How much social time is 'enough'?

[Not_a_Number]

2 minutes ago, Carrie12345 said:

You can’t *make sure* teens have friends. Humans are going to human. You can provide opportunities, and things will happen. Or they won’t.  Or they will and then the humans or circumstances will change.

To me, it comes across as a lot of overthinking. But I think there might be a generational difference involved in that. 

Nah, it's just me, lol. I'm the eternal optimizer. 

I obviously can't make sure of anything, because people are going to people 😉 . But I was basically brought up with zero parental help, and there were points at which it wouldn't have come amiss. I would like to make sure to do my part, whatever it is. I figure that since I've taken away the standard way kids make friends (which is spending lots of time with other kids at school), I should make sure to make up for it as best as I can. 

Mind you, we love homeschooling. But I do try to think about how to solve problems before they become serious. 

[MEmama]

33 minutes ago, Not_a_Number said:

Nah, it's just me, lol. I'm the eternal optimizer. 

I obviously can't make sure of anything, because people are going to people 😉 . But I was basically brought up with zero parental help, and there were points at which it wouldn't have come amiss. I would like to make sure to do my part, whatever it is. I figure that since I've taken away the standard way kids make friends (which is spending lots of time with other kids at school), I should make sure to make up for it as best as I can. 

Mind you, we love homeschooling. But I do try to think about how to solve problems before they become serious. 

I mean, she’s going to cultivate interests and since you are an involved, intentional parent you will do your best to get her involved in those things that she wants to be involved in. They will change and evolve, some years will be busy and full and some less so (like right now, out of necessity).

You are fortunate to live in area where she can readily explore literally anything AND there will be other kids doing the same. Until DS started high school, it was very difficult to find activities where there other interested, engaging kids outside of sports (thank goodness he was always playing sports— but even some of those weren’t exactly social. When he did triathlons and bike racing, he was really on his own and it was tough watching kids he competed against having fun with their entire teams). Gifted level academic classes were nowhere to be found where we live, so while he craved that kind of opportunity we just didn’t have access. Spring and summer middle school programs at MIT were the best we could do.

Kids find friends where kids find friends. Gaming has been helpful for DS, but really connections can be made anywhere there is a shared interest. I know you’re a planner (me too!), but there’s only so much a parent can actually do to cultivate friendships, beyond offering up opportunities. I know you’re already good at that! 🙂 

 

[GoodGrief3]

1 hour ago, Not_a_Number said:

Nah, it's just me, lol. I'm the eternal optimizer. 

I obviously can't make sure of anything, because people are going to people 😉 . But I was basically brought up with zero parental help, and there were points at which it wouldn't have come amiss. I would like to make sure to do my part, whatever it is. I figure that since I've taken away the standard way kids make friends (which is spending lots of time with other kids at school), I should make sure to make up for it as best as I can. 

Mind you, we love homeschooling. But I do try to think about how to solve problems before they become serious. 

No real advice, but just an observation from a parent of three daughters, the youngest of whom hits adult age in the next few months:  puberty is going to hit your home soon, and will change a lot of things. The teen years are complicated, and you don't always recognize the kids you thought you knew well in their early years. Kids often push to go to school in the preteen/early teen years because they feel uncomfortable with all the changes of puberty, and think going to school will make them feel better.

As far as a strategy for friendships as you transition into those years, my best advice would be to maintain ongoing group activities centered around an interest. Sports are good for that, maybe certain academic pursuits, depending on your area. There are no easy solutions though. I don't necessarily think building-based school is the answer either. Teen and young adult years are rough.

[Not_a_Number]

2 hours ago, MEmama said:

I know you’re a planner (me too!), but there’s only so much a parent can actually do to cultivate friendships, beyond offering up opportunities. I know you’re already good at that! 🙂 

I'm honestly just curious how many opportunities to offer! COVID has made me really reevaluate things, for obvious reasons. Before the pandemic, we were CONSTANTLY going to classes. And I can say for sure that this did not lead to close friendships in the way that school seemed to -- she simply didn't seem to see any one kid enough. On the one hand, she didn't seem to have the need to see any one kid that much -- when I'd ask her who to have a playdate with, she'd name a new kid every time 😂. On the other hand, it was clear that she felt tighter with her old preschool and kindergarten friends than she did with her homeschooling friends... so it was hard to weigh it all. 

She definitely prefers homeschooling to school and she absolutely adored all the play time. But it was also hard to think about what was the right environment to provide for her, you know? Right now, I'm experimenting with making a more cohesive social group and I'm going to see how that goes. And then I also wonder -- are there other things I should offer? Should she have some opportunities to spend time with kids NOT in our co-op? Is the hybrid online/in-person co-op a good way to go? 

I don't have so many choices right now, anyway, since I can barely stand the level of danger that comes with meeting up with the co-op outside once a week... so I'm just musing 🙂  .

Edited August 9, 2021 by Not_a_Number

[wendyroo]

5 minutes ago, Not_a_Number said:

I'm honestly just curious how many opportunities to offer!

This is exactly what my mom, an extravert through and through, spent most of my childhood asking herself (we have had many discussions about it).

I was very much like my kids minus the mental health challenges. I was academically very advanced, I had a hard time "getting" other kids my age, I was very skilled at interacting with adults, but had little interest in playing with other kids.

My mom enrolled me in a co-op preschool, was very involved and invested, set up playdates for me with classmates...and I wasn't interested. In kindergarten she set up more playdates, forced me to attend classmates birthday parties, carted six of us to Chuck-E-Cheese for my birthday...and I wasn't interested.

I changed schools before first grade, and testing indicated I had the maturity and academics to be accelerated two grades. The administration wanted to put me straight into second grade, but my mom felt that would hinder my social development and insisted I get put into first with my age mates. She forced me into Brownies (Girl Scouts), became a troop leader, and went all in trying to get me to connect with the other girls...and I wasn't interested.

But this time, it started to really backfire. Whereas before I was most indifferent to the other kids, after being pushed to socialize with them, I grew to hate them. They were so immature and knew so little and were interested in the most ridiculous things (looking back, clearly normal things compared to my extremely abnormal interests).

By the end of second grade, it was perfectly clear to myself and all my classmates that I did not fit in. I was horribly bullied physically and mentally. My mom finally let me drop out of Brownies, stopped forcing me to have birthday parties, stopped planning play dates, and more or less stopped trying to "fix" me.

I didn't have any friends in elementary, but I also didn't want any. I would have loved a cessation of hostilities; that did not happen, but I just spent less and less time in my classroom and more and more in the library reading and teaching myself algebra and making paper dioramas and helping reshelve books.

BUT, shortly after getting to middle school I started commuting to the high school for most of my classes, and I did make a friend. We still socialized very little compared to most of our peers - we never spent time together outside of school or even talked on the phone - but we ate lunch together every day and played cards during shared classes (our school sucked; about half the teachers did nothing and just let students sleep or watch movies or play cards every day).

I still have very, very few friends...mostly just varying levels of acquaintances. And I think my mom has just about accepted that I am okay this way. 😏

[Not_a_Number]

2 minutes ago, wendyroo said:

This is exactly what my mom, an extravert through and through, spent most of my childhood asking herself (we have had many discussions about it).

I was very much like my kids minus the mental health challenges. I was academically very advanced, I had a hard time "getting" other kids my age, I was very skilled at interacting with adults, but had little interest in playing with other kids.

My mom enrolled me in a co-op preschool, was very involved and invested, set up playdates for me with classmates...and I wasn't interested. In kindergarten she set up more playdates, forced me to attend classmates birthday parties, carted six of us to Chuck-E-Cheese for my birthday...and I wasn't interested.

I changed schools before first grade, and testing indicated I had the maturity and academics to be accelerated two grades. The administration wanted to put me straight into second grade, but my mom felt that would hinder my social development and insisted I get put into first with my age mates. She forced me into Brownies (Girl Scouts), became a troop leader, and went all in trying to get me to connect with the other girls...and I wasn't interested.

But this time, it started to really backfire. Whereas before I was most indifferent to the other kids, after being pushed to socialize with them, I grew to hate them. They were so immature and knew so little and were interested in the most ridiculous things (looking back, clearly normal things compared to my extremely abnormal interests).

By the end of second grade, it was perfectly clear to myself and all my classmates that I did not fit in. I was horribly bullied physically and mentally. My mom finally let me drop out of Brownies, stopped forcing me to have birthday parties, stopped planning play dates, and more or less stopped trying to "fix" me.

I didn't have any friends in elementary, but I also didn't want any. I would have loved a cessation of hostilities; that did not happen, but I just spent less and less time in my classroom and more and more in the library reading and teaching myself algebra and making paper dioramas and helping reshelve books.

BUT, shortly after getting to middle school I started commuting to the high school for most of my classes, and I did make a friend. We still socialized very little compared to most of our peers - we never spent time together outside of school or even talked on the phone - but we ate lunch together every day and played cards during shared classes (our school sucked; about half the teachers did nothing and just let students sleep or watch movies or play cards every day).

I still have very, very few friends...mostly just varying levels of acquaintances. And I think my mom has just about accepted that I am okay this way. 😏

I think if my kids were simply uninterested in any socializing, it'd be a different sort of question! I'm not one to push stuff onto my kids that they have no interest in 😉 . It's more like we've done a few different experiments, and they've had different outcomes (none of them all that bad), and I'm musing 🙂 .