Autism and friends

[Innisfree]

I hear so much about the kids on the spectrum who want friends, but have trouble making or keeping them because they don't understand the social expectations. We seem to be in a different spot. Dd15 (asd, etc) has a long term, on-again, off-again friend who really wants dd's company but is overwhelming dd with her need for time and attention.

I'm feeling bad for this girl, because by most not-autistic standards, she isn't asking for much time. She sees dd for daily bus rides to and from school, and occasionally for lunch at school.

They have known each other since kindergarten, and mostly maintained their friendship through years when they were not in school together. Dd15 has always thought that her friend had other friends in school, but once they were attending school together again this fall, discovered that her friend (I'll call her Emily, not her real name) considered the others acquaintances, and dd her only real friend.

To make matters worse, Emily is having some significant mental health issues. Her mom is aware of them, and she is receiving therapy. But she just seems very vulnerable, and I hurt when I think about dd deliberately limiting contact with her. But dd is not equipped to handle Emily's needs.

Dd15 is feeling overwhelmed by the whole situation. She says she is happier with the casual acquaintances she has made in her classes, and she doesn't want friends who make demands on her time. When she isn't in class, what she really wants is to sit by herself and listen to music on her phone, or read.

In a sense, I think dd is handling this well. She has made plans to talk to her case manager today, explain the situation, and ask for help limiting her contact with Emily, and also make sure the school knows about Emily's issues. So, she's advocating for her own needs, which is huge, and trying to make sure someone understands how bad this is for her friend. But, ouch. I feel so hurt for Emily.

Emily and her family have known about dd's autism for years. But they've never seemed to really understand all the permutations. They have previously interpreted some of dd's difficulties in a very unsympathetic way, so I'm concerned about them not understanding the emotional overload which this friendship is causing for dd. I'm just unhappy about the whole situation.

Does anyone else have a kid with autism who tries to limit friendships?

[Innisfree]

And, I should have stressed: I understand that dd is in a big school with hundreds of other students, dealing with all kinds of noise and demands, for the first time in many years, and needing time and space to decompress is completely reasonable. Under all the circumstances, she's doing amazingly well, though academics are not quite so good. And any high schooler might be overwhelmed by a friend's serious mental health issues.

It's the rejection of the idea that friends are an essentially good and desirable thing that interests me here. I suppose she is taking the stressful friendship with Emily as an example of what all friendships are like, perhaps. She has had other friends, and enjoyed time with them. But right now she seem to consider friendships to be too much effort for a small payoff. I'm curious whether other kids on the spectrum have come to this conclusion as they matured, and whether they have later reconsidered.

[Lecka]

I don’t know — but I am planning to get the parent book that goes along with the PEERS program.  Just in the kindle preview it talks some about motivation levels. 

https://www.amazon.com/Science-Making-Friends-DVD-Challenged/dp/1118127218/ref=nodl_

 

[Targhee]

Had a very similar situation with DS. He’s not got ASD dx but I have wondered sometimes - his sister got a dx just recently and they share so many traits.  He does have ADHD dx, is overwhelmed by full time school days, and prefers alone time. This year with his heavy school load he just wants to be alone making music at the end of the day. 

I tell him he is not responsible for friend’s happiness. He is responsible for being kind, honest, and setting his personal boundaries for mental health. When his friend asks to hang out and DS doesn’t want to right then I tell him to say “I’m needing some time to myself, want to hang out [insert a better time here]?”

Yes, I’m grateful for this friend and it is DS’s only close one, and want friend to be happy and healthy BUT I also need to teach DS that he doesn’t need to strain his own mental health to accommodate others.  This is important - he doesn’t need to mask or conform to another’s needs or demands because that person is mentally fragile when so doing could very likely result in his own mental fragility. I know this from my DD and my niece 😞

I also try to have conversations with his friend, wish him luck with things, notice his new clothes or hair style, etc.  I can do this, which has a smaller impact than if DS did it but is positive anyway, because i am in a place mentally/emotionally to give.

[PeterPan]

Friend is probably on the spectrum too, and that’s how it can look, yes. Let your dd kill it her own way and stay out of it. 

[Innisfree]

48 minutes ago, Targhee said:

I tell him he is not responsible for friend’s happiness. He is responsible for being kind, honest, and setting his personal boundaries for mental health. When his friend asks to hang out and DS doesn’t want to right then I tell him to say “I’m needing some time to myself, want to hang out [insert a better time here]?”

I love this formula.

Right now, I think dd would say she wants at least a week or so away from Emily, and then maybe one ride on the bus together, and then maybe another week off. Emily really needs some other friends, and that part is out of my ability or responsibility to fix. I don't think what dd can offer is ever going to meet Emily's needs.

48 minutes ago, Targhee said:

BUT I also need to teach DS that he doesn’t need to strain his own mental health to accommodate others.  This is important - he doesn’t need to mask or conform to another’s needs or demands because that person is mentally fragile when so doing could very likely result in his own mental fragility. 

 You are so right.

 

Edited November 25, 2019 by Innisfree
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[Innisfree]

35 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

Friend is probably on the spectrum too

I have wondered about this over the years.

[PeterPan]

4 hours ago, Innisfree said:

I have wondered about this over the years.

It's highly probable. And if you read about girl autism, that sort of hyper-possessiveness is a thing. It's a social thinking issue, a reflection of rigidity.

4 hours ago, Innisfree said:

I don't think what dd can offer is ever going to meet Emily's needs.

No, only Emily can learn how to meet Emily's needs. Now the real question is where the parents are, the caregivers, because this is something they could be supporting. So if they're not onboard and noticing and addressing her social thinking and rigidity, then that's the bigger problem. It's why you can't solve it. 

If you back off and let it devolve as it will, the parents can notice and step in and ask why she's losing friends. It may help her in the long run. And it teaches your dd how to have boundaries and self-advocate.

[Rosie_0801]

9 hours ago, Innisfree said:

But right now she seem to consider friendships to be too much effort for a small payoff. I'm curious whether other kids on the spectrum have come to this conclusion as they matured, and whether they have later reconsidered.

 

Uh, I think we mostly keep this opinion, but occasionally make exceptions for special people. 🤣

You can provide scaffolding, of course, but you can't fix it. There isn't a person on this earth for whom Interpersonal relations run smoothly all of the time.

[Innisfree]

4 minutes ago, Rosie_0801 said:

 

Uh, I think we mostly keep this opinion, but occasionally make exceptions for special people. 🤣

You can provide scaffolding, of course, but you can't fix it. There isn't a person on this earth for whom Interpersonal relations run smoothly all of the time.

Thanks, Rosie. Right this minute, I don't think dd believes any friend is worth this much effort. Maybe she'll find one someday.

[Rosie_0801]

1 minute ago, Innisfree said:

Thanks, Rosie. Right this minute, I don't think dd believes any friend is worth this much effort. Maybe she'll find one someday.

 

As long as she's comfortable with that opinion, it won't damage her.

[PeterPan]

50 minutes ago, Innisfree said:

Right this minute, I don't think dd believes any friend is worth this much effort.

Do you ever watch Good Doctor? They have the lead character (Shawn) saying this after a date, that it was horrible, it's too much work. They proceed to force this relationship that's a constant terrible fit and strain, all in the name of must stretch the disabled person, I don't know. Meanwhile, he has this relationship that DOES work, but she's only the roomie, haha.

Which is all to say, people are funny. Sometimes we outgrow friends and we move on. I think NT are more like I've known you forever, but sometimes in this circle it's more like outgrow, move on. 

[PeterPan]

Fwiw, Pretending to be Normal talks about that possessiveness of friends thing. It's a good book, worth reading. I'm not sure your dd is ready to, but maybe you'd find it informative. She does a lot of sharing what's going on in her head.