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28 minutes ago, Melissa in Australia said:

Welcome to the crazies that is Vic and NSW. 

It was a mistake to open up to Vic. The rest of Australia should just open up amongst themselves and leave Vic and NSW to the mess they have created

😞 

Just listened to the press conference and although Nicola was pretty discreet the police commissioner just came out and said that her advice had been to shut the border again with Omicron and they have made a different decision.  

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add hippos to the list of animals that can contract Covid!
 

Two Belgium hippos contract COVID 

Two hippos in Belgium have tested positive for COVID-19, prompting the closure of the Antwerp Zoo.

The 41-year-old mother and her 14-year-old daughter were tested by the zoo's vet after he noticed their noses were running badly.

They're expected to fully recover from the virus, which is spiking in numbers across many countries in Europe, including Belgium.
 

 

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https://www.nbc15.com/2021/12/04/wisconsin-wedding-liked-5-cases-omicron-covid-19-variant-california/
“ALAMEDA COUNTY, Calif. (WMTV) - Health officials say a Wisconsin wedding is being linked to 12 COVID-19 cases in California, five of which are the Omicron COVID-19 variant.

According to the Alameda County Public Health Department and the City of Berkley, the COVID-19 cases are linked to a wedding that took place on Nov. 27 in Wisconsin. Wisconsin health officials confirmed the wedding happened in Milwaukee County.

One of the people who tested positive for the virus had attended the event after returning from international travel. Investigators say the five people infected with the Omicron variant from California are mildly symptomatic.

No Omicron cases have been detected among Wisconsinites at this time, the Wisconsin Department of Health Services reports.

The individuals infected range between the ages of 18-49. No one has been hospitalized.

Alameda County health officials say all the people who tested positive were vaccinated and “most” had received their boosters.”

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2 hours ago, Ausmumof3 said:

We are holding borders open to NSW and Vic for now but people have to test and quarantine on arrival.  Apparently we already exported a case to QLD and we are now a hotspot in QLD so I guess that might mess with some plans.  Basically we’ve opened to NSW and Vic and the rest of Aus are shutting to us.  So stupid. 
 

The tone of press conferences is cautious and subject to change though so wouldn’t be surprised if things change again.  Some reports are that the health lady (who is good) has already asked twice to have the borders closed but so far been refused.

I'm kinda hoping the border stays open so ds' g/friend can go home for Christmas but boy, it should not be open. 

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Worldwide there was a big jump in numbers yesterday.  Maybe more testing as everyone’s worried about the new variant?

US passed 800,000 deaths by worldometer data sometime last week.  I missed it go by.  Also was a big spike in cases/deaths today but presumably that’s the thanksgiving backlog.  Deaths might be increasing very slightly world wide but holding at roughly 7,000 a day.

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6 hours ago, Melissa Louise said:


I'm sitting back and thinking, hmmmm...novel virus....no idea of potential long term impacts....maybe better to mitigate against kids getting it till we know more? 

But this is not mainstream view, apparently. 

One would think. A lot of people are super worried about long term impacts from the vaccine, but the same people seem to be completely unconcerned about possible long term effects from the virus itself. I don’t get that at all. 

18 minutes ago, Ausmumof3 said:

US passed 800,000 deaths by worldometer data sometime last week.  I missed it go by. 

Yikes. I guess I lost track of that, and the last milestone I was aware of was when we passed 600,000 deaths. Meanwhile, we have US politicians saying that “Real America is done with Covid-19.” Wishful thinking perhaps, but clearly Covid is not the least bit done with us. 

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5 hours ago, regentrude said:

They did not check my test result before boarding the plane. They checked my vaccination card, and I was about to hand them the paper with my test result, but they just waved me off. (Perhaps if I hadn't been forthcoming and waved the paper in their face, they might have asked? Maybe they were assuming that only somebody who has a negative test within the timeframe would readily hand them the document?)

There were zero Covid related checks upon arrival in the US.

I flew from Milan in August to the US.  DH flew from Frankfurt to the US two weeks ago.  We both had to upload negative test information into a VeriFly app to be able to fly to the US

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@mathnerd@sassenach

https://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local/covid-19-outbreak-at-marin-school-caused-by-family-breaching-health-order-county/2747742/

“A COVID-19 outbreak at a Marin County elementary school was caused by a family who sent their child to school while infected with the virus, school officials said Friday.

Officials with the Larkspur-Corte Madera School District told NBC Bay Area Friday that a family sent their child to Neil Cummins Elementary School, knowing the child had tested positive for COVID-19. 

According to the district officials, the school found out on Nov. 18 and tested three classes the next day. 

School officials said that at least eight children then tested positive for COVID-19. 

They added that as many as 75 people are in a modified quarantine as a result of one student's breach. 

Per Marin County rules, the student should have isolated for 10 days if they test positive for COVID-19.”

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40 minutes ago, Arcadia said:

@mathnerd@sassenach

https://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local/covid-19-outbreak-at-marin-school-caused-by-family-breaching-health-order-county/2747742/

“A COVID-19 outbreak at a Marin County elementary school was caused by a family who sent their child to school while infected with the virus, school officials said Friday.

Officials with the Larkspur-Corte Madera School District told NBC Bay Area Friday that a family sent their child to Neil Cummins Elementary School, knowing the child had tested positive for COVID-19. 

According to the district officials, the school found out on Nov. 18 and tested three classes the next day. 

School officials said that at least eight children then tested positive for COVID-19. 

They added that as many as 75 people are in a modified quarantine as a result of one student's breach. 

Per Marin County rules, the student should have isolated for 10 days if they test positive for COVID-19.”

Oof, my friend's kid goes to that school. It's cliquey as hell. That's a fast way to make your kid a total outcast. 

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Michigan is getting lots of Covid press now but I have family in Ohio and it’s rapidly turning into carnage there…OH had more than 9500 new cases yesterday (they’ve hit at or over 8,000/day for the past few days) and hospitalizations are the highest they’ve ever been. 

Edited by Happy2BaMom
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25 minutes ago, Happy2BaMom said:

Michigan is getting lots of Covid press now but I have family in Ohio and it’s rapidly turning into carnage there…OH had more than 9500 new cases yesterday (they’ve hit at or over 8,000/day for the past few days) and hospitalizations are the highest they’ve ever been. 

I was reading the same earlier. They are starting to cancel non urgent surgeries again 😢. Which is really awful for the people who really need those “non urgent” surgeries. https://www.news5cleveland.com/news/continuing-coverage/coronavirus/local-coronavirus-news/uh-metrohealth-cleveland-clinic-postpone-non-essential-surgeries-as-covid-patients-fill-beds

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4 hours ago, Happy2BaMom said:

Michigan is getting lots of Covid press now but I have family in Ohio and it’s rapidly turning into carnage there…OH had more than 9500 new cases yesterday (they’ve hit at or over 8,000/day for the past few days) and hospitalizations are the highest they’ve ever been. 

I'm in OH and have surgery scheduled for Wednesday and am hoping I get in before things get too bad.  Went for my pre-op appt. yesterday and they said they were pretty busy but still handling things.  

The hospital in my own county (I'm having surgery at a different hospital) numbers for hospital and ICU beds taken by Covid patients are higher than they've ever been throughout the whole pandemic.  Yet, if you walk around town you would never know anything was going on - hardly anyone wears masks, gatherings and celebrations everywhere, etc.  It's really like living in the twilight zone.  I am so so glad DH and I got our boosters.  People here (in general) are very anti-mask and anti-vax and mock people who do either.  

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5 hours ago, Kassia said:

I'm in OH and have surgery scheduled for Wednesday and am hoping I get in before things get too bad.  Went for my pre-op appt. yesterday and they said they were pretty busy but still handling things.  

The hospital in my own county (I'm having surgery at a different hospital) numbers for hospital and ICU beds taken by Covid patients are higher than they've ever been throughout the whole pandemic.  Yet, if you walk around town you would never know anything was going on - hardly anyone wears masks, gatherings and celebrations everywhere, etc.  It's really like living in the twilight zone.  I am so so glad DH and I got our boosters.  People here (in general) are very anti-mask and anti-vax and mock people who do either.  

Sending all good wishes for your surgery, Kassia, and that everything runs right on schedule.

My corner of Ohio is experiencing the biggest spike in the state, and when I went to dd15's basketball game last night the people wearing masks were most likely to have them below their noses and chins. This despite the fact that we heard the night before there is a Covid case on the team, and a half dozen girls were out between JV and varsity! I think it's one case so far, and the rest unvaccinated and quarantining.

Then I stopped at the mall and same thing--few masks, and most of those below the nose. I can't believe we're sprinting into another dark pandemic winter. 

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1 hour ago, Acadie said:

Sending all good wishes for your surgery, Kassia, and that everything runs right on schedule.

My corner of Ohio is experiencing the biggest spike in the state,

I think we're pretty close to each other  - I'm in Geauga county.  Surgery is in Lake County.  It's just unbelievable here - you go out and it's like the pandemic was just a bad dream.  No masks, lots of gatherings and celebrating, etc.  County meetings in small cramped rooms with no one wearing masks (including our health dept.).  

 

 

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We have 10 days until the Aucklanders are released. We are at 93.1% first dose and 87.3% double vaxed for 12+. (My city is 94% double vaxed for 12+.) They are desperately trying to get it up higher, and every day it is about 0.2% more. So we might hit 90% by Christmas. 15% of NZ population is under 12, and they are still checking safety and efficacy, expecting to offer vax to kids late January.  

We started the vaccine passports on Monday, so you can't go to restaurants, bars, gyms, hairdressers, any big events without being double vaxed. If venues don't want to require the vaccine passports, then the can operate as a contactless (carry out or by zoom) service. 

All teachers and staff, healthcare and elder care staff, all people working in venues that require the vaccine passport, and all border workers including port workers, must now all be double vaxed or lose their job. By January, all police and fireservices must be double vaxed. 

Because our vaccine rollout only started for under 60s in the beginning of September with second shots in October (we had a reccommended 6 weeks gap at first), we are going into Christmas with most people at a good protection level. They have started boosting the elderly.

To fly  or take a ferry to the South Island, you must be double vaxed or have a negative covid test, so that should control spread to the South Island. You could go by private boat but it is not an easy hop (rough water), so not common.

The outbreak in Auckland peaked 3 weeks ago, we are now at half of the numbers (98 yesterda), and the health teams have been able to control all the tiny embers spread throughout 7 other regions over the past 3 months, so that none of them have ever had more than 5 cases a day, even the ones near Auckland where it spread about 3 months ago. They are continuing tight contact tracing and isolating, and are incredibly effective.

The border restrictions with the world are still tight, with all travellers including citizens going into a military run quarantine facility, so no Omicron here.

Basically, we are opening up in the summer, with a very vaccinated population and a vaccine passport.  Crossing fingers, but it looks good. 

Deaths to date are 43. 

Edited by lewelma
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2 hours ago, Kassia said:

I think we're pretty close to each other  - I'm in Geauga county.  Surgery is in Lake County.  It's just unbelievable here - you go out and it's like the pandemic was just a bad dream.  No masks, lots of gatherings and celebrating, etc.  County meetings in small cramped rooms with no one wearing masks (including our health dept.).  

 

 

I wish I could tell people to pull their masks up like Baltimore Mayor Brandon Scott. Love the remix at the bottom.

https://www.baltimoresun.com/maryland/baltimore-city/bs-md-ci-brandon-scott-shorty-davis-pull-ya-mask-up-20210106-rraic6aas5hebfovbnisirlz44-story.html

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@lewelma I was wondering if there was talk of people dying from the vaccine in NZ like there is over here in the US. I have not seen that in the hospital I work at but there are plenty of people claiming it is happening, and spreading what I think is misinformation about it.  If ever there was a place to watch to find out the truth it would be NZ since you have vaccinated so many so recently.

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South Africa is seeing a sharp increase in hospitalizations in children under 5:

"We are hoping that in the coming weeks we'll be able to also give reasons for why this particular cohort of patient is having increased infections," said Dr. Ntsakisi Maluleke, a health official for South Africa's Gauteng province, at a briefing hosted by the country's health agency on Friday. Rates of COVID-19 among hospitalized children under five "is now second highest and second only to the incidence in those over 60." 

"The trend that we see now, that's different to what we saw before, is a particular increase in hospital admissions in children under five years," said Dr. Waasila Jassat of South Africa's National Institute for Communicable Diseases.

These children also remain ineligible for vaccination in South Africa, unlike older age groups. "All these young children being admitted, most of them, the parents have not been vaccinated either. So I think, certainly the value of vaccination in the adults, protecting the children in the homes, is something to keep in mind," said Jassat.

While doctors had suspected earlier in the pandemic that children might be less vulnerable catching and spreading SARS-CoV-2, health officials have since concluded that rates of disease among children "can be comparable, and in some settings higher, than in adults." 

During the surge in cases driven by the Delta variant earlier this year, pediatricians reported an unprecedented wave of admissions overwhelming children's hospitals around the country. A study published by the CDC concluded that hospitalizations had climbed simply due to the sheer number of overall cases, with the actual proportion of sick children who ended up with severe disease remaining unchanged by the Delta variant.

"We don't have the outcome data for those individuals. We haven't seen an increased risk of death yet. So we have to wait to understand how those patients will do," the World Health Organization's Dr. Maria Van Kerkhove said on Friday, when she was asked about reports of rising hospitalizations among young people in South Africa."

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/omicron-variant-children-south-africa/

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Oh, not good if babies and young kids are going into the hospital. 😞

 

Have any of you found more information about the newer self-amplifying mrna vaccines (SAM vaccines)? Gritstone has one already in at least phase 1 trials (started about 2.5 months ago) that is supposedly going to be trialed soon in South Africa along with a few other similar vaccines. I can't find any information about the other vaccines, though. Anyone know more about these?

SAM vaccines are potent with even a small dose because they self replicate continuously in the cell until the cell dies. I wonder if the smaller dose would be a better choice for babies and children. They are saying the vaccines are safe and should work against many future variants. Gritstone is saying that Omicron will not be a problem.

Also, does anyone know about AstraZeneca's Covid nasal vaccine? Now, if that one works, that would be something.

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2 hours ago, TCB said:

@lewelma I was wondering if there was talk of people dying from the vaccine in NZ like there is over here in the US. I have not seen that in the hospital I work at but there are plenty of people claiming it is happening, and spreading what I think is misinformation about it.  If ever there was a place to watch to find out the truth it would be NZ since you have vaccinated so many so recently.

It has happened in NZ. There was a big story just a few days ago of a male dying of a heart attack. Very sad

https://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/health/health-problems/coroner-investigating-whether-dunedin-mans-death-connected-to-vaccine-days-earlier/news-story/611e2ec30328377d0e0ca26b0009d2fd

Edited by Melissa in Australia
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I think there are around 600 deaths that have been reported as possibly related to the vaccine rollout in Australia, some  of those have been defiantly connected, some are still under investigation, and some are inconclusive.

 

80,919 adverse reactions that were bad enough to be reported.

https://www.tga.gov.au/periodic/covid-19-vaccine-weekly-safety-report-18-11-2021

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5 minutes ago, Ausmumof3 said:

You all seen the event where 100 out of 120 people present have so far tested positive? We better hope this is more mild because the hit rate is looking scary. With previous variants it was more like 25 or 30% of people at events that went down.

I haven’t heard, which event….

just googled, in Norway?

 

Edited by Melissa in Australia
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16 minutes ago, Melissa in Australia said:

I think there are around 600 deaths that have been reported as possibly related to the vaccine rollout in Australia, some  of those have been defiantly connected, some are still under investigation, and some are inconclusive.

 

80,919 adverse reactions that were bad enough to be reported.

https://www.tga.gov.au/periodic/covid-19-vaccine-weekly-safety-report-18-11-2021

How is your brother doing now?

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17 minutes ago, Melissa in Australia said:

I think there are around 600 deaths that have been reported as possibly related to the vaccine rollout in Australia, some  of those have been defiantly connected, some are still under investigation, and some are inconclusive.

 

80,919 adverse reactions that were bad enough to be reported.

https://www.tga.gov.au/periodic/covid-19-vaccine-weekly-safety-report-18-11-2021

I think the 600 deaths are deaths that occurred after immunisation not necessarily linked?  Basically you have to compare to background rates.  Biggest mistake the government made with the pandemic was not securing more Pfizer earlier in the piece so they weren’t relying on AZ.  

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23 minutes ago, Ausmumof3 said:

Yep

Also predominantly vaxed I believe.  Let’s hope the vaccines at least protect against severe illness here.

 

CNN said all participants were required to be vaccinated AND have a negative test prior to attending party.  

This is terrifying.  

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6 minutes ago, Terabith said:

CNN said all participants were required to be vaccinated AND have a negative test prior to attending party.  

This is terrifying.  

Yep. Plus 80 percent of tge country is vaccinated.   I mean what more can you do???????  This feels like everyone will get it.  I am absolutely terrified of giving it to mom. Though she has many other avenues of exposure. She got her booster today. I get mine Monday, but with Omicron, that won’t help. 

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7 minutes ago, Terabith said:

If it's not less virulent, well, humanity had a good run.  

Oh, come on. Yes, it would absolutely suck if this wound up killing off 1% of people, but that's not, like, goodbye to humanity 😛 . 

I'm hoping the vaccines are still preventing serious cases. I am also at this point utterly uninterested in the rate of "fully vaccinated" people, since that's a really meaningless number -- the right number is the percent boosted. Even with Delta, being fully vaxxed 7 months ago gives a totally puny protection from infection. 

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4 minutes ago, Not_a_Number said:

Oh, come on. Yes, it would absolutely suck if this wound up killing off 1% of people, but that's not, like, goodbye to humanity 😛 . 

I'm hoping the vaccines are still preventing serious cases. I am also at this point utterly uninterested in the rate of "fully vaccinated" people, since that's a really meaningless number -- the right number is the percent boosted. Even with Delta, being fully vaxxed 7 months ago gives a totally puny protection from infection. 

Which sucks since I cannot get my teenagers boosted.  

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20 minutes ago, TexasProud said:

Yep. Plus 80 percent of tge country is vaccinated.   I mean what more can you do???????  This feels like everyone will get it.  I am absolutely terrified of giving it to mom. Though she has many other avenues of exposure. She got her booster today. I get mine Monday, but with Omicron, that won’t help. 

The bolded: where do you get that from?

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1 minute ago, busymama7 said:

But it is most likely less virulent.  This is the exact situation we've been talking about for almost 2 years. That it would mutate to more contagious and less virulent. 

We really have no clue if it's less virulent. Those are basically orthogonal. 

But we also don't have any indications it's more virulent or that vaccines won't prevent serious illness. So I don't think it's time to panic just yet. 

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1 hour ago, Ausmumof3 said:

I think the 600 deaths are deaths that occurred after immunisation not necessarily linked?  Basically you have to compare to background rates.  Biggest mistake the government made with the pandemic was not securing more Pfizer earlier in the piece so they weren’t relying on AZ.  

That was why I included the link. They were deaths that occurred after the vaccine and have been reported as a possable. They are then investigated.  some of them might be  people who died of other causes.  I was very  careful with my wording to try and convey that. 

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7 minutes ago, Melissa in Australia said:

That was why I included the link. They were deaths that occurred after the vaccine and have been reported as a possable. They are then investigated.  some of them might be  people who died of other causes.  I was very  careful with my wording to try and convey that. 

Except that it sounds like such a big number that it's scary. Like, maaaaybe a few aren't really from the vaccine but most probably are. And what's actually the case is that the background rate is very very similar to that, so you can't even tell if the vaccine caused any. 

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3 minutes ago, Not_a_Number said:

Except that it sounds like such a big number that it's scary. Like, maaaaybe a few aren't really from the vaccine but most probably are. And what's actually the case is that the background rate is very very similar to that, so you can't even tell if the vaccine caused any. 

I got the numbers diectly from the official reporting government website that I linked. 

These are possable deaths related to the vaccine as reported by GPs etc. 

Not something I have made up, or some media has made up

 

Edited by Melissa in Australia
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6 minutes ago, Not_a_Number said:

Except that it sounds like such a big number that it's scary. Like, maaaaybe a few aren't really from the vaccine but most probably are. And what's actually the case is that the background rate is very very similar to that, so you can't even tell if the vaccine caused any. 

I do find it scary. 

 I still do not know a single person who has had covid. But know a person who has died of the vaccine and  have a relitive who has had a life threatening reaction that required hospitalisation. 

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4 hours ago, TCB said:

@lewelma I was wondering if there was talk of people dying from the vaccine in NZ like there is over here in the US. I have not seen that in the hospital I work at but there are plenty of people claiming it is happening, and spreading what I think is misinformation about it.  If ever there was a place to watch to find out the truth it would be NZ since you have vaccinated so many so recently.

Maybe one?  The press is unwilling to print misinformation because it is against the public health act, so against the law. So that kind of thing would only be on social media.

Also, NZ's figures on death due to vaccine are very different from Australia's because we used pfizer and Australia used Astrazenaca.  

Edited by lewelma
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22 minutes ago, Melissa in Australia said:

 I still do not know a single person who has had covid. 

which is such a completely, unimaginably different reality compared to those of us in the US or Europe that we are probably having a difficult time relating to one another....

I have friends who lost multiple family members to Covid, every week I have students quarantined with Covid, and every day we go to work trying to protect ourselves against infection which is an ever-present threat. 
Gosh, Australia must be paradise.

Edited by regentrude
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32 minutes ago, Melissa in Australia said:

That was why I included the link. They were deaths that occurred after the vaccine and have been reported as a possable. They are then investigated.  some of them might be  people who died of other causes.  I was very  careful with my wording to try and convey that. 

From the link you provided: "TGA has found 9 reports of death that were linked to immunisation from 665 reports received and reviewed.

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27 minutes ago, Not_a_Number said:

Except that it sounds like such a big number that it's scary. Like, maaaaybe a few aren't really from the vaccine but most probably are. And what's actually the case is that the background rate is very very similar to that, so you can't even tell if the vaccine caused any. 

Is that site equivalent to VAERS in the US? Because they have a crazy number of reports, and it’s clear the majority are not actually related to the vaccine. So I would reverse what you said: a few are probably from the vaccine, but most aren’t. If it were really at that rate, it would show up in studies.  When tens of millions of vaccines are given in a short period, there will be a measurable number of people who have an adverse medical event in the weeks following, because that is the background rate, and it would have been about the same without the vaccine. 

Edited by KSera
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4 minutes ago, KSera said:

Is that site equivalent to VAERS in the US? Because they have a crazy number of reports, and it’s clear the majority are not actually related to the vaccine. So I would reverse what you said: a few are probably from the vaccine, but most aren’t. If it were really at that rate, it would show up in studies.  When tens of millions of vaccines are given in a short period, there will be a measurable number of people who have an adverse medical event in the weeks following, because that is the background rate, and it would have been about the same without the vaccine. 

Exactly. I agree with you. I'm saying that's what the number sounds like out of context. Sorry not to make it clear. 

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9 minutes ago, regentrude said:

which is such a completely, unimaginably different reality compared to those of us in the US or Europe that we are probably having a difficult time relating to one another....

I have friends who lost multiple family members to Covid, every week I have students quarantined with Covid, and every day we go to work trying to protect ourselves against infection which is an ever-present threat. 
Gosh, Australia must be paradise.

Oh we do quarantine, protection and months and months of lockdown. Am sitting on public transport right now with every single person masked and the strong smell of hand sanitiser. We habe vaccine mandate and unvaccinated are only allowed into food shops or medical care. Shops have guards out front making sure the very few unvacvinated don't enter. Vaccination rates in  my state are 91% 12 and over fully vaxed. Mostly all within the last 3 months. 

We take it seriously, and it is no paradise. 

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