Unclear re COVID--If a person has mild symptoms, do we stay home or go get tested?

[Harriet Vane]

I feel like this should be obvious, but it's not. Everything online talks about prevention (wash your hands, cough etiquette, etc.) and about treatment for severe viral pneumonia. Everything online indicates that there will be more numbers of sick people soon.

What if a person has mild viral symptoms? Stay home? Seek testing? Tell everyone you know so they can panic?😋

I assume everyone who gets sick is supposed to try to manage at home unless in acute distress...right? 

What if one spouse gets sick and the other one is fine?

[PeterPan]

First thing I would do is call my doctor. Unless you're having respiratory distress or in a vulnerable population, I doubt they want you in their office. And from what I'm seeing, it's tricky to treat even if pneumonia develops, because it can be viral, not bacterial. The videos I'm watching of people with it are saying the hospital literally just fed them, bathed them, and would have done breathing interventions, that they weren't really given any meds or treatments.

[Fawnmoscato]

I don't know either. We are all sick and I'm kind of just staying home. I needed to run to the store, so I went at 7 am when there wouldn't be any ppl in the store. But like, how do I really know? One of my kid spikes a fever every time he gets sick. I never spike a fever, no matter what I have. So I'm just waiting it out and keeping to ourselves. 

[Lang Syne Boardie]

Dr. Dena Grayson -- look her up on Twitter and watch her video. 

She says that it's not the label of Covid19 that makes you more in need of care; it's 100% about the symptoms. So if you have a condition that, if you had never even heard of coronavirus, you would have totally managed at home (because it's a cold/flu type thing), then DO that.  If you are fairly low risk (under age 40 with no underlying conditions), that may be all you'll suffer with Covid19. Fever, cough, cold symptoms, manageable at home, nothing more to do beyond NOT spreading it. 

If you start to have trouble breathing, or cross any other threshold where it's no longer like a nasty cold or flu that you'd handle at home, then call your doctor. If your doctor has no advice, call the hospital. If they hospital has no advice, or if someone obviously cannot breathe, go to the ER immediately.

*IF testing becomes widely available, the time may come when they want everyone (with symptoms) tested so they can track and quarantine. Again, follow Dr. Grayson, watch the news for updates from Dr. Fauci, so you'll hear about those changed recommendations.

Dr. Grayson is not on the coronavirus task force. She was on the Ebola team and this is her field, so she is graciously helping with information.

Edited March 4, 2020 by Lang Syne Boardie

[Terabith]

I think what you do is stay home (unlike with most colds, where you go out and about) and don't go in unless symptoms are more severe.  

[Lang Syne Boardie]

Update: I just looked at Dr. Grayson's twitter. The CDC has now expanded testing recommendations to anyone who has symptoms - fever, cough, difficulty breathing - instead of continuing to restrict to those who have been exposed to travel/travelers to/from affected areas.

This does not change the fact that there are not test kits available everywhere, but to me, this might mean to call your doctor or hospital to find out if they are able to test you, if you can't tell how severe your "difficulty breathing" is or isn't.

 

[Pen]

38 minutes ago, Harriet Vane said:

I feel like this should be obvious, but it's not. Everything online talks about prevention (wash your hands, cough etiquette, etc.) and about treatment for severe viral pneumonia. Everything online indicates that there will be more numbers of sick people soon.

What if a person has mild viral symptoms? Stay home? Seek testing? Tell everyone you know so they can panic?😋

 

Part of relevant material from cdc — some place like counties where there have been cases (King, Santa Clara, etc ) have published other information.  The hospitals in my county want to be called and will give instructions.  Some places have 211 lines active for more information. 

“Call ahead before visiting your doctor

If you have a medical appointment, call the healthcare provider and tell them that you have or may have COVID-19. This will help the healthcare provider’s office take steps to keep other people from getting infected or exposed.

Wear a facemask

You should wear a facemask when you are around other people (e.g., sharing a room or vehicle) or pets and before you enter a healthcare provider’s office. If you are not able to wear a facemask (for example, because it causes trouble breathing), then people who live with you should not stay in the same room with you, or they should wear a facemask if they enter your room.

Cover your coughs and sneezes

Cover your mouth and nose with a tissue when you cough or sneeze. Throw used tissues in a lined trash can; immediately wash your hands with soap and water for at least 20 seconds or clean your hands with an alcohol-based hand sanitizer that contains 60 to 95% alcohol, covering all surfaces of your hands and rubbing them together until they feel dry. Soap and water should be used preferentially if hands are visibly dirty.

Clean your hands often

Wash your hands often with soap and water for at least 20 seconds or clean your hands with an alcohol-based hand sanitizer that contains 60 to 95% alcohol, covering all surfaces of your hands and rubbing them together until they feel dry. Soap and water should be used preferentially if hands are visibly dirty. Avoid touching your eyes, nose, and mouth with unwashed hands.”

38 minutes ago, Harriet Vane said:

 

I assume everyone who gets sick is supposed to try to manage at home unless in acute distress...right? 

What if one spouse gets sick and the other one is fine?

 

If possible separate the sick spouse to a separate room, ideally one with its own bathroom, to avoid infection spreading in family . Self quarantine whole family. Is my understanding.   

Call outsiders to deliver necessary items to door and leave it . Wait for them to be gone prior to opening door. 

[Pen]

Another example of instructions for handling suspected Covid-19 in the home: 

•  
•  
• Make sure that you understand and can help the patient follow their healthcare provider’s instructions for medication(s) and care. Help the patient with basic needs in the home and provide support for getting groceries, prescriptions, and other personal needs.
• Monitor the patient’s symptoms. If the patient is getting sicker, call his or her healthcare provider before you travel to the healthcare provider’s office. This will help staff take steps to keep other people in the office or waiting room from getting infected.
• When possible, household members should try to stay in another room or be separated from the patient as much as possible.
• If people do not have an essential need to be in the home, they should not visit while a person is ill.
• Make sure that shared spaces in the home have good air flow, such as by an air conditioner or an opened window, weather permitting.
• Wash your hands frequently with soap and water and scrub your hands for at least 20 seconds.
• If soap and water are not readily available, use an alcohol-based hand sanitizer that contains at least 60% alcohol. Cover all surfaces of your hands and rub them together until they feel dry. If hands are visibly dirty, using soap and water is preferable.
• Avoid touching your eyes, nose, and mouth with unwashed hands.
• Avoid sharing household items with the patient. Don’t share dishes, drinking glasses, cups, eating utensils, towels, bedding, or other items. After the patient uses these items, you should wash them thoroughly.
• Each day use a household cleaning spray or wipe, according to the label instructions to clean all high-touch surfaces, such as counters, tabletops, doorknobs, bathroom fixtures, toilets, phones, keyboards, tablets, and bedside tables. Also, clean any surfaces that may have blood, stool, or body fluids.
• Wash laundry thoroughly.
  • Wear disposable gloves while handling soiled items and keep soiled items away from your body. Clean your hands (with soap and water or an alcohol-based hand sanitizer) immediately after removing your gloves.
  • Immediately remove and wash clothes or bedding that have blood, stool, or body fluids.
  • Read and follow directions on labels of laundry or clothing items and detergent. In general, use a normal laundry detergent according to washing machine instructions and dry thoroughly using the warmest temperatures recommended on the clothing label.
• Place all used disposable gloves and other contaminated items in a lined container before disposing of them with other trash. Clean your hands (with soap and water or an alcohol-based hand sanitizer) immediately after handling these items.

For the most complete guidance on preventing the spread of coronavirus please visit the CDC’s website at https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/hcp/guidance-prevent-spread.html#f1

[Jean in Newcastle]

You can be tested IF you have a doctor’s approval for the test. I assume that is so that they can decide if your symptoms are a match. 

[Lang Syne Boardie]

I hope nobody will call this post "political" because I am sharing the information that we still have no confirmation that there will be any opportunity for the uninsured to be tested. If I were currently uninsured, and a homeschool parent in a single-income household, I would want to see this. And nearly 40 million Americans do not have insurance. So whatever anyone's politics, I don't care, and neither does Covid19. I do care what we are being told about testing. 

Also, this cannot be "partisan" or "political" to share, because the Trump  Administration has advised us to consider Vice President Pence to be in charge of the Covid19 response, and Vice President Pence has instructed us to understand that he will be controlling information, with the assistance of Katie Miller, who is the young woman addressing this reporter. So clips such as this, from conferences such as this, are our primary source.

 

Edited March 5, 2020 by Lang Syne Boardie

[Matryoshka]

1 hour ago, Lang Syne Boardie said:

Update: I just looked at Dr. Grayson's twitter. The CDC has now expanded testing recommendations to anyone who has symptoms - fever, cough, difficulty breathing - instead of continuing to restrict to those who have been exposed to travel/travelers to/from affected areas.

This does not change the fact that there are not test kits available everywhere, but to me, this might mean to call your doctor or hospital to find out if they are able to test you, if you can't tell how severe your "difficulty breathing" is or isn't.

One of my kids has just been diagnosed with pneumonia, after days with difficulty breathing even with inhaler.  Given antibiotics,  multiple steroids, and a nebulizer, and told to go about their business.  Even with pneumonia, they absolutely refuse to even consider testing, in spite of all the 'anyone can get tested' BS - in part because *no one* has any tests. That is what they told me. They don't have tests.  

I get that they wouldn't want to test people with just cold/fever/cough, but when it's progressed to pneumonia,  I would think they'd start to care.  Nope.  So much for figuring out if this is spreading locally. 

Our state, and the closely neighboring ones, all have cases, but supposedly all travel traced/ no local transmission.  But how do you know if *no one* is being tested????  Meanwhile, some nearby guy who does have it (returned from Italy, so tested and positive) was supposed to be self quarantining, but I guess felt better and was bored so went out for a night at the pub with colleagues.  He works at a hospital.  SMH.

Edited March 5, 2020 by Matryoshka

[Matryoshka]

25 minutes ago, Jean in Newcastle said:

You can be tested IF you have a doctor’s approval for the test. I assume that is so that they can decide if your symptoms are a match. 

Nope. See my post. It's posturing. Maybe once they make and distribute functional tests in meaningful numbers, which will be.... when? A week? More?

Meanwhile, South Korea has drive-through testing.

[gardenmom5]

stay home - call the health dept/ER/Dr's office and ask them about testing.   if you think you have it, do not needlessly expose other people.

[bibiche]

21 minutes ago, Matryoshka said:

Nope. See my post. It's posturing. Maybe once they make and distribute functional tests in meaningful numbers, which will be.... when? A week? More?

Meanwhile, South Korea has drive-through testing.

I’m so sorry, and I sincerely hope your child recovers soon. Maybe this virus, which affects people indiscriminately, will be the thing that finally makes Americans realize that their healthcare and their government are backwards and barbaric.

[Pen]

3 hours ago, Matryoshka said:

One of my kids has just been diagnosed with pneumonia, after days with difficulty breathing even with inhaler.  Given antibiotics,  multiple steroids, and a nebulizer, and told to go about their business.  Even with pneumonia, they absolutely refuse to even consider testing, in spite of all the 'anyone can get tested' BS - in part because *no one* has any tests. That is what they told me. They don't have tests.  

I get that they wouldn't want to test people with just cold/fever/cough, but when it's progressed to pneumonia,  I would think they'd start to care.  Nope.  So much for figuring out if this is spreading locally. 

Our state, and the closely neighboring ones, all have cases, but supposedly all travel traced/ no local transmission.  But how do you know if *no one* is being tested????  Meanwhile, some nearby guy who does have it (returned from Italy, so tested and positive) was supposed to be self quarantining, but I guess felt better and was bored so went out for a night at the pub with colleagues.  He works at a hospital.  SMH.

 

Are you in the USA? (I know you wrote our state, but other countries such as Australia and Brazil also have have states.)

What I am about to write only applies to USA.

Places that don’t have their own tests (and this is most of USA) are supposed to send samples to the CDC in Atlanta, Georgia for testing.

Your child sounds suspicious for Covid-19.  Other possibly than argument that children aren’t getting it seriously, but as you say, if they don’t test, they can’t know. 

They are no doubt correctly telling you they don’t have tests. But they are wrong that that means testing cannot be done. They should be sending samples to CDC.

Since they have refused, IMO you should be going over “their” heads, and getting names, taking notes, and if legal where you are to do so and possible for you, recording calls.

Where are you located if you don’t mind saying?

Who is the “they” you spoke with? 

Have you tried contacting your county and state health departments? Have you tried CDC itself.  Have you tried starting with something like asking for each person’s name and stating that you are concerned because your son is showing Covid-19 symptoms .

if no action, next step imo would be newspaper or equivalent.

Because even if your son doesn’t have it he sure sounds like the very typical manifestations and they Should be testing.

Go mama bear on them.

Make a stink if need be. 

 

[Farrar]

I was going to say the same thing Matroyshka said. Only a few places have the tests so it's mostly a moot question.

Also, unless you want the bill or have amazing insurance, I'd wait until the symptoms justify going to the doctor regardless. Especially at this point when it's not that widespread yet. Obviously go if anyone is having trouble breathing. But then it doesn't matter if it's Covid-19 or not, just go get medical help.

[Ali in OR]

On the radio today, a government health authority was explaining that we still cannot test just anyone. There is only one state lab here that runs the test and they have to follow the CDC guidelines. It sounded like you have to have severe symptoms before they'll test (unless you've been traveling abroad or had contact with someone who tested positive). Severe symptoms like you need to be admitted to the hospital.

[Pen]

4 hours ago, Matryoshka said:

One of my kids has just been diagnosed with pneumonia, after days with difficulty breathing even with inhaler.  Given antibiotics,  multiple steroids, and a nebulizer, and told to go about their business.  Even with pneumonia, they absolutely refuse to even consider testing, in spite of all the 'anyone can get tested' BS - in part because *no one* has any tests. That is what they told me. They don't have tests.  

I get that they wouldn't want to test people with just cold/fever/cough, but when it's progressed to pneumonia,  I would think they'd start to care.  Nope.  So much for figuring out if this is spreading locally. 

Our state, and the closely neighboring ones, all have cases, but supposedly all travel traced/ no local transmission.  But how do you know if *no one* is being tested????  Meanwhile, some nearby guy who does have it (returned from Italy, so tested and positive) was supposed to be self quarantining, but I guess felt better and was bored so went out for a night at the pub with colleagues.  He works at a hospital.  SMH.

 

I think if you know personally that things are happening like nightclub guy, you need to report them. Call 211, 311, even 911 if necessary.

push hard to get your son tested

[Pen]

2 minutes ago, Ali in OR said:

On the radio today, a government health authority was explaining that we still cannot test just anyone. There is only one state lab here that runs the test and they have to follow the CDC guidelines. It sounded like you have to have severe symptoms before they'll test (unless you've been traveling abroad or had contact with someone who tested positive). Severe symptoms like you need to be admitted to the hospital.

 

I think it is true that they cannot test just anyone (all sorts of people with sniffles or nothing at all would be clamoring for tests. But @Matryoshka son sounds very suspicious and an unexplained pneumonia isn’t “just anyone”.   

It may or may not be Covid-19, but it sounds like a something not a nothing.  

[Matryoshka]

9 hours ago, Pen said:

I think if you know personally that things are happening like nightclub guy, you need to report them. Call 211, 311, even 911 if necessary.

push hard to get your son tested

I found out about nightclub guy on the local news...

ETA: The NYT has an article on him, even: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/04/us/coronavirus-new-hampshire-dartmouth.html

Edited March 5, 2020 by Matryoshka

[Matryoshka]

7 hours ago, Ali in OR said:

On the radio today, a government health authority was explaining that we still cannot test just anyone. There is only one state lab here that runs the test and they have to follow the CDC guidelines. It sounded like you have to have severe symptoms before they'll test (unless you've been traveling abroad or had contact with someone who tested positive). Severe symptoms like you need to be admitted to the hospital.

Yes. They still won't test unless you've just come back from a hot spot or *maybe* if you're so bad you're hospitalized (like in CA there was that guy who transferred hospitals and exposed people both places before they tested him, and there's at least one person who died before they tested them post-mortem).  Pence is just bald-faced lying. 

Of course this could have been avoided if we'd just used the tests that every.freaking.body.else on the whole planet is using. But no.

@Pen , of course I'm in the US - everywhere else is using the WHO tests which are widely available. It's only here they're rationed because we decided to make our own tests, and then they didn't work, so back to the drawing board. The CDC actually took the # tested off it's website the other day, because it was making it so obvious how inadequate it was. There was an outcry - don't know if it's back up.

Edited March 5, 2020 by Matryoshka

[Katy]

Here the tests are so few and far between that they won't test you unless you need to be hospitalized and are negative for the flu.  I would imagine as more tests get released it might change, but for now, stay home.

[catz]

I think many doctors are frustrated too.  They don't have access to easy testing and the CDC has called the shots.  There are likely many many more cases out there that have not been tested. Testing will be expanding soon it sounds like.  I am also concerned about the uninsured and those who can't easily quarantine or take sick leave. 

That said, I wouldn't get too wound up about death rates in the US.  I saw people spiraling about a 7% death rate in Seattle.  I don't think we have enough data and while it is spreading there are substantially more cases out there that are not diagnosed.     It's just extremely unfortunate that a nursing home outbreak rose to the surface first.  I really don't feel like this is being handled well so far.  We will see.  

[Matryoshka]

55 minutes ago, FuzzyCatz said:

That said, I wouldn't get too wound up about death rates in the US.  I saw people spiraling about a 7% death rate in Seattle.  I don't think we have enough data and while it is spreading there are substantially more cases out there that are not diagnosed.     It's just extremely unfortunate that a nursing home outbreak rose to the surface first.  I really don't feel like this is being handled well so far.  We will see.  

Since virtually all the cases in Seattle are from a nursing home, that worries me much less than it would otherwise.  I mean, to even be in a nursing home (as a patient), you have to be not just old but also have some kind of health-compromising condition.  No one checks themselves in to a nursing home if they're not already significantly sick in some way - this is not just assisted living, even. These are people who need nursing care already before any viruses hit.  So, in this most-vulnerable population, only 7% seems actually kind of like good news.

Honestly, the 3.4% death rate I've heard of from Italy is much, much scarier.

[athena1277]

I don’t think anyone mentioned this yet.  I heard a recommendation somewhere that if your symptoms aren’t ER worthy to use a virtual doctor if it’s available to you.  They can help you determine if you need to be seen in a physical doctor’s office or continue treating at home.  This keeps you from spreading whatever you have coronavirus or not.