Why is everyone depressed?

[Scarlett]

1 hour ago, Faith-manor said:

I am sorry for what you are going through, and I am most certainly glad you find purpose in faith. That's great for you. Please at least accept that for me, christianity is hell on earth and provides NO comfort, joy, peace, or assistance. It is really offensive when Christians assume certain things about non-christians. I totally accept what your faith does for you. Likewise, you should accept what I say to be true for me. And yes, I can understand your perspective. Don't think for one single second that I was not a Christian at any point in my life...that old "No True Scotsman myth". You would be profoundly wrong. My deconversion has been a complicated journey from a person of profound faith to one in abject despair because of that faith. I 100% understand what you believe and why it informs your perspective. That is wonderful for you. It does not hold true for me.

Best wishes and peace to you and your family.

That is the weirdest thing for me.I mean……not the  part about questioning a harsh type version of Christianity……but the complete   Dismissal of Christianity is weird to me. 

[Melissa Louise]

CBT is one tool, not The Answer.

Part of the reason it's so popular is that it, like ADs, is cheap to provide. Because it's manualized. You can get AI to deliver CBT.

CBT ( particularly short term with no psychotherapeutic aspect) + AD's is suitable for a minority of mildly depressed patients. Probably the same patients who would improve without treatment, or with lifestyle adjustments.

Over-use of CBT is no better than overuse of AD's. 

[Wheres Toto]

14 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

That is the weirdest thing for me.I mean……not the  part about questioning a harsh type version of Christianity……but the complete   Dismissal of Christianity is weird to me. 

Why is that weird?   Billions of people around the world dismiss Christianity.

I do find it weird that a discussion about an afterlife defaults to a Christian idea of an afterlife.  There are other possibilities.  

[Scarlett]

6 minutes ago, Wheres Toto said:

Why is that weird?   Billions of people around the world dismiss Christianity.

I do find it weird that a discussion about an afterlife defaults to a Christian idea of an afterlife.  There are other possibilities.  

I  do not believe billions of people who strongly believe in Christianity for years then go on to completely dismiss it.   Leave a certain church? Sure.  But to completely dismiss Christianity?  No.  Not billions.  
 

Said as a Christian who probably believes very little of what Faith believed.  

[Clarita]

I'm not sure if the AD and CBT are cheap and freely dispensed is a regional thing. Amongst my friends who need medication for their mental illness they have to beg and plead to get the meds they need or be able to pay $$ for them. Therapy getting someone to talk to is much easier (not easy if you have to ask for monetary assitance but easier than getting the meds).   

[Murphy101]

On 11/26/2021 at 7:00 PM, GracieJane said:

According to the CDC, almost 14% of the adult population in the US was on anti-depressants before Covid (maybe now it’s higher?). The highest use was found among women above the age of 60 (24%, so almost a quarter). 
 

Do you think this is new? Were this many people depressed 100 years ago?

For women above the age of 60?  Most likely because their spouse has died or they are having medical problems that can cause depression. Things like Alzheimers and cancer for example.  And then there’s the whole entire life turned upside down when they sell the home of decades and move into a new place and/or watching friends die off phase.

For others it may be that they needed it for years and finally decided to hell with shame and got some meds in the hope of not feeling that way for whatever time they have left.

And then of course there’s the medical side affect bonus to care givers - many antidepressants have a calming to actual sedating bonus.  Elderly are often over medicated and wrongly medicated and don’t know it.

 

[LucyStoner]

I have PTSD and anxiety.  I can’t take SSRIs.  The sexual side effects are so pronounced that it just gives me yet another thing else to be depressed about.  I have had doctors write off my concerns about the side effects in a way that basically implied that sexual side effects just shouldn’t be a big deal to me.  I have found other meds to be useful at times though.  I have also found diet, exercise and other lifestyle factors helpful.  I don’t think I that people should write off meds in favor of other strategies.  At the same time, I also see people writing off lifestyle factors in favor of medication mgmt only.  I don’t think this is helpful.  

[ktgrok]

On 11/28/2021 at 12:00 AM, Clarita said:

I tend to reserve the word depression (for myself) during those times when I feel really down and bummed out and there is no reason for it. I have felt that twice in my life. Once was because I took Vicodine for a wisdom tooth extraction. The second was my third pregnancy, and the miscarriage is what made me feel better (this was not an undesired pregnancy). So not all depressed people can be fixed with happier thoughts and a growth mindset.

 

We talk so much about postpartum depression, but people don't realize that prenatal depression is just as common! I had it with my last pregnancy and it was miserable. The pregnancies before that I had anxiety, but not the depression. With the last pregnancy the depression never fully went away, although it is much better now. 

23 hours ago, Scarlett said:

Did anyone except @fraidycat watch the TED talk I posted?   
 

Anti depressants may help and some may literally have no other option in order to function…..but there are consequences to long term use of those drugs.  Have any of you that take antidepressants avoided weight gain?  I have a lot of friends who are on AD and everyone has had significant weight gain.  
 

 

Don't some older ones have weight loss as a benefit? Like, Wellbutrin?

21 hours ago, Scarlett said:

And I have known many who went straight for AD and never changed anything in their personal life.  
 

But no I don’t think people should suffer needlessly. 

Sometimes people need the chemical help before they have the ability to make changes. It gives them enough relief to have the ability to think rationally and the mental stamina to work on the changes. Have to stop the bleeding before starting physical therapy, you know?

20 hours ago, Pawz4me said:

 

As far as the comment earlier about Lexapro changing the brain -- when I was on it my brain certainly needed changing! Desperately needed it. My medical provider at the time told me if I would just take it for at least six months it would give my brain chemicals time to rebalance to where they needed to be. And he was absolutely correct about that. 

 

Yes - the idea is that it gives your brain time to rewire new pathways, new responses that become habit/automatic later, even without meds. I've seen this with my ADHD meds as well - even on days I skip them I still have the ingrained habits/responses that I was able to create while on meds. 

[Granny_Weatherwax]

15 hours ago, Melissa Louise said:

Because being anti AD, pro bootstrapping is just one way lack of understanding/acceptance that mental illnesses are real plays out. 

 

I am definitely not pro-bootstrapping. I had been on ADs for years. I recently chose to go med free because of severe side effects. I am also well aware and intimately involved with mental illness. I know it exists. I know meds are the answer for some. I know it can relieve pain and anguish and offer a ray of hope and stability. I know it is a lifeline and keeps demons at bay. 

I have never in my life stated I am anti antidepressant or against any medicine for that matter. 

I have been on the receiving end of horrible advice regarding depression and anxiety. The worst being to pray harder, strengthen my faith, and read the Psalms because no true believer could possibly ever be depressed. I happily took my ADs; thank you very much.

But I do believe too many health care providers throw out a prescription for ADs without actually looking for the root cause or developing a treatment plan for why the depression initially occurred. I'm sorry if you interpret that as anything but concern for the overwhelming use of ADs. That's all it is. 

Edited November 29, 2021 by Granny_Weatherwax

[Scarlett]

1 hour ago, ktgrok said:

 

Sometimes people need the chemical help before they have the ability to make changes. It gives them enough relief to have the ability to think rationally and the mental stamina to work on the changes. Have to stop the bleeding before starting physical therapy, you know?

 

Yes, that absolutely makes sense.  But I don't see a lot play out that way.  I mostly see people put on ADs and never get off.  

[Murphy101]

2 hours ago, Scarlett said:

Yes, that absolutely makes sense.  But I don't see a lot play out that way.  I mostly see people put on ADs and never get off.  

And there’s lots of reasons for that, many of which are often not within their control or deemed socially acceptable. 

For example, working a god -awful low wage job but can’t get a better one without major financial struggle.  Caring for a loved one with major health problems that aren’t ever going to improve. Or just the on-going cycle of major financial strain in general.  The mortgage doesn’t care that the job paying it makes someone feel like jumping a cliff. But living under a bridge probably won’t improve their mentality either.  And that’s not even considering the affect on kids or spouses.

Changing to a very healthy diet on a snap budget is just not realistic.  And a LOT of elderly are on snap budgets.  Bottom line is Fritos are cheaper than broccoli and you can eat Fritos in the car between work and picking up kids. And at some point we all reach an age where by golly if we only have 5-10 years left - we are darn well having pie for breakfast.   Getting healthy exercise is also not as straight forward as it sounds.  Many mental health concerns are related to vitamin or mineral deficiency - but supplements are expensive and time consuming to research which ones are worth buying  and a regular doctor appt to know which are needed and at what doses to achieve healthy levels and change of dose to maintain it.  And depression and anxiety make it hard to function.  Let me repeat that louder.  DEPRESSION AND ANXIETY MAKE IT HARD TO FUNCTION.  Everything is just so exhausting and frustrating and overwhelming that adding more to the everything just makes it go from Pike’s Peak to Mt Everest.  Telling people who are dragging themselves every single day to smile and get dressed and work and eat and do dishes to also change their lifestyle (and research how) and go to the dr and research what to demand from the dr and how to fight insurance on it and and and  … if they do all that and get meds? They have more energy than me so good for them.

For the elderly and disabled - many times the cause is never going away before they die.  At some point for all of us, the goal is no longer healing, it’s accepting that our bodies have been well-used and are just never going to be like it was before again.  And our brain and our chemistry won’t be either so meds for mental health may become permanent just like heart medications or high blood pressure meds usually do for people the further over 60 they get.  There’s nothing wrong with them in the youthful medical sense of the word.  It’s just part of aging. At some point all machines need help to run efficiently and the older the machine - the more help it usually needs.  Doesn’t mean there is something wrong with the machine or that it’s a design flaw or a wrong usage issue.

[Faith-manor]

51 minutes ago, Murphy101 said:

And there’s lots of reasons for that, many of which are often not within their control or deemed socially acceptable. 

For example, working a god -awful low wage job but can’t get a better one without major financial struggle.  Caring for a loved one with major health problems that aren’t ever going to improve. Or just the on-going cycle of major financial strain in general.  The mortgage doesn’t care that the job paying it makes someone feel like jumping a cliff. But living under a bridge probably won’t improve their mentality either.  And that’s not even considering the affect on kids or spouses.

Changing to a very healthy diet on a snap budget is just not realistic.  And a LOT of elderly are on snap budgets.  Bottom line is Fritos are cheaper than broccoli and you can eat Fritos in the car between work and picking up kids. And at some point we all reach an age where by golly if we only have 5-10 years left - we are darn well having pie for breakfast.   Getting healthy exercise is also not as straight forward as it sounds.  Many mental health concerns are related to vitamin or mineral deficiency - but supplements are expensive and time consuming to research which ones are worth buying  and a regular doctor appt to know which are needed and at what doses to achieve healthy levels and change of dose to maintain it.  And depression and anxiety make it hard to function.  Let me repeat that louder.  DEPRESSION AND ANXIETY MAKE IT HARD TO FUNCTION.  Everything is just so exhausting and frustrating and overwhelming that adding more to the everything just makes it go from Pike’s Peak to Mt Everest.  Telling people who are dragging themselves every single day to smile and get dressed and work and eat and do dishes to also change their lifestyle (and research how) and go to the dr and research what to demand from the dr and how to fight insurance on it and and and  … if they do all that and get meds? They have more energy than me so good for them.

For the elderly and disabled - many times the cause is never going away before they die.  At some point for all of us, the goal is no longer healing, it’s accepting that our bodies have been well-used and are just never going to be like it was before again.  And our brain and our chemistry won’t be either so meds for mental health may become permanent just like heart medications or high blood pressure meds usually do for people the further over 60 they get.  There’s nothing wrong with them in the youthful medical sense of the word.  It’s just part of aging. At some point all machines need help to run efficiently and the older the machine - the more help it usually needs.  Doesn’t mean there is something wrong with the machine or that it’s a design flaw or a wrong usage issue.

Hear hear!!!!!!!!!

[Scarlett]

1 hour ago, Murphy101 said:

And there’s lots of reasons for that, many of which are often not within their control or deemed socially acceptable. 

For example, working a god -awful low wage job but can’t get a better one without major financial struggle.  Caring for a loved one with major health problems that aren’t ever going to improve. Or just the on-going cycle of major financial strain in general.  The mortgage doesn’t care that the job paying it makes someone feel like jumping a cliff. But living under a bridge probably won’t improve their mentality either.  And that’s not even considering the affect on kids or spouses.

Changing to a very healthy diet on a snap budget is just not realistic.  And a LOT of elderly are on snap budgets.  Bottom line is Fritos are cheaper than broccoli and you can eat Fritos in the car between work and picking up kids. And at some point we all reach an age where by golly if we only have 5-10 years left - we are darn well having pie for breakfast.   Getting healthy exercise is also not as straight forward as it sounds.  Many mental health concerns are related to vitamin or mineral deficiency - but supplements are expensive and time consuming to research which ones are worth buying  and a regular doctor appt to know which are needed and at what doses to achieve healthy levels and change of dose to maintain it.  And depression and anxiety make it hard to function.  Let me repeat that louder.  DEPRESSION AND ANXIETY MAKE IT HARD TO FUNCTION.  Everything is just so exhausting and frustrating and overwhelming that adding more to the everything just makes it go from Pike’s Peak to Mt Everest.  Telling people who are dragging themselves every single day to smile and get dressed and work and eat and do dishes to also change their lifestyle (and research how) and go to the dr and research what to demand from the dr and how to fight insurance on it and and and  … if they do all that and get meds? They have more energy than me so good for them.

For the elderly and disabled - many times the cause is never going away before they die.  At some point for all of us, the goal is no longer healing, it’s accepting that our bodies have been well-used and are just never going to be like it was before again.  And our brain and our chemistry won’t be either so meds for mental health may become permanent just like heart medications or high blood pressure meds usually do for people the further over 60 they get.  There’s nothing wrong with them in the youthful medical sense of the word.  It’s just part of aging. At some point all machines need help to run efficiently and the older the machine - the more help it usually needs.  Doesn’t mean there is something wrong with the machine or that it’s a design flaw or a wrong usage issue.

You have valid points.  And yet I think there are some people who could benefit by thinking about it differently.  

[Melissa Louise]

18 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

You have valid points.  And yet I think there are some people who could benefit by thinking about it differently.  

When someone has clinical depression, they may indeed benefit by thinking about it differently, only the awkward thing is, the brain's ability to think about it differently is impaired by  clinical depression.

Are people just talking about a low mood now and again, or are we talking about clinical depression ( which isn't a single illness anyway?)

 

[Melissa Louise]

1 hour ago, Murphy101 said:

And there’s lots of reasons for that, many of which are often not within their control or deemed socially acceptable. 

For example, working a god -awful low wage job but can’t get a better one without major financial struggle.  Caring for a loved one with major health problems that aren’t ever going to improve. Or just the on-going cycle of major financial strain in general.  The mortgage doesn’t care that the job paying it makes someone feel like jumping a cliff. But living under a bridge probably won’t improve their mentality either.  And that’s not even considering the affect on kids or spouses.

Changing to a very healthy diet on a snap budget is just not realistic.  And a LOT of elderly are on snap budgets.  Bottom line is Fritos are cheaper than broccoli and you can eat Fritos in the car between work and picking up kids. And at some point we all reach an age where by golly if we only have 5-10 years left - we are darn well having pie for breakfast.   Getting healthy exercise is also not as straight forward as it sounds.  Many mental health concerns are related to vitamin or mineral deficiency - but supplements are expensive and time consuming to research which ones are worth buying  and a regular doctor appt to know which are needed and at what doses to achieve healthy levels and change of dose to maintain it.  And depression and anxiety make it hard to function.  Let me repeat that louder.  DEPRESSION AND ANXIETY MAKE IT HARD TO FUNCTION.  Everything is just so exhausting and frustrating and overwhelming that adding more to the everything just makes it go from Pike’s Peak to Mt Everest.  Telling people who are dragging themselves every single day to smile and get dressed and work and eat and do dishes to also change their lifestyle (and research how) and go to the dr and research what to demand from the dr and how to fight insurance on it and and and  … if they do all that and get meds? They have more energy than me so good for them.

For the elderly and disabled - many times the cause is never going away before they die.  At some point for all of us, the goal is no longer healing, it’s accepting that our bodies have been well-used and are just never going to be like it was before again.  And our brain and our chemistry won’t be either so meds for mental health may become permanent just like heart medications or high blood pressure meds usually do for people the further over 60 they get.  There’s nothing wrong with them in the youthful medical sense of the word.  It’s just part of aging. At some point all machines need help to run efficiently and the older the machine - the more help it usually needs.  Doesn’t mean there is something wrong with the machine or that it’s a design flaw or a wrong usage issue.

Thank you for getting it. 

[Scarlett]

4 minutes ago, Melissa Louise said:

When someone has clinical depression, they may indeed benefit by thinking about it differently, only the awkward thing is, the brain's ability to think about it differently is impaired by  clinical depression.

Are people just talking about a low mood now and again, or are we talking about clinical depression ( which isn't a single illness anyway?)

 

I think I am being completely misunderstood.  I am not trying to beat up on anyone for their medical choices.  It is just a thought that maybe society as a whole is approaching the entire thing incorrectly.  That is all.  If one person can benefit by a different approach that would be great.  Everyone who is great doing things they way they are doing them, that is great too.  Not trying to change the way you do things.  

[Melissa Louise]

8 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

I think I am being completely misunderstood.  I am not trying to beat up on anyone for their medical choices.  It is just a thought that maybe society as a whole is approaching the entire thing incorrectly.  That is all.  If one person can benefit by a different approach that would be great.  Everyone who is great doing things they way they are doing them, that is great too.  Not trying to change the way you do things.  

Actually, I'm not medicated for my depression. So this isn't a me thing. 

I agree there needs to be a more holistic approach, but bucking up and changing your diet doesn't really cut it. 

Holistic means changing a lot. And it doesn't mean the burden of change is solely on the individual.

[Granny_Weatherwax]

32 minutes ago, Melissa Louise said:

When someone has clinical depression, they may indeed benefit by thinking about it differently, only the awkward thing is, the brain's ability to think about it differently is impaired by  clinical depression.

Are people just talking about a low mood now and again, or are we talking about clinical depression ( which isn't a single illness anyway?)

 

This question is what I was trying to discuss earlier. The term depression is used as an umbrella term for so many different things. It is nearly impossible to have a conversation about prevalence rates, treatment, or efficacy of treatment when each person is talking about something different.

[Jean in Newcastle]

33 minutes ago, Granny_Weatherwax said:

This question is what I was trying to discuss earlier. The term depression is used as an umbrella term for so many different things. It is nearly impossible to have a conversation about prevalence rates, treatment, or efficacy of treatment when each person is talking about something different.

Exactly.  Situational depression (especially if temporary) is so different from long term clinical depression.  And it depends on whether someone can function in life or not and / or how easily. 

But it's hard to pin down rates.  People who should be / or could be helped with meds don't always take meds.  Those who might not really need meds do take them at times.  Meds are prescribed for things that aren't depression (often off label).  The premise in the original post is terribly flawed because of it.

And then when you try to compare it to other generations where terms were different, coping mechanisms were different, life spans were different, and whether things were even tracked was different, then it's kind of a crap shoot. 

[Scarlett]

1 hour ago, Melissa Louise said:

Actually, I'm not medicated for my depression. So this isn't a me thing. 

I agree there needs to be a more holistic approach, but bucking up and changing your diet doesn't really cut it. 

Holistic means changing a lot. And it doesn't mean the burden of change is solely on the individual.

Things I never said.

[Terabith]

1 hour ago, Scarlett said:

I think I am being completely misunderstood.  I am not trying to beat up on anyone for their medical choices.  It is just a thought that maybe society as a whole is approaching the entire thing incorrectly.  That is all.  If one person can benefit by a different approach that would be great.  Everyone who is great doing things they way they are doing them, that is great too.  Not trying to change the way you do things.  

The issue is that while yes, there are definitely societal things that are exacerbating depression, most of those societal trends are not within the power of any individual suffering from depression or any medical provider to change.  

So we are stuck with solutions that are within our power to change, including meds.  

[regentrude]

2 hours ago, Terabith said:

The issue is that while yes, there are definitely societal things that are exacerbating depression, most of those societal trends are not within the power of any individual suffering from depression or any medical provider to change.  

And there are plenty of depressed people who, by any external measures, have everything going well for them in life. A person can be in good physical health, have an intact family, a great partner, a well-paid job - and they can still experience depression. Which then is exacerbated by the guilt that they don't really have anything to complain about and that they should be happy (and the count-your-blessings/gratitude inspirational sayings make things just worse for them).

Not every depression can be blamed on "society". 

[kiwik]

On 11/28/2021 at 3:28 PM, Farrar said:

I think it's a huge host of factors. Of course depression has always been around. And I agree it's being talked about more.

But also, I think that anxiety has risen. The ways we address depression have changed - many for the better, but some for the worse. I think there's a lot of social alienation that is exacerbating it in particular ways for some people. I think there's also been a rise in existential depression among a lot of people - young people I know feel that there's no point because climate change has doomed us all and the economy is so rigged that they don't think they'll ever get ahead. They don't plan to have families or kids. I think some of that is also exacerbating depression for some young folks.

But my generation were convinced world war 3 was going to wipe everyone out and the generation before had World War 11 and before that ,,, I think the main difference is that kids feel they can change things.which is a lot more stress inducing than just hoping Russia and the US don't start a nuclear war.  Also we expect to be happy and fulfilled in a way our ancestors didn't 

[kiwik]

17 hours ago, Melissa Louise said:

When someone has clinical depression, they may indeed benefit by thinking about it differently, only the awkward thing is, the brain's ability to think about it differently is impaired by  clinical depression.

Are people just talking about a low mood now and again, or are we talking about clinical depression ( which isn't a single illness anyway?)

 

I have had a lot of depression and then post natal depression with my oldest.  I got referred to a psychologist or complained because I wasn't trying hard enough.  I had severe depression, had just gone back to full time work and my grandmother was dying - it was as much as I could do to get out of bed, care for my son and work 

ETA I don't consider situational depression to be an issue - with help it should resolve.  I have the kind of depression that comes and goes but has been a constant companion my whole life.

Edited November 30, 2021 by kiwik

[Dmmetler]

9 minutes ago, kiwik said:

But my generation were convinced world war 3 was going to wipe everyone out and the generation before had World War 11 and before that ,,, I think the main difference is that kids feel they can change things.which is a lot more stress inducing than just hoping Russia and the US don't start a nuclear war.  Also we expect to be happy and fulfilled in a way our ancestors didn't 

Not only do they feel they can change things, but that it is their obligation to do so. By themselves, individually. And even Greta Thurnburg has been unable to singlehandedly arrest climate change. No teen has the power or reach. Heck, no single world leader does either. Jacinda Arden can't make up for acts by the US. Joe Biden can't go back and make up for what the US has done in the past, or completely change the economic system overnight. Neither can control China. It's a mess.

 

  My kid's therapist once commented to me that it's hard to even say that a kid has an anxiety disorder when their fears are valid and are playing out all around them, and, if anything, being desensitized to such issues is a problem in it's own right. But at the same time, as an individual, your mental health has to take priority. And that means realizing that you can't solve all of the world's problems by yourself, but that you, simultaneously, are not 100% powerless, either. Because one side, trying to take responsibility leads to anxiety. The other leads to depression. 

 

My personal kid has diverged from a goal of directly saving species to a goal of educating others. And one main reason is that the latter is possible and under your control to a much greater degree. The former, much less so.

 

 

[SKL]

And it doesn't help the way info sources tend to catastrophize things that individuals cannot control (even if we can have an impact individually).

This has been going longer than recorded history, and rather than modern science helping to end it, "science" has been used to give it "credibility."

I tell my kids how these dire warnings have been going back and forth my whole life, and none of them have proven true.

I for one choose not to worry about these things.  I take a practical approach and try not to be wasteful or messy.  That's really all I can do without actually making things worse.

Though, I'm happy to accommodate my kids any time they decide they'd rather walk or bike than catch a ride somewhere.  Or put up the electronics.  Or donate their birthday/Christmas money to a good cause.

Edited November 30, 2021 by SKL

[Lady Florida.]

I know this thread is about depression but ADHD is a disorder that gets people riled up and claiming it's "new". When ds was diagnosed at a young age I kept hearing about how ADHD is over diagnosed and over medicated. In reality experts think it's both under diagnosed and under treated. People gave all kinds of advice about changing his diet, giving him more exercise, or just saying we should discipline him more strictly. In the past people with ADHD were the "bad seed"; the family embarrassment. They did poorly in school. They couldn't hold down a job or keep a relationship. I'm glad that ds lives in a time where his disorder is at least understood and treated by doctors, if not the general public.

It's not that ADHD, depression, and other mental illnesses didn't exist in the past. It's not that there's more of them today. It's that we can diagnose and treat better than we could in "the good ole days". 

On 11/26/2021 at 8:31 PM, Katy said:

It's not new. Diagnosis and treatment are new.

 

On 11/27/2021 at 12:43 PM, DreamerGirl said:

 

Just because labels did not exist does not mean trauma did not. Reaching for  help now and getting it does not mean more issues exist now.

It means mental health is getting a response, is thought of as a disease that needs medical help just like physical health.

 

Yes, these express what I was saying above.

 

On 11/27/2021 at 7:13 PM, GoodGrief3 said:

That's a theory of mine. Many, many people were self medicating depression and anxiety with smoking. We discouraged tobacco use (with good intentions) without providing adequate treatment for the underlying mental health condition.

Also with alcohol. 

 

On 11/28/2021 at 5:27 PM, Melissa Louise said:

Because being anti AD, pro bootstrapping is just one way lack of understanding/acceptance that mental illnesses are real plays out. 

 

 

This is what comes from the inability to understand science. The brain is an organ. Sometimes organs fail and sometimes we can treat those failures with meds. The bootstrap advice would sound ridiculous if said to someone who is nearsighted, has diabetes, high blood pressure, or a broken ankle. We need to get to a point where it sounds equally ridiculous when speaking about mental illness. 

On 11/29/2021 at 9:09 AM, ktgrok said:

 

Don't some older ones have weight loss as a benefit? Like, Wellbutrin?

 

Wellbutrin was (still is?) used off label for smoking cessation. It became apparent to some researchers and possibly doctor reporting that people with depression who were also smokers tended to quit smoking when on Wellbutrin. It ended up being prescribed for smokers who weren't depressed but wanted to quit. Insurance companies weren't covering the off label use and I don't know if it's still used that way, but in the early to mid 2000s I learned about it from a smoker who was trying to quit.

[Melissa Louise]

6 hours ago, kiwik said:

I have had a lot of depression and then post natal depression with my oldest.  I got referred to a psychologist or complained because I wasn't trying hard enough.  I had severe depression, had just gone back to full time work and my grandmother was dying - it was as much as I could do to get out of bed, care for my son and work 

ETA I don't consider situational depression to be an issue - with help it should resolve.  I have the kind of depression that comes and goes but has been a constant companion my whole life.

Yes, this idea that people just aren't trying hard enough is very persistent. 

 

[LucyStoner]

On 11/29/2021 at 7:44 AM, Scarlett said:

Yes, that absolutely makes sense.  But I don't see a lot play out that way.  I mostly see people put on ADs and never get off.  

Really?  People go off their anti-depressant medication *all the time*. Medication compliance is statistically fairly low for anti-depressants.  As I understand it, more than 1/2 of people who start an anti-depressant are off of it by 6 months.  

[Mrs Tiggywinkle]

Wellbutrin kills my appetite and I lose a lot of weight on it.   I honestly don’t know if it really alleviates my depression or if it just makes me feel healthier; and then I feel better.

prozac made me gain weight.