Duggar trial Dec. 8 update, jury has adjourned for the day

[Faith-manor]

Hi everyone, the jury is in deliberations. The Sun and KNWA both have some recaps of closing arguments. There wasn't anything new obviously from the prosecution. The closing argument took about an hour or so, and reiterated what can only be described is very damning evidence, Josh's own statement at the raid, "Did someone download child pornography?", and so on. I mean, Marshall really wrote a convincing closing argument.

The Defense took an hour as well. How can I put this? " Everybody on the prosecution lied on the stand, and then framed him by downloading CSAM to his machine from a thumbnail drive of another case because they want to persecute him. Guys, I read a bunch of the defense argument, and it really was that bad..qAnon, conspiracy 101, baloney. I thought for sure they would stick to some fallacious argument about techno this that, and not having the router, and trying to pretend that their only witness of any note was NOT qualified at all to testify. I thought they would go with that. Nope. Everybody.in.the.D.OJ.lied.and.poor.joshie.was.framed.by.the.feds.

I don't know what to say. I mean, if I was a juror I would see through that crazy in a snap. But, who knows. If you have a bunch of people on the jury that are prone to conspiracy theory rabbit holes, then this could cause a hung jury.

At any rate, if there is a verdict today, I will post it.

 

ETA: 6:12 pm EST - Court is adjourned and the jury will resume deliberations tomorrow. 

Edited December 8, 2021 by Faith-manor

[WildflowerMom]

I’m sick to my stomach.  I want him to suffer, whether that’s a Christian thing to say or not.  😔

[maize]

1 minute ago, WildflowerMom said:

I’m sick to my stomach.  I want him to suffer, whether that’s a Christian thing to say or not.  😔

If he should by chance get off this time he can still be prosecuted by the state.

His chances of getting off scott free are very, very slim.

[Cordelia]

He needs to go to jail. 

[DreamerGirl]

I want to say thank you @Faith-manor for wading through the muck. I have been reading silently and I did not have any idea it was this bad.  It is horrifying.

I always thought growing up, women in the US had more rights and gender based treatment was not a thing here. How naive of me.

But crappy people are crappy people all over the world. Most of all a woman being born in a developed country does not make her immune from something like this. It is a very sobering realization.

Hope he gets jail. But I will believe it when I see it.

[AbcdeDooDah]

The jury asked to hear the interview from the car lot the day the agents showed up.

[Faith-manor]

1 minute ago, AbcdeDooDah said:

The jury asked to hear the interview from the car lot the day the agents showed up.

Well, that doesn't bode well for Josh because he volunteered the information that his hard drive was partitioned, and was under his own password. Then he asked them if they found something on his devices? That doesn't make a case for "I got framed" or "somebody else did it", but more of a, " The dude practically admitted he was up to something not good" kind of slant.

[Annie G]

The jury also asked for a calendar from May 19 to present but it was denied. Were they likely asking for a timeline of events, or just a plain old calendar?  

[freesia]

And why would they deny a regular calendar?

[Faith-manor]

Just now, Annie G said:

The jury also asked for a calendar from May 19 to present but it was denied. Were they likely asking for a timeline of events, or just a plain old calendar?  

Not sure but it was denied. There was no calendar entered into evidence. There was a timeline in a spreadsheet for the downloads, texts, photos sent, and emails. They could ask for that. But if the prosecution or defense did not enter a calendar into evidence, they can't have one for deliberations.

[Faith-manor]

Just so everyone knows, I have a not nice trip tomorrow in which I have to make it 7 hours north to get our youngest, the college senior, from college. His dorms close at 5 pm Friday, but anywhere from 3-10 inches is expected on my route Friday evening, and freezing rain on one part of the route in the late afternoon on Thursday, so I am trying to travel in between the two things. This means I am leaving at 6 am tomorrow, and have a hotel for Thursday night. I am laying over, and then getting DS at noon immediately following his last final exam. My hope is to make it back to Mackinac Bridge and then depending on conditions, lay over again either St. Ignace or Mackinaw City. Then another bunch of bad, bad yuck is supposed to dump on Gaylord overnight. We will hang out at the hotel, get lunch, and hopefully by noon on Saturday, the plows and salt trucks will have I-75 in decent enough shape to come home.

If there is a verdict tomorrow morning, I may not be able to post until I take a lunch break and only if I have time to check on my phone. Otherwise, it will be Thursday evening/supper time or at least after I check into the hotel before I can check and update. If someone else sees it first, please feel free to post and start discussing.

Dear Michigan, you are beautiful, just gorgeous, so much to love. But there is a reason we have a retirement home down south.

 

[freesia]

Have a good trip, Faith-Manor.  I've had to do the the college drop off between storms thing, too.  Not fun! At least the drive will be beautiful.

[Pam in CT]

Safe travels, Faith.

[Catwoman]

Have a safe trip, Faith!

[Ottakee]

@Faith-manor stay safe.  I am familiar with much of that drive.  Stay where you need too.  Hopefully we won't have much wind.

 

Thanks too for your updates. 

[MEmama]

Safe travels, Faith. I hope you can ride it out together at a hotel longer if need be. 

[MooCow]

Praying for safe travels 👍

[Annie G]

Have a safe trip. Thanks for your work on these threads during the trial. 

[QueenCat]

Safe travels to you and your son!

[TravelingChris]

Safe travels

 

[MerryAtHope]

Praying you have a safe trip! I’ve done a lot of that trip before too, and I know in the winter it can be really sketchy. Thanks for the updates.

[AbcdeDooDah]

I don't think I can refresh the news all day tomorrow like I did today. The stress is too much. As much as I'd love to believe the state made their case, I'm worried. I will be glad to be wrong, though!

[busymama7]

Just now, AbcdeDooDah said:

I don't think I can refresh the news all day tomorrow like I did today. The stress is too much. As much as I'd love to believe the state made their case, I'm worried. I will be glad to be wrong, though!

I would like to follow along but wasn't sure where to look? Where were you watching for updates?

[MercyA]

31 minutes ago, busymama7 said:

I would like to follow along but wasn't sure where to look? Where were you watching for updates?

I never thought I'd recommend this as a source, but The Sun has frequent, short updates. A lot of it is repeat info / filler but they do update often during the trial itself and the updates seem to be factual. It's where I've been looking. If someone has a better source for live updates, let us know!

Edited December 9, 2021 by MercyA

[AbcdeDooDah]

18 minutes ago, MercyA said:

I never thought I'd recommend this as a source, but The Sun has frequent, short updates. A lot of it is repeat info / filler but they do update often during the trial itself and the updates seem to be factual. It's where I've been looking. If someone has a better source for live updates, let us know!

Yes, the Sun, unfortunately.  Duggar snark on Reddit  CCMcCandless on Twitter, and Carrie Jernigan on TikTok are some other places I check.

Edited December 9, 2021 by AbcdeDooDah

[AbcdeDooDah]

The Sun just reported Guilty!

[Annie G]

I appreciate the jury’s service.  Can’t imagine how difficult it was to hear the testimony. But so grateful for justice. 

[Bensmom]

Sentencing is not for four months. Does is usually take that long?  

[Spryte]

2 minutes ago, Bensmom said:

Sentencing is not for four months. Does is usually take that long?  

Yes, and what usually happens while they await sentencing? Where do they reside?

[fraidycat]

2 minutes ago, Spryte said:

Yes, and what usually happens while they await sentencing? Where do they reside?

I read that he has been detained. I hope it stays that way!

[zimom]

Did any Duggar ever testify?  I noticed that a few were on the witness list but either I missed when they testified or they were never called.   

[freesia]

9 minutes ago, zimom said:

Did any Duggar ever testify?  I noticed that a few were on the witness list but either I missed when they testified or they were never called.   

No, only in pre-trial hearings. 

[dirty ethel rackham]

12 minutes ago, zimom said:

Did any Duggar ever testify?  I noticed that a few were on the witness list but either I missed when they testified or they were never called.   

 

2 minutes ago, freesia said:

No, only in pre-trial hearings. 

I read that some (the girls) were expected to be rebuttal witnesses if the defense chose to present character witnesses.

[dirty ethel rackham]

Thanks, @Faith-manor for all the updates.  Praying for safe travels for you.  

[freesia]

Just now, dirty ethel rackham said:

 

I read that some (the girls) were expected to be rebuttal witnesses if the defense chose to present character witnesses.

Yes, that was what people thought.  Jill and Jed were possible witnesses, but no one knew for sure for which side. Neither were used. 

[Ottakee]

8 hours ago, Spryte said:

Yes, and what usually happens while they await sentencing? Where do they reside?

Yes, that is typical.  My ex was convicted in early Sept and sentenced in late January in federal court.

In his case he was held in a county jail where the feds have a contract.  It was about an hour from where we lived.  It was a smaller, rural jail that likely had room and made money renting out spots.

My ex was in protective type custody for at least part of the time due to the nature of his crimes.

He got 90 years and is now in an out of state federal prison where he is in a medical unit due to type 2 diabetes and history of heart attack and stents.  That said, I think it is also in a unit for similar crimes.

[Faith-manor]

9 hours ago, Bensmom said:

Sentencing is not for four months. Does is usually take that long?  

It often does. There will be reports from the prosecution on sentence recommendations, a psychiatric exam and report, etc. These all have to be compiled. 90 days is average however the defense asked for 30 days to discuss or prepare appeals motions. The chances of an appeal trial being granted at the federal level is bizarrely low.

[Ottakee]

29 minutes ago, Faith-manor said:

It often does. There will be reports from the prosecution on sentence recommendations, a psychiatric exam and report, etc. These all have to be compiled. 90 days is average however the defense asked for 30 days to discuss or prepare appeals motions. The chances of an appeal trial being granted at the federal level is bizarrely low.

Yes to all of the above.  It was 3 1)2 months for my ex in federal court.  He was held in a county jail in a county a few away from ours where the feds have a contract to house their waiting to be sentenced prisoners.  Larry Nassar was in the same jail while he awaited sentencing.

The chances of an appeal trial being granted are very very low....but expect that he will file motion after motion and request and ..........  Not that they will be granted, but rather that he will have the time, and possibly the help, to do this.