Best way to have fewer trucks on the road?

[gardenmom5]

1 hour ago, Sneezyone said:

When I was in middle school, my parents couldn’t afford braces but they were able to get me into the UW dental clinic to get my teeth done. My mom taught me how to ride the bus from downtown Tacoma to the UW for my appointments. I did that every six weeks for two years by myself making multiple connections. I also rode the Tacoma city busses to get to my first high school, to the mall, to the library...pretty much anywhere I needed to go. My cousins who lived on Mt. Baker did the same. When we lived in Magnolia, DS was 2/3, we rode the bus downtown every week so he could ride the monorail, run around the science museum, and attend children’s theater shows. There is always room for improvement but to suggest public transportation has no value b/c it didn’t meet your specific needs is a stretch. Even in my suburban bedroom community, buses run the major thoroughfares. My DD and her bestie got on one two summers ago just to see where they could go. I had to come rescue them, they got lost, but they weren’t more than 10 minutes walk from a bus stop.

It really depends where you're located.  It also depends how much time you have to sit around waiting for the next bus - for even A bus.  As a teen - I turned down two afterschool office jobs because there was no way to get there within a reasonable amount of time.  If I had *an hour* to work before the business closed - it would have been a long day. (and my entire paycheck would have been eaten up with bus fare.)

I did the bus a lot when I was growing up - but then the route was a direct one to downtown and that's where I was going.  My son moved in with 1dd because he could get a more direct route to the UW and cut his commute time in half.

[Bootsie]

28 minutes ago, gardenmom5 said:

I liked the public transportation in vienna - but we were staying in the 1st bezirk.  We drove everywhere else.  used public transport for some things in Innsbruck.  (we were conveniently located on a main line that ran between hafelekar, right through the altstadt and onto patcherkofel) But we also went places where you couldn't get without a car - or a lot of inconvenience.   (re: Piber)

downtown areas of cities tend to benefit most from transit - outlying areas of those cities (let alone suburbs) not nearly as much. 

we were in Vancouver - and the train was very convenient for going downtown - NOT for anywhere else.

I have stayed at at least 11 different places in Innsbruck, including outlying villages and have had no issue getting around Innsbruck (or anywhere in Austria) that I wanted to go using busses and trains (and cable cars).  At times it has been more convenient to drive, especially when we were carrying a lot of gear for kids.  At times it was much more convenient to take public transportation so that we didn't have to worry about parking (or driving mountain roads that I am not used to).  Public transportation has not always been the most convenient option, but there have always seemed to be some reasonable public transportation options for the locals.  

[Carrie12345]

1 hour ago, Bootsie said:

IMO, pushing for safe, reliable, convenient public transportation is one of the best ways to provide for a more egalitarian society.  Have reliable public transportation means that young people can travel for educational opportunities, teens can get jobs, those with disabilities who prevent them from driving can participate fully in society, the elderly can get to medical appointments and the grocery store, etc.  Unfortunately, I think too  many young people in the US get into a trap that they can't get a job because they don't have a car, so they buy a car they can't afford to maintain, then they can't afford to go to continue their education... and it becomes a downward spiral.   And, I think we would reduce the incidence of teen driving fatalities and drunk driving fatalities.  

Where possible, for sure. My area does its best to serve senior citizens, and we have a fancy bus location for supercommuters (gotta drive to it), and a not so terrific bus system for general use as some people’s only/last resort (a stop about 2 miles from my house and no shelter). But our regional layout simply isn’t good for widespread efficiency.

Our school bus system is as well oiled as possible and still takes 45+ minutes to get kids to the school 20 minutes away. And they don’t do door to door; I was driving my kid 2 miles to and from the bus stop already. It would have made more sense to drive him to school if they had had a parent drop off section. We’re just that spread out over a huge swath of land.

[frogger]

2 hours ago, Margaret in CO said:

We have almost no public transportation here, only from town to the ski area, plus we have snow on the ground 6+ month out of the year, along with -30 degree temps. Biking is not doable. Biking to the orthodontist? That would be 130 miles, over two passes! Dh hauled a basketball team for 5 hours yesterday, over a MAJOR pass! City folks have no concept of life in the boonies. We run into this with Scouts. We just combined two Clans of Order of the Arrow, which sounded good, but that meant the meetings are 3 hours over 2 passes for us. When you have to schedule swim meets for the avalanche danger, transpo takes on a whole, new meaning!

Well, to be fair most people aren't talking about the very specific town you live in. 

I have lived so rural that it had only a trail to the cabin. Once you got to the road you had a dirt highway for 70 miles until you got to a highway that would take you to a small town of 1000 and if you want a real doctor or want to do a major grocery run you drive over 400 miles once you get to the road, which is always the most challenging part. In the winter you didn't even have the dirt road plowed but took a snowmachine, sorry snowmobile for southerners, 70 miles to the nearest road.

It doesn't matter though that we lived that way since it doesn't change the fact that the majority of people live in places that could be made more pedistrian friendly so you don't have to heat up your car to drive your kid one mile and sit in line for half an hour blocking other traffic to pick up your child that could easily have walked if they could be kept safe from drivers.

[SKL]

Totally off topic, but I am just gonna leave a pet peeve here.  Our school system buses kids up to the 8th grade, but from 9th to 12th, you have to find your own way.  My kids' high school is 3 miles away, and we live where the weather is snowy, icy, or rainy almost 100% of the school year.  (Plus, again, no sidewalks on busy streets along the way.)  Basically parents are forced to drive their teens to & from school (or, for those old enough to drive, teens have to drive themselves.)

It is even weirder since my kids' school is 8th-12th, meaning they have buses driving all around the district, but even kids in both the same household AND the same school don't get the same treatment.

So I drive my kids to school & leave them off in the student parking lot.  I make them walk to a shopping center after school rather than go sit in a pickup line at 2:30 every day.

I hate this arrangement, but there's not much I can do about it.

Edited February 7, 2021 by SKL

[regentrude]

36 minutes ago, frogger said:

it doesn't change the fact that the majority of people live in places that could be made more pedistrian friendly so you don't have to heat up your car to drive your kid one mile and sit in line for half an hour blocking other traffic to pick up your child that could easily have walked if they could be kept safe from drivers.

Pet peeve of mine. We live 0.8 mi from the elementary school. All the other families in my street drove their kids to school; we were the only ones who walked.
People are sitting in the pickup line an hour before school lets out. That's crazy.

[regentrude]

But to circle back to the OP's question: I think the best way to reduce trucks on the road is if we all bought less stuff.
Radically reducing consumption would have so many benefits.
 

Edited February 7, 2021 by regentrude

[Amethyst]

51 minutes ago, regentrude said:

But to circle back to the OP's question: I think the best way to reduce trucks on the road is if we all bought less stuff.
Radically reducing consumption would have so many benefits.
 

Yes. I totally agree. Years ago I remember  a visiting priest came to our parish and the take-away from his sermon was “buy less stuff” or “ buy one less thing”. I try. But I’m trying to do better at this. 

[frogger]

Yes, and I suppose digital books are better for this than paper books. Sigh

[gardenmom5]

5 hours ago, Bootsie said:

I have stayed at at least 11 different places in Innsbruck, including outlying villages and have had no issue getting around Innsbruck (or anywhere in Austria) that I wanted to go using busses and trains (and cable cars).  At times it has been more convenient to drive, especially when we were carrying a lot of gear for kids.  At times it was much more convenient to take public transportation so that we didn't have to worry about parking (or driving mountain roads that I am not used to).  Public transportation has not always been the most convenient option, but there have always seemed to be some reasonable public transportation options for the locals.  

it's also more dense - but we did also wind through roads that wouldn't have been possible for buses to traverse - and no trains.  

But I really liked Piber.   

then we were back and forth between dh's nieces (20 - 30 minutes outside) salzberg (we still had our rental car) - They themselves dont' use public transit for that one -   her dh works in Salzberg.

But population density is much higher in most of western europe than it is in most of the US.

[Bootsie]

1 hour ago, gardenmom5 said:

it's also more dense - but we did also wind through roads that wouldn't have been possible for buses to traverse - and no trains.  

But I really liked Piber.   

then we were back and forth between dh's nieces (20 - 30 minutes outside) salzberg (we still had our rental car) - They themselves dont' use public transit for that one -   her dh works in Salzberg.

But population density is much higher in most of western europe than it is in most of the US.

Population density in Tirol (Innsbruck) is about 59 people per square kilometer.  Forty percent of the states in the US have greater population density.  Texas has a population density of  40 people per square kilometer, but the vast majority of people who live in Texas are living in more densely populated areas, much more densely populated than Tirol. 

The population of Austria is approximately 9 million.  The DFW region alone has over 7.5 million--but not anywhere the public transportation reliability or safety over a relatively small region.  Yes, there are areas in the US for which low population density makes public transportation difficult, but there are many areas of population density for which we do not have good public transportation.  

[Carrie12345]

9 hours ago, frogger said:

Yes, and I suppose digital books are better for this than paper books. Sigh

I haven’t been able to transition to ebooks, but it’s been a huge surprise to me that I’ve sort of gotten on the audiobook train.  Not for everything, but enough that it’s made a real difference in physical book stacks.

[frogger]

4 hours ago, Carrie12345 said:

I haven’t been able to transition to ebooks, but it’s been a huge surprise to me that I’ve sort of gotten on the audiobook train.  Not for everything, but enough that it’s made a real difference in physical book stacks.

Even though I enjoy podcasts, I really struggle with actual books. They are denser and I feel like I miss out on info because I'm not an audio learner. Stories are ok( not great) but audible non-fiction is really tough for me. 

 

[prairiewindmomma]

I think one of the things that has made it difficult for public transportation to truly succeed is that so few truly give up their cars here. You get the downsides of both systems—the cost of maintaining a working vehicle and insurance (which is not insignificant) AND some of the logistical hurdles of public transport. When dealing with both, a lot of people end up sticking with just cars because you never gain the critical mass to make public transport financially viable and user friendly.

[Sneezyone]

52 minutes ago, prairiewindmomma said:

I think one of the things that has made it difficult for public transportation to truly succeed is that so few truly give up their cars here. You get the downsides of both systems—the cost of maintaining a working vehicle and insurance (which is not insignificant) AND some of the logistical hurdles of public transport. When dealing with both, a lot of people end up sticking with just cars because you never gain the critical mass to make public transport financially viable and user friendly.

There's a reason for that tho. We have prioritized and subsidized the vehicle and oil industry such that we are able to value convenience and immediacy over expense. The digital revolution contributes to this too. Heaven forbid that someone has to plan ahead or be patient when trying to get somewhere or obtain an ingredient. Wasted time=lost $$$.

[Rosie_0801]

56 minutes ago, Sneezyone said:

There's a reason for that tho. We have prioritized and subsidized the vehicle and oil industry such that we are able to value convenience and immediacy over expense. The digital revolution contributes to this too. Heaven forbid that someone has to plan ahead or be patient when trying to get somewhere or obtain an ingredient. Wasted time=lost $$$.

And there is loss in other ways too. If around 70% of your average city is covered in tarmac due to roads and car parks, that's holding in a lot of heat, and can't have housing or food growing on it. Then you have to truck more of your food in from somewhere else. Anyway, these days, with all the tech we have now, people work on public transport on their way to the office (here, anyway.) Not that they should have to. So much for the labor revolution and the 8 hour working day.