Frances Posted August 7, 2021 Share Posted August 7, 2021 5 hours ago, pinball said: What do the signs SAY? And how many houses in your town HAVE anti-vaccine signs on their lawn? I haven’t seen any on lawns here (although I wouldn’t expect them in my neighborhood) and I don’t regularly go to other neighborhoods. But we have a very large Farmer’s Market here every Saturday and every week the anti vax people have a tent set up across from it with signs and fliers and they post people at each intersection with signs. I don’t remember exact slogans but words like poison, experimental, evil, death, guinea pig, devil, etc. are used. Some of the signs have the skull and cross bones, others have rats with poison bottles and needles. The group trends elderly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spryte Posted August 7, 2021 Share Posted August 7, 2021 57 minutes ago, Jean in Newcastle said: Example signs (most are not from my area but I've seen pictures): "Sacrifice the Weak I will not take the mark of the beast (vaccine chip) - words in parentheses were on the sign Give me liberty or Give me Covid 19 That face mask you were duped into wearing symbolizes you losing your freedom of speech Freedom over fear Vaccination is Genocide." I could go on but it makes me sick to my stomach. It is sickening. The “Sacrifice the Weak” sign is chilling. It literally makes me feel ill. I’ve seen it here (mid-Atlantic, in a mostly anti-vax/anti-mask county of an otherwise fairly high rate vaccination state). It was at an anti-mask rally. That particular sign always brings back painful memories of trying to send DS to school in a district where parents literally stood with similar signs and screamed that their kids must be allowed peanut butter in the classroom, and that my kid shouldn’t even have the option of a peanut free *table* … because “rights.” It feels like the same people, different time period. I don’t know where these people were raised but the lack of compassion and caring is deeply troubling. 2 16 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pinball Posted August 7, 2021 Share Posted August 7, 2021 Just now, Frances said: I haven’t seen any on lawns here (although I wouldn’t expect them in my neighborhood) and I don’t regularly go to other neighborhoods. But we have a very large Farmer’s Market here every Saturday and every week the anti vax people have a tent set up across from it with signs and fliers and they post people at each intersection with signs. I don’t remember exact slogans but words like poison, experimental, evil, death, guinea pig, devil, etc. are used. Some of the signs have the skull and cross bones, others have rats with poison bottles and needles. The group trends elderly. I think it takes a certain personality to put a *sign on your own lawn* that is quite different than protest signs at a protest when you have other people surrounding you. Lawn signs and bumper stickers are targets, so to speak. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regentrude Posted August 7, 2021 Share Posted August 7, 2021 2 minutes ago, Ordinary Shoes said: I hear so many people say things like, "if God wants to take you, he will" and I want to scream. Yep, here too. And the same people live with enough fear to feel the need to carry firearms. The irony. 12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frances Posted August 7, 2021 Share Posted August 7, 2021 5 hours ago, TravelingChris said: Well Scarlett, I considered my father in law who never even finished high school to be educated-- he was quite intelligent and a self taught learner. I am very conscious that brick and mortar education matters less than the willingness and eagerness to learn. Same with my dad who had a few technical college classes. Although he struggled with writing and spelling in school (likely due to an undiagnosed learning disability based on the diagnoses of some of his grandchildren), he was extremely well read and always eager to learn more. He was incredibly skilled in multiple trades and in retirement was an adjunct technical technical college instructor and hired by several companies to do on-site training. Because he wanted to be a lector in church but wasn’t comfortable speaking in front of a group, he joined Toastmasters. He was later elected to the School Board and in his second term, elected president of it. He was someone who could talk with and get along with anyone from any walk of life. Pallbearers at his funeral ranged from the president of the local bank and a retired school superintendent to a barge captain, a farmer, and a welder. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbutton Posted August 7, 2021 Share Posted August 7, 2021 7 minutes ago, Ordinary Shoes said: What I worry about is that this is an indication that these kinds of people will become more resistant to mainstream medicine in the future. I had started hearing people talk about alternative cancer treatments at our old crazy church before COVID and most of them were already anti-vaxxers. I think some will and some won't. They seem to have roped Covid off as a special exhibit in their minds. A few do this with the flu shot as well. They think that any shot that doesn't confer 100% guarantee against illness is dumb, and natural immunity is better (while not realizing that even with something like the measles shot, their odds aren't 100%). I think it's uncommon for people to really understand how vaccines work even if they are pro-vaccine. I know some of what I know because of a DH in healthcare, and even then, I have picked up more because of discussions on the boards. The only conception most people have is that getting a vaccine is supposed to always be in place of getting the disease. That's it. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frances Posted August 7, 2021 Share Posted August 7, 2021 11 minutes ago, pinball said: I think it takes a certain personality to put a *sign on your own lawn* that is quite different than protest signs at a protest when you have other people surrounding you. Lawn signs and bumper stickers are targets, so to speak. For all I know, they have signs on their lawns and cars. I live in a fairly large city with lots of small towns nearby, and as I said, I don’t regularly go to other neighborhoods. It does seem like quite a commitment to show up week after week for more than half the year. Putting up a lawn sign certainly seems a lot easier. For what it’s worth, I don’t get the impression these people would be worried about having signs on their lawns or cars. Guns are pretty common here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frances Posted August 7, 2021 Share Posted August 7, 2021 53 minutes ago, popmom said: Wow. I had no idea. I live in a state with one of the lowest vaccine uptake. I’m surprised I haven’t seen such things here. Maybe they don’t feel the need because they are in the majority? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKL Posted August 7, 2021 Share Posted August 7, 2021 Interesting ... once again it seems that living in a swing state is a buffer against the extremes on either side. I have not seen any signs that get political or nasty about Covid here. I'm so glad. I don't want people to decide based on anything other than objective facts applied to their own personal health history. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frances Posted August 7, 2021 Share Posted August 7, 2021 2 minutes ago, SKL said: Interesting ... once again it seems that living in a swing state is a buffer against the extremes on either side. I have not seen any signs that get political or nasty about Covid here. I'm so glad. I don't want people to decide based on anything other than objective facts applied to their own personal health history. Michigan, where Faith Manor lives, is generally considered a swing state. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lewelma Posted August 7, 2021 Share Posted August 7, 2021 Is the anti covid vaccine attitude impacting the percentage of infants getting their childhood vaccinations? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktgrok Posted August 7, 2021 Share Posted August 7, 2021 17 minutes ago, lewelma said: Is the anti covid vaccine attitude impacting the percentage of infants getting their childhood vaccinations? Oh, I don't know. I admit one of my kids is behind on vaccines due to not wanting to go into the office during the pandemic (again, Florida, it's bad here) and knowing that they are going no where to be exposed to anything. But she's 4, already had several doses, and at least one of all the stuff I'm concerned about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katy Posted August 7, 2021 Share Posted August 7, 2021 28 minutes ago, ktgrok said: Oh, I don't know. I admit one of my kids is behind on vaccines due to not wanting to go into the office during the pandemic (again, Florida, it's bad here) and knowing that they are going no where to be exposed to anything. But she's 4, already had several doses, and at least one of all the stuff I'm concerned about. Our pediatrician said that with our kids not in daycare and DD2's heart she didn't want any of us in the office, "Until all of this is over." 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktgrok Posted August 7, 2021 Share Posted August 7, 2021 7 minutes ago, Katy said: Our pediatrician said that with our kids not in daycare and DD2's heart she didn't want any of us in the office, "Until all of this is over." Yeah, ours normally harrasses us to come in if we are late..not this year. My kids literally have been to the store less than a dozen times in the last 18 months, always masked. Chances of them getting measels or pertussis are pretty slim. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lewelma Posted August 7, 2021 Share Posted August 7, 2021 (edited) 54 minutes ago, ktgrok said: Oh, I don't know. I admit one of my kids is behind on vaccines due to not wanting to go into the office during the pandemic (again, Florida, it's bad here) and knowing that they are going no where to be exposed to anything. But she's 4, already had several doses, and at least one of all the stuff I'm concerned about. I was thinking more that the antivax crowd has grown by a LOT. And was curious if it would ooze off onto rejecting childhood vaccines also, which would lead to long term ramifications for spread of those diseases. Didn't know if there was data yet. Edited August 7, 2021 by lewelma 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Innisfree Posted August 7, 2021 Share Posted August 7, 2021 25 minutes ago, lewelma said: I was thinking more that the antivax crowd has grown by a LOT. And was curious if it would ooze off onto rejecting childhood vaccines also, which would lead to long term ramifications for spread of those diseases. Didn't know if there was data yet. I've been wondering about that, too. No idea if it's happening, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktgrok Posted August 8, 2021 Share Posted August 8, 2021 Someone I used to know in a moms group (and have unfriended as of tonight) posted a new "frame" on her facebook photo of "proud to be unvaccinated". I responded, including info about our overwhelmed hospital workers, EMS, etc. And someone else, another of her friends, replied to my comment saying her relative had just died because of this. She was in the ER admitted for sepsis, needed an ICU bed but none were available - all full of Covid patients. Her relative died because of unvaccinated people filling up the ICU. 29 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AbcdeDooDah Posted August 8, 2021 Share Posted August 8, 2021 4 hours ago, lewelma said: I was thinking more that the antivax crowd has grown by a LOT. And was curious if it would ooze off onto rejecting childhood vaccines also, which would lead to long term ramifications for spread of those diseases. Didn't know if there was data yet. My thought is they're still going to the doctor and living life normally so I wouldn't think it would seep into other vaxes. I could be totally wrong. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TravelingChris Posted August 8, 2021 Share Posted August 8, 2021 10 hours ago, popmom said: Wow. I had no idea. I live in a state with one of the lowest vaccine uptake. I’m surprised I haven’t seen such things here. Yes, same here in my part of the same state- I haen't seen anything like it. We had a groups of about 2 5 parents protest masking in schools here with some stupid slogans that I saw but that was on posters. Huntsville and Madison CIty both mandated school masks here. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dmmetler Posted August 8, 2021 Share Posted August 8, 2021 (edited) 13 hours ago, AbcdeDooDah said: My thought is they're still going to the doctor and living life normally so I wouldn't think it would seep into other vaxes. I could be totally wrong. Also, every single person I know IRL who has chosen not to get the COVID vaccine had their kids in in-person school/child care even if their school was virtual. COVID isn't required for school/daycare, but measles, diptheria, etc are. Edited August 8, 2021 by Dmmetler 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
popmom Posted August 8, 2021 Share Posted August 8, 2021 I thought this opinion piece might be of interest... https://www.nytimes.com/2021/08/06/opinion/covid-delta-vaccines-unvaccinated.html 3 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frances Posted August 8, 2021 Share Posted August 8, 2021 4 minutes ago, popmom said: I thought this opinion piece might be of interest... https://www.nytimes.com/2021/08/06/opinion/covid-delta-vaccines-unvaccinated.html Great editorial. This is definitely happening in my state and backs up the polls that show the unvaccinated are generally really two groups, the hesitant and the opposed. As for money, the commissioners in several rural counties here where vaccinations rates are quite low have turned down state money because they don’t see the need to increase vaccination rates and believe most in their counties are opposed, not lacking access or hesitant. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
historically accurate Posted August 8, 2021 Share Posted August 8, 2021 (edited) 37 minutes ago, popmom said: I thought this opinion piece might be of interest... https://www.nytimes.com/2021/08/06/opinion/covid-delta-vaccines-unvaccinated.html In my area, I've run into the vaccination van at least weekly. In the last 6 or so weeks, it's been in my neighborhood, at the park during free kids' meal pickup, the schools at drop off time for summer school, the library, the Spanish-language grocery store, and the health department. Those are just the places I've run into it - I assume it has been other places as well. I believe there will be a vaccination tent at the county fair this coming week. I thought this kind of thing was happening everywhere - apparently not, according to the article. ETA: I was curious after posting where they will be, so I looked it up. Over the next few weeks, they will be at: the county fair (2 days out of the 5 day fair) a local park the county food bank (twice in August) the YMCA the Salvation Army store 2 different grocery stores the Lions' Club (twice) a rural neighborhood that has a clubhouse and they have a non-mobile clinic at the health department one day a week 7 am-7pm. Most of these they are there for 6-8 hours, although the local park is only a 3 hour window. Edited August 8, 2021 by historically accurate 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktgrok Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 This is genius!!! Farmers understand the importance of vaccines, and how quickly disease can spread, more than anyone else on earth. (in a similar vein, veterinary staff seem to take Covid more seriously than pretty much anyone else, for similar reasons). And farmers are trusted more than "government" - hopefully this works! https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2021/08/07/1025412688/as-trusted-voices-farmers-could-be-key-to-boosting-rural-vaccination-rates When he first became eligible for the coronavirus vaccine in Illinois, Tom Arnold, 68, says he didn't need any convincing. He raises cattle, hogs and chickens in Elizabeth, a small rural town in the northwest corner of the state. After all, who better to understand why herd immunity matters than a herdsman? "Being a livestock producer, I'm well aware of vaccinations and vaccines," he says. "That's how we develop immunity in our animals. We're always vaccinating the breeding stock to pass on immunity to the little ones." 13 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktgrok Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 Just now, Ordinary Shoes said: Hopefully but I know some anti-vaxxers who have their pets vaccinated but not their children. Go figure. Ugh. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MEmama Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 7 hours ago, Ordinary Shoes said: Hopefully but I know some anti-vaxxers who have their pets vaccinated but not their children. Go figure. Or farm animals but not people…(other than himself, natch) https://www.cbsnews.com/news/tennessee-incentivizes-giving-cows-vaccines-but-giving-humans-covid-shots-not-so-much/ 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy2BaMom Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 On 8/7/2021 at 9:14 PM, ktgrok said: Someone I used to know in a moms group (and have unfriended as of tonight) posted a new "frame" on her facebook photo of "proud to be unvaccinated". I responded, including info about our overwhelmed hospital workers, EMS, etc. And someone else, another of her friends, replied to my comment saying her relative had just died because of this. She was in the ER admitted for sepsis, needed an ICU bed but none were available - all full of Covid patients. Her relative died because of unvaccinated people filling up the ICU. And someone I know has a child who is so ill with Covid that this child needs a f*cking ECMO machine and the closest STAFFED available machine the doctor could find was 500 miles away due to all closer staff being already consumed with other Covid patients. All these "but MY chances are less than 1/3/5/whatever %" people don't take into account that even 1% is hundreds of thousands of OTHER people suffering and dying. 5 18 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dmmetler Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 2 hours ago, MEmama said: Or farm animals but not people…(other than himself, natch) https://www.cbsnews.com/news/tennessee-incentivizes-giving-cows-vaccines-but-giving-humans-covid-shots-not-so-much/ Lee has been awful. His entire pandemic response has been to toss up his hands, not mandate anything, and let people do what they want (except for ordering schools to go back in person in April). The big cities have their own health departments and have basically been independent (Memphis had a car giveaway for those who were vsccinated before June 1, for example, and most of the independent health departments did mask mandates last year, and some of the larger school districts or cities have put in school mask mandates for this fall). The Memphis health department and Memphis area hospitals have also taken up the child/teen vaccination publicity since the state now doesn't do it. (Not just for COVID, but for the ones required for school). So, the idea than TN would incentivize vaccinating cattle, while ignoring humans doesn't surprise me. 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbutton Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 I saw this gem on Facebook today: Quote Guys I’m fed up about these vax mandates. Welcome to the beast system. You better keep your spiritual eyes wide open. If I had to give an explanation of why I can’t take the vax as a Christian this is what I wound write. Feel free to use and tweak. But no mistake we are fighting a spiritual fight here. As a Christian I believe that I am made in the image and likeness of God, Genesis 1:27. My body is not my own, but rather a temple for God’s Holy Spirit to dwell in. 1 Corinthians 6:19-20. To receive the Covid vaccination will defile my body, and will cause God’s Holy Spirit to depart from me, Jeremiah 7:1-15, Jeremiah 7:21-31, 2 Chronicles 7:19-21, Ezekiel 10:1-22, Haggai 2:6-9. This is unconscionable and unreasonable for me to lose my eternal salvation because of the hope of a vaccination. God alone can protect me, Psalm 62:5-8. It was a repost, so I have no idea if the author is normally anti-vax or not. The person who reposted it...maybe? I wouldn't have thought so, but who knows these days. 9 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktgrok Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 1 hour ago, Happy2BaMom said: And someone I know has a child who is so ill with Covid that this child needs a f*cking ECMO machine and the closest STAFFED available machine the doctor could find was 500 miles away due to all closer staff being already consumed with other Covid patients. All these "but MY chances are less than 1/3/5/whatever %" people don't take into account that even 1% is hundreds of thousands of OTHER people suffering and dying. I'm so so sorry. And yes, people don't seem to understand how many people even a small percentage is. 7 minutes ago, kbutton said: I saw this gem on Facebook today: It was a repost, so I have no idea if the author is normally anti-vax or not. The person who reposted it...maybe? I wouldn't have thought so, but who knows these days. Um, I'd ask which part of the Bible says vaccines are unholy or defile the body? Is there a spectrum or is it all or nothing? Do they defile you more than a diet coke but less than heroin? What about a blooming onion...that seems pretty sinful. Or is it only medical stuff? If so there a list, like with Kosher food? Like, will taking an ibuprofen send me to hell? What about using a bandaid? 6 1 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danae Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 (edited) 39 minutes ago, ktgrok said: I'm so so sorry. And yes, people don't seem to understand how many people even a small percentage is. Um, I'd ask which part of the Bible says vaccines are unholy or defile the body? Is there a spectrum or is it all or nothing? Do they defile you more than a diet coke but less than heroin? What about a blooming onion...that seems pretty sinful. Or is it only medical stuff? If so there a list, like with Kosher food? Like, will taking an ibuprofen send me to hell? What about using a bandaid? Or you could go with “But what comes out of the mouth proceeds from the heart, and this is what defiles.19For out of the heart come evil intentions, murder, adultery, fornication, theft, false witness, slander.” (Matthew 15:18-19) Particularly the false witness against and slander about people who have dedicated their lives to healing people from disease. Edited August 9, 2021 by Danae 6 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 18 hours ago, popmom said: I thought this opinion piece might be of interest... https://www.nytimes.com/2021/08/06/opinion/covid-delta-vaccines-unvaccinated.html This is a great article. Very informative. Thank you. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 35 minutes ago, ktgrok said: I'm so so sorry. And yes, people don't seem to understand how many people even a small percentage is. Um, I'd ask which part of the Bible says vaccines are unholy or defile the body? Is there a spectrum or is it all or nothing? Do they defile you more than a diet coke but less than heroin? What about a blooming onion...that seems pretty sinful. Or is it only medical stuff? If so there a list, like with Kosher food? Like, will taking an ibuprofen send me to hell? What about using a bandaid? ROFLOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktgrok Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 2 minutes ago, Scarlett said: ROFLOL That thing is suspiciously tasty while being absolutely terrible for you. something attractive but deadly seems of the devil to me, lol. Much more than a jab with a needle that saves your life. But what do I know, lol. 3 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katy Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 44 minutes ago, ktgrok said: I'm so so sorry. And yes, people don't seem to understand how many people even a small percentage is. Um, I'd ask which part of the Bible says vaccines are unholy or defile the body? Is there a spectrum or is it all or nothing? Do they defile you more than a diet coke but less than heroin? What about a blooming onion...that seems pretty sinful. Or is it only medical stuff? If so there a list, like with Kosher food? Like, will taking an ibuprofen send me to hell? What about using a bandaid? Oh Katie I really needed this today. Thanks for the laughs! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MEmama Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 1 hour ago, Ordinary Shoes said: After I wrote the post you responded to I realized that there are more rules about vaccinations to take your dog to doggie daycare than to enroll a kid in public school. isn't that crazy??? No religious exemption at doggie daycare. My state doesn’t have religious exemptions for vaccines. 🙂 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbutton Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 1 hour ago, ktgrok said: I'm so so sorry. And yes, people don't seem to understand how many people even a small percentage is. Um, I'd ask which part of the Bible says vaccines are unholy or defile the body? Is there a spectrum or is it all or nothing? It’s about “coercion” and their sense that this is the mark of the beast. It’s not about health or not. 1 hour ago, Danae said: Or you could go with “But what comes out of the mouth proceeds from the heart, and this is what defiles.19For out of the heart come evil intentions, murder, adultery, fornication, theft, false witness, slander.” (Matthew 15:18-19) Particularly the false witness against and slander about people who have dedicated their lives to healing people from disease. Yes! My DH in healthcare can somewhat laugh about the more ludicrous stuff that is religiously based because it’s just so out there (and we are Christians). It’s really hard for him to see the lies about the medical side when he has really sick patients present who are shocked they’re sick because they listened to bad information. The religious crazy is sad too, but maybe it hits less close to home when so few of our friends believe this but so many believe the lies about the science. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktgrok Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 6 minutes ago, kbutton said: It’s about “coercion” and their sense that this is the mark of the beast. It’s not about health or not. But what on earth do they base the idea that a vaccine is the mark of the beast on? It's as logical as saying blooming onions will send you to hell. Actually it's way less logical, lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbutton Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 2 minutes ago, ktgrok said: But what on earth do they base the idea that a vaccine is the mark of the beast on? It's as logical as saying blooming onions will send you to hell. Actually it's way less logical, lol. Vaccine passports. They feel as though it will be required for buying and selling, which is a characteristic of the mark. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktgrok Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 Just now, kbutton said: Vaccine passports. They feel as though it will be required for buying and selling, which is a characteristic of the mark. So the mark of the beast is figurative, not literal, but a 7 day creation is literal? I'm really tempted to tell anyone that says a passport or vaccine is the mark of the beast that I'm way to serious about taking the bible literally to think such a thing -and I thought they were a bible believing Christian! The horror! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbutton Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 9 minutes ago, ktgrok said: So the mark of the beast is figurative, not literal, but a 7 day creation is literal? I'm really tempted to tell anyone that says a passport or vaccine is the mark of the beast that I'm way to serious about taking the bible literally to think such a thing -and I thought they were a bible believing Christian! The horror! There is no consistency whatsoever! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danae Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 42 minutes ago, kbutton said: There is no consistency whatsoever! There is a great deal of consistency, it’s just not where you’re looking for it. For certain groups calling themselves Christian the whole point of religion is to maintain the hierarchical order of society. All scripture is interpreted through that lens. A government that doesn’t serve to maintain the hierarchy with white Christian men at the top is anti-(their form of) Christian and therefore akin to Babylon/Rome in Revelation. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbutton Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 6 minutes ago, Danae said: There is a great deal of consistency, it’s just not where you’re looking for it. For certain groups calling themselves Christian the whole point of religion is to maintain the hierarchical order of society. All scripture is interpreted through that lens. A government that doesn’t serve to maintain the hierarchy with white Christian men at the top is anti-(their form of) Christian and therefore akin to Babylon/Rome in Revelation. Good point. I think I know lots of people in this camp who don’t know they are in this camp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKL Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 3 hours ago, kbutton said: Vaccine passports. They feel as though it will be required for buying and selling, which is a characteristic of the mark. I have Jewish friends who compare it to the proof people had to carry/wear during the holocaust that they were or weren't Jewish. This is in addition to some friends from communist countries who are equally scared of government coercion. The more people keep pushing for mandates, the longer it will take for people like this to stop reacting in fear and start getting informed. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matryoshka Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 (edited) 8 minutes ago, SKL said: I have Jewish friends who compare it to the proof people had to carry/wear during the holocaust that they were or weren't Jewish. This is in addition to some friends from communist countries who are equally scared of government coercion. The more people keep pushing for mandates, the longer it will take for people like this to stop reacting in fear and start getting informed. Yeah, that's working really well in all the states where they're actively against mandates and have actually passed laws against them, so no one has to worry about mandates them anymore. Everyone's getting informed. Yep. That's exactly what is happening. The other states should follow their example. Edited August 9, 2021 by Matryoshka 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktgrok Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 17 minutes ago, SKL said: I have Jewish friends who compare it to the proof people had to carry/wear during the holocaust that they were or weren't Jewish. This is in addition to some friends from communist countries who are equally scared of government coercion. The more people keep pushing for mandates, the longer it will take for people like this to stop reacting in fear and start getting informed. Oddly, the same people against vaccine passports - who are sure that being forced to carry papers is evil and one step away from facism/communism/pick your ism, are often the same people who are totally in favor of a universal ID requirement for citizens. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KSera Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 (edited) 32 minutes ago, Ordinary Shoes said: I'm not saying they don't exist but I've yet to know of any Jewish people who compare vaccine passports to the Star of David. Everyone I've know who has made that comparison has been non-Jewish. All of the high-profile examples were non-Jews, e.g. the Oklahoma Republican Party. Of course, never say never. I’ve seen just one, but it’s widely seen as an anti Semitic comparison. To compare proof of whether youve had a life-saving vaccine during a pandemic to being rounded up and sent to gas chambers is really, really gross. And that’s an understatement. Edited August 9, 2021 by KSera 6 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stacia Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 1 minute ago, KSera said: I’ve seen just one, but it’s widely seen as an anti Semitic comparison. To compare proof of whether youve had a life-saving vaccine during a pandemic to being rounded up and sent to gas chambers is really, really gross. And that’s an understatement. 100% Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KSera Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 20 minutes ago, KSera said: I’ve seen just one, but it’s widely seen as an anti Semitic comparison. To compare proof of whether youve had a life-saving vaccine during a pandemic to being rounded up and sent to gas chambers is really, really gross. And that’s an understatement. Germany has called for banning the use of the yellow star in this way (they have very different laws than we do surrounding anything anti-semitic, for obvious reasons): https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-57020697 And there has been all manner of use by it in the US which has drawn a lot of criticism for the trivializing of the death and imprisonment faced by Jewish people during the Holocaust. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-57297902 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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