nm

[Ann.without.an.e]

4 minutes ago, Janeway said:

Why do some people assume suggesting going to a counselor is an attack? I am trying to point out to Attolia that if she did not send her daughter to a counselor to attack her daughter, then why would she refuse to go? When someone is having a problem, those closest to them can benefit by getting help too. When my son has Aspergers (which he does) then I go to someone for me to get help in what I can do. I see nothing wrong with that. I love my son. I want to do what is right by him. I am not weak or attacking myself for going. Suggesting seeing a counselor is not an attack.

 

I am not upset that you are asking me to go to a counselor.  It is just the reasons are invalid.  You have totally misread my posts.  I am NOT NOT NOT pushing college on my dd.  Period.

My original question was "So what does a mom do to support, lead, and help her think through and process these desires?  What can I do that doesn't squash her dreams and supports them but makes sure this is a decent direction?  I won't lie, this had led to some anxious thoughts on my part.  I have had to step back and trust God with dd in this area."

WHAT DO I DO TO SUPPORT HER DREAMS AND NOT SQUASH THEM?!?!?!?  How much clearer can I be?  Geesh. 

[Guest]

19 hours ago, FuzzyCatz said:

I do think society and college marketing materials and teen peers spread this notion that those deemed traditionally brilliant by the hoop jumping required at rigorous B&M schools and a narrow test like the ACT need to walk down a very  particular path to use their gifts and be successful and they owe it to the world to solve the worlds problems blah blah.  

I just think that is so far from actually true.  There really are academically gifted folks in every CC and directional college and in blue collar jobs.  Having my kid who is a lot like OP's kid academically attend a 60% pell grant urban public CC through dual enrollment was a huge eye opener.  I don't think you can pigeon hole people.  Everyone has their own story.  And my similar kid is having a fantastic experience at a state flagship where he has found no shortage of nerdy high achieving academically minded peers.  

I have 2 grandmothers and a mother who are obviously brilliant but never attended college.  They all found opportunities and worked and were life long learners.   I am first gen female college grad.   None had the family support or finances to attend college.  There are many reasons why someone might not want or be able to pursue higher education or pursue it on a different time table or in an unconventional format.  

This. My DD feels a lot of pressure to make the world a better place, save the world, etc, and I think a lot of it is because she is percieved as being just so gifted that she gets the message that this is her God ordained role, a responsibility given to her before birth that she didn't choose, but just had handed to her. Going to the CC and seeing the paths that different people have taken and mistakes they've made has reduced her anxiety a bit, and after attending an ultra-competitive, just for brilliant kids summer program, is mostly looking at state U's where her grades/scores put her in the automatic admissions realm, she doesn't have to write a lot of essays and sell herself to them, and where she knows she can graduate with little or no debt. 

 

I spent years hearing that I was too smart to teach, and certainly to be a SAHM, even though there was nothing I wanted more in the world than to be with kids and to be a mom. I occasionally still get people who make comments that I'm "wasted" as a (mostly) SAHM/homeschooler/part time teacher/tutor. And I think it is a lot harder on kids now, especially those who really do want to be a wife and mother first.

 

And, OP, I think the most important message you can send is that God will use her gifts where ever she ends up, and that nothing that is right and good is displeasing to him. Raising organic plants, being a mother, raising children, working at Starbucks, writing, etc are all as valid as being a brain surgeon or astrophysicist or college professor. 

 

Edited December 29, 2019 by dmmetler

[BlsdMama]

On 12/27/2019 at 3:10 PM, Attolia said:

The last few months have been a massive amount of change for us.  If you remember, I brought dd home from a rigorous private day school (where she was on a full ride merit scholarship) to homeschool her because of health. We have sorted through the health stuff and have it mostly resolved (yay!). She has zero desire to go back to b&m school.  In fact, I spent hours and hours prepping syllabi for AP classes and she has no interest in continuing these classes.  She wants out of academics (she's been making comments about this for like 2-3 years).  She loves to learn but hates the institutional academic trap (her words). She is already being recruited by the school older dd is at (top ten university) and has already been offered scholarships to schools.  She has a stacked, stacked resume with tons of writing awards (nationally and regionally) and a bazillion achievements and easily got a 35 on her first time through on the ACT with no prep.  

BUT, dd doesn't want to go to college. Period.  The idea or thought of it induces anxiety.  She wants to farm/homestead/write/be a wife and mom.  This has always been her dream, to be honest. When I took her to a therapist to sort out leaving school, etc. the therapist asked her "if you could do anything without limits of money or education, what would you do?" and that was exactly what she said (farm, homestead, write). She wants to drop Calculus and take business finance.  She wants to start a small organic farm on our land and homestead/farm/start a website.  She has big plans.  Very large ideas that will either work amazingly or fail completely. 

She does sometimes panic that this path will lead to regret but overall she is happy and healthy when she is business planning and farming mode and sad and depressed when she thinks maybe she has to conform and go to college.  The cycle has been difficult. 

So what does a mom do to support, lead, and help her think through and process these desires?  What can I do that doesn't squash her dreams and supports them but makes sure this is a decent direction?  I won't lie, this had led to some anxious thoughts on my part.  I have had to step back and trust God with dd in this area.  

 

ETA ~ DD is not driven by materialism.  We joke that she belongs in another century.  I have to beg her to get a new pair of jeans, she has no desire for the finer things of life and requires very little financially.  She is the type that would rather be poor and do what she loves as opposed to hate her life but have material gain.

Attola,

I'd say this - your daughter is an extreme high achiever.  I can understand why her choosing NOT to pursue college is unsettling.  That said, I think perhaps an apprenticeship at a place like what she is thinking of might be a great idea?  Seed Savers?  

There is another option out there that she might consider?  The University of Iowa is reknown for its Masters program in both fiction and non-fiction creative writing, as well as poetry.  They offer several writing courses online for undergrads.  That said, the courses are not the same as sitting in the classroom.... However, while plenty of non-writing majors are taking these courses (so some very sub-par writing) the teachers are all in the masters program.  They are a gifted and invested lot and they are willing to give heavily of their time and assistance to those students who show promise.  She could enroll and just take 1-2 courses at her leisure.  Obviously, if she did her entire degree online, it'd be relatively useless without following it up with a Masters, but it might be a way for her to continue on in academic classes and forward her goals.  I've found the criticism and format of the program beneficial to my writing.  

ETA: Oh, and if she decided to eventually attend IRL, we do have our share of farm boys. 😉 

Edited December 29, 2019 by BlsdMama

[PeterPan]

25 minutes ago, Janeway said:

Why do some people assume suggesting going to a counselor is an attack?

It was how you said it. I'm pretty edgy sometimes too. When I feel that way, I sometimes have to walk away from the keyboard. I get in trouble around here a lot, so me I'm always like ok what I said was probably enlightened (haha), but did I say it in a way they were ready to receive? I fail in that a lot. So yeah, if you want to know, that's what it was. I have no disagreement with advice to talk with the right level of person and get experienced counsel.

[PeterPan]

35 minutes ago, Attolia said:

this had led to some anxious thoughts on my part.

And, fwiw, my dd is 20, so I'm right there with you, feeling it. So I don't remember ages of people, but having btdt it becomes a bit more poignant. It's kind of an angsty stage, all this transition, because we're trying to help people who have to learn to help themselves and can no longer protect or make it perfect. It's really hard. 

Fwiw, I wouldn't expect it to be ONE THING. It would be nice if it were, but it might not be. It might be and and and. Sigh. Which means research. But what's great is we CAN do that. You can do 23andme testing for $69 and download the raw data and run it through engines. You can have explanations and treatment options people only DREAMED of before. 

So another tip of the day. If going to the doctor constantly is prohibitive, you know you can pay and run labs yourself? HealthcheckUSA is one. There might be more. I've used them multiple times. Like right now, my thyroid has gone up and down so much, I can't pay $99 to see my doc over and over just to ponder. I don't want exposed to all those germs either, lol. So I'll run labs again, update, and if something needs attention now I'll connect with my doctor. 

Maybe that's not the *proper* way to do it, but it's A way. You don't want to stop gathering data just because your practitioner (who is otherwise helpful, who got you like 95% of the way there!!) can't finish you out.

Nuts, if she has autoimmune stuff, has she looked for whether FOOD is triggering her anxiety? Some people with celiac (which is connected to autoimmune) find gluten ups their anxiety. You want to keep asking these questions.

Edited December 29, 2019 by PeterPan

[Ann.without.an.e]

8 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

And, fwiw, my dd is 20, so I'm right there with you, feeling it. So I don't remember ages of people, but having btdt it becomes a bit more poignant. It's kind of an angsty stage, all this transition, because we're trying to help people who have to learn to help themselves and can no longer protect or make it perfect. It's really hard. 

Fwiw, I wouldn't expect it to be ONE THING. It would be nice if it were, but it might not be. It might be and and and. Sigh. Which means research. But what's great is we CAN do that. You can do 23andme testing for $69 and download the raw data and run it through engines. You can have explanations and treatment options people only DREAMED of before. 

So another tip of the day. If going to the np constantly is prohibitive, you know you can pay and run labs yourself? HealthcheckUSA is one. There might be more. I've used them multiple times. Like right now, my thyroid has gone up and down so much, I can't pay $99 to see my doc over and over just to ponder. I don't want exposed to all those germs either, lol. So I'll run labs again, update, and if something needs attention now I'll connect with my doctor. 

Maybe that's not the *proper* way to do it, but it's A way. You don't want to stop gathering data just because your practitioner (who is otherwise helpful, who got you like 95% of the way there!!) can't finish you out.

Nuts, if she has autoimmune stuff, has she looked for whether FOOD is triggering her anxiety? Some people with celiac (which is connected to autoimmune) find gluten ups their anxiety. You want to keep asking these questions.

 

Thank you.  

As part of figuring out her health stuff we have removed dairy and gluten.  It turns out the heart racing out the roof, the breathing problems, etc have turned out to be a severe intolerance to caffeine. She had to cut coffee and then black tea and now she's realizing that even chocolate is a big no.  We didn't see that coming.  Her adrenals were so weird they thought she had a tumor.  Turns out she is just hyper sensitive to caffeine.  We know that dairy is a huge problem.  Gluten is suggested because of hashimotos so whether she can feel a difference or not I am encouraging her to stick with it.  

Edited December 29, 2019 by Attolia

[PeterPan]

3 minutes ago, Attolia said:

 

Thank you.  

As part of figuring out her health stuff we have removed dairy and gluten.  It turns out the heart racing out the roof, the breathing problems, etc have turned out to be a severe intolerance to caffeine. She had to cut coffee and then black tea and now she's realizing that even chocolate is a big no.  We didn't see that coming.  Her adrenals were so weird they thought she had a tumor.  Turns out she is just hyper sensitive to caffeine.  We know that dairy is a huge problem.  Gluten is suggested because of hashimotos so whether she can feel a difference or not I am encouraging her to stick with it.  

You really should run genetics. There are a couple other explanations there, because all those things are also heavy methyl donors. They'll also show some genetics for how she processes caffeine, sure. But there could be more to the story, and that more will connect to her mental health stuff.

What is the word on the street for how long she'd need to be off gluten to feel a difference? The irony is, if she doesn't get any improvement, then being off is just one more stressor in her life.

You know, you ought to take her on a Disney cruise. Ok, so I'm all about the cruising. But if she hasn't been relaxing, a cruise where they would cater to the GF and make that happen might be very relaxing, just the thing. And get her massages and just let her wind down.

Or take me. I've never been on a Disney cruise, so it's a dream, haha. My ds is not into characters, so that would be freakishly horrible to him to go. 

Other people can say, but sometimes it can kind of mess with their minds to be DIFFERENT, to feel defective, etc. You want to normalize her, normalize things, and definitely remove any restrictions that aren't making a difference. That would take data to drive that. I haven't done it to be helpful there. 

[PeterPan]

11 minutes ago, Attolia said:

It turns out the heart racing out the roof, the breathing problems, etc have turned out to be a severe intolerance to caffeine. She had to cut coffee and then black tea and now she's realizing that even chocolate is a big no.

If she's already hyper and you amp the heart up more with caffeine, yeah it would be freaky. Thyroid too high is going to take her heart rate up already. My resting heart rate, when I was at that TSH, was 15-20 bpm higher, RESTING in the morning, than it is at a more normal TSH.

Edited December 29, 2019 by PeterPan

[fairfarmhand]

By the way, my oldest dd did AP classes and my second dd did dual enrollment online. The pressure from my oldest's AP was ridiculous. And it was all that work (I found that AP didn't necessarily mean more depth, just more projects and papers) and you STILL had to take ONE Test to determine whether or not you got the college credit. Which was absurd. The Dual Enrollment online was still challenging for my second dd, but There were LOTS of grades and it was more of a balanced approach. She didn't have so much riding on a single grade. 

So if AP was a no go, DE might be much better. The nice thing about DE is that one can drop the class after a week or two if it seems to be too much.

[Pen]

16 hours ago, barnwife said:

I'm neither a commercial farmer nor organic. My life is rarely brutal.  I have seen lots of unprepared beginning organic farmers flame out, often losing a marriage and/or a ton of money in the process.  I've known several organic farmers back in the day who became quite successful.  I've had contact with aspiring farmers and tried to steer them to these successful farms to learn something.

I would never call it "empty talk", I don't know the child or mother, I will gladly give my opinion on the reasonableness of the info presented.  I'm not even sure which direction I'm steering?  Definitely against confusing the social media farming lifestyle image with profitable, production agriculture.  I don't think I'm steering for or against college, or for social media celebrity vs commercial farmer vs lifestyle services. 

If this child is 16, then my judgements might be too harsh.  Would you rather I be only positive?  Do you feel I should keep my negative concerns to myself? 

 

It sounded like you were angry or bitter and were reacting to something outside this thread.  

And I do think your judgment is too harsh.  Starting on a trail can lead in many directions.

I don’t think a 16yo needs a viable “business plan” for a permanent farm business.  

 

 

With a depressed /anxious / self critical child, I think having some trail of interest that isn’t self destructive or illegal is great.

 If she gets out of bed to go plant lettuce that’s a win, IMO.   If she gets enough for family salads, super.  If she manages to figure out how to sell some as well, fantastic. 

 

Maybe the part that sounded like  you resent unpaid internships is key?

But the farms I know with paid internships tend mostly to want far more abilities and experience and people have to start somewhere.    Not entirely.  Some kids like my son get paid to do something like buck hay as needed. Which certainly shows off the aspect of farming being physically difficult.  

As described, this  child doesn’t seem emotionally ready for a formal demanding job, or internship, paid or not.  

Something that would get her out and learning, perhaps finding mentors, seems like it would be a step forward.

 

 

eta: it might not be a step forward that ultimately leads to what she’s now thinking of doing...it might ...     or it might lead to a life path currently unimagined

 

Edited December 29, 2019 by Pen

[ktgrok]

2 hours ago, Janeway said:

You are upset enough over her choice to not go to college that you sent her to a counselor. But you have not considered going to one yourself. Why? I did look at some of the posts made here. You are so upset over her choice and so unwilling to accept it that you are looking for yet another counselor and putting her through medical testing and everything. You assume something must be wrong with her to not want to go to college and therefore, she needs to be fixed and you are focused on finding out what is wrong with her and fixing it. You have not stopped to consider that she is making a decision that is fine, nothing wrong with her. There is a ton in the media these days about how college is not what it used to be. And it is no longer a "litmus test" for employers. If you sent her to a counselor because you are convinced she is broken and only broken people go to counselors and she needs to be fixed, therefore, you refuse to go yourself, then you need to seriously think about that. And seeing a counselor to help work through this might help. 

There is a difference between a child that doesn't want to go to college and a child who might benefit or want what college can bring but doesn't feel able to go due to mental health issues. 

If the anxiety were not a factor, it sounds like the DD might want to go to school for something or other, maybe writing, maybe agriculture, who knows. But she can't go due to her anxiety, so treating that anxiety opens doors for her. She doesn't HAVE to go even if she deals with the anxiety, but at least then she CAN go if she wants to. 

[barnwife]

Pen, absolutely.  Doing physical work like haying is one of the best things anybody can do for their mental health.  Getting out a few days a week bright and early and doing something physically tiring, even if it's mostly mindless work like weeding, is good in so many ways.  A 120 pound 16 year old is capable of working hard when she's healthy.  I'm not suggesting she get a job on the kill floor, but a little bit of drudgery is a good experience to balance her aversion to academic drudgery.  The farms I know are always (at least in season) looking for willing workers, there's plenty of low skilled work available for someone who shows up.  And it's way easier than baling hay 99% of the time. 

Of course my judgement isn't "fair and accurate", I've never met mother or daughter, I'm just offering my presumptions of what could be going on (just like the medical advice here) and how I'd handle it.  Supporting the daughter to me means helping her to see the consequences of her decisions and offer some experience that she's lacking.  I didn't suggest she was arrogant, just inexperienced and naive, like most of us were at 16. 

Wanting to be an astronaut, and a ballerina, and a rock star is fine for a little kid, maybe not so much for a twelve year old.  I originally assumed we were talking about a brilliant 18 year old, who should be made aware of the reality of the world as she makes decisions about her life.  

[Scarlett]

How old is she?

[Ann.without.an.e]

23 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

How old is she?

 

She turned 17 this past fall.

[Scarlett]

16 minutes ago, Attolia said:

 

She turned 17 this past fall.

Oh ok.  I was beginning to think she was like 14 the way some were talking.....17 is young though. I wouldn’t worry too much about her future.  Most people change their minds, especially if they feel free to do so, at least once between ages 17 and 25. 
 

and I haven’t read the health info on this thread closely but her anxiety could very easily be directly related to something physical.

[Scarlett]

Dss18 never wanted to do anything except cook for a living.  Until he did it for about a year.  Now he is done with it.  He HATES restaurant life.  

[GoodGrief]

48 minutes ago, Attolia said:

 

She turned 17 this past fall.

Oh, somewhere in this thread I picked up that she was 16. Doesn't really change my answers but 17 is a little older :-)

[Carol in Cal.]

Something I vaguely recall is that in the high school section of TWTM, which I did not use, one idea was to have your child do a big, massive, complicated project of her choice, and report on it and such, to give project management skills, delve deep into an area of interest, and have a large body of work type accomplishment to cite in college applications and such.  I think that the farm would be a great idea for this in this particular situation, and entirely credible as a high school level project particularly if she reads up on truck farm methods or marketing, and takes business math, and maybe a small business start up class.  That might be a good way to position her gap year work, and it would enable her to pivot in another direction, back toward college, if necessary.

FWIW, I went to college a year early and it worked out fine for me; but a lot of people feel that that is too rough on kids and they crash and burn.  I think it's case by case and that you're wise to be reconsidering this path at this juncture.

Also, FYI, when my DD attended a local high school, they had an option to design your own one semester class available.  She applied for that her junior year, and was turned down--she wanted to write a book of poetry and they said that she should exhaust the available regular classes first--so she took extra English classes, one in creative writing and one in poetry--and then reapplied for her senior year.  This was a fantastic experience for her, and she ended up repeating it (which was not supposed to be possible, but they did it) to actually arrange for illustrations for and publish and market her book.  So in the end, when we visited colleges she had a bound, self-published book of poetry to give the admissions folks, which was darned impressive, at least at the more artistic schools.  So doing a project at the high school level is a thing at good high schools as well as in homeschooling.  Just saying.

[Lilaclady]

On 12/27/2019 at 4:42 PM, Attolia said:

 

I think she is in part simply burned out but also this is what she has always wanted to do.  I have considered extending high school a year to help her have a reprieve and regroup this year.  She is willing to learn.  

I think instead of extending high school, I will have her take a gap year and just focus on what she wants to do for a year with no academics. I will also make sure she does some job shadowing with people in the line of work and see if it is what she really wants to do. 

[PeterPan]

15 hours ago, barnwife said:

Doing physical work like haying is one of the best things anybody can do for their mental health.

On the other hand, if her thyroid is over treated, it may push her into adrenal fatigue. But sure just in general yeah. Just they have to get this thyroid meds straightened out.

[EmilyGF]

14 hours ago, Scarlett said:

Dss18 never wanted to do anything except cook for a living.  Until he did it for about a year.  Now he is done with it.  He HATES restaurant life.  

Our friend's son wanted to be a cook so they made him spend summers working in a restaurant. He did end up going to culinary school, but he went in with his eyes wide open. He now teaches elementary school, though.

I just spent an evening with a clearly brilliant woman whose mother wanted her to be a doctor. She said she spent 1.5 years at a private college working on her med school prereqs before deciding to fail the classes on purpose, because that was easier than standing up to her mother. (End of story - she ended up teaching high school English before later going to law school and now has her own practice. She worked as a paralegal before law school so she knew what she was going into.)

I love the idea of her working on a farm. 

[Scarlett]

36 minutes ago, EmilyGF said:

Our friend's son wanted to be a cook so they made him spend summers working in a restaurant. He did end up going to culinary school, but he went in with his eyes wide open. He now teaches elementary school, though.

I just spent an evening with a clearly brilliant woman whose mother wanted her to be a doctor. She said she spent 1.5 years at a private college working on her med school prereqs before deciding to fail the classes on purpose, because that was easier than standing up to her mother. (End of story - she ended up teaching high school English before later going to law school and now has her own practice. She worked as a paralegal before law school so she knew what she was going into.)

I love the idea of her working on a farm. 

We made dss get a job washing dishes at a resort when he was 17.  Their rules prohibited him from cooking there until he was 18.  Then 2 weeks before he was 18 he insisted on changing jobs and going to Panda Express.  He started out making $12.50 an hour and after 6 months he got AMAZING insurance. ($100 per month, no deductible).   But one month after he got insurance he was done. For one thing they were working him over 50 hours a week. But I suspect the biggest reason is he just realized that commercial cooking is not near as ‘fun’ as cooking a meal for your friends.  
 

Sigh.  He will figure it out.  He graduated in June and reached his goal of saving $10k by the end of the year.  So he has a little wiggle room. 
 

Oh and he did the DE at vo tec his junior senior year.  He loved that.  But that is far different from commercial restaurant life.  

Edited December 30, 2019 by Scarlett

[SKL]

Wish I didn't have mega deadlines and could read all of this.  I will try to do so later.

One of my kids has been falling apart recently.  (She has a Feb 3 appointment to be checked out - that is the earliest I could get.)  It is so hard to figure out what to do about each thing.  If this continues, it's hard to see a future for her.  And up until a few weeks ago, I would have said she has a great future.

This morning my kid was scheduled to go to a career day at the zoo.  Her dream is to work with polar bears.  So this is right up her alley, and up until last night, she was positive on it.  But over the past 12 hours she all but went catatonic.  I did finally get her out the door.  But this can't be how life is on a regular basis.

I guess the positive thing is that in the USA, our kids have so many valid choices if they can function at all.

[catz]

19 hours ago, Lilaclady said:

I think instead of extending high school, I will have her take a gap year and just focus on what she wants to do for a year with no academics. I will also make sure she does some job shadowing with people in the line of work and see if it is what she really wants to do. 

I have actually seen a not structured gap year backfire for anxious kids without a really clear and structured plan to be doing something reasonably productive and have it turn into a situation where the kid would withdraw further and lose ground on moving forward.  So I do think this is a delicate balance.  I think this can be fine, but I'd want to have my teen engaged out of the home in an interest area darn near full time.  If she weren't ready/willing/able doing some academics/DE/CC/online academics as well as some other enforced daily structure may be helpful to keep things rolling.  

Even as a somewhat anxious teen myself, I know it was HARDER to get momentum and get out of my own head if I had too much free time and I sometimes needed guidance on the executive function break down of things to keep things moving.  I think gifted kids can think 10,000 things at once and it can become paralyzing to move forward with something.  Summer on a farm sounds great though if you  can find something like that.  I do really agree that can help hone a path forward.  I think it's really easy for teens to idealize a particular path.  And it's possible other interests and opportunities will fall out of that.

And even for kids that go to college, it's just a step.  Plenty of people do a 360 career wise from their college degree path.  I have a brother with a degree in a very particular branch of science doing business/sales after working the science would for several years.  I have another friend who majored in music who is a financial adviser.  I know someone else with a degree in Psychology teaching violin lessons.  Nothing you do needs to be a lifelong commitment.  I have to remind my college freshman of this fact on a regular basis.  He wants to major in ALL the things.  I'm trying to keep him to "just" 2 majors.   Earn some money, open some doors, consider your next moves.  Explore and enjoy!  

[Pen]

On 12/29/2019 at 3:03 PM, Carol in Cal. said:

Something I vaguely recall is that in the high school section of TWTM, which I did not use, one idea was to have your child do a big, massive, complicated project of her choice, and report on it and such, to give project management skills, delve deep into an area of interest, and have a large body of work type accomplishment to cite in college applications and such.  I think that the farm would be a great idea for this in this particular situation, and entirely credible as a high school level project particularly if she reads up on truck farm methods or marketing, and takes business math, and maybe a small business start up class.  That might be a good way to position her gap year work, and it would enable her to pivot in another direction, back toward college, if necessary.

 

I think to make organic farming  a special project learning year sounds like good idea.  

To learn as much as possible in depth about a subject like this is useful in itself.

in addition physical exercise, time outdoors with plants, seems like it could help health and well being.  

 

[Ann.without.an.e]

Update in original post

[Corraleno]

11 minutes ago, Ann.without.an.e said:

Update in original post

Sounds like a great plan, I'm glad to hear she's so happy!

[Lori D.]

Hurray! What a great plan, and such passion! Go DD of Ann.without.an.e!

[Carol in Cal.]

54 minutes ago, Ann.without.an.e said:

Update in original post

Nice to see, great plan!

[Selkie]

That's a smart plan! Best of luck to her. I can totally empathize, because being stuck inside at a desk job would be so depressing for me - I need to be active and outdoors to be happy. Good for her for figuring out what she wants!

[Monica_in_Switzerland]

1 hour ago, Ann.without.an.e said:

Update in original post

 

What an interesting, amazing person you have raised.  I wish her the best of luck.  It takes guts to follow a dream!  

[mommyoffive]

Awww. I loved reading the update.  I wishing her all the luck in the world.  I am glad she is following her heart.  

[Guest]

It sounds like she has a good plan. I’m glad she’s figuring things out. 

[Pen]

On 12/27/2019 at 1:10 PM, Ann.without.an.e said:

UPDATE - Since this caused a pretty good bit of stir 😉. I thought I would update as to where we are almost 2 months later.

DD is starting a small farm.  She is passionate about this, has been since she was little.  She has researched, spent lots of time talking to small farmers at the market, looked into how to get started, etc.  She has some creative ideas too.  Some good friends of ours own the farm at the end of our street (they specialize in one spring/summer crop and then pumpkins in the fall). They are looking to hire dd to manage one of their farmer's markets three days a week, but they are also planning to buy what she sells and sell it under their name for now.  They want to do this as basically a paid internship so she can learn and also it will help her to have a place to sell her produce until she has a good grasp of how much to plant and how to market it.  She wants to expand into greenhouses over the next 2-3 years and hopefully will venture out on her own, under her own label, in the next 5 years.  I feel good about this.  She is happy, happy, happy.  She has been working out in the dirt most days while also planting seeds indoors.  She has zero anxiety about this plan. She feels like she will always regret it if she ends up in a desk job and lives with the question "what if I had pursued my passion?".  She wants to pursue it full time for the next few years and if it is falling flat by the time she is 26, she will return to school and pursue something different.  We have the land, her dad wants to help.  He is willing to fund a large greenhouse or two and some equipment in lieu of the money we would spend on college.  

We are in the ideal market.  We have land 30 minutes outside of a major city with a thriving health food and restaurant scene.  Local food is a big deal here.  If we were far from a major city, out in "farm country" then this might be a terrible idea.  She has talked to several small farmers who are doing exactly what she wants to do.

 

Awesome!!!

fantastic! Fabulous!  

I am so happy for both of you!!!

And thanks for updating!

Do update again as it progresses!

 

[ktgrok]

So glad for her!

Dirt is my drug of choice for anxiety/depression, so I totally get the need for it. Nothing helps me as much as getting outside and getting dirty, making things grow, etc. 

[Jaz]

What a wonderful update! I'm excited for her.

[Carol in Cal.]

4 hours ago, Ktgrok said:

So glad for her!

Dirt is my drug of choice for anxiety/depression, so I totally get the need for it. Nothing helps me as much as getting outside and getting dirty, making things grow, etc. 

I have actually seen evidence that something about getting skin contact with dirt has an antidepressant quality.  I think it was chalked up to enzymes in the soil or something like that.

[Pen]

https://www.gardeningknowhow.com/garden-how-to/soil-fertilizers/antidepressant-microbes-soil.htm

also sunlight and greenery are supposed to both help

[katilac]

Thanks for updating! That sounds like a wonderful way to spend a year or two or a lifetime. 

[Pen]

Since depression has been an issue maybe forewarnings that the path could have setbacks and difficulties, ups and Downs, will help her to take those in stride.  It’s inevitable that that will be the case.  In anything, but I think especially with farming where weather and other things play a role