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Nope. Too far for us. Especially driving. Our worst "traffic" is being stopped for a train, but we have real winters. Roughly thirty minutes is our limit for DE. We are rural and that gives us two not-great options.

If there was public transportation? I might consider an hour each way. 

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4 minutes ago, RootAnn said:

Nope. Too far for us. Especially driving. Our worst "traffic" is being stopped for a train, but we have real winters. Roughly thirty minutes is our limit for DE. We are rural and that gives us two not-great options.

If there was public transportation? I might consider an hour each way. 

We are also rural. 30 minutes here is not even enough to get to the crappy CC. 😞

I also think 3 hours every day in the car is way too much. 

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Every day? No way. Twice a week for multiple classes? Yes.

Fwiw, we drove 100 miles one way 2 to 3 times a week so DS could train judo since there was no alternative. 

But for DE, it better be amazing and unlike anything I could replicate at home.

Edited by regentrude
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11 minutes ago, regentrude said:

Every day? No way. Twice a week for multiple classes? Yes.

Fwiw, we drove 100 miles one way 2 to 3 times a week so DS could train judo since there was no alternative. 

But for DE, it better be amazing and unlike anything I could replicate at home.

He needs a live classroom. 😞 

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I'd also do it 1-2 times a week for the right option like Regentrude said.

If things go back in person next year, we might be spending an hour there and back, which I'm not looking forward to at all. It's not even that far, we're just in a city and there's a river. It's very much not convenient. Supposedly there will be some outdoor labs for environmental science coming up soon so I guess I'll see how that feels.

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Our closest real city is an hour away (or was until we moved closer to the interstate, now it’s more like 45 minutes to the suburbs. But the suburbs also moved our way.) We go once a week right now for music and CAP. I used to teach 3 days a week there and DC27 commuted there 2 semesters, but was set up for Tuesday/ Thursday one of them and MWF the other. That school actually publishes a list of classes listed by number of days students need to come to campus. 

Edited by MamaSprout
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I know your DS is terrified of leaving home early, but maybe have him help you choose an “early launch” school. It might not be the best school he could get into at 18, but something that is maybe close enough he could come home in weekends? Small enough to be nurturing?

We have that school picked out for dd. It would be more expensive than our big state school, but if we were at the end if our rope here, we would pull the trigger. 
 

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My husband drops us off in the morning to the campus before work. So we arrive around 8am even if the class is at 11am.

We take public transport home so 2hrs 21mins to get home (according to Google maps). We take the bus to the train station and then take the train home. 
 

We did that four days a week before the campus had to switch to all virtual due to COVID.

Since I don’t drive, we used Uber to get there when my husband was out of town. 

ETA: It is a 16.5 miles drive

Edited by Arcadia
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11 minutes ago, MamaSprout said:

I know your DS is terrified of leaving home early, but maybe have him help you choose an “early launch” school. It might not be the best school he could get into at 18, but something that is maybe close enough he could come home in weekends? Small enough to be nurturing?

We have that school picked out for dd. It would be more expensive than our big state school, but if we were at the end if our rope here, we would pull the trigger. 
 

Nothing worthwhile driving distance. 😞 

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1 hour ago, Roadrunner said:

We have one potential option 1.5 hours away each way. I can’t imagine driving 3 hours every day, but maybe I should be? 

You also have to consider whether you can or want to stay on campus while he is in class so that you can drive him back. So its not just the 3hr driving time. 
 

My kid’s class was 2.5 hrs long so when my husband was on leave, he would drop him off, go shopping nearby, then drive back to campus to pick him up. My younger boy also didn’t mind staying home alone though he did come along sometimes. I did my own enrichment class homework while he was in class.
 

 

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1 minute ago, Arcadia said:

You also have to consider whether you can or want to stay on campus while he is in class so that you can drive him back. So its not just the 3hr driving time. 
 

My kid’s class was 2.5 hrs long so when my husband was on leave, he would drop him off, go shopping nearby, then drive back to campus to pick him up. My younger boy also didn’t mind staying home alone though he did come along sometimes. I did my own enrichment class homework while he was in class.
 

 

I will do anything for his mental health. 

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We currently do a 90 mile roundtrip once a week for my son to take university level classes. He takes 2 classes while we wait (do some walking or shopping) and then we drive back. That is all we can do for him given other family members' schedules. So, if you want him to be around other kids for mental health reasons, why not start out with a class that meets fewer times a week - perhaps one day a week which is more doable for the parents even if it is far away? Is there any option like that available?

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9 minutes ago, mathnerd said:

We currently do a 90 mile roundtrip once a week for my son to take university level classes. He takes 2 classes while we wait (do some walking or shopping) and then we drive back. That is all we can do for him given other family members' schedules. So, if you want him to be around other kids for mental health reasons, why not start out with a class that meets fewer times a week - perhaps one day a week which is more doable for the parents even if it is far away? Is there any option like that available?

I haven’t seen anything that meets once a week in person that would hold his interest. I am most definitely going to look very closely once all the schedules are up. That a a great idea. 

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2 hours ago, Roadrunner said:

I am curious how much you guys would drive for a good DE option. We have one potential option 1.5 hours away each way. I can’t imagine driving 3 hours every day, but maybe I should be? 

My oldest son had a doozy of a math professor in his very first year of DE. That experience left such a bad taste in his mouth that he wanted to homeschool math for the remainder of high school (this is a kid who thrives on in-person classes). Unfortunately, the CC would not use his homeschooled calculus to satisfy pre- and co-requisites for another class that he wanted to take. So, back to DE math we went. After carefully evaluating all of the reviews that we could, we decided his best option was at a branch of our cc system (there are 5 or 6 campuses) that was an hour from home (with no traffic). We trekked out there twice a week (Monday/Wednesday class) to go with our best bet professor. The class ended at rush hour, so we definitely had many 1.5 hour return drives thrown in the mix, and getting there was usually at least an hour, sometimes more.

Was it worth it? Honestly, it really was. It was only twice a week and he really got over his DE math trauma in that semester. We got used to the drive pretty quickly (it's amazing how quickly you can get used to something once you start!). I would drag my younger two along with us, and we did work while my older son was in class. We used the drive to listen to podcasts or audiobooks or other fun things. After the "palate cleanser" of that math class, he took the subsequent semester with another prof much closer to home and that went just fine as well. Good luck in finding your best option for your child!

Edited by UmmIbrahim
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30 minutes ago, Roadrunner said:

. I am most definitely going to look very closely once all the schedules are up.

For us, spring quarter schedule is already up and its all online. No confirmation yet if summer is going to be all online as well. 

After more than a year of campus going virtual, I have no idea if any of the non lab classes would ever go back to being on campus. The lecturers have already adjusted to Zoom classes and the colleges can have more students in a class slot since they don’t need to consider room capacity. 
 

My teens are not interested in going to college early so we use community college as high school.

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1 hour ago, Arcadia said:

For us, spring quarter schedule is already up and its all online. No confirmation yet if summer is going to be all online as well. 

After more than a year of campus going virtual, I have no idea if any of the non lab classes would ever go back to being on campus. The lecturers have already adjusted to Zoom classes and the colleges can have more students in a class slot since they don’t need to consider room capacity. 
 

My teens are not interested in going to college early so we use community college as high school.

They don’t mind zoom?  Mine wants nothing to do with zoom. Nothing. 
 

I can’t understand why anybody thinks it’s OK to pay teachers to basically be graders and support campus infrastructure with taxpayer funds while learning continues on zoom. They aren’t teaching here at all. Literally linking free online videos and administering 3-4 tests a semester. That’s self study. It’s unacceptable. 
 

I know UCs and CSUs are going back in person. I don’t understand how CCs can get away just basically staying online. 

Edited by Roadrunner
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11 minutes ago, Roadrunner said:


 

I can’t understand why anybody thinks it’s OK to pay teachers to basically be graders and support campus infrastructure with taxpayer funds while learning continues on zoom. They aren’t teaching here at all. Literally linking free online videos and administering 3-4 tests a semester. That’s self study. It’s unacceptable. 
 

 

Our experience has been that some professors aren't teaching , but others are really working hard and making online learning work.  It all depends on the instructor.  

Even before the pandemic, my kids have had some good online classes as well as bad ones.  

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27 minutes ago, Roadrunner said:

They don’t mind zoom?  Mine wants nothing to do with zoom. Nothing. 
...

I know UCs and CSUs are going back in person. I don’t understand how CCs can get away just basically staying online. 

My teens don’t have a choice since my whole county’s community colleges are still online and the next county has already confirmed that Summer and Fall 2021 terms will be online for most classes.

CCs can have lots of classes online because they are reaching a wider audience (people with no childcare or no means of transport or working adults). They have associate degrees that can be completed totally online.

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12 minutes ago, Arcadia said:

My teens don’t have a choice since my whole county’s community colleges are still online and the next county has already confirmed that Summer and Fall 2021 terms will be online for most classes.

CCs can have lots of classes online because they are reaching a wider audience (people with no childcare or no means of transport or working adults). They have associate degrees that can be completed totally online.

So you think CC system from now on will be completely online Covid or not? That just shows you that the rich kids get real teachers in a classroom at four year schools. The poor ones, online “education.” I am so upset over this. Kids are back to school in the fall. I don’t understand why childcare should be an issue. Somehow it wasn’t before Covid. 

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37 minutes ago, Kassia said:

Our experience has been that some professors aren't teaching , but others are really working hard and making online learning work.  It all depends on the instructor.  

Even before the pandemic, my kids have had some good online classes as well as bad ones.  

I can’t afford to experiment with this anymore. Zero success here. Zero. I am done. I used to be so proud of our free CC system. Now I think you get what you paid for. 

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5 minutes ago, Roadrunner said:

I can’t afford to experiment with this anymore. Zero success here. Zero. I am done. I used to be so proud of our free CC system. Now I think you get what you paid for. 

I'm sorry.  

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1 hour ago, Roadrunner said:

I know UCs and CSUs are going back in person. I don’t understand how CCs can get away just basically staying online. 

I don’t know if UCs are truly going back in person, dd is a TA at a UC and she told me that the school is giving the professors an option of teaching remotely. It is possible that students will be in lecture halls with the professors teaching remotely. 
 she said that the TAs may have the option of holding remote office hours, but they will have to teach discussions in person. 

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35 minutes ago, Roadrunner said:

So you think CC system from now on will be completely online Covid or not? That just shows you that the rich kids get real teachers in a classroom at four year schools. The poor ones, online “education.” I am so upset over this. Kids are back to school in the fall. I don’t understand why childcare should be an issue. Somehow it wasn’t before Covid. 

I think CC classes like vet tech, ultrasound tech, bio, physics, chem, astronomy are likely to stay on campus. Computer science classes and accounting classes were already predominantly online pre-Covid.


Childcare was an issue pre-Covid. That’s why online sections filled up quite fast. A friend was able to get her associates degree in child education more than 10 years ago because her classes were majority online. 

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That was my DS’s commute for 2 years (well 1 and 1/2 because of Covid) to his charter high school and the college were he did DE. He did it 3 days a week until Covid shut everything down last year. He was driving himself as I had a full time job and couldn’t do the driving. That was the best option we had because of where we live and how far from anything we are.

 On the other hand, when I was in college, I commuted 1  1/2 hours each way and that was just to the other side of Houston. 

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1.5 hours would be way too far for us, too.

It wasn't DE, but when DSs each started at the community college after high school, their core concentration classes were all at the farthest away campus -- a 50-minute bus ride (40-minute drive) away. They did that, and could study (or nap) on the bus commutes. Any longer than that would have been too long.

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7 hours ago, Roadrunner said:

I will do anything for his mental health. 

We spent hours at a few campuses just to get a feeling of which ones my teens feel they belong to. The one they preferred has the demographics closest to what they are comfortable with (as in being in the majority minority category) as well as having lots of students around. The other one that they didn't mind did not have many students on campus.

The first time I was asking my way to the admin block, the staff told me that English was a popular class for dual enrollment. The community college principal also has a very hospitable personality.

My teens like the campus grounds, the bookstore, the cafeteria. The admin staff makes them feel welcomed. I was doing DS16's dual enrollment paperwork in summer 2019 while undergoing chemo (and obviously balding) and the admin staff and guidance counselors were all very helpful.  When there was no one around at the admin counter, the financial aid staff went to the backroom to get someone to help me with my queries. There were two campuses that didn't make us feel welcomed though the admin staff were not rude.

My husband attended a parents orientation with me in 2019 and was impressed.

Our public transport option was an 18 min bus ride followed by a 41 min train ride. Due to the train schedule and bus schedule, as well as the walking required from the train station, the total time is about 2hrs. If it was raining, we stayed on campus and waited for my husband to pick us up after work. So there were days we were on campus from 8am to 6pm.

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When I taught at a CC, we had M/W classes and T/Th classes. F and S both had 1x/week classes that met 2.5ish hrs.  I always taught then because spouse could be home with our kids.  I had one Friday night class that was great, and one semester I taught a Saturday morning lab followed by a Saturday afternoon lecture for the came class, with some of the same students.  Is something like that an option?  I loved teaching it - I got a lot of nontraditional-aged students.  There were a few DE high school kids but a lot of working people changing careers.  One semester i had a grandma who gave toddler tips during breaks, and over the years I had several combat veterans and there were several babies born to students.  Those classes seemed to me to be CCs at their best.  

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My DD drove an hour each way for CC classes at 16.  I had planned to do most of the driving,  but we had sone family and medical stuff happen that conflicted with the time.  She left about 8, drove there, went to 2 classes, ate a packed lunch, and drove home by 1- 2 days a week.  Then she joined a club and would stay a little later some days.  It was a great experience,  but Covid has really turned the classes upside down.  Most classes are online- except a few science labs and a handful of classes that usually don't fit together well.  I'm hoping the fall will be back in person, but I think a lot of the professors liked doing do much online.  

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4 minutes ago, BusyMom5 said:

My DD drove an hour each way for CC classes at 16.  I had planned to do most of the driving,  but we had sone family and medical stuff happen that conflicted with the time.  She left about 8, drove there, went to 2 classes, ate a packed lunch, and drove home by 1- 2 days a week.  Then she joined a club and would stay a little later some days.  It was a great experience,  but Covid has really turned the classes upside down.  Most classes are online- except a few science labs and a handful of classes that usually don't fit together well.  I'm hoping the fall will be back in person, but I think a lot of the professors liked doing do much online.  

This. They don’t want to go back to work. And it looks like they can do whatever they want. I am shocked and saddened. 

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2 hours ago, BusyMom5 said:

.  I'm hoping the fall will be back in person, but I think a lot of the professors liked doing do much online.  

 

1 hour ago, Roadrunner said:

This. They don’t want to go back to work. And it looks like they can do whatever they want. I am shocked and saddened. 

It’s about economics and logistics too. 
The part time lecturers usually teach at a few community colleges, sometimes in different counties. Being online means they don’t need to commute between campuses and be trapped by freeway traffic. 

For the community colleges, online sections are easier to add. If any of the part time lecturers are able to take a class slot, they can open another section. My oldest has a math class that is a requirement for math major or computer science major. It always fill up very fast as there was only one section which was in campus, no online section. This quarter, they were able to add an online section taught by a different math lecturer. So that effectively more than double the seats for that course. The community college courses I am taking for fun typically has 50 students per online section. When DS16 had classes on campus, it was less than 30 per class due to room capacity (they don’t have that many lecture halls or big classrooms).

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1 hour ago, Arcadia said:

 

It’s about economics and logistics too. 
The part time lecturers usually teach at a few community colleges, sometimes in different counties. Being online means they don’t need to commute between campuses and be trapped by freeway traffic. 

For the community colleges, online sections are easier to add. If any of the part time lecturers are able to take a class slot, they can open another section. My oldest has a math class that is a requirement for math major or computer science major. It always fill up very fast as there was only one section which was in campus, no online section. This quarter, they were able to add an online section taught by a different math lecturer. So that effectively more than double the seats for that course. The community college courses I am taking for fun typically has 50 students per online section. When DS16 had classes on campus, it was less than 30 per class due to room capacity (they don’t have that many lecture halls or big classrooms).

Well but this was all true pre Covid as well. Covid online school was supposed to be a temporary thing, not permanent. Students are better served in the classrooms. Now if CCs want to remain online, then hire one teacher per subject to develop online courses (like Scout) so we as taxpayers pay one teacher (we don’t need a thousand teachers putting out subpar prerecorded lectures for $$$$$$ in salaries) and we could hire graders (grad students who could use extra cash). And we can sell the physical campuses to those who actually want to run real classes in person (maybe UCs will extend their reach in more rural areas). Then at least we will have private in person options and will pay less in taxes for the crappy CC product. I am sick of this all. the students who most need personal interactions and help usually end up at CC here. Rich kids are heading to the dorms at UCs. Low income students who had a chance to learn in a real classroom are now stuck at home (20 people in 2 rooms) basically self studying and failing. CC enrollment here is falling. 

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3 hours ago, BusyMom5 said:

but I think a lot of the professors liked doing do much online.  

Teaching online is so much more work! I haven't heard from any faculty colleague that they like being online better than in a classroom - except to keep them safer from Covid. Most hate it.

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15 minutes ago, regentrude said:

Teaching online is so much more work! I haven't heard from any faculty colleague that they like being online better than in a classroom - except to keep them safer from Covid. Most hate it.

That gives me hope. 
 

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1 minute ago, Roadrunner said:

That gives me hope. 
 

Also, colleges don't care about their faculty as much as they care about the bottom line. The college's decision to be online or in person will have nothing to do with the preferences of the faculty.

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Just now, regentrude said:

Also, colleges don't care about their faculty as much as they care about the bottom line. The college's decision to be online or in person will have nothing to do with the preferences of the faculty.

But CCs here are virtually free. They are mostly tax funded. So taxpayers can’t vote with their wallets as much as they could at a UC for example. 

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@Arcadiai have no idea what you are trying to tell me.  Are you trying to tell me you are happy for your children that classes are online? OK. Are you trying to tell me CCs should remain online permanently? Then we disagree. I am not even sure what conversation I am having now. 

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2 minutes ago, Arcadia said:

I am telling you to have backup plans because we really don’t know how many classes would go back to being on campus. COVID cause an unintentional “experiment” in having campuses going virtual and students not having much alternatives to go for. 
 

My kids want to be on campus but they aren’t going to be surprised if the on campus offerings are going to be reduced for classes with no hands on components like math and foreign languages when campuses finally reopen.

Our taxes did not go down when colleges have more part time or adjuncts than full time tenured staff. Realistically I don’t think taxes would go down even if community colleges manage to lower their operational expenses. 
 

Since your son does not want online, have backup plans just in case. Like how about other community colleges if the first choice falls through.

That I know.
Backup is a 4 year school.

 

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2 hours ago, Roadrunner said:

That I know.
Backup is a 4 year school.

 

UCs and CSUs have DE for middle and high schoolers. We are looking at DE at the UC for fall if they are in person, but there are more hoops to jump through.

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8 minutes ago, Marie.Sd said:

UCs and CSUs have DE for middle and high schoolers. We are looking at DE at the UC for fall if they are in person, but there are more hoops to jump through.

When should I start my hoop jumping 😂. Am I safe waiting till August? 

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@Roadrunner Not what you are directly asking about and not a club (and unfortunately it is too late for this session, well, there is 1 final one that maybe you might be able to get your ds to joint) but perhaps you could try contacting Roy to ask him if he is doing any more events like these or club type offerings that might help your particular situation.  https://hscollegebound.com/MOVIE-NIGHTS-Online-2021-Winter.htm

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We usually start in September, but UCSD starts in late September We needed to get signatures for the charter school, then the department that the class is in, and the professors as well. They will not let DE students add the classes until after school starts. We found that the math professors were the easiest to get signatures from. 

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