Covid cautious wwyd

[Elizabeth86]

 My husband has the week of Christmas off from work. Originally I told my parents we could visit on the 7th day off and we all felt pretty good about that, but now I'm feeling worried. I know 14 days is what the standard is for quarantine, but I was feeling 7 was a safe enough number. My dad is pretty high risk. They are being completely safe, but they would choose to visit with us daily and live with the consequences. They do love the grandkids that much, but it is me that doesn't want the risk. I couldn't be responsible for my dad's death. So this is all up to me. They don't care. They'd probably rather get covid than not see us for a Christmas visit. Would 7 days be reasonable for you or no way? 

 

[maize]

In my area, kids who have to quarantine because of a close school contact (say, the kid who sits nearest them, both in masks) testing positive are allowed back in school after seven days, no symptoms, and a negative rapid test. Is there any chance you could access rapid tests, even if you have to pay for it yourself? They've tested I think several hundred kids following this protocol and only three have tested positive, so the chance even after a known exposure of being covid positive but asymptomatic after seven days is quite small (kids who develop symptoms have to follow a different protocol so aren't among this rapid test group).

Is your husband's work a likely high exposure environment?

[Elizabeth86]

7 minutes ago, maize said:

In my area, kids who have to quarantine because of a close school contact (say, the kid who sits nearest them, both in masks) testing positive are allowed back in school after seven days, no symptoms, and a negative rapid test. Is there any chance you could access rapid tests, even if you have to pay for it yourself? They've tested I think several hundred kids following this protocol and only three have tested positive, so the chance even after a known exposure of being covid positive but asymptomatic after seven days is quite small (kids who develop symptoms have to follow a different protocol so aren't among this rapid test group).

Is your husband's work a likely high exposure environment?

7 minutes ago, maize said:

In my area, kids who have to quarantine because of a close school contact (say, the kid who sits nearest them, both in masks) testing positive are allowed back in school after seven days, no symptoms, and a negative rapid test. Is there any chance you could access rapid tests, even if you have to pay for it yourself? They've tested I think several hundred kids following this protocol and only three have tested positive, so the chance even after a known exposure of being covid positive but asymptomatic after seven days is quite small (kids who develop symptoms have to follow a different protocol so aren't among this rapid test group).

Is your husband's work a likely high exposure environment?

I honestly hadn't thought of being tested. That's a good idea.  Yes, my husband works in an institutional setting with over 1,000 people. There is currently lots of covid cases, but they have it isolated and he isn't working in that area. I'll reassess in December based on how things are looking of course. 

[easypeasy]

1 hour ago, Elizabeth86 said:

 I couldn't be responsible for my dad's death. So this is all up to me.

I can't help you - but man, I hate this virus. I feel the same way as what I quoted and I hate, hate, hate it. I hate that my parents probably only have so many years left and we haven't seen them (for more than a few minutes from far, far away) since March. They live 10 minutes away. 😕

They are being careful and taking certain risks for their own mental well being - but *I* can't handle getting them sick, so we just have sort of agreed to stay distanced. I don't want that on my shoulders!! 😕

Ugh. I'm sorry and hope you come up with a good solution!

[JustEm]

I live with my parents who are both high risk.  Our personal choice has been to do what they are most comfortable with because in theory they have less time living than we do. My aunt has terminal cancer but she how long she lives is a crap shoot.  Basically, as long as the drugs keep working she keeps living and living well.  But once they are no longer effective she could succumb to the cancer within months.  At first she was pretty cautious and stayed at home.  But by June, when she realized this wasn't going away any time soon she decided that her life was better spent taking the risk rather than staying home missing her friends and family.  

We pretty much had to come to terms with the fact that if they get sick and die we are not responsible for it.  They all made the decision to risk their health in order to live their lives the way they want knowing that many things could happen to increase their time line.

[Pen]

yes - given the grandparent preference to see you all

Try to get tested.

 

plus use masks as much as possible, hygiene,  ventilation and/or air filter if possible. Outdoors time if circumstances allow

[Elizabeth86]

5 hours ago, hjffkj said:

I live with my parents who are both high risk.  Our personal choice has been to do what they are most comfortable with because in theory they have less time living than we do. My aunt has terminal cancer but she how long she lives is a crap shoot.  Basically, as long as the drugs keep working she keeps living and living well.  But once they are no longer effective she could succumb to the cancer within months.  At first she was pretty cautious and stayed at home.  But by June, when she realized this wasn't going away any time soon she decided that her life was better spent taking the risk rather than staying home missing her friends and family.  

We pretty much had to come to terms with the fact that if they get sick and die we are not responsible for it.  They all made the decision to risk their health in order to live their lives the way they want knowing that many things could happen to increase their time line.

Yes. I understand this situation.  I have distant family in this situation as well. It's harder for me because my parents are being completely safe. They'd just forget about their own health in order to be with us. That's what makes it so hard 

[Ausmumof3]

It probably depends what numbers are doing where you are at the time.  If you do I’d try to isolate the rest of you aside from DH as much as physically possible on the lead up to Christmas.  And if by some miracle the weather is good have open windows or outdoor time if possible.  

[Elizabeth86]

4 hours ago, Pen said:

yes - given the grandparent preference to see you all

Try to get tested.

 

plus use masks as much as possible, hygiene,  ventilation and/or air filter if possible. Outdoors time if circumstances allow

I have a 2 year old and she will not keep a mask on. We haven't done anything as a family since March because she wi not cooperate. 

[Elizabeth86]

1 minute ago, Ausmumof3 said:

It probably depends what numbers are doing where you are at the time.  If you do I’d try to isolate the rest of you aside from DH as much as physically possible on the lead up to Christmas.  And if by some miracle the weather is good have open windows or outdoor time if possible. 

Isolating wouldn't work to well really.  We have 1 bathroom and our house is tiny. Also we would be seeing my parents after Christmas so dh wouldn't isolate from the kids on Christmas day, kwim. I wish we could manage this, but if one of is sick we all are in this house. Ugh

[Elizabeth86]

7 hours ago, maize said:

In my area, kids who have to quarantine because of a close school contact (say, the kid who sits nearest them, both in masks) testing positive are allowed back in school after seven days, no symptoms, and a negative rapid test. Is there any chance you could access rapid tests, even if you have to pay for it yourself? They've tested I think several hundred kids following this protocol and only three have tested positive, so the chance even after a known exposure of being covid positive but asymptomatic after seven days is quite small (kids who develop symptoms have to follow a different protocol so aren't among this rapid test group).

Is your husband's work a likely high exposure environment? 

Would we all need to be tested?

[Ausmumof3]

34 minutes ago, Elizabeth86 said:

Isolating wouldn't work to well really.  We have 1 bathroom and our house is tiny. Also we would be seeing my parents after Christmas so dh wouldn't isolate from the kids on Christmas day, kwim. I wish we could manage this, but if one of is sick we all are in this house. Ugh

Sorry I didn’t mean from each other but from the rest of the world.  It probably wasn’t clear.  I know your dh can’t but do what you can to limit exposure.  And I know what you mean.  Even with two bathrooms this year has been the first time we’ve managed to not pass sickness round our house (probably because the kids are old enough to feed themselves etc as required if I’m sick now).

[Lanny]

If your parents are in their 70s, as I am, they are thousands of times more likely to get COVID-19 than a healthy adult 1/2 of their age is.  I think about 2200 % more likely but I forget the number. For that reason, I read yesterday on the web site of the local newspaper (in Cali, Colombia) that when they begin giving the vaccine for COVID-19 here, the first people to get it will be the elderly population.

Bottom line is that I suggest that if you are with your parents that you do it where there is a lot of fresh air and social distancing. Not ideal but better than no visit.  Some danger to them.

There is a possibility that the first batches of the first vaccines will be available, possibly in December 2020. Early in 2021 there should be huge quantities available. There are approximately 4 or 5 that are in huge (30K to 40K participants each) tests. Including Johnson and Johnson is looking for 500 people (out of 40K worldwide) here in the city of Cali. That test will go for 2 years, with 1/2 of the people getting the vaccine and the other half getting the placebo.  (I am most interested in the vaccine produced by a company called MODERNA but the others are probably equally good)

[Not_a_Number]

I’d do the 7 days and a test, personally.

[busymama7]

My friends husband is a Dr at the health district here and I have discussed similar timelines with him.  At 5 days past exposure, a PCR test is very very accurate in determining if you have the virus in your system.  I think testing him on day 5 of his vacation is a good idea. Gives you time to get the results.  And keep the kids and you away from the public and other kids for 2 weeks before the visit.  If you do those things the risk is very low.   We are covid cautious but we also see that this isn't going away any time soon and we can't keep our lives on hold forever.  Hopefully an effective vaccine is close but that isn't a guarantee either.   Be cautious, but also chose some contact and that is acceptable in my opinion.  

[Farrar]

I would do it for seven days and a test. Get the test right at the start. And yes, I'd test everyone. 

It's not foolproof by any means (only 14 days and two tests would be foolproof) but we're all having to take measured risks on some level. 

[Pen]

2 hours ago, Elizabeth86 said:

I have a 2 year old and she will not keep a mask on. We haven't done anything as a family since March because she wi not cooperate. 

I might try to do a 14 day, rather than 7 day semi “quarantine” of the 2yo if possible .  
 

 And, while people here on WTM and NYT etc have Pooh poohed mouthwash (also gargle, and nasal rinse), I’d consider teaching mouthwashing and having especially the 2yo, and maybe everyone do it before visit to possibly reduce viral shed.  (I know dentists who are having patients do this.) 

 

also possibly helpful to understand iodine better:

 

 

 

If me, I would also check (or suggest they do it for other adults) everyone to be involved (including the grandparents themselves) in visit for vitamin D level right now if u/they haven’t already. And if it were me personally I would want to be in around ~ 66 ng/mL.  I know people who thought their levels would be high because they take daily D3 and get sun, and have been surprised when they test that levels are low.   This is also controversial.  WTM member @ElizabethB is also pro-vitamin D3. 

And I would follow one of the poor person’s DIY /OTC prophylaxis approaches or a blend (such as Zelenko / Marik approach)  You can find those on Dr Been videos too.   Again it is controversial.

Note, none of this is medical advice, I am just saying some of what ***I personally*** would do to help ease my mind about adding safety for visiting grandparents who want a visit.  

I am offering these thoughts to you @Elizabeth86 - use what you can, if anything,  and leave the rest.

 I am not going to debate with others here on WTM who may tell you how terrible and unproven it all is. 
 

 

Edited November 12, 2020 by Pen

[Elizabeth86]

2 hours ago, Ausmumof3 said:

Sorry I didn’t mean from each other but from the rest of the world.  It probably wasn’t clear.  I know your dh can’t but do what you can to limit exposure.  And I know what you mean.  Even with two bathrooms this year has been the first time we’ve managed to not pass sickness round our house (probably because the kids are old enough to feed themselves etc as required if I’m sick now).

Oh we do. I do go anywhere but to the grocery store to fill in from my big grocery pickup. I also have been picking up books at the library.  We are going to no activities and seeing no one. 

[Elizabeth86]

2 hours ago, Lanny said:

If your parents are in their 70s, as I am, they are thousands of times more likely to get COVID-19 than a healthy adult 1/2 of their age is.  I think about 2200 % more likely but I forget the number. For that reason, I read yesterday on the web site of the local newspaper (in Cali, Colombia) that when they begin giving the vaccine for COVID-19 here, the first people to get it will be the elderly population.

Bottom line is that I suggest that if you are with your parents that you do it where there is a lot of fresh air and social distancing. Not ideal but better than no visit.  Some danger to them.

There is a possibility that the first batches of the first vaccines will be available, possibly in December 2020. Early in 2021 there should be huge quantities available. There are approximately 4 or 5 that are in huge (30K to 40K participants each) tests. Including Johnson and Johnson is looking for 500 people (out of 40K worldwide) here in the city of Cali. That test will go for 2 years, with 1/2 of the people getting the vaccine and the other half getting the placebo.  (I am most interested in the vaccine produced by a company called MODERNA but the others are probably equally good)

Yes, my parents are in their 70's. My dad smoked for probably 40 years and he has black lung from working in the coal mines for that long as well. He got pneumonia back in January and it was very rough on him. They will be in line for a vaccine asap.

[Elizabeth86]

1 hour ago, busymama7 said:

My friends husband is a Dr at the health district here and I have discussed similar timelines with him.  At 5 days past exposure, a PCR test is very very accurate in determining if you have the virus in your system.  I think testing him on day 5 of his vacation is a good idea. Gives you time to get the results.  And keep the kids and you away from the public and other kids for 2 weeks before the visit.  If you do those things the risk is very low.   We are covid cautious but we also see that this isn't going away any time soon and we can't keep our lives on hold forever.  Hopefully an effective vaccine is close but that isn't a guarantee either.   Be cautious, but also chose some contact and that is acceptable in my opinion.  

Sounds good. The kids and I already stay away from everyone, so no problem there. 

[Elizabeth86]

33 minutes ago, Pen said:

I might try to do a 14 day, rather than 7 day semi “quarantine” of the 2yo if possible .  
 

 And, while people here on WTM and NYT etc have Pooh poohed mouthwash (also gargle, and nasal rinse), I’d consider teaching mouthwashing and having especially the 2yo, and maybe everyone do it before visit to possibly reduce viral shed.  (I know dentists who are having patients do this.) 

 

also possibly helpful to understand iodine better:

 

 

 

If me, I would also check (or suggest they do it for other adults) everyone to be involved (including the grandparents themselves) in visit for vitamin D level right now if u/they haven’t already. And if it were me personally I would want to be in around ~ 66 ng/mL.  I know people who thought their levels would be high because they take daily D3 and get sun, and have been surprised when they test that levels are low.   This is also controversial.  WTM member @ElizabethB is also pro-vitamin D3. 

And I would follow one of the poor person’s DIY /OTC prophylaxis approaches or a blend (such as Zelenko / Marik approach)  You can find those on Dr Been videos too.   Again it is controversial.

Note, none of this is medical advice, I am just saying some of what ***I personally*** would do to help ease my mind about adding safety for visiting grandparents who want a visit.  

I am offering these thoughts to you @Elizabeth86 - use what you can, if anything,  and leave the rest.

 I am not going to debate with others here on WTM who may tell you how terrible and unproven it all is. 
 

 

Thanks. My parents do have their vitamin d checked. I know my mom has to supplement. Yeah, I mean, the kids are quarantined, we have no where to be except to the grocery store and I pick up library books. The 2 year old doesn't leave the house.  

[Pen]

2 hours ago, Elizabeth86 said:

Thanks. My parents do have their vitamin d checked. I know my mom has to supplement. Yeah, I mean, the kids are quarantined, we have no where to be except to the grocery store and I pick up library books. The 2 year old doesn't leave the house.  

I think u r in pretty good shape for a quite safe visit.

Nothing is perfect or guaranteed.

I think your father’s own feelings about it should weigh strongly.   And he could possibly wear a more self-protective type mask except when eating etc if his lung condition allows.  Happy Mask (Taiwan type not German) seem light and easy to breathe in IME.   Seems to have good Nelson Lab filtration results. 
 

If u decide to do the visit, enjoy it!!!  Stress and worry is hard on immune system too. 
 

👍😊