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Has anyone seen info out of the CDC about what their vsafe program has aggregated? I assume there is enough preliminary data to show trends (Do females tend to have side effects more often or more severe side effects? What is the average length of side effects after each type of vaccine? What other patterns is the data showing that we may not have noticed?)

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I’m getting the Pfizer vaccine on Monday! I’m prepping myself for some side effects, so am glad I’ll have a few days to recover before Christmas.

My health care provider called me today and said my turn has come to get the vaccine and I'd be able to get my first shot of Moderna on Monday. I literally broke into tears of joy.  Bill

My dd works at a grocery store and people have actually shared their positive test results as she's bagging their groceries, as in, "I tested positive 3 days ago." More than once.

8 minutes ago, RootAnn said:

Has anyone seen info out of the CDC about what their vsafe program has aggregated? I assume there is enough preliminary data to show trends (Do females tend to have side effects more often or more severe side effects? What is the average length of side effects after each type of vaccine? What other patterns is the data showing that we may not have noticed?)

I have read that females and people under 55 have a higher rate of side effects, but most are pretty mild (even if uncomfortable).  I think I read most last 48 hours or less.  

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Yep, *grin*, those are all things I've read/heard. I was listing those questions on purpose. I just wondered if there is data behind those assertions and if the CDC has published/looked at what their vsafe program has collected so far. They would have some data on differences & similarities between after-affects (after-effects?) of the three vaccines, for example.

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re best boosters may need to be of a different vaccine:

11 hours ago, Laura Corin said:

On current data, the initial course of two should be the same vaccine. Trials are happening right now to see if mix and match might produce a better immune response.

It's possible that boosters might need to be of a different vaccine - the side effects might increase with a third mRNA jab, and there's concern that a third adenovirus vaccine dose might lead to the immune system to start reacting to the vector rather than to the Coronavirus element.

OK I hear your words (and FTR I am perfectly game to hold out my arm for whatever vaccine my physician recommends) but I do not have the vaguest idea what you mean. Please give it another go using very short words, like you're speaking to a kindergartener whose principal sources of scientific "knowledge" is Magic School Bus and Junior Ranger badges.

Which, I'm just saying.

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58 minutes ago, Pam in CT said:

re best boosters may need to be of a different vaccine:

OK I hear your words (and FTR I am perfectly game to hold out my arm for whatever vaccine my physician recommends) but I do not have the vaguest idea what you mean. Please give it another go using very short words, like you're speaking to a kindergartener whose principal sources of scientific "knowledge" is Magic School Bus and Junior Ranger badges.

Which, I'm just saying.

"Viral vector vaccines" use a different virus (in this case an adenovirus) to deliver the genetic information for the targeted virus (in this case the SARS2 spike protein) to the cells in the body. So the body will generally mount an immune response to both the vector virus and the targeted virus. The concern is that once the immune system has been primed to respond to that particular vector, when future boosters are given the immune system may knock out the vector virus before it has a chance to deliver it's SARS2 genetic package to the cells.

That's why developers of viral vector vaccines try to choose viruses that most of the population have never been exposed to. J&J, Sputnik, and CanSIno all use a rare human adenovirus. The AZ vaccine uses a modified chimpanzee adenovirus instead of a human adenovirus. I haven't been been able to find info on any other manufacturer using a chimp virus, and my impression is that this is a specific project that the Oxford group have been working on, having spent years trying to (unsuccessfully) develop a vaccine for malaria using this vector.

 

Edited by Corraleno
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OK, so...

... the concern is that by a third mRNA shot,

12 hours ago, Laura Corin said:

.. there's concern that a third adenovirus vaccine dose might lead to the immune system to start reacting [ONLY] to the vector rather than to the Coronavirus element [AS WELL AS the vector].

?

Is that more or less the concern?

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9 minutes ago, Pam in CT said:

OK, so...

... the concern is that by a third mRNA shot,

?

Is that more or less the concern?

mRNA shots don't use a viral vector, so this is an issue with the other types of vaccines. Not the mRNA ones. 

Also, mRNA ones are sometimes called "plug and play" in the sense that once you have the basic vaccine it is somewhat simple (comparatively, lol) to change out the actual protein you are using. So easier to update them with new variants, etc. 

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1 hour ago, Pam in CT said:

OK, so...

... the concern is that by a third mRNA shot,

?

Is that more or less the concern?

Not exactly. As Katie noted, mRNA vaccines are totally different — their main advantage is that they don't rely on a virus to deliver the genetic material.

The problem is that by the third (or, some have suggested, even the 2nd) shot of a viral vector vaccine, the immune system may recognize and destroy the vector virus particles before they have a chance to deliver their genetic SARS2 packages. So your cells will not even make the spike protein for the immune system to respond to.

This is actually one of the reasons that J&J (and CanSino) are marketing their shots as "one & done" — they don't have to deal with the question of whether a second shot with the same vector will result in an immune response that targets the vector before it can deliver the spike protein. Sputnik gets around this by actually using two slightly different (but still human) adenovirus vectors in the first and second shot.

AZ is using the same (chimpanzee) vector in both shots, so it's particularly important that 2 AZ shots not be followed up with an AZ booster. There has been some speculation that the reason the efficacy rate was much higher for AZ's Brazil trial, which accidentally used a half-dose for the first shot, is because it resulted in a weaker immune response to the vector in the second shot (due to the lower first dose), which enabled a stronger response to the spike protein.

 

Edited by Corraleno
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1 minute ago, kand said:

That is interesting speculation! I've never paid this much attention to the nitty-gritty of how the different kinds of vaccines work before now. Do you now how this relates to other vaccines we get in a series? Babies have some vaccines they get as many as 5 times. Is it perhaps because in that case, babies get them so often because their immune systems are too immature to create a sustained immune response, so it has to keep being repeated, thus they don't have the same risk of over-reacting to the vector? I now a couple of the vaccines that I started a bit late for some of my kids didn't need as many doses if started later, because their immune systems have a stronger reaction to them at that point.

Childhood immunizations don't use viral vectors — e.g. the MMR shot uses actual live (attenuated) measles, mumps, and rubella viruses., they're not inserting RNA from those viruses into another viral "carrier."

There haven't been a lot of viral vector vaccines that made it to market; one article I read said that ebola was the only successful viral vector vaccine in use before covid.

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@Pam in CT others have explained the issues with the two kinds of vaccines better than I could.

I'll only add that the issue I heard mentioned with the mRNA vaccines was that a third shot of a similar technology could increase the - temporary and benign - side effects, so that public acceptance would wane - I can't find a written reference to it so I think I probably heard this mentioned on the BBC podcast How to Vaccinate the World. The second jab effect seems well documented https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2021/02/second-vaccine-side-effects/617892/

 

Screenshot_20210403-072605_Chrome.jpg

Edited by Laura Corin
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Could the side effects have anything to do with the shots being given only 3-4 weeks apart?
 

I have heard that the interval was probably based on expediency rather than a better result. Did they measure fewer side effects with Astra Zeneca when they delayed the second dose? I know that’s a very different vaccine, but I’m curious. 

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We should have data soon on whether mRNA boosters cause worse side effects, as Moderna has already started a booster trial with 60 participants from the original Phase 2 trial. They are testing 2 different doses (20 & 50 µg) of a booster that specifically targets the B1351 (South African) variant as well as a 50 µg booster that combines both the original and B1351-targeted vaccine. They will also be testing the original, B1351, and combined vaccines (6 different protocols of 2 or 3 shots) in 150 people who have not previously been vaccinated.

https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT04785144

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22 hours ago, Bootsie said:

An 8-year old was vaccinated in the DFW area 8-year-old boy vaccinated in Grand Prairie, officials say human error to blame (dallasnews.com) at a drive-through vaccination site 😞 I can see a teen slipping through, but an 8 year old ?!? 

I'm trying to imagine this happening because here, they wouldn't vaccinate ANY minors, even when they were technically eligible, until they'd gotten a different set of forms from the state health department. It was a major source of frustration until just recently because there were absolutely 16 and 17 yr olds who qualified based on employment or health factors before they officially opened to everyone 16+, but apparently some sites would let them be vaccinated with the same forms and a parent signature added at the bottom, but others were waiting for the official form. 

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1 hour ago, Dmmetler said:

I'm trying to imagine this happening because here, they wouldn't vaccinate ANY minors, even when they were technically eligible, until they'd gotten a different set of forms from the state health department. It was a major source of frustration until just recently because there were absolutely 16 and 17 yr olds who qualified based on employment or health factors before they officially opened to everyone 16+, but apparently some sites would let them be vaccinated with the same forms and a parent signature added at the bottom, but others were waiting for the official form. 

Apparently when the state opened up to 16 year olds, a sign up site sent QR codes to anyone who had signed up, regardless of the date of birth.  The parent took the entire family.  Showed the QR codes for their appointments and everyone int he family received a vaccine without anyone at the vaccination site paying attention and asking questions. (Makes me a little concerned about how well run that vaccination site is.)  The father claims he had no idea that 8 year olds were not supposed to get the vaccine because if he got the QR code it must mean its OK??  

I don't know that we have had any official forms around here, that anyone has had to sign to get a vaccine, etc.  

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So, Florida, the state that never had a mask mandate and home of the Governor who made it illegal for counties and cities to enforce local mask mandates, has now signed an executive order forbidding govrernment agencies (like health department) from giving anything that could be construed as a vaccine passport or proof of vaccination and made it so that private businesses cannot require vaccination to enter. So if any of y'all are in Florida or want to visit, no worries, no one here can ask or require vaccination. https://www.disneyfoodblog.com/2021/04/02/breaking-florida-governor-signs-an-executive-order-regarding-vaccine-passports/?fbclid=IwAR1ATCEy50NgVY6fcSau1TJSQ5MBdWlxa7IGATN1grQjEZDV-F_wYN-ZZ74

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15 hours ago, ktgrok said:

So, Florida, the state that never had a mask mandate and home of the Governor who made it illegal for counties and cities to enforce local mask mandates, has now signed an executive order forbidding govrernment agencies (like health department) from giving anything that could be construed as a vaccine passport or proof of vaccination and made it so that private businesses cannot require vaccination to enter. So if any of y'all are in Florida or want to visit, no worries, no one here can ask or require vaccination. https://www.disneyfoodblog.com/2021/04/02/breaking-florida-governor-signs-an-executive-order-regarding-vaccine-passports/?fbclid=IwAR1ATCEy50NgVY6fcSau1TJSQ5MBdWlxa7IGATN1grQjEZDV-F_wYN-ZZ74

I was fine with the gov't entities but forbidding businesses? What a controlling tyrannical governor. 

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44 yr old Australian man hospitalized with blood clots and low platelet count after AZ vaccine:

"The man received the AstraZeneca vaccine on or around March 22 and was admitted to hospital with serious thrombosis and a low platelet count. He had low platelets, but he had clots in his liver, in his spleen and in his gut in general," Coronacast host Dr Norman Swan told ABC News. "So, he fits the description of vaccine-induced pro-thrombotic thrombocytopenia. He fits the case description."

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-04-02/man-who-received-astrazeneca-coronavirus-vaccine-has-blood-clots/100046540

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23 minutes ago, Corraleno said:

44 yr old Australian man hospitalized with blood clots and low platelet count after AZ vaccine:

"The man received the AstraZeneca vaccine on or around March 22 and was admitted to hospital with serious thrombosis and a low platelet count. He had low platelets, but he had clots in his liver, in his spleen and in his gut in general," Coronacast host Dr Norman Swan told ABC News. "So, he fits the description of vaccine-induced pro-thrombotic thrombocytopenia. He fits the case description."

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-04-02/man-who-received-astrazeneca-coronavirus-vaccine-has-blood-clots/100046540

At least in animals, this is a known but rare thing that can happen after a vaccine (or I think illness as well). An autoimmune reaction. I saw maybe 4 confirmed cases in 20 yrs in veterinary medicine?

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I just got an appointment with Walmart to get the vaccine. One of the questions it asked when I was registering was whether I have taken antivirals for longer than 2 weeks. I’m on an antiviral for CFS/ME. Anybody know anything about this? Is this something I should be concerned about? I’ll call the prescribing doctor about it tomorrow, but I really don’t anticipate that he will know anything about it. 

Edited by popmom
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I just got my 1st dose of Pfizer and go back in 3 weeks for my 2nd dose.  Do we just enjoy what time we have that is known to work (6 months I think) and then possibly be back at square 1 after that period of time?  My boys will be on a different timeline than DH and I because they aren't 16 until the end of June.

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2 minutes ago, mlktwins said:

I just got my 1st dose of Pfizer and go back in 3 weeks for my 2nd dose.  Do we just enjoy what time we have that is known to work (6 months I think) and then possibly be back at square 1 after that period of time?  My boys will be on a different timeline than DH and I because they aren't 16 until the end of June.

Timeline is AT LEAST 6 months...my understanding is the antibody results were remarkably good at th 6 month mark - more than expected, so immunity should last quite a while. 

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Found this on how long...the president of the American Medical Association is hopeful that immunity may be very long lasting and that if we need boosters it will be for newer variants that come up. So far though the vaccines work well on the variants we know about. https://www.healthline.com/health-news/how-long-does-immunity-from-covid-19-vaccination-last#Protection-lasts-for-at-least-6-months,-likely-longer

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33 minutes ago, Dreamergal said:

DH and I getting our first shot tomorrow. I am so excited, I feel silly. But it's finally our turn and I am impatient for it to happen. 😊

The night before my first shot I was so excited that I kept waking up thinking, "today is the day!" and would look at the clock but it was still before midnight.  😛  Good luck!

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My 16 year old is getting the Pfizer tomorrow!  She will be first in the family, my DH and I have appointments at local clinics in a couple weeks (also most likely Pfizer).  It is just hard to get appointments for 16 year olds, so we are road tripping a  bit for her for a big rural clinic that had hundreds of appointments open.   I considered changing mine, but decided to just leave it and let her have her day lol.  

I hope they are able to identify the people who got less effective vaccines!  

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NIH begins study of allergic reactions to Moderna, Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 vaccines

 

Quote

A clinical trial is underway to determine whether people who are highly allergic or have a mast cell disorder are at increased risk for an immediate, systemic allergic reaction to the Moderna or Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 vaccines. A systemic allergic reaction to a vaccine occurs in one or more parts of the body beyond the injection site. If such an allergic reaction occurs in study participants, investigators will assess whether the reactions are more frequent in participants who are highly allergic or have a mast cell disorder than in participants with no allergic history. In addition, investigators will examine the biological mechanism behind the reactions and whether a genetic pattern or other factors can predict who is at most risk. 

A mast cell disorder is a disease caused by a type of white blood cell called a mast cell that is abnormal, overly active, or both, predisposing a person to life-threatening reactions that look like allergic reactions.

“The public understandably has been concerned about reports of rare, severe allergic reactions to the Moderna and Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 vaccines,” said Anthony S. Fauci, M.D., director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases (NIAID), part of the National Institutes of Health. “The information gathered during this trial will help doctors advise people who are highly allergic or have a mast cell disorder about the risks and benefits of receiving these two vaccines. However, for most people, the benefits of COVID-19 vaccination far outweigh the risks.”

The Phase 2 trial, called Systemic Allergic Reactions to SARS-CoV-2 Vaccination, is sponsored and funded by NIAID. The vaccines are being provided by the program led by the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services and the U.S. Department of Defense to develop COVID-19 vaccines and therapeutics. The vaccines are manufactured by Moderna, Inc. of Cambridge, Massachusetts and Pfizer, Inc. of New York.

The Moderna and Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 vaccines are the first two COVID-19 vaccines authorized by the Food and Drug Administration for emergency use and already have been given to millions of Americans. Most of the rare, severe allergic reactions to these vaccines have occurred in people with a history of allergies. A substantial number of these people had previously experienced a life-threatening allergic reaction called anaphylaxis.

The study team will enroll 3,400 adults ages 18 to 69 years at up to 35 academic allergy-research centers nationwide. About 60% of study participants, group 1, must have either a history of severe allergic reactions or a diagnosis of a mast cell disorder, while 40% of participants, group 2, will not. The specific types of allergic reactions in group 1 participants are related to food, insect stings or allergen immunotherapy and require treatment with a drug called epinephrine; or are immediate allergic reactions to a vaccine or to one or more drugs. These reactions will have occurred within the past 5 years. Group 2 will consist of people with no history of any allergic reactions or allergic disease and no history of a mast cell disorder. Approximately two-thirds of participants in each group will be female, because severe allergic reactions to vaccines in general―and to the Moderna and Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 vaccines in particular―have occurred mainly in women.

 

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Here's an idea: Delay vaccinating US children.  Send the vaccines overseas to vulnerable populations in less wealthy countries:

https://www.medpagetoday.com/infectiousdisease/covid19vaccine/91972?xid=nl_vanayprasad_2021-04-07&eun=g1709400d0r&utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=VinayPrasad_040721&utm_term=NL_Gen_Int_Vinay_AYWDRL_Small_Active

 

(I've always figured charities would get involved in sending vaccines overseas. Not sure I'm as enthused about the US government doing it. But this article does make sense that it needs to be done sooner than when our country is 100% done. Though I definitely know some families would not want to wait)

 

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3 minutes ago, vonfirmath said:

Here's an idea: Delay vaccinating US children.  Send the vaccines overseas to vulnerable populations in less wealthy countries:

https://www.medpagetoday.com/infectiousdisease/covid19vaccine/91972?xid=nl_vanayprasad_2021-04-07&eun=g1709400d0r&utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=VinayPrasad_040721&utm_term=NL_Gen_Int_Vinay_AYWDRL_Small_Active

 

(I've always figured charities would get involved in sending vaccines overseas. Not sure I'm as enthused about the US government doing it. But this article does make sense that it needs to be done sooner than when our country is 100% done. Though I definitely know some families would not want to wait)

 

My heart says that this is right thing to do. It’s not going to happen, but it makes sense for all kind of reasons.

Its tricky. I would want parents of very high-risk to have the option here first under an EUA. 
But I definitely think we should worry about massive disease and deaths in adults in low income countries before we mass vaccinate children here.

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Pfizered !! Next appointment in 3 weeks.

I felt like a little kid on Christmas getting up today, so much anticipation. DH and I were advised to sign up in multiple counties, got our first appointment in one of those mega vaccine places with a multiple lane drivethru. It was highly efficient.

We had three tents. We wore our masks in the car.  First tent, hand over the QR code and driver's license and you get a clipboard with a form. Second tent you hand over the clipboard with filled form, third tent you drive right through, put down the window and you are vaccinated in the car. A TX ranger or a park ranger, not sure vaccinated DH. I think mine was a nurse. Not sure. I barely felt a prick. We were handed our vaccine cards and drove off to stay  in a line of cars for around 15 minutes I think. I was not sure, I was busy documenting it in the family WhatsApp. 😊. We got the text thanking us attending the vaccine appointment even before we left the third tent.

This was a facility where you could get Pfizer or Moderna. They decide. I was praying for Pfizer because BIL had it and could guide us with the effects and also we know first hand about it because he had it in Dec.

We had the kids with us, combination of no one to stay with them and we wanted them to see. DH warned me to wear my sunglasses if I may cry. I protested indignant that I will not. Well, what can I say, he knows me well. I shed a few tears when I got the vaccine. DD was watching eagle eyed and asked me why I was crying, did it hurt. I told her I was happy. I think it is important she gets to see it. We thanked anyone we met. They thanked us too for getting the vaccine.

TX does not have a mask mandate now. You hear a lot of complaints about TX and not wearing masks, people not vaccinating. I have met no one like that and today I saw the line up of cars standing, row after row, lane after lane. This is a location people have driven for hours to get vaccinated. We got on the list barely in the end of March. We got an appointment for today. People seemed so happy. I have heard around 10,000 vaccines a day. 

Now back home. Sitting and having coffee, typing this post, decompressing in the sunshine.

This is why I have hope that humans can prevail. It sounds rather naive. But we were able to do this within a year. I admit to having doubts about the process, lack of trust but today, my heart is thankful at the selflessness of people who made this possible. The brave volunteers who played a part in human trials with all the unknowns,  the scientists and every single unseen person involved in this process.

I can finally get to see my family soon which was not a possibility a year ago.

Today has been a very good day.

Edited by Dreamergal
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2 minutes ago, Dreamergal said:

 

This is why I have hope that humans can prevail. It sounds rather naive. But we were able to do this within a year. I admit to having doubts, about the process, lack of trust but today, my heart is thankful at the selflessness of people who made this possible. The brave volunteers who played a part in human trials with all the unknowns,  the scientists and every single unseen person involved in this process.

I can finally get to see my family soon which was not a possibility a year ago.

Today has been a very good day.

All this! It is TRULY super incredible amazing to have such an incredible array of vaccines this quickly. So many people worked SO hard to make this happen and I'm beyond grateful. And because of their hard work, I can hug my mom. I can pick up groceries and not worry I'm bringing home the virus to my kid with autoimmune diseases.There are no words to express how awesome that is and how grateful I am. 

I am not ashamed to say I cried when I got my first vaccine. I actually called the nurse who gave it an angel, and said she and everyone there are doing God's work. 

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4 hours ago, Bootsie said:

U.K. Limits AstraZeneca Covid-19 Vaccine to Over-30s Amid Blood-Clot Concerns - WSJ

It appears that a link between blood clots and the AstraZeneca vaccine is plausible

Yes, I wish I'd waited to have it. Am unsure what to do about my second dose - the cost/benefit is complicated for me by the fact I'm high risk in theory but we currently have zero community transmission. 

 

 

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18 hours ago, vonfirmath said:

Ugh. There was evidently a problem with early batchs of the Pfizer COVID-19 commercial vaccine that may mean it won't protect as well against COVID-19 as in the tests.

 

https://www.medpagetoday.com/infectiousdisease/covid19/91590

 

FWIW, the emails talking about suboptimal doses were from November of last year and they said the issue was resolved by December, so it doesn't sound like it would have affected many (if any) people who were vaccinated in the US, and certainly not anyone who got their shot in 2021.

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11 hours ago, Melissa Louise said:

Yes, I wish I'd waited to have it. Am unsure what to do about my second dose - the cost/benefit is complicated for me by the fact I'm high risk in theory but we currently have zero community transmission.

It is difficult, but the risk of complications, even if proven, is still incredibly low, and we really don't know about future Covid spread.  I would be concerned that if I didn't get fully vaccinated then there would be no time for a booster to be effective if there was suddenly a wave.  I'll be getting my second.

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Australia is no longer recommending Astra Zeneca for under 50s unless patients gp decides the risk outweighs benefits.  This is likely to delay things a lot here as the facility built has been set up to manufacture Astra Zeneca under license and potentially won’t be of use.  

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Just now, Laura Corin said:

It is difficult, but the risk of complications, even if proven, is still incredibly low, and we really don't know about future Covid spread.  I would be concerned that if I didn't get fully vaccinated then there would be no time for a booster to be effective if there was suddenly a wave.  I'll be getting my second.

If I was in the UK, I'd be doing the same. It's harder when the risk from Covid is (currently) theoretical.

I have a good handle on actual risk - tiny. I'm quite bothered by the quick change in messaging here where I am, from 'nothing to see here' to 'likely link' and feel it's that as much as anything that's dented my confidence in the approvals process. 

I do wish I'd waited, given our lack of community transmission. 

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5 minutes ago, Ausmumof3 said:

Australia is no longer recommending Astra Zeneca for under 50s unless patients gp decides the risk outweighs benefits.  This is likely to delay things a lot here as the facility built has been set up to manufacture Astra Zeneca under license and potentially won’t be of use.  

I think the roll out over 50 should have paused earlier, given EU concerns now strengthened.  I'd still have been eligible in 1b, but could have made a more informed choice re waiting. 

 

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22 minutes ago, Melissa Louise said:

If I was in the UK, I'd be doing the same. It's harder when the risk from Covid is (currently) theoretical.

I have a good handle on actual risk - tiny. I'm quite bothered by the quick change in messaging here where I am, from 'nothing to see here' to 'likely link' and feel it's that as much as anything that's dented my confidence in the approvals process. 

I do wish I'd waited, given our lack of community transmission. 

I think because it almost seems like an overreaction I tend to start speculating that there’s more to it than is public knowledge.  Giving it some thought though I suspect they know if anyone has the blood clot issue and does die in Australia they will have a huge obstacle to vaccine uptake.  And it’s pretty likely given incidence is 4 in a million with approx 25pc fatality rate that there would be a couple.  Plus I guess it seems kind of morally bankrupt to roll it out knowing that will happen when there’s a viable alternative.  Though to be honest I didn’t expect that to feature in the decision making process 😞 

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12 hours ago, Melissa Louise said:

Yes, I wish I'd waited to have it. Am unsure what to do about my second dose - the cost/benefit is complicated for me by the fact I'm high risk in theory but we currently have zero community transmission. 

 

 

The current recommendation is still to complete the second dose if you’ve had the first one although that’s obviously subject to change and to be decided with your Gp.  On the other hand some European countries are recommending doing a second dose with Pfizer (combination is currently untested), while others are recommending completing the dose on the theory that if you were ok after the first dose you’ll be ok.   I can’t remember when you had yours but was it fairly recent?  Hopefully by the time the three month gap is up we will have a clearer picture.

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1 minute ago, Ausmumof3 said:

I think because it almost seems like an overreaction I tend to start speculating that there’s more to it than is public knowledge.  Giving it some thought though I suspect they know if anyone has the blood clot issue and does die in Australia they will have a huge obstacle to vaccine uptake.  And it’s pretty likely given incidence is 4 in a million with approx 25pc fatality rate that there would be a couple.  Plus I guess it seems kind of morally bankrupt to roll it out knowing that will happen when there’s a viable alternative.  Though to be honest I didn’t expect that to feature in the decision making process 😞 

Yes, I mean, I guess a lot of public health is like this - we do what's right at a population level, and that often involves some element of risk to individuals. 

I think some pollies need to rock up for an AZ shot if they want the rest of us to accept the (tiny but real) risk for the common good. No more Pfizer for government.

 

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1 minute ago, Ausmumof3 said:

The current recommendation is still to complete the second dose if you’ve had the first one although that’s obviously subject to change and to be decided with your Gp.  On the other hand some European countries are recommending doing a second dose with Pfizer (combination is currently untested), while others are recommending completing the dose on the theory that if you were ok after the first dose you’ll be ok.   I can’t remember when you had yours but was it fairly recent?  Hopefully by the time the three month gap is up we will have a clearer picture.

Only 10 days ago. Mostly not thinking about it, but I'll be glad when it's a month behind me.

Pretty sure we won't be getting our hands on more Pfizer any time soon. Whispers of Novovax, though I don't know anything about that vaccine. 

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46 minutes ago, Melissa Louise said:

Yes, I mean, I guess a lot of public health is like this - we do what's right at a population level, and that often involves some element of risk to individuals. 

I think some pollies need to rock up for an AZ shot if they want the rest of us to accept the (tiny but real) risk for the common good. No more Pfizer for government.

 

I think on the press conference 2 of the health people said they have had the first astra Zeneca and will be getting the second one.  It seems from now on that it’s going to be Astra Zeneca for the old and Pfizer for the young.  Except of course we won’t be getting much Pfizer so I guess it’s closed border for longer.  

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55 minutes ago, Ausmumof3 said:

I think because it almost seems like an overreaction I tend to start speculating that there’s more to it than is public knowledge. 

I think that the reaction in the EU and the UK is an attempt to bolster public confidence by making it clear that even tiny possible risks are being taken seriously.

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21 minutes ago, Ausmumof3 said:

I think on the press conference 2 of the health people said they have had the first astra Zeneca and will be getting the second one.  It seems from now on that it’s going to be Astra Zeneca for the old and Pfizer for the young.  Except of course we won’t be getting much Pfizer so I guess it’s closed border for longer.  

Oy, less of the old thanks! 🤣

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