Another update on my divorce (yes, it's still ongoing)

[Home'scool]

I hesitate to post sometimes, especially on this topic, because it seems to always be a post with me bitching. But then I think, maybe someone else is dealing with a narcissist or just a really bad spouse and this may help in some way. But my apologies if you are sick and tired of my drama. I don't blame you .... I am sick and tired of it too! 🤣

So we had to go back to court for contempt because, even though we have a final court order of divorce, my ex still won't do anything the court has ordered. He was supposed to transfer the title of the car to me, start to process to transfer half his 401K, and give me back the grandfather clock he has in storage.

We sit with the mediator and he says we will start with the easiest thing .... the grandfather clock. My ex then says "She can pick it up any weekday she wants, but not the weekends." Um, I work full time, live an hour away from where the storage facility is, and would have to take a vacation day to get it and I only get two weeks vacation time. I remind my ex that there are 52 (!)  weekends in a year .... isn't there just one Saturday or Sunday that he can free up an hour to meet me and stand there while I load the clock? Nope. He isn't budging. The mediator tells him he is being difficult, and my ex actually says "I am offering 5 days out of 7 that she can get the clock and I'm the jerk?" Yes, yes you are. His big declaration during the divorce is that he is not taking shit from anyone and not having anyone dictate his time. So I guess this falls under me dictating his time (eye roll).

The mediator finally tells him that if he does not pick a weekend date the judge will pick it for him. So, after 20 useless minutes we got that decided and I will pick up the clock on a Sunday.

Then we start arguing about the credit card debt. The court order stated I had to pay off all the credit cards in my name, which I did. But my ex decided he paid the minimums on my credit cards for two months while I was working on paying them off, and he wanted to be reimbursed for those payments. Nope, he can't do that because that was not mentioned in the divorce decree. So then he says he wants to be reimbursed for the interest on those payments. It worked out the be about $500. I finally just agreed because by now we had been at this for two hours and we weren't even half way through stuff yet. But I said to him "Really?? You want $500 from me when I have the exact same amount of debt I have to pay off as you, only you make 5x as much as me! You make over $400,000 a year and you are dogging me for $500??" His answer? "Good job playing the victim."

And on and on it went. Finally we managed to agree on everything. I had to give him a check then and there for a relatively large amount of money. We left the courthouse at 2:00 pm and somehow he managed to scurry his way to a bank and cash my check immediately. He plays this game where he assumes everyone is lying and manipulating and he is just so smart he won't be caught unawares. But in reality, he is the only one playing dirty. Everyone else just wants to move on. And with all the little details finally hammered out this should be the end of it.

In the past I always said that I could handle seeing him and dealing with him, but after yesterday's experience I never want to see him again. And not in a petulant way, I just can't do it. I feel like a hollowed out pumpkin. By the time we went before the judge to say we had agreed on everything I was a wrung out mess from crying and being stuck in a conference room for 4 hours with Satan. I won't ever put myself through that again. 

[Selkie]

Are you taking someone with you when you pick up the clock? I don't think you should be alone with that creep.

[Soror]

I appreciate the updates, although I'm always sorry to hear about the new crappy things he has done. I so wish the judge would put his butt in jail or something to make him realize that complying is the easier option and just get this over with so you can move on. I think he likes you staying tied up with him.

[Home'scool]

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Are you taking someone with you when you pick up the clock? I don't think you should be alone with that creep.

I will definitely NOT be going. I am going to try and find a moving company that will just deal with him, or make some other type of arrangements. But, no, I will not be there.

[OH_Homeschooler]

I also appreciate the updates. I've been doing a lot of my own research on narcissists lately. It never fails to amaze me all the ways they can be a**holes. Your ex sure is good at projecting, huh? 

A very good friend of mine is starting her divorce with a likely narcissist. It's just awful what people have to go through when divorcing a narcissist. I wish the courts would just put a limit on how much they can get away with. 

I believe my ex is a narcissist as well, but I didn't have to deal with all the petty b.s. due to circumstances (he didn't have a leg to stand on). I feel like you do, I just do not want to ever see him again. I hope you get your wish and you are done with him.

[maize]

We're happy to be your sanity refuge--that's necessary sometimes when dealing with people who insist the world is the way they imagine it to be and everyone else is the problem.

I hope you really are done this time.

[fairfarmhand]

Was he always this much of a jerk? I mean, I don’t see how you could live with him for so long.

[Scarlett]

There is a woman on the marriage board I am on whose XH is very much like this.  The worst part is how the courts allow this crap to go on and on.

[PrincessMommy]

I'm glad we're here for you.  Come complain as much as you want or need.  Hugs.

 

[happi duck]

Just my two cents:  If the clock matters to you I'd consider being there.  He seems like the kind of person who'd take out a piece so it wouldn't work and then blame the movers.  I have zero experience with clocks so maybe there's nothing that can be tampered with or maybe it's all replaceable.  

(hugs)

 

[Home'scool]

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Was he always this much of a jerk? I mean, I don’t see how you could live with him for so long.

Believe me, this has been a topic of conversation in my house! I met my ex when I was 18 and he was 20 in college. He always had an arrogance about him, but he was a "good guy". He was loved by my family and, when our daughters were young and before they developed their own opinions, was very hands on with the children. He was never very generous with gifts but he was smart and grounded and made me feel safe. But he always had a touch of feeling nothing was good enough and always was the type to push himself hard. I think a girl with more confidence and a stronger background would never have put up with some of the stuff that happened when we were dating, but I was insecure and in love. 

Basically, he was an arrogant guy who could be a real a**hole but he had more good points than bad and proved himself enough of a stand-up guy that we all loved him.

Then ... somewhere along the way he got lost. We moved to an affluent town and he started moving up the corporate ladder. All of a sudden he was very concerned with what type of car we drove, how we dressed, who we hung out with. My youngest daughter was very good at softball but hated soccer, yet my ex made her cry numerous times because he kept pushing her to play soccer. Why? Because, according to my ex, families who are involved with soccer are in a higher social status that people who are involved in softball. This from a guy who used lived in jeans and flannel shirts and drove a beat up pick-up truck and didn't care what anyone thought.

All of a sudden we weren't good enough. I wasn't doing enough. Our weekends were to be filled with ADVENTURE!! No longer were bike rides along the local bike path good enough, we should all be training for a 100 mile bike race. Driving an hour to go skiing wasn't good enough, we should be renting a condo in Colorado for a month (never mind that we couldn't afford that!) I was planning a trip to NYC with my sister for the weekend and he made it quite clear that I should be going to somewhere like Paris for the weekend and my plans were lame. Watching tv on a Friday night was a waste of time. We couldn't go to dinner at any chain restaurants. 

All these things now had to be implemented or I would get lectured that I wasn't doing enough, that the walls were closing in on my life. Spending time with our daughters was not a priority because it broke into his bike time, his workout time, his socializing time. 

My college roommate who has known my ex since college (35 years now! Ugh) once asked me seriously, "Do you think he could have some kind of brain injury that is changing his personality so much?"

I think he hit mid-life and decided he wanted MORE of everything. More free time. More activity. More sex. More success. And even if he had all that ... he would say "See? We achieved that, now we can set the bar even higher." It's so obnoxious because he thinks all this "stuff" is impressive; his $4000 a month condo in the city, his BMW, his bragging about his stupid bike races ...... those of us that truly know him know what a sad, empty life he now has compared to what he did have. But he just stopped valuing the family life and wanted to live what he thinks is now a cool, successful life. 

 

 

[Scarlett]

3 minutes ago, Home'scool said:

Believe me, this has been a topic of conversation in my house! I met my ex when I was 18 and he was 20 in college. He always had an arrogance about him, but he was a "good guy". He was loved by my family and, when our daughters were young and before they developed their own opinions, was very hands on with the children. He was never very generous with gifts but he was smart and grounded and made me feel safe. But he always had a touch of feeling nothing was good enough and always was the type to push himself hard. I think a girl with more confidence and a stronger background would never have put up with some of the stuff that happened when we were dating, but I was insecure and in love. 

Basically, he was an arrogant guy who could be a real a**hole but he had more good points than bad and proved himself enough of a stand-up guy that we all loved him.

Then ... somewhere along the way he got lost. We moved to an affluent town and he started moving up the corporate ladder. All of a sudden he was very concerned with what type of car we drove, how we dressed, who we hung out with. My youngest daughter was very good at softball but hated soccer, yet my ex made her cry numerous times because he kept pushing her to play soccer. Why? Because, according to my ex, families who are involved with soccer are in a higher social status that people who are involved in softball. This from a guy who used lived in jeans and flannel shirts and drove a beat up pick-up truck and didn't care what anyone thought.

All of a sudden we weren't good enough. I wasn't doing enough. Our weekends were to be filled with ADVENTURE!! No longer were bike rides along the local bike path good enough, we should all be training for a 100 mile bike race. Driving an hour to go skiing wasn't good enough, we should be renting a condo in Colorado for a month (never mind that we couldn't afford that!) I was planning a trip to NYC with my sister for the weekend and he made it quite clear that I should be going to somewhere like Paris for the weekend and my plans were lame. Watching tv on a Friday night was a waste of time. We couldn't go to dinner at any chain restaurants. 

All these things now had to be implemented or I would get lectured that I wasn't doing enough, that the walls were closing in on my life. Spending time with our daughters was not a priority because it broke into his bike time, his workout time, his socializing time. 

My college roommate who has known my ex since college (35 years now! Ugh) once asked me seriously, "Do you think he could have some kind of brain injury that is changing his personality so much?"

I think he hit mid-life and decided he wanted MORE of everything. More free time. More activity. More sex. More success. And even if he had all that ... he would say "See? We achieved that, now we can set the bar even higher." It's so obnoxious because he thinks all this "stuff" is impressive; his $4000 a month condo in the city, his BMW, his bragging about his stupid bike races ...... those of us that truly know him know what a sad, empty life he now has compared to what he did have. But he just stopped valuing the family life and wanted to live what he thinks is now a cool, successful life. 

 

 

So much of that is how I could describe my XH to a point.  He too changed when he got a good job....suddenly climbing that corporate ladder was so important....he became enraged one day when he needed to drive my old car to work for some reason. It would damage his image.  My/our friend's too were just gobsmacked he was acting that way...At 17 he was wildly in love with me...and then he began to view me with contempt because I wasn't good enough in oh so many ways.  It was super weird.  

The only difference is he did snap out of it and now the interactions I have with him (very few since ds is grown and married) are amicable.  In fact about 3 years after the divorce he did give me a very real apology that I know was heartfelt.  

I am just glad you do not have to raise small children with this version of your XH.

[OH_Homeschooler]

10 minutes ago, Home'scool said:

He wanted MORE of everything. More free time. More activity. More sex. More success. And even if he had all that ... he would say "See? We achieved that, now we can set the bar even higher." It's so obnoxious because he thinks all this "stuff" is impressive; his $4000 a month condo in the city, his BMW, his bragging about his stupid bike races ...... those of us that truly know him know what a sad, empty life he now has compared to what he did have. But he just stopped valuing the family life and wanted to live what he thinks is now a cool, successful life. 

 

 

 

It's almost like they can only keep up the facade of being a good guy until mid-life, and then it all falls apart. They use love-bombing to get you hooked and continue the manipulations until they can't anymore. Or until their spouses can't take it anymore.

And then there's no good left at all and you sit back and wonder where it all went south. And you realize it was always bad, they were just hiding it from you. 

[Carol in Cal.]

Do you remember your first post about the impending divorce?  I do.  He had you very confused at that point, and I”m mentioning this only for others who might not have seen it but who might be feeling twinges of recognition but also feeling that ‘mine is not that bad, and it’s really as much my fault as his’.

[PinkTulip]

I definitely appreciate your continued posting about these things. My youngest is 17 and I will most likely find myself in a similar situation in about a year or so. We have moved too many times and I’m not going to uproot him yet again so I’m just hanging on. In the meantime, I’m reading, listening, learning, and gathering information and other essentials. You have taught me a lot and I admire how well you have managed your situation. 

[Carrie12345]

I’m so sorry, but glad there are more things checked off the list!

[Mothersweets]

I'm always glad to hear your updates. I hope getting the clock goes smoothly and you can finally be free from all of his horribleness. ((hugs))

[mom2scouts]

Wow, your description of your ex is just really sad. I'm all about wanting to be a better person, but he just sounds like someone who's chasing happiness and will never, ever find it. The Bible talks about "chasing the wind". Someday (too late) he'll probably realize that he could have had happiness with his family and simple pleasures, but he hurt you all and chased you away. I'm so sorry you have to go through all of this with him. 

[umsami]

I can't post a lot of details because it's ongoing...but yeah...I'm dealing with somebody who ignores any and all court orders, won't provide discovery, won't pay $1, etc.

[Home'scool]

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It's almost like they can only keep up the facade of being a good guy until mid-life, and then it all falls apart. They use love-bombing to get you hooked and continue the manipulations until they can't anymore. Or until their spouses can't take it anymore.

And then there's no good left at all and you sit back and wonder where it all went south. And you realize it was always bad, they were just hiding it from you. 

 

Bingo! This is exactly it!

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Wow, your description of your ex is just really sad. I'm all about wanting to be a better person, but he just sounds like someone who's chasing happiness and will never, ever find it. The Bible talks about "chasing the wind". Someday (too late) he'll probably realize that he could have had happiness with his family and simple pleasures, but he hurt you all and chased you away. I'm so sorry you have to go through all of this with him. 

One time when we were in counseling my ex was trying to impress the counselor with all the things he does and plans to do and she flat out told him he would never be happy because he set this standard of "nothing is ever good enough". Of course he just ignored her advice.

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I remember. OP tried hard to be so nice, so reasonable, so believing that it would be settled in good faith. I’m so glad homes’cool caught on and stood up for herself. 

And home, I’m sorry you are STILL dealing with that jerk. Ask your movers to examine and photograph the clock upon pickup, before they load and move it.

 

I was just thinking this morning how much I wanted to avoid any unpleasantness because deep down inside I knew he was going to be a very nasty adversary. And at the time, I thought that would be the worst thing to go through. It turned out that I had to go through it anyways and it was worse than I could imagine. But I made it through with LOTS of help from my family. I cannot believe how close this whole process has brought me to my sister and my two daughters. It has been such a blessing in disguise. Last week was hopefully the last time I have to see him or talk to him for a long while. When I think of all the times I cried into my poor cat's fur at night ..... he definitely earned all the treats and toy mouses I get for him!

[sweet2ndchance]

Home'scool, I also deal with a narcissistic ex that I had to go through mediation with except I found out he was going to the mediator between our sessions and making deals that I had no idea about until the next session. He would take our kids to the mediator when he had his parenting time but the mediator refused to allow me to bring the kids to her on my parenting time to see if their opinions on things were different depending on which parent brought them. Which is something that is mentioned in the state guidelines as a best practice for mediation cases with children involved and when I brought it up that not only should I be told by my ex or her that they have an appointment to talk to her instead of being told by the children after the fact, she should also be seeing the children on my parenting time to get the full picture of what the children are like when they are in both of our care as that is the state's best practice guideline. She told me that the guidelines are just guidelines and she doesn't have to follow them.... She also insisted that I was being a bad co-parent because I refused to write him a detailed weekly report on the kids every Friday so he could be "involved" with his preteen and teenage children.... but when she told me to outline what I would want when I was the non-residential parent, I told her I wanted exactly what he has and these weekly reports that he seems to think are so vital to him being involved with his children. She told me that I was asking too much of him because he has a full time job.... so did I at that time AND I was going to school to get a better job AND I was raising 5 kids basically on my own because he didn't even take his parenting time 60% of the time and I had the documentation to prove it. But then I was bringing up the past and I needed to be willing to compromise for less time, none of the discounts on child support payments that he had (despite the fact that he makes many times more than I did at the time) and no contact at all on his parenting time .... and the court let this go on for 5 years after the divorce before I put an end to it for the children's sake. Family court is no place for children in any capacity.

Yes, ex was throwing money and names of powerful people he knew every which direction to get the outcome he did. He even paid off my lawyer to be a wallflower and constantly tell me that she couldn't interfere with the mediation process but his lawyer was also constantly talking to the mediator and I have the records of all of that as well. I understand the "hollow inside" feeling all too well. His newest passion is to manipulate our adult children by trying to buy their allegiance to him any time he gets wind of them having talked to me. We are nearly ten years post divorce now. I have been in therapy and on a variety of mental health medications because of his never ending shenanigans for most of these years post divorce. I thought when the children were grown and I grey rocked him into oblivion, he might lose interest in making me miserable but apparently he still says with passion that I have to pay for the embarrassment I caused him by leaving him and "forcing" him to start the divorce process against me... oh, and the restraining order I have against him that I obviously paid someone, in his twisted opinion, to serve him at work so that I made him look like the bad one in our relationship.... I won't bore you with further details but I just wanted you to know that you aren't alone in this. I have found that very few people truly understand what it is like, physically, mentally and emotionally, to deal with this level of crazy for years on end. Yes, there were signs in 20/20 hindsight but, now, it just is what it is and I just try to survive it.

I don't tend to share much of my story publicly because I still really struggle with a lot of it and when I do, I usually only share bits and pieces. If you ever need to talk to someone who completely gets what it is like, you are welcome to pm me anytime. (((((hugs)))))

[Home'scool]

sweetsndchance: thank you for your heartfelt post. It took me a long time to realize that he was constantly trying to convince me that black was white. And for a long time I went along with it either to keep the peace or because I had been browbeaten enough to be convinced he was right. That's what they do, 24/7. It's like breathing to them.

Thankfully our children are grown and they choose to have nothing to do with him.

[OH_Homeschooler]

@sweet2ndchance That makes me so mad. I can't believe a mediator could get away with that. (I mean I can, because narcissists get away with everything, but you know). I'm so sorry you had to go through that.