doses and then waiting a short while to see if there was a reaction and then proceeding, and so on, and so on over the course of a few hours.  However, I have the complicating factor that I have a history of delayed anaphylactic reaction (I have other anaphylactic and severe allergies) - my reaction starts at about the two hour mark, so I don't know that that method would work. I should look into it again, though, to see if there are new methods.

Right now I am holding out hope for a new vaccine to be authorized. Novavax was supposed to submit, but then delayed, and delayed again and again. They finally did submit their paperwork to the FDA on December 31st.  I think, but could be wrong, that there is now a 30 day wait period and then they can apply for EUA, so crossing my fingers as it is my understanding that it is supposed to be safer for those with allergies. I believe it has already been authorized by the W.H.O. as well as other places (EU, India, and some others). I am not certain if any of these places have actually received and started using it yet. Anyway, my hope is that there will soon be another approved vaccine that will be safer for me. I will certainly feel more at ease once there is 🙂.

[Drama Llama]

4 hours ago, natalie said:

This is the only orthodontist in our tri-county area.

I would drive a few hours to avoid a medical provider who didn't follow standard safety precautions. Not just because of covid, but I would assume anyone who would flaunt this rule, isn't going to be sterilizing equipment, or following other safety practices either.  

[City Mouse]

Can you look for a new orthodontist? At The place where my DS and I got braces, the back office staff wore masks when doing adjustments and other such close work even before Covid. Once Covid hit they were even more cautious. 
 

edited to add: I know that probably isn’t realistic to switch. I know that it would cost a lot to start over at a new place.

Edited January 10, 2022 by City Mouse