What is your first response when you see a Confederate flag displayed?

[catz]

1 hour ago, SeaConquest said:

I would love to know where people are living where they are NOT seeing the rebel flag these days because that sounds like a part of the country I would be interested in learning more about...

 

I don't recall seeing it within an hour or 2 of where we live ever.  There may  be some luck involved.  

I tend to subscribe to Hanlon's razor for most things "Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity."  But this one has been going around a while and I'm sure some using it are using as a direct symbol of white supremacy, etc.  I think nothing good for certain. But glad I live somewhere it really isn't something I see unless we're traveling.  

[TravelingChris]

10 minutes ago, Jean in Newcastle said:

?  I never said that it was right.  But it has been very common for people to act as if it was the entire city of Seattle and it wasn't. 

Oh then those people are entirely ignorant.  I never knew some people thought that.   And I believe it is the same in Portland too--it isn't the entire city but hell for people who are in that area.

[SeaConquest]

5 minutes ago, GracieJane said:

I live in California and I’ve only seen the Confederate flag once in my entire life.

In a city or rural area, if you don't mind my asking? I grew up in LA and Ventura Counties and don't really remember seeing the Confederate flag growing up (other than in the Dukes of Hazard) until I joined the Army at 17 and was stationed in the South, but it was a different era. People kinda kept that stuff on the DL compared to today. San Diego has some seriously conservative pockets that are kinda scary right now. 

[Zinnia2]

I can't stand them, and I don't buy the idea that people don't know what they are flying. I am occasionally able to give someone the benefit of the doubt for ignorance, but I am often proved wrong. 

My sister in law lives in Ohio.  My inlaws are from the south.  My sister in law has had a mid-life crisis in the last few years, and as part of redefining herself, she has embraced her "southern roots."  Part of that is displaying the confederate flag.  My mother in law bluntly told her that she should not hang it, that it was wrong and racist and intended to intimidate people, and she (the MIL) did not support it at all.  My sister in law took it down for a couple of months, but I noticed in a picture recently that it was back up.  She has no excuse.  And I have no patience for someone displaying something that has come to mean so much hate.

FWIW, I was raised in the deep south.  Rodney King was while I was in high school.  We knew back then that the stars and bars were hurtful.  Some kids wore t-shirts, intended to inflame people, and they were banned.  As they should have been.  The flag has no place outside of a museum. 

[GracieJane]

42 minutes ago, SeaConquest said:

In a city or rural area, if you don't mind my asking? I grew up in LA and Ventura Counties and don't really remember seeing the Confederate flag growing up (other than in the Dukes of Hazard) until I joined the Army at 17 and was stationed in the South, but it was a different era. People kinda kept that stuff on the DL compared to today. San Diego has some seriously conservative pockets that are kinda scary right now. 

I live in Los Angeles, and it would be really odd to see a Confederate flag here. I know plenty of Conservatives (and a few Trumpers), but the Confederate flag has a decisively Southern pride in it that seems incongruent with the population here.

[SeaConquest]

5 minutes ago, Plum said:

I clarified that some in my ETA while you were typing.
No, they were mini-succeeding for their own reasons that have nothing to do with slaves. However I would presume to say that they might see capitalism as a form of slavery. At least some of them do and they are not completely wrong. 

So, let me make sure I understand. You are equating people who want to secede, so that they can escape from the economic exploitation they perceive capitalism imposes *upon them*, with people who seceded so that they could continue the economic exploitation of *other people* being enslaved and in bondage?

[SeaConquest]

2 minutes ago, GracieJane said:

I live in Los Angeles, and it would be really odd to see a Confederate flag here. I know plenty of Conservatives (and a few Trumpers), but the Confederate flag has a decisively Southern pride in it that seems incongruent with the population here.

I am glad to hear that my hometown still doesn't tolerate that nonsense. I wish I could say the same about parts of San Diego County.

[stephanier.1765]

On 6/23/2021 at 9:03 AM, Roadrunner said:

If I saw one here in CA, I would run as fast as I could. I would assume the person was part of some sort of hate group. 
If I were in the South, I wouldn’t have the same reaction. I just wouldn’t know. Most likely I would shrug my shoulders and think “redneck.” 

I live and grew up in the south. Redneck is exactly what I think when I see one.

[GracieJane]

3 minutes ago, SeaConquest said:

I am glad to hear that my hometown still doesn't tolerate that nonsense. I wish I could say the same about parts of San Diego County.

Haha! For all it’s issues, Los Angeles is likely the least racist area in the world. I think white supremacists would be laughed out of the city tbh.

[SeaConquest]

11 minutes ago, GracieJane said:

Haha! For all it’s issues, Los Angeles is likely the least racist area in the world. I think white supremacists would be laughed out of the city tbh.

Totally agree. I went to LA Unified schools for elementary and the diversity of our community made a huge impact on my outlook at a young age. Of my little girl group of best friends, I was the only white girl. My three best friends were Puerto Rican and African American.

I literally thought for the longest time that my best friend's grandmother's name was "Abuelita." I just grew up speaking Spanglish, like most everyone else. So, when people talk sh*t about Mexicans and others trying to get to the border for a better life, to those of us that are native to Southern California (I am a 3rd gen Angelino), it feels personal. They are trash talking our friends, our neighbors, our caregivers, and so many other hard-working first gen immigrants (and their families) that we grew up around. I cannot relate to those nativist and/or white supremacist sentiments at all.   

Edited June 24, 2021 by SeaConquest

[Lady Florida.]

Other - I live in Florida so there are all kinds of reasons why people fly that flag. Usually my first thought is they are racist but the other thought is they are racist but don't think they are. They think they're just displaying "heritage" or some such sh!t. 

I do not understand the heritage bit. Why proudly display the flag of traitors to the United States if your ancestors were such traitors? 

[GracieJane]

4 minutes ago, Lady Florida. said:

Other - I live in Florida so there are all kinds of reasons why people fly that flag. Usually my first thought is they are racist but the other thought is they are racist but don't think they are. They think they're just displaying "heritage" or some such sh!t. 

I do not understand the heritage bit. Why proudly display the flag of traitors to the United States if your ancestors were such traitors? 

Well...they were Southern statesmen before they were American countrymen, no? I’ve always thought the Confederate flag was some nod to the “heritage” of the South. Part of the secession was reclaiming the vision of democratic States (like little mini-nations), and I’ve always assumed the Confederate flag was a belief in that “idea” of America.

[73349]

I sometimes see, to my amazement, the US flag and the Confederate flag flown together (e.g., on the same pickup truck), and my first response is PICK A TEAM! It's not State and UNC--you can't have both.

Or out loud, more like, Bless his heart, not everybody has had a decent education.

[Annie G]

3 hours ago, SeaConquest said:

I would love to know where people are living where they are NOT seeing the rebel flag these days because that sounds like a part of the country I would be interested in learning more about...

 

We’ve only lived here for 2 years but I’ve never seen a confederate flag in the county where the University of Georgia is located, or the more rural county adjacent to it which is the county we live in. Clarke county is very liberal and I can’t imagine they would tolerate the flag there. Not at all. In our county, which is much more conservative, I haven’t ever seen it. But that doesn’t mean anything since it might be in a part I’m not familiar with.  I have seen it in Dahlonega, which is about 90 minutes away, and in some more rural areas up in the N Ga mountains. 
 

However, there is surely racism and rednecks in all the places I mentioned.  I’m not convinced there’s anywhere in the US where there is zero racism. 

[Lady Florida.]

1 hour ago, BetsyT said:

  The flag has no place outside of a museum. 

This. As do the statues of Confederate soldiers. It's not erasing history to move these things to museums. It's actually preserving history.

1 hour ago, Plum said:

No, they were mini-succeeding for their own reasons that have nothing to do with slaves.

Have you read the secession documents? Four states very specifically said it was about slavery. Have you read the Confederate Constitution? It bans any state from making slavery illegal, allows slave owners to travel between states with their slaves, and says that any new states admitted to the nation must allow slavery. Not about slavery my a$$.

[MercyA]

1 hour ago, Ordinary Shoes said:

Rejecting authority is not the same thing as anti-authoritarian. In my observation, people who fly the Confederate flag are fine with authority as long as that authority agrees with them.

Yes this. The people around here who fly Confederate flags also seem to be the type who absolutely revere certain political leaders. 

[MercyA]

23 hours ago, Plum said:

I suppose this could be a spin-off (and if someone wants to knock yourself out) but what do you all think of the Antifa & Anarchist flags I've seen at protests? Should people who wave these flags (confederate, anarchist, antifa) be lumped into the same category, anti-authoritarian, anti-American extremists?

That's an interesting question. I've never seen an Antifa or anarchist flag IRL.

An Antifa flag wouldn't signal "racist," to me, unlike the Confederate flag. And the Confederate flag (ironically enough) usually seems to be flown by "Yay, 'Merica" patriotic types, not anti-American extremists. 

An anarchy flag would remind me of rebellious teenagers more than anything else. Pretty sure a friend in high school used to wear an anarchy shirt. He turned out okay. 😉

[Melissa Louise]

14 minutes ago, MercyA said:

That's an interesting question. I've never seen an Antifa or anarchist flag IRL.

An Antifa flag wouldn't signal "racist," to me, unlike the Confederate flag. And the Confederate flag (ironically enough) usually seems to be flown by "Yay, 'Merica" patriotic types, not anti-American extremists. 

An anarchy flag would remind me of rebellious teenagers more than anything else. Pretty sure a friend in high school used to wear an anarchy shirt. He turned out okay. 😉

Ds has an anarchy flag in his room. I told him he can't take it out of the house until he can persuasively explain anarchist thought to me. He seems content to leave it in his room 🙂

[Pam in CT]

1 hour ago, Melissa Louise said:

Ds has an anarchy flag in his room. I told him he can't take it out of the house until he can persuasively explain anarchist thought to me. He seems content to leave it in his room 🙂

Solid parenting strategy

[Wheres Toto]

6 hours ago, SeaConquest said:

I would love to know where people are living where they are NOT seeing the rebel flag these days because that sounds like a part of the country I would be interested in learning more about...

  

Northern NJ.  One of the wealthiest counties in the nation but a very racially diverse area.    I've probably seen one twice in my entire life in this area. 

[Selkie]

8 hours ago, SeaConquest said:

I would love to know where people are living where they are NOT seeing the rebel flag these days because that sounds like a part of the country I would be interested in learning more about...

I live in a rural county in the Midwest and there are no Confederate flags to be seen here.

[Terabith]

We've been on a trip for the last two weeks, driving through VA, TN, KY, IL, IN, OH, and PA, and I have seen more Confederate flags than I can count, and more Trump 2020 signs still waving, including a fully operational Trump/ Pence merchandising store in PA.  

I've seen more Confederate flags in PA than I did in TN.  

[Garga]

28 minutes ago, Terabith said:

We've been on a trip for the last two weeks, driving through VA, TN, KY, IL, IN, OH, and PA, and I have seen more Confederate flags than I can count, and more Trump 2020 signs still waving, including a fully operational Trump/ Pence merchandising store in PA.  

I've seen more Confederate flags in PA than I did in TN.  

I’ve always said I live in Trumpsylvania. And that idiot flag is seen regularly around here. Not all over, but more than enough for my tastes.

When I see that flag I think, “Idiot.” It’s unChristian of me, of course, but that’s what I think. 

[popmom]

I haven’t read all the replies. 
 

I’m in the Deep South, and it’s just not done. Seriously. I rarely EVER see that symbol anymore. When I do, my first thought is, “what in the world are they thinking? Just why?” 
 

I attribute it to “they are proud of their heritage” combined with “uneducated”. The culture in rural areas here is complex. I would never automatically assume racist.

[popmom]

On 6/22/2021 at 6:25 PM, TechWife said:

I selected all of the above, but in reality I don’t think that people who display the “confederate flag” are necessarily uneducated. I think most are making at least a partially informed, deliberate choice. They are proud  of the fact that their ancestors owned other people (proud of the history) and they don’t see anything wrong with it. Not only that, they want to preserve that way of life as much as possible.
 

Lest anyone think I’m uninformed, I’m born, raised and am living in the south. I was taught that the Civil War was about states’s rights, without being taught that it was about the state’s right to allow ownership and abuse of other people. I was also taught that “carpetbaggers” were bad. I was not taught about the Wilmington Coups & similar events, the Tulsa massacre or the Civil Rights movement. I spent my life in Georgia as close as twenty minutes from downtown Atlanta and no further than 45 minutes away and didn’t have any idea who Martin Luther King, Jr. was until the Federal holiday came about when I was in my mid twenties. When I visit the area where I spent my teen years, I can still go directly to the house where the head of the state KKK lived and his family is still well known and respected in the community. I have “southern credentials.” 

Dang. Small town? I have “southern credentials”, too, but I’ve always known about the civil rights movement and MLK. And for as long as I’ve been on this earth (50+ years) the KKK has always been regarded as evil in my communities and among my peers. Even as a teenager. I’m sure there were KKK members where I grew up, but it was ultra secret. It was NOT acceptable at all. 

Also, I have never met anyone who was proud that their ancestors owned slaves. Was the “old south” romanticized? Yes. But no one thought that slavery was ok. Not even remotely. 

I’ll add fwiw. I speculate that those who were involved in the KKK would never display a Confederate flag. And those who did/do, had/have nothing to do with the KKK. As I said in my other post, the culture here in small towns and rural areas is complex. 
 

Credentials: I’ve lived in Huntsville, AL, and Birmingham. I spent 10 years in a small town called Scottsboro in the 70’s. It was mostly white, and there were definitely racists. My best friend was Indian. Both of her parents were doctors. Her whole family dealt with a lot of hate when they first moved there. Also, you may have heard of the Scottsboro Boys. I’m under no illusion that I lived in some panacea growing up, but my schools (and my parents and even my grandparents) did better by us, and by the ‘70’s, it was commonly accepted that the KKK was an evil organization. 
 

 

Edited June 25, 2021 by popmom

[LucyStoner]

Depending on the context I think anything from “lame” to “racist assholes” to “meth”.

Our across the street neighbors back in about 2005 or so had a giant Confederate flag on their porch.  After the first few days we were there I told my husband they were dealing drugs.  My husband had no idea how I knew that but I recognized the pattern of short visits and two of the people who lived there had the drug eyes.  They were busted by the cops a few months later.  A lot of the white supremacist types in WA state tend to get money from drugs.  

[MercyA]

On 6/24/2021 at 11:43 PM, popmom said:

I speculate that those who were involved in the KKK would never display a Confederate flag. And those who did/do, had/have nothing to do with the KKK. 

I'm not sure that's the case in my area.

[Removed personal details for privacy.] 

And the Confederate flag is everywhere in the last few years. Odd for northerners, unless there is a racial significance to the flag.

Edited July 13, 2021 by MercyA

[TravelingChris]

On 6/24/2021 at 3:35 PM, Lady Florida. said:

This. As do the statues of Confederate soldiers. It's not erasing history to move these things to museums. It's actually preserving history.

Have you read the secession documents? Four states very specifically said it was about slavery. Have you read the Confederate Constitution? It bans any state from making slavery illegal, allows slave owners to travel between states with their slaves, and says that any new states admitted to the nation must allow slavery. Not about slavery my a$$.

We moved the statue of the Confederate Soldier from in front of our courthouse to the part of the city cemetery where the Confederate Soldiers are buried.  I thought that was an appropriate move.

[TravelingChris]

I do not see the flag often in my city, and then only on a t shirt or truck decal or something like that and I figure those people are visiting my city.  I do see it at times traveling to more rural areas.    Oh, I forgot to mention, most years I do see it at least once a year- when I go to the cemetery in October and they have costumed actors talking about some of the dead who are buried (they stand by their graveside---mostly- because they always have a Tallulah Bankhead and she is not buried here).  But that is a historical event- not something racist.

But I know I have seen flags and tshirts with flags in certain types of tourist shops.  We tend to go to tourist shops in National or State parks or at museums or that sort of thing but sometimes go to local ones and I would not be surprised to see it being sold.  
 

We do have a local flag company and shortly after the killings at that church in Charleston they stopped making Confederate flags.  I don't know if they would make one for a museum or something like that.

[1234]

On 6/24/2021 at 9:21 PM, happysmileylady said:

I live in south central IN right now.  I am actually currently living in one of the most redneck neighborhoods, on one of the most redneck streets I have ever lived on.  There are people here who own more giant pick ups than I have children, and right now, someone is shooting off fireworks..........in the rain.  The guy across the street from has a dually..................................full sized van.  The children in this neighborhood go to an all white public school, named Whiteland. 

 

Not a single one of these people displays a confederate flag.  That doesn't mean I have never seen a confederate flag in south central IN.  Just like most other places, it's bound to appear here and there.  I am sure I have seen it on a random truck driving down the freeway and it certainly wouldn't surprise if some of my neighbors wear a confederate flag shirt occasionally, etc etc.

 

I am sure you don't want to come to this part of the country.  The county voted for Trump, vax rate is a little lower than the US average, and there's pretty much nothing to do here except maybe watch tractors navigate a Walmart parking lot lol.  But yeah, even in this area where the KKK was pretty rampant, (lets count the number of Catholic churches....) the confederate flag is barely visible. 

I live very close to there (find myself at least driving through for some reason or another often) and see them all the time. It’s wild to me you haven’t seen them. Maybe I’m just out and about at the wrong time of day all the time. 

[popmom]

@MercyAno doubt there is racial significance to the flag—especially where you are. I’m really shocked at what you have and are seeing. I don’t get it. 

What I was getting at...I’m not sure how to explain. Members of the kkk would not be so bold. Because it’s not acceptable here. And those who might have one on a t shirt or truck wouldn’t have the connections or the inclination.

I’m curious...the area where you live where you are seeing all this. Is it racially diverse? Mostly white?

eta: I looked it up. At least one county is 98% white. The state overall is 88% white. My state is 68% white. I’d bet it’s closer to 65% now. That stat was a little dated. 

I think that’s the problem in your area. 

 

Edited June 26, 2021 by popmom

[MercyA]

On 6/25/2021 at 9:48 PM, popmom said:

@MercyAno doubt there is racial significance to the flag—especially where you are. I’m really shocked at what you have and are seeing. I don’t get it. 

What I was getting at...I’m not sure how to explain. Members of the kkk would not be so bold. Because it’s not acceptable here. And those who might have one on a t shirt or truck wouldn’t have the connections or the inclination.

I’m curious...the area where you live where you are seeing all this. Is it racially diverse? Mostly white?

eta: I looked it up. At least one county is 98% white. The state overall is 88% white. My state is 68% white. I’d bet it’s closer to 65% now. That stat was a little dated. 

I think that’s the problem in your area. 

My county is about 94% white, .5% black. We have a fairly large Hispanic population.

The county next door is 72% white and 13% black.

[Removed examples for privacy.]

We are a rural county. There is a lack of education. Many of the people who are educated still don't trust science or the "mainstream media." We live in a politically conservative, proudly redneck bubble. And the KKK roots go way back. 

ETA: I'm sure not everyone sporting a Confederate flag is a member of the KKK. I've seen t-shirts that say, "Heritage, Not Hate." (I'd like to press them on what heritage they're so proud of, exactly.) But a KKK member would definitely have no fear of flying a big Confederate flag off the back of their truck, and, yes, I've seen it. 

Edited July 13, 2021 by MercyA

[Faith-manor]

18 minutes ago, MercyA said:

My county is about 94% white, .5% black. We have a fairly large Hispanic population.

The county next door is 72% white and 13% black.

My parents have a friend who is a black pastor. When he still lived nearby, he was afraid to come to our town after dark. I used to think he was paranoid. 😞 

At least one person at my former church--someone I would have said was kind, loving, and good--used the "n" word in front of my husband and implied that black people are lazy. 

We are a rural county. There is a lack of education. Many of the people who are educated still don't trust science or the "mainstream media." We live in a politically conservative, proudly redneck bubble. And the KKK roots go way back. 

ETA: I'm sure not everyone sporting a Confederate flag is a member of the KKK. I've seen t-shirts that say, "Heritage, Not Hate." (I'd like to press them on what heritage they're so proud of, exactly.) But a KKK member would definitely have no fear of flying a big Confederate flag off the back of their truck, and, yes, I've seen it. 

MercyA, I think my area is a parallel universe to yours!

[popmom]

33 minutes ago, MercyA said:

My county is about 94% white, .5% black. We have a fairly large Hispanic population.

The county next door is 72% white and 13% black.

My parents have a friend who is a black pastor. When he still lived nearby, he was afraid to come to our town after dark. I used to think he was paranoid. 😞 

At least one person at my former church--someone I would have said was kind, loving, and good--used the "n" word in front of my husband and implied that black people are lazy. 

We are a rural county. There is a lack of education. Many of the people who are educated still don't trust science or the "mainstream media." We live in a politically conservative, proudly redneck bubble. And the KKK roots go way back. 

ETA: I'm sure not everyone sporting a Confederate flag is a member of the KKK. I've seen t-shirts that say, "Heritage, Not Hate." (I'd like to press them on what heritage they're so proud of, exactly.) But a KKK member would definitely have no fear of flying a big Confederate flag off the back of their truck, and, yes, I've seen it. 

See this is what everyone thinks when they think of MY state. 
 

When you live next door to folks of different races, nationalities, and religions...When you regularly patronize minority owned businesses (not because you’ve been told to as the do gooder thing to do—but because of the quality of the service or product and because there are so many that I often don’t even know until after the fact)...When you worship alongside them...When you see them every single day at the McD’s drive through and you’re on a first name basis...When you trust your life to someone who looks or worships differently than you because you’re sick or having a baby...you cannot help but see a fellow human being created in the image of God. Someone to esteem as better than myself; someone I can and should learn from. 
 

and yet there but for the grace of God...

There is hate and evil and backwardness here for sure. (Listen to the podcast S&$t Town) So I don’t want to misrepresent my home. And it doesn’t make it any more acceptable that it’s kept secret, but I will still go out on a limb and say...it’s better here. Diversity makes it better here.
 

 

Edited June 26, 2021 by popmom

[Selkie]

2 hours ago, popmom said:

@MercyAno doubt there is racial significance to the flag—especially where you are. I’m really shocked at what you have and are seeing. I don’t get it. 

What I was getting at...I’m not sure how to explain. Members of the kkk would not be so bold. Because it’s not acceptable here. And those who might have one on a t shirt or truck wouldn’t have the connections or the inclination.

I’m curious...the area where you live where you are seeing all this. Is it racially diverse? Mostly white?

eta: I looked it up. At least one county is 98% white. The state overall is 88% white. My state is 68% white. I’d bet it’s closer to 65% now. That stat was a little dated. 

I think that’s the problem in your area. 

 

It’s a culture problem. Like @MercyA, I live in a rural county in the Midwest that is 97% white. But the culture here is completely different from where she lives. 

As I posted earlier, there are no Confederate flags to be seen here. No “proud redneck” culture, despite it being farm country. No KKK activity (that would be totally shocking here). Our county is politically mixed and not religiously conservative. People are fairly well educated. 

So I think it goes way beyond the fact that MercyA’s county is predominantly white - because if that was the problem, my county and all the counties around me would be like Mercy’s, and they’re not. There are other toxic elements at play. 

[popmom]

6 minutes ago, Selkie said:

It’s a culture problem. Like @MercyA, I live in a rural county in the Midwest that is 97% white. But the culture here is completely different from where she lives. 

As I posted earlier, there are no Confederate flags to be seen here. No “proud redneck” culture, despite it being farm country. No KKK activity (that would be totally shocking here). Our county is politically mixed and not religiously conservative. People are fairly well educated. 

So I think it goes way beyond the fact that MercyA’s county is predominantly white - because if that was the problem, my county and all the counties around me would be like Mercy’s, and they’re not. There are other toxic elements at play. 

I agree. What do you think that toxic element is? I have my ideas.

[popmom]

On 6/24/2021 at 1:14 PM, TravelingChris said:

I asked my dh this question but did not read out the poll questions.  He answered that he thinks redneck.  We do live in the South.  

Not all rednecks though. I’ve got redneck blood flowing through my veins, and I’ve spent so much time with these “redneck” aunts and uncles, cousins, etc, and I never once—not once saw a confederate flag or heard anything racist. Now that I think about it, I’m actually kind of surprised at that. But it’s true. Me here standing up for rednecks... they ain’t all bad. 🙂 I value these relationships and the time I’ve spent with them. Hardworking, humble, loving, loyal folks. 

You might be a redneck if “Sweet Home Alabama” was played at your wedding reception. 🙂 Not mine—just to be clear. 😂

Edited June 26, 2021 by popmom

[MercyA]

1 hour ago, Faith-manor said:

MercyA, I think my area is a parallel universe to yours!

Then you get it! It's craziness. 😞 

[TravelingChris]

4 hours ago, popmom said:

Not all rednecks though. I’ve got redneck blood flowing through my veins, and I’ve spent so much time with these “redneck” aunts and uncles, cousins, etc, and I never once—not once saw a confederate flag or heard anything racist. Now that I think about it, I’m actually kind of surprised at that. But it’s true. Me here standing up for rednecks... they ain’t all bad. 🙂 I value these relationships and the time I’ve spent with them. Hardworking, humble, loving, loyal folks. 

You might be a redneck if “Sweet Home Alabama” was played at your wedding reception. 🙂 Not mine—just to be clear. 😂

Oh certainly not.  And he knows that too.  

[TravelingChris]

5 hours ago, Faith-manor said:

MercyA, I think my area is a parallel universe to yours!

Way long time ago, I was at the Federal Law Enforcement Training Center in Glynco, GA on the months long training for Immigration Officers.  There were people in my class from many parts of the country- most of us were at airports (I was at LAX) but there were two guys from the Detroit Land Crossing.  I was shocked by their racist talk.  I am not really sure why I thought people from the North would be less racist but I think that is a common myth.  After all, the horrible busing demonstrations were in Boston in the 70s and I remember the hateful attitudes.  

My son, who lived in Indiana for a few months said he learned how the KKK is actually active there.  OTOH,  the universal condemnation around here for any KKK or white supremacy or anti-semitism is the reality.  In the ten years I have lived here, we had one instance of someone placing some supposedly KKK brochures around election time, supposedly because it was misspelled and possibly done by someone trying to just cause controversy since we don't have active KKK around here.  We also had someone who looked like a youth do Nazi and other offensive words and symbols on two local synagogues and also under overpasses.  No one was caught in either of these cases but both seemed to be the works of some lone perpetrator.

[Guest]

8 hours ago, MercyA said:

My county is about 94% white, .5% black. We have a fairly large Hispanic population.

The county next door is 72% white and 13% black.

My parents have a friend who is a black pastor. When he still lived nearby, he was afraid to come to our town after dark. I used to think he was paranoid. 😞 

At least one person at my former church--someone I would have said was kind, loving, and good--used the "n" word in front of my husband and implied that black people are lazy. 

We are a rural county. There is a lack of education. Many of the people who are educated still don't trust science or the "mainstream media." We live in a politically conservative, proudly redneck bubble. And the KKK roots go way back. 

ETA: I'm sure not everyone sporting a Confederate flag is a member of the KKK. I've seen t-shirts that say, "Heritage, Not Hate." (I'd like to press them on what heritage they're so proud of, exactly.) But a KKK member would definitely have no fear of flying a big Confederate flag off the back of their truck, and, yes, I've seen it. 

This is very similar to the county where I live. I am at the edge of a county; if I go in one direction, I enter a MUCH more diverse area. Go the other direction (towards the town where I work) and it is something like 97% white. It’s rural, with agrarian roots, a lot of Civil War significance. Lots of blue collar/trades people. Politically “red”, though the adjacent county is politically “blue.” 

I encounter a lot of “not-racism.” People who “aren’t racist, but...” I don’t really know what the counter is for that, nor even whether this should be corrected; I usually will only have the conversation if it’s an on-going relationship and the person needs to know I don’t agree with that. 

PS., there is also a KKk presence here, though I do not think every Rah-Rah Republican Flag-Waver is in it. 

Edited June 26, 2021 by Quill
Blue “collar,” not blue “color”, lol

[Wheres Toto]

My county isn't as diverse as I thought [White (Non-Hispanic) (70.5%), White (Hispanic) (11.2%), Asian (Non-Hispanic) (10.5%), Black or African American (Non-Hispanic) (3.35%), and Two+ (Non-Hispanic) (1.75%)]. 

But the county that I can be at in 5 minutes, where older dd goes to school, where dh and I both used to work, where the majority of my students come from is [Black or African American (Non-Hispanic) (38.4%), White (Non-Hispanic) (29.7%), White (Hispanic) (11.3%), Other (Hispanic) (9.7%), and Asian (Non-Hispanic) (5.53%)].

[Pam in CT]

re coded language

2 hours ago, Quill said:

...I encounter a lot of “not-racism.” People who “aren’t racist, but...” I don’t really know what the counter is for that, nor even whether this should be corrected; I usually will only have the conversation if it’s an on-going relationship and the person needs to know I don’t agree with that. ..

No Confederate flags around here, even hanging off the 4x4s waving Thin Blue Line and MAGA banners, but a lot of this.  My Representative was recently appointed chair of a new legislative study group to study cause of / make policy recommendations around inequality; and I *can't tell you* how many comments along the lines of: what do you expect when so many minority families are one-adult households and: "people" don't want to work when they can get paid not to work. 

 

And definitely amplifying/ concurring with this:

4 hours ago, TravelingChris said:

... I am not really sure why I thought people from the North would be less racist but I think that is a common myth.  After all, the horrible busing demonstrations were in Boston in the 70s and I remember the hateful attitudes. 

The form is different: for instance we have super-decentralized school funding -- virtually nothing at the state level-- so that adjacent towns have order of magnitude  discrepancies in per pupil expenditures.  Unsurprisingly, while our state *average* on various apples-to-apples education metrics are pretty good, those averages mask some of the worst gaps between schools.  And here as elsewhere, charter schools have enabled re-segregation in a different form.

And the language is different.  This legislative cycle there was a bill to amp up and give enforcement teeth to an (existing) affordable housing mandate that pressed into suburban towns like mine and rural towns.  A lot of earnest talk about "preserving the character of our towns," and concerns about "local control over local zoning," All very genteel and Land of Steady Habits, but it got the job done and the bill died in committee.

 

 

[Fritz]

I just realized why I have been avoiding this thread. Just reading the words gives me the same sick feeling in the pit of my stomach when I see a confederate flag. I am especially disgusted when I see it worn on clothing. I think because that's intentional not a "it's my heritage thing", but rather an "I'm a racist idiot and proud of it thing". I live in the south and I still don't get the "It's my heritage" thing either. If it were just one generation ago and grandpa fought blah, blah, blah...maybe but  it's more than a generation ago. If it's about southern heritage let's fly a flag of grits, liver mush and biscuits and gravy. Now I could get behind that😉.

[NewnameC]

I would not notice a flag on clothes, because I have awful eyesight. So I never notice the details of someone’s clothing.

I try not to judge someone I don’t know, so I would choose none of the above on the poll.

I do have a confederate ancestor, who never owned slaves. He didn’t even live in the South, so I’m not sure why he was in the Confederate Army. He moved to New Jersey as a child from Ireland at end of potato famine. During the Civil War, he joined the confederate army. After the war, he returned to New Jersey, but he kept in touch with the men he served with. 
 

 

 

 

[Zinnia2]

On 6/24/2021 at 4:33 PM, Annie G said:

We’ve only lived here for 2 years but I’ve never seen a confederate flag in the county where the University of Georgia is located, or the more rural county adjacent to it which is the county we live in. Clarke county is very liberal and I can’t imagine they would tolerate the flag there. Not at all. In our county, which is much more conservative, I haven’t ever seen it. But that doesn’t mean anything since it might be in a part I’m not familiar with.  I have seen it in Dahlonega, which is about 90 minutes away, and in some more rural areas up in the N Ga mountains. 
 

However, there is surely racism and rednecks in all the places I mentioned.  I’m not convinced there’s anywhere in the US where there is zero racism. 

This is my hometown. There are racists there. I'm related to some of them.  

[Annie G]

9 minutes ago, BetsyT said:

This is my hometown. There are racists there. I'm related to some of them.  

I’m sure there are racists there. But I’m not sure the Confederate flag is an accurate tell, because not all racists brandish the flag and not all who display it are racists. Some are just stupid.   I also think that county is less racist than some of the rural surrounding counties.  Not that ‘less racist’ is anything to brag about. 

[Ottakee]

Yesterday I was on a website of a homeschool mom led store.   One of the pop up adds was selling confederate stuff with the words NO apologies.   I emailed her and let her know and she was very quick to respond that she would make sure that ad never popped up on her page again.  I was thankful for her quick action as she had not seen it

[MercyA]

On 6/26/2021 at 1:36 AM, popmom said:

Me here standing up for rednecks... they ain’t all bad. 🙂 I value these relationships and the time I’ve spent with them. Hardworking, humble, loving, loyal folks. 

That's for sure! #NotAllRednecks

[mom2scouts]

On 6/22/2021 at 11:18 PM, theelfqueen said:

So I work in a WWII Museum ... the other day I got a call from someone wanting to make a donation. 

He proceeded to explain that they had a very large ceremonial nazi flag and to explain what great condition it is in and so forth... then the guy stopped himself and said "wait, I need to explain..." (like it sort of occurred to him  that "let me tell you about my great, enormous Nazi flag" didn't look great lol) "My wife and I were at an estate sale and we found the flag and my wife insisted we must buy it and get it into a museum before some skinhead finds it". 

My grandfather had a Confederate flag on a shelf in his basement. No idea of its provenance or purpose. It was never discussed just we kids played in the  basement and dug around a lot. It wasnt displayed it was in a pile of old stuff. Perhaps it belonged to his parents and he didnt know what to do with it. No idea.

I know LOTS of WW2 collectors. It's more likely the flag would have ended up with a collector or reenactor than a skinhead. Someone earlier said there's no innocent reason to have a Nazi flag, but collectors have them (but they don't display them on their pickup trucks!!) Did your museum take the donation?