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Mass shooting at a FedEx facility Indianapolis


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The morning news just said 7 died. There was an interview of a witness, but I didn’t turn up the volume because the little ones are already awake. 

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Why the hell anyone wants to come to this country is beyond me. 
 

At this point, are we really that different than any other war zone? You head to the coffee machine on a standard work break, theatre visit, restaurant, what have you, and next thing you know, you’re full of holes and out of your body. 
 

Sorry, I’m bitter this morning. And ready to shoot anyone (haha) who offers their “thoughts and prayers”. Keep ‘em. They’re not doing any good whatsoever. 

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This happened not that far from me. It’s not that surprising since almost everywhere I go here people are obviously armed. I’ve walked out of stores before because idiots have a gun shoved in the back of their pants. Most just carry at the side but most also look like they shouldn’t be anywhere near a weapon. Ds broke his lease and moved out of his off campus apartment because his 19 year old roommate started keeping a gun under the bed (and it’s apparently perfectly legal to do so here). I grew up with guns and know how to shoot, but what I see today just isn’t normal. 

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My daughter texted me yesterday that something was going on at school. I immediately thought it was a shooting. I can’t even keep up with all of the mass shootings. It’s so depressing. And it’s not going to get better. I’ve never owned a hand gun but the news these days makes me reconsider, even though I’m aware of the statistics. It feels so hopeless. 

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23 minutes ago, Joker2 said:

This happened not that far from me. It’s not that surprising since almost everywhere I go here people are obviously armed. I’ve walked out of stores before because idiots have a gun shoved in the back of their pants. Most just carry at the side but most also look like they shouldn’t be anywhere near a weapon. Ds broke his lease and moved out of his off campus apartment because his 19 year old roommate started keeping a gun under the bed (and it’s apparently perfectly legal to do so here). I grew up with guns and know how to shoot, but what I see today just isn’t normal. 

Indianapolis is certainly having an awful time of it this year. The 17 yo charged with killing his family supposedly after the fight with his dad and the boyfriend charged with killing his ex-girlfriend’s family supposedly over her stimulus check and now this. I’m sure there are other things that didn’t make national news

:sad:

 

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41 minutes ago, Joker2 said:

This happened not that far from me. It’s not that surprising since almost everywhere I go here people are obviously armed. I’ve walked out of stores before because idiots have a gun shoved in the back of their pants. Most just carry at the side but most also look like they shouldn’t be anywhere near a weapon. Ds broke his lease and moved out of his off campus apartment because his 19 year old roommate started keeping a gun under the bed (and it’s apparently perfectly legal to do so here). I grew up with guns and know how to shoot, but what I see today just isn’t normal. 

It’s a form of madness. Montana just passed a Bill that now allows students to do permitless open carry almost everywhere on campus, INCLUDING DORMS. Like, what could go wrong with drunken 18-yos partying with weapons? The bill also limits colleges’ abilities to place further restrictions on guns, with a very few exceptions for certain events/venues. DS had MT State on his list and we instantly removed it.
 

It seems like no one has common sense anymore and it definitely isn’t normal. It’s right in line with things like Q, the Woke mob, etc. People are losing their minds. 

Edited by Happy2BaMom
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1 hour ago, pinball said:

Indianapolis is certainly having an awful time of it this year. The 17 yo charged with killing his family supposedly after the fight with his dad and the boyfriend charged with killing his ex-girlfriend’s family supposedly over her stimulus check and now this. I’m sure there are other things that didn’t make national news

:sad:

 

 

58 minutes ago, Happy2BaMom said:

It’s a form of madness. It seems like no one has common sense anymore and it definitely isn’t normal. It’s right in line with things like Q, the Woke mob, etc. People are losing their minds. 

Why do stories about a 17yo killing his family make it to national news? Surely it’s tragic, but it isn’t something I need to know living in the western US. Does knowing about such stories add or take away from my well-being?  
 

Knowing every bad thing that happens anywhere in the US let alone the world must contribute to mental illness. I don’t see how it wouldn’t. 
 

The only comparison I can make is if the news in the EU reported every bad thing that happened anywhere in the EU. It doesn’t matter if you live in a rural part of France, you will hear every bad thing that happens in Estonia or Bulgaria or Finland. 
 

So many times I read a post from the local news about some tragedy or abused animal only to find out once I clicked that it happened on the other side of the country. Why don’t they put the location in their title? Because they want people to think it happened locally so they will click. There’s tragedies happening all over the world. It doesn’t do my or anyone’s mental  health any good to have every one of them etched into our consciousness. 
 

I just think we need to really weigh what news we bring into our homes, our lives, our minds. I really do believe our pocket impending doom notifications are contributing to mental illness everywhere.
 

I don’t think our brains are able to handle being constantly bombarded with this type and level of information. We tend to localize it even when it happens somewhere far far away in a place we’ve never been and to people we’ve never met.  

 

It’s also contributing to the epidemic of mass shootings. 

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2 hours ago, Plum said:

 

Why do stories about a 17yo killing his family make it to national news? Surely it’s tragic, but it isn’t something I need to know living in the western US. Does knowing about such stories add or take away from my well-being?  
 

Knowing every bad thing that happens anywhere in the US let alone the world must contribute to mental illness. I don’t see how it wouldn’t. 
 

The only comparison I can make is if the news in the EU reported every bad thing that happened anywhere in the EU. It doesn’t matter if you live in a rural part of France, you will hear every bad thing that happens in Estonia or Bulgaria or Finland. 
 

So many times I read a post from the local news about some tragedy or abused animal only to find out once I clicked that it happened on the other side of the country. Why don’t they put the location in their title? Because they want people to think it happened locally so they will click. There’s tragedies happening all over the world. It doesn’t do my or anyone’s mental  health any good to have every one of them etched into our consciousness. 
 

I just think we need to really weigh what news we bring into our homes, our lives, our minds. I really do believe our pocket impending doom notifications are contributing to mental illness everywhere.
 

I don’t think our brains are able to handle being constantly bombarded with this type and level of information. We tend to localize it even when it happens somewhere far far away in a place we’ve never been and to people we’ve never met.  

 

It’s also contributing to the epidemic of mass shootings. 

You're so right.

John Eldredge said something that really was true for me. He said that our hearts are village sized. We were not meant to carry the burdens of every community globally. It's too much. I really also think that it gives us empathy fatigue. We can't carry on this way because it's exhausting.

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3 hours ago, Happy2BaMom said:

DS had MT State on his list and we instantly removed it.

Please let them know why! I know it's not their decision, but maybe if students and parents push back, then colleges will start to push back. 

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48 minutes ago, fairfarmhand said:

You're so right.

John Eldredge said something that really was true for me. He said that our hearts are village sized. We were not meant to carry the burdens of every community globally. It's too much. I really also think that it gives us empathy fatigue. We can't carry on this way because it's exhausting.

Yes. I like to give to charity and I feel bad when I can’t give to everything. I have to force myself to focus on the few charities that I faithfully support and tell myself that I can only help a few and everyone else has to help the rest. The idea that I’m helping one village worth of charities is exactly what it is like.  I simply can’t help everyone or feel bad for everyone. It’s impossible. 

There are many, many days where I wish I could focus only on what goes on in my own little town and not get bombarded with what’s going on around the entire nation or world. I can’t do a blasted thing about 99% of it.

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I agree with Plum and FairFarmhand that it is not good for our mental health to deal emotional with every tragedy in the world. Especially when you stop to think how often we hear good news from around the world. 😕 It is very lopsided that we hear about this one families tragedies but not this other families joy or victory. It gives us a very lopsided view of the world.  

 

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4 hours ago, Plum said:

 

Why do stories about a 17yo killing his family make it to national news? Surely it’s tragic, but it isn’t something I need to know living in the western US. Does knowing about such stories add or take away from my well-being?  
 

Knowing every bad thing that happens anywhere in the US let alone the world must contribute to mental illness. I don’t see how it wouldn’t. 
 

The only comparison I can make is if the news in the EU reported every bad thing that happened anywhere in the EU. It doesn’t matter if you live in a rural part of France, you will hear every bad thing that happens in Estonia or Bulgaria or Finland. 
 

So many times I read a post from the local news about some tragedy or abused animal only to find out once I clicked that it happened on the other side of the country. Why don’t they put the location in their title? Because they want people to think it happened locally so they will click. There’s tragedies happening all over the world. It doesn’t do my or anyone’s mental  health any good to have every one of them etched into our consciousness. 
 

I just think we need to really weigh what news we bring into our homes, our lives, our minds. I really do believe our pocket impending doom notifications are contributing to mental illness everywhere.
 

I don’t think our brains are able to handle being constantly bombarded with this type and level of information. We tend to localize it even when it happens somewhere far far away in a place we’ve never been and to people we’ve never met.  

 

It’s also contributing to the epidemic of mass shootings. 

I’m confused.

first, let me say, you can watch whatever you want and what I have to say has no impact on your personal decisions, so don’t think I’m saying citizens need to watch or read any particular news item.

do you mean it is OK for certain crimes to be national news and other crimes aren’t?

 

 

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The shooter has been identified and was only 19. Apparently, police were called to his home just over a year ago as he was suicidal and had just purchased a gun. Mental health care in this country sucks and so do our so called gun laws.

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28 minutes ago, pinball said:

I’m confused.

first, let me say, you can watch whatever you want and what I have to say has no impact on your personal decisions, so don’t think I’m saying citizens need to watch or read any particular news item.

do you mean it is OK for certain crimes to be national news and other crimes aren’t?

 

 

Your post and the other I linked just got me thinking. That’s all. We all can watch what we want. I do think it would be wise to consider what we take in on a daily basis just like we watch what our kids take in. It’s up to me to decide what I want to know about and seek it out rather than passively letting it all fill my head. 

I can’t say what should or shouldn’t be a national story, nor can anyone else. That is out of my control. Unless we as a nation take a long hard look at mental illness, our news, our social media and these shootings, we will never truly know what is going on here. 

The news isn’t going to stop reporting the way they are currently unless they collectively decide it is in the best interest of the nation like in suicides and naming a minor.

They have a responsibility to report the truth, not to speculate or hypothesize until the truth gets buried. If it were me, I don’t think I’d want my family tragedy to be speculated about or used as a monetization tool for national news unless there was some lesson in it for others. 

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6 hours ago, Plum said:

 

Why do stories about a 17yo killing his family make it to national news? Surely it’s tragic, but it isn’t something I need to know living in the western US. Does knowing about such stories add or take away from my well-being?  
 

Knowing every bad thing that happens anywhere in the US let alone the world must contribute to mental illness. I don’t see how it wouldn’t. 
 

The only comparison I can make is if the news in the EU reported every bad thing that happened anywhere in the EU. It doesn’t matter if you live in a rural part of France, you will hear every bad thing that happens in Estonia or Bulgaria or Finland. 
 

So many times I read a post from the local news about some tragedy or abused animal only to find out once I clicked that it happened on the other side of the country. Why don’t they put the location in their title? Because they want people to think it happened locally so they will click. There’s tragedies happening all over the world. It doesn’t do my or anyone’s mental  health any good to have every one of them etched into our consciousness. 
 

I just think we need to really weigh what news we bring into our homes, our lives, our minds. I really do believe our pocket impending doom notifications are contributing to mental illness everywhere.
 

I don’t think our brains are able to handle being constantly bombarded with this type and level of information. We tend to localize it even when it happens somewhere far far away in a place we’ve never been and to people we’ve never met.  

 

It’s also contributing to the epidemic of mass shootings. 

Agree with this.  

 

I am in Indy.  In fact.....my dad used to work at the aircraft maintenance facility that was just across I 70 from the location.  He retired in July.  My brother and his wife actually worked at the facility this happened, but it was over a decade ago.  And even with all that, I really can't process this as if I have some kind of actual connection, because I don't. 

 

There is a LOT of tragedy across the world every single day.  Our brains are not capable of processing all of them. 

 

Your last sentence.......that's the biggie.  I think that these last few months just really demonstrate that pretty clearly. 

 

 

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Compassion fatigue is real.  We all need to do what we need to do to manage our news intake and tend to our own mental health.

 

And at the same time: empathy is the capacity to hold the pain of other people. Not to avoid it or deny it, but acknowledge it. Which is life-affirming in the first order, and becomes a source of  fuel for constructive change in the second order.

Ruth Messinger, one of my life teachers, often comes back to different variants of the concept that "we must not retreat into the convenience of being overwhelmed."

Quote

[People] talk about the frustratingly slow pace at which change occurs, how many setbacks arise, how many different issues and challenges there are competing for their attention. Often, people say that it is too much, that they are overwhelmed because they cannot do everything, they cannot do anything.

I certainly reassure them we all feel this way some of the time, but ..to use that as an excuse to move away from work for social justice is a convenient out... It is our responsibility to work through the feeling of being overwhelmed, find ways in which we can make a difference, and remember our tradition teaches that to save one life is to save the world.

I think about that a lot.  I also curate my news.

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While I agree that constant bombardment of all of the worlds' tragedies contributes to mental illness and emotional fatigue, I don't think we should bury our heads in the sand and pretend these problems will go away.  Action is needed.

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14 minutes ago, Amy in NH said:

While I agree that constant bombardment of all of the worlds' tragedies contributes to mental illness and emotional fatigue, I don't think we should bury our heads in the sand and pretend these problems will go away.  Action is needed.

I don't disagree.

 

But I want to put forth the idea that I think broadly applies.  At least in terms of the concepts of Plum's post that I agree with...

"we can't save them all."

 

As a person, I literally cannot advance change or betterment in ALL THE THINGS that need that sort of thing.  I can't help the border crisis, help gun control problems, help domestic violence problems, help child abuse problems, help education reform, help child hunger, help girls become strong women, help education reform, help police training reform, help support transparent elections, etc etc etc etc...pick ANY issue of your choice......as an individual person....I literally cannot do all those things all at the same time.   And I certainly cannot do it while also putting my kids lives back together from their own personal tragedy (which...yes I have mine but the truth is, we ALL have our own tragedies at any one given moment)  and while working to feed them nutritionally responsible meals as much as I can, and supporting my extended family through the additional family issues, oh and, yeah "self care" and so on and so on and so on.

 

Every human has to pick and choose what they have the mental capacity to care about and then....recognize that they aren't capable of taking ALL THE ACTION.   It's not wrong to make a choice about the things you can care about and then choose to even...gasp...ignore the rest.

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1 hour ago, Pam in CT said:

Compassion fatigue is real.  We all need to do what we need to do to manage our news intake and tend to our own mental health.

 

And at the same time: empathy is the capacity to hold the pain of other people. Not to avoid it or deny it, but acknowledge it. Which is life-affirming in the first order, and becomes a source of  fuel for constructive change in the second order.

Ruth Messinger, one of my life teachers, often comes back to different variants of the concept that "we must not retreat into the convenience of being overwhelmed."

I think about that a lot.  I also curate my news.

That full link is so worth reading and very convicting to me (I’m prone to noticing but taking no action).

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5 hours ago, Joker2 said:

The shooter has been identified and was only 19. Apparently, police were called to his home just over a year ago as he was suicidal and had just purchased a gun. Mental health care in this country sucks and so do our so called gun laws.

I'm extremely concerned about the state of mental health after this past year with lockdowns, job loss, Covid deaths and illnesses, closed schools, riots, business losses, and so many lonely and isolated people. 

 

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I’ve seen that half of those killed were members of the Indy Sikh community. 
 

ETA: It looks like they are expecting it to be more as they make up the majority of employees at that site. 😔

Edited by Joker2
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Apparently the employees aren't allowed access to their cell phones during work and so weren't able to use them to call for help of contact family after.  Fed Ex is reviewing the policy.  Family members were tweeting at the police for help in the aftermath.  The poor families.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/fedex-indianapolis-cell-phone-policy-employee-shooting/

 

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17 hours ago, happysmileylady said:

I don't disagree.

 

But I want to put forth the idea that I think broadly applies.  At least in terms of the concepts of Plum's post that I agree with...

"we can't save them all."

 

As a person, I literally cannot advance change or betterment in ALL THE THINGS that need that sort of thing.  I can't help the border crisis, help gun control problems, help domestic violence problems, help child abuse problems, help education reform, help child hunger, help girls become strong women, help education reform, help police training reform, help support transparent elections, etc etc etc etc...pick ANY issue of your choice......as an individual person....I literally cannot do all those things all at the same time.   And I certainly cannot do it while also putting my kids lives back together from their own personal tragedy (which...yes I have mine but the truth is, we ALL have our own tragedies at any one given moment)  and while working to feed them nutritionally responsible meals as much as I can, and supporting my extended family through the additional family issues, oh and, yeah "self care" and so on and so on and so on.

 

Every human has to pick and choose what they have the mental capacity to care about and then....recognize that they aren't capable of taking ALL THE ACTION.   It's not wrong to make a choice about the things you can care about and then choose to even...gasp...ignore the rest.

I mean, you can do all of that to the extent that you vote with your dollars and your electoral ballots.

Support political candidates that work toward betterment in a majority of those areas - no one politician is perfect, but choose ones who are trying to make a difference. 

And support businesses which support those causes, while also purposely not supporting businesses that detract from them.

And you can be a voice, particularly if you come from a place of privilege.  Amplify injustice instead of trying to bury it, so that others will be compelled to take action.

Not saying you personally don't already do those things - this is a general "you". 
Also, we can always re-evaluate our personal actions on this front.

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2 minutes ago, Amy in NH said:

I mean, you can do all of that to the extent that you vote with your dollars and your electoral ballots.

Support political candidates that work toward betterment in a majority of those areas - no one politician is perfect, but choose ones who are trying to make a difference. 

And support businesses which support those causes, while also purposely not supporting businesses that detract from them.

And you can be a voice, particularly if you come from a place of privilege.  Amplify injustice instead of trying to bury it, so that others will be compelled to take action.

Not saying you personally don't already do those things - this is a general "you". 
Also, we can always re-evaluate our personal actions on this front.

QFT.

Learning to do all of the above has been particularly empowering for my teen. 

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21 hours ago, Amy in NH said:

While I agree that constant bombardment of all of the worlds' tragedies contributes to mental illness and emotional fatigue, I don't think we should bury our heads in the sand and pretend these problems will go away.  Action is needed.

I don't think curating my news down to what is important for me to know and what is within my control is avoiding or denying it. I know it all exists out there. At least I seek out information. There's a good number of people out there that don't watch the news and they go about living their lives happy and healthy and productive. There are most certainly issues that affect every single one of us that deserve national attention. And then there are local stories that effect locals but don't have a direct impact on my life. Do I really need to know about a teenager that got into a car accident in FL? Do I really need to know about how an animal in OH was horrifically abused? I don't know about you, but I cannot bear witness to every tragedy and be ok in the morning.

I think we would all be better off if we honestly look at what we can change around us. What is within our control and what is external to us. I can be a good person. I can write to my representatives. I can elect my local officials. I can vote to change my laws locally. I can't control other people no matter how much I would like to sometimes. 

I'm seeing more and more people with anxiety and depression, more than ever before. Isn't it at all possible that phones, social media, MSM and how much negativity we take might in have something to do with that? 

FTR  I've seen enough of these threads and know how they usually go. I've posted about Malcolm Gladwell and Mother Jones research into shootings and how this suicidal idea has been firmly planted in our collective minds. Mass shooting is a viable option for a few messed up people out there. So what do we do about it?  I have been pushing No Notoriety's mission for years. I think it's helped, but there is more that can be done. I'm not claiming I have the answers or want to tell everyone what news they should consume. I'm only asking questions about whether it's a good idea to plow ahead with taking in so much bad news and what it could be doing to our mental health as a whole. For some there is a fame or infamy component of social media that plays a role in these shootings. Rankings and body counts in headlines have been proven to encourage some who might be on the edge, but I still see them. Mass shootings are a contagion and it is being spread by all of us, in social media, in the dark underbelly of the internet and glorified by the MSM for ratings.  

Sorry it's choppy. I started this post yesterday and then had to make dinner and forgot to come back to it. At least I remembered to come back to it and didn't mentally check it off in my head that I posted it already only to find the conversation has moved on 3 pages. Cause that never happens to me. 😉

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3 hours ago, Amy in NH said:



And you can be a voice, particularly if you come from a place of privilege.  Amplify injustice instead of trying to bury it, so that others will be compelled to take action.
 

Explain.This always seem so fuzzy. I always feel like I am being yelled at for not doing enough, but do not know what to do?

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2 hours ago, Plum said:

I don't think curating my news down to what is important for me to know and what is within my control is avoiding or denying it. I know it all exists out there. At least I seek out information. There's a good number of people out there that don't watch the news and they go about living their lives happy and healthy and productive. There are most certainly issues that affect every single one of us that deserve national attention. And then there are local stories that effect locals but don't have a direct impact on my life. Do I really need to know about a teenager that got into a car accident in FL? Do I really need to know about how an animal in OH was horrifically abused? I don't know about you, but I cannot bear witness to every tragedy and be ok in the morning.

I think we would all be better off if we honestly look at what we can change around us. What is within our control and what is external to us. I can be a good person. I can write to my representatives. I can elect my local officials. I can vote to change my laws locally. I can't control other people no matter how much I would like to sometimes. 

I'm seeing more and more people with anxiety and depression, more than ever before. Isn't it at all possible that phones, social media, MSM and how much negativity we take might in have something to do with that? 

FTR  I've seen enough of these threads and know how they usually go. I've posted about Malcolm Gladwell and Mother Jones research into shootings and how this suicidal idea has been firmly planted in our collective minds. Mass shooting is a viable option for a few messed up people out there. So what do we do about it?  I have been pushing No Notoriety's mission for years. I think it's helped, but there is more that can be done. I'm not claiming I have the answers or want to tell everyone what news they should consume. I'm only asking questions about whether it's a good idea to plow ahead with taking in so much bad news and what it could be doing to our mental health as a whole. For some there is a fame or infamy component of social media that plays a role in these shootings. Rankings and body counts in headlines have been proven to encourage some who might be on the edge, but I still see them. Mass shootings are a contagion and it is being spread by all of us, in social media, in the dark underbelly of the internet and glorified by the MSM for ratings.  

Sorry it's choppy. I started this post yesterday and then had to make dinner and forgot to come back to it. At least I remembered to come back to it and didn't mentally check it off in my head that I posted it already only to find the conversation has moved on 3 pages. Cause that never happens to me. 😉

I agree with all of this. 

In reality, my sphere of influence is remarkably small. I vote, I donate to one organisation, and I help kids read. Sometimes I protest/march on indigenous, climate and refugee issues. Other than the literacy remediation, I'm not sure any of it is wildly effective. But that's the circle of good I can do. It has to be enough because it can't be more. 

So what good does it do me or the world to delve into every injustice going via endless interaction with news? I'm someone very interested in news, and I've come to think that it's not such an admirable trait - that in some ways it's an avoidance of the small, the local, the home, the self. I'm better off spending that time walking by the river, watching the pelicans, and the world is no worse off. 

I cannot agree more with No Notoriety. Excellent approach. 

 

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On 4/17/2021 at 4:26 PM, TexasProud said:

Explain.This always seem so fuzzy. I always feel like I am being yelled at for not doing enough, but do not know what to do?

Using racism as an example, but this also works amplifying the voices of other marginalized and oppressed groups such as LGBTQ+, etc.:

If you have a presence on social media, you can include some anti-racist articles and links in your daily posting.  It could be something about how BIPOC are disproportionately affected by many problems - be it health, violence, education, climate change, etc.  It could be about BIPOC achievements in all fields from science to literature.  It could be about legislative initiatives or legislators who support or oppose racist actions. 

Posting something different each day, a good mix, to let all of your friends and family members know that these are important issues, can change the social narrative about BIPOC and open people's eyes to injustice, causing them to also take action.  We need to reach a tipping point of awareness and action in order to make broad social changes.  IMO, if you aren't already aware ie. "woke" (some people say this like awareness is a bad thing?), having some stranger yelling at you about things outside your personal experience is likely to make you turn your back and dismiss it, but if someone you know and trust brings it into your awareness you are more likely to give it some thought; the more people you know who are talking about it and/or affected, the more likely you are to become engaged in the social action.

Here is a great list of pages you can follow to re-post articles:

If you know of an organized peaceful protest, you can also amplify voices by showing up and adding yours.
You can also call your legislators to express your position before a vote in your state or federal legislature.

Edited by Amy in NH
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I link to articles or honestly my new friens who are Black young women and their work as well.  Or another friend who is white married to a black man who wrote a fabulous piece about her Christian response when someone called her kid a fing n... on a Zoom call.  But I get crickets.  I am already posting tgese kind of things once a week.  No one ever responds.  The only time I ever get comments is on fun family stuff. 

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On 4/17/2021 at 3:20 PM, Plum said:

I don't think curating my news down to what is important for me to know and what is within my control is avoiding or denying it. I know it all exists out there. At least I seek out information. There's a good number of people out there that don't watch the news and they go about living their lives happy and healthy and productive. There are most certainly issues that affect every single one of us that deserve national attention...

[SNIP]

So, this implies that if it doesn't happen locally or affect you personally, then you don't want to know about it.  But, like the butterfly effect, everything affects you personally in some way in the long run. 

For example, if some teen dies in a car accident in another state, don't you want to know if it was caused by faulty equipment, distracted driving due to a carload of friends, or a lack of education?  Might many similar stories change what you would do with your own teen driver?

For another example, if people in Georgia and Texas change their laws to disenfranchise a particular group of people in order to suppress political opposition to their minority platform, then you will be impacted when the groups chosen by those state-level fascists (defined as form of authoritarian ultra-nationalism characterized by dictatorial power, forcible suppression of opposition and strong regimentation of society and of the economy) become national-level fascists and re-write all of your laws.

Would you rather act pro-actively or re-actively to make the world a better place for everyone? It behooves us to know what is going on in the world.

 

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3 minutes ago, TexasProud said:

I link to articles or honestly my new friens who are Black young women and their work as well.  Or another friend who is white married to a black man who wrote a fabulous piece about her Christian response when someone called her kid a fing n... on a Zoom call.  But I get crickets.  I am already posting tgese kind of things once a week.  No one ever responds.  The only time I ever get comments is on fun family stuff. 

You don't need responses in order to amplify voices.  People quietly take note.

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4 minutes ago, TexasProud said:

Or quietly ostracize you.

Maybe, but that’s on them, not on you. 

It seems like you are in direct opposition to most of the people you know on many issues, and it’s hard to be stuck between a rock and a hard place. You feel like you can’t win.

Either you do what you believe is right and accept the consequences, or you go along with the crowd even though you believe they are wrong. 

You talk a lot about how important these friends are to you, but to be honest, they don’t sound like particularly nice people.

The biggest problem here seems to be that your own dh is one of the people you disagree with, and these are BIG issues.

I wish I knew how to advise you, but I don’t. I’m sorry you feel so alone.

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57 minutes ago, Amy in NH said:

So, this implies that if it doesn't happen locally or affect you personally, then you don't want to know about it.  But, like the butterfly effect, everything affects you personally in some way in the long run. 

For example, if some teen dies in a car accident in another state, don't you want to know if it was caused by faulty equipment, distracted driving due to a carload of friends, or a lack of education?  Might many similar stories change what you would do with your own teen driver?

For another example, if people in Georgia and Texas change their laws to disenfranchise a particular group of people in order to suppress political opposition to their minority platform, then you will be impacted when the groups chosen by those state-level fascists (defined as form of authoritarian ultra-nationalism characterized by dictatorial power, forcible suppression of opposition and strong regimentation of society and of the economy) become national-level fascists and re-write all of your laws.

Would you rather act pro-actively or re-actively to make the world a better place for everyone? It behooves us to know what is going on in the world.

 

No I said "There are most certainly issues that affect every single one of us that deserve national attention."

I could nitpick every point but I have to get started with school. If it were faulty equipment and a part of a recall, then I would likely find out about it if I had that brand and model. Carloads of teens are nothing new. I sent my oldest to a defensive driving course that had police officers there to give first hand stories. That has more impact than anything read or watched in the news. 

Fascists, defined as form of authoritarian ultra-nationalism characterized by dictatorial power, forcible suppression of opposition and strong regimentation of society and of the economy, can also define people who want to force people to do and see everything exactly how they see it with no exceptions, aka cancel culture. 

I don't think we are going to agree on this. Not everyone has to be marching out in the streets or on social media to make a difference in other people's lives. There are countless other ways to be a good productive citizen. If I don't watch the news does that make a bad citizen? Is that really all it takes since I pay my taxes, don't break laws, raise my children, help my neighbors, clean up trash in my neighborhood, vote, etc.

Yes, I should know about things that matter in the world, that doesn't mean I have to sacrifice my mental health, time with my family, and exhaust all of my friends by posting political rhetoric to do so. My FIL alienated his friends and family and sacrificed a relationship with his son and grandchildren to research, consult politicians and speak in the media about politics and foreign policy in order to try to make the world a better place and bring awareness. It's easy for politics to be overly consuming. I have no intention of going there or doing any such thing. 

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10 minutes ago, TexasProud said:

Or quietly ostracize you.

And that's where anti-racism breaks down and becomes complacent acceptance of racism and adjacent racism.  If we know better, and choose not to do better because we fear judgment from the people around us who support the injustice, we must view ourselves as complicit in perpetuating that injustice.  Silence becomes endorsement of the injustice.

What other people think of you is neither your concern nor your business.  Perhaps it is time to find different "friends"?

 

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15 minutes ago, Amy in NH said:

And that's where anti-racism breaks down and becomes complacent acceptance of racism and adjacent racism.  If we know better, and choose not to do better because we fear judgment from the people around us who support the injustice, we must view ourselves as complicit in perpetuating that injustice.  Silence becomes endorsement of the injustice.

What other people think of you is neither your concern nor your business.  Perhaps it is time to find different "friends"?

 

Agreed.

One other thought — Texas, what if some of your friends are “quietly agreeing with you?” You don’t really know that they are “quietly ostracizing you,” do you?  Why are you assuming that no one feels the same way you do? They may simply lack the courage to come right out and agree with you, but if you continue doing what you believe is right, maybe they will get up their nerve to stand with you.

Edited by Catwoman
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3 minutes ago, Plum said:

No I said "There are most certainly issues that affect every single one of us that deserve national attention."

Yes, and that can be taken to mean that you are only interested in issues that "affect every single one of us". 
The implication is that issues that affect only some of us, or happen outside your insular local community, aren't important to you.

I could nitpick every point but I have to get started with school. If it were faulty equipment and a part of a recall, then I would likely find out about it if I had that brand and model. Carloads of teens are nothing new. I sent my oldest to a defensive driving course that had police officers there to give first hand stories. That has more impact than anything read or watched in the news. 

Fascists, defined as form of authoritarian ultra-nationalism characterized by dictatorial power, forcible suppression of opposition and strong regimentation of society and of the economy, can also define people who want to force people to do and see everything exactly how they see it with no exceptions, aka cancel culture. 

No, actually fascism has a definition that does not include what you wrote.

What I've noticed is that when people who are entrenched in systems that benefit them while oppressing others are upset when their unjust system is revised to become more equitable, they are quick to call it "cancel culture" in a derisive tone.  These same people are also mighty quick to "cancel" their opponents.

I don't think we are going to agree on this. Not everyone has to be marching out in the streets or on social media to make a difference in other people's lives. There are countless other ways to be a good productive citizen. If I don't watch the news does that make a bad citizen? Is that really all it takes since I pay my taxes, don't break laws, raise my children, help my neighbors, clean up trash in my neighborhood, vote, etc.

I think we do agree about the bolded. I provided those examples as an answer to a direct question.
IMO, watching the news has nothing to do with being a good citizen - civic engagement does.  What that looks like will vary.

Yes, I should know about things that matter in the world, that doesn't mean I have to sacrifice my mental health, time with my family, and exhaust all of my friends by posting political rhetoric to do so. My FIL alienated his friends and family and sacrificed a relationship with his son and grandchildren to research, consult and speak in the media about politics and foreign policy in order to try to make the world a better place and bring awareness. It's easy for politics to be overly consuming. I have no intention of going there or doing any such thing.

 

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49 minutes ago, Amy in NH said:

And that's where anti-racism breaks down and becomes complacent acceptance of racism and adjacent racism.  If we know better, and choose not to do better because we fear judgment from the people around us who support the injustice, we must view ourselves as complicit in perpetuating that injustice.  Silence becomes endorsement of the injustice.

What other people think of you is neither your concern nor your business.  Perhaps it is time to find different "friends"?

 

I don’t know what they think because I never see them!!! The only time I talk to people is when I am at places with them.  I never talk to people outside of church or when youngest was in public school at football games.  This one year of homeschooling has put me off the grid.  I was rarely home before Covid hit.  I had groups or extracurricular with kids every day.  Now.  I have no clue.

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11 minutes ago, TexasProud said:

I don’t know what they think because I never see them!!! The only time I talk to people is when I am at places with them.  I never talk to people outside of church or when youngest was in public school at football games.  This one year of homeschooling has put me off the grid.  I was rarely home before Covid hit.  I had groups or extracurricular with kids every day.  Now.  I have no clue.

Can’t you call anyone on the phone to talk? How about texting or emailing them?

You don’t have to see people in person in order to stay in touch with them.

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4 minutes ago, Catwoman said:

Can’t you call anyone on the phone to talk? How about texting or emailing them?

You don’t have to see people in person in order to stay in touch with them.

That just feels weird to me. Don’t have a clue what we would talk about if it wa not for band fundraising, or the next play about to be performed.  I mean what do you talk about?

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57 minutes ago, Amy in NH said:

What I've noticed is that when people who are entrenched in systems that benefit them while oppressing others are upset when their unjust system is revised to become more equitable, they are quick to call it "cancel culture" in a derisive tone.  These same people are also mighty quick to "cancel" their opponents.

 

Who am I trying to cancel? 

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14 minutes ago, TexasProud said:

That just feels weird to me. Don’t have a clue what we would talk about if it wa not for band fundraising, or the next play about to be performed.  I mean what do you talk about?

Ok, wait a minute.

You don’t even know what to talk to these people about, yet you consider them to be friends and you value their opinions very highly???

This makes no sense.

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4 hours ago, TexasProud said:

I link to articles or honestly my new friens who are Black young women and their work as well.  Or another friend who is white married to a black man who wrote a fabulous piece about her Christian response when someone called her kid a fing n... on a Zoom call.  But I get crickets.  I am already posting tgese kind of things once a week.  No one ever responds.  The only time I ever get comments is on fun family stuff. 

I don't think social media works to change minds. Either you end up preaching to the choir, or people who disagree with you ignore (at best) or attack (at worst).

I agree with my sibling on 99% of politics, and yet I'm only on FB to see pics of my niece. Even agreeing, I'm not going to interact daily with their endless political posts. I realize yours are less frequent. 

Best you can hope with social media is that once in a while, someone quietly reads and considers. But in general, posting on social media is not wildly effective advocacy. 

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1 hour ago, Catwoman said:

Ok, wait a minute.

You don’t even know what to talk to these people about, yet you consider them to be friends and you value their opinions very highly???

This makes no sense.

I dont know that I value their opinion highly. I just miss having places to go and people to talk to.  But about fun things or things going on. Probably why I have a ton of acquaintances and no close friends.  Heck my husband and I dont talk about much other than logistics. 

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Social ostracism is an extremely painful experience for humans. Only very hardy souls can willingly embrace it. I'd be willing to bet most of us don't.

~

Most of the news I am interested in has zero effect on my life. That's part of the attraction. I truly believe my energy is better spent on almost anything other than being up to date, in granular detail, on what's happening in another state or country. Does it add to the world that I know the jury in the Chauvin trial just retired to consider their verdict? No.

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On 4/17/2021 at 12:28 PM, Amy in NH said:

I mean, you can do all of that to the extent that you vote with your dollars and your electoral ballots.

Support political candidates that work toward betterment in a majority of those areas - no one politician is perfect, but choose ones who are trying to make a difference. 

And support businesses which support those causes, while also purposely not supporting businesses that detract from them.

And you can be a voice, particularly if you come from a place of privilege.  Amplify injustice instead of trying to bury it, so that others will be compelled to take action.

Not saying you personally don't already do those things - this is a general "you". 
Also, we can always re-evaluate our personal actions on this front.

No politician is perfect...

 

The thing is, no *choice* of anything you listed, is perfect.  People are way more nuanced than one position or another.  To give a made up example....lets say I want to support a local restaurant because they do a great deal to fight childhood hunger in a way I support.  Excellent, I vote with my dollar bills there.  But, what if they also support PETA, something I might completely oppose?  So then, I have to choose, do I support their efforts in the area I support by patronizing their business, or do I disavow their positions with PETA, and boycott them?  Again, that's a completely made up example, but the point is, everything you list is not actually as simple as you make it sound.  And to bring that back to my earlier point, it's not wrong to then turn around and decide that trying to support businesses based on their political position is simply not worth the time and effort.   It just takes too much time and effort to delve deep into every political position, charity donation, etc of all the various owners/board members etc.....when maybe all I really wanna do buy a laundry hamper. 

 

Which does really all support the idea that there's a limit to what our brains and bodies can process and act on.  We simply cannot work to end all injustice, all the time, all across the world, in every single issue.  I think that being being bombarded constantly by the media with all of the wrongs and tragedy all over the world gives this impression that we are supposed to, and I don't think it's healthy.

 

Priorities are healthy.

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