If you’re in Michigan

[Hyacinth]

Can you share how locals are perceiving the protest today? Is it seen as a fringe group making a little noise? Something bigger? Thanks!

[Carol in Cal.]

I'm not in Michigan but a friend of mine is participating in the protest, and honestly she is the last person I would ever expect to do so.  She is in her late 60s and is very quiet and law-abiding.  Never did anything like this before, but although she supports the shut down, she thinks that the local governor has gone way too far.  

That tells me that this has legs, big time.  That's not a demographic that normally does this kind of thing.

I won’t drive that far right now, but it did make the Detroit news this morning.  I want the governor severely restricted by the legislature.  Between her obvious desire to be the VP candidate (please take her!) she is stubborn and unwilling to back down on anything.  Her whole campaign was based on “fix the (cuss word) roads”, told the opponent he was crazy when he claimed she would go for a 20 cent gas tax hike, but made her first and only proposal for fixing the roads to be a 45 cent gas tax hike-so I guess he was crazy.  Even her own party wouldn’t support her, she wouldn’t negotiate anything unless the 45 cent hike was accepted and wouldn’t accept the proposed budget...she line item vetoed spending for autism programs and charter school funds instead.  Her state of the state announcement before this whole thing started was she was going to by executive action authorize borrowing the money instead of working with the legislature. With covid she explicitly stated when California had a lockdown that Michigan would never do that.   I don’t know how it is going to proceed or the attitude on this particular protest, but I think she may have overestimated her support with her latest “doubling down” on restrictions.  There was an opinion piece in the Detroit news yesterday about the huge FAQ on the state website because of the general confusion about what is and is not allowed.  Even the Oakland County Sheriff was on the news last night saying they were not going to enforce the closure of golf courses unless it was really egregious if the owners have said they don’t care.

Edited April 15, 2020 by Mom2mthj

14 minutes ago, Carol in Cal. said:

I'm not in Michigan but a friend of mine is participating in the protest, and honestly she is the last person I would ever expect to do so.  She is in her late 60s and is very quiet and law-abiding.  Never did anything like this before, but although she supports the shut down, she thinks that the local governor has gone way too far.  

That tells me that this has legs, big time.  That's not a demographic that normally does this kind of thing.

I could see my mom going if it weren’t for my father with dementia.  She would go do her own shopping if it weren’t for him as well.

I say it will take off in the next week to 10 days if she doesn’t give in on a few things or if she makes any chatter about extending it.

[Spy Car]

Irresponsible people will have blood on their hands when they cause needless deaths due to their extremism and selfish actions.

It is disgusting behavior. Shame on them.

Bill

Edited April 15, 2020 by Spy Car

3 minutes ago, Spy Car said:

Irresponsible people will have blood on their hands when they cause needless deaths due to their extremism and selfish actions.

It is disgusting behavior. Shame on them.

Bill

Maybe you should work on being less holier than thou.  Somehow I doubt you are perfect.  Shame on you for being so judgmental in what is clearly not a black and white situation.  

Edited April 15, 2020 by Mom2mthj

[Spy Car]

Just now, Mom2mthj said:

Maybe you should work on being less holier than thou.  Somehow I doubt you are perfect.

I'm not willfully putting lives in danger. That's for sure.

Bill

1 minute ago, Spy Car said:

I'm not willfully putting lives in danger. That's for sure.

Bill

Yes you are...people will die if they can’t work and can’t buy food.  It is not an all or nothing thing.

[Ottakee]

I think most of them are honest, law abiding people that are grassroots and seriously concerned about the over reaches of the governor.  People I know that are in strong support are not those you would think of as activists.

The thing that concerns me is that they are showing quite a few people (I have no news sources on TV so just going by FB clips) that were getting out of their cars, congregating, etc.  That was NOT the intention of the organizers.  They clearly said to stay IN your cars, maintain social distancing, etc.

Most of the people I know that strongly support this ARE maintaining social distancing, shopping only rarely and with only one family member, fine with closure of large venues and get togethees, etc.  

Hopefully I am wrong, but I do fear that those that didn't follow the organizer's guidelines to stay IN their cars might now be spreading/getting the virus.

[Spy Car]

Just now, Mom2mthj said:

Yes you are...people will die if they can’t work and can’t buy food.  It is not an all or nothing thing.

Political protests are examples of neither work nor part of supplying people food. Sorry.

Bill

[forty-two]

Just now, Spy Car said:

I'm not willfully putting lives in danger. That's for sure.

Bill

Fwiw, as I understand it, the protest was supposed to be a drive-in protest; aka, protesting while maintaining social distancing.  You could argue that what they want - an easing of the restrictions - would put lives in danger,  but the protest itself shouldn't be adding to the danger. 

[Terabith]

I don’t see anything wrong with protesting, but blocking roads to ambulances is pretty unconscionable.  

[Hadley]

I can see both sides of this issue.  I just don’t understand how in the world people can see this issue as black or white?  Isn’t it more complicated than that?  

I haven’t left the house in a month, but I am fortunately financially able to do so.  I don’t pretend that staying at home is as easy for others as it is for me.

And for GOODNESS SAKES, can the world just stop using the phrase “blood on their hands”.  I just quit listening to both sides when they start with this simplistic hyperbole.  

[Pawz4me]

I know nothing about the protests. I can say that one of my very good online friends (I've "known" her for 20 years) is firmly in support of the governor and her restrictions. She thinks the people who are pushing back against them are totally reckless nutters.

FWIW

[4everHis]

47 minutes ago, Carol in Cal. said:

I'm not in Michigan but a friend of mine is participating in the protest, and honestly she is the last person I would ever expect to do so.  She is in her late 60s and is very quiet and law-abiding.  Never did anything like this before, but although she supports the shut down, she thinks that the local governor has gone way too far.  

That tells me that this has legs, big time.  That's not a demographic that normally does this kind of thing.

I agree with this assessment. I am personally acquainted with 2 State Reps who agree that Gov. Whitmer has gone too far. I have watched news cast. They are mostly interviewing camera hogs. The ones(larger number) staying in their vehicles are staying true to the real protest. 

[Momto6inIN]

53 minutes ago, Hadley said:

And for GOODNESS SAKES, can the world just stop using the phrase “blood on their hands”.  I just quit listening to both sides when they start with this simplistic hyperbole.  

Amen, amen, and amen!

[Spy Car]

1 hour ago, Hadley said:

I can see both sides of this issue.  I just don’t understand how in the world people can see this issue as black or white?  Isn’t it more complicated than that?  

I haven’t left the house in a month, but I am fortunately financially able to do so.  I don’t pretend that staying at home is as easy for others as it is for me.

And for GOODNESS SAKES, can the world just stop using the phrase “blood on their hands”.  I just quit listening to both sides when they start with this simplistic hyperbole.  

 

It is hardly (no pun intended) hyperbole.

Maintaining proper precautions is literally a matter of life and death. Is that not manifestly clear by now?

Bill

 

 

 

 

[Corraleno]

Michigan is #3 in the country for total number of deaths, #3 for number of new deaths, #3 for number of new cases (despite an extremely low level of testing — they are 32nd for tests per capita), and #4 for deaths per capita. They are almost certainly not catching all the cases and will soon be #3 for deaths per capita as well. And people are demanding that stores be reopened and people go back to work? 

Edited April 15, 2020 by Corraleno

[rocassie]

I have friends on both sides.  One that attended and another that believes all the people protesting will kill everyone else in the state with their actions.  The one thing both my friends agree on is that they want Michiganders to be safe, healthy, and good citizens.  They just disagree in how that happens.

[Spy Car]

16 minutes ago, happysmileylady said:

Bill, do you not realize that every single time you have ever interacted with a person in your life, you could have potentially passed on some communicable disease to a high risk individual?

the risk is certainly increased now since this is a new disease, but it’s not like it was never “a matter of life and death” before this.  

 

I think this is an absurd argument. We are in an unprecedented global pandemic where people are dying in droves.

It isn't too much to ask people to behave responsibly.

Bill

[Spy Car]

1 minute ago, happysmileylady said:

You think it’s absurd to recognize the fact that people die of communicable diseases every year, simply because they didn’t die during a pandemic?

The analogy between a global pandemic and normal times is an absurd one to make. Clearly and beyond doubt.

Is this for real???

Bill

 

 

[Hadley]

37 minutes ago, Spy Car said:

I think this is an absurd argument. We are in an unprecedented global pandemic where people are dying in droves.

It isn't too much to ask people to behave responsibly.

Bill

As I said, I haven’t been past my own yard in a month.  I take this very seriously.  I seriously value my freedom.

I have raised a son who has an anaphylactic reaction to peanuts.  He has had an anaphylactic reaction from someone eating peanut butter crackers in their own car, and then getting out and touching my son on the shoulder.  I understand fear.  I also know that I have to let my son walk out of my front door every morning (at least in better times).  I don’t think it’s wrong that people are trying to find a the right balance of precaution with living.

I don’t want to argue further with you, I just hope that you might see the other side of this issue as well as your own.

[Spy Car]

2 minutes ago, happysmileylady said:

So how many yearly deaths do you think are normal enough to warrant our “normal” procedures?

 

I'd prefer to not extend this conversation. Thank you for your understanding.

Bill

[mathnerd]

We are living through a pandemic, not a simple flu outbreak. Circumstances are unique and like nothing I have experienced in my lifetime (and I was infected by H1N1 and got all the symptoms and suffering in all its glory). 

This is a particularly contagious disease, far more contagious than others we have experienced (like ebola) because it is respiratory in nature. Gov Cuomo said it best in one of his briefings: we are staying home not because we cannot deal with an infection, but because of those in society who will be unable to beat this infection if they get it (Don't spread it if you have it, don't get it if you don't have it).

Edited April 15, 2020 by mathnerd

[itsheresomewhere]

2 hours ago, Mom2mthj said:

I won’t drive that far right now, but it did make the Detroit news this morning.  I want the governor severely restricted by the legislature.  Between her obvious desire to be the VP candidate (please take her!) she is stubborn and unwilling to back down on anything.  Her whole campaign was based on “fix the (cuss word) roads”, told the opponent he was crazy when he claimed she would go for a 20 cent gas tax hike, but made her first and only proposal for fixing the roads to be a 45 cent gas tax hike-so I guess he was crazy.  Even her own party wouldn’t support her, she wouldn’t negotiate anything unless the 45 cent hike was accepted and wouldn’t accept the proposed budget...she line item vetoed spending for autism programs and charter school funds instead.  Her state of the state announcement before this whole thing started was she was going to by executive action authorize borrowing the money instead of working with the legislature. With covid she explicitly stated when California had a lockdown that Michigan would never do that.   I don’t know how it is going to proceed or the attitude on this particular protest, but I think she may have overestimated her support with her latest “doubling down” on restrictions.  There was an opinion piece in the Detroit news yesterday about the huge FAQ on the state website because of the general confusion about what is and is not allowed.  Even the Oakland County Sheriff was on the news last night saying they were not going to enforce the closure of golf courses unless it was really egregious if the owners have said they don’t care.

Her interview this morning on the today show showed how much she wants to be VP and how her actions were making a statement to it. 
 

I know one who is protesting there.  He is a very strict law abiding citizen so for him to protest says a lot. 

[Corraleno]

So do the folks who think Michigan should loosen restrictions also think NY & NJ should? Do they realize that Michigan is on the upside of the curve and this could get MUCH worse before it gets better? Do they want to be the next NY?

Michigan already has more total deaths, and is adding more new deaths per day, than the entire west coast:

MI:     1921 total deaths, 153 new deaths, 193 deaths per million

CA:     858 total deaths, 76 new deaths, 22 deaths per million
WA:    547 total deaths, 24 new deaths, 59 deaths per million
OR:       58 total deaths, 3 new deaths, 14 deaths per million

Edited April 15, 2020 by Corraleno

[EmseB]

2 hours ago, Corraleno said:

Michigan is #3 in the country for total number of deaths, #3 for number of new deaths, #3 for number of new cases (despite an extremely low level of testing — they are 32nd for tests per capita), and #4 for deaths per capita. They are almost certainly not catching all the cases and will soon be #3 for deaths per capita as well. And people are demanding that stores be reopened and people go back to work? 

They aren't demanding to go back to work unfettered, I don't think. I mean,, maybe some are, but not all that i know on my socials. They see the governor not letting people purchase things like seeds, but pot and lotto tickets are essential items. I think the decisions MI's governor is making seem arbitrary and unscientific and instead of explaining the reasoning or science behind what she's doing she is basically telling citizens to suck it up and deal. I think people respond much better to a leader who shows them a bit of respect.

Edited April 15, 2020 by EmseB

[Ausmumof3]

I have been thinking about this in general not specific to Michigan and wondering how protests should happen.  If this was done with everyone remaining in vehicles and not blocking roads somehow that would be ok.  And of course online petitions are easy.  I don’t know if there’s spaces where a huge number of cars can easily be at once.  Maybe a multi story car park where the gov works?  Sounds bizarre but I think of the longer term restrictions need to apply we need to figure out a way to allow people their right to protest without raising risk to the community.

[Ottakee]

38 minutes ago, EmseB said:

They aren't demanding to go back to work unfettered, I don't think. I mean,, maybe some are, but not all that i know on my socials. They see the governor not letting people purchase things like seeds, but pot and lotto tickets are essential items. I think the decisions MI's governor is making seem arbitrary and unscientific and instead of explaining the reasoning or science behind what she's doing she is basically telling citizens to suck it up and deal. I think people respond much better to a leader who shows them a bit of respect.

Yes....that is what I am seeing.  Most people agree with and support the social distancing and other protective measures.  They are not happy with the arbitrary rules....some of which make no sense....at least not across the entire state.

I have seen that our local Walmart is busier than ever due to limited options.  People are very polite and keeping distance though.

[Carol in Cal.]

4 hours ago, Spy Car said:

I'm not willfully putting lives in danger. That's for sure.

Bill

Dude, you have no nuance.  And you need some.
These people are demonstrating for less dictatorlike action, mostly not for a complete withdrawal of the shutdown.  

 

[Pawz4me]

I've been watching Michigan and Georgia because I'm in NC and population wise we're sandwiched between those two (Georgia #8, NC #9, MI #10). And goodness . . . Michigan's numbers are so horrible compared to ours. If I were there not only would I NOT be protesting, I'd be hunkered down and planning on staying that way for a long time. In many states I can very easily see both sides of the argument, 'cause I'm a person who tends to live in the gray areas. In Michigan -- no way. 

Edited April 15, 2020 by Pawz4me

[Terabith]

I'm also not sure it's right to treat Detroit the way you do the Upper Peninsula, because infection wise, they're very different.  

[EmseB]

5 minutes ago, Pawz4me said:

I've been watching Michigan and Georgia because I'm in NC and population wise we're sandwiched between those two (Georgia #8, NC #9, MI #10). And goodness . . . Michigan's numbers are so horrible compared to ours. If I were there not only would I NOT be protesting, I'd be hunkered down and planning on staying that way for a long time. The number of positive cases and deaths they've had with that incredibly low number of tests is beyond scary. In many states I can very easily see both sides of the argument, 'cause I'm a person who tends to live in the gray areas. In Michigan -- no way. 

Again, not about hunkering down or not. The reason there is grey is because Detroit is very different from the UP, etc., and if you're going to say people can buy lotto tickets but not do curbside pickup of garden items and then be unwilling to waver or explain the reasons for such restrictions, that is not about asking people to hunker down, it's about ensuring revenue to the state via a predatory scheme while not allowing people to grow food.

Edited April 15, 2020 by EmseB

[Corraleno]

I thought the prohibition on plant sales was only for big box stores (>50,000 sq'), to try to limit the numbers of people shopping there, and regular plant nurseries and garden centers were allowed to be open. Is that not true? 

[Spy Car]

51 minutes ago, Carol in Cal. said:

Dude, you have no nuance.  And you need some.
These people are demonstrating for less dictatorlike action, mostly not for a complete withdrawal of the shutdown.  

 

Nah.

And there are plenty of ways to makes grievances known in the internet age that are more effective and don't pull police and other first responders away from more import duties.

This is nutzo.

Bill

 

[Pen]

I wonder if they have tried other methods like letters, contact forms, emails phone calls, petitions?

 I wish they would listen to Trump, Birx etc asking for people to be patient longer so that opening up can be done in a careful way.  

 

[Pen]

15 minutes ago, Corraleno said:

I thought the prohibition on plant sales was only for big box stores (>50,000 sq'), to try to limit the numbers of people shopping there, and regular plant nurseries and garden centers were allowed to be open. Is that not true? 

 

I think that is true.    I googled one dedicated MI nursery (not part of big box store) and it is open. 

[Wheres Toto]

Looks like it's not just people peacefully protesting.

New: The Michigan Proud Boys, a local Neo Nazi group of Trump supporters, organized a blockade of the intersection at a green light outside Sparrow Hospital in Lansing.
A doctor rushed out of the hospital to plead with them to let the ambulances through, but the Trumpsters just waved their Confederate flags and laughed. This is how America dies

https://www.whmi.com/news/article/protestors-crowd-capitol-stay-at-home-order

ETA:  I'm in NJ.  You definitely don't want a repeat of what we have going on here.

Edited April 16, 2020 by Where's Toto?

[EmseB]

30 minutes ago, Corraleno said:

I thought the prohibition on plant sales was only for big box stores (>50,000 sq'), to try to limit the numbers of people shopping there, and regular plant nurseries and garden centers were allowed to be open. Is that not true? 

Except with stores like wal mart they are letting a certain number of people in and just taping off the seeds or whatever other items. People are there shopping and number of people in the store at one time is limited. It was just an example, there are many others. People can't drive to a second home within the state, but people from out of state are allowed to come to their vacations homes in Michigan. You can't buy a canoe but can buy a regular boat. The governor, at the very least, isn't explaining these things well on any interview I've seen.

[EmseB]

9 minutes ago, Where's Toto? said:

Looks like it's not just people peacefully protesting.

New: The Michigan Proud Boys, a local Neo Nazi group of Trump supporters, organized a blockade of the intersection at a green light outside Sparrow Hospital in Lansing.
A doctor rushed out of the hospital to plead with them to let the ambulances through, but the Trumpsters just waved their Confederate flags and laughed. This is how America dies

https://www.whmi.com/news/article/protestors-crowd-capitol-stay-at-home-order

ETA:  I'm in NJ.  You definitely don't want a repeat of what we have going on here.

You can't use bad actors to limit people's right to assemble in any case. You can arrest people who are doing this sort of thing but the vast majority were not.

ETA: That article is laughably biased anyway. It doesn't touch on any of the very legit concerns that many reasonable people have about the governors orders. Who still cites the SPLC as credible anymore anyway? 

ETAA: I'm in CA and disagree with Gavin Newsom on almost everything but I think he has handled our stay at home orders really well. Gov. Whitmer has not. It's possible to be for hunkering down and SIP and be against what certain govs are doing. 

Edited April 16, 2020 by EmseB

[melmichigan]

The limitations on gardening supplies, paint, flooring and such are limited in stores over 50,000 sq ft.  You can get them in smaller stores that follow the 25% of fire code in store including employees.  You can do curbside pickup in the big box stores.  Locally people are upset about boating.  I laughed, people complaining about boating when it’s 33 degrees and snowing today.  Same with the greenhouses, here they don’t open until May 1st, but because they’d be included if they’d been open people are upset about it.  People are upset about lawn services being closed, again snow today.  SMH.  I watched the polls today that the local news stations were doing, 60+% of people agreed with the restrictions.  Representatives are split down party lines, which is really sad, this isn’t a political issue.  If the governor had differentiated between say Detroit, and all surrounding counties, people would be protesting the discrimination. The governor is in a tight spot, not enough people were taking the original order seriously.  People aren’t reading the actual order, of the FAQ’s and clarifications, they’re just following the news stations.

Edited April 16, 2020 by melmichigan

[EmseB]

I have read the faqs and watched Whitmer's interviews. She is handling this poorly. You have to have buy in for this to work and it isn't a partisan issue.

[gardenmom5]

6 hours ago, Carol in Cal. said:

I'm not in Michigan but a friend of mine is participating in the protest, and honestly she is the last person I would ever expect to do so.  She is in her late 60s and is very quiet and law-abiding.  Never did anything like this before, but although she supports the shut down, she thinks that the local governor has gone way too far.  

That tells me that this has legs, big time.  That's not a demographic that normally does this kind of thing.

isn't Michigan the state where you can't even buy garden seeds?

[Corraleno]

5 minutes ago, gardenmom5 said:

isn't Michigan the state where you can't even buy garden seeds?

You cant buy them at big box stores like Walmart. Apparently you can buy them at nurseries and garden centers under 50,000 sq'

[Acorn]

4 minutes ago, gardenmom5 said:

isn't Michigan the state where you can't even buy garden seeds?

You can buy seeds. I’m so frustrated with how the media and protesters aren’t researching the truth. My family has done curb side pickup from Tractor Supply, which is a legit agricultural store. Michigan big box grocery stores have been asked to limit the people inside so that the shoppers there can get actual groceries. Too many of the shoppers at Meijer and Walmart wanted to be in the store and buy home improvement, garden and apparel. They can wait, or do pick up from an agriculture store or buy through the mail.

[TABmom]

I'm in Michigan. It's ridiculous how people seem to be trying to misinterpret the orders. The smaller nurseries, hardware stores, etc are open. You just can't buy everything at a big box store. She's trying to keep the big box stores from being crazy crowded. Maybe she hasn't gone about it in the best way, but she is trying to save people's lives. But people in Facebook are all "I can't have a garden now!" Or " who cares what the order says? She can't tell me what to do! "Honestly, these people sound like toddlers throwing a tantrum about what they can't have. And I'm NOT talking about people needing to get back to work. People here are throwing fits because boat launches are closed and she told people with multiple residences to pick one and stay there. Or that stores with more than 50,000 square feet needed to block off some of the nonessential items. 

I've gone out for groceries and stuff twice and Meijer (a big box store like wal-mart) has been very crowded. There was a line at Home Depot outside for curbside delivery - people are NOT hurting for gardening supplies.

[4everHis]

Nm

Edited April 16, 2020 by 4everHis

[melmichigan]

 

24 minutes ago, EmseB said:

I have read the faqs and watched Whitmer's interviews. She is handling this poorly. You have to have buy in for this to work and it isn't a partisan issue.

Do you live here?  You are sharing incorrect information. I can go online and order all the garden stuff I want from Lowe’s and do a pickup.  I cannot walk into the store and wander around the garden center and pick out what I want.  I can go to Feed and Seed and get whatever I want provided I follow the customer limitations for the numbers in the store at a given time.  I can buy a canoe at Sam’s Club right now.  One can do all these things, but we’re being asked to stick to essentials.  Hospitals up north don’t have capacity.  If I were to go to Canada Creek, it’s almost two hours to the nearest hospital to treat COVID unless one is airlifted. (I used to work at the regional hospital when I lived up north.)

Edited April 16, 2020 by melmichigan

[Momto6inIN]

This is a legit question - isn't getting everything you need at 1 store better than multiple stops all over town?

[gardenmom5]

6 hours ago, Mom2mthj said:

I won’t drive that far right now, but it did make the Detroit news this morning.  I want the governor severely restricted by the legislature.  Between her obvious desire to be the VP candidate (please take her!) she is stubborn and unwilling to back down on anything.  Her whole campaign was based on “fix the (cuss word) roads”, told the opponent he was crazy when he claimed she would go for a 20 cent gas tax hike, but made her first and only proposal for fixing the roads to be a 45 cent gas tax hike-so I guess he was crazy.  Even her own party wouldn’t support her, she wouldn’t negotiate anything unless the 45 cent hike was accepted and wouldn’t accept the proposed budget...she line item vetoed spending for autism programs and charter school funds instead.  Her state of the state announcement before this whole thing started was she was going to by executive action authorize borrowing the money instead of working with the legislature. With covid she explicitly stated when California had a lockdown that Michigan would never do that.   I don’t know how it is going to proceed or the attitude on this particular protest, but I think she may have overestimated her support with her latest “doubling down” on restrictions.  There was an opinion piece in the Detroit news yesterday about the huge FAQ on the state website because of the general confusion about what is and is not allowed.  Even the Oakland County Sheriff was on the news last night saying they were not going to enforce the closure of golf courses unless it was really egregious if the owners have said they don’t care.

Yep - the opponent was crazy for thinking she ONLY wanted a $0.20 gas tax . . . . sheesh.

 

1 hour ago, Terabith said:

I'm also not sure it's right to treat Detroit the way you do the Upper Peninsula, because infection wise, they're very different.  

I don't know if there are more vacation type homes in the UP - but I know here small towns have been struggling to prevent people from populated areas running off to their vacation homes on the beach or in the mts - where its rural and they don't have adequate resources.  like groceries (becaue the city folk sure don't bring enough food with them, and rural grocery stores don't get deliveries as often as the city). - let alone medical if someone who fled the city gets sick and needs a hospital.

 

42 minutes ago, EmseB said:

You can't use bad actors to limit people's right to assemble in any case. You can arrest people who are doing this sort of thing but the vast majority were not.

ETA: That article is laughably biased anyway. It doesn't touch on any of the very legit concerns that many reasonable people have about the governors orders. Who still cites the SPLC as credible anymore anyway? 

ETAA: I'm in CA and disagree with Gavin Newsom on almost everything but I think he has handled our stay at home orders really well. Gov. Whitmer has not. It's possible to be for hunkering down and SIP and be against what certain govs are doing. 

I'm in WA  - generally seriously dislike Inslee, but have generally supported how he's handled the shut down here. Shut down was early and long. (his original order was for six weeks, when every other state was maybe two weeks. - it's been extended.)    the news stations have generally been good about giving balanced information with out sensationalizing things (which they have been known to do too.)

I'm also seeing signs of impatience though. Parking lots in parks are being cordoned off because people aren't distancing the way they should.

5 minutes ago, Acorn said:

You can buy seeds. I’m so frustrated with how the media and protesters aren’t researching the truth. My family has done curb side pickup from Tractor Supply, which is a legit agricultural store. Michigan big box grocery stores have been asked to limit the people inside so that the shoppers there can get actual groceries. Too many of the shoppers at Meijer and Walmart wanted to be in the store and buy home improvement, garden and apparel. They can wait, or do pick up from an agriculture store or buy through the mail.

how much of your area is agricultural that there would be tractor/agricultural supplies? 

I became aware of the seed thing because a MI person posted to a common friend's FB page about personally not being able to buy any of these supplies (seeds, paint) so they can work in their yard or on the their house.

I can go to a big box store.  there are limits for how many people are allowed inside.  grocery stores have passed out gloves - both wipe down cart handles.  (I have my own mask and gloves - not sure how much good their quick wipe does on the handle.)