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At what point would you lock down again?


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While I WISH that all HCWs would willingly get vaccinated, I will not mourn the loss from the profession of those who quit because they don't understand the necessity.  I don't trust people like that to be able to provide good healthcare for the community.  Unfortunately this puts more strain on the communities and hospitals with staffing shortages and more strain on those responsible healthcare workers who are still working diligently.  Healthcare requires people who are altruistic and understand that it's important to protect the health of the community. 

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10 minutes ago, Laura Corin said:

My endgame is to do with better understanding/ treatment of Long Covid, as well as an NHS that can offer a more normal service. Until that point I'll be cautious. Still working out how cautious. I'm considering my first haircut in 18 months, now that I have a better mask. All indoor public contact in Scotland is still masked.

I just got my first haircut in 18 months in July! It's pretty freeing 😄 . 

And yes, agreed about long COVID. 

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45 minutes ago, Sdel said:

No, you miss the point….threatening someone’s livelihood is not giving them a  “choice” and it goes against the concepts of freedom and liberty. 

Every unmasked, unvaxed person who goes into a grocery store, school, office, hospital, etc. etc. poses a threat to the life, liberty, freedom, and livelihood of the people around them. So why shouldn't those people also get to choose not to be around unvaxed/unmasked folks? Either the people who don't want to vax/mask get to choose whether to comply or find another job, or the people who want to be protected by having those around them be vaxed/masked have to choose between working in an unprotected environment or finding another job. Someone has to choose, and it should be the people whose personal choices put others at risk.

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Idk what my endgame will be.

I am incredibly grateful we are all vaxxed and we will get our boosters as soon as we are eligible. We’ve never stopped masking, not eating out etc, and those won’t change for the long haul. Those are changes I can live with permanently if necessary without affecting my quality of life.

I am also grateful that DS is out of the public school and will be in university overseas. Ireland has a 90% (and rising) vaccination rate so even though the college years aren’t necessarily filled with the best decision making, I am so much more comfortable that he will be there instead of n the US. 
 

I don’t want to get Covid, that’s what it comes down to. I don’t want to risk long covid, I don’t want to strain the system short or long term, I don’t want lifelong health complications. I just don’t. So for no matter how long it takes I’m going to do what I have to in order to avoid it, in so far as I can.
 

I'm working on making peace with the fact that on occasion my boundaries will need to be flexible and may evolve. I think it’s a healthy approach to our current reality. 

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49 minutes ago, Sdel said:

He does, and TB testing is not a “treatment”.  No chicken pox titers mandated.  None of the other vaccines were required for employment or he got when he was military (and knew he didn’t have a choice).  They aren’t even required to get a flu shot for employment.

The Covid shot is a vaccination. If it were a treatment, we could give it to people when they are dying of Covid--sadly, it sounds like some people who are dying are begging for it. 

It is something that requires informed consent, I think Jean covered what that means. 

3 minutes ago, Jean in Newcastle said:

While I WISH that all HCWs would willingly get vaccinated, I will not mourn the loss from the profession of those who quit because they don't understand the necessity.  I don't trust people like that to be able to provide good healthcare for the community.  Unfortunately this puts more strain on the communities and hospitals with staffing shortages and more strain on those responsible healthcare workers who are still working diligently.  Healthcare requires people who are altruistic and understand that it's important to protect the health of the community. 

QFT

Sometimes people have lapses in judgment, but we need to have standards. Sad to say, my DH's current employer had Covid run through the staff before people would mask outside of patient rooms. The other facility he worked at earlier in the pandemic enforced their mask rules, and they had fewer cases. 

Even medical people need to defer to experts within medical specialties. Infectious disease is a specialty, one which my DH very much respects, thankfully. 

Infectious disease doctors don't deal with pandemics only--they also set standards for things like what cleaning products and techniques the facility uses, how to prevent MRSA and other nosocomial infections, and how to interpret data on things like, "Can we get the birthing tubs clean enough between patients to allow their use in our facility?" Infectious disease protocol prevents people from just tossing up their hands and saying, "We can't control this." We should all be happy about this because we are all healthier for it when practitioners, nurses, and facilities use best practices to control disease.

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7 minutes ago, Corraleno said:

Every unmasked, unvaxed person who goes into a grocery store, school, office, hospital, etc. etc. poses a threat to the life, liberty, freedom, and livelihood of the people around them. So why shouldn't those people also get to choose not to be around unvaxed/unmasked folks? Either the people who don't want to vax/mask get to choose whether to comply or find another job, or the people who want to be protected by having those around them be vaxed/masked have to choose between working in an unprotected environment or finding another job. Someone has to choose, and it should be the people whose personal choices put others at risk.

I don't understand how it's not obvious to people that if "you do you, and I'll do me" doesn't work for driving on the wrong side of the road, it will work for sharing germs.

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13 minutes ago, Not_a_Number said:

I just got my first haircut in 18 months in July! It's pretty freeing 😄 . 

And yes, agreed about long COVID. 

I got one in April, but my haircutter lives 2 doors down from me and has a room in her basement all set up for it.  I still had her do it outside -- LOL.  I won't be getting another one for awhile.

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46 minutes ago, ktgrok said:

To those vaccinated, likely. But with so many NOT vaccinated, no. Cause I don't remember my local EMS saying they were overhwelmed by flu in previous years, nor flu wards set up in parking lots and tents. 

Exactly.

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10 minutes ago, kbutton said:



Infectious disease doctors don't deal with pandemics only--they also set standards for things like what cleaning products and techniques the facility uses, how to prevent MRSA and other nosocomial infections, and how to interpret data on things like, "Can we get the birthing tubs clean enough between patients to allow their use in our facility?" Infectious disease protocol prevents people from just tossing up their hands and saying, "We can't control this." We should all be happy about this because we are all healthier for it when practitioners, nurses, and facilities use best practices to control disease.

Yes, but it took time for the medical community to realize this. I read a book, a long time ago.  It was the guy who figured out hand washing would save lives for childbirth.  People are just resistant to change. 

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2015/01/12/375663920/the-doctor-who-championed-hand-washing-and-saved-women-s-lives

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54 minutes ago, SKL said:

I was wondering - with the vast majority of at-high-risk people vaccinated and otherwise protected, can we now say Covid is like the flu, or maybe even less dangerous than the flu, overall?

I don't recall the flu overwhelming hospitals to the extent Covid does. I never heard that people in our ER had to lay on the floor for hours. I don't recall any state ordering refrigerated morgue trucks for the flu or  hospitals converting their parking garages into emergency wards.
So, nope. 

Edited by regentrude
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20 minutes ago, Corraleno said:

Every unmasked, unvaxed person who goes into a grocery store, school, office, hospital, etc. etc. poses a threat to the life, liberty, freedom, and livelihood of the people around them. So why shouldn't those people also get to choose not to be around unvaxed/unmasked folks? Either the people who don't want to vax/mask get to choose whether to comply or find another job, or the people who want to be protected by having those around them be vaxed/masked have to choose between working in an unprotected environment or finding another job. Someone has to choose, and it should be the people whose personal choices put others at risk.

I wish people would stop putting unmasked and unvaxxed in the same sentence. There are unvaxxed people who do wear masks. As I’m sure those HCW do that are considering quitting. 

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50 minutes ago, SKL said:

I was wondering - with the vast majority of at-high-risk people vaccinated and otherwise protected, can we now say Covid is like the flu, or maybe even less dangerous than the flu, overall?

Right now there are 2930 people in my state who are hospitalized for Covid. Of those 728 are adult patients who are in ICUs, and 14 percent of those are on ventilators. So . . no. I think at this time we may NOT treat it as the flu, let alone like "even less dangerous than the flu." That is beyond ludicrous given the current stats from almost every state.

As far as end goals . . I don't know for sure what ours are. I can say that a few weeks ago when case numbers and test positivity rates were much lower, and when hospitals weren't anywhere close to being overwhelmed we were pretty darn comfortable with resuming life as normal. Not so anymore.

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20 minutes ago, whitestavern said:

I wish people would stop putting unmasked and unvaxxed in the same sentence. There are unvaxxed people who do wear masks. As I’m sure those HCW do that are considering quitting. 

Well...not really around here. HCW who are against the Covid vax are usually anti-mask as well. I know one of them who was bragging on FB that she went to the store "vaxed" as soon as we were told that vaccinated people no longer had to mask. I thought she was an honest person until I saw this. 

While she likely masks at work (and is likely required to), she's still far more dangerous masked and unvaxed at work because she is unmasked and unvaxed in the community than someone who is vaccinated is (even if the vaccinated person is unmasked, since the vaccine still prevents a great deal of infection).

I doubt she's the only one around here. 

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23 minutes ago, whitestavern said:

I wish people would stop putting unmasked and unvaxxed in the same sentence. There are unvaxxed people who do wear masks. As I’m sure those HCW do that are considering quitting. 

Yes, there are unvaxxed people who wear masks.  But they aren't as safe to be around as vaxxed people wearing masks.  And you cannot be sure that those HCWs who are considering quitting do mask.  Many do not. 

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23 minutes ago, whitestavern said:

I wish people would stop putting unmasked and unvaxxed in the same sentence. There are unvaxxed people who do wear masks. As I’m sure those HCW do that are considering quitting. 

I think in this case, it just means "either unmasked or unvaxxed." At this point, given the numbers, I'd really prefer everyone to do the maximum, not the minimum, especially in healthcare settings. 

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1 minute ago, Pawz4me said:

Right now there are 2930 people in my state who are hospitalized for Covid. Of those 728 are adult patients who are in ICUs, and 14 percent of those are on ventilators. So . . no. I think at this time we may NOT treat it as the flu, let alone like "even less dangerous than the flu." That is beyond ludicrous given the current stats from almost every state.

As far as end goals . . I don't know for sure what ours are. I can say that a few weeks ago when case numbers and test positivity rates were much lower, and when hospitals weren't anywhere close to being overwhelmed we were pretty darn comfortable with resuming life as normal. Not so anymore.

We weren't going to do "normal", but we were going to do modified normal. Not going to resume our DSO concerts at Max Fisher Hall, but yes to indoor dining at not peak times. Continuing to cultivate outdoor activities, but limiting longer get togethers to people we know are vaxed or have recently had covid and may have some immunity. 

I am still going to do my solo camping trip in October, and attend the outdoor activities at ds's college on parent's weekend. Seniors up for honors in their department will be featured and he is one. So masked and outside, I have decided not to miss it. We will pack food, mask for rest areas, and thus be able to have the holidays with our grandsons in Alabama. But, I have given up my piano gig job, this weekend is my last. We will not return to 4H, and just pulled the plug on mentoring the school district's rocket team because they are not going to let us require masks of the team members, and only one of the kids has said they are vaccinated. We are going to continue with the university team because we meet with ten students and one professor inside a huge laboratory with new ventilation and hepa filters, masks are required inside on this campus, and a high percentage of students and faculty are vaccinated. The students on the team all volunteered that they are vaxed. We only have to meet once per month for Sept and Oct, twice in Nov, once in Dec and Jan, twice in Feb, and if they have a successful test launch and travel to Huntsville or a regional launch site, we drive separate and stay separate. If they go to Huntsville, we won't even be in the hotel because we have the house a half hour south. But if things don't get better, the college may end participation in the competition this fall anyway. So it could still go away.

But really, it is just dh and I, and our kids, the two grandmothers, and our grandsons pretty much for a long time.

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1 hour ago, SKL said:

I was wondering - with the vast majority of at-high-risk people vaccinated and otherwise protected, can we now say Covid is like the flu, or maybe even less dangerous than the flu, overall?

I think this is a reasonable question for the long-term, but in the short term, no. We still have healthcare systems falling apart over this. That's not like any flu except pandemic-strain flu. 

In the long-term, I hope and expect that it will be like the flu in seasonality, death rate, transmission rate, ability to vax for it, and responsiveness to some kind of anti-viral treatment. I hope. I hope that it will become something that the vast majority of people can contract without major fear (that said, I hope I never have the flu either!). 

Given that long Covid is as big of a problem as it is, we don't know if that will stay at the same prevalence or get better. We don't even really know what long Covid is. It could end up causing a lot of secondary issues later on in the way that strep infections can cause heart damage--we might find out that we really want a zero tolerance for Covid like we have a zero tolerance for strep (doctors don't use watch and wait for strep, for instance--they give antibiotics every time). Right now, long Covid seems to cause some kind of dysautonomia for lots of people. That's already an area of "unicorn/zebra" diagnosis, and the organizations and doctors who study it are maxed out. 

It's going to be a bumpy ride to an endemic normal (even after the rollercoaster hills), and while I am not into catastrophizing, we might not like the ride and might not like the outcome that much. It might be something we're working on effective treatments for for a very long time. 

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1 hour ago, SKL said:

I was wondering - with the vast majority of at-high-risk people vaccinated and otherwise protected, can we now say Covid is like the flu, or maybe even less dangerous than the flu, overall?

Given that COVID's still killing people directly, and given we've now learned that 11.5% of people who get COVID at any level of severity get severe sequelae within 6 months of COVID (excluding Long COVID, which is also potentially disabling)... ...no, we have to treat it as more severe than flu.

We already have a situation where it's disabled enough people to generate staff shortages, as it stands.

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re COVID lurching slowly toward flu-like status

1 hour ago, SKL said:

I was wondering - with the vast majority of at-high-risk people vaccinated and otherwise protected, can we now say Covid is like the flu, or maybe even less dangerous than the flu, overall?

If COVID plays out like 1919 influenza did... it may eventually burn down to something like regular flu, as it runs out of hosts around the world.  But current hospital overwhelm where it is at the moment, it obviously hasn't yet gotten to that point.

33 minutes ago, regentrude said:

I don't recall the flu overwhelming hospitals to the extent Covid does. I never heard that people in our ER had to lay on the floor for hours. I don't recall any state ordering refrigerated morgue trucks for the flu or  hospitals converting their parking garages into emergency wards.
So, nope. 

 

27 minutes ago, Pawz4me said:

Right now there are 2930 people in my state who are hospitalized for Covid. Of those 728 are adult patients who are in ICUs, and 14 percent of those are on ventilators. So . . no. I think at this time we may NOT treat it as the flu, let alone like "even less dangerous than the flu." That is beyond ludicrous given the current stats from almost every state.

As far as end goals . . I don't know for sure what ours are. I can say that a few weeks ago when case numbers and test positivity rates were much lower, and when hospitals weren't anywhere close to being overwhelmed we were pretty darn comfortable with resuming life as normal. Not so anymore.

And so long as it's finding hosts, it'll keep on mutating into new variants, some of which will evade both "natural" immunity from prior infection with prior variants, and also vaccination developed around prior variants.  All over the world, until it runs out of hosts all over the world.

It's a race against the emergence of new variants.  And at the moment we are still losing the race.

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2 hours ago, mommyoffive said:

If you are locking down, what is your end game?  Do you have younger kids and just want to get them vaccinated and then will stop locking down?  Waiting for this surge to be over?  Do you think you are going to be avoiding Delta?  

 

Well, I'm not really locking down, and we've never been ABLE to lock down anyway because of my husband's job...but the extent to which we're still taking as many precautions as we can is, yes, about my unvaccinated kid and also about Delta and the stuff that goes with it (overwhelmed hospitals, test shortages, etc.) I do think this goes on for years from here, and I envision the future, at least in the short term, as looking like vaccines and boosters plus masks inside during surges. And that looks fairly okay to me once my youngest is vaccinated. 

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1 minute ago, ieta_cassiopeia said:

Given that COVID's still killing people directly, and given we've now learned that 11.5% of people who get COVID at any level of severity get severe sequelae within 6 months of COVID (excluding Long COVID, which is also potentially disabling)... ...no, we have to treat it as more severe than flu.

We already have a situation where it's disabled enough people to generate staff shortages, as it stands.

I don't think I'd heard that stat yet. Ouch.

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1 hour ago, SKL said:

I was wondering - with the vast majority of at-high-risk people vaccinated and otherwise protected, can we now say Covid is like the flu, or maybe even less dangerous than the flu, overall?

I just looked up the stats on flu deaths in the US in recent years; the highest number (by far) was in 2017-18 with 61,000. That comes out to 167 deaths a day over 365 days. Right now the 7 day average of covid deaths in the US is 704 (and climbing). The 7 day average never dipped below 175 even at its very lowest point in early summer. So if things had stayed like that long term, we could have said it was about the same as a very bad flu season (putting aside questions about whether covid has more frequent/severe long term complications than flu).

Edited by kokotg
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12 minutes ago, kokotg said:

I just looked up the stats on flu deaths in the US in recent years; the highest number (by far) was in 2017-18 with 61,000. That comes out to 167 deaths a day over 365 days. Right now the 7 day average of covid deaths in the US is 704 (and climbing). The 7 day average never dipped below 175 even at its very lowest point in early summer. So if things had stayed like that long term, we could have said it was about the same as a very bad flu season (putting aside questions about whether covid has more frequent/severe long term complications than flu).

Yup, when Covid deaths get to that same number per day for the nation and stay that way, THEN I will say that it's just like the flu. 

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9 minutes ago, Jean in Newcastle said:

Yup, when Covid deaths get to that same number per day for the nation and stay that way, THEN I will say that it's just like the flu. 

And even then it still won't be like the flu if it requires astronomical hospitalization rates in order to achieve that low number of deaths. We just don't need that same allocation of resources for influenza.

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1 hour ago, Jean in Newcastle said:

Yes, there are unvaxxed people who wear masks.  But they aren't as safe to be around as vaxxed people wearing masks.  And you cannot be sure that those HCWs who are considering quitting do mask.  Many do not. 

Are you saying there are nurses in hospitals not wearing masks? I honestly can’t imagine that is true. 

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https://www.thv11.com/mobile/article/news/verify/yes-a-private-care-doctor-can-refuse-treatment-if-patient-isnt-vaccinated/91-614b7d30-c72f-4456-9f5a-fe52e94bf6ee

My guess is more doctors will follow suit. 

https://www.fox5atlanta.com/news/argosy-coronavirus-vaccination-requirement-threats

Restaurants are doing so, and I am sure it will be unpopular. But for some of us who are eschewing indoor dining, something like this if numbers go down, might woo us back.

I am seeing more and more venues posting this policy in the cities, but not up here in my rural area.

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8 minutes ago, whitestavern said:

Are you saying there are nurses in hospitals not wearing masks? I honestly can’t imagine that is true. 

I'm having to look for a new dentist because two of the hygienists weren't wearing masks while working with patients on our last visit. And when I visit my grandmother's assisted living place, more of the people working there than not are either not wearing masks or wearing them incorrectly (on one visit, the woman running bingo pulled down her mask every time she called out a number). The last time I talked to my dad, he told me that the whole place was on (another) two week lockdown (residents couldn't leave their rooms) because a staff member had tested positive.

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Just now, kokotg said:

I'm having to look for a new dentist because two of the hygienists weren't wearing masks while working with patients on our last visit. And when I visit my grandmother's assisted living place, more of the people working there than not are either not wearing masks or wearing them incorrectly (on one visit, the woman running bingo pulled down her mask every time she called out a number). The last time I talked to my dad, he told me that the whole place was on (another) two week lockdown (residents couldn't leave their rooms) because a staff member had tested positive.

Wow, that’s very surprising to me. But where I live many many people are still masking. And I haven’t come across any HCW who is not. 

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I think there needs to be several prime time specials broadcast on every single channel, informing the population that yes indeed, your nose is connected to your respiratory system!

And forget AP biology for high school. I think we have to go back to rudimentary 4th grade anatomy with lots and lots of pictures and memes, maybe Samuel L Jackson narrating with F bombs in order to get the point across. High schoolers might listen to that and then go home and inform their parents. 😠

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2 minutes ago, heartlikealion said:

During 2020 my son’s chiropractor refused to mask and discouraged it. 

What is is with chiropractors??? My chiro practice never required masks in the office, neither for staff nor patients.
Another chiro was the leader of the local anti-mask protests.

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7 minutes ago, heartlikealion said:

During 2020 my son’s chiropractor refused to mask and discouraged it. But I would be very shocked to see a nurse not wearing a mask during a shift. The comment about the dental office — what?! Did they even wear a shield? Gross 

Right?! pandemic or not, you're inches from someone's filthy open mouth all day--why would you not WANT to wear a mask?! no shield. 

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18 hours ago, Faith-manor said:

Yes, he is rabidly against any precautions. He also has had a booster shot, something not available to the rest of the public yet, and though asymptomatic, has been given regeneron antibody treatment, something also rationed among the general public and very costly. Dh's brother couldn't get regeneron just a couple of months ago when he had, and he spent many, many hours in the ER. So the p.o.s. governor gets the primo, sucks to be serfs, Lord of the Land treatment while not even in danger, while others die who can't get it because no hospital beds. I would like to volunteer him for a one way trip to Mars.

Where is this? I know 2 people who had it last week in different parts of my state. 

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29 minutes ago, Faith-manor said:

https://www.fox5atlanta.com/news/argosy-coronavirus-vaccination-requirement-threats

Restaurants are doing so, and I am sure it will be unpopular. But for some of us who are eschewing indoor dining, something like this if numbers go down, might woo us back.

I am seeing more and more venues posting this policy in the cities, but not up here in my rural area.

It's happening here and there around here at music venues. Seems like someone mentioned airlines.

I still see "breakthrough" posts (after unfollowing or snoozing lots of people), whining about this. They refuse to get a Covid test or vaccinate for anything and see it as major oppression. One of the people is oh-so-oppressed; she's probably been on more vacations since Covid started than I've been on in the last 5-10 years. 

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1 hour ago, kokotg said:

Right?! pandemic or not, you're inches from someone's filthy open mouth all day--why would you not WANT to wear a mask?! no shield. 

Seriously.  All my dentists wore surgical masks *before* Covid was a thing (and I think also goggles!), because yuk. Now they're double-masked with face shields.

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We have very good mask compliance around here.  I see about 75% of people in stores masking even though there is no general mandate.  We have mandates for schools and medical facilities.  Our numbers in generally are still pretty good.  

I went for a follow up with an orthopedic doctor this morning.  The nurse that brought me to the room and did some intake was wearing her mask around her chin.

A couple weeks ago, we all went to the eye doctor.  One nurse there was also not wearing her mask right, which made the kids uncomfortable but when we saw her next and were going to say something, she had it on right.  The doctor made a sarcastic comment about covid no longer being a problem once you leave a medical office.   He thought the requirement didn't make sense but wore a mask correctly the entire time.  

I figured the medical and schools were about protecting those who are likely to be most vulnerable.

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2 hours ago, whitestavern said:

Are you saying there are nurses in hospitals not wearing masks? I honestly can’t imagine that is true. 

I have seen other people on this board report going to doctors where there were no masks on the doctor or nurses.  I have seen other reports of nurses who might wear a mask in the actual patient room but then pull them down in the halls, breakroom, waiting room, etc. which negates a lot of the usefulness of the mask.

I personally haven't seen it.  But I am in a high-vax area with very good  healthcare.  My husband (HCW) was vaxxed at work, masks, and can be tested at work if there is known exposure or symptoms - and he doesn't even do direct patient care.  Even my chiropractor masks. 

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I've been thinking about end game on this.  I feel like we've been very careful.  We've been far more careful than almost anyone I know in real life, although by the standards of folks on the board, I really am not.  Other than a brief three week period in June, we've only done take out or outdoor dining.  We've worn masks when indoors with anyone, with only a couple exceptions:  1) when we visit with my in laws and eat with them a couple times a week, and 2) when my youngest child socializes with a small group of friends, all of whom are vaccinated.  Our exposure will increase dramatically next week when my kids return to in person school, and I won't lie, I am pretty anxious about that, but for academic, social, and emotional reasons, I think they very much need to go.  

I do figure we are all likely to contract covid at some point.  I trust that vaccination is likely to ameliorate the risk to a large degree, and we will get boosters when it is our turn to do so.  

Other than travel and things like theater and movies, we are mostly living life normally, just with masks.  We don't have a high risk lifestyle, and I definitely have more anxiety over doing what needs to be done.  But we're going to medical appointments and picking up books from the library and take out from restaurants and doing in person grocery shopping and what not.  

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11 hours ago, whitestavern said:

You might want to get another test. My vaxxed friend was exposed to Covid, tested negative, then had another test 8 days after exposure and tested positive. All symptoms were gastrointestinal related. 

What did she test with? I went and got a PCR test done. Those are pretty accurate and I did it when symptomatic with gastrointestinal issues.

 

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4 hours ago, kokotg said:

I'm having to look for a new dentist because two of the hygienists weren't wearing masks while working with patients on our last visit. And when I visit my grandmother's assisted living place, more of the people working there than not are either not wearing masks or wearing them incorrectly (on one visit, the woman running bingo pulled down her mask every time she called out a number). The last time I talked to my dad, he told me that the whole place was on (another) two week lockdown (residents couldn't leave their rooms) because a staff member had tested positive.

That’s gross…..our dentist and staff have always worn masks when working with patients…..long before Covid even existed. I don’t even remember the last time I saw a dentist or hygienist without a mask, maybe as a kid? 

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16 minutes ago, HSmomof2 said:

That’s gross…..our dentist and staff have always worn masks when working with patients…..long before Covid even existed. I don’t even remember the last time I saw a dentist or hygienist without a mask, maybe as a kid? 

Yeah, I was pretty shocked. I should clarify that they were technically wearing masks...but they were ill fitting surgical masks that stayed under their noses all the time (i.e. it wasn't that they kept slipping down, and they'd pull them back up). I honestly can't remember now if everyone wore masks there pre-pandemic. It wasn't on my radar, even though it probably should have been. 

 

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DH and I have been trying to figure out VT's current plan. As a state, we were so cautious in the beginning, but recently it's seemed much less so. I think our governor and health department are now of the mind that only 2% of cases are in vaccinated people, so focus on protecting kids under 12 and otherwise live life as you want. Masking in school for schools w/ students under 12 and other schools until they're at an 80% vaccination rate. Otherwise, don't worry? I think that's the message we're getting now. Deciding how I feel about it - I don't think I mind. It seems very - "you have a choice to get vaccinated, if you choose not to, it's on you." Probably only (may) work because we're more than 85% vaccinated?

 

 

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