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36 minutes ago, idnib said:

One of the things she can't seem to control is animals, like the stork, lobster, rabbit, and puppy, so I was getting the feeling it was not all under her jurisdiction. But I agree that if it were all under her command, she would include a sassy and handy neighbor.

I have questions about the stork, too.  Not only can she not control the stork, it has that red smoke effect every time she tries.  I've wondered since the 70's episode if the stork was Mephisto.  

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My husband told me. He can’t remember anything I say and calls our kids by the wrong names half the time but he has the genealogy and origins of every marvel/dc/movie/song down right to the fine print

I think we may see the twins again -- just not for a while (so maybe not these actors). The comic's Young Avengers storyline happens when they are teens and there are signs that we're building up to i

Or another possibility—Agnes really was just one of the many puppets in Westview, which seems to fit her acting prior to this episode, but as Wanda is starting to lose it, she wants the real problem t

3 minutes ago, Terabith said:

I have questions about the stork, too.  Not only can she not control the stork, it has that red smoke effect every time she tries.  I've wondered since the 70's episode if the stork was Mephisto.  

Is mephisto red? I've assumed everything red was Wanda, like the hex.

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10 minutes ago, Seasider too said:

I thought that but was confused when at the end, Rambeau’s eyes seemed to flash purple when she found and looked into the root cellar door. Or was that just my imagination?

Yes, until Pietro woke her up.

 

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2 minutes ago, Slache said:

Bah! I learned nothing. I think that was Ultron.

What was Ultron? In the end-credit scene? 😲 Gosh, I hope not...but he didn't look friendly...

It was a good episode...but we're still dangling, without much new info. 

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9 minutes ago, alisoncooks said:

What was Ultron? In the end-credit scene? 😲 Gosh, I hope not...but he didn't look friendly...

It was a good episode...but we're still dangling, without much new info. 

Yes, blue Vision. Vision is made out of Ultron and I think that thing is made out of Vision. So we're looking at Vision without the wisdom of the mind stone or the virtues installed by the Mewmew hammar. He's also Ultron's color.

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Tonight's -- 2/26 -- was so good! I'm really loving watching an Avenger show w/ my teen that really absorbs me. (I also loved Iron Man and Hulk. Dr. Strange too. I loved Wonder Woman too, but different universe.)

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Enjoyed the longer episode. I did feel the pacing was a bit off but I can't put my finger on it.

It was interesting to use the TV show (versus a movie) to show the MCU's take on what Wanda's backstory looks like.

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Kathryn Hahn is fabulous. 

Where is Rambeau?

I guess that episode was necessary to give Wanda’s full backstory and transition from sitcom-oriented to full on Marvel flick. It did not answer why Vision had free agency within Wanda’s massive complex of spells. If I just missed that, someone please fill me in. 
I definitely still need to rewatch Age of Ultron. 

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54 minutes ago, Seasider too said:

It did not answer why Vision had free agency within Wanda’s massive complex of spells. If I just missed that, someone please fill me in. 
I definitely still need to rewatch Age of Ultron. 

Yeah, it didn't answer that. What do you think about the idea that she gave him agency within since it was a retirement plan for both of them (ie in her mind everything is for him too, not just for her) and she knows he can't live outside anyway.

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32 minutes ago, idnib said:

Yeah, it didn't answer that. What do you think about the idea that she gave him agency within since it was a retirement plan for both of them (ie in her mind everything is for him too, not just for her) and she knows he can't live outside anyway.

I could buy that. 

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25 minutes ago, idnib said:

Anyone else still thinking something isn't right with Dottie?

It’s kind of like an M Night film - now that I know the twist (who Agnes is) - I want to watch it all from the beginning. I’d keep my eye on Dottie then.

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So I've also been working my way through Agents of Shield on Netflix. There is an episode set in a Hydra facility, where we see a new employee getting a tour. He says he's there because of the "incentive program " (which turns out to mean that they've got your loved one, and you have no choice). 

Anyway: this new employee was Norm (or the actor that played Norm, lol). But...does the MCU reuse minor characters or have coincidences? IDK, but my theory is it's Norm that's in the Witness Protection program -- because he's hiding from Hydra. 

(DH says that this is a nope because Agents of Shield isn't considered canon...but I still like it, as unimportant theories go!)

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On 2/13/2021 at 8:27 PM, Alicia64 said:

I love the show. Watch it w/ my Avengers-obsessed teen. I hadn't realized that Wanda is the little sister of Mary Kate and Ashley Olsen.

Duh, I know.

I'm just catching up on this thread since I'm late to the WandaVision game but there were several times I would mistake her for one of the twins so it's a relief to me to know there's a reason why. LOL

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41 minutes ago, Seasider too said:

It’s kind of like an M Night film - now that I know the twist (who Agnes is) - I want to watch it all from the beginning. I’d keep my eye on Dottie then.

If you do re-watch, notice she's not on the bulletin board of townspeople and her house is in the (maybe?) intriguing position between Wanda and Agatha. Or it could be nothing--the MCU makes me look for little things that probably don't matter much!

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I actually liked the finale!  Wanda and Vision handled themselves very well in their respective battles, and the final family scenes were lovely.  I wish there had been more... closure?... with the people of Westfield.  I like that the ending sets up Wanda for future movies.  Be sure to watch the scene after the end credits!  

 

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Yes! We missed the second end credit scene at first. That cabin looks all Baba Yaga, lol, minus the chicken feet. 😂

I suppose that was her astral projection studying the book, a la Doctor Strange?  Thoughts on hearing her children?

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I LOVED the finale. I bawled. I didn't care for the final extra scene. Just too weird.  Such a creative job on this series. My husband had been out of town, so rewatching the series with him helped me see all of the extra touches they put in there. Very well done.

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14 minutes ago, alisoncooks said:

Yes! We missed the second end credit scene at first. That cabin looks all Baba Yaga, lol, minus the chicken feet. 😂

I suppose that was her astral projection studying the book, a la Doctor Strange?  Thoughts on hearing her children?

I'm so glad you said it was the SECOND end credit scene!  I totally skipped the first one!  Now that I've gone back to see it, I'm very pleased.  More setting up the new Marvel movies!  🙂 

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7 hours ago, TexasProud said:

I LOVED the finale. I bawled. I didn't care for the final extra scene. Just too weird.  Such a creative job on this series. My husband had been out of town, so rewatching the series with him helped me see all of the extra touches they put in there. Very well done.

We cried, too. (Well, my youngest and I did -- we cry at almost everything sad in movies/tv.)

We think the kids are still alive, somewhere. But the Darkhold! Yikes. If you've watched Agents of Shield, it's super evil. It doesn't bode well. 

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1 hour ago, Terabith said:

I don't understand.  Is Agnes just being meat puppetted in Westview still?  And I'm confused about the second post credit scene.  Are the boys still alive somewhere?

Agnes has been given the role to play instead of being physically locked up someplace or being free to cause chaos. And it does seem like the boys must be alive somehow, maybe in another dimension which she's able to hear while in her astral projection?  I haven't read the comics, so I'm just guessing.

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This show is crazy. Like if Vision is dead how real are the children? And yet here we are attached to them and freaking out when they’re in danger. Or that’s just me lol 

I think tonight was the final ep of season 1. 

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I’m ready for the next Doctor Strange.😁 

I like the way they said goodbye to the kids. To me, that’s closure. I don’t think they will come back. There’s no need for them to come back. They would make the scarlet witch a less mobile character in future films. JMO, maybe the comics differ but I wouldn’t be too upset if we didn’t see them again. 
 

The final scene left her very busily working on something. There’s another vision out there now, right? One who received all of the wandavision vision’s memories. We will see what happens with him in the future. 

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3 minutes ago, heartlikealion said:

This show is crazy. Like if Vision is dead how real are the children? And yet here we are attached to them and freaking out when they’re in danger. Or that’s just me lol 

I think tonight was the final ep of season 1. 

The children aren’t real-real, they’re a figment of the reality Wanda created inside the hex. Same with Vision. 
 

I don’t believe there will be a season 2, I think Wandavision is a limited series bridging two marvel feature films. This last episode provided lead-ins for Dr Strange 2 and/or Captain Marvel 2. 

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18 minutes ago, Seasider too said:

The children aren’t real-real, they’re a figment of the reality Wanda created inside the hex. Same with Vision. 
 

I don’t believe there will be a season 2, I think Wandavision is a limited series bridging two marvel feature films. This last episode provided lead-ins for Dr Strange 2 and/or Captain Marvel 2. 

Yeah that’s what I mean... logically I say they aren’t real but yet I feel for her as she tries to save them. It’s a show so I always wonder if they will try to rationalize/explain she really had kids at some point. Which also would make no sense... was vision ever able to have a physical relationship in the bedroom? I mean no genitalia. So really more of an emotional than physical relationship. 

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I think we may see the twins again -- just not for a while (so maybe not these actors). The comic's Young Avengers storyline happens when they are teens and there are signs that we're building up to it. Cassie Lang is a member (Ant-Man) and so a protégé of Hawkeye. We'll see...

Also, re: logistics of the WandaVision physical relationship... I mean, the dude can transform himself a human face; who's to say he can't do the rest. 

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Wanda really is a very gray character, isn't she? On the one hand we root for her, on the other hand she traumatized all these innocent people and seems to be learning from Agnes's book of darker magic.

I liked the scene with Wanda's runes. It felt like Agnes was going to regret asking for all of Wanda's power and that would be the climax of the fight, so when the runes came into play I was happy. Agnes must be regretting telling Wanda she has powers but not enough knowledge. It's not like Wanda can't learn!

We both cried when they tucked in the kids and were looking at each other.

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I have been ASSIDUOUSLY not coming into this thread for fear of spoilers. But now......

 

AHHHHHHHHHHHH

re Agnes' Regret

26 minutes ago, idnib said:

Wanda really is a very gray character, isn't she? On the one hand we root for her, on the other hand she traumatized all these innocent people and seems to be learning from Agnes's book of darker magic.

I liked the scene with Wanda's runes. It felt like Agnes was going to regret asking for all of Wanda's power and that would be the climax of the fight, so when the runes came into play I was happy. Agnes must be regretting telling Wanda she has powers but not enough knowledge. It's not like Wanda can't learn!

We both cried when they tucked in the kids and were looking at each other.

Indeed, and in that final very-scenic after-credit scene Wanda does appear to be working on the book knowledge, doesn't she.  For good or ill, is the question.

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42 minutes ago, Pam in CT said:

 

Indeed, and in that final very-scenic after-credit scene Wanda does appear to be working on the book knowledge, doesn't she.  For good or ill, is the question.

From what I know of the book, nobody ever really gets good from that book.  

She definitely is grey and did some horrible things, although I'm not sure she realized how much she was traumatizing them.  I think she really thought they were happy before, and to her credit, she sacrificed EVERYTHING when she realized the pain she was causing.  

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1 hour ago, idnib said:

Wanda really is a very gray character, isn't she? On the one hand we root for her, on the other hand she traumatized all these innocent people and seems to be learning from Agnes's book of darker magic.

I liked the scene with Wanda's runes. It felt like Agnes was going to regret asking for all of Wanda's power and that would be the climax of the fight, so when the runes came into play I was happy. Agnes must be regretting telling Wanda she has powers but not enough knowledge. It's not like Wanda can't learn!

We both cried when they tucked in the kids and were looking at each other.

I think this is the reason for the Wandavision series - to give enough backstory to understand the depth of her experiences. Child of war, exposed to the mindstone in unethical experiments, loss of her soulmate... So whatever happens from here on out, we have compassion for her. It’s like her origin story. It means when she turns bad and then seeks redemption, viewers will be willing to give it. I don’t know how all this will ride out based on the comics (which I’m not directly familiar with), but it gives Disney a character with a long shelf life. 

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11 minutes ago, Terabith said:

She definitely is grey and did some horrible things, although I'm not sure she realized how much she was traumatizing them.  I think she really thought they were happy before, and to her credit, she sacrificed EVERYTHING when she realized the pain she was causing.  

I agree she should get credit for that. 

I LOVED the finale! What an amazing portrayal of grief this series has been. 

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12 hours ago, alisoncooks said:

I think we may see the twins again -- just not for a while (so maybe not these actors). The comic's Young Avengers storyline happens when they are teens and there are signs that we're building up to it. Cassie Lang is a member (Ant-Man) and so a protégé of Hawkeye. We'll see...

Also, re: logistics of the WandaVision physical relationship... I mean, the dude can transform himself a human face; who's to say he can't do the rest. 

I realized that today when I saw Legends. I said oh duh! But I doubt he’d be able to procreate. 

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20 hours ago, Seasider too said:

The children aren’t real-real, they’re a figment of the reality Wanda created inside the hex. Same with Vision. 
 

I don’t believe there will be a season 2, I think Wandavision is a limited series bridging two marvel feature films. This last episode provided lead-ins for Dr Strange 2 and/or Captain Marvel 2. 

Yeah, I agree about being the lead in for Dr. Strange and Captain Marvel 2. 

But.....what is real?  I mean, that's the whole question about the conversation between Vision and White Vision, and also the connotations of the movie Tannhauser Gate playing in the theater.  

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10 minutes ago, Terabith said:

Yeah, I agree about being the lead in for Dr. Strange and Captain Marvel 2. 

But.....what is real?  I mean, that's the whole question about the conversation between Vision and White Vision, and also the connotations of the movie Tannhauser Gate playing in the theater.  

Whoa. 
 

Another lead in for a second Captain Marvel (and, since space, my faves, GOG).

I think the whole parallel universe stuff can get really tricky. I’m willing to accept that there was current reality (outside the hex) and alternate reality (created by Wanda in the hex). Apparently the marquis with Blade Runner was shown twice, once in Episode 8 in the flashback before the hex was created, and again in ep 9 after the hex was breached. I’m going to have to go back and rewatch the conversation between Vision and White Vision. 
 

Very interesting. But I must confess the rabbit hole is getting a little too deep for me!

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2 minutes ago, Seasider too said:

Whoa. 
 

Another lead in for a second Captain Marvel (and, since space, my faves, GOG).

I think the whole parallel universe stuff can get really tricky. I’m willing to accept that there was current reality (outside the hex) and alternate reality (created by Wanda in the hex). Apparently the marquis with Blade Runner was shown twice, once in Episode 8 in the flashback before the hex was created, and again in ep 9 after the hex was breached. I’m going to have to go back and rewatch the conversation between Vision and White Vision. 
 

Very interesting. But I must confess the rabbit hole is getting a little too deep for me!

Oh, I didn't catch it in episode 8!!!  I'll have to go back and look at that!

It does feel like it's going pretty deep down the rabbit hole!

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I'm on the fence about the final two episodes. I feel like I'm going to go back and watch the whole thing again to decide. There were definitely moments of brilliance, but... I'm not completely sure if the tone shift ended up fully working or if they built enough of the end theme of grief into the beginning for the whole thing to hang together as well as I want. The thing I most wanted a payoff for was the Twilight Zone-esque horror that built slowly from the early episodes to the middle. And that... maybe never got paid off. 

In the finale, I loved Vision vs. Vision.

I needed WAY more Darcy in the finale. Like, one what the heck? Why not at least 30 seconds of what is a relatively major character here? Not to mention that it was so obvious that they felt the need to explain it away that she left. And two, I may have a crush on Kat Dennings and just wanted more of her.

 

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3 minutes ago, Farrar said:

I'm on the fence about the final two episodes. I feel like I'm going to go back and watch the whole thing again to decide. There were definitely moments of brilliance, but... I'm not completely sure if the tone shift ended up fully working or if they built enough of the end theme of grief into the beginning for the whole thing to hang together as well as I want. The thing I most wanted a payoff for was the Twilight Zone-esque horror that built slowly from the early episodes to the middle. And that... maybe never got paid off.

 

Totally agree.  I feel like a horrible person, but I really didn't like the last two episodes.  They felt, in so many ways, disjointed compared to the first seven.  

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Just now, Terabith said:

Totally agree.  I feel like a horrible person, but I really didn't like the last two episodes.  They felt, in so many ways, disjointed compared to the first seven.  

I liked some things about them a lot. But the disjointedness made it hard to appreciate them. I'm not sold on them, basically. 

My kid really, really hated that they brought Vision back essentially. He was like, that's so Marvel. Just give people consequences for once.

A friend pointed out that the whole grief-mad woman thing is a trope and a pretty tired, anti-feminist one as well. They felt that Marvel wanted to use that trope, but then didn't want it to be too trope-y so they tweaked it but that was part of what possibly undermined it. I'm thinking about whether I agree or not. I'm not sure. It's definitely a bit of a trope.

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11 minutes ago, Farrar said:

A friend pointed out that the whole grief-mad woman thing is a trope and a pretty tired, anti-feminist one as well. They felt that Marvel wanted to use that trope, but then didn't want it to be too trope-y so they tweaked it but that was part of what possibly undermined it. I'm thinking about whether I agree or not. I'm not sure. It's definitely a bit of a trope.

How can loving people so much that losing them alters you in unimaginable ways be anti-feminist? I think this was a very deep look into being human, not being a woman. 

Grief compounded upon grief is a very real and very difficult thing to deal with and wreaks a lot of havoc in people's lives. I watched my sister have years of it, and she is suffering still. Our mother died in 2014. Her husband had OCD, anxiety, and depression for over 10 years and committed suicide later that year. Their only son dealt with uncontrolled seizures and developmental delays his entire life, and he died in early 2017. So much sadness and loss changes people. 

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