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Ugh ... I really tried!


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I have really tried to like my daughter's boyfriend but I just don't.

They have been dating for over 2 years now. I don't see him all that often because she has her own apartment about an hour from me, and when she comes to visit she does not always bring him. On the surface he seems nice, maybe just a bit quiet. But then after a while I realized he is not just quiet, he literally does not engage at all in any conversation! My family can be rambunctious and loud so maybe that intimidates him, but even when it is a quiet, small group he doesn't engage. I do notice, though, that sometimes when I am talking about something to my daughter if he does not agree with what I am saying he will lean over to her and quietly say "that's not true" or something like that, but never to the person talking.

The last time she visited with him was 2 weekends ago. She had period cramps really bad and was basically on the couch with a heating pad and ibuprofen the whole time. And he was quite attentive to her by rubbing her back, etc. But as I was watching him rubbing her back I am thinking "I should be happy that this guy is being so nice and attentive to her when she is uncomfortable but instead there is just something off about the whole thing." I don't think he is weird in any perverted way ... I'm not saying that. I just don't trust his motivations. My gut doesn't get a good feeling.

My daughter has had a tumultuous couple of years with our divorce and I feel like if she was completely mentally healthy and strong she would not be with this guy. I worry that he keeps her weak.

My stepfather was extremely controlling to my mother. Every morning he would lay out a banana and vitamins for her to take, he would handle all difficult things around the house, he was always in charge. On the surface it seemed like it was all done in a caring way, but eventually it turned into complete control. I am worried that is what this guy is like.

They are planning on moving across country next year. If nothing changes I may sit down with her before the move just to express my concerns but I worry that will blow up. Ugh

 

 

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Yes, trying to have a serious 'I don't like your boyfriend' talk before they move away will blow up.

In spite of your gut feeling, I don't think you have really identified any red flags for control in this relationship. You just don't like him, and it's most likely because he isn't relating to you at all, therefore you don't have any real relationship with him -- except that he reminds you of someone else sometimes.

But really. This is just one of those "to each their own" situation. Your dd likes him, and she is the one who is with him. It's her own taste that governs her choices... and these 'flaws' seem very much like a matter of taste/personality not a matter of safety or health in the relationship. (If you remain concerned about health and safety, sending her off with a message that you are totally behind her and trust her in every possible way is much better anyways.)

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My 2 cents having BTDT with my own mother...if you want any sort of healthy relationship with your adult daughter, stay out of her relationship. 
Despite what you might think, you do not know her better than she knows herself. And it doesn’t sound like you know him almost at all. It is without a doubt best to keep your judgement to yourself.

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If you want to talk to her about it do it now. Don't wait until right before they move. I would express concerns without in any way criticizing the boyfriend. Share with her the dynamics of your mother's relationship with your step-father and tell her your concerns. I would say something like "I'm sure boyfriend isn't like this, but here is an example of an unhealthy relationship so watch out for these red flags". 

I would also try to get to know the boyfriend better. It could be that he is just introverted and doesn't feel comfortable with your family. Let your daughter know that you want to get to know him and try to arrange some family activity you can all do together.

Susan in TX

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My dh was like that around my family for years. They’d try and engage him to get to know him and he’d give one word answers and generally rebuff those attempts. He was very quiet around them. Luckily my parents could see that he treated me amazingly well and never made it an issue except for occasionally asking me if they had done something to offend him. We’ve been ridiculously happy together for 28 years. He’s pretty reserved around anyone he doesn’t know, but nothing like he is with my folks. To this day, I still don’t know why he is so guarded with them, but I’ve given up trying to understand and let it go. FWIW, the harder they tried, the more guarded he got. He makes some small talk now, and answers questions in several complete sentences, so we all consider that a win and move on 😄. He’s very solicitous of them in acts of service which they appreciate - they’ll just never really know him well.

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I know if I talk to her about it it could be like walking through a minefield. The last thing I want is to alienate her so if I did speak with her I would probably take a roundabout approach. I am going to try to spend more time with him to see if I can get him to warm up a bit. 

It was just the gut feeling that I had. Not like a "boy, he is quiet I wish he would talk more" but more like "Something just isn't right here". 

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Have you had much opportunity to interact with him on his turf?  Do you know what his interests are?  Have you tried engaging him in conversation about those things?  Have you asked your daughter what qualities she sees in him that she admires?  

He may be quiet, shy, and use to a less rambunctious environment.  He may think it is impolite to interject in a conversation.  DH is quiet; he was an only child in a quiet household, and he is an introvert.  He says that by the time he has processes what has been said by someone in my family and has something to say, the conversation has jumped forward so much he is lost, and that everyone is talking over each other and interrupting.  

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1 hour ago, Susan in TX said:

If you want to talk to her about it do it now. Don't wait until right before they move. I would express concerns without in any way criticizing the boyfriend. Share with her the dynamics of your mother's relationship with your step-father and tell her your concerns. I would say something like "I'm sure boyfriend isn't like this, but here is an example of an unhealthy relationship so watch out for these red flags". 

This is how I'd talk to her, too. Don't even mention the boyfriend at all. Ask what she's looking for in a husband/marriage. Go even further if you can and ask what's important to her when she's a parent. Where does she see herself in a year? 5 years? 10 years? Speak in generalities about boyfriends, but in specifics about what she's looking for. I'm not sure I'd wait until you're face to face. Can you ask in such a way on the phone to open a discussion? If she asks you if you're asking her about this because you don't like her boyfriend, I would sidestep that question by telling her you're hoping she will think about what her goals are and relate those goals to any boyfriend, not just this one. You can also tell her you haven't had a chance to get to know him well enough to know if you don't like him. (At this point, you could mention some things you've seen that you're curious about. Don't be critical!) Your goal isn't to change her mind about boyfriend, but rather to encourage her to think about her goals and how others fit into them. You might also be able to work your own marriage/divorce into the discussion as an example  if it has any bearing. 

One thing I found out about my niece a few weeks ago astounded me. She's a smart college educated young woman who was living with her boyfriend. About a year ago, she broke up with him and moved back in with her parents. She mentioned to my sister a few weeks back that if my sister hadn't offered their extra room, she would probably still be with him even though she knew he wasn't right for her because she didn't know how to get out. There was no abuse, but the boyfriend needed a mommy to take care of him and she knew she didn't want that. Despite having a job, dn couldn't afford her own place and felt stuck.

All that to say sometimes young women don't know how to handle situations and are unable to come up with or ask for help. Talking to her about her goals might give her a way to think about what she wants. And perhaps you could also mention that she'll always have someone to talk to or a place to stay if she needs to leave for whatever reason.

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I am not sure what nefarious "motivations" he can have. Is your DD is an heiress?

I am extremely extroverted and talkative. Both my kids' significant others are extremely introverted and quiet. It was several years before I had an actual conversation with DS' gf, even though she stayed at our house a lot and we shared many family dinners. DD's bf is a listener, not a talker, and with him, too, it took a few years before we could chat comfortably.

none of what you write raises any red flag for me. Are you sure that your experience with your stepfather doesn't cloud how you see their relationship? None of the things you mentioned indicate that he is controlling.

Edited by regentrude
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If you ask my in-laws, they will probably say the same things about me. I don’t like noisy people who are constantly talking about nothing. They are also exclusionary because they talk about “we always do things this way” as if I am weird. They rub me the wrong way by assuming that because I married their son, I automatically follow and uphold their family values. I keep quiet, always am polite to them, talk to them as needed, don’t feed them unnecessary details to gossip about and leave. My husband and I have been together for 25 years, I am not controlling and I have no ill will towards my in-laws.

Edited by mathnerd
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BTDT.  The first time my dd was with somebody in a situation that was not great, there was no way I could have said anything without a huge explosion.  I just always, always kept a non-judgmental ear and let her know I would always have a place for her.  We talked about everything except her relationship and how I thought it was awful.  Eventually, she opened up about it and I never told her how I felt and finally, it ended.

This last time around we were in a different place in our relationship and I straight told her what I thought and why and it turned out that all of her friends -and even she - agreed with that assessment.

Easy for people to say what they would do, but sometimes as a parent, you feel like you don’t want to lose your kid (as rational or irrational as that fear may be).   Imo, probably always best to simply always keep communication open and offer a safe place.

Is there a difference of religion between you and bf?  That could also explain his behaviour and your feelings.  

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Well, what I notice in your post is that you said he is quiet and not confrontational and that your family is rambunctious. In my opinion-from-afar, that is what is attractive to your dd, because the divorce has most likely made her crave quiet and non-conflict-generating people. 

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haha No, my daughter is not an heiress so I know he is not after her money.

I am trying to not let past experiences with people cloud my judgement. I also worry that the divorce and all the horrible results of that may have affected who my daughter picked to get involved with.

I will apply some of the advice here if and when I do speak with her. I will try to keep it as general as possible. I want to be clear; I'm not bashing him because he is quiet or shy. That I can deal with. I just get a bad vibe from this guy. I think he would be very happy if my daughter split from the family and never spoke to us again.

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I don't think you should say anything.

If you really have to do something, how about trying to get to know him better instead. It sounds like there are some barriers to really getting to know him - you have different styles and personalities. Maybe you can play a talkative board game - Say Anything, Apples to Apples, Dix It, something along those lines. I'm just trying to think of ways to structure conversation so you are all forced to interact a bit more. And I do think you could say that to your dd. "Dd, I feel like I don't know Boyfriend that well. He seems like he really cares about you, but he's so quiet compared to us. I hope we're not intimidating to him. And now you're looking at moving. Maybe we can (suggest activity that will encourage real interaction) a couple times before you go."

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13 minutes ago, Danae said:

The only thing that would raise a flag for me in what you wrote is whispering contradictions of what you say to your DD in your presence.  That's weird and rude.

Eh, depends on the context.

My FIL quoted President 45 as the gospel truth....on things that are flat out lies. I could see myself making snide side whispers.

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I have no good advice, only two personal stories that I'll share in case they might be helpful --

DH and I had a similar reaction to a man that his sister dated. We both had an intense, visceral, "danger! danger!" feeling about him from the moment we first met, but there was nothing specific we could name as a reason. So we held our opinions. She left him after a year or so of marriage, and after he started with physical, verbal and emotional abuse. FIL and MIL literally had to whisk her away one day while he was at work. She believes she was lucky to get out alive. That's been close to 30 years ago and DH and I still occasionally kick ourselves for not speaking out and (maybe) preventing that trauma. Hindsight, you know.

I'm sure my grandmother had similar misgivings as you about my DH when we were dating, based on some things my mother said. But my grandmother was totally wrong--he was (is) "just" a strong introvert. That was a long time ago, and before introvert/extrovert were common labels, and I think she had no reference for someone with his type of personality. She couldn't have been more wrong.

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In my experience prayer works better than sit down conversations...

Pray if he's good for her that it will become obvious to you.

Pray that if he's bad for her it will become obvious to her.

Then, after a lot of prayer, ask her what she loves about him.  After that, stay out of it.

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Quote

I am trying to not let past experiences with people cloud my judgement. I also worry that the divorce and all the horrible results of that may have affected who my daughter picked to get involved with.

 

We all try not to let past experiences of other people cloud our judgment of new people. We don't always succeed. And it does look like your worries about this boyfriend are wholly wrapped up in your messy divorce.

That doesn't mean you're wrong. None of us has anything like the perspective necessary to see this.

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When I was in my late teens, early twenties I had a toxic relationship that turned into a disaster of a marriage.  When we were dating, I presented on the outside like everything was perfect, that he was the perfect guy for me.  He was always polite as well.  On the inside, I pushed aside doubts and reasoned through so many red flags.  My family and friends never said a word, but I came to find out after my divorce that every single one of my close friends and family did not like him and had a bad gut feeling about him.  There was nothing specific that they could point to, just that something was "off".  

I remember feeling so hurt and confused when I found out that nobody tried to intervene and tell me their reservations.  I would have listened, or at least paid attention to someone else who had misgivings along with my own.  I doubted myself and my gut feeling about him.  So having someone else verbalize what I was feeling would have given me a life preserver in what felt like a drowning situation.

I don't know if your gut feeling is skewed by your own experiences or if feelings are telling you the truth, but speaking from my own past experience, I would encourage you to speak up to your daughter.  Do it in a round about way if you have to, definitely offer her a way out, anytime she might need it.

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I probably wouldn't say anything about the relationship yet, but keep working to deepen your relationship with your dd so that hopefully she'll feel comfortable in talking with you if she begins to have concerns herself.  I can certainly understand why you'd feel a little on edge given your own background.  I can have pretty strong instincts about people and I generally trust my instincts, but I've also been wrong.

But, would I'd do now is try and learn more about him from your dd...  You can ask her things like what are his interests, what's his family like, what do your dd and boyfriend like to do together, etc.   Not like you're interrogating her, but you could figure out a way to make it come up more naturally in conversations.  That would serve two purposes:  It gets your dd used to talking about him with you, and you'll be learning more about him too.

Depending on your relationship and your dd, you maybe could ask more personal questions about him too, such as is he comfortable at your home, since he seems very quiet.  Young adult kids take comments like that differently though...  Some wouldn't have any problem at all, and others would feel defensive.

Out of curiosity, does she have a sister?  There have been times when I know asking one of my dd's a personal question might feel awkward or prying, but if a sister asked, it would be fine.

Also, I have a relative who I'm quite sure has Asperger traits -- he's very high-functioning and it only shows itself very subtly, but he does the same whispering into the ear of his spouse thing.  He thinks he's whispering very quietly and going unnoticed, but everyone always hears and notices!  ha  :)  He's a super good man and we all love him.

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56 minutes ago, Medicmom2.0 said:

I guess I’ll be the dissenting voice and say trust your gut.  I had a very close family member who dated a guy who looked amazing on the surface, but several of us had that gut feeling. Unfortunately people did say things, without having specific red flags, and that drove her right to him.  After marriage he turned out to be a Very Bad Guy and it imploded spectacularly, and unfortunately by then involved children.  There really was no red flags to point to, just gut feelings that turned out correctly.

I am convinced those gut reactions are simply our unconscious putting together things that our conscious minds can’t.  
I think you have to tread carefully. It’s not just money that people can be after.  He may have surmised your DD was in a vulnerable and hurting place, and simply wants to be with someone he thinks he can control long term.


 The problem often seems to be how to convince your kid about your gut feeling without pushing them away.  Or maybe not even convince, just mention.   People can be awfully dramatic sometimes and if you are no longer talking to your kid, how can you know when to swoop her out of danger?  

Bleh, kids 🙄 (I was way worse than my dd, so I’m actually very grateful).

Edited by Ailaena
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3 hours ago, livetoread said:

My dh was like that around my family for years. They’d try and engage him to get to know him and he’d give one word answers and generally rebuff those attempts. He was very quiet around them. Luckily my parents could see that he treated me amazingly well and never made it an issue except for occasionally asking me if they had done something to offend him. We’ve been ridiculously happy together for 28 years. He’s pretty reserved around anyone he doesn’t know, but nothing like he is with my folks. ... He makes some small talk now, and answers questions in several complete sentences, so we all consider that a win and move on 😄. He’s very solicitous of them in acts of service which they appreciate - they’ll just never really know him well.

This, except we've only been married 23 years. My mother and aunt both admitted they thought he was weird. My aunt said she didn't like him for the longest time. My mom thinks my DH has changed but all he's changed is her mind because he quietly fixes, cleans, and takes care of things.

Regardless, I'm in the camp that suggests you not say anything -- just support your dd.

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5 hours ago, Home'scool said:

I have really tried to like my daughter's boyfriend but I just don't.

They have been dating for over 2 years now. I don't see him all that often because she has her own apartment about an hour from me, and when she comes to visit she does not always bring him. On the surface he seems nice, maybe just a bit quiet. But then after a while I realized he is not just quiet, he literally does not engage at all in any conversation! My family can be rambunctious and loud so maybe that intimidates him, but even when it is a quiet, small group he doesn't engage. I do notice, though, that sometimes when I am talking about something to my daughter if he does not agree with what I am saying he will lean over to her and quietly say "that's not true" or something like that, but never to the person talking.

The last time she visited with him was 2 weekends ago. She had period cramps really bad and was basically on the couch with a heating pad and ibuprofen the whole time. And he was quite attentive to her by rubbing her back, etc. But as I was watching him rubbing her back I am thinking "I should be happy that this guy is being so nice and attentive to her when she is uncomfortable but instead there is just something off about the whole thing." I don't think he is weird in any perverted way ... I'm not saying that. I just don't trust his motivations. My gut doesn't get a good feeling.

My daughter has had a tumultuous couple of years with our divorce and I feel like if she was completely mentally healthy and strong she would not be with this guy. I worry that he keeps her weak.

My stepfather was extremely controlling to my mother. Every morning he would lay out a banana and vitamins for her to take, he would handle all difficult things around the house, he was always in charge. On the surface it seemed like it was all done in a caring way, but eventually it turned into complete control. I am worried that is what this guy is like.

They are planning on moving across country next year. If nothing changes I may sit down with her before the move just to express my concerns but I worry that will blow up. Ugh

 

 

How old is he?  The bolded is extremely rude and it could just be immaturity. 

As far as expressing your concerns to your dd.....I understand what others are saying.  She is an adult and you don't get to decide....on the other hand if your own mother won't speak up when something seems off, who can you depend on to have your back?  

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What is he like with other people?  Is he quiet and reserved with everyone?  Or is it just with your family?  What does his social media suggest?

I would make a concerted effort to get to know him.

I would also talk to your daughter in general (not specific to this boyfriend) about relationships.

My husband and I were just talking about this the other night -- how I was so careful not to trust him at first because I was the child of divorced parents.  Even if your daughter is not aware of it, your marriage relationship is going to color her relationships in some way.  She needs to become aware of that.

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It's interesting reading this thread after having so so many threads where people say to trust your gut. Now, in this situation, most are saying not to. I will also be a dissenting voice. Exactly how a conversation should take place and what should be said, is definitely tricky. I would proceed with care, and with prayer for guidance; I like @wilrunner2's suggestions. But I wouldn't go along acting like everything is fine. When our oldest was dating someone, it was clear to dh and me that they were not a good match for each other--on both sides. We struggled with the situation deeply, realizing that we could wreck our relationship with our child. Eventually, we came to the conclusion that we would take the risk, because we value marriage and our child so much. We were not willing to act like everything was okay, see everything eventually fall apart, and then say, "Yeah, we wondered about that but didn't want to say anything," or something similar. Then we'd have to face his saying, "WHY didn't you say something??" So we spoke up about it, and he wasn't too happy with us. They did break up not too long afterward (I believe he was already seeing things, though he didn't admit it to us at the big conversation). Then ds told us that after they broke up, his friends were saying they saw red flags, but they didn't say anything to him about it beforehand, even when he asked them what they thought of her. At that point, he was upset with them rather than us.

We decided from that experience that we would be open with our kids about dating relationships. Marriage is too important of a decision for us to feel we shouldn't talk about it. I mean, we talk about friendships, college choices, career choices, and everything else. Why would we pretend we have no opinion when it comes to this big deal that could affect their whole life afterwards? (We are not controlling by any means, btw, and give our children a lot of freedom to make their adult decisions.) It has sometimes been uncomfortable. With one, the bf had some little red flags, but he matured a lot, and is now our much loved sil. I believe that our kids know we will speak the truth with them, so it makes them trust us more. On our part, we try to be fair and adjust our opinions, if needed. We don't go around being super critical and running every person they date through the wringer. But if there are red flags, we do find some way to bring up at least the issue, even if we have to be general about it.

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I was probably that way with part of ex-dh's family for some time. I come from a small quiet family, they were neither small nor quiet. It took years before I felt like they would even listen to me. People can also pick up vibes of not being liked and it can affect their interactions. 

I agree with maybe trying to interact with them elsewhere, someplace where he maybe more himself. 

I probably wouldn't have that talk, but I would probably ask her how she feels about him. The whole "I just want to make sure you're happy" conversation. 

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2 hours ago, Ailaena said:


 The problem often seems to be how to convince your kid about your gut feeling without pushing them away.  Or maybe not even convince, just mention.   People can be awfully dramatic sometimes and if you are no longer talking to your kid, how can you know when to swoop her out of danger?  

Bleh, kids 🙄 (I was way worse than my dd, so I’m actually very grateful).

I agree...  The young adulthood ages are the trickiest.  They're feeling very independent but their natural reactions are defensive.  Even when mentioning something in the nicest way possible.   And even if you're otherwise very close!   (I was once that kind of young adult!)

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3 hours ago, aaplank said:

When I was in my late teens, early twenties I had a toxic relationship that turned into a disaster of a marriage.  When we were dating, I presented on the outside like everything was perfect, that he was the perfect guy for me.  He was always polite as well.  On the inside, I pushed aside doubts and reasoned through so many red flags.  My family and friends never said a word, but I came to find out after my divorce that every single one of my close friends and family did not like him and had a bad gut feeling about him.  There was nothing specific that they could point to, just that something was "off".  

I remember feeling so hurt and confused when I found out that nobody tried to intervene and tell me their reservations.  I would have listened, or at least paid attention to someone else who had misgivings along with my own.  I doubted myself and my gut feeling about him.  So having someone else verbalize what I was feeling would have given me a life preserver in what felt like a drowning situation.

I don't know if your gut feeling is skewed by your own experiences or if feelings are telling you the truth, but speaking from my own past experience, I would encourage you to speak up to your daughter.  Do it in a round about way if you have to, definitely offer her a way out, anytime she might need it.

This was almost my exact experience.  I too needed a life preserver.

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He may just not be that into you. 

My husband is polite to my family, but he's a very different type of person compared to them. The only thing they have in common is me and DS.  Honesty, *I* don't have much in common with my family other than DNA and a shared history, which makes for tricky relationships.  I have 48+ years of history with them and I still struggle to find common ground.  I can't fault DH for not being chummy with my dad or BIL when *I* find it exhausting to relate to them.   

Maybe your daughter's bf is a jerk or maybe he's fine and you two simply don't like each other.  It's hard to tell what the situation is from what you've written.         

Edited by MissLemon
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I agree that if I saw red flags, I’d say something. But a gut feeling isn’t a red flag, IMO. Our gut feelings can be shaped by our own issues for better or worse. I wouldn’t ignore what you are feeling, but I wouldn’t act on it either. Tuck it away and see if anything adds or subtracts from it. In the meantime, there is nothing wrong with asking her general questions about her relationship goals to help her clarify her own thoughts and feelings, but unless you have more to go on, I would not speak up, personally.

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2 hours ago, hippiemamato3 said:

What about him  rubbing her back because she has cramps seems controlling?

The part which set off my concerns was this:

9 hours ago, Home'scool said:

sometimes when I am talking about something to my daughter if he does not agree with what I am saying he will lean over to her and quietly say "that's not true" or something like that, but never to the person talking.

But context is everything. We don't know if (forgive me, Home'scool) the situation is Home'scool quoting Q Anon conspiracy theories which the bf knows make his gf anxious ( hyperbole, but you get the point), or if it's Home'scool saying "You know I love you and I'll always be here if you need me."

Obviously contradicting the latter is a real concern, while contradicting the former might just better have been spoken later in private, but was genuinely intended to be supportive. It's all a matter of context and degree, and we don't know. But I do think the potential is there for that to be really nasty, or on the other hand innocuous.

Gut feelings have weight for me.

I do agree that the best plan atm is finding more ways to get to know the bf better, while having general conversations about relationships if Home'scool can do that without raising her dd's hackles. And, most of all, making sure communication stays open and the dd knows she has a place and support at home if it's needed.

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27 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

If I Had a gut feeling about someone in a loved ones life I would probably do a background check on them. Which I know many think is wrong.  Hopefully I would find that there was nothing concerning.  

 a background check will only turn up obvious things.

there are far more things - that aren't "illegal" (like being a control freak), that wont' show up on a background check.

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I think the quiet - Thats a lie - comment is a red flag.  He isn't addressing you, he is almost driving a wedge between you, making you a liar, to distrust what you say.  As if he's emotionally isolating her, so that he is the one that she relies on for truth.  No cool, but necessarily bad, he could be immature or just not have good people skills.

I probably would bring things up occasionally,  but very carefully and not specifically.  Maybe something like  "I read an article a few days ago about.... similar situation..."  and let her know dge can always talk to you,  move back in, not a failure if things don't work out.  Don't make it about him, make it sboutvher happiness and health.   You can even use yourself as an example.  

Best if luck- I do think parenting adults may take more nerve than toddlers! 

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11 hours ago, Home'scool said:

I have really tried to like my daughter's boyfriend but I just don't.

They have been dating for over 2 years now. I don't see him all that often because she has her own apartment about an hour from me, and when she comes to visit she does not always bring him. On the surface he seems nice, maybe just a bit quiet. But then after a while I realized he is not just quiet, he literally does not engage at all in any conversation! My family can be rambunctious and loud so maybe that intimidates him, but even when it is a quiet, small group he doesn't engage. I do notice, though, that sometimes when I am talking about something to my daughter if he does not agree with what I am saying he will lean over to her and quietly say "that's not true" or something like that, but never to the person talking.

The last time she visited with him was 2 weekends ago. She had period cramps really bad and was basically on the couch with a heating pad and ibuprofen the whole time. And he was quite attentive to her by rubbing her back, etc. But as I was watching him rubbing her back I am thinking "I should be happy that this guy is being so nice and attentive to her when she is uncomfortable but instead there is just something off about the whole thing." I don't think he is weird in any perverted way ... I'm not saying that. I just don't trust his motivations. My gut doesn't get a good feeling.

My daughter has had a tumultuous couple of years with our divorce and I feel like if she was completely mentally healthy and strong she would not be with this guy. I worry that he keeps her weak.

My stepfather was extremely controlling to my mother. Every morning he would lay out a banana and vitamins for her to take, he would handle all difficult things around the house, he was always in charge. On the surface it seemed like it was all done in a caring way, but eventually it turned into complete control. I am worried that is what this guy is like.

They are planning on moving across country next year. If nothing changes I may sit down with her before the move just to express my concerns but I worry that will blow up. Ugh

 

 

Any movie you can watch with her some visit?  About a ‘nice guy’ but with red flags to some?  And just talk about the movie but not making it personal at all?  Or wow, what would you do if it was a friend.  I’d be afraid to speak up.  Feel her out?

 

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What do you do when the boyfriend whispers to her? Can you just go ahead and address it directly? 

"Why do you think that, Bad  Boyfriend?" 

"I think it's true because of X, Y, and Z. Why do you think it's not true, Bad Boyfriend?"

"Eh, what was that? Speak up, sonny, I can't hear you when you whisper!"

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I’ve been thinking about this for a few days.  We had a boyfriend situation with red flags go spectacularly bad here, but we had to step in bc dd was way too young and the boy older.  I also was honest with a friend once and that cooled the friendship for years ( they did divorce.)

I am a believer in trusting gut feelings, but do think that is different from red flags. I think I wouldn’t dance around the whispering issue with your dd.  But I would approach it by telling her that it makes you uncomfortable and ask if there is something you could do to help him feel more comfortable speaking directly to you. When he does it in the future I would say something like,”I am interested in hearing why you think it isn’t true.”  Be open and listen.

If there are other red flags, I might point them out but again approach it from a you and he relationship not a she and he relationship as much as possible.

I would absolutely work on making my relationship with dd strong and encouraging and safe and non-critical.  With our dd I hoped that having a healthy home environment would be a foil to the chaos that was the other. In our case, the narrative framed was that the chaos was bc if us, but eventually she set emotional boundaries ( where we had set physical bc of the age.) I think the healthy environment won. I know things have been chaotic for your dd with the divorce and estrangement from her dad.  Just try to be steady, calm and non-reactive for her now.

 

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37 minutes ago, Danae said:

I would not do any of the “talk about it indirectly” ideas offered here.  She’s not stupid, she’s going to know it’s about her boyfriend even if you frame it as about relationships in general.

I was thinking the same thing.  That sort of thing never worked with my son.  He always immediately knew what I was saying.  

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9 hours ago, BusyMom5 said:

I think the quiet - Thats a lie - comment is a red flag.  He isn't addressing you, he is almost driving a wedge between you, making you a liar, to distrust what you say.  As if he's emotionally isolating her, so that he is the one that she relies on for truth.  No cool, but necessarily bad, he could be immature or just not have good people skills.

That was my concern as well. I think this is a big deal. 

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Since it's onto the subject of gut feelings... I don't actually think gut feelings are very reliable. I think especially when they're about people, they're usually colored by prejudice more than our minds putting together some complex puzzle. I especially agree with someone upthread who suggested that when people think something is "off" about a person, it's often that the person is neuroatypical in some way and that's definitely more about prejudice than about some sort of wise gut feeling.

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8 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

I was thinking the same thing.  That sort of thing never worked with my son.  He always immediately knew what I was saying.  

Same. I used to hate it when my mother would try stuff like that, it’s so transparent and demeaning. Far more damaging than just confronting a situation IMO. 

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