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AP Physics C vs College Physics


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Can anyone give me pros or cons to one versus the other? I am trying to decide between AP Physics vs College Physics(calculus base). I am trying to figure out which one is the better for a younger math and stem kid. He is a rising 8th grader. He has already completed Calc BC and is taking Thinkwell Honors Physics this year. 

He's had experience taking college classes.

Edited by SDMomof3
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  • SDMomof3 changed the title to AP Physics C vs College Physics

Unless he's really into physics, I'm not sure I would do physics two years in a row. Otherwise, I'm afraid the answer is, "it depends". A good professor for a college class wins our vote over an online AP class, even a very good one. However, there is definitely more student interaction in between students in a college class. My dd has had some very interesting lab partners, lol. ETA- see regentrude's comment. The calc-based physics course is often called "University Physics"

Edited by MamaSprout
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"College Physics" is algebra based and will not satisfy the requirements for science and engineering majors ( with the exception of biology). Those would require University Physics which is calculus based. While AP Physics C does give credit for it, I don't consider it an equivalent experience. 

If he is already taking a physics course, I would not have him take a second one the following year at all, because the content is so similar that it is boring. I would have him take a calc based physics some time later.

Edited by regentrude
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9 hours ago, SDMomof3 said:

Can anyone give me pros or cons to one versus the other? I am trying to figure out which one is the better for a younger math and stem kid. He is a rising 8th grader. He has already completed Calc BC and is taking Thinkwell Honors Physics this year. 

He's had experience taking college classes.

My 10th grader is about to  start thinkwell honors physics. Tw's honors physics is calculus based, and equivalent to college physics 1. Tw does not college physics 2. 

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I have a ds who loves physics and at that age he knew he wanted to be a physicist. (He is currently a 3rd yr grad student at Berkeley.) He was not as advanced in math as your ds. (He took AoPs cal in 10th.) 

We used high school to broaden his interest.  We designed astronomy classes using GC lectures and college astronomy texts.  He self-designed a course around Kip Thorne's BLack Holes and Dark Matter book.  He took those courses alongside other sciences.  Then he started DEing in math and physics at a local U.  He ended up taking 5 physics classes and 4 math classes DE.  When he was at his actual UG uni, he was able to skip all of the intro astronomy classes after talking to the profs bc they ended up using the same texts he had self-studied at home.  (Their physics/astronomy dept is small and he entered taking the 300/400 electro mag sequence, so when he talked to them about what he self-studied, they didn't doubt him.)

Anyway, that is a long way of saying that he can study other science topics outside of the traditional sequence and have fun doing them.   They will broaden his understanding of whatever fields interest him and that knowledge is definitely not wasted.  It will also make him a more interesting college applicant bc he has demonstrated internal motivation to explore topics vs simply thinking vertically.

Eta: FWIW, if DEing at a 4 yr is an option, I would bc of the lab experience. Way more interesting labs than at home.

Edited by 8filltheheart
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College Physics" is algebra based and will not satisfy the requirements for science and engineering majors ( with the exception of biology). Those would require University Physics which is calculus based.

Just a note that the names “College Physics” and “University Physics” are not universally used, so I am not sure the original post was referring to algebra-based physics.  Our community college offers both algebra-based and Calc-based physics, distinguished by course number and prerequisites.  Since the student has already taken Calc BC, a Calc-based physics class offered on a college campus may be what was meant.

Edited by jplain
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5 hours ago, 8filltheheart said:

I have a ds who loves physics and at that age he knew he wanted to be a physicist. (He is currently a 3rd yr grad student at Berkeley.) He was not as advanced in math as your ds. (He took AoPs cal in 10th.) 

We used high school to broaden his interest.  We designed astronomy classes using GC lectures and college astronomy texts.  He self-designed a course around Kip Thorne's BLack Holes and Dark Matter book.  He took those courses alongside other sciences.  Then he started DEing in math and physics at a local U.  He ended up taking 5 physics classes and 4 math classes DE.  When he was at his actual UG uni, he was able to skip all of the intro astronomy classes after talking to the profs bc they ended up using the same texts he had self-studied at home.  (Their physics/astronomy dept is small and he entered taking the 300/400 electro mag sequence, so when he talked to them about what he self-studied, they didn't doubt him.)

Anyway, that is a long way of saying that he can study other science topics outside of the traditional sequence and have fun doing them.   They will broaden his understanding of whatever fields interest him and that knowledge is definitely not wasted.  It will also make him a more interesting college applicant bc he has demonstrated internal motivation to explore topics vs simply thinking vertically.

Eta: FWIW, if DEing at a 4 yr is an option, I would bc of the lab experience. Way more interesting labs than at home.

We have been trying to use this time to broaden his interest. My DH designed an AI class for him this year, he is learning about Tensorflow and GAN. Ds has enjoyed the home-designed courses much more. We have avoided DE and APs for ds until now, but we are running into the situation where ds is learning university level subjects and not getting credit for them, which is causing a problem, when trying to enroll him in classes at the college. Ds took AoPS Calc BC in 6th grade and when we went to register him for math at the college, the administration informed us that the highest level math that Ds can test into is Calculus. So he is retaking calc this year, which was a good choice because he is gaining a lot of confidence from having the highest grade in the class. The college and ds's charter school are both advocating that we enroll ds in college classes instead for self learning college topics so he get credit and avoid the situation of having to retake classes. We are also researching other paths, so Ds can avoid DEing in too many college class at an early age, we have no plans for him to graduate early.

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Could he study some course topics that he might not take in college? Ds really enjoyed studying philosophy. GCs has some interesting philosophy courses.  (His love of philosophy is how he and his now wife connected. She was a physics and philosophy double major he met at an REU. They spent a lot of time discussing philosophy....they are both such geeks!!)

Geology, meteorology, oceanography, etc? Or has he already completed college intro courses in those subjects?  

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4 hours ago, SDMomof3 said:

We have been trying to use this time to broaden his interest. My DH designed an AI class for him this year, he is learning about Tensorflow and GAN. Ds has enjoyed the home-designed courses much more. We have avoided DE and APs for ds until now, but we are running into the situation where ds is learning university level subjects and not getting credit for them, which is causing a problem, when trying to enroll him in classes at the college. Ds took AoPS Calc BC in 6th grade and when we went to register him for math at the college, the administration informed us that the highest level math that Ds can test into is Calculus. So he is retaking calc this year, which was a good choice because he is gaining a lot of confidence from having the highest grade in the class. The college and ds's charter school are both advocating that we enroll ds in college classes instead for self learning college topics so he get credit and avoid the situation of having to retake classes. We are also researching other paths, so Ds can avoid DEing in too many college class at an early age, we have no plans for him to graduate early.

Be aware that not all universities require you to retake classes that you have self studied.  My older boy is a physics and math double major at MIT. He was allowed to take Graduate level math classes his freshman year, even though he had only officially taken 2 university classes in highschool -- all other undergraduate content he self studied. All he had to do was talk to the professor, explain his background, and he was allowed in. So his undergraduate math major is all graduate level classes. As for physics, unless a kid competed in the IPhO, MIT recommended that physics majors retake University Physics even if they had had a 5 on the AP exams. The university has a special theoretical version of University Physics that is designed for physics majors and goes way beyond the AP content. 

I also did not have my ds go to university early, but the problem soon became that the local university classes (which is considered good) were just too low level for him because there were no other students of his caliber in the country (we are in NZ so it is a small pool). He got really frustrated with the 2 university classes he took, which is why he ended up self-studying throughout high school. DE is not always the solution for highly gifted kids. 

Edited by lewelma
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17 hours ago, SDMomof3 said:

. He has already completed Calc BC and is taking Thinkwell Honors Physics this year. 

He's had experience taking college classes.

Both my teens did AP Physics C in 8th grade but they didn’t want to start dual enrollment early so AP exams was an easy way to get credits. If your child enjoys labs in an actual  lab environment, he might enjoy the college physics (calculus based) classes more. 

If your child enjoys the theoretical aspect of physics more than the hands on aspect, then he could easily just self study for the AP physics C exams. My oldest took the AP Calc BC exam by self study in the same year after completing AoPS calculus. That’s because many of the math classes  he was looking at potentially doing has a Calc BC credit as prerequisite.  

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On 3/14/2021 at 8:37 PM, SDMomof3 said:

Can anyone give me pros or cons to one versus the other? I am trying to decide between AP Physics vs College Physics(calculus base). I am trying to figure out which one is the better for a younger math and stem kid. He is a rising 8th grader. He has already completed Calc BC and is taking Thinkwell Honors Physics this year. 

He's had experience taking college classes.

AP Physics C

Pros: standardized curriculum, well understood scoring system (AP exam score of 4-5 shows competency)

Cons: one exam determines your outcome for a year long class, difficulty for homeschoolers to find a location to test

CC physics class

Pros: less risky outcome measure (homework and multiple exams versus one single exam), in person college labs and professors

Cons:  unknown course quality 

 

My dd did not want to waste time commuting to campus and has no stress issues with taking an AP exam at the end of the year to determine her outcome.  She liked taking online classes in her pajamas and didn't mind labs at home.  

 

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It’s also possible next year some colleges may still be offering online versions of classes. This may change, but my local CC has all the physics scheduled to be taught synchronously online.

Schools usually provide a way to test out of classes. My husband has revealed that he tested out of quite a few classes in college, which enabled him to take more of things he was interested in exploring and enabled him to have time for a minor. I did this via AP exam, but he spoke to teachers and requested a test, including for languages he speaks that they didn’t teach there.

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