S/o International people views on Americans

[DesertBlossom]

While this thread had made me somewhat uncomfortable, it's also made me think about how our cultural practices (which may be neither right nor wrong) are interpreted in other cultures. Someone up thread mentioned greeting the shop owner in France as being he norm. Shopping at mostly large stores here, I don't think about greeting the store owner, though I see why that would be important in a small shop. And I can see why not doing so would be considered rude if I didn't while in France. But like I said, I don't think most of the cultural norms are right or wrong. They just are. I think we would all be better off if we extended international travelers some grace AND if we made an effort to "when in Rome, do as the Romans do."

[MEmama]

12 minutes ago, Lady Florida. said:

 

Yep. I live in a state with tourism as the top industry and I live in a area of the state that's one of the tourist destinations. We get visitors from all over the world. We smile and nod regardless of their behavior because they're our bread and butter. There are tourists from a certain area of the world that we locals find loud, brash, and full of themselves. If those descriptions fit Americans then for Americans to say that about another culture is really saying something.

The nicest tourists I've encountered are from Japan. In my city we don't think of Canadians as tourists because they're snowbirds. They're not tourists for 5-6 months of the year, they're residents. I think part of that is just how nice Canadians are and part is due to their part time residency. Living in a hotel in a city for a week or two is different from living in an apartment or house for nearly half of the year.

N/m. 

Edited January 16, 2020 by MEmama

[Meriwether]

43 minutes ago, Laura Corin said:

I'm interested in the use of the word 'stereotype'.  If you experience things yourself and report them, is that still stereotyping?

Often it probably has more to do with confirmation bias. If someone doesn't fit the stereotype, they aren't associated with the country. If someone does, they are.

[wintermom]

10 minutes ago, MEmama said:

That’s interesting. It’s completely opposite where I live, also in a tourist town and state. Summer people are treated horribly, in general, by the old time locals; there’s an entitled sense of place here, of who belongs and who doesn’t. It’s an attitude not shared by transplants, but definitely prevalent in many of our communities. 😞
Sorry to say, there are groups (of, ahem, Canadians in particular) who are especially loathed due to poor behavior. Brash drunken behavior and using the beaches as public toilets will do that, fairly or not, despite historical cultural ties with same group. 

Yes, poor neighbour behaviour is not appreciated by anyone, however there are poor neighbours everywhere and there are more poor neighbours who are of our own nationality than international. The local poor neighbours hang around longer. 😋

And these poor neighbours are probably going to be equally annoying when they travel internationally. 😉

Edited January 16, 2020 by wintermom

[Arcadia]

3 hours ago, KungFuPanda said:

 I'm completely fascinated by the differences in my shopping experiences there with and without my son. 

 

Asian supermarkets tend to be less spacious than the non-asian ones due to rental costs. People are generally used to being jam pack in a supermarket, kind of like in crowded public transport. If someone is using a wheelchair, or clutches or any mobility help, people generally would be polite and give priority of space to the person. When I had obvious difficulty walking, people do give me more room on the aisles and estimate that I would need more time to walk from one end of an aisle to the other. 

Chinese supermarkets aisles tend to be too narrow for a wheelchair to go through easily. I tried using a double jogger which is slight wider than a typical wheelchair when my kids were toddlers. I go during less busy hours to Japanese, Korean, Chinese supermarkets and people would try to extend grace.

Edited January 16, 2020 by Arcadia
Funny autocorrect

[annegables]

16 hours ago, Pen said:

 

If it helps any, IME US Southern accents often come across as more mellifluous and pleasant to people who speak the native English of some places outside of North America.  Less brusque, harsh, flat and chopped than the American accent from many other parts of USA  or Canada for that matter. 

If you are traveling, I think you should dress for comfort and practicality—but some people elsewhere (France, Italy, IME) can be bothered by the informality (sloppiness?) of American dress.  Even dressed up we may appear dowdy.  Dressed down we may appear disrespectful. 

I only got to this part of the thread, but based on the number of torn jeans, skinny jeans, crop tops, and sneakers, etc I saw in Paris (and all over France) worn by French people and other Europeans, I find this fascinating. Maybe it was designer torn jeans and therefore fancier? I wore skirts the whole time. My DH who grew up in Europe, commented on how much more casual the dress had become since the 80s. 

We could spot US men because they were dressed in polo shirts and khakis, all looser. Almost without fail. Skinny jeans and tighter shirts were for Europeans. 

[LarlaB]

37 minutes ago, soror said:

I think it is unfair to be upset about opinions given when they were asked for. There are good and bad stereotypes of every group and usually a bit of truth behind those views. Naming stereotypes and views is not saying that every person from that place does those things. Different cultures value different things, what is acceptable one place won't be in another. When we traveled overseas we did our best to be courteous and follow the norms of where we visited but I'm sure we unwittingly caused offense at some point (likely many). Oh well. 

It’s not unfair to be upset.  Everyone is entitled to opinions. Maybe if OP, who asked for input, got upset?  Sure.  But everyone answered knowing this is a large community and not just OP would reply.  

Ducking behind   “But she asked and we are simply answering her question“ (innocent eyes- blink blink) doesn’t fly with me as a defense of sharing broad generalizations. 

 

59 minutes ago, Laura Corin said:

I'm interested in the use of the word 'stereotype'.  If you experience things yourself and report them, is that still stereotyping?

Possible stereotype of British abroad: uptight, reserved, expecting British food, unadventurous, looking down on people

My observation of common British behaviour abroad: drunk, uninterested in local culture, thinking that if you speak louder and slower people will understand English, complete lack of historical awareness, expecting British food, unadventurous, looking down on people

There's an overlap between my experiences and the stereotype, but that doesn't mean that I didn't see what I saw.

 

I suspect I might have very different stereotypes (err, observations) of British travelers abroad if I lived in Ibiza vs. say, Kenya.

Edited January 16, 2020 by GGardner

[Soror]

1 minute ago, LarlaB said:

It’s not unfair to be upset.  Everyone is entitled to opinions. Maybe if OP, who asked for input, got upset?  Sure.  But everyone answered knowing this is a large community and not just OP would reply.  

Ducking behind   “But she asked and we are simply answering her question“ (innocent eyes- blink blink) doesn’t fly with me as a defense of sharing broad generalizations. 

 

You are right my wording is poor, people are entitled to their feelings, whatever they may be.  It is my opinion that is unfair to complain and chastise those who gave opinions that were asked for. Reading the post I expected she was looking for broad generalizations not views on individual people. 

[wintermom]

37 minutes ago, Laura Corin said:

Even when specifically asked what kinds of behaviour it would be good to be aware of overseas?  ETA: personally, I'd like to be told what irritates people about some Brits as travellers.  If it doesn't refer to my behaviour, then I'll lay it aside.

Bingo! Canadians partying and peeing on public beaches is irritating. I've never done this and am unlikely to do so. I'm sad that there are people who do this and think it's acceptable, no matter where they hail from.

Poor, rude behaviour is never appreciated. I think the intention of this thread, though, was to dig deeper into what behaviours are rude, because these are not the same across the world.

For example, drunk university students could be seen as just fine and to be expected in some circumstances. Homecoming celebrations comes to mind.

Edited January 16, 2020 by wintermom

[MEmama]

17 minutes ago, annegables said:

I only got to this part of the thread, but based on the number of torn jeans, skinny jeans, crop tops, and sneakers, etc I saw in Paris (and all over France) worn by French people and other Europeans, I find this fascinating. Maybe it was designer torn jeans and therefore fancier? I wore skirts the whole time. My DH who grew up in Europe, commented on how much more casual the dress had become since the 80s. 

We could spot US men because they were dressed in polo shirts and khakis, all looser. Almost without fail. Skinny jeans and tighter shirts were for Europeans. 

Yeah, I’ve never seen a general difference in dress in Europe/UK than in North America.  Even in Uber stylish Copenhagen, I was never out of place wearing sneakers and leggings—all the women were. 
 

Because the stereotype of Americans standing out in their white tennis shoes comes up here all too frequently, I’ve found myself weirdly watchful of foot wear when I watch European cycling races. Guaranteed nearly no bystander is an American, but at least a solid 1/4 the fans of any race I watch are wearing white sneakers. 😂 It’s way past time to retire fashion stereotypes. Lol. 
 

[annegables]

1 minute ago, MEmama said:

Yeah, I’ve never seen a general difference in dress in Europe/UK than in North America.  Even in Uber stylish Copenhagen, I was never out of place wearing sneakers and leggings—all the women were. 
 

Because the stereotype of Americans standing out in their white tennis shoes comes up here all too frequently, I’ve found myself weirdly watchful of foot wear when I watch European cycling races. Guaranteed nearly no bystander is an American, but at least a solid 1/4 the fans of any race I watch are wearing white sneakers. 😂 It’s way past time to retire fashion stereotypes. Lol. 
 

As long as we are talking about fashion... If the tennis shoes (sneakers) are super weird (not just different colors, but more trendy), it was a European wearing them, both where I live in the US and abroad. Most of the US tourists seemed to have gotten the memo about white sneakers when I was there. I almost never saw a pair! 

But in France, I saw a ton of leggings and skinny jeans on Europeans. 

[frogger]

23 hours ago, DesertBlossom said:

This thread is making me quite self-conscious. I haven't done any international travelling since I was young and single, and I went to Central America where I stuck out like a sore thumb because of my looks. Now with 7 kids we can't go anywhere without making a spectacle of ourselves, even when the kids are well-behaved. A few months back we took a trip to some touristy scenic locations and even (especially?) the international visitors loudly and dramatically counted my children as we walked by. 😄

This thread also has me pondering how much of our personalities are shaped by the culture we grow up in.

 

 

 

It doesn't make me feel self conscious because I get frustrated with Americans for the same reason. It feels like, especially in crowded places, they have zero care for anyone around. Many Asian countries are the same way so that comment about it not bothering them makes sense. 

 

 

P.S. You would never find me on a cruise. I hate fairs and concerts and other crowded places.

[debinindy]

On 1/14/2020 at 5:39 PM, Rosie_0801 said:

Every non-American on this board uses their talking to Americans manners on here. 

 

How would it go over here if one said:

Every American on this board uses their talking to non-Americans manners on here.

Or if post #1 replaced American with any other country/culture of choice?  And people responded frankly and honestly.

I find the discussion quite interesting, but I do see why it may rankle some.

[wintermom]

15 minutes ago, debinindy said:

 

How would it go over here if one said:

Every American on this board uses their talking to non-Americans manners on here.

Or if post #1 replaced American with any other country/culture of choice?  And people responded frankly and honestly.

I find the discussion quite interesting, but I do see why it may rankle some.

I felt the same way as a Canadian in a thread little while ago that "to me" was very negative toward Canada. Many American posters assured me that I was mis-understanding the sentiment, though. I was in the wrong and should not have felt hurt or any other negative feelings. 

So ya, I understand why this thread may rankle some.  Having to defend all your countrymen for all the poor behaviour they have committed in the past is painful. 

[SKL]

29 minutes ago, MEmama said:

Yeah, I’ve never seen a general difference in dress in Europe/UK than in North America.  Even in Uber stylish Copenhagen, I was never out of place wearing sneakers and leggings—all the women were. 
 

Because the stereotype of Americans standing out in their white tennis shoes comes up here all too frequently, I’ve found myself weirdly watchful of foot wear when I watch European cycling races. Guaranteed nearly no bystander is an American, but at least a solid 1/4 the fans of any race I watch are wearing white sneakers. 😂 It’s way past time to retire fashion stereotypes. Lol.

Right?  I always bristle when I see those posts about what not to wear.  It is OK to have your own style, pretty much everywhere in the world.  Believe it or not, most people have better things to do than pick out white sneaker wearers and think nasty thoughts about them.  As for those who don't ... that's more their problem than ours.

[frogger]

28 minutes ago, SKL said:

Right?  I always bristle when I see those posts about what not to wear.  It is OK to have your own style, pretty much everywhere in the world.  Believe it or not, most people have better things to do than pick out white sneaker wearers and think nasty thoughts about them.  As for those who don't ... that's more their problem than ours.

 

 

I had a group of Russians laughing at my clothes before but that was in America and I took it in stride and ended up joking with them. Yes, they were laughing at me not with me but really it didn't bother me. I do come from the worst dressed city in America according to some magazine (I forget which).  

The Canadian comments are also interesting. Wintermom (I think you were the one who said an American could never fit in with Canadians), may I ask what part of Canada you are from. I'm going to assume back east. In talking to western Canadians, I would think that they have more in common with Alaskans than with people in Quebec. I was asked by a Canadian in Alberta if I felt more Candian than American.  My high school pal married a Canadian, Canadians lived with us in camp and built our cabin (in the bush), we don't have football teams at our colleges just hockey ( well and other less popular to watch sports).  I do find that attending museums and other things in Canada is easier for me because the crowds are more polite so we fit in better than in the cities of the contenental US.  Really we get along great with each other out west. 

 

These aren't sterotypes. Just personal observations.

Edited January 16, 2020 by frogger
Grammar nonsense

[MEmama]

31 minutes ago, parent said:

 

I think this is right on.  Topic is interesting and I am not offended because well, I don't fit the stereotype and don't really care... but really, I think Americans are accustomed to being the melting pot and are open and tolerant of many cultures and generally don't want to be rude or offend anyone.  Politically correct to a fault.  So yeah, we are keeping it real and using our American manners, since the majority of us are pretty nice...

 

And what is with the white sneakers?? Only old people wear those.  I haven't had a pair since I was in early grade school since I think it was a gym req.  I have about 5 pairs of athletic shoes that I only wear for. workouts but they are purple, gray, blue, etc.  I don't even remember seeing white sneakers for sale where I shop.  This is a very tired stereotype.

They are actually quite trendy. I only ever see them on teens and college students. Mostly they seem really impractical in this climate, though.
 

Agreed! 

[wintermom]

1 hour ago, soror said:

You are right my wording is poor, people are entitled to their feelings, whatever they may be.  It is my opinion that is unfair to complain and chastise those who gave opinions that were asked for. Reading the post I expected she was looking for broad generalizations not views on individual people. 

Yes, and now that dialogue has ended, pretty much.  I'm sad. ☹️

[SKL]

10 minutes ago, parent said:

@wintermom

I cannot add to the end of my last post, I guess because there is an emoji.

Anyway, me not having negative sterotypes about Canadians isn't because Canadians are so perfect and I have not seen stupid one.  It is because most of the people I have interacted with are normal and nice and I wouldn't generalize the entire country by a few bad eggs.

So far, my only negative impression of Canadians is that an unknown percentage of them look down upon people in the US whom they don't even know.

I learned this by surprise one day when I discovered that it is an insult to suggest people in the US and Canada have a lot in common.  (I still think we do.  Sorry.)

I have had Canadian friends and co-workers and have visited Canada a fair number of times.  I don't recall bad experiences that one would stereotype.  I have had people on both sides of the border ask me if I was Canadian.

[MEmama]

25 minutes ago, frogger said:

 

 

I had a group of Russians laughing at my clothes before but that was in America and I took it in stride and ended up joking with them. Yes, they were laughing at me not with me but really it didn't bother me. I do come from the worst dressed city in America according to some magazine (I forget which).  

The Canadian comments are also interesting. Wintermom (I think you were the one who said an American could never fit in with Canadians), may I ask what part of Canada you are from. I'm going to assume back east. In talking to western Canadians, I would think that they have more in common with Alaskans than with people in Quebec. I was asked by a Canadian in Alberta if I felt more Candian than American.  My high school pal married a Canadian, Canadians lived with us in camp and built our cabin (in the bush), we don't have football teams at our colleges just hockey ( well and other less popular to watch sports).  I do find that attending museums and other things in Canada is easier for me because the crowds are more polite. In other words, we fit in better but really we get along great with each out west. 

 

These aren't sterotypes. Just personal observations.

We lived in eastern Canada and there was zero chance of fitting in, the local community made certain of that. 🙄

Exclusionary stereotypes can happen anywhere. Those were eye opening years, though.

[SKL]

So confused about the white sneakers.  I always used to buy white sneakers when I needed a replacement.  Like a haircut, it was just my style and I was comfortable with it.  After hearing them so roundly bashed here on WTM forums, I went for black shoes the last time.  I don't even like them.  And now I hear white is OK again.  Sigh.

Edited January 16, 2020 by SKL

[Selkie]

4 minutes ago, MEmama said:

They are actually quite trendy. I only ever see them on teens and college students. Mostly they seem really impractical in this climate, though.
 

Agreed! 

Yep, white sneakers are very popular on the college campus where my boys attend.

[wintermom]

19 minutes ago, SKL said:

So far, my only negative impression of Canadians is that an unknown percentage of them look down upon people in the US whom they don't even know.

I learned this by surprise one day when I discovered that it is an insult to suggest people in the US and Canada have a lot in common.  (I still think we do.  Sorry.)

I have had Canadian friends and co-workers and have visited Canada a fair number of times.  I don't recall bad experiences that one would stereotype.  I have had people on both sides of the border ask me if I was Canadian.

As a Canadian, I find this really strange as well. And apparently it is fairly accurate, though not by me personally. I'm married to a man who is dual US/Canadian citizen, and all his immediate family are dual. I know a lot of Americans personally, and I don't look down on them. Perhaps it's more of the big brother/little brother feeling rather than looking down on Americans. We have 1/10 the population, our trade economy, military security, etc. is dependent upon the US, and many Canadians go back and forth across the border very frequently. 

Regarding the difference/similarity between Canada and the US, one American comedian apparently stated something like, "Imagine you were transported to a land that, on the surface, looked just like the US, except when you really looked closely, everything was just a little bit "off." Canada's McDonalds have a different menu, our WalMart and Costco have different products. Even the cars on the road, while having similar makes, have vastly different models. All the road signs are different, and we use km instead of miles/hour. 

Then there is our money. It's colourful. It has the Queen on many forms of it. We have a prime minister. We don't say "Zee" for the letter z.

Edited January 16, 2020 by wintermom

[Pawz4me]

57 minutes ago, parent said:

 

And what is with the white sneakers?? Only old people wear those. 

Nope. They're very "in" with the stylish young people now. DS24, our family fashionista, bought a pair recently. And a couple of years ago he would have been rolling on the floor at the idea. FWIW, he's also traveled widely in Europe (multiple trips). But those trips pre-dated the white sneaks. 😉 

[SKL]

1 minute ago, wintermom said:

As a Canadian, I find this really strange as well. And apparently it is fairly accurate, though not by me personally. I'm married to a man who is dual US/Canadian citizen, and all his immediate family are dual. I know a lot of Americans personally, and I don't look down on them. Perhaps it's more of the big brother/little brother feeling rather than looking down on Americans. We have 1/10 the population, our trade economy, military security, etc. is dependent upon the US, and many Canadians go back and forth across the border very frequently. 

Regarding the difference/similarity between Canada and the US, one American comedian apparently stated something like, "Imagine you were transported to a land that, on the surface, looked just like the US, except when you really looked closely, everything was just a little bit "off." Canada's McDonalds have a different menu, our WalMart and Costco has different products. Even the cars on the road, while having similar makes, have vastly different models. 

"We have a lot in common" does not mean "you are exactly like me."

I figured out that the real reason for the hate is that they assume we are looking down on them.  I have no idea where this comes from, because nobody I know thinks that way at all.  But in a country with 300M+ population, sure, there may have been some idiots saying stupid things about Canada at some point.  Well, lots of folks have said lots of things about my birthplace / hometown, but somehow it didn't translate into hate or contempt for a whole population.

[wintermom]

7 minutes ago, parent said:

 

I thought they just wanted to have their own national identity, national pride thing, and not be considered American... not because they don't like Americans.  But maybe I am oblivious to these things... oh well, keeps me happy.  

It would be nice to be recognized as being our own country.  Especially when bunched together with the US, when it seems like a lot of Americans don't even know where Canada is. There is a giant "ocean" between a map of the 48 states and Alaska. Some Americans think it's water, some aren't sure what it is. 😂

[Laura Corin]

2 hours ago, SKL said:

I also note that this thread is (I believe) a spinoff from the royal thread where certain non-US boardies made some rather scathing comments about folks in other countries - comments that I really doubt were meant in kindness or humor.

Lol. I was just coming back to point out the irony of my having sat patiently through British institutions and the national character being roundly criticised over multiple pages in the Royal thread, only to be accused of rude stereotyping in the spin off.

[frogger]

5 minutes ago, wintermom said:

As a Canadian, I find this really strange as well. And apparently it is fairly accurate, though not by me personally. I'm married to a man who is dual US/Canadian citizen, and all his immediate family are dual. I know a lot of Americans personally, and I don't look down on them. Perhaps it's more of the big brother/little brother feeling rather than looking down on Americans. We have 1/10 the population, our trade economy, military security, etc. is dependent upon the US, and many Canadians go back and forth across the border very frequently. 

Regarding the difference/similarity between Canada and the US, one American comedian apparently stated something like, "Imagine you were transported to a land that, on the surface, looked just like the US, except when you really looked closely, everything was just a little bit "off." Canada's McDonalds have a different menu, our WalMart and Costco have different products. Even the cars on the road, while having similar makes, have vastly different models. All the road signs are different, and we use km instead of miles/hour. 

Then there is our money. It's colourful. It has the Queen on many forms of it. We have a prime minister. We don't say "Zee" for the letter z.

 

 

I remember listening to Canadian radio (while in Canada) talking about getting Canadians to list Canadian stars, military generals, etc and they kept listing American ones. This was Canadian broadcasters talking to Canadians asking the Canadian population at large. No Americans were involved. Well, I suppose Hollywood was unintentionally involved. I can understand some frustration about constantly being overshadowed.

 

I will say that Walmart and Costco in Georgia have different products than the ones in Alaska. My in laws also love Canadian Tire. Lol 

[SKL]

5 minutes ago, parent said:

There is a serious problem with the lack of geography taught in schools.  

And see, my kids know where Canada is because they've been there, infecting it with American ugliness ....  😛

[Sneezyone]

11 minutes ago, wintermom said:

It would be nice to be recognized as being our own country.  Especially when bunched together with the US, when it seems like a lot of Americans don't even know where Canada is. There is a giant "ocean" between a map of the 48 states and Alaska. Some Americans think it's water, some aren't sure what it is. 😂

 

I don't know anyone who doesn't know where Canada is or that it's its own country. Canada and Mexico are probably the most recognizable countries to Americans.

[wintermom]

3 minutes ago, frogger said:

 

 

I remember listening to Canadian radio (while in Canada) talking about getting Canadians to list Canadian stars, military generals, etc and they kept listing American ones. This was Canadian broadcasters talking to Canadians asking the Canadian population at large. No Americans were involved. Well, I suppose Hollywood was unintentionally involved. I can understand some frustration about constantly being overshadowed.

 

I will say that Walmart and Costco in Georgia have different products than the ones in Alaska. My in laws also love Canadian Tire. Lol 

It can easily get confusing for Canadians, as we do have so much media, products, etc. from the US. And growing up with all this happening, we don't necessarily know as children what is particularly Canadian or American. It can take some time to discover what is distinctly Canadian. Even things as simple as spelling common words, like colour and centre, and saying the alphabet (the letter z = "zed"), there are differences. 

 

[LLucy]

Hi, I am another poster who doesn't usually venture an opinion but feels on safer ground recommending resources.  For people who are interested in world cultures, and stereotypes, The Great Courses has a short lecture series called Customs of the World: Using Cultural Intelligence to Adapt, Wherever You Are. I think its intended audience is people who do business internationally, but we really enjoyed it as part of a high school geography credit.

--LL

[wintermom]

 

3 minutes ago, Arctic Mama said:

Meh, I’m done.  I wanted to explain why it was bothering me and try to understand why everyone else was jumping on the bandwagon.  Question answered, I’m done and said my piece. Carry on.

That is a shame. There seem to be a lot of kind and generous people on this forum, more than willing to support and listen to you.

[frogger]

20 minutes ago, wintermom said:

It can easily get confusing for Canadians, as we do have so much media, products, etc. from the US. And growing up with all this happening, we don't necessarily know as children what is particularly Canadian or American. It can take some time to discover what is distinctly Canadian. Even things as simple as spelling common words, like colour and centre, and saying the alphabet (the letter z = "zed"), there are differences. 

 

Oh, I know there are differences and I don't blame you for wanting your own culture and identity. I just found it interesting.  The cultural difference between my Alaskan ways and a Southerner's ways (language, dress, mannerisms, food)  are simply more extreme than my differences with Western Canada's.  That is all. 

 

ETA It was really baffling to my children when traveling to the lower 48 when there appeared to be no difference other than km signs and money when we traveled in a different country but things were continually more different when we were back in our country.

Edited January 16, 2020 by frogger
differences (other than km and money) when we crossed the border to a different country but then things became stranger and stranger to them when we were in

[Xahm]

1 hour ago, debinindy said:

 

How would it go over here if one said:

Every American on this board uses their talking to non-Americans manners on here.

Or if post #1 replaced American with any other country/culture of choice?  And people responded frankly and honestly.

I find the discussion quite interesting, but I do see why it may rankle some.

When I lived and taught in Russia I absolutely used my "talking to Russian" manners. My students would constantly ask for my thoughts on Russian and US politics, on certain historical events, on religion, etc.  I got great at ducking questions, haha, but also at answering in ways that were true but sensitive to their ears, especially in a classroom setting. (Not even getting to those topics it would have been illegal to discuss.) There were a few times, with people I'd gotten to know well, when I answered honestly questions like "what do Americans really think of Russians"? Or even "what do you think about *insert political topic*, really." Only in very small groups, when I knew people really well, would I say "do you want me to talk to you about Russia like you aren't a Russian, or should I be polite?" I only made that offer a handful of times, and at least one of those times, the answer was, "please be polite."

[MEmama]

17 minutes ago, wintermom said:

It can easily get confusing for Canadians, as we do have so much media, products, etc. from the US. And growing up with all this happening, we don't necessarily know as children what is particularly Canadian or American. It can take some time to discover what is distinctly Canadian. Even things as simple as spelling common words, like colour and centre, and saying the alphabet (the letter z = "zed"), there are differences. 

 

Yup. I felt super bad for the kids in my sons grade one class (in Canada) who were read American Thanksgiving books about pilgrims and so forth. When I asked the teacher why, she told me flat out the history of the two countries is exactly the same.  SMH. I'm not sure why I didn’t pull him out that very day. Lol

[Paige]

7 minutes ago, Arctic Mama said:

Meh, I’m done.  I wanted to explain why it was bothering me and try to understand why everyone else was jumping on the bandwagon.  Question answered, I’m done and said my piece. Carry on.

I think I understand your point. I believe if anyone asked a polite group of Americans to list stereotypes we had of Mexican or Chinese immigrants and tourists, we'd clam up. We would not want to repeat them in polite company even if asked. A certain segment of the population may go ahead, but most people would feel uncomfortable and not want to be seen as part of that.

When it's turned onto us, however, the difference may be about power. It's ok to tease and kick the big guy, but so cheap and tacky to do the same to the less powerful. I can see why you feel uncomfortable with the topic but can understand why many, especially non-Americans- feel it is so different. I could be wrong, but I suspect the Australians would be less forthcoming about typical stereotypes about Sri Lankans. 

 

[wintermom]

2 minutes ago, Arctic Mama said:

???? I agree.  I’m not done with *the forum*, I meant I’d given my opinion on the discussion and felt I explained sufficiently why it was getting my dander up.  But I don’t need to belabor the point or change anyone’s mind, and I can see how I was hearing stereotype very negatively and others were not.  So...? I’m moving on to other forum discussions and anyone who wants to continue discussing this can without me dropping in with my hypersensitive American sensibilities 😉

We all have hypersensitivities toward ourselves and the things we hold dear to us. You are not alone, and it's perfectly understandable. 

[Matryoshka]

10 hours ago, Laura Corin said:

It was probably a dastardly grey rather than a virtuous red squirrel.

I've just been reading along but have to jump in and opine that of the two sorts it's the red squirrels that are the villains.   Sure, there are more gray squirrels and they are bigger and not as cute, but they pretty much limit their annoying behaviors, like raiding the birdfeeder, to the great out-of-doors. I'm not even sure what it is they do that's annoying other than that, which is honestly a very minor annoyance.  I've never had a squirrel of either sort bother my garden - that's the woodchucks and bunnies and deer.   Red squirrels may be a bundle of cuteness, but they gnaw and nibble their way into your house and outbuildings and then gnaw and nibble and poo all over the insides of your house and insulation and wiring and all the stuff you have stored in your attic and garage...    Red squirrels are real stinkers.

We've also had flying squirrels get into the house.  That was... interesting.  Gray squirrels tend to stay where they belong, chittering at us from the treetops.

[Pen]

2 hours ago, annegables said:

I only got to this part of the thread, but based on the number of torn jeans, skinny jeans, crop tops, and sneakers, etc I saw in Paris (and all over France) worn by French people and other Europeans, I find this fascinating. Maybe it was designer torn jeans and therefore fancier? I wore skirts the whole time. My DH who grew up in Europe, commented on how much more casual the dress had become since the 80s. 

We could spot US men because they were dressed in polo shirts and khakis, all looser. Almost without fail. Skinny jeans and tighter shirts were for Europeans. 

 

Stereotype: a tour group in baggy Bermuda shorts and loose T-shirts with plastic designs or writing on them, sneakers, maybe sunglasses and baseball cap. 

[mom2scouts]

1 hour ago, Selkie said:

Yep, white sneakers are very popular on the college campus where my boys attend.

Really? I live in a community with a large university and I can't even remember the last time I saw someone wearing white sneakers. The only person I know who wears them regularly is my elderly mom.

[Laura Corin]

2 minutes ago, Matryoshka said:

I've just been reading along but have to jump in and opine that of the two sorts it's the red squirrels that are the villains.   Sure, there are more gray squirrels and they are bigger and not as cute, but they pretty much limit their annoying behaviors, like raiding the birdfeeder, to the great out-of-doors. I'm not even sure what it is they do that's annoying other than that, which is honestly a very minor annoyance.  I've never had a squirrel of either sort bother my garden - that's the woodchucks and bunnies and deer.   Red squirrels may be a bundle of cuteness, but they gnaw and nibble their way into your house and outbuildings and then gnaw and nibble and poo all over the insides of your house and insulation and wiring and all the stuff you have stored in your attic and garage...    Red squirrels are real stinkers.

We've also had flying squirrels get into the house.  That was... interesting.  Gray squirrels tend to stay where they belong, chittering at us from the treetops.

Here the greys are not native. They are larger and out-compete the reds. They also carry a virus that is harmless to them and fatal to reds.

[Frances]

1 hour ago, frogger said:

 

 

I had a group of Russians laughing at my clothes before but that was in America and I took it in stride and ended up joking with them. Yes, they were laughing at me not with me but really it didn't bother me. I do come from the worst dressed city in America according to some magazine (I forget which).  

The Canadian comments are also interesting. Wintermom (I think you were the one who said an American could never fit in with Canadians), may I ask what part of Canada you are from. I'm going to assume back east. In talking to western Canadians, I would think that they have more in common with Alaskans than with people in Quebec. I was asked by a Canadian in Alberta if I felt more Candian than American.  My high school pal married a Canadian, Canadians lived with us in camp and built our cabin (in the bush), we don't have football teams at our colleges just hockey ( well and other less popular to watch sports).  I do find that attending museums and other things in Canada is easier for me because the crowds are more polite so we fit in better than in the cities of the contenental US.  Really we get along great with each other out west. 

 

These aren't sterotypes. Just personal observations.

I agree. As someone who lives in the PNW and travels to Canada fairly regularly, most western Canadians I encounter seem to feel a real affinity with those of us from the PNW, as we do them. 

[SKL]

Speaking of squirrels, why is it that the ones in my parents' neck of the woods are almost all black now?  Always used to be gray.  Fascinating!

(I don't like squirrels kuz I have known squirrels who (a) pooped on my when I was reading under a tree, (b) snuck into my basement / attic and made messes, and (c) ate food left out for non-rodents.  I do realize it is probably unreasonably of me to stereotype all squirrels based on a few bad experiences.  But too bad.)

[wintermom]

2 hours ago, frogger said:

 

 

I had a group of Russians laughing at my clothes before but that was in America and I took it in stride and ended up joking with them. Yes, they were laughing at me not with me but really it didn't bother me. I do come from the worst dressed city in America according to some magazine (I forget which).  

The Canadian comments are also interesting. Wintermom (I think you were the one who said an American could never fit in with Canadians), may I ask what part of Canada you are from. I'm going to assume back east. In talking to western Canadians, I would think that they have more in common with Alaskans than with people in Quebec. I was asked by a Canadian in Alberta if I felt more Candian than American.  My high school pal married a Canadian, Canadians lived with us in camp and built our cabin (in the bush), we don't have football teams at our colleges just hockey ( well and other less popular to watch sports).  I do find that attending museums and other things in Canada is easier for me because the crowds are more polite so we fit in better than in the cities of the contenental US.  Really we get along great with each other out west. 

 

These aren't sterotypes. Just personal observations.

No, it wasn't me. I'm married to an American and we both live in Canada. I was born and raised in Alberta, but my dh and I live in Ontario now. I discovered that this is NOT "back east." East is the maritimes. Ontario is the "evil" province that turns the tide of federal politics, and is generally disliked (or at least dis-trusted) by the rest of Canada (I think). Who really knows anymore. 😉

I'm not sure what you mean by "an American could never fit in with Canadians." Maybe you could explain. 

Edited January 16, 2020 by wintermom

[Matryoshka]

17 minutes ago, Laura Corin said:

Here the greys are not native. They are larger and out-compete the reds. They also carry a virus that is harmless to them and fatal to reds.

Ah, but those are European red squirrels with those cute tufty ears.  American red squirrels are a whole 'nother thing.  I talk of the latter.  Says Wikipedia: American red squirrels should not be confused with Eurasian red squirrels (Sciurus vulgaris); since the ranges of these species do not overlap, they are both commonly referred to as "red squirrels" in the areas where they are native. These are ours:

Invasive, non-native species are always a huge problem.  Like, starlings and English 'sparrows' are invasive and over-compete native birds in the US, but aren't a problem over on your side of the pond. But our native red squirrels are invasive in a different way!  And if you don't like our gray variety, be glad we haven't exported the red ones! 🙃

Edited January 16, 2020 by Matryoshka

[wintermom]

1 minute ago, Matryoshka said:

Ah, but those are European red squirrels with those cute tufty ears.  American red squirrels are a whole 'nother thing.  I talk of the latter.  These little stinkers:

Invasive, non-native species are always a huge problem.  Like, starlings and English 'sparrows' are invasive and over-compete native birds in the US, but aren't a problem over on your side of the pond. But our native red squirrels are invasive in a different way!

Is this a photo of squirrels found in mountain areas? I saw some in the Canadian Rockies. They were so different than the red squirrel we have in Ontario. We also have grey and black squirrels. I believe the blacks are simply a colour variation of the greys. 

The reds here are smaller and much faster than the greys and blacks. They are cute and they can be pretty noisy in forests. Their "yelling" at intruders in their woods sounds really cute. I feel like saying, "You sound so cute when you're mad."  I'm sure that would make them even more furious. 😉

[annegables]

28 minutes ago, Pen said:

 

Stereotype: a tour group in baggy Bermuda shorts and loose T-shirts with plastic designs or writing on them, sneakers, maybe sunglasses and baseball cap. 

Perhaps it is because we went not in summer but still nice out, but I never saw this anywhere in France. Not that I doubt this exists🤣. I was rather surprised at the polo shirt thing. It was very much a middle-aged American or Asian male thing. In fact, my DH, who speaks perfect French, was spoken to in English while I, who knows no Frecnch, was spoken to in French by shopkeepers because I didnt dress as "American". And this might be why some Americans might be seen as rude in European shops by not greeting the proprietor. I didnt greet them because I dont know the language much at all, and didnt want to be seen as an assuming American tourist who expects everyone to speak English.🤣

What was also interesting and relevant to this discussion was that we stayed in an airbnb in the Paris suburbs and my kids played at the local park with French kids. Many of the French kids had never met an AMerican child before and they asked my kids loads of questions, which seemed to be based off of assumptions from Am movies. Nope, we all dont live in big houses with dogs!

Edited January 16, 2020 by annegables
more info

[Matryoshka]

7 minutes ago, wintermom said:

Is this a photo of squirrels found in mountain areas? I saw some in the Canadian Rockies. They were so different than the red squirrel we have in Ontario. We also have grey and black squirrels. I believe the blacks are simply a colour variation of the greys. 

The reds here are smaller and much faster than the greys and blacks. They are cute and they can be pretty noisy in forests. Their "yelling" at intruders in their woods sounds really cute. I feel like saying, "You sound so cute when you're mad."  I'm sure that would make them even more furious. 😉

I live in New England.  Their range is fairly large, and does seem to include some mountains, but lots of flat places too.  They actually seem more widely distributed in Canada than the US.  But what other kind of red squirrel would you have in Ontario?  Should be the same kind as in the pic above; that's what we have here.  The wiki page does say there are subspecies, but I'm a lot closer to Ontario here than the Rockies...

 

Quote

The reds here are smaller and much faster than the greys and blacks. They are cute and they can be pretty noisy in forests. Their "yelling" at intruders in their woods sounds really cute. I feel like saying, "You sound so cute when you're mad."  I'm sure that would make them even more furious. 😉

Yes, this is true of the reds here too.  Smaller and more opinionated than the grays (but bigger than a chipmunk).

Edited January 16, 2020 by Matryoshka