How do you evaluate if an online class is a bad fit?

[cintinative]

What things would give you pause or cause you to consider dropping or switching a class, other than your child just not performing well?  What things would cause you to look elsewhere, and when would you just tell your child that they will occasionally have a teacher that is not their favorite/does not set up the course the way they think it should be? 

My kids are taking an asynchronous class.  We have done several online classes before, but we are having some unique issues with this class.

These are some examples of things that my kids are complaining about:

• What is on the quiz is never explicitly stated. When I (mom) asked, she said, anything they cover is fair game.  My kids think that there should be a list of vocabulary that we need to know for each week, or at least a Quizlet. Sometimes this is provided, sometimes not.
• My oldest was frustrated because a game she created had a typo (which she mentioned ahead of time) so that meant that his answers to the game were incorrect for that term. They feel that the game should be changed to correct the typo (like yesterday, preferably. LOL.)  Also my child though: won't accept that he can just play the game once, and then use the Quizlet I made for him without the typo.  
• My kids don't like that she uses Quizlet for some things and for other things she uses a game on an outside website. They want the review all in the same format.  She said she wants them to "mix it up."  
• My kids were frustrated that they didn't know you couldn't submit a text box and an attachment in Canvas (it only accepts one or the other). I emailed the teacher and she said this was covered in her canvas instructions video. The assignment with the issue was two weeks later, and my kids thought she should have reminded them in the assignment. 

 

Overall, I think some of this is whining and just not being used to this teacher's style. Also, being a teenager.   Also, having high expectations because other classes have communicated better.  I keep thinking that having a teacher that might not be communicating in the clearest way possible might be part of the growing pains of high school, but I attended public school, so maybe that is the wrong way of looking at it? 

From a mom standpoint, I am having to email the teacher a lot.  Way more than any other class we have ever taken.  I am little befuddled by her review strategies.  Sometimes we use Quizlet, sometimes a piece of paper, sometimes a game on this or that site.  My kids find it feels scattered. I have created quizlets for everything she doesn't have quizlet for. 

The question is--when do the sum total of all the little things add up to enough to consider a drop?  

ETA: more details downthread about specific issues. For example, we had to play three games on an external website (Flash-based) and they were expected to write down the Spanish words, basically infer the English translation, and then study those for next week's quiz. It was about 70 words across three games. No list of vocabulary or other means of confirming the list was or will be provided.

 

Edited September 17, 2020 by cintinative

[JenneinCA]

If you are still within the drop deadline AND the kids are seriously unhappy AND you have a reasonable substitution then I would drop the class.  But while we have had bad fits before I never had another alternative that I could shift to.

In particular I wasn’t capable of teaching English.  I just could not do it.  Therefore they just had to cope with the class.  It was not fun.  I listened to a ton of complaining.  But bad fits happen in other situations and it was good practice in dealing with it.  I was annoyed at having spent so much money on something that didn’t work, but that was a sunk cost.

[cintinative]

4 minutes ago, JenneinCA said:

If you are still within the drop deadline AND the kids are seriously unhappy AND you have a reasonable substitution then I would drop the class.  But while we have had bad fits before I never had another alternative that I could shift to.

We are past the drop deadline for this semester, but could drop 2nd semester. BUT, it is a foreign language class, so I think from a scope and sequence standpoint we would be better off "suffering" through the year and then switching, if we switch.  

[cintinative]

Just now, square_25 said:

 

But since this is a foreign language class, I would definitely be paying attention to other stuff, namely, how well they are learning the language. What does an "asynchronous class" mean? 

Asynchronous (a=not;  synchronous=at the same time) In this case, it means that we do the work at home over the course of the week but do not have class meetings. All the assignments are posted on Saturday morning and are due Thursday night.  Each student completes the week's assignments how they wish (they could do all in one day, but that's not recommended).  The teacher does all the grading.  That said, there is conversation practice once a week (it doesn't count as a class and no assignments are due for the practice time). 

[cintinative]

Just now, square_25 said:

Is the teacher a fluent speaker of the language? Are the activities helping them learn? 

She is fluent. 🙂 I think they are learning, but they are not enjoying it.  I remember learning Spanish as being fun but since I had a live class we could play games, etc.   I could also be a different learner than them.  I have heard others say that some kids just don't like foreign language.  If there was no COVID, I would have pursued a live class locally.

[RootAnn]

Hmm. I've considered dropping when the teacher is a bad fit for my kid (or mean, or cruel, or just stupid), when the goals of the class don't match mine (not always clear before the class starts even with emails to the teacher beforehand), when there isn't enough timely feedback (writing class), when there is busy work instead of quality assignments, and when the class is not helping my child learn but making them hate the subject instead.

None of those things would scream "drop" to me. I'm not sure why you are emailing the teacher instead of your kids emailing. Figuring out Canvas & paying attention are their jobs so not much pity for those things. Some teachers use a variety of review strategies to teach the kids multiple ways to do things with the understanding that they should figure out what works best for them & use it going forward.

On the quiz content, I would appreciate a vocab list to study from, but foreign language is cumulative, so as long as those words & concepts have been covered, they should be fair game.

Edited September 16, 2020 by RootAnn
Typo

[8filltheheart]

Well, my opinion might not be overly helpful since I don't outsource in general.  But, I would completely separate myself from everything you posted and ask myself, "What is the objective I have for my kids in taking this class and are my kids' academic needs being well-served by it? Is there an alternative approach that would better serve their needs?"

FWIW, my personal opinion is that if technology is inhibiting the methodology and my kids' feeling of success, I would run the other direction.  But, that is easy for me to say b/c I find ways to make things work for our family with our family being the #1 priority.  A class like that would leave me beyond frustrated and would impact our homeschool negatively.  (I very much dislike feeling irritated.  I'd rather just do it myself.  😉 )

Edited September 16, 2020 by 8FillTheHeart

[cintinative]

5 minutes ago, RootAnn said:

 

On the quiz content, I would appreciate a vocab list to study from, but foreign language is cumulative, so as long as those words & concepts have been covered, they should be fair game.

Would you count playing a game on another website to be covering it? Because that was our situation today. None of the vocab was listed anywhere. We had to infer it from what was in the game we had to play. 

[Matryoshka]

I can see how an asynchronous class wouldn't be as fun - or effective.  I wouldn't think a kid who didn't like that was just someone who didn't like foreign language. I've often thought of offering online Spanish classes myself, but I couldn't do them that cheaply and not put my local tutoring prices in jeopardy (I'm in a high COL area) - I'd have to charge about double that - it's hard to compete with people living in places where costs are way lower.  But I'd also offer 3 hours (2x/week) of live classes - I basically did this same thing IRL and then later hybrid (one in-person, one Zoom class/week) for a couple of years, so I know I could do a good job online.  Maybe next year...

Anyway, it's hard to say if you should drop it.  The not knowing what vocab to study and the random games would drive me nuts, have to admit.  Can you still get your money back?

Edited September 16, 2020 by Matryoshka

[8filltheheart]

4 minutes ago, cintinative said:

Would you count playing a game on another website to be covering it? Because that was our situation today. None of the vocab was listed anywhere. We had to infer it from what was in the game we had to play. 

I have found that foreign languages are better learned through other methodologies than strictly working with a limited vocabulary.  Watching movies, listening to music, etc all expand their vocabulary and hearing the language a lot helps them learn the accents, etc.  When they first start learning a language, if everything was limited to mastered vocabulary, it would be a very limited game!  

Are they being graded on the game?  I would be annoyed if the game was supposed to reflect their mastery, but if it is for fun exposure to the language, why not?

[Miss Tick]

If this is not a high school class I would grin and bear it. If it is a high school class I would probably try to find an alternative. One concern would be that the underlying disorganization means that they won't cover a reasonable amount of topics this year, which would make switching to a smoother provider more frustrating next year. 

For me to learn the vocabulary, I would need a list that I could study outside of class time. Making the list at home isn't a big deal, except that foreign languages have a lot of details like gender and case, and there isn't a lot of point to learning vocabulary if you are going to have to go back and learn them all over with gender associated.

[Matryoshka]

5 minutes ago, 8FillTheHeart said:

I have found that foreign languages are better learned through other methodologies than strictly working with a limited vocabulary.  Watching movies, listening to music, etc all expand their vocabulary and hearing the language a lot helps them learn the accents, etc.  When they first start learning a language, if everything was limited to mastered vocabulary, it would be a very limited game!  

Are they being graded on the game?  I would be annoyed if the game was supposed to reflect their mastery, but if it is for fun exposure to the language, why not?

I think that's true for kids who are really interested in language and are language sponges, like your dd seems to be, and well, me.  I learned most of my language through immersion and self-teaching and just being really interested.  But now that I've taught languages, I realize that the vast majority of kids need a more structured approach, especially at the beginning.  You need to get them over a 'hump' where they've got enough working vocab and basic grammar that it starts to come together.  Most kids just don't have enough innate interest to do the more immersive, whole-language type model (barring moving to a country and doing true immersion!).

[Sebastian (a lady)]

If you are homeschooling, then an outside provider is a tool you have chosen. It it doesn't suit your needs, you are free to pick a different tool.

That said, 

I used Canvas for my graduate certificate program. If you upload a file, the name shows on the assignment screen. If you put something in the text box, that shows up. You can go to the assignment page and see what you have submitted. 

I would consider Quizzlet games as a nice to have, not the limit on what is testable.  There are format limitations in Quizzlet, which may be driving the switching between platforms. 

One suggestion I would make is to download the Canvas app. I used that a lot to double check my homework submissions were in.

[Sebastian (a lady)]

On the vocabulary, I would encourage your kid to ask about this. Students should know what words they are expected to be learning. 

If there is a book, they may be expected to learn any new words in each chapter. If there is no book, they should ask what words they are accountable for and in what forms (plurals, verb conjugation, masculine & feminine forms). 

I would encourage your kids to create paper flashcards. The process of making them helps with learning. 3x5 cards cut in half are a great size.

If the vocabulary is all in Quizzlet, look for a button that allows you to see all terms. That can be printed out as a vocab list.

[BusyMom5]

It isnt a good fit- and I agree that learning Spanish online like this would be no fun at all.  I don't think anything you posted indicates a bad teacher, but it still comes down to not being a good fit for your student right now.   Your choices are to push ahead or just stop now and find another elective.  Leave Spanish for a year where he can do a real class.  Also, not all colleges require a Foreign Language now, so he may choose to do an extra science, math, English or Social studies class instead. 

[8filltheheart]

29 minutes ago, Matryoshka said:

I think that's true for kids who are really interested in language and are language sponges, like your dd seems to be, and well, me.  I learned most of my language through immersion and self-teaching and just being really interested.  But now that I've taught languages, I realize that the vast majority of kids need a more structured approach, especially at the beginning.  You need to get them over a 'hump' where they've got enough working vocab and basic grammar that it starts to come together.  Most kids just don't have enough innate interest to do the more immersive, whole-language type model (barring moving to a country and doing true immersion!).

I'm not suggesting that immersion is all that the students need.  I am saying that if the teacher is asking them to do things that don't only incorporate their limited vocabulary (like playing an online Spanish game) that there is nothing wrong with that in and of itself if it isn't being given a grade like they should know all of the vocabulary.  It is a game.   I would expect that starting to recognize words in context is the longer term objective.  

[73349]

...

Edited October 2, 2020 by Carolina Wren

[cintinative]

2 hours ago, whitehawk said:

What was your reason for picking this provider in the first place (as opposed to teaching it yourself or picking a different provider)?

If there's no text, I would not consider it acceptable for a language class not to have a list of vocabulary words to study. Students are not going to be able to pick it all up from a video.

I am just catching up.  Originally I thought we were going to take Spanish at co-op. Then Covid happened. Also I didn't get information on the teacher or methodology until late August.  The proposed method was more immersion via reading and listening and little to no grammar. I didn't want that.  So that meant co-op was out (Covid or not).

For this class, there is no text. I am totally okay with learning via games. I think that is useful. What I  think is weird is that we played three games today with a total of 70 vocab words and those will be on the quiz next week but we don't have any list of them on her class website or in her materials. 

Less than a couple of weeks in, I talked to a friend who teaches Spanish about dropping and running a class at home using Avancemos. She seemed really hesitant for me to drop based on the issues I had shared with her at that point. The advantage to Avancemos is we could pick our own pacing. The negative is that I am not a native speaker. I did take some Spanish, but I am not going to get the pronunciation right.  I think that was her concern. 

It might have been missed in the thread, but this class does have one hour of weekly live conversation practice with the teacher. There are about eight kids in that. 

I am not sure what other options I have at this point. I don't know that we could switch into another class this far in if it is live.  We could potentially drop mid-year, but as I said upthread, there are scope and sequence differences between curriculum/providers and I think that would be really hard to work through by myself.  

Someone upthread asked about the class content--I have no fear we are not learning what we should at this point. This class has a heavy workload. We are learning 60-70 new words a week plus grammar concepts plus projects.  

I think I might have caught all the questions before whitehawk's post. I will read the rest!  😃

Edited September 17, 2020 by cintinative

[8filltheheart]

14 minutes ago, cintinative said:

I am just catching up.  Originally I thought we were going to take Spanish at co-op. Then Covid happened. Also I didn't get information on the teacher or methodology until late August.  The proposed method was more immersion via reading and listening and little to no grammar. I didn't want that.  So that meant co-op was out (Covid or not).

For this class, there is no text. I am totally okay with learning via games. I think that is useful. What I  think is weird is that we played three games today with a total of 70 vocab words and those will be on the quiz next week but we don't have any list of them on her class website or in her materials. 

Less than a couple of weeks in, I talked to a friend who teaches Spanish about dropping and running a class at home using Avancemos. She seemed really hesitant based on the issues I had shared with her at that point. The advantage to Avancemos is we could pick our own pacing. The negative is that I am not a native speaker. I did take some Spanish, but I am not going to get the pronunciation right.  

It might have been missed in the thread, but this class does have one hour of weekly live conversation practice with the teacher. There are about eight kids in that. 

I am not sure what other options I have at this point. I don't know that we could switch into another class this far in if it is live.  We could potentially drop mid-year, but as I said upthread, there are scope and sequence differences between curriculum/providers and I think that would be really hard to work through by myself.  

Someone upthread asked about the class content--I have no fear we are not learning what we should at this point. This class has a heavy workload. We are learning 60-70 new words a week plus grammar concepts plus projects.  

I think I might have caught all the questions before whitehawk's post. I will read the rest!  😃

No way I would stay with the class, then.  I think you need a textbook for a grammar/vocabulary base.  

[cintinative]

Just now, 8FillTheHeart said:

No way I would stay with the class, then.  I think you need a textbook for a grammar/vocabulary base.  

Did you teach Spanish at home by chance? What did you use? 

[cintinative]

duplicate post. This new forum design is going to take me awhile to get used to!

Edited September 17, 2020 by cintinative

[8filltheheart]

1 minute ago, cintinative said:

Did you teach Spanish at home by chance? What did you use? 

Spanish was only with my oldest 3 which was so long ago that I don't remember anymore.  (Not to mention all 3 of them lived in Brazil, so they all had exposure to Portuguese.)

But, I would recommend finding a textbook and then adding in audio components.  (FInd something they don't mind watching in English and then rewatching it in Spanish. It could be anything.  YouTube is full of options. Or movies they like in English watch dubbed in Spanish.)   Play games like she had them doing, etc.  You can easily build your own Spanish credit that way.

[Matryoshka]

1 hour ago, cintinative said:

I am just catching up.  Originally I thought we were going to take Spanish at co-op. Then Covid happened. Also I didn't get information on the teacher or methodology until late August.  The proposed method was more immersion via reading and listening and little to no grammar. I didn't want that.  So that meant co-op was out (Covid or not).

For this class, there is no text. I am totally okay with learning via games. I think that is useful. What I  think is weird is that we played three games today with a total of 70 vocab words and those will be on the quiz next week but we don't have any list of them on her class website or in her materials. 

Less than a couple of weeks in, I talked to a friend who teaches Spanish about dropping and running a class at home using Avancemos. She seemed really hesitant for me to drop based on the issues I had shared with her at that point. The advantage to Avancemos is we could pick our own pacing. The negative is that I am not a native speaker. I did take some Spanish, but I am not going to get the pronunciation right.  I think that was her concern. 

It might have been missed in the thread, but this class does have one hour of weekly live conversation practice with the teacher. There are about eight kids in that. 

I am not sure what other options I have at this point. I don't know that we could switch into another class this far in if it is live.  We could potentially drop mid-year, but as I said upthread, there are scope and sequence differences between curriculum/providers and I think that would be really hard to work through by myself.  

Someone upthread asked about the class content--I have no fear we are not learning what we should at this point. This class has a heavy workload. We are learning 60-70 new words a week plus grammar concepts plus projects.  

I think I might have caught all the questions before whitehawk's post. I will read the rest!  😃

I am not usually a huge textbook fan, but I have to say I really like Avancemos.   It introduces the vocab and grammar in really clear ways, doesn't randomly throw in new stuff you haven't learned yet, but does keep coming back and reusing and reinforcing what you have learned in a really seamless manner so you get continual practice on older concepts while new ones are being introduced.  If you buy the online components (last I checked, you could get them for only about $18), there are also videos, online games, flashcards, extra practice worksheets, and more.  I do think it's much harder to self-teach - having someone to help with pronunciation and proactively explain grammar and answer questions is always better - any chance your Spanish teacher friend would lend a hand?  

That's an insane amount of vocab per week in the current class, especially with no real teaching.  Asynchronous really is just new-internet-speak for self-taught, random hour of conversation additional or not.

[cintinative]

1 hour ago, Matryoshka said:

I am not usually a huge textbook fan, but I have to say I really like Avancemos.   It introduces the vocab and grammar in really clear ways, doesn't randomly throw in new stuff you haven't learned yet, but does keep coming back and reusing and reinforcing what you have learned in a really seamless manner so you get continual practice on older concepts while new ones are being introduced.  If you buy the online components (last I checked, you could get them for only about $18), there are also videos, online games, flashcards, extra practice worksheets, and more.  I do think it's much harder to self-teach - having someone to help with pronunciation and proactively explain grammar and answer questions is always better - any chance your Spanish teacher friend would lend a hand?  

That's an insane amount of vocab per week in the current class, especially with no real teaching.  Asynchronous really is just new-internet-speak for self-taught, random hour of conversation additional or not.

Thanks for this. We covered Latin previously and I know that it is totally different but I didn't expect this to be such a hard adjustment. Every week we have had 60-80 new words.  Also today's "write down the words from the game" was made more complicated by the fact there was no English translation. Is that a duck, or a goose?  Is that a hen? Or should I write down chicken?  I did a lot of googling.  

I was just paging through my Avancemos books and I think we would just have to start over. There are things we have covered, but we did not cover Quien es? or days of the week, etc. I think with the audio and video they are going to get a lot more exposure to the language than they are currently getting with games, and I like how it put things in the frame of a conversation.  

[cintinative]

5 hours ago, Sebastian (a lady) said:

 

I used Canvas for my graduate certificate program. If you upload a file, the name shows on the assignment screen. If you put something in the text box, that shows up. You can go to the assignment page and see what you have submitted. 

She must have changed the settings. We did a test run after one of the assignments they posted didn't take. I watched my child type something in the text box, upload a file, and then go back and find it only accepted one of the two.  You can type a comment on the upload page, but you can't submit a text box and upload a file with the way it is set up for them.  Shrug.  

[Matryoshka]

9 minutes ago, cintinative said:

Thanks for this. We covered Latin previously and I know that it is totally different but I didn't expect this to be such a hard adjustment. Every week we have had 60-80 new words.  Also today's "write down the words from the game" was made more complicated by the fact there was no English translation. Is that a duck, or a goose?  Is that a hen? Or should I write down chicken?  I did a lot of googling.  

I was just paging through my Avancemos books and I think we would just have to start over. There are things we have covered, but we did not cover Quien es? or days of the week, etc. I think with the audio and video they are going to get a lot more exposure to the language than they are currently getting with games, and I like how it put things in the frame of a conversation.  

Yeah, I'd just start over. But it's a really good text, and I highly, highly recommend getting the online components.

[cintinative]

1 minute ago, Matryoshka said:

Yeah, I'd just start over. But it's a really good text, and I highly, highly recommend getting the online components.

I wouldn't try this without them!  I am trying to figure out how to order them. It looks like if I buy a new student text from Christianbook it comes with it, or I can spend $40 on The Curriculum Store for just the code. I am guessing I can get it from the publisher. I am trying to find the thread where bygrace asked about it.

[Matryoshka]

Yes, you can buy the student stuff right from the publisher - if you look in the online catalog, there's an isbn, and last I looked it was only about $18, and that includes a separate login for the teacher that gives you all the answer keys, tests, and other materials.  I just bought used textbooks to go with it (actually, the whole textbook is also included online,but I'm old and like a print copy too).  An edition or two older than what's online shouldn't matter; the differences are small, at least last I looked. 

[EKS]

Coming in late here, but it would drive me crazy not to have expectations regarding vocabulary and grammar written down.  I'd drop the class.

[cintinative]

I am waiting to hear if I can get a refund for 2nd semester. I don't know. I hadn't considered that I might not be able to. Sigh.

[SanDiegoMom]

Coming in late but that sounds like a disaster to me.  My kids are taking Spanish right now through public (virtual) school and there are 3-5 live meetings a week to practice speaking, worksheets, videos in Spanish, and a textbook that has all the words and that they are working through chapter by chapter.  If there was no textbook, my kids would be lost.  My son WAS lost until he realized there was a textbook -- he was trying to fill out a worksheet and spiraling with anxiety because he couldn't remember any of the words! 

And if they took that for a year and it was that disorganized and with little ability to review, how will they go on to a second year of Spanish with a different teacher and not be completely behind?  Yikes!

[RootAnn]

I hope you can get a refund for 2nd semester, but I'd probably bail on the class now vs. at the semester break if you plan to switch to Avancemos.

If you get the 2nd semester refund, I'd use those funds on italki (starting in January) for once per week convo practice. 

[Roadrunner]

Walk away if it doesn’t fit. 
 

I actually think textbooks are a great way to get the basic foundation. Immersion through videos and reading is much easier done once you have at least a year of basics. 
 

Look into hiring a native speaker once a week for reinforcement of whatever textbook you chose. You can probably get a Spanish speaker relatively cheaply through online services like italkie. 

[cintinative]

I found out I can get a refund for 2nd semester. And it looks like I can buy lesson plans and tests from Kolbe that align with Avancemos.   I have not heard of italkie but that sounds like a great option.

[Matryoshka]

1 minute ago, cintinative said:

I found out I can get a refund for 2nd semester. And it looks like I can buy lesson plans and tests from Kolbe that align with Avancemos.   I have not heard of italkie but that sounds like a great option.

There are free tests at three differentlevels already included in the online materials. ..

[cintinative]

Just now, Matryoshka said:

There are free tests at three differentlevels already included in the online materials. ..

I was more looking for the lesson plans. 😃 The teacher book does seem to lay it out, but Kolbe's weekly assignments look like a great format to give to my kids to refer to.   

I was completely unable to get an educator account on HMH yesterday. Something is up with the website--I haven't tried yet today.  I did find another place that sells the "homeschool access" code which appears to include the teacher stuff. Do you know if it would be best for me to have a separate student access for my 2nd student?  I was told I can use them both on the same account but if  it tracks progress and stuff it might not be the best situation.

[RootAnn]

When you are ready for italki, ask in here for a referral code. With your first $20 purchase, you get an extra $10 and your referrer gets $10, too.

[Farrar]

It sounds like you're going to drop it, which I agree with.

I'll just say that the first thing on your list, which several posters seemed to ignore - about the vagueness of what would be on the test - was a red flag to me. When I learned there was no text, it became a red flag of the size you see over a truck lot off the highway. Massive.

Why do teachers think this is okay?!? I find it infuriating. You can keep it loose and cover a ton of stuff in a variety of ways, but then evaluate with tools other than tests. You can keep it loose and cover things in a variety of ways, but then draw up a clear list of information for the test. You can use a text/reference and refer to exactly which parts will be on the test. What you can't do is use a ton of different things, keeping it loose... and then just hold a test that covers "anything we did." That's not fair to students. If there's not a clear reference point, then that's poor instruction.

[Matryoshka]

2 hours ago, cintinative said:

I was more looking for the lesson plans. 😃 The teacher book does seem to lay it out, but Kolbe's weekly assignments look like a great format to give to my kids to refer to.   

I was completely unable to get an educator account on HMH yesterday. Something is up with the website--I haven't tried yet today.  I did find another place that sells the "homeschool access" code which appears to include the teacher stuff. Do you know if it would be best for me to have a separate student access for my 2nd student?  I was told I can use them both on the same account but if  it tracks progress and stuff it might not be the best situation.

You don't need a teacher account (I don't think?), and you don't need the homeschool package unless you need brand-new books - I was cheap and bought used old versions.  You just need the student online materials, which include a separate login for a teacher that gives you extra materials your kids can't access with their login.  I literally just called their 800 number and gave them the ISBN code from their catalog.  Now, I was teaching an outside class to multiple students and told them so, so maybe they did set up an account for me??  It's all fuzzy in my brain, but I did have to talk to a local sales rep before ordering, so maybe that did happen...  You have two kids, though, right?  I only was teaching as few as three sometimes, lol, but then I had 4-6 licenses total because I had one.  You could buy two student accounts - I had each of my students buy one, and I bought one.  In the same household, they could likely share, but maybe you're right that they don't want to sell just one license for a 'class'...  LOL, or maybe it's just way easier for you to just buy a homeschool package!

The homeschool package might track progress or something?  The online student package I used didn't track stuff per se... it did have a place where I, the teacher, could 'assign' stuff electronically to each student, and also it had automatic grading which I could look up per student, but I found all those tools totally glitchy and more of a pain than it was worth.  I ended up manually assigning work, and the computer grading was so buggy as to be useless - it was way easier to keep track of manually than using the online tools.  Remember someone else posted about their kids' online Latin class marking something wrong for an extra space?  Like that.  Extra spaces, missing accent marks, article or no article, wrong article, even synonyms... all those things would be marked as totally wrong, where I'd at most take off partial credit or in the case of synonyms or including an article, mark it completely right.  The online quizzes were bad but the tests were worse - the first couple I had the kids take online and the system just ate them.  I ended up printing the tests and manually grading them (there are answer keys).  If you don't bother with online grading or assigning, I bet they could share one account, as it would be mostly to watch videos.  The rest of the good stuff is in the teacher materials anyway, and there's only one of you.

Online stuff that's really worth it - The Videos and audio files most importantly - the program is a shadow of itself without those.  There are also lots of online games for practice as well as PDFs of an entire workbook PLUS extra practice sheet PDFs (these were perhaps even better than the workbook pages!).  Plus tests (PDFs and to administer online, but as I said before the online versions were a disaster) and Vocab quizzes that I did give online but just graded manually because of the bugginess.  There are also extra reading assignments and exercises online that I used - but I'm fluent, so I was using them to check reading fluency and comprehension; that's harder if you're doing it at home without a fluent teacher.

I do have to say in your situation that Lesson Plans/weekly assignments like Kolbe's offering could be quite helpful - especially to navigate all the extra stuff online!

Edited September 17, 2020 by Matryoshka

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4 hours ago, RootAnn said:

When you are ready for italki, ask in here for a referral code. With your first $20 purchase, you get an extra $10 and your referrer gets $10, too.

Have you used it for Spanish and do you have a certain person you can recommend for Spanish? PM me if you do. Thank you.