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Rasinski webinar on fluency

PeterPan

By PeterPan,
in The Learning Challenges Board

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PeterPan

PeterPan

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https://www.teachercreatedmaterials.com/professional-learning/live-webinars/  TCM is doing live webinars as well as their on demand recorded (product pushing) webinars. The live webinar with Rasinski on building vocabulary with word roots last week was AMAZING. This fluency webinar runs with two sessions tomorrow. I don't recall that I got a link to recordings of the other live TCM webinars. I think they run and are done, unlike the on demand webinars. 

Anyway, he's a big name in reading, spelling, etc. so have a look, check it out, clear out an hour in your day. And if you get on their email, they'll send you notifications of their other webinars. I did one with Oczkus on Close Reading that BLEW MY MIND, super excited to begin using the materials and strategies. And from Rasinski's other workshop on vocabulary I'm planning to get the student workbooks (grade leveled) for his Building Vocabulary program. Once you see it explained and see why he was doing it, it makes a lot of sense. 

All these webinars have me on educator overload, hehe, so many great things. But partly it's that what Rasinski is saying mirrors what I was thinking about ds' reading. And the Close Reading mirrors some of the strategies the SLP is teaching ds for reading. Now she does it in a really whiz bang, upbeat way, bringing in inferencing, social thinking, etc. etc. But now that I see that the SLP is using those strategies with good fruit I'm comfortable bringing them over to our regular instruction sessions. 

So anyways, Rasinski, jump on board. It's likely to be amazing. Free. One hour. Lots of handouts. 

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PeterPan

PeterPan

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Ok, did you make it for the Rasinski fluency webinar? I did that and just finished the Therapro webinar on DYSGRAPHIA. I thought for sure @Runningmom80 was in there because there were some parents. :biggrin: Anyways, it was AWESOME and they're going to be doing a webinar on S'Cool Moves next week, meaning I should go sign up for that. I have my scool moves stuff and haven't done any with ds in ages. After watching the dysgraphia video, I realize what I need to be doing and why.

She mentioned a ton of products in the webinar, including your usuals like slant boards. This was a little less common. 

http://www.cdfieldtrips.com/choicemenu.html  She was liking their Reversals and Rotations workbooks, and I'm thinking I can assign them to ds as independent work, score. Actual academic (sorta?) independent work. 

She went through 3 types of dysgraphia (dyslexic, motor planning, spatial) and said you could have combos. So realizing what is causing the problem and what is intact lets you focus. Sorta obvious after she said it. 

She had other ideas like making a jump/spell. 

Well my brain is fried. Did you make any of the webinars @Runningmom80?

 

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PeterPan

PeterPan

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You could merge the blog idea https://www.123homeschool4me.com/spelling-games-hands-on-spelling-with_61/  with the speed stacking the OT was saying to do in the webinar. You could race to spell through the lists of words or time yourselves to see who was fastest. VMI plus spelling, wooo. Those mini cups are definitely going on my shopping list. Ds is burnt out on tiles and these will be cheap.

Edited by PeterPan
Runningmom80

Runningmom80

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10 hours ago, PeterPan said:

Ok, did you make it for the Rasinski fluency webinar? I did that and just finished the Therapro webinar on DYSGRAPHIA. I thought for sure @Runningmom80 was in there because there were some parents. :biggrin: Anyways, it was AWESOME and they're going to be doing a webinar on S'Cool Moves next week, meaning I should go sign up for that. I have my scool moves stuff and haven't done any with ds in ages. After watching the dysgraphia video, I realize what I need to be doing and why.

She mentioned a ton of products in the webinar, including your usuals like slant boards. This was a little less common. 

http://www.cdfieldtrips.com/choicemenu.html  She was liking their Reversals and Rotations workbooks, and I'm thinking I can assign them to ds as independent work, score. Actual academic (sorta?) independent work. 

She went through 3 types of dysgraphia (dyslexic, motor planning, spatial) and said you could have combos. So realizing what is causing the problem and what is intact lets you focus. Sorta obvious after she said it. 

She had other ideas like making a jump/spell. 

Well my brain is fried. Did you make any of the webinars @Runningmom80?

 

 

Nope, failure. Today is my husband's birthday and I had completely dropped the ball, so I had to scramble yesterday. 

I wish I would have seen the dysgraphia one. The SLP that did our testing also talked about the different types of dysgraphia and DD is definitely dyslexic dysgraphic. She also mentioned "surface dyslexia" which is less phonological more whole word weakness. I don't know that I totally see that but I do see that it's not just phonological with her. she's always spelled very phonetically, but still has holes. She's a combo. (and this is probably why she's so confusing to remediate)

So there are more webinars coming? 

Also, s'cool moves, I had never seen or heard of this, it looks cool! My brain is going a mile a minute, I am not sure if I have mentioned this, but I teach yoga in public schools in underserved areas. I wonder if some of these strategies could be added to what we do. I'm going to pass it along to my boss.

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Runningmom80

Runningmom80

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10 hours ago, PeterPan said:

Oh this is cute https://www.123homeschool4me.com/jump-spell-hands-on-spelling-activity_36/  The OT in the webinar did jump/spell with a sheet with letters in circles. This blogger wrote the letters with sidewalk chalk, very witty! 

 

We have done this! But only for small cvc words, I didn't think to add in vowel teams or anything like that, but now I am!

 

I think I might have DD draw a big version of her RIL vowel chart on the driveway next week when we officially start.

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PeterPan

PeterPan

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49 minutes ago, Runningmom80 said:

Is this the dysgraphia one? I was conflating the two websites. I need coffee. 

 

https://www.therapro.com/Webinar-08-25-2020-Every-Brain-is-Different-How-to-Help-Children-with-Dysgra.html

Yes, money in the bank! 

Yeah, I sort of have my toes in a bunch of different websites, trying to learn enough to work with ds, lol. Things are so fragmented, partly because each individual area is so complex and partly because it's just fragmented. But I'm one me, sigh. So yeah, I don't know how I found therapro, probably looking for stuff for ds' apraxia years ago. Kinda low key, but that was a crazy powerful, spill the beans kinda webinar. And they have 20+ of them just sitting there on demand on their website. 

The TCM on demand webinars with their staff were more ho hum. One had some really good meat and most were skim or skip. The hybrid learning one was the best. If it's still up, it's worth watching if you're playing with any of that. Ds is so funky to work with that I'm trying to have options for how I structure. Most kids could just do anything, sigh.

https://www.socialthinking.com/online-training/livestream-event  Michelle Garcia Winner is taking her regular conference/workshop circuit online, and she's breaking each workshop/lecture into 3 parts to make them more affordable and flexible. So $35-50 a pop, 3 hours, boom. I've been to almost every workshop she does around the country, but these are all NEW material. If you have any interest in any of the topics, they'll probably be well done. Her new interest right now is emotion and emotional regulation, so I think people are interested to see where she goes with it. She has some materials coming out this fall, so the workshops will be explaining those materials and getting people ready to use them.

Back to the dysgraphia webinar. It's really ironic that we (I) have sat here on the board for years trying to figure out WHAT IN THE WORLD dysgraphia means. My ds is diagnosed and it's pretty clear it's a serious problem for him. But when you're like how did they get there, what does it mean, and therefore what can I DO about it, that I couldn't tell. So in this workshop she was just digging right in as an OT, spilling the beans. Three types, figure out the combo of types, address the issues, boom. That works for me, lol. 

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PeterPan

PeterPan

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1 hour ago, Runningmom80 said:

but I teach yoga in public schools in underserved areas. I wonder if some of these strategies could be added to what we do. I'm going to pass it along to my boss.

Oh that's interesting! 

So S'Cool Moves is by an OT. I first saw it in an OT's office and decided to try it. I did some with ds, don't remember why I moved on. The book for the program is inexpensive on amazon, and I blew up the images of the posters to print and put in page protectors. So the entire cost to me was around $10. Right now my ds' VMI is very poor, so going back and hitting some of those things is going to be good for him. At the time, I *think* we were using it to work on directionality. There's probably more we can do.

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Runningmom80

Runningmom80

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3 hours ago, PeterPan said:

Yes, money in the bank! 

Yeah, I sort of have my toes in a bunch of different websites, trying to learn enough to work with ds, lol. Things are so fragmented, partly because each individual area is so complex and partly because it's just fragmented. But I'm one me, sigh. So yeah, I don't know how I found therapro, probably looking for stuff for ds' apraxia years ago. Kinda low key, but that was a crazy powerful, spill the beans kinda webinar. And they have 20+ of them just sitting there on demand on their website. 

The TCM on demand webinars with their staff were more ho hum. One had some really good meat and most were skim or skip. The hybrid learning one was the best. If it's still up, it's worth watching if you're playing with any of that. Ds is so funky to work with that I'm trying to have options for how I structure. Most kids could just do anything, sigh.

https://www.socialthinking.com/online-training/livestream-event  Michelle Garcia Winner is taking her regular conference/workshop circuit online, and she's breaking each workshop/lecture into 3 parts to make them more affordable and flexible. So $35-50 a pop, 3 hours, boom. I've been to almost every workshop she does around the country, but these are all NEW material. If you have any interest in any of the topics, they'll probably be well done. Her new interest right now is emotion and emotional regulation, so I think people are interested to see where she goes with it. She has some materials coming out this fall, so the workshops will be explaining those materials and getting people ready to use them.

Back to the dysgraphia webinar. It's really ironic that we (I) have sat here on the board for years trying to figure out WHAT IN THE WORLD dysgraphia means. My ds is diagnosed and it's pretty clear it's a serious problem for him. But when you're like how did they get there, what does it mean, and therefore what can I DO about it, that I couldn't tell. So in this workshop she was just digging right in as an OT, spilling the beans. Three types, figure out the combo of types, address the issues, boom. That works for me, lol. 

YES! It's especially frustrating when the "professionals" (at PS) are telling me "her handwriting isn't sloppy and she passed the timed test so she doesn't have dysgraphia." That was the day I lost it! 

And I think there is a piece that I'm just starting to really absorb, that the dysgraphia isn't going away. So use the time we have now to figure out work arounds/accomodations so that it affects her in the least amount possible or maybe just enough to get by. I knew that intellectually, but it takes a while to figure out what it means for her day to day life. I'm starting to understand it better now.

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Runningmom80

Runningmom80

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3 hours ago, PeterPan said:

Oh that's interesting! 

So S'Cool Moves is by an OT. I first saw it in an OT's office and decided to try it. I did some with ds, don't remember why I moved on. The book for the program is inexpensive on amazon, and I blew up the images of the posters to print and put in page protectors. So the entire cost to me was around $10. Right now my ds' VMI is very poor, so going back and hitting some of those things is going to be good for him. At the time, I *think* we were using it to work on directionality. There's probably more we can do.

 

Because there are too many things and we can't possibly do them all? And also, life. In general. 

DD's WMI is low average. I bought a couple of the RFWP books but have yet to do more than flip through them. I need to get those out. Part of me wants to spend a couple of weeks just doin those and then start back in on the Wilson/Rooted in Language stuff. 

 

The other day DD had her last tutoring session, she spelled "compulsive" and "comprehend" correctly, but then proceeded to write the words "mutch" and "brige."  I'm kind of...whatever about the spelling right now, it feels so random and like it's not "fixable." eventually she will see the word "much" enough times where she doesn't put the T in? Maybe? 🤣

 

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PeterPan

PeterPan

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11 hours ago, Runningmom80 said:

Part of me wants to spend a couple of weeks just doin those and then start back in on the Wilson/Rooted in Language stuff. 

That OT said 6 months at 1 hour a week. So I'm like you and I like really intensive focuses, sure. But like 1 hour a day, a week, I don't know. What *changes* if you do that? When I do it, it's because the new skill will be pivotal. Like you spend a month on typing. 

I think the benefits from the VMI work may be more gradual, less whiz bang. She didn't mention drawing, but drawing has been gold for ds. The OTs really encourage it. And that's something that is easy to drip drip, 5-10 min a day.

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Lecka

Lecka

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I am married to an adult poor speller.

Spell check on a computer would catch those to words.  
 

He makes mistakes with “easy” words where he doesn’t know which way to spell them, and gets longer “harder” words correct that are more phonetic to him.

My older son has turned out to be a good speller after time of seeing words.  Like — he started spelling better when he was about 10 🙂

My husband has commented several times he is impressed this son spell the word “science,” because my husband has trouble with it even though he saw it all the time because it was the name of a school subject.

Anyway — I think it’s worth working on,  but sometimes “easy, short” words just are harder for people to spell.  
 

I am asked weekly or so about the word “seem” when my husband texts, he can’t remember if it’s “seem” or “seam” and I think spell check doesn’t catch it when he is texting.  I’m not sure.  I think on “word” it will catch this kind of misspelling.  Has my husband ever just remembered?  No.  Can he spell a lot of long words that ”should be” harder?  No.  

Edited by Lecka
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Lecka

Lecka

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I think for spelling — you can control what method is used and how much time is spent, how much review.

I don’t think you can control what is easier or harder or what is retained longer-.term, or what is spelled correctly in outside writing, etc.  

 

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PeterPan

PeterPan

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23 hours ago, Runningmom80 said:

Ok I need to follow this company on social media or something so I know when these webinars are. I am just now putting 2 & 2 together that the Kwame coffee talk was through them. All of these videos look fun! https://www.teachercreatedmaterials.com/kwame-poetry/

Btw, I got the Kwame book and need to go through it. I don't know if you rabbited the Loops and Rotations that the OT mentioned in the dysgraphia seminar, but Burnt of L&R has an ebook for poetry http://www.cdfieldtrips.com/poetry.html  It was very practical, right where my ds functions. So I was thinking I could have a whole poetry gig going this year, with the Poems for Building Reading Skills (Rasinski) to work on prosody alternated with the poetry writing workbook. Then I can go through Kwame's ideas and see what I can make accessible to ds. I'm sure the idea is right, but with him having the structure of super small steps in a workbook always works out better. And what I'm seeing now is that his LANGUAGE is finally building up enough that more original stuff is starting to come out. But what's coming out now is limericks, words for tunes, that kind of thing. It's something I do, so it's fun to see him doing it, hehe. 

Also, for the jump n spell idea from the dysgraphia workshop, I found these https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07Q33M4V8/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1  I saw them in person in a store, but they were way cheaper on amazon. The size is nice for a home setting, and I think they'll probably stick to our carpet in the play area, wherever. I have a 5X7 rug in our office where we work. Either way I guess. Point is, I don't have to make the stupid circles or a mat. Sticking velcro circles to carpet is MUCH better.

So what were the components to your dd's dysgraphia? My ds doesn't have the spatial, but he does have the motor planning and dyslexia components. So I thought I'd just use components from intervention for those and see what happens. I think the Cursive Logic is going to be good for the motor component. 

You know, if I were really brilliant, I'd get through some of Cursive Logic and then have ds starting writing his spelling. I just don't want to be too perfectionist about this. I was realizing he needs to go through some lists multiple times. I guess it could be time two on the words, lol. That would be a miracle if he could comfortably write 10 words a day. I guess we'll see. Either way, I'm committed to winning on typing and he has access to tech. It's just they know that actually writing the words helps the spelling sink in better.

Well I have today to myself once ds blasts off on his adventure with his father, so I need to win the war on the office, get it tidied with the new stuff, and get some of my plans and structures organized. I have so many ideas it's insane. It's just he's been so BORED. I had this master learner list I got several years ago from the Mrs. Renz site (which is now all $$ on TPT). Anyways, I was thinking about taking some of my science learning ideas (learning all the parts of things, etc.) and turning that into *choice* boards of things to learn. So I'd have the lists prepped and he could choose lists/pages. And really, I have *activities* to go with most of my ideas. But I think it could be good for him to choose the things, since the what matters less to me than that he's actively doing it. I'm not sure he has viewed himself as a learner. 

I got some really cool things to further these ideas. I had been looking for woodworking, and I found this DIY String Art book at the education store. I was thinking that's pretty close to wood working (pounding nails in wood!) and that he can merge it with things like learning the constellations (master learner list). So activities to reinforce the language lists he's learning. We'll see if he bites, but that's what i'm thinking. He wants more, but he has to choose this stuff. I don't have energy to drive EVERYTHING. 

Oh, and if you want a laugh, I'm so old school, I was like oh I'll put the master learner choices on big circles on the wall! Haha, me and my paper. Kid would probably rather have a padlet, lol. I guess I could put it into google classroom, but it wouldn't be so pretty. I think there's a way to link a padlet to google classroom. GC is all words, but padlet could be pictures. I'll figure it out. Maybe we could have pretty things on the wall to show the things we've learned? Haha, I don't know. 

Runningmom80

Runningmom80

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Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, Lecka said:

I think for spelling — you can control what method is used and how much time is spent, how much review.

I don’t think you can control what is easier or harder or what is retained longer-.term, or what is spelled correctly in outside writing, etc.  

 

 

Yes, this is where I'm focusing my energy. I can't really teach her anymore how to spell "much." She's obviously using phonics, so to continue to drill those doesn't seem like the wisest way to go about all of this.  I could use flash cards, maybe? I'm not going to make a dysgraphic child write the word over and over, not that I even think it would help!

Anyways, yeah, it's a gray area. Lots of therapy has helped me be able to accept gray areas. lol 

We will continue to work on everything, but I think I see the end of the tunnel with remediation at least as far as spelling. I'll have her keep practicing but I'm not going to spend hours a day on it. I want her to be able to use accommodations to the best of her ability so that some of this levels out a little. 

Edited by Runningmom80
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Runningmom80

Runningmom80

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, PeterPan said:

Btw, I got the Kwame book and need to go through it. I don't know if you rabbited the Loops and Rotations that the OT mentioned in the dysgraphia seminar, but Burnt of L&R has an ebook for poetry http://www.cdfieldtrips.com/poetry.html  It was very practical, right where my ds functions. So I was thinking I could have a whole poetry gig going this year, with the Poems for Building Reading Skills (Rasinski) to work on prosody alternated with the poetry writing workbook. Then I can go through Kwame's ideas and see what I can make accessible to ds. I'm sure the idea is right, but with him having the structure of super small steps in a workbook always works out better. And what I'm seeing now is that his LANGUAGE is finally building up enough that more original stuff is starting to come out. But what's coming out now is limericks, words for tunes, that kind of thing. It's something I do, so it's fun to see him doing it, hehe. 

 

This is such a great idea. My oldest has read all of Kwame's books. 

Quote

So what were the components to your dd's dysgraphia? My ds doesn't have the spatial, but he does have the motor planning and dyslexia components. So I thought I'd just use components from intervention for those and see what happens. I think the Cursive Logic is going to be good for the motor component. 

 

She mostly has dyslexia, maybe a little spatial. She has a difficult time staying on the lines when she's writing more than a couple sentences. 

 

Quote

You know, if I were really brilliant, I'd get through some of Cursive Logic and then have ds starting writing his spelling. I just don't want to be too perfectionist about this. I was realizing he needs to go through some lists multiple times. I guess it could be time two on the words, lol. That would be a miracle if he could comfortably write 10 words a day. I guess we'll see. Either way, I'm committed to winning on typing and he has access to tech. It's just they know that actually writing the words helps the spelling sink in better.

Well I have today to myself once ds blasts off on his adventure with his father, so I need to win the war on the office, get it tidied with the new stuff, and get some of my plans and structures organized. I have so many ideas it's insane. It's just he's been so BORED. I had this master learner list I got several years ago from the Mrs. Renz site (which is now all $$ on TPT). Anyways, I was thinking about taking some of my science learning ideas (learning all the parts of things, etc.) and turning that into *choice* boards of things to learn. So I'd have the lists prepped and he could choose lists/pages. And really, I have *activities* to go with most of my ideas. But I think it could be good for him to choose the things, since the what matters less to me than that he's actively doing it. I'm not sure he has viewed himself as a learner. 

I got some really cool things to further these ideas. I had been looking for woodworking, and I found this DIY String Art book at the education store. I was thinking that's pretty close to wood working (pounding nails in wood!) and that he can merge it with things like learning the constellations (master learner list). So activities to reinforce the language lists he's learning. We'll see if he bites, but that's what i'm thinking. He wants more, but he has to choose this stuff. I don't have energy to drive EVERYTHING. 

 

We are going to attempt soap carving next week! I think it will help dexterity, even though she's not necessarily weak, I figure it can't hurt to strengthen fine motor. (OT's have tested her and her fine motor is good, but it's in our BYL plan so I'm going with it!) Anyways, when I mentioned it she asked if we could start this week, which I took as a good sign. so I am all for them picking what they want and having that excitement about the activity. I'm sure you have TONS of stuff to accommodate what he wants to do! 

Quote

Oh, and if you want a laugh, I'm so old school, I was like oh I'll put the master learner choices on big circles on the wall! Haha, me and my paper. Kid would probably rather have a padlet, lol. I guess I could put it into google classroom, but it wouldn't be so pretty. I think there's a way to link a padlet to google classroom. GC is all words, but padlet could be pictures. I'll figure it out. Maybe we could have pretty things on the wall to show the things we've learned? Haha, I don't know. 

 

I don't even know what a padlet is! 

Edited by Runningmom80
Runningmom80

Runningmom80

Posted
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10 hours ago, PeterPan said:

That OT said 6 months at 1 hour a week. So I'm like you and I like really intensive focuses, sure. But like 1 hour a day, a week, I don't know. What *changes* if you do that? When I do it, it's because the new skill will be pivotal. Like you spend a month on typing. 

I think the benefits from the VMI work may be more gradual, less whiz bang. She didn't mention drawing, but drawing has been gold for ds. The OTs really encourage it. And that's something that is easy to drip drip, 5-10 min a day.

 

I'm all out of order with these responses, but yeah I didn't mean to say that we would just do the VMI work for a couple of weeks. I was thinking like more of a jumpstart and then continuing on less intensely. I'm not sure I would even do that, I'm just spitballing over here 😆

 

Runningmom80

Runningmom80

Posted
Posted (edited)
10 hours ago, PeterPan said:

She's dyslexic.

How is her visual memory? 

 

Her working memory on WISC was high, her visual motor integration was low. I don't have a visual memory score, but she's for sure allll over the place. 

Developmental Test 0f Visual-Motor Integration (VMI)

Age Equivalent: 7-6

VMI Percentile: 32nd

 VMI Scale Score: 93

Developmental Test of Visual-Perception (VP)

Age Equivalent: 8-4

VP Percentile: 39th 

VP Scale Score: 96

Developmental Test of Motor Coordination (MC)

Age Equivalent: 9-8

MC Percentile: 68th 

MC Scale Score: 107

 

WISC Working memory index-

digit span: 13 (84%)

picture span: 15 (95%)

 

Edited by Runningmom80
PeterPan

PeterPan

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45 minutes ago, Runningmom80 said:

She's obviously using phonics

Ok, I see people say this and it makes no sense to me. https://lotsofwords.com/*utch  Here's a list of the 37 supposed words (many of which you've never heard of would use) that end in -utch. So she's using an uncommon, rare variant. She was hopefully taught to start with the MOST COMMON spelling for a sound, not the least common. Then she can memorize visually the few words that use less common variants.

Runningmom80

Runningmom80

Posted
Posted
18 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

Ok, I see people say this and it makes no sense to me. https://lotsofwords.com/*utch  Here's a list of the 37 supposed words (many of which you've never heard of would use) that end in -utch. So she's using an uncommon, rare variant. She was hopefully taught to start with the MOST COMMON spelling for a sound, not the least common. Then she can memorize visually the few words that use less common variants.

I misspoke, I meant she could hear the sounds. phonological processing isn't the same as phonics and I interchanged them

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