Menu
Jump to content

What's with the ads?

PeterPan

S/o Masks in Orlando, Disney, Universal, etc., also CA/Los Angeles

Recommended Posts

@Ktgrok mentioned masking percentages were like 50% in Orlando. Is that area *requiring* masks and people are not complying? Or it's in a county that doesn't require them? I was just wondering if the theme parks are going beyond what the counties require in masking. I'm pretty much in the not going back to a theme park till the masks thing is GONE camp, but I was flabbergasted at how low the crowds seem to be for Universal's re-opening. Are the theme park requirements beyond the county's and the parks are not seeing support for it? Something else?

And does anyone know what the masking requirements are right now in the Los Angeles area? Is Disney going beyond state/county requirements or is the masking going to be consistent with local requirements?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Anaheim, Orange County where Disneyland is

https://www.anaheim.net/5454/Tracking-Coronavirus-Anaheim-Ready

“Face masks, coverings

Updated June 11, 2020

All Orange County workers and residents are strongly recommended to wear a cloth face covering or mask when out in public and when unable to keep six feet of physical distance between themselves and others who are not in their immediate household.

Experts say the wearing of face coverings, in addition to social distancing, helps protect others from someone who may be sick or a carrier of coronavirus and stem the spread in the community.

The Orange County Health Care Agency reduced the order from a mandatory requirement previously in place with a revised public health order released June 11.

Essential workers such as those in grocery stores are still required to wear a mask based on an order issued April 24. 

Many businesses are requiring masks for entry.

This requirement is in line with recommendations from California and the federal Centers for Disease Control.”

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I’m seeing that Disney is planning to enforce mask wearing. They have trained squads of cast members for the task:

https://insidethemagic.net/2020/05/disney-springs-face-masks-ba1/

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/coronavirus/jobs-economy/os-bz-coronavirus-theme-parks-recovery-20200529-fttcxrpekbcezibpe3odfwv3ba-story.html

If they have trouble with people not complying with masks, I expect they will need to close back down. 

 

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the latest in Orlando is that masks are required for both employees and customers if they are within 6 feet of each other, unless the service can't be provided that way. Disney World is requiring masks at all times unless you are at a special break area, a dining table, or actively eating/drinking; Universal pretty much the same. This is above local requirements, and I would expect them to stay above local requirements for quite some time. 

Low crowds don't surprise me at all. The number of people traveling a good distance to visit is surely going to be way down - there's a lot of uncertainty, plus you want everything to be open and available for an actual vacation trip. Some shows and parades are closed, you can't get up close with characters, and there are going to be glitches when you test out new ways of getting people on rides and such. 

We've traditionally gone about once a year to Disney World, but definitely aren't planning on it this year. I think they will mostly get local, people within a short-ish drive, and people who are in town or passing through for other reasons. 

 

  • Like 4
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I want to go to Universal again so badly.  I would 100% plan a trip today if we didn't have to wear masks.  I understand why they have masks as a requirement and am not upset about it at all.  But I can barely wear a mask for an hour while grocery shopping so I can't imagine wearing one all day long.  They get so itchy.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not surprised that re-opening crowds are low -- a good portion of Disney customers are international visitors, who (even if they were *willing* to take the risks of flying during a pandemic), would be required by their home nations to go into extended quarantine after visiting the US, which at this point is the most COVID-dense nation in the world and is seen by other governments as a source of contagion. A mandatory 10-14 day quarantine upon return shifts the cost-benefit balance of a vacation considerably.

  • Like 6
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Count me in the crowd that's not going while masks are required- it's hot without a mask on.   A Disney trip is also very expensive- I'm not paying all that money to have my trip cut short with a sick family member unable to enter the parks or getting stuck states away while sick.  Not worth it!  And I drive- if you decide to fly, and get sick, you may not be able to fly back home!  

Also moneywise, many families have lost hours and money over the last 3 months, and the future is uncertain,  too.  With food prices going up, jobs uncertain,  now isnt a good time to spend money on a vacation.  

We had planned a trip to Disney for May, but its permanently put on hold- probably for al least 2 years.  

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, BusyMom5 said:

if you decide to fly, and get sick, you may not be able to fly back home!  

That is a point I hadn't thought about, hmm. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

they'd have to lower park tickets by at least 50% for me to go while wearing a mask.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, hjffkj said:

they'd have to lower park tickets by at least 50% for me to go while wearing a mask.

Yeah, fat chance on that. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, PeterPan said:

@Ktgrok mentioned masking percentages were like 50% in Orlando. Is that area *requiring* masks and people are not complying? Or it's in a county that doesn't require them? I was just wondering if the theme parks are going beyond what the counties require in masking. I'm pretty much in the not going back to a theme park till the masks thing is GONE camp, but I was flabbergasted at how low the crowds seem to be for Universal's re-opening. Are the theme park requirements beyond the county's and the parks are not seeing support for it? Something else?

 

WDW straddles two counties - Orange and Osceola. AFAIK Orange County never had mask requirements outdoors. Osceola County did though they outright said they wouldn't actually do anything but chastise people caught not wearing masks. I think, though I'm not positive, they're no longer requiring masks. The parks had to present their plans to both county and state officials before being allowed open. I haven't paid attention so I don't know if they presented the idea of masks, social distancing on rides, and limited numbers allowed in or if they were told to do those things. I think it was the former but don't quote me on that.

As Universal passholders we had the opportunity to go one of the two days before they opened to the general public but chose not to. For one, we don't usually go in summer because it's so hot, plus we just didn't feel ready to join even a limited crowd of people. 

  • Like 3
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
49 minutes ago, BusyMom5 said:

A Disney trip is also very expensive- I'm not paying all that money to have my trip cut short with a sick family member unable to enter the parks or getting stuck states away while sick.  Not worth it!  And I drive- if you decide to fly, and get sick, you may not be able to fly back home!  

I agree with you. Traveling to Disneyland during a pandemic and expecting everything to go as per plan is being overly optimistic. 

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The big three in Orlando (Disney, Universal, and SeaWorld) are requiring and enforcing masks for all guests ages  2 and up.  There are no exceptions.  They also are checking temperatures prior to park entry and have social distancing markers/reminders throughout the parks.   Neither Orange county or the City of Orlando requires masks, but use is encouraged.

We attended SeaWorld's reopening last Thursday.  It was our first outing and first time to use masks.  The temperature was in the mid 90's and with the humidity the "real feel" temperature was 100+.  We lasted an hour before heading back home.

As much as our local economy needs visitors to return, I do not expect we will see them return any time soon due to reduced experiences and  the mask requirement.  

  • Like 3
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, PeterPan said:

Yeah, fat chance on that. 

Oh I know it would never happen.  But that is what would get me in the park

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Pam in CT said:

Not surprised that re-opening crowds are low -- a good portion of Disney customers are international visitors, who (even if they were *willing* to take the risks of flying during a pandemic), would be required by their home nations to go into extended quarantine after visiting the US, which at this point is the most COVID-dense nation in the world and is seen by other governments as a source of contagion. A mandatory 10-14 day quarantine upon return shifts the cost-benefit balance of a vacation considerably.

And with no fireworks, no parades, no hugging characters, and no nighttime spectaculars, it's probably an easy decision.

It's going to hurt Disney even  more, because it seems the international people are usually big spenders. 

  • Like 1
  • Sad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

dh's prediction is that Disney World is going to raise prices substantially in a few months, and offer a more elite experience to fewer people. He thinks it's been trending this way already and Covid is going to speed it up. 

  • Like 2
  • Sad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, PeterPan said:

@Ktgrok mentioned masking percentages were like 50% in Orlando. Is that area *requiring* masks and people are not complying? Or it's in a county that doesn't require them? I was just wondering if the theme parks are going beyond what the counties require in masking. I'm pretty much in the not going back to a theme park till the masks thing is GONE camp, but I was flabbergasted at how low the crowds seem to be for Universal's re-opening. Are the theme park requirements beyond the county's and the parks are not seeing support for it? Something else?

And does anyone know what the masking requirements are right now in the Los Angeles area? Is Disney going beyond state/county requirements or is the masking going to be consistent with local requirements?

Florida is not requiring masks in general - maybe at hair dressers? But I think even then, just the employees are required. But the theme parks are - because hello - huge crowds, huge possibility of transmission to large numbers of people by just one infected person. 

I know they had to come up with a reopening plan to be allowed to reopen, not sure if the masks were a requirement or their own idea to limit liability and promote safety. But I mean, it's pretty normal to have different requirements for different businesses. So bars had a different reopening date than grocery stores, etc. 

But as a person who has to live here, near the theme parks, I am darned glad they are requiring masks and even then, given how badly people are about actually following rules, I'm terrified of what is going to happen now that they are open. There is huge potential for a superspreader event. And those employees live and work and grocery shop, etc in my town. Not to mention the residents that have passes, etc. so yeah, a superspreader event there would be very bad for my community. 

 

  • Like 3
  • Thanks 1
  • Sad 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, katilac said:

I think the latest in Orlando is that masks are required for both employees and customers if they are within 6 feet of each other, unless the service can't be provided that way.

 

Nope. Not a requirement here. 

And it is nowhere near 50% wearing masks at most places now. Much lower. A friend just posted that the only place with food near her job that has people wearing masks consistently (employees) is Starbucks. Some other places are more strict (bigger chains, more liability issues). 

But most people are "back to normal". 

 

  • Thanks 1
  • Sad 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well I plan Disney trips, and I, for one, have not encouraged a single person to travel. I know I wouldn’t go to Disney wearing a mask, least of all when it’s 100+ degrees and 90% humidity. I think it’s a recipe for disaster. Small children are not going to be able to vocalize if they are struggling with those masks on in that heat. People will be taking them on and off for eating, drinking, breathing, etc., and then they’ll be full of all the germs, not to mention sweaty and wet. I have zero clue how they think this is going to be helpful.

We go to Disney at least once/year, but we won’t be going again until it’s back to normal. Maybe I’ll finally get to travel to some other places. 😜

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't think California is anywhere close to allowing theme parks to open up again. This past December was the first time in 11 years that we didn't make a Christmas Disney trip and now I'm a little sad about that.

  • Sad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Disneyland Resort is working on being open by next month: https://disneyparks.disney.go.com/blog/2020/06/disneyland-resort-proposes-plans-to-begin-phased-reopening-july-9-with-proposed-reopening-of-theme-parks-july-17/

FWIW, Orange County, CA, "strongly recommends" but does not require mask use in public (https://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2020/06/11/face-masks-orange-county-required-coronavirus/). I'm sure Disneyland will have their own rules regarding masks, but at this time they are not required unless a business chooses to require it of their clientele/ patrons.

Edited by Elfknitter.#
  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Disneyland in Anaheim will be enforcing mask wearing by guests and cast members. Furloughed employees (including my ds) are waiting for word on when (and if) they will be returning to work. Employees all have to go through COVID training before returning to work, which I assume will NOT be sessions held in tiny meeting rooms with cast members stuffed in like sardines, lol! 

There is a petition here in So Cal to delay the reopening, but the opening is scheduled for July 17, the 65th anniversary of the park. 

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am in Central Florida too.  Masks are being strictly enforced at the parks that are open.  They are also checking temps on the way in.  Special reservations for rides at Universal so assuming Disney will have that.....no lines.  Numbers in really are low and I have read that there will be no guarantee regarding getting in to Disney after it reopens......staying in a Disney hotel will not guarantee  admission per something I read....think you need a reservation.  Looks like DVC members may be getting first dibs as all the hotels appear to be DVC property’s for the initial opening.  
 

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ice packs or cold towels on shoulders neck or back etc. seem to help me feel less hot in masks.     There were a variety of tricks iirc some of the workers dressed  up as Mickey Mouse, Pluto etc characters who had to dress with full head masks in summer heat in CA used to have. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, mumto2 said:

I am in Central Florida too.  Masks are being strictly enforced at the parks that are open.  They are also checking temps on the way in.  Special reservations for rides at Universal so assuming Disney will have that.....no lines.  Numbers in really are low and I have read that there will be no guarantee regarding getting in to Disney after it reopens......staying in a Disney hotel will not guarantee  admission per something I read....think you need a reservation.  Looks like DVC members may be getting first dibs as all the hotels appear to be DVC property’s for the initial opening.  
 

 

Yup.  My friend is a DVC owner and got reservations for Aug but then couldn't get any tickets or park ride reservations for their guest, so they are cancelling for now.

Limited park tickets sold, you can't just go up and buy them when you get there.  I have read they are booked through Sept now, so you can't even get tickets for the summer.  And you must stay on Disney property to even get into the parks in Orlando.

Edited by DawnM
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Pen said:

Ice packs or cold towels on shoulders neck or back etc. seem to help me feel less hot in masks.     There were a variety of tricks iirc some of the workers dressed  up as Mickey Mouse, Pluto etc characters who had to dress with full head masks in summer heat in CA used to have. 

A wet neck gaiter is helpful. 

But honestly, as a Floridian, even before masks it was too darned hot to go to theme parks this time of year - other than water parks. 

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Pen said:

Ice packs or cold towels on shoulders neck or back etc. seem to help me feel less hot in masks.     There were a variety of tricks iirc some of the workers dressed  up as Mickey Mouse, Pluto etc characters who had to dress with full head masks in summer heat in CA used to have. 

Yeah, it's completely not on the table. But at least what they're doing is finally making sense. They're keeping crowds so low that there are no lines. Surely they won't do that very long? What I don't want to see is some kind of complete conversion, like this becomes a new culture thing, like it seems to be in China. But if people in Orlando are not being *required* to wear masks and even in CA they are not *required* then I would think it's going to have to fade, that they're just doing what they think they have to do right now. If, on the other hand, it's a political statement or some attempt to make it permanent, then that's really sad. I'm seeing editorials freaking out about Texas and FL not wearing their masks enough, but sorry Ohio isn't either and our stats are holding steady. It seems like some of the places have an issue with their bars, and Ohio is being much more careful about bars. I haven't been in one since high school, so I wouldn't know, hahaha.

I think @BusyMom5's comment about the return trip is really important. I have a trip for 2020 planned, my annual trek for winter sun, and you're right I don't know what happens if we get sick along the way. On the plus side, it seems anything we get exposed to isn't likely to do it's thing too quickly. My mom suggested I could rent a car and DRIVE back, haha. I don't really like to drive more than 3 hours at a time, so that would be a long trip, lol. 

So I guess we'll only know for that if we see some track record of trips going successfully. But you're right that I was so focused on the whole mask thing and whether I was willing to go that I hadn't thought through the more basic should I go. But it's possibly unknowable. Or I'm not figuring it out, lol. The variable to me is the rapid tests. Some of these countries/ports are saying they're going to rapid test EVERYONE. If cruise ships rapid test, you can be a lot more confident. But hey, what happens if you get there, rapid test, and boom you're sick?? Can you imagine? Oh my. And trip insurance isn't going to cover that. 

 

Edited by PeterPan

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
24 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

Yeah, it's completely not on the table. But at least what they're doing is finally making sense. They're keeping crowds so low that there are no lines. Surely they won't do that very long? What I don't want to see is some kind of complete conversion, like this becomes a new culture thing, like it seems to be in China. But if people in Orlando are not being *required* to wear masks and even in CA they are not *required* then I would think it's going to have to fade, that they're just doing what they think they have to do right now. If, on the other hand, it's a political statement or some attempt to make it permanent, then that's really sad. I'm seeing editorials freaking out about Texas and FL not wearing their masks enough, but sorry Ohio isn't either and our stats are holding steady. It seems like some of the places have an issue with their bars, and Ohio is being much more careful about bars. I haven't been in one since high school, so I wouldn't know, hahaha.

I think @BusyMom5's comment about the return trip is really important. I have a trip for 2020 planned, my annual trek for winter sun, and you're right I don't know what happens if we get sick along the way. On the plus side, it seems anything we get exposed to isn't likely to do it's thing too quickly. My mom suggested I could rent a car and DRIVE back, haha. I don't really like to drive more than 3 hours at a time, so that would be a long trip, lol. 

So I guess we'll only know for that if we see some track record of trips going successfully. But you're right that I was so focused on the whole mask thing and whether I was willing to go that I hadn't thought through the more basic should I go. But it's possibly unknowable. Or I'm not figuring it out, lol. The variable to me is the rapid tests. Some of these countries/ports are saying they're going to rapid test EVERYONE. If cruise ships rapid test, you can be a lot more confident. But hey, what happens if you get there, rapid test, and boom you're sick?? Can you imagine? Oh my. And trip insurance isn't going to cover that. 

 

To be fair, Ohio was MUCH slower to reopen, and much better about stay in place, etc at the start, I believe. We have had stuff open for a while now, and probably opened way too quickly. But yeah, people are saying not wearing masks is a problem here because unlike ohio, who has numbers going down, and can start not wearing masks at some near point, our numbers are going up. So yes, we are ANGRY that people are not doing the one thing they could do to help slow the spread and prevent another shut down. We've had for a while now gyms opened up to full capacity, bars open, etc...retail open...and no one wearing masks, people partying, etc. And this is the result - 
ER visits for COVID-like illness increased by 24% and ER visits for influenza-like visits increased by 52%
New cases by date in Orange increased by 157%

Percent positive doubled. 

So yeah, honestly? I wouldn't make ANY plans to be in this area, until we see if we get this under control vs heading for another shut down. 

And regarding getting sick if here, that's a huge issue. Our hospitals are filling up again, and if you were in the hospital in Florida, who would take care of your son? 

As for the tests, they aren't super accurate, and there is now a speculation that people won't test positive early in the illness.The army tested all incoming recruits at Ft. Benning and found and isolated the 4 positive away from everyone else. Two weeks later 22% of the 640 recruits were positive. Now, imagine that scenario on a cruise...  https://connectingvets.radio.com/…/fort-benning-confirms-14…

  • Like 5
  • Thanks 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
46 minutes ago, Ktgrok said:

if you were in the hospital in Florida, who would take care of your son? 

Yes, that's actually my biggest concern. 

48 minutes ago, Ktgrok said:

The army tested all incoming recruits at Ft. Benning and found and isolated the 4 positive away from everyone else. Two weeks later 22% of the 640 recruits were positive. Now, imagine that scenario on a cruise... 

That's the thing. What is the CDC going to say when the ship comes back with people positive?? Right now they're doing some kind of utopian, impossible red/yellow/green light which basically means nobody gets off if anyone has it, which is completely preposterous. And they're saying tracking in NY has become political, that they aren't going to ask if they were at the protests. So if they aren't REALLY going to track/trace everyone (which they aren't, only the worst cases), then why the paranoia about someone on the cruise ship having it?? 

It's just a lot of unknowns for a mom and a kid. Sigh. Especially a kid with disabilities who *cannot* be without his meds. I mean, that's the stuff I was thinking about, how I make sure I have enough stuff with me for contingencies. It almost gets nuts. My thyroid meds, his anxiety meds and supplements (without which he's unsafe). It's not a small thing. 

So I don't know. You know the other thing is it sounds like the FL numbers are skewing young. Here, the majority of our cases and deaths are still congregate living. 70-75% of deaths were in nursing homes and assisted living. Another 25% of cases (not deaths, cases) have been prisons. But I agree, a cruise ship is going to send that around just like in a prison. I don't think their reduced capacity thing will improve that.

So I'm definitely thinking. I just really wanted all this to poof by 2020. I guess I could just make a really different plan. You're right, all it would take is getting the virus exposure on the plane and you'd be sick before your return date and unable possibly to fly home.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
56 minutes ago, Ktgrok said:

ohio, who has numbers going down, and can start not wearing masks at some near point, our numbers are going up.

Ohio just varies. Once you get outside the big cities, mask usage is incredibly low. During parts of the day when there are lots of elderly, it will be 50%. From 3pm on, bank on it being just a smattering of people wearing masks, maybe 5%. I didn't go to a lot of places in the big city when I went last week, because frankly I'm not an idiot. The person I talked with said it varies. I think it's probably higher in the more upscale, liberal parts of the city, very high rates there from what I'm being told. Whole Foods, for instance, is handing out masks. I doubt it's homogenous, but I'm not about to go into a bunch of stores and find out, lol. I'm planning to go to an indian store next time I'm there to pick up some black lentils and things for a dish, but that will probably be in/out, not a lot of people.

Anyways, point is, I doubt the overall mask usage at Walmart, the grocery store, etc. is so much different if you average it out across the state, in Ohio vs. Florida. Just my guess. Which means it's something different on things where people are closer like the bars. And they could tighten down on the things where people are close. Is FL doing contact tracing? Then surely they know where the exposures are happening. I saw some news articles about FL, and I just think that's unreasonable scare tactics to say they're going to shut down the entire state if what they need is *targeted* back tracking.

But could that happen to cruising? Oh yeah. I mean, can you imagine? That's just constant drinking and bars. I think I'm like one of the 10 sober people on the ship, lol. And all the evening entertainment is pretty tight, to the point where they can't fit everyone in. I don't know, the whole thing may be nuts, the more I think about it. But how to get my money back, that is the question. The real variable is what the CDC does when people get sick on the ship, not whether people will get sick. And like for traveling to anywhere, same gig. Even to say fly to Bahamas, fly somewhere and get your sun, you could get stuck. So Disney is trying to establish that people can fly in, hang with them, not get sick, and make it home? If they get that track record, they survive, sure. If people can't be guaranteed to fly back home, they suddenly become regional, only doable for people can drive it. I can fly WDW in less than 2 hours for $80 a person, but it would take me multiple days and be horrible to drive, oy. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My Central Florida county’s numbers really only started their scary climb last week.  The testing starting June 9........so exposure likely at the start of June.  My hubby has beautiful graphs that I can’t post because of technical difficulties on my part.  Yesterday’s climb wasn’t as significant so hoping a new trend is starting.  
 

I read the precautions being taken which are as safe as possible,  remember the post 9/11 silence at the parks,  and am almost tempted to use those DVC points and go.  We are DVC members and use our points for an annual Hilton Head vacation which we missed last spring due to Covid.  No crowds from the perspective of a visitor is really great, just saying.  Central Florida does need to try and get those parks going.......we all have friends and family whose jobs depend on them at some level.

I keep remembering my county had over thirty days of consistently low numbers even with our residents running around mainly mask free and honestly pretty open.  The theme parks did not contribute significantly to our climb as they hadn’t even really opened.  Even Memorial Day celebrations are a doubtful contributor because the climb numbers started way more than 5 days after.  Some county official said our cases are predominantly 18 to 30 year olds in something I listened to yesterday, so actually lower than the the statewide 20 to 45 from the governor.   I am just plain sad,  all our hard work gone!

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
48 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

Yes, that's actually my biggest concern. 

That's the thing. What is the CDC going to say when the ship comes back with people positive?? Right now they're doing some kind of utopian, impossible red/yellow/green light which basically means nobody gets off if anyone has it, which is completely preposterous. And they're saying tracking in NY has become political, that they aren't going to ask if they were at the protests. So if they aren't REALLY going to track/trace everyone (which they aren't, only the worst cases), then why the paranoia about someone on the cruise ship having it?? 

It's just a lot of unknowns for a mom and a kid. Sigh. Especially a kid with disabilities who *cannot* be without his meds. I mean, that's the stuff I was thinking about, how I make sure I have enough stuff with me for contingencies. It almost gets nuts. My thyroid meds, his anxiety meds and supplements (without which he's unsafe). It's not a small thing. 

So I don't know. You know the other thing is it sounds like the FL numbers are skewing young. Here, the majority of our cases and deaths are still congregate living. 70-75% of deaths were in nursing homes and assisted living. Another 25% of cases (not deaths, cases) have been prisons. But I agree, a cruise ship is going to send that around just like in a prison. I don't think their reduced capacity thing will improve that.

So I'm definitely thinking. I just really wanted all this to poof by 2020. I guess I could just make a really different plan. You're right, all it would take is getting the virus exposure on the plane and you'd be sick before your return date and unable possibly to fly home.

 

33 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

Which means it's something different on things where people are closer like the bars. And they could tighten down on the things where people are close. Is FL doing contact tracing? Then surely they know where the exposures are happening. I saw some news articles about FL, and I just think that's unreasonable scare tactics to say they're going to shut down the entire state if what they need is *targeted* back tracking.

But could that happen to cruising? Oh yeah. I mean, can you imagine? That's just constant drinking and bars. I think I'm like one of the 10 sober people on the ship, lol. And all the evening entertainment is pretty tight, to the point where they can't fit everyone in. I don't know, the whole thing may be nuts, the more I think about it. But how to get my money back, that is the question. The real variable is what the CDC does when people get sick on the ship, not whether people will get sick. And like for traveling to anywhere, same gig. Even to say fly to Bahamas, fly somewhere and get your sun, you could get stuck. So Disney is trying to establish that people can fly in, hang with them, not get sick, and make it home? If they get that track record, they survive, sure. If people can't be guaranteed to fly back home, they suddenly become regional, only doable for people can drive it. I can fly WDW in less than 2 hours for $80 a person, but it would take me multiple days and be horrible to drive, oy. 

I think the timing coincides with churchs,/gyms/bars/retail opening, plus restaurants going to higher capacity, plus people getting tired of wearing masks. But then, wherever they got it, those people go spread it other places. We have had pubs and such closing already due to the number of positive cases they have been made aware of, but it is being reported that the people themselves informed the businesses, not some government health agency. I'm not hearing anything really about contact tracing...I know a friend was considering applying for a job doing it, but that didn't work out due to scheduling. 

And yup - on a cruise it would be a nightmare. My understanding is even a lot of the hallways are not that wide, to allow for any distancing? And once people are drunk, they talk louder (spewing more virus) and lose all concept of personal space. Not to mention the possibility of hookups, lol. Which is why I'm pretty darned angry about them opening up bars! If IRELAND could close pubs, we can suck it up! Let people drink at home in small groups! I mean, hello - have these officials ever BEEN to a club? The music is SO loud you have to yell in each other's faces to talk. Who didn't think that was going to be an issue? And gyms opened up really early too - with pretty much NO restrictions. Like, no mask wearing, nothing...just "keep hand sanitizer and equipment cleaners available". Not even required to USE them! And you've seen people at gyms - plenty do NOT wipe the equipment down, few are going to sanitize their hands between equipment, etc. Plus of course, all of them huffing and puffing in an inclosed space. 6 ft apart is not enough in that situation!

We were really really dumb about it, frankly. We should have instead encouraged MORE curbside stuff, had some small business virtual conferences on how to shift to online ordering, let the places doing it well teach others how to do it. Helped the small places shift to selling more takeout - helped them also do waht some did, which was to offer uncooked ingredients, put together like those meal kit subscription boxes - that was smart! We could have used some funds to do a big publicity push for that stuff, and offered low or no interest loans or free even consultations to help businesses get their online platforms running, instead of spending those dollars on healthcare for people who get the virus!

We should have opened up outdoor stuff earlier, and indoor stuff like gyms later. We should have again, had roundtables and virtual town halls and such to help figure out how to open up safetly, rather than telling businesses "um...use sanitizer or something" which is pretty much what happened. And helped businesses source PPE and sanitizer and such! My friend who owns an eye clinic had to postpone opening at first because they couldn't source gloves, sanitizer and masks. 

Instead, we opened up gyms and bars and said "have at it". Sigh. 

And obviously, those people that catch it at the gym or the bar are not the only ones impacted. Because they will go to the stores, doctor's offices, restaurants, churches, etc and spread it. 

I really think it started with Memorial day and reopening spreading it some, but not enough to be a huge spike, but then all THOSE people spread it, and THAT is what we are seeing now. 

Also, I highly encourage you to think about not just "how to get home" but "how to handle being VERY sick while in a different state and having a child with special needs". Because although your chance of dying is low, as you realize, most of our hospitalizations are in your age bracket I think. And even if you don't end up hospitalized, plenty of people get VERY ill...and I don't imagine your son would handle that well, if you were bedridden for weeks, in a strange place. If you catch it there is a very good chance you wouldn't be well enough to drive home - not to mention, everywhere you stopped for the bathroom, water, etc you'd be exposing dozens of others. So, illegal, lol. But mostly, like you my worry is being out of commission. I don't think either of us can afford that, in our circumstances. (this is kind of what I was trying to explain in that other thread about traveling, but not well I think)

4 minutes ago, mumto2 said:

My Central Florida county’s numbers really only started their scary climb last week.  The testing starting June 9........so exposure likely at the start of June.  My hubby has beautiful graphs that I can’t post because of technical difficulties on my part.  Yesterday’s climb wasn’t as significant so hoping a new trend is starting.  
 

I read the precautions being taken which are as safe as possible,  remember the post 9/11 silence at the parks,  and am almost tempted to use those DVC points and go.  We are DVC members and use our points for an annual Hilton Head vacation which we missed last spring due to Covid.  No crowds from the perspective of a visitor is really great, just saying.  Central Florida does need to try and get those parks going.......we all have friends and family whose jobs depend on them at some level.

I keep remembering my county had over thirty days of consistently low numbers even with our residents running around mainly mask free and honestly pretty open.  The theme parks did not contribute significantly to our climb as they hadn’t even really opened.  Even Memorial Day celebrations are a doubtful contributor because the climb numbers started way more than 5 days after.  Some county official said our cases are predominantly 18 to 30 year olds in something I listened to yesterday, so actually lower than the the statewide 20 to 45 from the governor.   I am just plain sad,  all our hard work gone!

Yeah, I think some counties had very low numbers..but then with things open it only takes a few people getting it, maybe visiting a neighboring county, to bring it back and spread it. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
28 minutes ago, mumto2 said:

I am just plain sad,  all our hard work gone!

I have this theory that the sooner everyone gets the virus and we get herd immunity, the sooner my dad in assisted living gets his freedom back. I'm not saying that's a popular perspective, just saying it's mine. If the doctors are saying we all have to get it eventually, then to me it's just something that has to be done. Keep the meds flowing, the deaths low, get it done.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

I have this theory that the sooner everyone gets the virus and we get herd immunity, the sooner my dad in assisted living gets his freedom back. I'm not saying that's a popular perspective, just saying it's mine. If the doctors are saying we all have to get it eventually, then to me it's just something that has to be done. Keep the meds flowing, the deaths low, get it done.

or...the sooner someone brings it into his assisted living facility and he dies, alone with no visitors? I mean, keeping deaths low is easier done if we push this out...we are getting better treatments as time goes on. 

What I'd like is everyone to wear a mask and use common sense so that the spread dips down to nearly nothing, so that it would be relatively safe to go out. 

  • Like 7
  • Thanks 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

I have this theory that the sooner everyone gets the virus and we get herd immunity, the sooner my dad in assisted living gets his freedom back. I'm not saying that's a popular perspective, just saying it's mine. If the doctors are saying we all have to get it eventually, then to me it's just something that has to be done. Keep the meds flowing, the deaths low, get it done.

Personally I want to wait as long as possible to get it......hoping for a vaccine or at least for the treatments to keep improving beyond where they currently are.  I get that I am in a fortunate position with a husband who is semi retired, can afford instacart etc.  My kids have enough friends who had it really hard to know that being twenty does mean a guarantee of asymptomatic or even laying around binge watching for a week.  They seem to  be totally on board with hanging out with Mom and Dad for now.  

 

20 minutes ago, Ktgrok said:

Yeah, I think some counties had very low numbers..but then with things open it only takes a few people getting it, maybe visiting a neighboring county, to bring it back and spread it. 

It’s the suddenness of the spike that gets me........people were already crossing the county lines all the time.  I have been crossing lines for my curbside.  That isn’t new.

4 minutes ago, Ktgrok said:

What I'd like is everyone to wear a mask and use common sense so that the spread dips down to nearly nothing, so that it would be relatively safe to go out. 

Me too!

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, Ktgrok said:

I think the timing coincides with churchs,/gyms/bars/retail opening, plus restaurants going to higher capacity, plus people getting tired of wearing masks.

That's a really interesting take. And we're right on the cusp of that. We haven't resumed church even though the church is meeting again. I just think it's right on that edge. I really don't think it's safe. They were telling people to wear masks, only because the health dept said they had to. Reality is almost no one is. So that makes sense that if people are doing the higher risk activities (bars, church, ironic that we have to put them in the same sentence...) and the restaurants go to 100% (which ours aren't yet) and and, then yes that's how the explosion would happen. So maybe that's why our governor is doing such a protracted reopening? It's quite infuriating. You literally can't get in to a restaurant in the big city if it's any good, not for a same day reservation. Only ones that review poorly, lol. We ended up staying local for our anniversary instead of doing something swank.

I may just keep us home from church for a while yet. Bless them, I hope their plan works, but I have plans for the 4th and don't want to be sick.

14 minutes ago, Ktgrok said:

And gyms opened up really early too - with pretty much NO restrictions.

Yeah, I've been going in circles, because our Y is *requiring* masks, which seems completely impractical to me. I wish they would just say no masks but limit capacity radically, like by appt. So I'm still waiting to go, sigh. Fattening up I am, lol. 

15 minutes ago, Ktgrok said:

We were really really dumb about it, frankly. We should have instead encouraged MORE curbside stuff, had some small business virtual conferences on how to shift to online ordering, let the places doing it well teach others how to do it.

I see what you're frustrated about! Yes, basically every place that could converted or tried to do something. Our restaurants have one box family meals for carryout. Even our libraries are going to be curbside as they reopen. I guess I assumed this stuff was so obvious that everyone was doing it, mercy. 

19 minutes ago, Ktgrok said:

Instead, we opened up gyms and bars and said "have at it". Sigh.

And here's the thing. It sounds like the cruise lines latched onto the opening of these states like FL and said ok, this is on track to work. But if the states bungle *their* openings, it destroys the confidence of the consumer to travel their and get on the cruise ship. 

20 minutes ago, Ktgrok said:

Also, I highly encourage you to think about not just "how to get home" but "how to handle being VERY sick while in a different state and having a child with special needs".

Yup, I hadn't gotten that far. I was just in the hopeful stages of this will be smoothed over and back on track. It's a lot of variables, and it's fine if travel insurance has your back. But the travel insurance companies are saying they're covering ZILCH for pandemics. 

I'm not worried about the halls on the ship. I've only done long cruises and you don't see a lot of that. I saw *1* drunk person on my last cruise (two weeks) and that was as she ran by and jumped in the pool. They fished her out and I think she lost a lot of privileges at that point, lol. Now VAPING, that you see. On my other cruise (one week) I saw one way drunk person in the hall. I mean, I wouldn't be letting my ds walk around loose if there were drunks everywhere, lol. Now down by the bars, no doubt. But I don't do that. You do the upper decks and it's like a library, pretty quiet. I did have to tell some neighbors to quiet their rowdy kids, but that's about it. I hang at the spa, drink mango virgin mango smoothies, watch movies. As long as they change the buffet, I'd probably be fine. My ds is more likely to get sick with his 20 cones a day, haha. Everyone touches that stupid machine. 

Mainly, I'm going to need to see EVIDENCE of how it's turning out. If things get delayed, people in 2020 could be the guinea pigs, which definitely won't work. And I think it could get worse with winter. On the plus side, it sounds like CA is being slower to open, which might translate into more controlled numbers like Ohio. My trip would be through CA btw, not FL. So all I can do at this point is just watch, see what's happening. I want to see good data of them working it out, getting people home safely.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, Ktgrok said:

we are getting better treatments as time goes on. 

I SO agree with you on this!

10 minutes ago, Ktgrok said:

the sooner someone brings it into his assisted living facility and he dies, alone with no visitors?

Yeah there are a lot of issues. If it becomes as ubiquitous as the flu, then people won't be dying alone. That will be your herd immunity point. But that seems a year or two out. 

I *think* I heard on the radio Ohio is going to allow visitors at assisted living, but I'm not sure whether they meant outdoors or indoors. I think indoors would be really insane/rushed. The outdoors is just starting to happen where my dad is, so we're going to work on that. But for him, the issue is he was used to being able to go out and can't do that except for laps around his building. It's going to get pretty fraught pretty soon anyway. Residents with no hair cuts, no/limited access to medical care outside their building, on and on. It's unsustainable.

Edited by PeterPan

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Why do you think that if people catch covid and recover, they’re immune?  Other coronaviruses provide immunity for between a couple to 18 months.  It seems like a high risk of death or serious illness for something that has no guarantee you can’t get it again.  I don’t think there’s any evidence that herd immunity can EVER be achieved.  So yeah, everyone may get it eventually.  Maybe over and over and over.  

  • Like 6
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
57 minutes ago, Terabith said:

no guarantee you can’t get it again.

Same with the flu. I think a lot is banking on treatments.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Terabith said:

Why do you think that if people catch covid and recover, they’re immune?  Other coronaviruses provide immunity for between a couple to 18 months.  It seems like a high risk of death or serious illness for something that has no guarantee you can’t get it again.  I don’t think there’s any evidence that herd immunity can EVER be achieved.  So yeah, everyone may get it eventually.  Maybe over and over and over.  

Right. And the death toll for herd immunity to occur is staggering. It is simply not the solution nor something to hope for.

  • Like 6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ds wanted to go to Hobby Lobby today and there were some things I wanted so I went with him. All of the employees and about 2/3 of the customers were wearing masks and most people seemed to be trying to change direction or move down an aisle to stay away from other people. However, there was a woman there with three preschool to early elementary age children. I understand it's hard to get children to wear masks, but the woman wasn't wearing one and they all were just wandering aimlessly around the store, with the children running into other people. None of them were making any effort at social distancing. I just posted yesterday that the children's hospital is warning parents that they are seeing increasing cases of severe illness in children. Those are the people I worry about. They're not protecting their children or other people in the community and seem to think extended browsing at the craft store is worth the risk. I just wish everyone would be willing to be cautious so we can stop this thing and get back to some semblance of a normal life.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 6/16/2020 at 10:33 AM, Ktgrok said:

 

 

Yeah, I think some counties had very low numbers..but then with things open it only takes a few people getting it, maybe visiting a neighboring county, to bring it back and spread it. 

Yeah, my county didn't have the lowest Central Florida numbers but it was among the lower ones. Then they opened the beaches for Memorial Day and people flocked to them. Then we launched astronauts into space and a zillion people came to watch. They crowded in with no masks. Two weeks-ish later we're seeing our numbers climb. 

  • Like 1
  • Sad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Lady Florida. said:

Yeah, my county didn't have the lowest Central Florida numbers but it was among the lower ones. Then they opened the beaches for Memorial Day and people flocked to them. Then we launched astronauts into space and a zillion people came to watch. They crowded in with no masks. Two weeks-ish later we're seeing our numbers climb. 

Yup. We REALLY wanted to go to the launch...we had finished our space unit study that week even, but no way were we going to get caught up in that. 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

FYI, I've seen several of these types of reports, but various different bars/pubs/restaurants, over the last two days. I expect we will see more. Oh, and in all the cases I heard about, it was the sick customers/employees that informed the business, not contract tracers. https://www.wesh.com/article/16-friends-test-positive-for-coronavirus-after-outing-at-florida-bar/32889357

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Ktgrok said:

FYI, I've seen several of these types of reports, but various different bars/pubs/restaurants, over the last two days. I expect we will see more. Oh, and in all the cases I heard about, it was the sick customers/employees that informed the business, not contract tracers. https://www.wesh.com/article/16-friends-test-positive-for-coronavirus-after-outing-at-florida-bar/32889357

Yeah, I’m worried about us in Indiana. We’ve been doing really well despite opening up beginning of May but bars and clubs had stayed closed until this past Friday. I was worried about gyms opening a few weeks ago and all has been well so hopefully opening bars won’t be an issue, but I’m concerned. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Ktgrok said:

Yup. We REALLY wanted to go to the launch...we had finished our space unit study that week even, but no way were we going to get caught up in that. 

I will confess we went because my Ds was desperate to go.  He is a huge Space X fan.  Cloud cover was such we were never going to see from our house and we really wanted him to have the possibility of seeing.  Crowds were a big concern for us. We went to New Smyrna and stood in a parking lot’s grassy area.....maybe 10 other people in a football field size spot.  Outside for 3 minutes!😂 It was only visible for like 2 seconds even 10 miles away. Contemplated the beach for all of two seconds because easy parking was availiable.......a crowd at high tide, no thanks.  I had masks but we didn’t bother because we were essentially by ourselves.

Question.......Anyone know if masks are still required for restaurant servers in FL?  Saw some without today which is new and upsetting.

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
43 minutes ago, mumto2 said:

I will confess we went because my Ds was desperate to go.  He is a huge Space X fan.  Cloud cover was such we were never going to see from our house and we really wanted him to have the possibility of seeing.  Crowds were a big concern for us. We went to New Smyrna and stood in a parking lot’s grassy area.....maybe 10 other people in a football field size spot.  Outside for 3 minutes!😂 It was only visible for like 2 seconds even 10 miles away. Contemplated the beach for all of two seconds because easy parking was availiable.......a crowd at high tide, no thanks.  I had masks but we didn’t bother because we were essentially by ourselves.

Question.......Anyone know if masks are still required for restaurant servers in FL?  Saw some without today which is new and upsetting.

 

I'm not sure they were ever required. Edit- just checked. Nope, they were NEVER required, even in Phase 1. Florida is so....Florida. Sigh. https://www.clickorlando.com/news/local/2020/05/12/heres-what-to-expect-when-florida-enters-phase-2-of-reopening/

And I think that was fine you went to the launch like that. I was mostly worried about needing a bathroom...my bladder isn't what it used to be and there was no way I'd be able to make it there and back in all the traffic without one, likely two, pit stops. And I figured all the bathrooms would be busy with others needing the same. 

Edited by Ktgrok
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
56 minutes ago, Ktgrok said:

I'm not sure they were ever required. Edit- just checked. Nope, they were NEVER required, even in Phase 1. Florida is so....Florida. Sigh. https://www.clickorlando.com/news/local/2020/05/12/heres-what-to-expect-when-florida-enters-phase-2-of-reopening/

And I think that was fine you went to the launch like that. I was mostly worried about needing a bathroom...my bladder isn't what it used to be and there was no way I'd be able to make it there and back in all the traffic without one, likely two, pit stops. And I figured all the bathrooms would be busy with others needing the same. 

Well, I am not eating out right now but have to admit even a curbside without a mask would give me pause.  We had been considering doing a curbside from the restaurant without masks and won’t be. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, mumto2 said:

Well, I am not eating out right now but have to admit even a curbside without a mask would give me pause.  We had been considering doing a curbside from the restaurant without masks and won’t be. 

Yeah, I definitely think that there is a disconnect with those in areas who are doing all the things, and those of us in areas where well, we are not, lol. 

And it shows. Florida just was named the most new cases in the US. We're number 1! Yay! Wait...no....sigh. 

https://fortune.com/2020/06/16/coronavirus-florida-cases-us-covid-19/?fbclid=IwAR0Encs1YerEJY5DTtEk871txc900GAk6-rIKBSUhLCIxiyiIYhQZFMZgKc

  • Sad 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I did finally find something that put me at peace about how to handle travel plans. Apparently the cruise lines will let you extend final payment till a month before. So instead of paying off at three months before and then having that money in limbo while you wait and wonder if they're going to cancel, you can just extend the final payment. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...