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So, the time has finally come for the "everybody else" category people to get covid vaccines.  I was feeling pretty sure about getting it.  .  I just went online to sign up and I kind of froze up.  Like, tell me, I'll be fine.  Please? 

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Well, I signed up y'all.  I go on Monday! At the site I am going to, there was only 1 less appointment than there was 2 days ago.  Well 2 less, now that I signed up.  😢

She asked for a pep talk and you gave her this anti-vax       ? As a healthcare worker, this boils my blood. What absolute nonsense! California has the lowest infection rate in the nation because our

My post was edited for saying the phrase "anti-vax nonsense" while I am working in an ICU in a hospital filled with Covid patients at this very moment? Seriously? Talk about tone policing. It is absol

On 4/20/2021 at 2:41 AM, Elizabeth86 said:

So, the time has finally come for the "everybody else" category people to get thetold ya so.  ir covid vaccines.  I was feeling pretty sure about getting it.  .  I just went online to sign up and I kind of froze up.  Like, tell me, I'll be fine.  Please? 

I have known two otherwise healthy people who died after receiving the second shot, so there's that.

I would feel much better about it if TPTB would be more open and forthright about what they know and what they don't know. Now it seems as if it will become an annual vaccine, like the flu shot. Surely, this was not news to them. Why didn't they say that before?

Florida, which was never locked down, and California, which has been the ultimate in lockdown, have the same infection rate.

It's an infection that is 100% treatable with an existing, FDA-approved drug. Even without that drug, it has a 99.something recovery rate. I'm not yet willing to get an experimental drug from which some people have died. The vaccines don't guarantee immunity, either. So, an infection with 99.something recovery rate, treatable by a safe, existing drug, versus getting an experimental vaccine which has a dicey track record and which doesn't guarantee immunity, when we aren't even sure why some people get covid and some don't.

No, thanks.

[Moderator Note: Critical thinking skills require that you do not mistake this forum for a source of qualified medical advice. Even the medical personnel on here have not actually examined you or your medical records personally.]

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4 minutes ago, JumpyTheFrog said:

Do you have a specific concern? The rate of dangerous side effects of Covid is higher than the vaccines.

This is my feeling too.  I never even get flu shots but boy you can bet I got the Covid Vaccine. 

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7 minutes ago, JumpyTheFrog said:

Do you have a specific concern? The rate of dangerous side effects of Covid is higher than the vaccines.

WELL no valid concern. My dh, many many many friends and family are anti-mask, anti-covid vaccine and the type that just keep saying "it's just a virus." SO normally, I agree with these nutjobs on many things, BUT NOT on covid. We have been clearly divided on this.  I just feel like the only one, kwim?  My parents got the vaccine, but everyone else I know is all "hell no" about it.  It just feels like my area is NOT on board.  When the older folks were getting it, they did well, it was hard for people to get the shot, they wanted it.  I looked yesterday and looked again today and they have the EXACT SAME AMOUNT of open spots.  It's like no one young and healthy are going to get it.  It's just weird to be going against the crowd I usually follow. My husband was actually quite surprised I'd even consider getting the vaccine.

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26 minutes ago, Elizabeth86 said:

WELL no valid concern. My dh, many many many friends and family are anti-mask, anti-covid vaccine and the type that just keep saying "it's just a virus." SO normally, I agree with these nutjobs on many things, BUT NOT on covid. We have been clearly divided on this.  I just feel like the only one, kwim?  My parents got the vaccine, but everyone else I know is all "hell no" about it.  It just feels like my area is NOT on board.  When the older folks were getting it, they did well, it was hard for people to get the shot, they wanted it.  I looked yesterday and looked again today and they have the EXACT SAME AMOUNT of open spots.  It's like no one young and healthy are going to get it.  It's just weird to be going against the crowd I usually follow. My husband was actually quite surprised I'd even consider getting the vaccine.

I almost never get a flu shot - I think 2-3 my whole life, in bad flu years.  I selectively vaccinated my kids.  I look at each vaccine individually and do a cost/benefit analysis.

This one is easy.  I got the first appointment I could when my group opened up.  I've had the first shot and am counting the days till the second.

If it makes it any easier, here most people are running out and getting it as soon as possible, so pretty much everyone I know over 16 has had 1-2 doses, all with no significant issues.  Including all my kids, who all have medical letters that they don't need to finish their 'normal' vax cycles because of a bad vax reaction to the measles shot. Some had day of achiness, headache, or low fever - although most have nothing at all past a sore arm for a day.  NBD.  SO MUCH BETTER than risking Covid.  

At this point many, many, many more people have been vaccinated than have been infected with Covid.  500,000+ dead from Covid in the US, that's not even including the huge numbers on top of that that had to be hospitalized or weren't that sick initially but ended up with 'long Covid'  vs. virtually no confirmed deaths related to the vaccine (I think there's that one from the J&J clotting).  Them's better odds.  (and I'd pick a mRNA vax over J&J at this point, if I had any choice).

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We've received our first dose and will get our second in another 3 weeks.  At this point in time, we perceive Covid risks far outweigh vaccine risks.  We also see it as a way to slow transmission for others which hopefully means fewer mutations which benefits everybody.  We also believe a vaccine will be needed for international travel (without a lot of hoops and costs) and that is a huge need for us as we have close family and friends on three continents. 

I don't agree with the PP who said CA and FL have the same rate of infection as this snapshot from Worldmeter shows:1301157220_ScreenShot2021-04-19at7_01_32PM.thumb.png.a263c74da68b55fd5051b5ea20cc1320.png

Are the differences huge?  No, but CA (like NY) was hit far earlier with more C-19 cases than FL and their numbers reflect the lack of knowledge about the disease and best treatment. FL has both more cases per million as well as more deaths.  Plus its current number of new cases is vastly greater than CA's.  Does that prove that ultimately CA's path was the better choice?  I don't know--we aren't through this pandemic yet.

Getting the vaccine is a reasonable choice.

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24 minutes ago, Ellie said:

I have known two otherwise healthy people who died after receiving the second shot, so there's that.

I would feel much better about it if TPTB would be more open and forthright about what they know and what they don't know. Now it seems as if it will become an annual vaccine, like the flu shot. Surely, this was not news to them. Why didn't they say that before?

Florida, which was never locked down, and California, which has been the ultimate in lockdown, have the same infection rate.

It's an infection that is 100% treatable with an existing, FDA-approved drug. Even without that drug, it has a 99.something recovery rate. I'm not yet willing to get an experimental drug from which some people have died. The vaccines don't guarantee immunity, either. So, an infection with 99.something recovery rate, treatable by a safe, existing drug, versus getting an experimental vaccine which has a dicey track record and which doesn't guarantee immunity, when we aren't even sure why some people get covid and some don't.

No, thanks.

Ellie, can you tell me what drug you’re talking about? 

If this drug is so effective, why are so many people still dying of Covid, and what about the long haul Covid patients? Does this drug cure them, as well?

Please don’t think I’m asking this in a snarky way — if there is information out there that I haven’t heard, I want to know about it! 

 

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2 minutes ago, Catwoman said:

Ellie, can you tell me what drug you’re talking about? 

If this drug is so effective, why are so many people still dying of Covid, and what about the long haul Covid patients? Does this drug cure them, as well?

Please don’t think I’m asking this in a snarky way — if there is information out there that I haven’t heard, I want to know about it! 

 

I was going to ask the same thing!  I'm having trouble keeping up with all the info.

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In cases like this I always remember the ethics motto my kids had to learn in martial arts class:

I do what I know is right, even if it means standing alone.

 

 

Not only do un-vaccinated people run a higher risk of catching and spreading the virus, leading to unnecessary deaths and/or long term lung, heart, and brain consequences of self and others, but the fewer people who are vaccinated the more likely there will be mutations that will be resistant to the vaccine, prolonging suffering both economically and due to more unnecessary deaths/adverse health outcomes.

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Unlike Ellie I haven’t known anyone who died from any of the vaccines or even had any severe adverse effects. However, I know multiple people who died from Covid. These were people in all age groups with and without pre-existing conditions. Granted, as a HCW I’ve had much more exposure (heh! in the literal as well as figurative sense) to people with Covid. I also know that over a third of my colleagues have had Covid, many of whom were very sick and a few who needed to be hospitalized. Fortunately, everyone recovered; unfortunately, many of my colleagues are still suffering the effects of long Covid even a year later.

I’m not scared of the mortality of the disease; I’m scared about the morbidity. I received the jabs as soon as I could.

I think you should make the decision that is best for you in your situation regardless of what others in your community/social circle say. 

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2 minutes ago, Amy in NH said:

In cases like this I always remember the ethics motto my kids had to learn in martial arts class:

I do what I know is right, even if it means standing alone.

 

 

Not only do un-vaccinated people run a higher risk of catching and spreading the virus, leading to unnecessary deaths and/or long term lung, heart, and brain consequences of self and others, but the fewer people who are vaccinated the more likely there will be mutations that will be resistant to the vaccine, prolonging suffering both economically and due to more unnecessary deaths/adverse health outcomes.

Yes, and those of us who are able to be vaccinated are also helping to protect those people who have actual physical reasons for not being able to be vaccinated, as well as those for whom the vaccines are less effective due to any number of factors beyond their control. 

I know people who had reactions to the shots, but I don’t know anyone — or anyone who knows anyone — who died as a result of having been vaccinated. I do, however, know people who have suffered from long haul Covid, and many of us know people who died from Covid. 

I’m not one of those people who pressures people to get vaccinated for everything. But Covid is different. It just is.

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Have you read stories from the personal vaccination thread?

You've got a chance of some side effects but those are temporary. 

I got mine already and a big thing is that we don't know the long term effects of covid-19 either. We do see a study showing 1/3 of those who had Covid ending up with a mental health diagnosis. (I have a loved one living this) Others with long covid affecting a variety of body systems, usually those who didn't end up with that severe of a case in the first place. 

Lastly for me those that are pushing against the vaccine are not people I could trust to provide information without a political agenda. And I don't trust anyone that says there is a cure for covid-19 like all our medical providers around the world are just withholding this as a conspiracy. Too many that have died themselves. There is not a tin foil hat big enough. 

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I would consult with your doctor.  This is a medical decision.  I can tell you what my doctor told me:  get the vaccine.  It protects you from a virus that can have pretty devastating effects on some people and you can't tell which ones are going to be fine and which ones won't.  So it's better to be safe than sorry.  The vaccines have shown good safety and efficacy results so far.  Most people don't even have very bad side effects from the vaccine other than perhaps a day or two.  Also - the more people who get the vaccine, the sooner our communities can SAFELY get back to normal. 

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3 minutes ago, Jean in Newcastle said:

I would consult with your doctor.  This is a medical decision.  I can tell you what my doctor told me:  get the vaccine.  It protects you from a virus that can have pretty devastating effects on some people and you can't tell which ones are going to be fine and which ones won't.  So it's better to be safe than sorry.  The vaccines have shown good safety and efficacy results so far.  Most people don't even have very bad side effects from the vaccine other than perhaps a day or two.  Also - the more people who get the vaccine, the sooner our communities can SAFELY get back to normal. 

Yes, you have no way of knowing if you will be one of the lucky ones or not. It is like playing Russian Roulette. Long covid and lingering issues are hitting those that are young and healthy. 

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44 minutes ago, Ellie said:

I have known two otherwise healthy people who died after receiving the second shot, so there's that.

I would feel much better about it if TPTB would be more open and forthright about what they know and what they don't know. Now it seems as if it will become an annual vaccine, like the flu shot. Surely, this was not news to them. Why didn't they say that before?

Florida, which was never locked down, and California, which has been the ultimate in lockdown, have the same infection rate.

It's an infection that is 100% treatable with an existing, FDA-approved drug. Even without that drug, it has a 99.something recovery rate. I'm not yet willing to get an experimental drug from which some people have died. The vaccines don't guarantee immunity, either. So, an infection with 99.something recovery rate, treatable by a safe, existing drug, versus getting an experimental vaccine which has a dicey track record and which doesn't guarantee immunity, when we aren't even sure why some people get covid and some don't.

No, thanks.

The nation has lost 567,000 people so far, to say nothing of those hospitalized and the healthcare workers stressed to the breaking point or the unknown number of people who may deal with Long Covid (and perhaps as a lifelong illness).

 And CA has been nowhere near the "ultimate in lockdown" from my perspective living here.

Bill

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Yep, talk to your doctor.  It was an automatic yes for me.  I have a kid with a chronic illness (who himself is refusing the vax as of now 🤬) and if he gets covid, I need to be able to care for him and stay with him at the hospital if he ends up there.   Obviously, your mileage may vary.  

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@Elizabeth86 I'm one week out from my second round of Moderna and--while I intend to honor one more week of caution--I'm feeling positively liberated. What a relief!!!

I did experience a considerable headache the day after round 2, tender arm, and was tired. All over by the next day.

Very grateful.

Bill

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1 hour ago, Soror said:

Have you read stories from the personal vaccination thread?

You've got a chance of some side effects but those are temporary. 

I got mine already and a big thing is that we don't know the long term effects of covid-19 either. We do see a study showing 1/3 of those who had Covid ending up with a mental health diagnosis. (I have a loved one living this) Others with long covid affecting a variety of body systems, usually those who didn't end up with that severe of a case in the first place. 

Lastly for me those that are pushing against the vaccine are not people I could trust to provide information without a political agenda. And I don't trust anyone that says there is a cure for covid-19 like all our medical providers around the world are just withholding this as a conspiracy. Too many that have died themselves. There is not a tin foil hat big enough. 

I am so sorry that you are experiencing that.

Yes, I would not be getting information about whether to vax or not from friends who are against it.  Even if I ended up not getting it.  This is a medical decision and you should talk to your doctor, listen to what the CDC is saying, or do your own real (getting info from the medical community and not anything political) research .  

For me I got it as soon as I could.  And I have my second this week.  Is there a risk getting it?  Sure but it is much smaller than actual risk of getting covid and ending up dying, really sick, having life long problems or something else.  So I choose vaccine.  But it is also about ending this pandemic and protecting people who can't get the vaccine.  Like all of my kids who are not able to get it right now.  I want them to be safe, go back to the life they have missed, and have a lower risk of anything happening to me or dh because of covid. 

Oh the only side effect after my first Moderna shot was sore arm.

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I am at high risk of getting a bad case if I get it.  I moved out to the boonies last year for the initial SIP, from March to October.  I’ve been extraordinarily and unusually careful.  I really wanted the vaccine.  

But I also don’t want to use an untried drug, particularly one like this that is using a different mechanism than others that have been developed before.  And I came back to ‘town’ in October and have still be able to be extraordinarily isolated and make that stick comfortably.  So I had decided not to get the vaccine until it had been out in general use for at least 6 months, so that unforeseen side effects become well known/surfaced.

Then my dear nephew decided to get married the week after Easter this year, two states away, and I decided to roll the dice and go.  This was extremely important to me, even to the point of being willing to risk my life.  So at that point I decided to try to get vaccinated to improve my odds if I get exposed.  I was not able to finish the vaccine sequence before the wedding, but I did get the first shot about a week beforehand and I know that that boosted my immunity to this disease somewhat.

I just got the second shot yesterday.

So far my side effects have been very minimal.  After the first one, I suffered from an achy arm (not bad enough to even take Tylenol) and about 3-4 hours of brain fog the next day, and that was all.  I’m not feeling any worse after the second one yet.

I’m telling you all this to explain a ‘middle path’ approach that was pretty individual to me.  I’m neither sanguine about the disease nor sanguine about the vaccines.  If I were able to keep isolated longer, I would rather have postponed getting the vaccine until knowing more about them, but under the circumstances changed my stance.  I know folks who had no side effects at all, and ones who were bedridden and horribly sick for 2-3 days after each one.  It varies a lot.  

You do you.  You know your own details better than anyone else.  You know your risks.  

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I'm another person who is typically slow to vaccinate.  I don't get flu vaccines and my children were vaxxed in a delayed fashion.  HOWEVER!  I am now fully vaccinated for Covid, even realizing that I might still get the disease in spite of the vaccine.  The really terrible side effects of this disease are quite frightening to me and getting the vaccine seems to reduce the chances of that happening to a infinitesimal risk.  

Anne

 

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4 hours ago, Ellie said:

I have known two otherwise healthy people who died after receiving the second shot, so there's that.

I would feel much better about it if TPTB would be more open and forthright about what they know and what they don't know. Now it seems as if it will become an annual vaccine, like the flu shot. Surely, this was not news to them. Why didn't they say that before?

Florida, which was never locked down, and California, which has been the ultimate in lockdown, have the same infection rate.

It's an infection that is 100% treatable with an existing, FDA-approved drug. Even without that drug, it has a 99.something recovery rate. I'm not yet willing to get an experimental drug from which some people have died. The vaccines don't guarantee immunity, either. So, an infection with 99.something recovery rate, treatable by a safe, existing drug, versus getting an experimental vaccine which has a dicey track record and which doesn't guarantee immunity, when we aren't even sure why some people get covid and some don't.

No, thanks.

She asked for a pep talk and you gave her this anti-vax       ? As a healthcare worker, this boils my blood. What absolute nonsense! California has the lowest infection rate in the nation because our governor has done absolutely everything to get shots in arms asap. And it is working! Not like the sh*t show I am seeing here in Texas, where rates are rising again. 

Oh how I wish people could walk around a Covid ICU and see what the public doesn't see -- 40 year olds on ventilators, parents not able to say goodbye to their kids. It's always no big deal until it happens to you. Over half a million American lives lost and we still have to deal with these anti-vax Covid deniers. I just can't anymore. Take a look at Israel if you want to know if the vaccine is safe and effective. And, for the love of G-d, stop spewing antivax  on a thread that asked for a pep talk. Sheesh.

ETA: Yes, I got my vaccine in December. It was an enormous relief and has been keeping me safe at work for months, despite several known exposures. I had the Pfizer vaccine and zero side effects besides a sore arm. Easy peasy. I am doing everything humanly possible to get my kids (12 and 7) vaxed asap (tried enrolling them in several trials, but all full). I follow all the major virologists, immunologists, and epidemiologists involved in Covid research on Twitter and there is no question about the science of vaccines vs contracting Covid through exposure. None.

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I do not know any one who experienced serious side effects from the vaccine.  Sore arm and a day or two of flu-like symptoms, sure, but nothing that didn't clear up in a few days.  A minor inconvenience in exchange for a chance for life to become more normal.

On the other hand, none of the people I know who had COVID suggest it was a minor illness.  All were seriously ill for weeks.  Several were hospitalized and continue to suffer the effects months later.  I lost five relatives in the past year.  Two of the deaths were directly attributed to COVID, one COVID was a factor, and the other two were collateral damage - failure to thrive after months of isolation and delayed medical care. 

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1 hour ago, Ellie said:

I would feel much better about it if TPTB would be more open and forthright about what they know and what they don't know. Now it seems as if it will become an annual vaccine, like the flu shot. Surely, this was not news to them. Why didn't they say that before?

I'm not sure how you missed that information, but it has been common knowledge for many months now. Not a secret at all.

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2 minutes ago, Selkie said:

I'm not sure how you missed that information, but it has been common knowledge for many months now. Not a secret at all.

I agree. Also, did anyone ever really believe the vaccine would be one and done? Didn’t most people assume we would need booster shots?

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4 minutes ago, Selkie said:

I'm not sure how you missed that information, but it has been common knowledge for many months now. Not a secret at all.


Not to mention that anyone with even general knowledge about how vaccines work could have predicted that this would probably be the case.  I mean, there are "one-and-done" vaccines but I wouldn't expect it with a contagious respiratory virus. 

 

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19 minutes ago, SeaConquest said:

She asked for a pep talk and you gave her this anti-vax nonsense? As a healthcare worker, this boils my blood. What absolute nonsense! California has the lowest infection rate in the nation because our governor has done absolutely everything to get shots in arms asap. And it is working! Not like the sh*t show I am seeing here in Texas, where rates are rising again. 

Oh how I wish people like you could walk around a Covid ICU and see what the public doesn't see -- 40 year olds on ventilators, parents not able to say goodbye to their kids. It's always no big deal until it happens to you. Over half a million American lives lost and we still have to deal with these anti-vax Covid deniers. I just can't anymore. Take a look at Israel if you want to know if the vaccine is safe and effective. And, for the love of G-d, stop spewing antivax horsepoop on a thread that asked for a pep talk. Sheesh.

ETA: Yes, I got my vaccine in December. It was an enormous relief and has been keeping me safe at work for months, despite several known exposures. I had the Pfizer vaccine and zero side effects besides a sore arm. Easy peasy. I am doing everything humanly possible to get my kids (12 and 7) vaxed asap (tried enrolling them in several trials, but all full). I follow all the major virologists, immunologists, and epidemiologists involved in Covid research on Twitter and there is no question about the science of vaccines vs contracting Covid through exposure. None.

Thank you for being on the front lines. Heroism.

Bill

 

 

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26 minutes ago, SeaConquest said:

She asked for a pep talk and you gave her this anti-vax nonsense? As a healthcare worker, this boils my blood. What absolute nonsense! California has the lowest infection rate in the nation because our governor has done absolutely everything to get shots in arms asap. And it is working! Not like the sh*t show I am seeing here in Texas, where rates are rising again. 

Oh how I wish people like you could walk around a Covid ICU and see what the public doesn't see -- 40 year olds on ventilators, parents not able to say goodbye to their kids. It's always no big deal until it happens to you. Over half a million American lives lost and we still have to deal with these anti-vax Covid deniers. I just can't anymore. Take a look at Israel if you want to know if the vaccine is safe and effective. And, for the love of G-d, stop spewing antivax horsepoop on a thread that asked for a pep talk. Sheesh.

ETA: Yes, I got my vaccine in December. It was an enormous relief and has been keeping me safe at work for months, despite several known exposures. I had the Pfizer vaccine and zero side effects besides a sore arm. Easy peasy. I am doing everything humanly possible to get my kids (12 and 7) vaxed asap (tried enrolling them in several trials, but all full). I follow all the major virologists, immunologists, and epidemiologists involved in Covid research on Twitter and there is no question about the science of vaccines vs contracting Covid through exposure. None.

Surely you are not serious about our governor.  CA has been absolutely incompetent at getting shots into arms, particularly in the SF Bay Area.  It’s appalling.  Our governor is in over his head, in spades.  We have had tons of cancelled confirmed appointments for first and for second shots here because supply has been so unreliable.  Thank goodness he was unable to force all the counties to submit to his ever changing distribution systems, none of which worked well.  It’s been horrendous, and entirely unnecessarily so.

I’m glad you were vaccinated, and I’m glad that they put front line health workers first.  But the follow through for ‘the rest of us’ has been awful.

 

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OP, with so many around you with an anti vax/mask mentality, it’s probably messing with your head and maybe  causing the conflict you feel inside. If you were around tons of people who were being super careful and getting a vax , you’d likely already had yours. 

I’m hugely afraid of needles and was hesitant. I did fine. Now I feel better and relieved. Do what you feel is best for you, even if others aren’t on the same page where you are. Tons of people are on the same page as you, even though they aren’t all around you.

If you have your mind made up that you want the vaccine, just get it over with.

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26 minutes ago, Spy Car said:

Thank you for being on the front lines. Heroism.

Bill

 

 

Thanks, Bill, but I am just a student. I work with ECMO and Covid nurses in the ICU. They are the real heroes and are so burned out. I graduate next month (G-d willing). Hoping to work in either psych or the ICU, but the job market in SD is uber competitive. Can take 6-12 months to get a job, so it will probably mostly be over by the time I am working FT.

But, just for curiosity's sake, I just looked up the current Covid rates per 100k. California and Florida don't seem to have the same infection rates at all, Ellie. Seems your sources are not credible. Shocking. https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/us/coronavirus-us-cases.html

CA: 6 per 100k

TX: 12

FL: 30 

CA leads by a substantial margin with 45% of the population with at least one dose of vaccine (Florida 38%, Texas 35%). Tell me again how those shots and mask mandates aren't working. Mhmm.

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8 minutes ago, Carol in Cal. said:

Surely you are not serious about our governor.  CA has been absolutely incompetent at getting shots into arms, particularly in the SF Bay Area.  It’s appalling.  Our governor is in over his head, in spades.  We have had tons of cancelled confirmed appointments for first and for second shots here because supply has been so unreliable.  Thank goodness he was unable to force all the counties to submit to his ever changing distribution systems, none of which worked well.  It’s been horrendous, and entirely unnecessarily so.

I’m glad you were vaccinated, and I’m glad that they put front line health workers first.  But the follow through for ‘the rest of us’ has been awful.

 

I am sorry that supply has been so uneven. I honestly blame that on the county because the standards have varied across counties and were set by the local authorities. In SD, they opened up the supply to people with BMI over 25 almost a month ago, which was almost everyone, and I got my husband a vax appointment the next day.

ETA: California is in the top 10 re vaccinations. https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/us/covid-19-vaccine-doses.html

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9 minutes ago, Catwoman said:

I agree. Also, did anyone ever really believe the vaccine would be one and done? Didn’t most people assume we would need booster shots?

Personally, I assumed a lot of things that were not said.  I assumed that the SIP/shut down would last for months and months.  I assumed that the vaccine would require frequent readminstration because we have flu shot drives every year.  And I assumed that vaccines would not be developed as fast as they were. Thanks to our prior administration, of which I was largely not a fan but must give credit where credit is due, that last assumption turned out not to be the case.  The other ones were, however.  We do all need to think for ourselves and not believe everything that politicians say.

 

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6 minutes ago, SeaConquest said:

I am sorry that supply has been so uneven. I honestly blame that on the county because the standards have varied across counties and were set by the local authorities. In SD, they opened up the supply to people with BMI over 25 almost a month ago, which was almost everyone, and I got my husband a vax appointment the next day.

Well, here in the Bay Area the problem has been that the state promises deliveries that they renege on, over and over.  They undeniably got off to a very slow start.  In the first quarter I kept reading that CA had X million doses, of which X thousand had been administered.  Given that I badly wanted to be vaccinated in time for the wedding I watched this very closely, and it was extremely frustrating.  The governor couldn’t get out of his own way and get the doses to people early on, and coupled with his lovely dinner in Napa with many non-household members present while I could not visit my own elderly mother in the hospital or rehab after a bad fall when she really, really needed my personal help, my opinion of him is now very low.  

Edited by Carol in Cal.
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1 minute ago, Carol in Cal. said:

Personally, I assumed a lot of things that were not said.  I assumed that the SIP/shut down would last for months and months.  I assumed that the vaccine would require frequent readminstration because we have flu shot drives every year.  And I assumed that vaccines would not be developed as fast as they were. Thanks to our prior administration, of which I was largely not a fan but must give credit where credit is due, that last assumption turned out not to be the case.  The other ones were, however.  We do all need to think for ourselves and not believe everything that politicians say.

 

I agree with you, Carol!!!

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25 minutes ago, Selkie said:

I'm not sure how you missed that information, but it has been common knowledge for many months now. Not a secret at all.

Every single source I've ever read about even potential vaccines (before they were available) said they would most likely be at least a yearly booster, based on the nature of Coronaviruses and previous difficulty in making any kind of long-lasting Coronavirus vaccine based on more standard methods of vaccine-making.  I'd heard we might need boosters every six months.

So, the fact that these mRNA vaccines give even more robust and longer-lasting immunity than even catching and suffering through an actual infection.  Wowza.  And the 6-month-out data is fantastic - immunity is not waning in that time. 

Not only is it not surprising that we might need a once-a-year booster, that is actually better news than what I'd been hearing.  If you missed that boosters were part of what was expected, you might consider listening to different news sources.  Because that news was everywhere.  

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2 hours ago, Matryoshka said:

I almost never get a flu shot - I think 2-3 my whole life, in bad flu years.  I selectively vaccinated my kids.  I look at each vaccine individually and do a cost/benefit analysis.

This one is easy.  I got the first appointment I could when my group opened up.  I've had the first shot and am counting the days till the second.

If it makes it any easier, here most people are running out and getting it as soon as possible, so pretty much everyone I know over 16 has had 1-2 doses, all with no significant issues.  Including all my kids, who all have medical letters that they don't need to finish their 'normal' vax cycles because of a bad vax reaction to the measles shot. Some had day of achiness, headache, or low fever - although most have nothing at all past a sore arm for a day.  NBD.  SO MUCH BETTER than risking Covid.  

At this point many, many, many more people have been vaccinated than have been infected with Covid.  500,000+ dead from Covid in the US, that's not even including the huge numbers on top of that that had to be hospitalized or weren't that sick initially but ended up with 'long Covid'  vs. virtually no confirmed deaths related to the vaccine (I think there's that one from the J&J clotting).  Them's better odds.  (and I'd pick a mRNA vax over J&J at this point, if I had any choice).

This. 
 

“Just a virus” has killed 10x more Americans in a year than a terrible flu season. It has killed 3 million people worldwide in a year.

Get the vax.  

 

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I cannot tell you what to do. No one can.  I can tell you about my doubts about the vaccine. I can tell you the relief we had as a family when my BIL who is a doctor took Pfizer in Dec and is no longer isolating and the mental health effects of that. I can tell you how many in my mega family around the world took different vaccines from Pfizer, Moderna, Astra Zeneca, the Indian vaccine, the Chinese vaccine and yet, all are fine. 

Instead I will tell you what is happening in my country of origin, India.

They are running out of vaccines. People are being turned away.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/04/17/india/covid-vaccine-shortage-covishield-covaxin-intl-hnk-dst/index.html

They are running out of hospital beds. Ambulance queues with the living waiting for beds.

https://www.india.com/gujarat/no-hospital-beds-in-gujarat-ambulances-spotted-in-long-queues-outside-rajkot-hospital-watch-4594770/

Ambulance taking the bodies of the dead straight to the crematorium.

People are willing to vaccinate, they cannot. We also have Astra Zeneca Vaccine which has issues. But still it was going strong until they are running out. We are country of a billion people, this is what happens when supply does not meet demand.

if the "miracle drug" that the PP referred to that TBTB are not forthright about is Remdesivir, then India has banned exports of it because huge quantities are needed there and they are the primary maker of the drug.

I have the Pfizer first shot, my parents and inlaws got the Indian vaccine two shots and they were among the first to go after health care workers so I can visit them. I  planned to go in May, I have to travel 20 hours one way, to go. I cannot go now. I have never not in the 20 years I have been here not been able to get on a plane in a few hours notice and I have travelled during SARS and Ebola. It hurts me to my very soul that I may not be able to see my parents alive again. I have always had them come here almost every alternate year or I would go. So too my inlaws. Video is no substitute. Please know  I am not telling you any of this to guilt or shame you. These are just facts and for me, to defeat this disease we must work together. 

Edited by Dreamergal
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17 minutes ago, SeaConquest said:

Thanks, Bill, but I am just a student. I work with ECMO and Covid nurses in the ICU. They are the real heroes and are so burned out. I graduate next month (G-d willing). Hoping to work in either psych or the ICU, but the job market in SD is uber competitive. Can take 6-12 months to get a job, so it will probably mostly be over by the time I am working FT.

 

In my estimation EVERYONE working on the front lines is a hero!!!

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Bill

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Thank you, Dreamergal (and Amira, on the other thread), for putting this in a global context. The fact that Americans are turning down this vaccine while most of the world cannot get it (see Wathe's thread about the difficulty of getting vaccines in Canada, yet alone the rest of the world!) should be a stark reminder of the inanity and ridiculous privilege of the American populace that we even allow anti-vax misinformation to take up the same airspace as legitimate science. Most of this stuff is spread by Russian bots because Putin is a master at playing the long game. Yay, America!  

ETA: I remember living in Mexico, they didn't mess around. The Centro de Salud (Health Center) had a vacuna mobile (shot mobile) that would come to the school and just vaccinate your kids. No parental opt out forms for the crybabies. Kids got shots and they looked at you like you had 3 heads if you questioned it.

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1 minute ago, SeaConquest said:

Thank you, Dreamergal, for putting this in a global context. The fact that Americans are turning down this vaccine while most of the world cannot get it. (See Wathe's thread about the difficulty of getting vaccines in Canada, yet alone the rest of the world!) It should be a stark reminder of the inanity and ridiculous privilege of the American populace that we even allow anti-vax misinformation to take up the same airspace as legitimate science. Most of this stuff is spread by Russian bots because Putin is a master at playing the long game. Yay, America!  

Thank you.

It just breaks my heart that there are people needing vaccines and dying in some places and in others..

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Here's where I'm at right now.  Those of us in the "everyone else" group are probably in that group because we can withstand most short-term health challenges, whether from Covid or a "mostly safe" vax.  There are high risk people who aren't getting the vax because it could push them from high risk to very sick or dead.

If you believe the vax works to prevent spread, and that Covid is [still] a real threat in your community:  then, is it better for healthier people to take one for the team, or is it better to leave that to older / less healthy people?

My personal belief is (a) unless people are telling huge lies, the vax is proving effective, and (b) it makes more sense for me to get it than to expect people at risk of serious vax harm to either get it or isolate indefinitely.  I've already let everyone eager to get the vax go before me.  I'm not taking someone else's place in line.  So that's where I am.

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2 hours ago, Ellie said:

 

It's an infection that is 100% treatable with an existing, FDA-approved drug.

This is false. Verifiably, flat out false. On par with "the moon landing was faked" and "the earth is flat" false. 

As for boosters, we don't KNOW how often anyone will need boosters yet. It might be annually. It might not. We will be given that info when it is available - and there is NO WAY TO KNOW until antibodies start wearing off. They haven't done that yet. No one is hiding info on that - there just isn't info to give yet - other than at 6 months, they are working well and don't need a booster. 

 

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Also, at this point, many many millions of doses have been given, starting with the trials almost a year ago. At what point have enough people been vaccinated that you would feel safe getting it? If many million isn't enough to feel safe, what on earth would be? If nearly a year of trials and use, with good data 6 months out, isn't enough, what would be - keeping in mind that in the history of vaccines serious side effects are found within 8 weeks. 

Edited by ktgrok
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3 minutes ago, ktgrok said:

Also, at this point, many many millions of doses have been given, starting with the trials almost a year ago. At what point have enough people been vaccinated that you would feel safe getting it? If many million isn't enough to feel safe, what on earth would be? If nearly a year of trials and use, with good data 6 months out, isn't enough, what would be - keeping in mind that in the history of vaccines serious side effects are found within 8 weeks. 

Also this.  I will admit to being someone that is normally hesitant to be first-on-the-bandwagon for a new vaccine.   My kids got actual chicken pox rather than the (at that time) new vaccine because chicken pox has been around forever and is almost always NBD in kids and confers lifetime immunity in everyone, and at that point it wasn't yet clear that the vaccine wouldn't wear off and leave them vulnerable when they were adults and it's actually a more dangerous disease.  I also didn't get my kids the Gardasil vax.

BUT... the situation here is quite different.  This is not a long-time, well-known, well-understood disease like cpox.  Natural infection seems to have a very short immunity window.  It is much, much, much more deadly than anything else there's even a vaccine currently available for!  And much more infectious than anything else currently circulating (like, anti-Covid precautions led to almost NO flu cases this winter.  So WAY more infectious than that).  And, while even I was not wanting to be first on the list to get it, that wasn't even possible if I had wanted to, as I'm healthy and under 60yo.  So, by the time it was my turn, millions and millions of shots have been given, and it turns out that (in the opposite case of chicken pox) the immunity from the vaccine is longer-lasting than catching the disease.  So, as soon as my number came up, off I went, and very happy and grateful that the vaccine ended up being even so much better than I even thought it might be.  I mean, 95% with maybe a day of feeling a bit crummy?  Amazing.  Incredible.  Yay science.

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3 hours ago, Scarlett said:

This is my feeling too.  I never even get flu shots but boy you can bet I got the Covid Vaccine. 

Me too. I'm feeling the responsibility to not infect others with the flu. I never really thought of that before thinking about transmission for COVID.

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10 minutes ago, Kanin said:

Me too. I'm feeling the responsibility to not infect others with the flu. I never really thought of that before thinking about transmission for COVID.

Thank you! As a person with multiple loved ones for whom the flu can be very serious, thank you! I had to take my kids out of activities in the past because people considered it "just the flu" and were not taking any precautions. Those for whom it is NOT "just" the flu appreciate you taking it more seriously. ( I mean that, no shame or sarcasm, it's easy to not think it is a big deal until you know people for whom it is a big deal). 

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56 minutes ago, Kanin said:

Me too. I'm feeling the responsibility to not infect others with the flu. I never really thought of that before thinking about transmission for COVID.

Me too!  It wasn't until covid that I even noticed the number of flu deaths.  I don't want our country to be fine with tens of thousands of deaths every year.   I really didn't know.

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