Menu
Jump to content

What's with the ads?

CuriousMomof3

Homeschooling when the kid is ahead of the parent

Recommended Posts

We'll face this issue sooner rather than later, so I'm wondering what other parents have done.  How do you teach content that you don't know?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

At that point would it be teaching?  I'd think of it more as facilitating.
I have been the guide point for my kids many times with skills I don't have or did not wish to acquire.  I helped them find clubs and teachers that would work with them on a subject that they themselves were passionate about.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Different ways:

1) find mentors. Uusally, it's more that DD finds them and I facilitate getting her there. This is how most of science has worked since about age 9/10. Sometimes, it comes full circle. DD is more a Herpetology expert than I am, but when it comes to actually teaching content to kids, she often has ended up using me as a resource and support. 

2) being willing to listen, discuss, read,  buy materials, and provide support, but not actually teach. This happens a lot in humanities 

3) outsource the topic/subject. This is usually what we do when it's something that really needs an outside teacher and people to Discuss with, but isn't a passion subject that needs the intensity of a 1-1 mentor (like Spanish, where having a native speaker to talk with regularly is very helpful). 

 

Since she reached high school age (and college level content, even if it's not always a graded college class), it's pretty much 100% one of these three things. I could teach high school content, but not college content. But, at that point, the guidance counselor role also became a lot more prominent. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, CuriousMomof3 said:

How do you teach content that you don't know?

I learn it, which requires planning well ahead--like years ahead.

Edited by EKS
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
56 minutes ago, EKS said:

I learn it, which requires planning well ahead--like years ahead.


That is an admirable solution.  It is not going to work for us.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

For subjects that I have no chance of teaching, we outsource, so that's things like instrumental lessons and Korean lessons.

In all other areas, I've been the 'teacher', but for several years now I haven't really taught. We co-learn, which has worked really really well for us. We nut stuff out together and for my daughter, this works well. It means that at times we've had to pull out several textbooks on a topic to get a full understanding, or head to youtube or Khan Academy for some explanatory videos on something.

There's no way one person could be expected to know all content in all subjects for all grades forevermore anyway, so facilitating, co-learning and outsourcing need to happen.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm in that position with several subjects right now. DS10 and I are learning both Latin and Portuguese (barely) together. DS7 wants to learn Greek, so I facilitate (poorly) with him and find him supplemental materials that he can use himself.

My big problem right now is Python coding. Both DS7 & DS10 are using an online program called Code Combat. They are in the 2nd course, and I cannot help them any more than looking up the answers. I thought my father (retired computer guy) would be able to help them but, nope, he was a hardware guy and doesn't know enough coding to be helpful. So, we borrow as many books as we can from the library and I think I'm going to have to start sorting through youtube channels for them. I was hoping that they could take online courses (AoPS or similar), but that was before we hit a bit of a money crunch. I will see what happens once they finish all the levels of Code Combat if they want to take a 'real' course. I may get in touch with the local high schools to see if there is a student who might be able to help out.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
42 minutes ago, CuriousMomof3 said:

That is an admirable solution.  It is not going to work for us.

I wouldn't call it admirable.  You asked about teaching ("How do you teach content that you don't know?"), not homeschooling in general, and learning ahead is what needs to happen if you're going to be doing the teaching.  You can't teach something you do not know, and you cannot teach it properly if you are not actually well beyond whatever it is.  This goes against homeschooling myths #457 (that you don't need to know anything) and #458 (that if you actually do need to know something, you can learn it along with your kid).  

People who can't or don't want to learn ahead of their students should not be teaching.  And I think that most people realize this intuitively when they get to that point.  They end up outsourcing--either to a textbook, an online course, or a b&m course--and in doing so become a facilitator rather than a teacher.  There is nothing wrong with this and is, in fact, what should happen when the parent doesn't stay ahead of things.  

So my point is that you either learn ahead of your student or you outsource.  And if you outsource to a textbook, you need to make a plan for grading, because if you don't know it well yourself, you can't grade it.  Of course, you can use an answer key, but if your student is highly gifted, assignments that can be graded properly using an answer key will be totally inappropriate.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, EKS said:

I wouldn't call it admirable.  You asked about teaching ("How do you teach content that you don't know?"), not homeschooling in general, and learning ahead is what needs to happen if you're going to be doing the teaching.  You can't teach something you do not know, and you cannot teach it properly if you are not actually well beyond whatever it is.  This goes against homeschooling myths #457 (that you don't need to know anything) and #458 (that if you actually do need to know something, you can learn it along with your kid).  

People who can't or don't want to learn ahead of their students should not be teaching.  And I think that most people realize this intuitively when they get to that point.  They end up outsourcing--either to a textbook, an online course, or a b&m course--and in doing so become a facilitator rather than a teacher.  There is nothing wrong with this and is, in fact, what should happen when the parent doesn't stay ahead of things.  

So my point is that you either learn ahead of your student or you outsource.  And if you outsource to a textbook, you need to make a plan for grading, because if you don't know it well yourself, you can't grade it.  Of course, you can use an answer key, but if your student is highly gifted, assignments that can be graded properly using an answer key will be totally inappropriate.

RE the bold - for us, this actually has worked really well. The process of problem-solving and discussion and sharing ideas and researching together has all worked a treat for us.

I guess it depends on both the type of learner and the type of adult, and also the dynamic between the two?

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Right now, we definitely learn content that neither of us know, but where we're sort of starting in the same place, and that works fine.  So, we can read about Egyptian gods together, or whatever.  I imagine that we could tackle a new foreign language together.  Because we'd both start at the beginning, and hopefully, I'd keep up.

But what I'm thinking about is more situations where the adult doesn't have the skills or knowledge to access the material that the child is learning.  Our plan right now is that DH will take over as the parent at home, and I'll go back to work in about 18 months when he becomes eligible for retirement with a pension.  There are lots of reasons why this makes sense, but from a homeschooling perspective it will be challenging, because academics are not my husband's strong suit.   So, I'm looking for other options.  Unfortunately, anything that involves physically going somewhere, is probably out.  We have a math tutor that comes to us right now, and that works well, but it's pricey, so not an option for other subjects.  Outsourcing to a text book seems like it would get boring.  Do people use a lot of online classes?

Or maybe we're a rarity with a kid who is far smarter than the parents, and other people don't face the same issues. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Learning ahead of the student, writing my own tests, leading discussions where I can contribute substantially are the only ways that I know of where I can teach advanced content to my kid. I spend way more time reading multiple books, writing notes, writing tests etc than other things that I do, which is probably not feasible in many households.

In your case, I think that the best option is to find online classes which have subject matter experts to teach and answer questions, grade papers, write comments and give you a transcript. There are many here who can point you to great providers of online courses. This might look like facilitating rather than teaching but that is what happens commonly at higher grade levels when the subjects get advanced and most parents cannot provide teaching in all the areas. I would have suggested DE in your local CC but you said that physically going out is not possible, so it is best to look ahead for online providers starting now so that you have options lined up when the need arises.

Edited by mathnerd
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, mathnerd said:

Learning ahead of the student, writing my own tests, leading discussions where I can contribute substantially are the only ways that I know of where I can teach advanced content to my kid. I spend way more time reading multiple books, writing notes, writing tests etc that is probably not feasible in many households.

In your case, I think that the best option is to find online classes which have subject matter experts to teach and answer questions, grade papers, write comments and give you a transcript. There are many here who can point you to great providers of online courses. This might look like facilitating rather than teaching but that is what happens commonly at higher grade levels when the subjects get advanced and most parents cannot provide teaching in all the areas. I would have suggested DE in your local CC but you said that physically going out is not possible, so it is best to look ahead for online providers starting now so that you have options lined up when the need arises.

 

Are there online providers that people suggest?  We'd need one that was flexible with attendance, and comfortable with disability accommodations. 

DE isn't an option, partially because of the going out issue, but also he's, in my opinion, too young, so even online DE isn't a great fit.  At this point, we need high school level content, but will need college level sooner rather than later.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
41 minutes ago, chocolate-chip chooky said:

RE the bold - for us, this actually has worked really well. The process of problem-solving and discussion and sharing ideas and researching together has all worked a treat for us.

I guess it depends on both the type of learner and the type of adult, and also the dynamic between the two?

I think that it is possible to do this to some extent at the lower levels though I think that teaching even basic arithmetic benefits from a wider perspective.  But when you get into advanced high school level work (really, college level), it gets much harder to work this way (and everyone's limit is going to be different--lots of people will top out far earlier).   One problem is that you don't know what you don't know, and you don't know what is important down the line.  So, for example, my math tops out at beginning calculus, so I am able to tell my Algebra 1 and 2 students that something will be important later on or to emphasize it or whatever, but when I have attempted to teach trig and calculus, the experience is much more procedural, less nuanced, there is less appreciation for the discipline, and I can't connect things to future learning.  My student got an A in both classes (from an outside provider who wasn't teaching but was grading--long story), but I know that his experience could have been so much better.

I actually ended up getting a master's degree in (interdisciplinary) humanities a few years ago, and it was astounding how much the knowledge I gained doing that has spilled over into my teaching.  Night and day.  And prior to that I had thought that I had been doing pretty well learning humanities stuff along with my kids.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, CuriousMomof3 said:

Or maybe we're a rarity with a kid who is far smarter than the parents, and other people don't face the same issues. 

This made me smile. 🙂 

If your husband has no interest in learning something academic, I would recommend discussion-based content.  I am currently watching Econmovies with my ds (super fun short economics based on movies). We stop a lot and discuss because I can add even more nuance.  I am also currently reading and discussing a book on leadership.  The 48 power laws, which is about how people manipulate you to their will.  My husband and I can talk about people we know who have used these techniques on us, and how we can use some of them for manipulating people in a good way. This kind of discussion is something you just won't get from a textbook or from an online class.  Discussion topics like these would allow your dh to share *wisdom* and *experience* rather than knowledge. We have found it to be an incredibly important piece of the puzzle to advancing our gifted children in areas where wisdom, experience, and *nuance* are important.  

Ruth in NZ

  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, lewelma said:

This made me smile. 🙂 

If your husband has no interest in learning something academic,

I wouldn't say he has no interest, he's just not very good at it.  He's an amazing father, and very very good at his job, but academics have always been hard for him.  Add to that that it's been like 23 years since he finished high school, and he doesn't remember a lot.   

3 hours ago, lewelma said:

 

I would recommend discussion-based content.  I am currently watching Econmovies with my ds (super fun short economics based on movies). We stop a lot and discuss because I can add even more nuance.  I am also currently reading and discussing a book on leadership.  The 48 power laws, which is about how people manipulate you to their will.  My husband and I can talk about people we know who have used these techniques on us, and how we can use some of them for manipulating people in a good way. This kind of discussion is something you just won't get from a textbook or from an online class.  Discussion topics like these would allow your dh to share *wisdom* and *experience* rather than knowledge. We have found it to be an incredibly important piece of the puzzle to advancing our gifted children in areas where wisdom, experience, and *nuance* are important.  

Ruth in NZ


I think that's a great reminder of some things they can do together, but if my DH is the one at home, he'll need to do most or all of the homeschooling other than math, or provide support so DS2 can participate in some kind of online class.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Curiousmom, it sounds like you want an online solution.  So far I have heard (thought this may not be exactly what you said or mean):

1) Co-learning: Learning with the child is out

2) Teaching: Learning ahead of the child is out 

3) B&M school is out: no travel

4) Tutors are out: expensive

5) Textbooks are out: boring

This is why I suggested taking courses where experience and wisdom are critical things to mastering the content. Then your dh can actually teach, because the knowledge required is from his life experience. 

For me personally, online solutions are not why I homeschool. So with the exception of AoPS courses, we have done homeschooling at home as a family.

I did the following with my older:

       Taught: English

       Co-learned: Chemistry, Physics, Economics, History, Philosophy

        Facilitated: Math, Contemporary World Problems, Government, Biology

       Online outsourced: Math

       Tutor outsourced:  Violin, Mandarin

       Extracurriculars: Quartet, Badminton

With my younger, the balance is different

      Taught: Remedial English, Advanced Composition, Math, Physics, Chemistry (sciences learned with older)

      Co-learned: Cultural Geography, Physical Geography, Economics, History, 

      Facilitated: Literature      (My ds is unable to work independently yet)

      Online outsourced: None     (my ds has been unable to write, so could not take online courses)

      Tutor outsourced: Violin, Drama 

       Extracurriculars: Quartet, Badminton, Swimming, multi-sport, Games night, the gym, Gymnastics

I think that the variety was what kept schooling fun and rigorous here. But every child has their own needs as you can see from the 2 plans described above.  I would not, however, suggest a diet of only online courses. Why don't you make up a list like the ones above, and figure out what your dh can teach, co-learn, or facilitate; and then decide how much you want to spend to outsource. Then you will have a plan.

Ruth in NZ

Edited by lewelma
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, EKS said:

 This goes against homeschooling myths ... #458 (that if you actually do need to know something, you can learn it along with your kid).  

Going to have to completely disagree with you here.  Co-learning has been my most powerful tool in developing critical thinking in both my boys. 

Edited by lewelma
  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, EKS said:

But when you get into advanced high school level work (really, college level), it gets much harder to work this way (and everyone's limit is going to be different--lots of people will top out far earlier).   One problem is that you don't know what you don't know, and you don't know what is important down the line. 


Totally not helping the OP (so please ignore), but I went looking for my post from all those years ago about when I helped my ds get into the IMO camp.  I think that I co-learn to help my kids with critical thinking and problem solving, but I think I *teach* when the content is more factual/conceptual. So in the following situation, ds needed to learn problem solving, not content. So the co-learning technique was key.

X-post from 2013!! Boy was that a long time ago!

I told someone last week that I could only go through this process once because what I am giving my son is not a knowledgeable tutor, but rather a skilled learner who is at his exact level in math. If I ever go through this material again with a student, I would be much much more knowledgeable and I would loose the confusion that has been so critical in helping him battle through this material. What I am finding is that because I don't know the answers and I cannot teach him how to do it, I am instead teaching him how to learn problem solving -- what questions to ask, what answer to hunt for, how to compare problems, how to really interact with this material. No tutor who knows the material well could do this as well as I can, because once you have the knowledge, it would be virtually impossible to relive the confusion.

  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My kids all surpasse me at some pt, some younger than others. I am also going to completely disagree with EKS. We have been successful in graduating kids at high levels of achievement without me filling the role of stereotypical teacher. But our homeschool does not resemble a classroom school atmosphere and that is not how we approach learning. It is never a matter of me sitting and teaching. Our homeschool flows around conservations with lots of directed questioning. I can have conversations with them where I ask questions that require them to exemplify their understanding by explaining things to me and I can dig deeper with pointed questions when I dont understand or intuit that they dont understand. If questions can't be answered, we go searching for answers together.

I spend a significant amt of time searching for resources. We are mostly non-textbook for most subjects. Great Courses is one source we use quite frequently. (My ds who is in grad school completely surpassed me by 8th grade. We own every GC lecture on physics and astronomy that had been released then.) 

For some subjects we outsource (very few and not many online. There are only 4 online scenarios we have used that I can recommend, and only 3 without reservation: Connie's honors chem, ChemAdvantage, Ms. Denne's private Skype Russian tutoring, and AoPS (with reservation bc the approach and pace is not for all students.) For classes we cannot manage successfully at home (for us that has been math beyond cal and cal based physics up) my kids have DE at the local U.

But by far, finding resources and putting together courses designed specifically to challenge my kids' individual needs and interests has enabled successful mastery of subject matter. (Fwiw, I also dont approach learning as learn/test/learn/test.  My kids rarely take tests in our homeschool.....only through courses I dont design myself bc I dont give tests. We talk. They research. They write papers. They work problem sets. We stay on topic to mastery.)

Works here. 

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, lewelma said:

Going to have to completely disagree with you here.  Co-learning has been my most powerful tool in developing critical thinking in both my boys. 

I probably should have included the word just in there, as in if you actually do need to know something, you can just learn it along with your kid.  Yes, it can be done, but as the material gets more difficult, it becomes harder and harder to achieve.

Also, I agree that learning alongside a student can be a great way to explore new ground and that the things a student learns in the process can be extremely valuable.  But I was responding to the specific query "How do you teach content that you don't know?"  And learning together is not the same as teaching content.  You may be teaching (modeling) various skills, but you're not teaching content.  Instead, I'd categorize it as an advanced form of facilitation, if you want to keep the parent in a leadership role, but realistically it is more like the collaboration of peers.

Note that I'm not saying that collaboration with peers (or learning on one's own if the maturity to do that well is there) is a bad way to learn.  Quite the opposite, actually, since when one gets to the frontiers of knowledge, this is the only way learning takes place.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

At some point I had to step into the role I nicknamed cruise director and to cease being the live teacher.  When they were young I taught,  moved to learning beside in upper elementary/middle school but for each there was a point where they needed to learn on their own.  At first it was letting them be self paced because they needed to go at a speed through set curriculum that I had not intended at purchase.  I could monitor the output,  do what I considered to be quality checks.  But it was impossible for me to maintain the pace my kids moved at in fields I had never had a particular interest in.   Admitting that was probably one the best things I ever did for them.  My kids are close in age and do have similar abilities and interests so started working together a great deal.  We did have robust academic based conversation in our home with Dh fully engaged from a young age. They were fully monitored not just sent out on their own.  Essays were read etc.

In middle school we  slowly moved into our mooc phase without planning to.  I still taught the basics, bought the books but there were so many great things out there so............ Many mooc’s, many finished but many quit because they figured out what they were looking for quickly.  I actually spent many hours online searching for these mooc’s.  Doing the registration,  making sure they knew the class was running now.  When one starts looking at the mooc world you quickly discover that there are many graduate level classes out there,  some made my kids run but others they completed.  I had the philosophy that I never knew what they could do......both did a graduate level cryptology series quite young.  They did well enough for certificates but readily admitted there was much that their backgrounds weren’t robust enough for yet.  Dd once took a graduate level finance at an elite school all the way through........the Professor was doing a test on online viability and ran his live class completely simultaneous to the free mooc.  She did all the work and had one of the highest grades in the class......highest for the online if I remember right.  Professor was stunned when he learned she was 12 with essentially no background other than calc. and did it on her own.  Dh actually had the degree the class was part of from that school which is why she was signed up.....sort of a look at what dad did.  No dad help btw other than his work calculator was borrowed to check herself.

My kids never did traditional DE because the concept did not exist where we were living.  They both rejected online high school outsourcing because of the times the classes met.  They did do online University classes for credit at young ages.  

This approach did allow my kids to delve deeply into fields that interested them that they never really studied again and quit when they hit the level of mastery they wanted.  We made an attempt to document it via external exam when possible and they did do a number of cleps for credit. 

 

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, lewelma said:

Totally not helping the OP (so please ignore), but I went looking for my post from all those years ago about when I helped my ds get into the IMO camp.  I think that I co-learn to help my kids with critical thinking and problem solving, but I think I *teach* when the content is more factual/conceptual. So in the following situation, ds needed to learn problem solving, not content. So the co-learning technique was key.

X-post from 2013!! Boy was that a long time ago!

I told someone last week that I could only go through this process once because what I am giving my son is not a knowledgeable tutor, but rather a skilled learner who is at his exact level in math. If I ever go through this material again with a student, I would be much much more knowledgeable and I would loose the confusion that has been so critical in helping him battle through this material. What I am finding is that because I don't know the answers and I cannot teach him how to do it, I am instead teaching him how to learn problem solving -- what questions to ask, what answer to hunt for, how to compare problems, how to really interact with this material. No tutor who knows the material well could do this as well as I can, because once you have the knowledge, it would be virtually impossible to relive the confusion.

This is fascinating, and I totally agree. 

Problem solving is incredibly difficult to teach in a top down fashion because when you try to do so, you usually end up imposing a procedure onto something that is more complex and nuanced than a procedure can deal with.  This is why teaching that there is something called the "scientific method" is a crock, why all writing programs are terrible, and why most math textbooks are just glorified cookbooks. 

More generally, I have found that when it comes to advanced academics, content is just the tip of the iceberg, in that it moves from being an end in itself to becoming a vehicle for wrestling with ideas.  Wrestling with ideas is impossible to do authentically if the teacher already knows the "answer."  This is why those "discussion" questions that you find in instructor materials can be so awful, particularly if they helpfully provide a "suggested response."  If the parent is trying to get the student to conform to the suggestion, it is not a discussion at all, and neither is it when the parent already knows the "answer." 

An authentic discussion happens between/among equals, and it has been an absolute pleasure these past few years to finally have such discussions with my younger son (my older son left homeschooling before we got to to that point).  These discussions have been facilitated by the fact that the focus of our homeschool shifted from content to ideas.

Edited by EKS
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@CuriousMomof3, I think I know what you are saying, and I hope you find a program that works for you. I also hope, though, that your DH has a chance to teach DS the skills he has. They may not be calculus or whatever, but they are important. First, so your DS can respect the work his dad has done, but also because there are probably traits that he can apply to the material he is learning. I’m generalizing, but I’m thinking something as simple as just doing the job in front of you and doing it well. Also, they might have interesting discussions going forward, if they approach problems differently. I didn’t do well in the lecture part of university physics, figuring things out with formulae, but I kicked butt in labs!

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, EKS said:

This is fascinating, and I totally agree. 

Fascinating conversation. Hope OP doesn't mind, but I do love it when a thread creates a wonderful, some-what tangential conversation.

So I think we are just using the words differently.  I consider facilitation the minimum a homeschool parent can do for a subject.  I find the resources, make an annual plan, and monitor his work daily or weekly to make sure it is getting done. For me, facilitation is for subjects I know nothing about and plan to no nothing about.  If the kid has a question, I can facilitate someone for them to ask - online or in person - or I can go find more resources.

For co-learning, I am peer. I am actually learning the content and putting for a TON of effort to do so when we are talking gifted kids in high school. I would never consider what I did with my ds to get him into the IMO camp facilitation, because I was spending 3 hours a day for 5 months working *with* him to figure out problem solving techniques and how to use them.  I came in with more EF skills, but he came in with more innate talent. We were matched equally.  I name this approach co-learning rather than facilitation because of the effort I put in and because in the end, I learned an entire subject that I did not know (competition math and I am no mathematician!)

But I have also learned straight content/concept subjects with my ds - specifically physics.  We would each work for an hour independently each day, and then we would come together with questions to ask each other and work to find answer for.  We discussed, argued, analyzed, and synthesized this content. He did not have a teacher and I certainly didn't know the content. He was *definitely* not doing it on his own, and if he had been alone to learn the content, he would have struggled because he did not have the capability to understand difficult nuanced concepts without our discussions. So not facilitation in my books. Definitely co-learning.    And I believe that by co-learning, he learned more than physics; he learned how to learn in a deep and meaningful way because our discussions forced him to challenge his own understanding and look for nuance and insight.  In fact, in his first year at university, ds did not attend a single physics class after the first class -- and yet he got the top mark both semesters in the honors version. He told me that when he struggled through the content on his own without someone explaining it, he gained a deeper understanding than kids who mastered concepts that they had been directly taught. The classes he chooses to attend are the discussion-based humanities ones - the ones where the *content* is the bringing together of many minds to synthesize a nuanced perception of a concept. He *loves* those classes. 

Over time, I have come to believe that top down teaching is inferior to bottom up learning. Top down teaching appears more efficient to the teacher, but in my experience it is less efficient for the student because true learning happens only when there is enough struggle for the content to stick.    

 

Edited by lewelma
  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, EKS said:

This is why teaching that there is something called the "scientific method" is a crock, why all writing programs are terrible, and why most math textbooks are just glorified cookbooks. 

More generally, I have found that when it comes to advanced academics, content is just the tip of the iceberg, in that it moves from being an end in itself to becoming a vehicle for wrestling with ideas.  Wrestling with ideas is impossible to do authentically if the teacher already knows the "answer."  

This is beautifully said, and so true.  When the teacher knows the answer, the discussion is fake and does not teach critical thinking because the student knows you have an answer in your mind and they are just trying to figure out what you want them to say. Plus then the teacher tries to guide the student to that specific answer, which undercuts the development of insight.

I think that the best thing I have done in my homeschool has been to create a discussion-based learning environment. Like you said, we have moved from content to the wrestling with ideas. This requires parental time and knowledge, but is incredibly valuable to the student. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, arctic_bunny said:

@CuriousMomof3, I think I know what you are saying, and I hope you find a program that works for you. I also hope, though, that your DH has a chance to teach DS the skills he has. They may not be calculus or whatever, but they are important. First, so your DS can respect the work his dad has done, but also because there are probably traits that he can apply to the material he is learning. I’m generalizing, but I’m thinking something as simple as just doing the job in front of you and doing it well. Also, they might have interesting discussions going forward, if they approach problems differently. I didn’t do well in the lecture part of university physics, figuring things out with formulae, but I kicked butt in labs!

 

I hope that I don't come across as if I don't respect my husband's skills.  He's a wonderful man, a great father, and really good at his job.  He's also good at lots of other things too, they just don't happen to be academic things.  DS2 adores his father, and clearly thinks the world of him.  One challenge is that many of the things that DH is good at, and that he enjoys teaching our other boys, are things that DS2 can't do due to physical disability.  DH coaches their sports, and is teaching them how to do woodworking and repair cars, and DS2 is happy to watch him do these things and ask questions, but he can't actually do them himself.   

I'm not worried about their relationship.  They are very close, and I think they'll love being home together.  I just also know that DS2 really enjoys the time we spend together doing academics, and I want to figure out a way for him to continue to have that experience when he's with his Dad.  Since the switch won't happen for another 18 months or so, it's not something I have to problem solve now, but it's something to start thinking about, especially because if we are going to move towards mostly online classes, I'd like to try one or two next year, so that it's not as sudden a shift.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Curiousmom, so I just saw your thread on the HS board about all-online solutions.  I don't want this to come across wrong, but I am curious what you hope this thread will give you. If you want all-online solutions, then people on that thread gave you a bunch of really good options. Is this thread about other possibilities? Or is it really a JAWM thread for online courses as the best/only solution to helping a kid who is beyond their parent? If so, I totally support whatever you deem necessary to meet both your ds's and dh's needs. But if you want other ideas, I would suggest the following:

1) Find something your dh already knows that he can teach.  Interpretation of baseball stats and predictions? Interpretation of current events and their complexity? Complex wood joints (yes, my dh is really into this)? Something that would break the tedium of an all online course load.

2) Find something your dh wants to learn. It doesn't have to be academic, but something that can interest both him and your ds. Maybe the complexity and history of Jazz. Or maybe the history of the development of sewer systems in cities. I have NO idea. But then, your dh could read to your ds and they could discuss what they are learning. 

So an all online academic program for your ds, with a couple classes each year that your dh is involved in.  This would allow deeper learning and personal interaction for your ds without taxing your dh beyond what he is keen to do. 

Just some thoughts. But if you want a JAWM thread, state that, and we can support what you deem necessary.

Edited by lewelma

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 hours ago, lewelma said:

Curiousmom, it sounds like you want an online solution.  So far I have heard (thought this may not be exactly what you said or mean):

1) Co-learning: Learning with the child is out

2) Teaching: Learning ahead of the child is out 

3) B&M school is out: no travel

4) Tutors are out: expensive

5) Textbooks are out: boring

This is why I suggested taking courses where experience and wisdom are critical things to mastering the content. Then your dh can actually teach, because the knowledge required is from his life experience. 

For me personally, online solutions are not why I homeschool. So with the exception of AoPS courses, we have done homeschooling at home as a family.

 

We aren't in an ideal situation.  I'll say that straight up.  We homeschool because he's too medically fragile to go to school.   We make the best of it, but the truth is that if he could go to school with his brothers, that's what we'd do.    And medical needs limit other options.  Things like in person classes, or coops, or DE aren't really workable solutions.  Money is tighter than it was when we had two incomes and fewer medical bills. 

I'm not opposed to co-learning, but I'm just not sure how it works if the kid is ahead.  I completely get what it would look like in a situation where the adult and the kid are starting at the same place, and exploring together, and moving forward together, and for some subjects, like history, I think that could work.  But for other subjects, I think the gap might be too wide.  It would be like trying to co-learn 4th year Spanish with your kid, when you hadn't taken 1st through 3rd year.  

I'm not opposed to textbooks as one strategy, and my kid has really enjoyed Life of Fred's science books, which are the only real  textbooks that we've used.  My husband can sit with him, and read to him or listen to him read, and scribe the answers for him, and help him flip the pages in the book and check, but it's clear that he doesn't understand the science, so he's not really a discussion partner.   But I'm not convinced that hours of textbook reading would be the solution.  I think he needs the discussion, and the skill of participating in discussion and having his ideas challenged.  I think that's an important part of education.  

I will check out the courses you suggested, but I think we'll probably need to do some online classes.  I'm just not sure how online classes work with a scribe.  

22 hours ago, lewelma said:

I did the following with my older:

       Taught: English

       Co-learned: Chemistry, Physics, Economics, History, Philosophy

        Facilitated: Math, Contemporary World Problems, Government, Biology

       Online outsourced: Math

       Tutor outsourced:  Violin, Mandarin

       Extracurriculars: Quartet, Badminton

With my younger, the balance is different

      Taught: Remedial English, Advanced Composition, Math, Physics, Chemistry (sciences learned with older)

      Co-learned: Cultural Geography, Physical Geography, Economics, History, 

      Facilitated: Literature      (My ds is unable to work independently yet)

      Online outsourced: None     (my ds has been unable to write, so could not take online courses)

      Tutor outsourced: Violin, Drama 

       Extracurriculars: Quartet, Badminton, Swimming, multi-sport, Games night, the gym, Gymnastics

I think that the variety was what kept schooling fun and rigorous here. But every child has their own needs as you can see from the 2 plans described above.  I would not, however, suggest a diet of only online courses. Why don't you make up a list like the ones above, and figure out what your dh can teach, co-learn, or facilitate; and then decide how much you want to spend to outsource. Then you will have a plan.

Ruth in NZ

 

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

looks like we were writing at the same time. My previous reply may not apply, but I'll leave it up to give you some food for thought. 

You sound like an awesome mom to me. And I am impressed with your desire to make this difficult situation work.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, lewelma said:

Curiousmom, so I just saw your thread on the HS board about all-online solutions.  I don't want this to come across wrong, but I am curious what you hope this thread will give you. If you want all-online solutions, then people on that thread gave you a bunch of really good options. Is this thread about other possibilities? Or is it really a JAWM thread for online as the best/only solution to the problem many of us face? If so, I totally support whatever you deem necessary to meet both your ds's and dh's needs. But if you want other ideas, I would suggest the following:

1) Find something your dh already knows that he can teach.  Interpretation of baseball stats and predictions? Interpretation of current events and their complexity? Complex wood joints (yes, my dh is really into this)? Something that would break the tedium of an all online course load.

2) Find something your dh wants to learn. It doesn't have to be academic, but something that can interest both him and your ds. Maybe the complexity and history of Jazz. Or maybe the history of the development of sewer systems in cities. I have NO idea. But then, your dh could read to your ds and they could discuss what they are learning. 

So an all online academic program for your ds, with a couple classes each year that your dh is involved in.  This would allow deeper learning and personal interaction for your ds without taxing your dh beyond what he is keen to do. 

Just some thoughts. But if you want a JAWM thread, state that, and we can support what you deem necessary.

 

That thread's about a different kid, my oldest, and after thinking about it more we're almost certainly not going to end up homeschooling him.  I got lots of great ideas for online classes for him, but there are still other challenges that will probably make it not happen.

Online school for my middle kid, the one I'd consider an advanced learner, would be more complicated, in part because of physical disabilities, in part because he'd need someone with him to scribe any kind of response.  

I like your idea of finding something that my DH can explore with my son.  I'm just not sure yet what it would be. 

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, arctic_bunny said:

I think I got the threads and the kids mixed up.... Sorry!


No need to apologize, it's totally understandable.

The two kids are really different, which is why I started a new thread, because I think it was getting confusing talking about both in the same conversation.  

DS1 is a very typical kid, both academically and in other ways.  He's expressed interest in homeschooling, but I think we're going to say no. If we did say yes, we'd need to outsource everything, in part because of my husband's lack of academic strengths, but also because his brother's needs are such that there's no way to guarantee an adult is available to teach/co-learn/facilitate consistently.  That thread gave me some good ideas on ways we might be able to build a program for him, but as I said I think in the end we're going to decide that he needs the structure and consistency of school given the things going on at home. 

But DS2, who is the kid I meant this thread to be about, will stay home, because medically he doesn't have another option.  I don't see only online school as a great fit for him, but to be honest I haven't ever taken an online class, so I could be wrong.  I do think that online school might play a role, and I'd love more suggestions of online providers that work for very gifted kids, that are also flexible and open to accommodations.  But I also think that he'll need more interaction, and since he's stuck at home or in the hospital, a lot of the time, that means we need to figure out ways for him to interact around academics.  Which is why I started a different thread.  

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, CuriousMomof3 said:


I'm not opposed to co-learning, but I'm just not sure how it works if the kid is ahead.  I completely get what it would look like in a situation where the adult and the kid are starting at the same place, and exploring together, and moving forward together, and for some subjects, like history, I think that could work.  But for other subjects, I think the gap might be too wide.  It would be like trying to co-learn 4th year Spanish with your kid, when you hadn't taken 1st through 3rd year.  

Thanks for helping me understand the 2 different situations for the two different kids. I definitely had them mixed up.

As for co-learning, my dh is too tired at night and on the weekend to be an academic partner for my boys, but he has loved learning with them just through reading. He has picked topics that *he* was interested in, and his enthusiasm has brought the kids with him. He has read out-loud and discussed books like Guns, Germs, and Steel by Jared Diamond over many months.  He is now reading Persian Fire by Tom Holland.  These are adult level books worthy of discussion by gifted kids.  But my dh has not needed any background to start reading and discussing. So he and my boys have started at the same level. He has also read classics out-loud like Oliver Twist or To Kill a Mockingbird. My ds is 16 and still loves this reading/discussing time. Leave math, science, and foreign language to online classes, but humanities and social sciences can be super fun to explore with gifted kids. 

 

Edited by lewelma

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, CuriousMomof3 said:

I'm  not opposed to co-learning, but I'm just not sure how it works if the kid is ahead.  I completely get what it would look like in a situation where the adult and the kid are starting at the same place, and exploring together, and moving forward together, and for some subjects, like history, I think that could work.  But for other subjects, I think the gap might be too wide.  It would be like trying to co-learn 4th year Spanish with your kid, when you hadn't taken 1st through 3rd year.  

If you think about learning in terms of a traditional classroom setting, than your scenario of a student studying 4th yr Spanish and your not knowing Spanish making the situation undoable is accurate. But, creating a learning environment where kids thrive and achieve high levels of accomplishment does not have to even slightly resemble a classroom teacher-student relationship. It really is going to come down to if you want to replicate school-at-home. If that is what you want, you are correct that your options are limited. But, other methods work and the paths are many.

For example, I have had kids take through Latin 4 at home and score golds on the NLE (my Latin stinks). I have a Dd who graduated from high school at a very high level in French (I don't know any French). My math skills beyond about the first 1/2 of alg 2 stink, but my kids work through alg 2 and precal with me (and go on to major in things like engineering with a solid mathematical background.) I don't understand physics, but have a ds in grad school for physics who studied physics and astronomy at home to a level where his UG U let him skip all the astronomy pre-req courses and jump into their upper level astronomy courses bc his physics background was so strong they knew when he talked to them about having used the exact same textbooks for astronomy at home that he already knew the material.

It doesn't take teacher/student scenarios for mastering material at a deep level. It takes finding the right resources and designing an environment that leads to successful learning. For example, my Dd who speaks French fluently---her approach was nothing like a classroom. She used grammar textbooks, but that was a minor part of her French studies. She watched  movies in French that she  knew in English. She read children's books in French that she was very familiar with in English (Chronicles of Narnia).She watched French news (news typically shows scenes of what is being talked about so she started to learn vocabulary in context.) Her input French got to a very high level, but her spoken French was weak, so we found a local Alliance Francaise and she would go to their meetings to practice conversing. She ended up meeting a Francophone her jr yr who would meet with her to discuss literature (like Les Mis) and the area (she had just moved there from France her English was not very good and she had left her adult children behind, so Dd became her "adopted" Dd.)  None of those examples required me to be a master teacher. It did require me to be engaged with their learning, understand their needs, talk with them, and find resources to help them move to the next level of mastery.

There are so many resources a available for learning that can be used in conjunction with other materials that just about any subject can be studied at an advanced level. MOOCs (for example https://ocw.mit.edu/index.htm ) and Great Courses https://www.thegreatcourses.com/ are just 2 examples of supplemental materials you can use.  Great Courses lectures come with booklets with supplemental resource lists, outline summaries of lectures, and questions for further research. I use the booklets for designing complete courses for my kids.

Edited by 8FillTheHeart
  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thank you for this thread. It's been a dream-come-true for me that my kids have passed / are passing me - this has been our GOAL, but it does beg some questions at the practical level! ❤️ I love you people.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, 8FillTheHeart said:

None of those examples required me to be a master teacher. It did require me to be engaged with their learning, understand their needs, talk with them, and find resources to help them move to the next level of mastery.

This I think is key.  I believe that gifted kids crave discussion and interaction. I have worked hard to come to a level where I can offer this kind of support in most subjects. But in ones where I could not, we found creative solutions. 

For my older ds's math, once I did my last big co-learning push when he was 12 that I described above, we put him into the AoPS classes not because he needed to be taught, but because he wanted the discussion. But by 15 he was out of classes to take there.  We tried having him take classes at the university but that was a huge bust because even at age 15 in 2nd year classes he topped the class by a 40 point margin. There was no discussion happening there. So I researched and bought him a pile of math books that he could work through on his own, and I listened to him talk and talk and talk about math (although I never knew what he was saying). We never could find a mentor, although we had a couple of wonderful computer science people who would talk to him about discrete math occasionally, but I am talking like 3 times a year. And he had his math camp 1 time per year. But in the end, he made his own reality like 8filltheheart's dd did with French.  He organized fortnightly study sessions with the other 2 IMO kids in town to work through those tough problems he loves. Then he organized and taught his own competition-math after-school class for gifted kids. He convinced one of the other IMO kids to help him run the class, so they worked together to plan a year-long program, create lecture notes and worksheets, and run the class in a collaborative manner. This course gave him the interaction he craved by being a mentor rather than having a mentor. And in the end he walked into MIT and took a grad level math class as a freshman.  This outcome did not happen by chance. I *managed* his high school math program, as varied and non-schoolish as it was. The solution for him was not to be taught by a person or by an online class, the solution was for him to battle through the material on his own with a ton of support from us and collaboration with his peers. And then to share his passion and knowledge by teaching others.

Edited by lewelma
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

OP, Just doing some more thinking, does your dh and ds like movies?  My younger boy and I have been doing an analysis of how comedies are created.  He loves loves loves humor.  So we watch TV shows like Gilligan's Island and movies like Legally Blond, and discuss what makes them funny and how this was done with the cinematography, costumes, script, etc.  We look stuff up about humor, and then try to find the elements in different shows. It has been great fun and has led to lots of questions about the cultural nature of humor and how it changes over time. Fascinating stuff. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, CuriousMomof3 said:


 

But DS2, who is the kid I meant this thread to be about, will stay home, because medically he doesn't have another option.  I don't see only online school as a great fit for him, but to be honest I haven't ever taken an online class, so I could be wrong.  I do think that online school might play a role, and I'd love more suggestions of online providers that work for very gifted kids, that are also flexible and open to accommodations.  But I also think that he'll need more interaction, and since he's stuck at home or in the hospital, a lot of the time, that means we need to figure out ways for him to interact around academics.  Which is why I started a different thread.  

Could he be a home bound student through the local public school with a teacher coming to the home to provide interaction and instruction for the main subjects with your husband being more of a facilitator, scribe, and discussion partner? Maybe if your husband knows the basics are being taken care of by ps, he will feel more comfortable embracing co-learning and/or facilitating in other areas.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Frances said:

Could he be a home bound student through the local public school with a teacher coming to the home to provide interaction and instruction for the main subjects with your husband being more of a facilitator, scribe, and discussion partner? Maybe if your husband knows the basics are being taken care of by ps, he will feel more comfortable embracing co-learning and/or facilitating in other areas.


We tried home and hospital when he first came home, but it really wasn’t a fit.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, CuriousMomof3 said:


We tried home and hospital when he first came home, but it really wasn’t a fit.  


I just wanted to add to this because I know that it sounds like I am making excuses. but it was really bad.  It took forever to set up, in part because the school system seems to think that the kids should be literally home bound, when in reality we spend a lot of time at the hospital for various therapies and appointments.  And then once it was set up, and he was hospitalized we started over again with a new person.  So, they ended up only coming a handful of times, and a lot of the time was eaten up with new people trying to figure out what he knew and could do.

Then, they claimed they could only work on either goals from his IEP or from the fifth grade curriculum, but in reality they’d spend most of their time on material that was way below grade level, and saying they were assessing him.  
 

In the end, it just ended up being a colossal waste of time and we registered him as a homeschooler instead.  Which has been way better, although there is still room for improvement.  

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Honestly, doing homeschooling when a kid is ahead of you pretty much has to be outsourced unless the parent(s) are willing to put in a lot of time and effort. The co-learning works when you are really committed-I've learned a lot of science alongside DD (my last bio class was AP Bio in 11th grade), but even when she has a mentor who guide the instruction, it takes a lot of effort on my part to make it work. That's one reason why I have chosen to move some classes to the community college in DD's less intense interest areas, because I simply do not have the enthusiasm and energy to co-learn every single subject to the degree she needs. 

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, dmmetler said:

Honestly, doing homeschooling when a kid is ahead of you pretty much has to be outsourced unless the parent(s) are willing to put in a lot of time and effort. The co-learning works when you are really committed-I've learned a lot of science alongside DD (my last bio class was AP Bio in 11th grade), but even when she has a mentor who guide the instruction, it takes a lot of effort on my part to make it work. That's one reason why I have chosen to move some classes to the community college in DD's less intense interest areas, because I simply do not have the enthusiasm and energy to co-learn every single subject to the degree she needs. 


It’s not that we aren’t willing, I just don’t know that we have the capacity, in terms of time and intellect to do it.

I am just not sure how to go about finding a mentor for a kid who is often stuck at home.  We lucked out with a math tutor who kind of fell out of the sky, but I can't count on more happy accidents like that.  Plus it's an expensive model!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21 minutes ago, CuriousMomof3 said:

Plus it's an expensive model!

Could you barter?  Could your dh take another homeschool parent's kids out on field trips in exchange for tutoring? Or if your dh has woodworking skills or other trade skills, could he exchange those?  I know 2 families here that exchanged German lessons for music lessons. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, lewelma said:

Could you barter?  Could your dh take another homeschool parent's kids out on field trips in exchange for tutoring? Or if your dh has woodworking skills or other trade skills, could he exchange those?  I know 2 families here that exchanged German lessons for music lessons. 


Interesting idea.  Not field trips because he can’t leave my kid, he needs someone with specific medical training in the room. 

He does have woodworking and other skills, but the logistics of teaching someone else’s kid while also watching DS would be tricky.  Whoever we traded with would also need to be very flexible.  I am not sure if that’s realistic.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, CuriousMomof3 said:


Interesting idea.  Not field trips because he can’t leave my kid, he needs someone with specific medical training in the room. 

He does have woodworking and other skills, but the logistics of teaching someone else’s kid while also watching DS would be tricky.  Whoever we traded with would also need to be very flexible.  I am not sure if that’s realistic.

Someone on the tutoring thread has a list of what she accepts in barter:  "dinners for my freezer, piano lessons, a truck full of apples, local co-op classes like gym and career exploration, etc."  Perhaps brainstorm what your dh can offer in barter from home. 

As for a flexible mentor/tutor, for the kids I work with who have physical or mental illness, I am very flexible.  I can only take on 1 or 2 a year, because they muck up my schedule and don't pay what the others do because they don't show up regularly. But I do take them on knowing that I am doing a community service. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21 minutes ago, lewelma said:

Someone on the tutoring thread has a list of what she accepts in barter:  "dinners for my freezer, piano lessons, a truck full of apples, local co-op classes like gym and career exploration, etc."  Perhaps brainstorm what your dh can offer in barter from home. 

As for a flexible mentor/tutor, for the kids I work with who have physical or mental illness, I am very flexible.  I can only take on 1 or 2 a year, because they muck up my schedule and don't pay what the others do because they don't show up regularly. But I do take them on knowing that I am doing a community service. 


Our math tutor is amazingly flexible, and I am very grateful.  I just feel like it would be optimistic to assume we’d find the same for other subjects, especially with someone who was also willing to barter. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have a friend who found a retired professor keen to stay active who was willing to tutor for free.

I have a friend who tutored my older boy in competition math for 6 weeks because he enjoyed the mental stimulation.

I have a friend whose child is deaf and blind and also gifted who has had to work hard with the online schools to find work arounds. 

I personally have worked with kids with leukemia, debilitating migranes, and profound mental illness. 

I agree that it feels so lucky when things work out. But there are people who are willing to help, but you are going to have to ask wide and far to find them. I think you are in the situation where you are just going to have to do a ton of leg work to make a good education happen. I am really impressed at how much you do for your son, and hope it works out for him and your dh.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, CuriousMomof3 said:


It’s not that we aren’t willing, I just don’t know that we have the capacity, in terms of time and intellect to do it.

I am just not sure how to go about finding a mentor for a kid who is often stuck at home.  We lucked out with a math tutor who kind of fell out of the sky, but I can't count on more happy accidents like that.  Plus it's an expensive model!

I think it would be helpful to understand what sort of situation you hope to find as a a good solution. If tutors are unaffordable and you don't see yourself taking on the role, and the school system doesnt accommodate his special needs appropriately, and the teaching schedule needs to be flexible due to his drs appts, it is hard for me understand what you envision.

There are asynchronous courses and resources out there, but nothing I would pass onto a 9 yr old without parental involvement/direction.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, 8FillTheHeart said:

I think it would be helpful to understand what sort of situation you hope to find as a a good solution. If tutors are unaffordable and you don't see yourself taking on the role, and the school system doesnt accommodate his special needs appropriately, and the teaching schedule needs to be flexible due to his drs appts, it is hard for me understand what you envision.

There are asynchronous courses and resources out there, but nothing I would pass onto a 9 yr old without parental involvement/direction.


I feel like I don't know the answer, which is why I'm asking.  The reality is that there are compelling financial and family reasons why I need to go back to work, and while I can obviously take on some role in homeschooling, if I'm out of the house 45 hours a week, and taking on my share of the medical stuff, and parenting my other kids, I can't do 100% of the homeschooling, especially with a kid who needs everything scribed and who is learning stuff I don't know.  I also can't change the other parameters.  I can't make him be in or at the hospital less.  I can't make his immune system function well enough to be in group settings with other kids.  I can't change the school system.  So, I'm looking for other ideas.  I imagine they'll be far from perfect. 

As far as tutoring, we have an amazing tutor who charges us way less than market rate, and is willing to do things like reschedule at the last minute, and tutor by Skype when he's in the hospital, and drive 90 minutes each way to do a tutoring session in ICU.  And we will keep him, but for one subject that's about $5K a year.  We've lost an income, and taken on significant expenses due to his medical needs.  We can't do that for every subject.  

So, what will it look like?  My guess is it will be a mix.  I assume that we'll keep the math tutor.  Maybe, if I'm back at work and the financial pressures ease a little we could do tutoring for a second subject, but that's probably the limit.  I assume that there will be some subject where the solution will be to do it with me.  Maybe some subjects will just be reading with no output, or audiobooks that he and DH listen to together and discuss. I assume there will be some online classes, and that DH will sit with him and scribe for him.  There may also be subjects that we just skip.  Maybe, for example, he doesn't need a foreign language.  

But I don't know which materials would let a kid learn with just reading and no output, and which online classes are structured so that they might work.   We've got about 18 months to figure this out.  He'll be 11 by the time we switch places.  So, my thought is that we start identifying potential resources now, so that we can try bits and pieces, and maybe an online class or two next year, and hopefully by the beginning of the 2021-22 school year we'll have some sort of a workable plan.  Of course, he's changing all the time, which means that nothing is set in stone. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I haven't read any of the replies. so the thread may have changed direction.

 and I hardly ever come to this section of the forum as I feel too inadequate 

but I had a very similar situation. A child with an  IQ way higher than mine.  Who was very quick to grasp math/ science things  and who loved physics, a under-educated me ( left school after year 10 ) who had never even taken physics. I also had to do a lot of scribing and reading aloud as he has Dyslexia and Dysgraphia

 I taught my son how to learn. He had to teach himself. He had to teach me. The most effective way to learn something is to have to teach it to someone else. He did that. And while all the  year 12 physics he taught me went straight out my other ear. he retained it. We had a math tutor for exactly 2 sessions, just to help ds with a particular thing. It was when he was studying a university level unit to get into University.

It was a frustrating time for both of us. Him frustrated at the wanting to learn at a faster rate, me frustrated by my inadequacies 

He use to say that he got to university in spite of me. But now that he is working he has said that he realized at university that most other students didn't now how to learn, they  were use to teachers telling them and struggled at university because of that.

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...