When to do Killgallon Sentence in relation to MCT sequence?

[Sarah0000]

My third grader is doing W&R Narrative and MCT Town this semester. Next semester I plan to do Treasured Conversations. We'll likely stick with W&R and MCT long term but throw other things in as well (we school year round).

My understanding of Killgallon Elementary Sentence Composing is that the sentences are often broken down by clauses but the book doesn't use the grammatical terminology. I would prefer for DS to have an understanding of the grammar aspects while doing this. So where would Killgallon fit in best in relation to the MCT sequence? Or even in relation to W&R, although so far W&R is much behind MCT in terms of grammar but perhaps there is other overlap that is relevant.

[domestic_engineer]

I'm doing Sentence Composing now on a 1x/week basis.  We have finished Grammar Town and Practice Town and are waiting to start  Grammar Voyage et al until our workload is a little lower.  I think you'll be fine with Killgallon after finishing all the grammar work in the Town level.  

I've done all those resources with my older child, but I can't remember how I sequenced them except that MCT was of primary importance and everything else was fit around that as opportunity presented itself and seasons of life dictated.  I only completed 2/3 of Treasured Conversations, but I think that you will find it easy if your student is very comfortable with Town Level grammar.  Both W&R and TC cover outlining .... W&R may cover it later than you want and the instruction is not explicit like TC.  As it's my second time through these resources, I think there's a bit of overlap with Killgallon and later books of W&R's Sentence Play & Copiousness exercises.  But Killgallon has more complex models that also excite the student because the child recognizes the book serving as the model.

[Matryoshka]

16 minutes ago, Sarah0000 said:

My third grader is doing W&R Narrative and MCT Town this semester. Next semester I plan to do Treasured Conversations. We'll likely stick with W&R and MCT long term but throw other things in as well (we school year round).

My understanding of Killgallon Elementary Sentence Composing is that the sentences are often broken down by clauses but the book doesn't use the grammatical terminology. I would prefer for DS to have an understanding of the grammar aspects while doing this. So where would Killgallon fit in best in relation to the MCT sequence? Or even in relation to W&R, although so far W&R is much behind MCT in terms of grammar but perhaps there is other overlap that is relevant.

I tossed in Killgallon at some point after they'd gone through the MCT grammar enough that we were just doing 4-level analysis on 2 sentences 2x/week in the Practice book, so they did know all their phrases.  There are two separate but quite similar Killgallon books per level, I have no idea why, but I believe at each level one of them does use the grammatical terms for the different kinds of phrases.

[Sarah0000]

10 minutes ago, Matryoshka said:

I tossed in Killgallon at some point after they'd gone through the MCT grammar enough that we were just doing 4-level analysis on 2 sentences 2x/week in the Practice book, so they did know all their phrases.  There are two separate but quite similar Killgallon books per level, I have no idea why, but I believe at each level one of them does use the grammatical terms for the different kinds of phrases.

Oh thank you. I'll have to look for the book with the correct phrases and see where it fits in with MCT.

[Sarah0000]

22 hours ago, domestic_engineer said:

I'm doing Sentence Composing now on a 1x/week basis.  We have finished Grammar Town and Practice Town and are waiting to start  Grammar Voyage et al until our workload is a little lower.  I think you'll be fine with Killgallon after finishing all the grammar work in the Town level.  

I've done all those resources with my older child, but I can't remember how I sequenced them except that MCT was of primary importance and everything else was fit around that as opportunity presented itself and seasons of life dictated.  I only completed 2/3 of Treasured Conversations, but I think that you will find it easy if your student is very comfortable with Town Level grammar.  Both W&R and TC cover outlining .... W&R may cover it later than you want and the instruction is not explicit like TC.  As it's my second time through these resources, I think there's a bit of overlap with Killgallon and later books of W&R's Sentence Play & Copiousness exercises.  But Killgallon has more complex models that also excite the student because the child recognizes the book serving as the model.

Thank you.

Sounds like Killgallon will be fine anytime after our current work. 

[domestic_engineer]

12 minutes ago, Matryoshka said:

There are two separate but quite similar Killgallon books per level, I have no idea why, but I believe at each level one of them does use the grammatical terms for the different kinds of phrases.

I thought that Sentence Composing (the one that OP is planning on using) had the most grammatically correct terms.  But definitely don’t depend on my recollections. 🤪

[Matryoshka]

2 minutes ago, domestic_engineer said:

I thought that Sentence Composing (the one that OP is planning on using) had the most grammatically correct terms.  But definitely don’t depend on my recollections. 🤪

It's been a long time here too.  I have some vague memory that it's not consistent - like Sentence Composing for Elementary has more of the correct terms than Story Grammar, but at the Middle School level the Sentence Composing books don't have it and Grammar for Middle School does.  I know Grammar for Middle School does because I've used it more recently with some tutoring students.

[Cake and Pi]

I think it's pretty flexible and can just be tossed in where ever, lol. We did the exercises verbally and then picked a couple to use as copywork each day.

My DS 8 did a part of Killgallons Elementary Sentence Composing after MCT Island but before W&R Fable. He did most of the rest near the end of MCT Town and after W&R Narrative I. He's doing MCT Voyage and part-way through W&R Narrative II now and I'd be totally comfortable adding in the last little bit of Killgallons if I felt he needed more copywork. However, at this point it feels unnecessary.

My DS 11 used the same Killgallons book in one solid go after MCT Island and 3.5 years of public school (2nd through half of 5th), just before beginning W&R Narrative I.