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At what point would you lock down again?


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I've been enjoying the summer. The positivity in Manhattan has been like 0.4% and the cases per day has been 30 or so. It's been very nice. I never thought it'd last, but it's been very nice. 

You can guess where this is going... Delta cases are on the rise around here, the case load for the last few days has been 90, not 30, and the positivity is up to 1%. 

We haven't been doing indoor activities, anyway. But we've started enjoying going to the playground without masks. What would you do if you were me? Would you keep things as they were? Ask the kids to mask up in the playground? Lock down again? What would your thresholds for various behavior be? 

By the way, we are both vaccinated with Pfizer but the kids are too young for the vaccine. I really didn't enjoy the vaccine side effects and would get a booster if I had to, but I'd worry about it. 

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Are your kids high risk?  Has anyone in your extended family (genetically related) died from Covid?  Do you interact with anyone who is high risk on a regular basis?

If the answer is no, I probably wouldn't worry about it until public health officials did.

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I have never masked outside unless it was an area where we had to pass quite close to other people (like side by side on a trail).  I still keep a mask in my pocket for those kinds of situations outside.  While playgrounds here were roped off for the first 9 months of the pandemic, I think that the science shows that transmission is fairly unlikely in that situation?  (If people know otherwise, I would like to know.)  I just had a picnic and visit and hike with a close friend at a park the other day.  The other day was perfect weather (though a touch hot at times) but we were commenting on how nice it was compared to when we did the same picnic, visit and hike in chilly March!  We still enjoyed the social interaction both times though and braving the weather wasn't an issue compared to the priority on getting together. 

I still mask inside but I haven't done parties or inside things where I would be in close contact with people for hours.  I never totally locked down in the sense that I still did necessary errands even during lockdown because those were considered essential activities and I felt comfortable still doing them in a mask.  Now I feel even safer with vaccine plus mask doing those errands. 

 

 

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Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, Katy said:

Are your kids high risk?  Has anyone in your extended family (genetically related) died from Covid?  Do you interact with anyone who is high risk on a regular basis?

If the answer is no, I probably wouldn't worry about it until public health officials did.

Uhm, sure, a 90-year-old great-uncle died from COVID. I don't think that says much about my kids. 

We're not high risk, but then I have no idea what the risk of long haul disease for anyone at all is. 

As for public health officials, I really don't care much what they say and never have. I care about the evidence they use, but the goals of public health and health for my own family are not always aligned. 

Edited by Not_a_Number
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2 minutes ago, Jean in Newcastle said:

I have never masked outside unless it was an area where we had to pass quite close to other people (like side by side on a trail).  I still keep a mask in my pocket for those kinds of situations outside.  While playgrounds here were roped off for the first 9 months of the pandemic, I think that the science shows that transmission is fairly unlikely in that situation?  (If people know otherwise, I would like to know.) 

I have not seen good data on outdoor transmission, because I don't think it's easy to trace that kind of transmission. Plus, Delta is supposed to be more transmissible, anyway, and kids are in each other's faces all the time. 

 

2 minutes ago, Jean in Newcastle said:

I just had a picnic and visit and hike with a close friend at a park the other day.  The other day was perfect weather (though a touch hot at times) but we were commenting on how nice it was compared to when we did the same picnic, visit and hike in chilly March!  We still enjoyed the social interaction both times though and braving the weather wasn't an issue compared to the priority on getting together. 

I still mask inside but I haven't done parties or inside things where I would be in close contact with people for hours.  I never totally locked down in the sense that I still did necessary errands even during lockdown because those were considered essential activities and I felt comfortable still doing them in a mask.  Now I feel even safer with vaccine plus mask doing those errands. 

I think I'd feel differently if the kids were vaccinated. As is, I worry. 

We've been going to stores recently ourselves. We didn't during the height of the pandemic. 

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My kids are all vaccinated, as is virtually everyone in my extended family in all directions (the only ones who are not, are younger than 12) and *literally* all our friends with whom we socialize. My calculus would be somewhat different if I had young kids.

As feared, Delta looks to be transmitting quickly, in both absolute cases and as a percentage of all cases.  But so far, the vaccines seem to be defending pretty against Delta.  I keep watching different states' and cities' numbers, and the refrain seems to be pretty consistent: slightly different variations of numbers along the lines of of  X COVID cases, 50+++ % are Delta; but ~98+% of deaths, and ~96++% of hospitalizations, and ~90+% of cases are in people who did not vaccinate.

So for *us,* vaccinated, I'm feeling blessed relief. Not quite back to normal -- I'm not ready to fly, I wouldn't go to an indoor concert, I'm conscious of ventilation, I still mask when shopping.  But I recently stayed overnight at my (vaccinated) mother's for the first time since Feb 2020; we're going to friends' houses for dinner; we're eating INSIDE restaurants; I've booked road trips involving hotels as well as VRBOs. Nearly normal.

And so long as the vaccine keeps working ahead of the variants, I'm cautiously optimistic that we'll stay in that range through fall.

 

If a different variant arises that the vaccine doesn't protect against, that will change things.  We're not at herd immunity levels, so that remains a risk.

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1 minute ago, Pam in CT said:

My kids are all vaccinated, as is virtually everyone in my extended family in all directions (the only ones who are not, are younger than 12) and *literally* all our friends with whom we socialize. My calculus would be somewhat different if I had young kids.

Well, yes, I have young kids. I'd probably feel different if I didn't. 

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We have similar conditions here, but vax compliance has been good in our metro.  I am not worrying much about outdoor interactions with asymptomatic people.  Still trying to limit indoor public interactions as we can.  BUT our whole family of 4 is vaccinated.   I do have a 25 year old niece that was in the hospital w/pneumonia and a 14 year old nephew that had covid related MIS.  Our elders have done fine, but were very conservative with going out prior to vaccination.

I have been checking this site occasionally still and the risk level is SO much lower still than even April/May time frame I'm just watching and waiting and enjoying the weather.  Large crowded indoor events are still a no though.  I am running in and out of places more for quick order pick  ups, etc  But it still seems like businesses in our area are still doing a good job with this and plenty still have masking going on.

https://covid19risk.biosci.gatech.edu/

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Just now, FuzzyCatz said:

We have similar conditions here, but vax compliance has been good in our metro.  I am not worrying much about outdoor interactions with asymptomatic people.  Still trying to limit indoor public interactions as we can.  BUT our whole family of 4 is vaccinated.   I do have a 25 year old niece that was in the hospital w/pneumonia and a 14 year old nephew that had covid related MIS.  Our elders have done fine, but were very conservative with going out prior to vaccination.

I have been checking this site occasionally still and the risk level is SO much lower still than even April/May time frame I'm just watching and waiting and enjoying the weather.  Large crowded indoor events are still a no though.  I am running in and out of places more for quick order pick  ups, etc  But it still seems like businesses in our area are still doing a good job with this and plenty still have masking going on.

https://covid19risk.biosci.gatech.edu/

So would you not worry about playgrounds? I'm trying to decide whether to ask them to mask up in playgrounds. I don't think we'll stop going unless cases really spike... although I'm curious at what point I'll feel uncomfortable with playgrounds at all 😕 

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I still am not concerned outside, except for my uneasiness now increasing about my youngest playing with other young kids from families that are not at all concerned about Covid. He’s young enough that kids are still all up in each other’s faces. I don’t feel much worry about it with people whose kids are also only seeing other kids outside, and a small number at that. I don’t take my unvaccinated kids inside public places, though. They don’t go to the store or anything right now, with a couple one time exceptions (small candy store on a road trip, for example). They wear well fitted KF94s. 
 

14 minutes ago, Not_a_Number said:

I care about the evidence they use, but the goals of public health and health for my own family are not always aligned. 

This is how I feel as well. The measures that are going to keep the population as a whole relatively health aren’t aimed at keeping my specific kids healthy, and that’s one of my top priorities. As such, we are stricter with measures than public health would dictate. 

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Just now, KSera said:

I still am not concerned outside, except for my uneasiness now increasing about my youngest playing with other young kids from families that are not at all concerned about Covid. He’s young enough that kids are still all up in each other’s faces. I don’t feel much worry about it with people whose kids are also only seeing other kids outside, and a small number at that. I don’t take my unvaccinated kids inside public places, though. They don’t go to the store or anything right now, with a couple one time exceptions (small candy store on a road trip, for example). They wear well fitted KF94s. 

We're in Happy Masks right now. They are working pretty well. But we're definitely in the "in each other's faces" phase of life (my kids are 5 and almost 9), and that's why I'm wondering if I should mask them up in playgrounds. 

 

Just now, KSera said:

This is how I feel as well. The measures that are going to keep the population as a whole relatively health aren’t aimed at keeping my specific kids healthy, and that’s one of my top priorities. As such, we are stricter with measures than public health would dictate. 

Exactly. It's not like I don't respect public health experts -- we just have different goals. For instance, they may not want to cause panic... and I'm not panicking, just trying to decide. 

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I'm not absolutely locking down again until the vaccine is ineffective against a new variant. Like, allows breakthrough of serious infection in a large number of mostly healthy individuals. 

I may alter my behavior in various ways though.

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I would have a really hard to time deciding about masks on playgrounds, to be honest. I think the general idea is that outdoor spread is rare, but I would really like to know that outdoor spread with Delta is low.

My whole family is vaccinated, so we are back to going out and about cautiously. We all mask indoors in public places, including church (have only recently started attending again and didn't go back to the not cautious church we used to attend). We don't mask indoors around family/friends--most people we know well enough to hang out are people that vaccinated their eligible folks. Most family lives away, and we saw oodles of them post-vaccinated and pre-Delta rise. Much of the time, we were outside. That could change if Delta goes nuts, but I am still far less worried if I am with vaccinated family and friends.

My older son is still planning to attend vo-tech school in a month part-time, and I assume he'll be allowed to mask even though the school will no longer require it. I don't feel like we have an option--we already asked him to delay graduation a year. If we had unvaxed household members, I might feel differently.

I will probably go back to grocery pickup other than very brief runs as the county next to me is where I shop, and they have the highest rates in our entire state. 

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Ha, I was hoping you would have the answers to this Not_a_Number.    I am wondering this myself.  We didn't rejoin life a ton now, although we did lots of stuff we didn't feel comfy with last year.  Only 4 people in our family are vaccinated.  The others are to young.  I am sending my kids to indoor dance intensives now even my nonvaccinated kids.  The state had off and on gone sometimes of new cases in the 40s or 50s.  Now we are up in 140-200s.  I don't feel good about those numbers.  I am telling my kids we are going to do a few weeks of things take the risk, because it looks like we might have a bad fall.  

 

Just saw this

 

Israel Suggests Vaccine May Weaken (4:12 p.m. HK)

Data collected in Israel suggests that the protection afforded by the Pfizer Inc.- BioNTech SE vaccination weakens over time, the Ynet news website reported.

People who were among the earliest vaccinated figure prominently among the new cases, though even among this group, protection against severe illness remains strong, according to the data presented to the Health Ministry.

I hadn't heard that before.

 

Can people just go get vaccinated already.  Can we do state and/or national lottery for getting a shot?   Would that get more people to do it?

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1 minute ago, mommyoffive said:

People who were among the earliest vaccinated figure prominently among the new cases, though even among this group, protection against severe illness remains strong, according to the data presented to the Health Ministry.

That makes sense this might be the case, but I think it might also be completely confounded by the fact that the ones who were vaccinated earliest are also the ones at highest risk. Elderly people were first after healthcare workers, how many elderly are the ones having the most breakthrough cases. And healthcare workers are at higher risk by virtue of having much more exposure.

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We are...cautious here, but not locked down.  I have hope that the youngest can get vaccinated in the fall.  I don't know what a right answer is anymore, except to still treat every risk with respect for the outcome.  It means I have to be comfortable with the level of risk, I think.  Ds is at camp, but every kid was tested and most were vaccinated.  We hike and bike unmasked, but stay away from indoor areas mostly still unless there's a protocol we know will be followed.

 

So...I think we would lock down again after the summer if the numbers keep increasing.  At least until we can protect ds some other way we can minimize his risk while still letting him have a life.

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I've been thinking about this too but have concluded that we can't lock down again. DD is 11 so can't be vaccinated yet. Unfortunately it looks like the vaccines will not be available to kids under 12 before school begins. I considered lying about her age to get her vaccinated but decided against it. 

My daughter has spent a year and a half away from her friends. She's an 11 year old girl. She needs to see her friends. She's going back to school in August. The school hasn't officially said what the masking policy will be but I expect there will be no masks. 

DD is not high risk and everyone else in the family (including extended family) is vaccinated. 

I decided that I'm not going to worry about it and I'm not going to force DD to be the only masked kid in her friend group and keep her away from her friends. We're about to drop her off for sleep-away camp. I have no idea about the vaccine status of any of the children over 12 or the counselors. I know it's a big risk. DD's best friend is going to camp and the girls begged to go. 

I weighed the risks and concluded that DD's emotional need to be with her friends outweighs the risk of COVID. 

But your daughters are younger and they have each other. How are they doing emotionally? 

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1 minute ago, mommyoffive said:

People who were among the earliest vaccinated figure prominently among the new cases, though even among this group, protection against severe illness remains strong, according to the data presented to the Health Ministry.

This were also the oldest age groups, for which fading immunity has always been a concern.  

If I were in NYC with young kids right now,  I think I'd mostly try to steer clear of the most-crowded parks at the most-crowded times, but other than that not worry overrmuch about playgrounds.  

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1 minute ago, JennyD said:

If I were in NYC with young kids right now,  I think I'd mostly try to steer clear of the most-crowded parks at the most-crowded times, but other than that not worry overrmuch about playgrounds.  

I can't say that I can tell the difference between the most and least crowded playgrounds! They all involve kids in each other's faces. It's not like we're one of the only families there, ever. 

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Just now, Not_a_Number said:

I can't say that I can tell the difference between the most and least crowded playgrounds! They all involve kids in each other's faces. It's not like we're one of the only families there, ever. 

I wouldn't think you'd ever actually be alone; I was thinking along the lines of 'little neighborhood park at 8am on a Tuesday morning' vs. 'Union Square playground at 3pm on a glorious Sunday afternoon.'  But maybe nowadays there's less difference?

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5 minutes ago, JennyD said:

I wouldn't think you'd ever actually be alone; I was thinking along the lines of 'little neighborhood park at 8am on a Tuesday morning' vs. 'Union Square playground at 3pm on a glorious Sunday afternoon.'  But maybe nowadays there's less difference?

Our local playgrounds are the Riverside Park ones. They are fairly crowded. 

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My family and all of our extended family are vaccinated. I am higher risk due to autoimmune issues. My dh and kids had covid in January. Our city and state are lower vax areas, sadly. 
 

We will never lock down again unless compelled to. Highly unlikely in my state. My family’s emotional/social/psychological state of being is fragile and we need to be out and doing things with other people. Worship, Scouts, school (1 homeschooler with some classes outsourced locally, 1 in a very small private school) exercise/sports - these things are essential for us. We participated in all of them throughout the past year, with whatever restrictions were necessary. 
 

We will likely modify some choices when the delta surge gets here. Masks indoors, choosing outdoor locations whenever possible, curbside pick-up, etc. I just ordered some new masks this week because I expect to need them relatively soon for indoors. 

Edited by ScoutTN
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28 minutes ago, Ordinary Shoes said:

I weighed the risks and concluded that DD's emotional need to be with her friends outweighs the risk of COVID. 

But your daughters are younger and they have each other. How are they doing emotionally? 

Oh yes, I don't think we'll stop seeing friends. We've spent this whole month seeing friends a lot. 

However, I'll say that DD8 seems to feel close with the friends she kept in touch with via Zoom and I expect to be able to maintain friendships in this way for a number of months if need be. I have a hybrid in-person/online co-op planned for next year and while it's supposed to involve playground playdates, I don't foresee there being intense emotional consequences if that has to stop until the kids get vaxxed, especially since we'll have had the chance to catch up with friends. 

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I don’t have littles but I will say I’m surprised every time I see pre-vaccination age kids unmasked in indoor spaces. I honestly don’t mean to judge, but I can say with certainty it wouldn’t be the choice I would make (as it is, we are fully vaxed and wear Happy Masks inside public spaces).

Outdoors we don’t mask and for the most part I wouldn’t expect little kids to, either. Although, honestly, I think I’d be inclined to have them mask up at a busy park or in close proximity to other people. It just strikes me that they are *so* vulnerable—last year at this time we masked outdoors, and if anything this summer seems even more dangerous for them given the rapid rise of Delta.
 

So without actually being in your position but being quite conservative in regards to exposure, I would say yes, I’d probably have them continue to wear masks (or wear them again). 

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42 minutes ago, Ordinary Shoes said:

I've been thinking about this too but have concluded that we can't lock down again. DD is 11 so can't be vaccinated yet. Unfortunately it looks like the vaccines will not be available to kids under 12 before school begins. I considered lying about her age to get her vaccinated but decided against it. 

My daughter has spent a year and a half away from her friends. She's an 11 year old girl. She needs to see her friends. She's going back to school in August. The school hasn't officially said what the masking policy will be but I expect there will be no masks. 

DD is not high risk and everyone else in the family (including extended family) is vaccinated. 

I decided that I'm not going to worry about it and I'm not going to force DD to be the only masked kid in her friend group and keep her away from her friends. We're about to drop her off for sleep-away camp. I have no idea about the vaccine status of any of the children over 12 or the counselors. I know it's a big risk. DD's best friend is going to camp and the girls begged to go. 

I weighed the risks and concluded that DD's emotional need to be with her friends outweighs the risk of COVID. 

But your daughters are younger and they have each other. How are they doing emotionally? 

I agree with all of this. Mine are 11, 9 and 6.  My 9 year old daughter is wedged between two special needs boys and this last year of homeschooling was very hard for her. She did do gymnastics twice a week.

And she did have a couple exposures, but those were all from family and not gymnastics.  I won’t lock my kids down again at this point. It’s not worth it mentally for them.  The younger two were at camp all last week and NYS has said they don’t have to wear masks, so they didn’t.  I fully believe Covid will be endemic and that we will have to learn to co-exist, variants and all.  I do still have hopes foR the vaccine, but knowing our rather low local numbers and the data coming out of Israel makes me feel pessimistic.  But I also think we have to start taking a long warm view.

Edited by Mrs Tiggywinkle
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I probably would have unvaxxed kids mask at a busy, crowded playground.  Kids are gross and in each other's faces, and they cluster tightly on play structures.

I probably wouldn't bother with masking on the walk to or from, or when seated at a picnic table/park bench with the family, but while playing on the playground, probably yes.

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1 minute ago, Ausmumof3 said:

I think we had one known case of transmission in an outdoor setting (outdoor cafe).  I haven’t heard if there’s been more. 
 

How crowded are you playgrounds?

Crowded. 

The reason we've stopped masking at playgrounds is the sprinklers. Wet masks do not work very well! 

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We can’t lock down again.

Ds is working and going to university.

Dh returns to in-building work in September.

The middles are returning to brick and mortar school in September.

We are masking in indoor spaces, and our unvaccinated child is masking in outdoor spaces if within 6’ of someone (as am I). My other family members are as well, by their choice, to protect Youngest and I, but I let it be a their choice.

This is our new normal. I feel some unease about it all. I am honestly kind of hoping it burns through the community soon so that I will be better protected by the herd. I am vaccinated and masked and I have little tolerance for those who don’t think their personal responsibility extends to the community as well. 

Youngest and I plan to button back down for influenza season—by mid-November for sure, sooner if Delta really takes off in our area. The others can errand run for us and do what needs to be done. We will still run HEPA filters and do all of our other usual precautionary things (isolating sick people, airing their rooms to the outside, etc.)

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I don’t see us locking down again. There are definitely some things that make me uneasy after the past year but I’m trying to push past them.

Dh and I actually went to Chicago for the weekend (rode the train, dealt with crowds, etc). We met up with friends who live there for drinks and were out late, which was a first since this all started. It was so very needed!

Both dc are headed back to college in the fall and will be fully participating in campus life. 

We’re all vaccinated and I hope we don’t get sick but I do think we have to figure out a way to live with Covid because I don’t think it’s going anywhere. 

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Our immediate family who spend lots of time together are all vaccinated, and our county is doing pretty well too.  I'm mostly just following our state's guidelines.  I think they've been very wise so far and I trust them.   I feel like much of our lives are back to normal, although we always eat outside at restaurants (thankfully we can because -- summer!), and do activities like lake swimming, picnics, even an upcoming wedding reception picnic outside.  It will be a different story when we're back in winter and everything moves indoors -- we'll wait and see about that.  My dh has a myriad of health problems but he's vaccinated and we're trusting that the vaccine is protecting him during all our outdoor activities and indoor gatherings with close family.

Edited by J-rap
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Posted (edited)

I'm sort of surprised everyone is quite this adamant. If everyone is vaccinated and the vaccine is working well, then that's different, but that's not my situation right now because of the kids. I'd personally rather keep everyone healthy, especially if whatever is supposed to help next is right around the corner. I can easily imagine becoming very sparing with outings for a month or two if we're that close to a kid vaccine! 

Edited by Not_a_Number
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2 hours ago, ScoutTN said:

My family and all of our extended family are vaccinated. I am higher risk due to autoimmune issues. My dh and kids had covid in January. Our city and state are lower vax areas, sadly. 
 

We will never lock down again unless compelled to. Highly unlikely in my state. My family’s emotional/social/psychological state of being is fragile and we need to be out and doing things with other people. Worship, Scouts, school (1 homeschooler with some classes outsourced locally, 1 in a very small private school) exercise/sports - these things are essential for us. 
 

We will likely modify some choices when the delta surge gets here. Masks indoors, choosing outdoor locations whenever possible, curbside pick-up etc. 

Same here.  We will not lock down again.  The mental health for our family is fragile and we need to be out and about with others. Zoom meeting do not cut it. The amount of damage/undoing of all the work that DD had put into overcoming her anxiety and depression from the lockdown will take years to overcome. Nor will we wear masks outside ( farmers market is the only place I have).   Now while we have chosen to not vaccinate at this time until long term data ( 5 years worth to me would be good) for those with autoimmune and genetic disorders that do affect the heart ( our doctors support this decision). We had covid and continue to test for antibodies.  Our family has been through a lot over the years and we try to live each day to the fullest.  

 

Edited by itsheresomewhere
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As for mental health, we've all had to make our decisions, and I always figured that whatever version of lockdown we did HAD to work for everyone, mental health-wise. I was never treating this as a short term thing to push past, anyway, so I tried to make our life pretty palatable. I'll be able to do the same thing again if need be and am preparing the year with this in mind. 

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We won’t but that is at least in part because it still feels like we haven’t left it.  My husband is still working from home full time.  His company says maybe in August they can go back.  The community college that I would send my youngest to is still almost all online for the fall.  They say maybe in the Spring for in person classes.  The parks near me still have signs requiring masks and most people are still masking at the parks.  The drinking fountains still don’t work.  And won’t until Santa Clara County Health says they can be turned on.  No one knows when that will be.

The good part is we have very high vaccination rates.  The case load is going up but not so much.  

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Not locking down again unless local conditions warrant it.  We are all vaccinated and have no extraordinary risk factors.  My husband is still WFH fulltime.  His employer is phasing departments back in later this month but his team doesn’t have a transition date next.  

Edited by LucyStoner
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7 minutes ago, Not_a_Number said:

I'm sort of surprised everyone is quite this adamant. If everyone is vaccinated and the vaccine is working well, then that's different, but that's not my situation right now because of the kids. I'd personally rather keep everyone healthy, especially if whatever is supposed to help next is right around the corner. I can easily imagine becoming very sparing with outings for a month or two if we're that close to a kid vaccine! 

I think maybe because the thead title is "at what point would YOU lock down again?" many of us answered in relation to OUR OWN particular circumstances.  In *my* circumstances, I don't foresee locking down again unless a variant beats the vaccine.

Your family obviously has its own particular circumstances.  Had you asked "if you had kids too young to be vaxxed, how would you approach the Delta mini-surge?" I would, myself, have answered differently.

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2 minutes ago, Pam in CT said:

I think maybe because the thead title is "at what point would YOU lock down again?" many of us answered in relation to OUR OWN particular circumstances.  In *my* circumstances, I don't foresee locking down again unless a variant beats the vaccine.

Your family obviously has its own particular circumstances.  Had you asked "if you had kids too young to be vaxxed, how would you approach the Delta mini-surge?" I would, myself, have answered differently.

Fair enough 😄 . I like hearing all the perspectives. I'm just pretty sure that some of the people saying "never again" have littler kids. 

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9 minutes ago, Not_a_Number said:

I'm sort of surprised everyone is quite this adamant. If everyone is vaccinated and the vaccine is working well, then that's different, but that's not my situation right now because of the kids. I'd personally rather keep everyone healthy, especially if whatever is supposed to help next is right around the corner. I can easily imagine becoming very sparing with outings for a month or two if we're that close to a kid vaccine! 

Yeah I am trying to be careful and hoping that the kid vaccine really does come out in Sept or Oct.  I can see locking down for a month or 2 just to get to that.  We will if rates rise a lot.  I am hoping ours fall and maybe it was just the holiday.  I really would love to get to Sept or Oct before they rise due to everyone coming inside. 

I think that for me it is easier a bit to lockdown little kids.  Well my teens and tween did and never complained, it came with a cost.  My younger ones for the most part loved being at home.  I mean sure they missed being in activities, but now that we are out doing things they don't miss their activities as much.  They have enjoyed all the time at home to play and relax.  As long as we have been working to make it fun for them.  My teens and tween have enjoyed their time at home too, but I know they also missed being around their friends during our lockdown time.  At that age it is more important to be around other kids.

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Just got back from dropping off DD for camp. They are taking a bus to camp and we dropped the kids off at a church. The kids have to wear a mask on the bus. 

There were at least 100 people at the church. I saw maybe 5 masks? Most of the kids are under 12 so not vaxxed. No one was social distancing. 

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We are very low risk aside from our kids being young and unvaccinated (all adults are vaccinated). I'm not going to "never again!" or anything because who knows. I guess if they say lockdown again we'll lockdown with our pod (12 people we hang out with during pandemic) again.  

I definitely don't want to go back to anything like that again. My 4.5 year old no doubt went through a major bout of depression during COVID lockdown. 

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This may possibly be helpful in the decision making? Obviously the data is far from perfect in all of this which is probably what makes things hard.

playgrounds seem low risk to me but that’s because I have several in driving distance where we could head on a school day and likely see no other kids or maybe one family.  If they’re crowded it might be different.

 

edited to add there’s a bit of discussion down thread about at least one of the studies referenced.

 

I also saw that Pfizer are meeting with the FDA (?- think that’s right) to discuss a 3rd booster.  Just makes me wonder a bit.

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4 minutes ago, Not_a_Number said:

Fair enough 😄 . I like hearing all the perspectives. I'm just pretty sure that some of the people saying "never again" have littler kids. 

It may depend how people define lockdown. We had stay-at-home orders in my state but I never considered it a real lockdown because we could get out and hike, go to the store with masks, etc. For me lockdown will always remind me of the high-rises in Wuhan where people were literally locked inside and could only get deliveries on certain days. 

I'm freely enjoying all our outdoor options this summer and feel comfortable getting together with others who are vaccinated indoors, but still mask in public indoor spaces despite being fully vaxed. I guess I've varied what I'm doing at different phases of the pandemic less than most.

My kids are teens but if I had littles and playgrounds were crowded, I'd probably have them mask on the playground soon. Delta is so transmissible and kids are kids. 

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Our playgrounds have been pretty low-risk. If there are people we don't know there everyone masks up. If we are there with people we know (who aren't high risk of transmission) we remove masks. Usually, it's only us and the people we know at our playgrounds anyway. The other play area we visit is our local zoo which requires masks anyways, outdoors and indoors.

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9 minutes ago, Not_a_Number said:

Fair enough 😄 . I like hearing all the perspectives. I'm just pretty sure that some of the people saying "never again" have littler kids. 

The ONLY reason I kept my kids away from people over the past 1.5 years was because of the possible risk to people in fragile health.  Nearly all of those at-risk people are now vaccinated.

At this point I know a number of kids who have had Covid and are absolutely fine.  Not a single one under 12 who had any symptoms worse than a cold, either during or after Covid.  I know there are kids who have been sicker, but it's extremely rare in otherwise healthy kids.  The trade-offs of avoiding rare effects are not worth it to me and mine.

You of course need to do what you're comfortable with.  But it doesn't surprise me at all to see parents allowing their kids to play freely.

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And as for "just another month or two" ... we've heard that over and over since March 2020.  We gave up summer 2020.  Summer 2021 is here for a short while.  I have no doubt we'll still be discussing Covid daily in summer 2022.  Childhood is short.  Kids literally need to go out and play.

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Also a bit more data from lower vaccine states.

 

I think for us personally I’m just trying to respond to the current situation changes fairly promptly as the best way to balance kids need to have some kind of life outside home and still play it safe.  Of course most likely by the time we know we have a problem it may be too late.  But at the rate vaccination and variants are happening it feels like this will be going on another year or two.  So I’m going for getting them out and about while we can so we’re a bit better equipped mentally and emotionally if we do end up locked down again. 
 

obviously the situation is different here with both low Covid and low vaccination rates for now.

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18 minutes ago, Ausmumof3 said:

This may possibly be helpful in the decision making? Obviously the data is far from perfect in all of this which is probably what makes things hard.

playgrounds seem low risk to me but that’s because I have several in driving distance where we could head on a school day and likely see no other kids or maybe one family.  If they’re crowded it might be different.

Those numbers for Pfizer came from Scotland (79%) and England (88%), and they excluded the data from Israel (64%) & Singapore (69%). Israel and Singapore may have included some cases that were asymptomatic, but it seems a little deceptive to only include the highest possible stats and leave out the much lower ones.

Edited by Corraleno
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