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So I‚Äôve gone through and read a bunch of threads about ADHD and slow processing and a bit on dyslexia but now would like some input ūüôā

We just finished getting my soon to be 9yo son tested and I think I’m struggling with knowing how to put together a plan from here.

His WISC Scores:

 

VC   130     98%

Similarities               16   98%

 

Vocab                       15     95%

VS   108    70%

Block Design            12    75%

 

Visual Puzzles          11   63%

FR    126    96%

Matrix Reason          11    63%

 

Figure Weights         18   99.6%

WM    97    42%

Digit Span                  9   37%

 

Picture Span             10   50%

PS    72     3% 

Coding                       4    2%

 

Symbol Search           6   9%


(FSIQ 116 / 86%, GAI 128 / 97%) 
So... psychologist said he would be considered 2e

He also has "mild"' ADHD inattentive type, also dyslexia and dysgraphia.

I'm no psychologist but I did work in mental health as a case manager for several years and I have seen how little we actually know about the brain ... and neurotransmitters, etc. 
Something that I found interesting about the testing is that really high "figure weights" score up there... we have done balance benders at home (which I found out is almost identical to what is used in the IQ test) so it was something he was already very familiar with whereas the other testing were not things he would have been exposed to before.... 
I don't feel like I got a good answer to why his processing speed is so slow. My understanding is that it can be audio, visual, motor or some combination. I have this theory that the other diagnoses are really almost a sub-type to the slow processing. Meaning, if he could increase his processing speed his attentiveness, dyslexia and dysgraphia wouldn't be so notable. 
Now, if this isn't true, and I just need to back off and accept things "as they are" I'm open to that too.... He's a really compassionate, funny, and truly delightful boy. 

I'm wondering if we need to get further testing done for the processing speed idea... like seeing an optometrist for possible visual processing, audiologist, etc. any thoughts?
Testing has already been a huge hit on our finances (we were initially told it would be about $250 but because he's so slow she had to add on another day and now it's close to $500) 

I've started him back up on fish oil and was wondering if I should ask for testing for vit b levels, zinc, magnesium and iron (is that a thing to do?) 

I've seen recommendations for Interactive Metrenome... is this something that can be done at home or does it have to be done by a "provider" 

We've used AAR from level 1 and we are on level 3 now. He is reading 61wpm (which is typical for end of 1st grade).  I thought we were going slow enough but I realize I was probably still pushing him too hard so we are slowing down even more.  I've seen recommendations for Nessy and Reading Eggs but I really don't want to add MORE onto his plate unless really necessary. Has anyone looked at how these compare to 22learn phonics and sight words ? 

I'm open to thoughts, impressions, suggestions... 

Thanks for sticking with this long post ūüôā¬†

He also had Kaufman, and Beery Buktenica but I don't want to overwhelm with a bunch of numbers....

Edited by Moncha
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Hi!

How was dyslexia and dysgraphia diagnosed? 

So I have 3 kids with low processing speed. My oldest actually has a much wider spread than your son, and I didn't get a good answer either. I'm not sure there is one? Maybe. Tilt parenting has a good podcast on this subject, the author of the book "Bright Kids who Can't Keep Up" was on. She kind of said processing speed is processing speed and you just teach your kids how to function.

Ok, on to the dyslexia, my daughter is dysgraphic and "remediated" dyslexic whatever that means. Her processing speed was similar to your son's. I don't ever notice it, I think because she has a really high working memory. Anyways, I don't know 1. that it's even possible to raise it and 2. I doubt it would matter for dyslexia. It's a different WAY of processing that doesn't have to do with speed.

I'm no expert and there are plenty of parents on this board that know way more than me, and I'm sure they will chime in soon. 

 I've heard of people diagnosing dyslexia with IQ which is absolutely not the way to do it. So assuming there was language testing, I'd work on the dyslexia, dysgraphia and ADD and not worry too much about the processing speed. I think it's worthwhile to try to understand it, but I'd focus on getting supports with the other stuff. 

 

Is Kaufmann achievement? My kids did WJ so I'm more familiar with that, but if it noted decoding and comprehension levels that would help with recommendations. Was he given language testing? RAN. RAS, CTOPP, etc?

ETA: Nessy is for dyslexics, Reading Eggs I'm not sure but I don't think so. I wouldn't use reading eggs with a 9 year old, but I'm not knee deep in the dyslexia curricula so I'll let other people answer this one.  You will probably need something like Barton or Wilson. 

ETAA: His vocab is really high. I'm guessing his comprehension is good, but the decoding is lagging?

Etaaa: my phone autocorrected CTOPP in a crazy way lol

 

Edited by Runningmom80
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31 minutes ago, Runningmom80 said:

dysgraphia diagnosed?

coding score probably

1 hour ago, Moncha said:

"figure weights" score

yes you can have splinter skills

1 hour ago, Moncha said:

I have this theory that the other diagnoses are really almost a sub-type to the slow processing

So you can dyslexia withoute process being that low. Thats partly brain structure, see Eides book.

1 hour ago, Moncha said:

Interactive Metrenome..

yes see heathermomster's free instructions. worth starting free in your case to stretch budget. add working memry and ran/ras. see my dropbox files.

1 hour ago, Moncha said:

"mild"'

ha

1 hour ago, Moncha said:

a plan

do ran/ras, metronome, and retained reflex work for 45 days till end of summer. during that time read up on adhd, develop structures/routines. you have a lot of curriculum listed. what needs to change?

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3 hours ago, Moncha said:

He also has "mild"' ADHD inattentive type, also dyslexia and dysgraphia.

Something that I found interesting about the testing is that really high "figure weights" score up there... we have done balance benders at home (which I found out is almost identical to what is used in the IQ test) so it was something he was already very familiar with whereas the other testing were not things he would have been exposed to before.... 

We've used AAR from level 1 and we are on level 3 now. He is reading 61wpm (which is typical for end of 1st grade).  I thought we were going slow enough but I realize I was probably still pushing him too hard so we are slowing down even more.  I've seen recommendations for Nessy and Reading Eggs but I really don't want to add MORE onto his plate unless really necessary. Has anyone looked at how these compare to 22learn phonics and sight words ? 

 

He also had Kaufman, and Beery Buktenica but I don't want to overwhelm with a bunch of numbers....

Did they do a CTOPP for dyslexia? 

So, on the Figure Weights, I am not sure if the Balance Benders would sway that or not. It is considered as an excellent way to test nonverbal reasoning and be a pretty pure measure of IQ. It's pretty heavily researched. It is not his only high score, so I think if the dyslexia and ADHD diagnoses were made with solid evidence (like the CTOPP for dyslexia), 2e is likely to be true, particularly if you feel he's pretty bright. 

Some kids with dyslexia, particularly gifted kids, can learn to read fairly proficiently from good but mainstream phonics like AAR. My dyslexic did really well with phonics, but he is a pretty mild case.

I wouldn't use sight words with any kid, much less a dyslexic.

$500 for an evaluation is a pretty amazing bargain. Are they giving a thorough report or handing you the numbers and list of diagnoses for that price?

2 hours ago, PeterPan said:

yes you can have splinter skills

You can have splinter skills, but not usually on an IQ test--more on achievement. See my above comment. If his score is artificially high, it would be from the Balance Benders not some freak splinter skill.

 

With that processing speed, I would get a developmental vision exam to look at convergence, etc., and I would get an OT evaluation if he shows signs of motor issues. It's also possible the ADHD made this score worse, but even meds might not fix it that much.

Also, convergence or other visual problems could seriously interfere with the visual spatial part of the test. My son had convergence issues at his first two WISC tests, but he had vision therapy before the third. He also had ADHD meds by the third one, and they updated the WISC to remove vestiges of language from the visual part, and his scores went from high but normal to ceiling scores across the board for the visual portion. So, vision can be a huge thing on the nonverbal portions of the test. It can also make the processing portion a lot harder. My son had really low coding scores before vision therapy. 

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34 minutes ago, kbutton said:

You can have splinter skills, but not usually on an IQ test--more on achievement. See my above comment. If his score is artificially high, it would be from the Balance Benders not some freak splinter skill.

splinter skill = something strong from workingit when the rest of the system remains weak

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23 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

splinter skill = something strong from workingit when the rest of the system remains weak

That's not how I've heard it used. I've heard it used as something innate to the child that works when other things don't. 

There isn't really an agreed upon definition, but here is one stab at it I found: https://medical-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/splinter+skill

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4 hours ago, Runningmom80 said:

How was dyslexia and dysgraphia diagnosed? 

1 hour ago, kbutton said:

Did they do a CTOPP for dyslexia? 

So, on the Figure Weights, I am not sure if the Balance Benders would sway that or not. It is considered as an excellent way to test nonverbal reasoning and be a pretty pure measure of IQ. It's pretty heavily researched. It is not his only high score, so I think if the dyslexia and ADHD diagnoses were made with solid evidence (like the CTOPP for dyslexia), 2e is likely to be true, particularly if you feel he's pretty bright. 

Some kids with dyslexia, particularly gifted kids, can learn to read fairly proficiently from good but mainstream phonics like AAR. My dyslexic did really well with phonics, but he is a pretty mild case.

I wouldn't use sight words with any kid, much less a dyslexic.

$500 for an evaluation is a pretty amazing bargain. Are they giving a thorough report or handing you the numbers and list of diagnoses for that price?

40 minutes ago, PeterPan said:
4 hours ago, Runningmom80 said:

RAN. RAS

should be im ctopp

 

So I don't think she used the CTOPP... this is what it says under "Evaluation Procedures"
Parent Clinical Interview
Dev Hx Questionaire
BASC-3
ADHD-5 parent forms
CDI-2 Self Report (depression)
MASC-2 Self Report (anxiety)
WISC-V
KTEA-3 (Educational Achievement)
Beery VMI-6 (Visual Motor Integration) 

She states that "Select sub-tests from the Kaufman Test... were administered to assess current level of academic achievement. Tests specific to dyslexia were also administered and yield a Dyslexia Index score, which calculates an overall risk category....." Additional sub-tests were given that  test age-based norms in reading skills, listening comprehension, and academic fluency. 
I wish I could just take a picture of it and share it... I don't want to write it all out. 
Essentially he tests Average to Low in everything. And "High Risk" for Dyslexia. 

Re: Cost - My husband is a disabled/medically retired vet so I think Tricare covered some of the testing... but we were under the impression that our portion would  not be as much as it has come out to. 


@Runningmom80I do plan on picking up "Bright Kids...." thank you

4 hours ago, Runningmom80 said:

Is Kaufmann achievement?

Yes

3 hours ago, PeterPan said:

see heathermomster's free instructions. worth starting free in your case to stretch budget. add working memry and ran/ras. see my dropbox files.

3 hours ago, PeterPan said:

do ran/ras, metronome, and retained reflex work for 45 days till end of summer. during that time read up on adhd, develop structures/routines. you have a lot of curriculum listed. what needs to change?

 

where can I find this? (free instructions and your dropbox)  and I don't know anything about retained reflex work.... 
So he's been okay with a small math facts review and about 15 min of reading a day... do I skip that for the next month & half while working on these other things... I may have to, to get a buy in from him ūüėē
We do have a lot of structure in place for him already, we use a visual timer, visual morning and evening routine, white board with what needs to be done that day, etc. 
The curriculum in my signature was for this last year... I need to update. My plan was to continue with AAR 3 , start AAS 2, we haven't focused on writing much at all aside from his HWOT booklets, we used LLFT which was good, nice and gentle, and I didn't require most of the writing. I was thinking of trying some freewriting and Games for Writing. He did fine w/ BJU math... we do a lot of it orally. We are going to do a lot more math facts practice. For science he is a sponge... we are going to try out crosswired science this year and I'm doing my own countries and cultures study. And lots of reading aloud to him and audiobooks. 

1 hour ago, kbutton said:

With that processing speed, I would get a developmental vision exam to look at convergence, etc., and I would get an OT evaluation if he shows signs of motor issues. It's also possible the ADHD made this score worse, but even meds might not fix it that much.

Also, convergence or other visual problems could seriously interfere with the visual spatial part of the test. My son had convergence issues at his first two WISC tests, but he had vision therapy before the third. He also had ADHD meds by the third one, and they updated the WISC to remove vestiges of language from the visual part, and his scores went from high but normal to ceiling scores across the board for the visual portion. So, vision can be a huge thing on the nonverbal portions of the test. It can also make the processing portion a lot harder. My son had really low coding scores before vision therapy. 

35 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

you can start at home by testing for retained reflexes. start with just annual visit and *screening* by dev opto, for eyes. 


So it looks like the Beery was given because she noticed laborious handwriting. 
On Visual-Motor Integration he scored 45% - average
Visual Perception 77% - above average
Motor Coordination 5% - low

I still think that a dev. vision exam as you suggested may be in order but she did also suggest OT for the handwriting ... we just can't afford both at the same time if insurance isn't going to pay for it. 

1 hour ago, PeterPan said:

btw youre discrepant on verbal vs non and should llok at nvld and pragmatics. How is his narrative language and reading comprehension? social skills? very literal?


I don't know what your 1st sentence is asking/saying ūüėĄ¬†¬†
His reading comprehension per the Kaufman test is low - 5%, but when he reads our curriculum (AAR or we're using the K Level Christian Liberty Nature Reader) he doesn't seem to have any trouble understanding and narrating it back.
He has very good social skills and while it may take a few seconds to get the punch line enjoys a good joke. He doesn't like scary things but I wouldn't say he's more literal than his peers.

She did say he tired easily and that was why she tagged on another day... she thinks he gave a good effort... I wish I could have been a fly on the wall....  not that I don't think he gave a good effort but sometimes he just sort of shuts down if he doesn't think he can do it especially if it's unfamiliar material. 

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Oh , and as far as the splinter skill discussion. I don't think the balance benders was something he was just good at... it has taken some practice... we would talk through when he would make mistakes... and he would really examine it and figure it out...   but because it doesn't require reading I do feel like it is one of those things that he has gotten good at in a short time. 

And yes, he is very "bright".

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7 hours ago, Moncha said:

Oh , and as far as the splinter skill discussion. I don't think the balance benders was something he was just good at... it has taken some practice... we would talk through when he would make mistakes... and he would really examine it and figure it out...   but because it doesn't require reading I do feel like it is one of those things that he has gotten good at in a short time. 

And yes, he is very "bright".

Yes, you worked on it and the score was higher. That's what I've had OTs, etc. refer to as a splinter skill. And it just goes to show in general you don't read too much into one score. You look for the pattern. Now single scores *can* mean something. My dd, for instance,  [back to pecking] had poor word retrieval and it was a big deal, one score.

20 points is 1 standard deviation and significant. yor nonverbal is at that line below verbal EVEN WITH THE ONE SECTION HIGH. probably most significant piece to consider. how were his comprehension scores? no narrative o pragmatics scoes? maybw ask for SLP eval to get those.

google nvld

https://mindwingconcepts.com/pages/methodology find his narrative stage here. that reaing comprehension score is concerning and you want to know why

hes too young for pragmatics testing to be accurate anyway

7 hours ago, Moncha said:

sometimes he just sort of shuts down if he doesn't think he can do it especially if it's unfamiliar material. 

how was anxiety score?

7 hours ago, Moncha said:

I still think that a dev. vision exam as you suggested may be in order but she did also suggest OT for the handwriting ... we just can't afford both at the same time if insurance isn't going to pay for it. 

no id only do a SCREENING on the eyes. The OT referral is correct for those scores. also options you can do yorself

 

7 hours ago, Moncha said:

retained reflex work.

start googling . read at pyramid of potential, cheap video download=$35. your first step, will improve EVERYTHIMG.

7 hours ago, Moncha said:

where can I find this? (free instructions and your dropbox)

now you learn to fish :biggrin: google site search so "heathermomster metronome site:welltrainedmind.com" will change your life :biggrin:

 

7 hours ago, Moncha said:

he doesn't seem to have any trouble understanding and narrating it back.

low stage narrative, see chart i linked 

 

7 hours ago, Moncha said:

Games for Writing

yes Peggy Kaye is awesome, also sequencing cards and get autism kit from https://mindwingconcepts.com/pages/methodology  or watch all their videos and learn for free and do it hack. they run sales

***you got a lot of data and its not all going to be obvious yet what its telling you. reread monthly and grow into it. youll see/understand more each time

 

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7 hours ago, Moncha said:

vet

my dad is too, 100%

7 hours ago, Moncha said:

So he's been okay with a small math facts review and about 15 min of reading a day... do I skip that for the next month & half while working on these other things... I may have to, to get a buy in from him

nah, reflex work is 10 minutes a few times a day

7 hours ago, Moncha said:

We do have a lot of structure in place for him already, we use a visual timer, visual morning and evening routine, white board with what needs to be done that day, etc. 

AWESOME

7 hours ago, Moncha said:

He did fine w/ BJU math... we do a lot of it orally. We are going to do a lot more math facts practice. For science he is a sponge... we are going to try out crosswired science this year and I'm doing my own countries and cultures study. And lots of reading aloud to him and audiobooks. 

all sounds really good. id learn about narrative language to allow you to milk what youre using. will bump reading comprehension and expository writing. for example https://mindwingconcepts.com/blogs/news/46846209-expository-my-research-cut-and-fold-booklet?_pos=1&_sid=38db27b14&_ss=r 

see if library has https://www.amazon.com/Word-Callers-One-One-Research-Informed/dp/0325026939/ref=sr_1_1?crid=G1YEEX549YMK&dchild=1&keywords=word+callers+by+kelly+cartwright&qid=1595077090&sprefix=word+callers%2Caps%2C160&sr=8-1 not sure you need to buy but from library defintely

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1 hour ago, PeterPan said:

you now qulify for national library service. print application for doc to sign. HIGHLY recommemd

Total aside, but are the readers for this real people? Are they audiobooks read by humans, or are they mechanical readers? 

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9 hours ago, Moncha said:

Essentially he tests Average to Low in everything. And "High Risk" for Dyslexia. 

So it looks like the Beery was given because she noticed laborious handwriting. 
On Visual-Motor Integration he scored 45% - average
Visual Perception 77% - above average
Motor Coordination 5% - low

His reading comprehension per the Kaufman test is low - 5%, but when he reads our curriculum (AAR or we're using the K Level Christian Liberty Nature Reader) he doesn't seem to have any trouble understanding and narrating it back.
He has very good social skills and while it may take a few seconds to get the punch line enjoys a good joke. He doesn't like scary things but I wouldn't say he's more literal than his peers.

She did say he tired easily and that was why she tagged on another day... she thinks he gave a good effort... I wish I could have been a fly on the wall....  not that I don't think he gave a good effort but sometimes he just sort of shuts down if he doesn't think he can do it especially if it's unfamiliar material. 

The bolded is behavior consistent with learning issues. Thankfully, most testers are quite good at getting the best out of the kids they are testing. 

So, the visual perception is a relative strength depending on the context, probably not just a splinter skill, since his visual perception is good. Obviously doing the Balance Benders did help, but it's not like he's average or low on that count in the Beery. 

I don't think it's terribly unusual for kids who've been read to a lot and have parents with good vocabularies to test significantly higher on verbal than non-verbal, honestly, but it's something to watch for with reading comprehension being an issue on some of the testing. Working on narrative language is never going to be a waste of time, I don't think.

Does he tire easily at home? Is he kind of bendy or hypermobile (or floppy)? https://www.hypermobility.org/what-are-hypermobility-syndromes#:~:text=Hypermobility is the term used,or it may be widespread.

2 hours ago, PeterPan said:

***you got a lot of data and its not all going to be obvious yet what its telling you. reread monthly and grow into it. youll see/understand more each time

Yes, this.

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5 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

professional readers, no tts/digital. We use 100+ books a year from them.

I need to know more about this. I think both of my kids would qualify and at this point, my younger one's auditory process has been remediated to normal, though he does need to relearn a few behavioral quirks with listening.

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I'm going to chime in with just a couple of things to supplement what others said.

People vary, of course, but processing speed, in general, is something that can bump up but doesn't generally change. It does depend on having good visual processing, however, so if there is a vision issue that can be remediated, that could help. Vision therapy is not usually covered by insurance, I believe, and can be costly, but you will need to look into what is available in your area. If a therapist is willing to give more homework and less in-person visits, that can reduce the cost. My son with processing speed issues was cleared as not having a vision problem by a COVD, so we never pursued vision therapy, but sometimes I wonder if it would have made a difference for him. You have to pick a vision therapist carefully, because some are more reputable than others.

You can learn a lot by googling the name of each of those WISC subtests and reading about them. The coding test, for example, relies on having both good visual processing to discriminate between the symbols AND the motor skills to copy the symbols correctly into the correct box. So there is a chicken-or-eggs thing with that test, where one might wonder whether it is a low processing speed that makes it hard to copy the images, or whether having poor fine motor skills makes the processing speed appear lower.

My son has a constellation of issues that affects his performance on the subtests that score the processing speed. His ADHD makes it hard for him to focus his attention. His motor skills make it hard for him to copy the images. His visual perception makes it hard for him to discriminate the symbols from one another. His working memory is taxed during those exercises. And so on. It's all interwoven.

In DS16's case, he was given a diagnosis of dysgraphia (among a slew of other things), and we were told that it would affect his ability to get thoughts on paper when doing pencil to paper tasks. He does have messy handwriting, but it's legible (which is not always the case for kiddos with dysgraphia). He produces writing a lot more effectively when typing, and typing is a common accommodation for kids with dysgraphia and/or low processing speed. Other accommodations include having extra time, having reduced volume of work, being able to give his answers orally, the use of graphic organizers to collect his thoughts when writing, etc. He does better with creating PowerPoint slides, where he writes little chunks of information, than he does with writing an essay. You can google accommodations for dysgraphia to get other ideas. I suggest keeping a log of what accommodations you use, for future reference.

For DS, ADHD medication helps significantly with his ability to produce school work, but his ADHD is severe, and nothing will "fix" it. Meds do make things go better for him, all around (and not just for school).

There are a lot of things that you can try to work on at home. You can get visual processing workbooks with exercises. You can do the metronome exercises. We never tried those, because DS is a drummer, and drumming serves the same purpose for him. Interactive Metronome therapy is expensive, I believe, so you can try it at home to save the money, but I can't vouch for whether an at-home version is as effective. (But I can't vouch for official IM lessons, either, since we didn't do them). The thing is that you can pour a lot of money into occupational therapy, and there is no guarantee of a return in the way of improved function on these things, so in my opinion trying things at home, if your son will cooperate, is worth a try.

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A personal anecdote -- DS's processing speed scores were in the less than 1% range. Basically as low as one can get, when he was 10 (private testing) and 11 (school testing). Then when he was 14, his score jumped to 7%. This was a huge, huge increase in his raw scores -- something like a 40 point jump.

And what did we do to help that to happen? No specific therapy. But DS is a musician and has had years of drum and bass guitar lessons, so I attribute it to that. I highly recommend music lessons, though my advice is just anecdotal and not scientific.

Edited by Storygirl
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And about NVLD. That stands for Nonverbal Learning Disorder. DS16 also has that diagnosis, because it is determined by a wide gap between the nonverbal (low) and verbal (higher) scores on the WISC. You can read about it online, or search for some of my old posts about it (I've written a lot about it here on the LC board). If you are interested, I can explain some more about it, but a google search will give you some basic information. NVLD is not always diagnosed, because it is not in the DSM5 (psych diagnostic manual), but there is a constellation of traits that forms a NVLD learning pattern.

Kids with NVLD often struggle with reading comprehension and with math concepts. These difficulties often don't appear until kids are in later elementary years or older. DS16, for example, learned to read easily and had no trouble with math in the beginning. At age 10, when his neuropsych evaluations stated that he had LDs in those areas and would struggle, I was shocked, but over time, the troubles have indeed reared their heads.

I'm just mentioning this so that these things can be on your radar, and you can watch out for them. The math, reading, and even the social (pragmatics) problems related to NVLD can become more evident the older the child gets. They may remain minor, or they may become trickier in the teenage years.

 

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You might also do some reading about pragmatic language and social skills. Some of the things you mention about not immediately understanding jokes, etc., can be related to pragmatic language, which is related to social skills. What one thinks is meant by "social skills" is not exactly what a therapist means by it. We had teachers who swore that DS had no social issues but then ranked him as never ("never" was a box one could check) being able to do SO MANY things on the school's pragmatic testing. He scored as low as one could get on that evaluation (1 out of 10, I think) even though his teachers though he had no social problems. He has qualified for social skills help from an SLP at school ever since.

You can click on the "documents" links on the webpage below and read a list of questions that can help you think through the social skills in more detail.

https://www.ocali.org/project/assessment_guide/page/assessment_measures

You might notice this link refers sometimes to autism. Many of the NVLD traits can cross over into the autism spectrum, if they are severe enough. Some people will say that NVLD is never a correct diagnosis, and that only ASD should be considered, but I do believe that NVLD is a kind of spectrum from mild to severe, and it's possible to have mild NVLD traits and not have autism.

DS16 did eventually get an autism diagnosis, but not everyone who has NVLD traits will meet the autism qualifications. It's big debate in the NVLD and autism community. But don't let the idea of autism (if you don't think that might be an issue for your son) keep you from looking into NVLD. Understanding NVLD helped me be a better advocate for my son, even when we encountered people who didn't believe in it. If you dig into information online, you will come across this debate.

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