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8 minutes ago, Ali in OR said:

I'm exploring the Oregon Health Authority website. Now that we have metrics, I would like to see those specific numbers reported. What I can definitely find on the website is the weekly state positivity rate from the "Weekly Testing Summary." The most recent week was 4.8% but the two previous were both 5.8%, so we wouldn't make it on that metric yet. I need to start tracking our county numbers. We need to be 10 or lower for the week, and I don't think we've been hitting that (our population is close to 100k). Some days we have 0 cases, some days 1 or 2 or 3. The most I've seen in a day is 6 I think. Today was 3. I don't know where to track down our positivity rate yet. 

 

Our county has definitely been higher than 10 new cases per week recently total. I think also more than 10 per 100,000 but that would take more calculating.  I don’t know our positive rate.

 

do you understand the metrics to be Both cases under ____ per hundred And positivity under 5%

or is it an either or ?

 

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Looks like our county positivity rate has been well below 5%. And we have to go back to 3 weeks ago to have more than 10 cases in a week: most recently 5, then 4, then 13. So one more good week and our county data would be fine but we would need 2 more weeks of the state being under 5%. But we're online for sure until later in October, so it will depend on what the numbers are doing then. I think you have to meet all the criteria, not an either/or. And it doesn't matter how well we do if Portland goes much over 5%, as they have a much bigger population that will drive the whole state percentage up. 

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@Pen This is the most helpful page I've found for county data. Hover over the graph for numbers.

https://public.tableau.com/profile/oregon.health.authority.covid.19#!/vizhome/OregonCOVID-19TestingandOutcomesbyCounty/OregonsCOVID-19TestingandOutcomesbyCounty?:display_count=y&:toolbar=n&:origin=viz_share_link&:showShareOptions=false

That didn't go right to the page. You have to click the tab for Trends in Test Positivity by County.

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5 minutes ago, Ali in OR said:

Looks like our county positivity rate has been well below 5%. And we have to go back to 3 weeks ago to have more than 10 cases in a week: most recently 5, then 4, then 13. So one more good week and our county data would be fine but we would need 2 more weeks of the state being under 5%. But we're online for sure until later in October, so it will depend on what the numbers are doing then. I think you have to meet all the criteria, not an either/or. And it doesn't matter how well we do if Portland goes much over 5%, as they have a much bigger population that will drive the whole state percentage up. 

 

I don’t know if it makes sense for what is going on in Portland to affect schools east of Cascades, but for our rural area it probably does make sense because people go there for some events, health care, shopping etc, so we are sort of exposed to Portland. 

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7 minutes ago, Pen said:

 

I don’t know if it makes sense for what is going on in Portland to affect schools east of Cascades, but for our rural area it probably does make sense because people go there for some events, health care, shopping etc, so we are sort of exposed to Portland. 

Yeah, here too. But dh and I were just looking at the map showing all the counties and the Portland counties were under 5% last week. Marion and Polk were closer to 10, but the highest % positives were in eastern Oregon! We figure those are agriculture related.

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2 hours ago, Ali in OR said:

Yeah, here too. But dh and I were just looking at the map showing all the counties and the Portland counties were under 5% last week. Marion and Polk were closer to 10, but the highest % positives were in eastern Oregon! We figure those are agriculture related.

 

One of the Eastern Oregon problems (Union County) is the church outbreak. 

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A high school classmate/facebook friend just posted that he submitted an open records request to the district next door to me (the one that's starting in person classes next week) asking about cases among staff members....and found out that seven schools have already had positive cases and/or quarantines--just with the few staff members in the building over the summer. I just submitted a request (my first ever open records request!) to our district to get the same information, since they're planning to have all teachers back in the buildings (and their school age children if they don't have childcare) next week.

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We finally got a draft for our district. It’s a work in progress, but it generally looks like it will follow the State's red-yellow-green guidelines for  online-hybrid-fully open depending on the counties numbers. Grades 10-12 will be online only during both yellow and red scenarios, and it looks like we might be able to opt out of in person entirely until at least December. My county is unlikely to ever be green.

The first day of class still hasn’t been determined and the draft needs to be finalised, but at least I no longer feel left in the dark. DS is relieved that he might be able to do online, while hoping hoping hoping the spring can be in person.  🤞

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Just checked my school district's website to see what the latest is, just for conversation, because I don't think we can really predict right now.  I think our governor can say no to opening regardless of what the school district wants.

The basic plan I saw before apparently hasn't changed much ... people can opt into all virtual if they want that, and in-person school will depend on week-to-week case info as of the previous Thursday.  [Either all in-person or hybrid 2 days in / 2 days online.]  Opening for everyone is pushed back 2.5 weeks to the 2nd week of September.

The new thing I thought was interesting - even when the school starts in-person, the first 2 weeks will be hybrid (part in-person, part virtual).  That makes sense to me - teach everyone how to do virtual school in case they need to transition to that.  Everyone is given a laptop and they're working on getting internet access to any homes that don't already have it.  Hopefully the teachers develop plans that will work whether they are in person or at home.

Band and choir are a go from day 1.  Sports - they say the season starts August 1 and they haven't decided anything yet, but group practices have been going on all through July at least, so hopefully that doesn't stop.

Career tech programs are a go, with no all-virtual option.

Bus service is a go, but they are trying to have fewer kids on the buses.

They say that the protocol if a student or teacher is diagnosed with Covid is to:  inform the health department which will advise of next steps, do extra cleaning, and inform "appropriate" families "within legal parameters."

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My school district just announced they will use Canvas and Discovery Ed for grades 6-12. I think they are using their virtual school courses they already had in place, requested more licenses for Canvas so they can offer them across the state for uniformity. I haven't seen what they have planned for elementary yet. I have heard of Discovery Ed videos through homeschoolers, but never used it. Are they good? I like Canvas. I'm familiar with it when my son took online CC courses. It's just a platform though, so it all depends on how good the course and how familiar with it the teacher is that will make the difference. 

It sounds like they will also offer some paper packet distance school type learning for our population that is rural and without internet. 

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Ohio Education Association says that 69% of Ohio teachers don't think it's safe to return to school. This echoes what I heard at our school board meeting, where the superintendent read a letter from the local teachers' association, saying that 65% of teachers don't think it's safe to have in-person classes.

https://fox8.com/news/coronavirus/many-ohio-teachers-concerned-about-returning-to-in-person-classes-this-fall/

Here is an article that interviews multiple teachers from around the state and describes a lot of the issues of concern:

https://ohiocapitaljournal.com/2020/07/28/i-just-feel-so-powerless-ohio-teachers-fear-returning-to-class/

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Given the spike in cases in my region (b/c beaches and stupidity don't mix), all schools in the largest three districts will be virtual-only to start the school year. We had already selected the virtual option for DD but it validates my preference to homeschool DS. I wish I could pull DD back to the dark side but...credits! Blech.

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So... are public schools exempt from some state laws, or what? I'm so confused. Our state just lifted restrictions on outdoor gatherings from 50 to 100. Meanwhile, our school of 250 people will be allowed to all gather, inside? Or is each classroom a "gathering," despite the fact that 75 kids share the same hallway and two single-stall bathrooms?

I don't get it. It seems like the rules for schools are so patently different than the rules for other places, with no explanation. Or maybe I'm thinking about it wrong...?

 

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9 minutes ago, Kanin said:

So... are public schools exempt from some state laws, or what? I'm so confused. Our state just lifted restrictions on outdoor gatherings from 50 to 100. Meanwhile, our school of 250 people will be allowed to all gather, inside? Or is each classroom a "gathering," despite the fact that 75 kids share the same hallway and two single-stall bathrooms?

I don't get it. It seems like the rules for schools are so patently different than the rules for other places, with no explanation. Or maybe I'm thinking about it wrong...?

 

Here in Aus they said social distancing doesn’t need to apply the schools because kids don’t transmit the virus.

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Schools are explicitly allowed to set their own rules under our health department ordinances. Our governor refuses to do any state-wide ones. 

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1 hour ago, Kanin said:

So... are public schools exempt from some state laws, or what? I'm so confused. Our state just lifted restrictions on outdoor gatherings from 50 to 100. Meanwhile, our school of 250 people will be allowed to all gather, inside? Or is each classroom a "gathering," despite the fact that 75 kids share the same hallway and two single-stall bathrooms?

I don't get it. It seems like the rules for schools are so patently different than the rules for other places, with no explanation. Or maybe I'm thinking about it wrong...?

 

You don't get it because it doesn't make sense. 

Here we have no real rules about size gatherings, but daily the state department of health puts out infographics saying to avoid the three C's - Confined Spaces, Crowds, and Close contact (which they define as close conversations). Um...schools have all three of those! And yet, they won't say schools should not open. 

 

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1 hour ago, Ausmumof3 said:

Here in Aus they said social distancing doesn’t need to apply the schools because kids don’t transmit the virus.

Oh dear 😬

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50 minutes ago, dmmetler said:

Schools are explicitly allowed to set their own rules under our health department ordinances. Our governor refuses to do any state-wide ones. 

Really? Argh!!

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29 minutes ago, Ktgrok said:

You don't get it because it doesn't make sense. 

Here we have no real rules about size gatherings, but daily the state department of health puts out infographics saying to avoid the three C's - Confined Spaces, Crowds, and Close contact (which they define as close conversations). Um...schools have all three of those! And yet, they won't say schools should not open. 

 

Ugh. Yes. Schools are pretty much everything we're told to avoid. I'm trying to push for our school to adopt a hybrid model even if we're allowed to open fully. I am hearing crickets on that proposal.

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6 hours ago, MEmama said:

We finally got a draft for our district. It’s a work in progress, but it generally looks like it will follow the State's red-yellow-green guidelines for  online-hybrid-fully open depending on the counties numbers. Grades 10-12 will be online only during both yellow and red scenarios, and it looks like we might be able to opt out of in person entirely until at least December. My county is unlikely to ever be green.

The first day of class still hasn’t been determined and the draft needs to be finalised, but at least I no longer feel left in the dark. DS is relieved that he might be able to do online, while hoping hoping hoping the spring can be in person.  🤞

Oh, I'm so glad you finally got some direction! I hope spring can be in person, too. 💛

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1 hour ago, Ausmumof3 said:

27 cases of campers and staff, plus additional cases due to campers spreading it to their families "but authorities are not including those cases in the count, for privacy reasons."

I do not at all understand how giving an overall count is a privacy concern 🤔

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I'm not even sure why we're discussing schools. After what I saw tonight, I don't think it's going to matter what we do about opening school.  I drove by a high school and the marching band was out practicing. They weren't on the practice field where they could spread out. They were on this little patch of grass between the building and the sidewalk. This is a big  band too with hundreds of students. They were all right on top of each other and the ones not playing were sitting shoulder to shoulder on the sidewalk. Then I went to a parking lot near a walk up ice cream shop. The place was PACKED with people. Large groups stood around talking. Of course none of them were wearing masks because they were eating. There was a middle school age baseball team all crammed together on a round picnic table. They got up and played tag, wrestled each other, tackled each other, and basically spent the entire time I was there all over each other. I kept thinking about how one asymptomatic carrier in that group could easily affect fifteen to twenty families. The whole experience was surreal because on one side of me I was watching people putting on masks and using hand sanitizer and on the other side were big groups acting like there's nothing unusual going on at all. I'm sad, angry, confused, and frustrated. My children and my family have given up a lot this year including time with my new grandchild and once in a lifetime opportunities. I don't think we all have to cower at home, but I would appreciate at least a few precautions.

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Since the weekend I have learned of outbreaks in 2 church camps in my area from small towns.  One person can spread it to the entire cabin- who then take it home and give it to their parents. These are churches and camps who decided to go ahead and have camp in July, bc cases are so low here.  My aunt is a teacher in one town, and the students are supposed to go back- no social distancing, full time, no masks required,  in 2-3 weeks.  They feel like sitting ducks and expect to get it with a month of school starting.  

But hey, another teacher friend of mine was just posting today that all these kids with positive cases must be politically connected, to stop kids from coming to school and playing sports, (he didnt mention Trump by name, but it was kinda implied that this was to hurt him).  I was very tempted to reply, but no- not going there!

And yet another teacher was asking me for HSing advice for her own kid- bc she knows this school year is going to be a mess and isnt sure she wants her kid to go.  

Schools are stuck- they cannot win, no matter what they do.  

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1 hour ago, mom2scouts said:

The whole experience was surreal because on one side of me I was watching people putting on masks and using hand sanitizer and on the other side were big groups acting like there's nothing unusual going on at all. I'm sad, angry, confused, and frustrated. My children and my family have given up a lot this year including time with my new grandchild and once in a lifetime opportunities. I don't think we all have to cower at home, but I would appreciate at least a few precautions.

All this! 

It's SO disheartening! My 3 yr old will never be 3 again, and she is the one out of all of mine that reminds me SO much of my mom. They would be SO amazing together - I can't even tell you. Like soulmates. And in a way that won't happen when she is older - my mom LOVES this age so much. And she is missing out, and in large part because other people won't freaking be even slightly careful. So because they are too special to distance while getting ice cream, this thing spreads and I have to keep my kid away from my (high risk) mom. 

Honestly, its infuriating. 

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4 hours ago, Kanin said:

So... are public schools exempt from some state laws, or what? I'm so confused. Our state just lifted restrictions on outdoor gatherings from 50 to 100. Meanwhile, our school of 250 people will be allowed to all gather, inside? Or is each classroom a "gathering," despite the fact that 75 kids share the same hallway and two single-stall bathrooms?

I don't get it. It seems like the rules for schools are so patently different than the rules for other places, with no explanation. Or maybe I'm thinking about it wrong...?

 

 

I think individual classrooms might be considered “gatherings”.    

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23 hours ago, Ali in OR said:

Yeah, here too. But dh and I were just looking at the map showing all the counties and the Portland counties were under 5% last week. Marion and Polk were closer to 10, but the highest % positives were in eastern Oregon! We figure those are agriculture related.

 

So I ran some figures today and concluded that my county if not all of Oregon will not be opening ftf for fall start of school.  

I am feeling some relief.  

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3 minutes ago, Pen said:

 

So I ran some figures today and concluded that my county if not all of Oregon will not be opening ftf for fall start of school.  

I am feeling some relief.  

At the moment it has to be no one because the state doesn't have 3 weeks of <5% positivity. But they could in a few weeks. It seems like most counties are announcing that they're starting online. As our superintendent said, parents need to be able to plan for something, so better to announce now.

 

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Just got the news that schools will be online only to start.  No surprise since we are still only in phase 1. 

Though it did get modified today to allow some super crucial activities.  Super limited lap swim that's probably not even worth opening for so late in summer.   Wineries and breweries outdoors with more capacity big.   Also drive in movies with no food service which actually seems ok. Except we don't have any drive in theatres so not sure what that is about.

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6 hours ago, rebcoola said:

Just got the news that schools will be online only to start.  No surprise since we are still only in phase 1. 

Though it did get modified today to allow some super crucial activities.  Super limited lap swim that's probably not even worth opening for so late in summer.   Wineries and breweries outdoors with more capacity big.   Also drive in movies with no food service which actually seems ok. Except we don't have any drive in theatres so not sure what that is about.

Around here they are doing a lot of drive-in movies in school parking lots or large fields.  They are pop-up events usually put on by a town.  

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8 hours ago, Pen said:

 

I think individual classrooms might be considered “gatherings”.    

I'm sure.... but that is nonsense. All the "gatherings" share the same halls, bathrooms, busses... and have siblings and friends in different "gatherings" and certainly don't distance outside of school. 

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4 minutes ago, Kanin said:

I'm sure.... but that is nonsense. All the "gatherings" share the same halls, bathrooms, busses... and have siblings and friends in different "gatherings" and certainly don't distance outside of school. 

All of it is nonsense. All of it. 

"Avoid crowds! Except schools, which magically are different! Stay home! But support the economy an go to Disney!"

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I really think that the answer needs to be to use community resources and spread those little bodies out. Let those who need school have it, and let kids have some social contact. Move the kids who can do virtual delivery to virtual to allow more adults to supervise, and let the ones who need hands on get it in really small groups (K-2, special ed, etc). Maybe pay parents to homeschool with district providing access to things like those textbooks that aren’t being used. 
 

At the same time, I’m doing my last week of summer piano. Unless things change, the next time I see most of my local students, it will be face to face (or at least half a face since masks are required) in person. The kids are SO excited-and while I am wary, I am, too. I think it is worth the risk.  

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Two more school districts in Georgia just pushed back start dates because multiple teachers have tested positive during pre-planning. I'm not sure why they think another week or two before bringing all the students back is going to help at all. 

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19 minutes ago, Bagels McGruffikin said:

You’re missing out, it’s an excellent paper and I’m so glad we started getting paper copies again and not just digital.

Basically it is talking about risk assessment and how to move forward with life and school risk assessments, in various detail.
 

5D55ABF9-B5CC-43C2-98F0-B28EC47BC6E2.thumb.jpeg.ecd6da5bfe02ddd94d9e0d3c82c862a1.jpeg

 

 

Why is he assuming 200,000 covid deaths? We're more than 3/4 of the way to that now and deaths are speeding up, not slowing down at the moment. Not to mention that opening schools has something to do with how likely kids are to get sick or die from covid and also a whole lot to do with how likely their teachers, relatives, and contacts in their communities are to get sick or die. Particularly given the new research on how well kids over 10 spread it. ETA: I think it's also important to consider, when talking about how many kids died between February and July, that kids were not in school for the vast majority of that time. A study just came out yesterday I think that estimated there would have been 40,000 more deaths if schools had stayed open (not all in kids, of course, but that's a lot of my point: any analysis that fails to consider not just the effect on kids but the fact that kids don't exist in a vacuum is pretty useless. It's a WONDERFUL RELIEF to all parents that kids are less affected by covid than adults...but it's far from the whole story when you're talking about schools or anything else).

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13 hours ago, dmmetler said:

Schools are explicitly allowed to set their own rules under our health department ordinances. Our governor refuses to do any state-wide ones. 

Our governor just extended mask wearing while indoors and outdoors not socially distancing and stated specifically that she extended the order to 2nd graders on up in schools that open.  She said she would like all schools to be virtual for the first marking period but she has no right to demand that. In our state, whether schools are open or not and whether  schools get some type of exemption from 180 days, etc is all in the hands of the State Superintended of Education and the governor has no or maybe very limited ability to influence who is chosen for that position.  I believe that is a choice of the State Board of Education which has elected representatives by a whole different set of districts.

Now apparently our city school district has been having some type of babysitting/ feeding breakfast and lunch/ and virtual learning in a building set up and several people have come down with COVID there- I believe both staff and students.   They will be getting rid of that service in a few weeks and they did the usual close for a few days, clean and open up silliness.  Our county has had a quite dramatic downward trend in new cases and that is wonderful.  

But dmmetler, I was walking by and saw a bit of a news conference with your governor this week and what he said made me think he is pandering to conspiracy holders and face mask refusers, etc.  He was saying something like masks are a good idea and many cities and counties in TN have adopted rules and anyway, everyone has their way of getting their own knowledge----- I am not sure of the exact phrasing but I am fairly sure he used knowledge or some close synonym.  I was completely taken aback.  I know that people have their own amounts of knowledge and quite a number of people are ignorant but I don't think that was what he was referring to.  I may be completely wrong and it was but my impression was that it had to do with more like people who think face masks don't work have their knowledge and people who do have theirs.

 

Now on a further aside,  I think the whole wear a face mask to protect others is a bad slogan and leads to thong and underwear mask wearing.  Wearing one to protect you and others should be the message.  Because unless the mask is worn under the nose,etc,   even tight bandanas help to a little bit of degree. And doing something like wearing a surgical mask plus a cloth mask or three layer tight cotton masks or many other combinations help quite a bit and sometimes even more than a N95,  

 

 

 

 

 

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https://www.statnews.com/2020/07/29/school-reopening-covid19-cases/

Quote


Now, a study published Wednesday in the Journal of the American Medical Association shows that closing all of a state’s schools was associated with a drastic decrease in both Covid-19 cases and deaths. And the point at which officials made that call mattered: Those states that adopted the policy while few people were testing positive saw a correlated flatter curve of cases.

 

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9 hours ago, rebcoola said:

Just got the news that schools will be online only to start.  No surprise since we are still only in phase 1. 

Though it did get modified today to allow some super crucial activities.  Super limited lap swim that's probably not even worth opening for so late in summer.   Wineries and breweries outdoors with more capacity big.   Also drive in movies with no food service which actually seems ok. Except we don't have any drive in theatres so not sure what that is about.

We have been having drive in movies in large parking lots mostly where there were entertainment events earlier.

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1 hour ago, Bagels McGruffikin said:

People tend to be more fearful of risks that are novel, or inspire dread. Thus, they fear nuclear power more than coal, gas or oil which kill far more people.

I disagree. People fear nuclear power because of Chernobyl and Fukushima. That land will be uninhabitable for a very, very long time. The Chernobyl exclusion zone is 1600 sq miles and Fukushima's is 143 sq miles. 

Comparing flu deaths to Covid is a bit like comparing deaths from air pollution due to coal, oil and natural gas power plants to the Chernobyl and Fukushima disasters. These are not comparable experiences with comparable effects. One is a constant and regrettable fatality rate, the other is literally unknown. We only know how many people die relatively quickly from Covid, we don't know what the long range health effects are, we don't know how long immunity lasts and we don't know if a second infection is far deadlier (like Dengue). We're playing with numbers (some of which appear to be pulled out of thin air with a pinch of wishful thinking). @kokotg is right that 200,000 deaths seems pretty optimistic when we've already seen 150,000 and more states appear to have accelerating outbreaks. 

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49 minutes ago, square_25 said:

Yes, I agree there. People would do better with this if they thought this protected THEM. 

idk, the majority of the people I know tend to say talk as though they do think masks are for the wearer's benefit, like they're not worried about getting covid or they're willing to take the chance of getting it.  

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21 minutes ago, Bagels McGruffikin said:

 

I have to cringe at the flu comparisons, for the opposite reason as all of you. I can name, off the top of my head, seven children whose families I KNOW who have died from flu complications in the last twelve months. In my circles this is common, and a much higher risk. Dismissing it because it’s the devil you know ignores the actual data of risk, who is at risk and why. That is the point, and a huge flaw in the analysis of many on these boards, IMO.

If you're suggesting that we need to take the risks from the flu more seriously--push harder for vaccinating, make sick leave more accessible and get rid of the stigma about missing school or work because of illness, considering masking indoors in areas or times of year with significant outbreaks--I absolutely agree. I hope that that's something good that will come out of this.

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11 hours ago, Ali in OR said:

At the moment it has to be no one because the state doesn't have 3 weeks of <5% positivity. But they could in a few weeks. It seems like most counties are announcing that they're starting online. As our superintendent said, parents need to be able to plan for something, so better to announce now.

 

 

They could probably get under 5% positivity by making it easier for anyone to get tested. 

But my county already has over 10 new cases per hundred thousand per week and seems to be trending up.  Unless the state mask rule or something else brings daily cases down,  it looks to me like I can narrow focus to public school at a distance or homeschool options.  

Though I am feeling some relief, I expect that My son will be unhappy because the social part of brick and mortar school is very important to him. 

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So the new ridiculous thing in Florida and schools, is that the emergency order says local health departments have the power to say school is unsafe to open. But the head of the county health department here said, when asked about that, that the order says the health department can do that, but he's just an employee of the health department, not THE health department, so he can't do that. 

I just...I can't even.

And in funny stuff, this is an impression of how the local district is handling this, from a radio station here

 

 

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1 hour ago, Bagels McGruffikin said:

I have to cringe at the flu comparisons, for the opposite reason as all of you. I can name, off the top of my head, seven children whose families I KNOW who have died from flu complications in the last twelve months. In my circles this is common, and a much higher risk. Dismissing it because it’s the devil you know ignores the actual data of risk, who is at risk and why. That is the point, and a huge flaw in the analysis of many on these boards, IMO.

I'd be very happy if people begin to take flu precautions more seriously, but you knowing seven people who have died from it means nothing statistically. I know zero people who have died from flu complications in the last twelve months, and that also means nothing. 

I think there's something to be said for using extra precautions with an unknown like Covid, but the number of deaths is beating flu regardless. The estimate for flu from October 2019 to April 1 2020 is 24,000 to 62,000 flu deaths over six months. Using the higher number, Covid has more than double the number of deaths in the same amount of time, and huge numbers of people have been/still are in some level of quarantine for much of that time. Huge numbers of employees going completely remote, tons of congregate spaces closed, schools closed - and still 154,000 deaths versus 62,000. 

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12 hours ago, rebcoola said:

Just got the news that schools will be online only to start.  No surprise since we are still only in phase 1. 

Though it did get modified today to allow some super crucial activities.  Super limited lap swim that's probably not even worth opening for so late in summer.   Wineries and breweries outdoors with more capacity big.   Also drive in movies with no food service which actually seems ok. Except we don't have any drive in theatres so not sure what that is about.

I think we have one drive-in theater in our state.  Dd19's already been three times since it reopened...  they're only showing classics mostly from the 80's, double-features.  She's thinking of buying an FM radio since last time her car battery died.  Apparently they have someone who comes around with jumpers for whoever that happens to...

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19 minutes ago, square_25 said:

Sigh. You gotta be kidding me. 

I wish. 

He then, when pressed on that bit of idiotic logic, tried to say he meant that the state surgeon general "is" the health department. But since the emergency order specifically referred to LOCAL health departments, not state level, that makes zero sense. 

11 minutes ago, Bagels McGruffikin said:

Children. The risk is specifically about children, and scaling risk for the actual danger of transmission and death of the disease in a given age range does indeed matter when we are talking about school. That’s what the article was about, as well as the graph.
 

As I said, if you or anyone else would like the read the article just message me.

Agreed. Children are less at risk of Covid, as far as death. And if they were also unable to spread it to other, higher risk people, that would make schools safe. But since they can, particularly older children, spread it to teachers and parents and grandparents and the community at large, we can't just look at their risk. but at the risk to all those people. 

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