Novel to Replace Imitation of Christ

[shburks]

My son is doing Notgrass Exploring World History this year, and I'm not interested in having my son read Imitation of Christ. He's is a 9th grader but can handle any literature I've thrown at him. Can anyone suggest a suitable replacement that would take place during similar time frame? This covers the units from the Fall of Rome to the early Middle Ages.

I considered:

• Beowulf
• OR Beowulf, Dragon Slayer
• The Dragon and the Raven (aka the Days of King Alfred) by GA Henty
• Merry Adventures of Robin Hood

 

Would any of these be more appropriate than another or something else anyone can suggest? Thanks!

[Lori D.]

2 hours ago, shburks said:

My son is doing Notgrass Exploring World History... Imitation of Christ... Can anyone suggest a suitable replacement that would take place during similar time frame? This covers the units from the Fall of Rome to the early Middle Ages. I considered:

• Beowulf
• OR Beowulf, Dragon Slayer
• The Dragon and the Raven (aka the Days of King Alfred) by GA Henty
• Merry Adventures of Robin Hood

Would any of these be more appropriate than another or something else anyone can suggest? Thanks!

- Beowulf would be the only one on your list that is at a high school level, and that is classic literature for digging into with literature analysis and learning about lit. topics.
- Beowulf, Dragon Slayer (Sutcliff) -- gr. 4-6 reading level; her historical fiction is great, but a 9th grader who loves to read can handle a full translation of Beowulf. 😉
- Merry Adventures of Robin Hood is most typically a middle school work.
- GA Henty's historical fiction has little to no depth for literary analysis, AND, some of his works contain historical inaccuracies and imperialistic views.
_______________________

Side note: I really dislike Notgrass' literature selections for World History and American History:
- way too weird and scattered with no unifying "thread" running throughout
- too much nonfiction (which cannot be analyzed in the way fiction/poetry/plays can be, and is better used as supplemental reading in support of the actual History)
- too much historical fiction
- not enough actual classics of literature
- and not much in the way of actual instruction, background and helps for literary analysis and learning about literature topics

Whew... with THAT off my chest... (LOL!) ... Ideas for substitutes that are classics done in high school and that will get you the biggest "bang for your buck" as far as works that are well-known and alluded to:

ancients (B.C. to 500AD) -- although, it looks like you're already past this time period, these are still very worthwhile to read in high school:
- The Odyssey -- and the Garlic Press Discovering Literature guide -- meaty!
- Greek myths

medieval (500AD - 1500AD)
- Beowulf -- Seamus Heaney or Burton Raffel translation -- here's the free Glencoe Lit. Library guide to go along
- a few Canterbury Tales (Chaucer) -- MacCaughrean's abridged retelling is frequently used; Tenggren's edition is also abridged/retelling, with language not too far from the original
- Sir Gawain and the Green Knight -- Tolkien, Burton, or Amitage translations are most frequently used 
- possibly a King Arthur work (perhaps The Once and Future King by T.H. White?)

Edited October 14, 2019 by Lori D.

[Farrar]

I'd do Beowulf if you want to do the traditional choice. It's shortish, meaty, very useful for cultural literacy in general.

I second doing Once and Future King if you just want some meaty but interesting literature. There is a bit of sex - nothing too explicit though. It's the best of the Arthurian books out there.

If you wanted a literature tie in but didn't care if it was only loosely connected, you could do The Hobbit. Tolkien was inspired by this period, obviously. There are other fantasy books that might also fit the bill. You could even do a YA fantasy.

If you wanted something that's more historically focused and weren't worried about the literary aspects as much, I'd do Pillars of the Earth. It's long, but a light read. Very historically accurate. Not high literature, but well written. There are other options in this vein. It would just depend.

Edited October 14, 2019 by Farrar

[chiguirre]

12 hours ago, shburks said:

My son is doing Notgrass Exploring World History this year, and I'm not interested in having my son read Imitation of Christ. He's is a 9th grader but can handle any literature I've thrown at him. Can anyone suggest a suitable replacement that would take place during similar time frame? This covers the units from the Fall of Rome to the early Middle Ages.

I considered:

• Beowulf
• OR Beowulf, Dragon Slayer
• The Dragon and the Raven (aka the Days of King Alfred) by GA Henty
• Merry Adventures of Robin Hood

 

Would any of these be more appropriate than another or something else anyone can suggest? Thanks!

The Imitation of Christ was written in the early 15th century. I'd go with something more contemporaneous than Beowulf or Alfred or Robin Hood, all of which are set between 900 and 300 years earlier. I'd suggest The Canterbury Tales which was written about 20 years earlier than the IoC. You will want to pick a modern translation and choose your tales carefully if you want to avoid the bawdier tales. This is a very standard high school text, so you should be able to find lots of supporting material.

[Lori D.]

1 hour ago, chiguirre said:

The Imitation of Christ was written in the early 15th century. I'd go with something more contemporaneous than Beowulf or Alfred or Robin Hood, all of which are set between 900 and 300 years earlier. I'd suggest The Canterbury Tales which was written about 20 years earlier than the IoC. You will want to pick a modern translation and choose your tales carefully if you want to avoid the bawdier tales. This is a very standard high school text, so you should be able to find lots of supporting material.

If trying to match publishing date of publishing dates, then the first 2 of the following classics are closest in publishing date:
approx. 1380s-1390s = Sir Gawain and the Green Knight
1392 = The Canterbury Tales
1418-1427 = Imitation of Christ

I can't think of another widely-read classic written in the rest of the 1400s -- it would have to be something like Farrar's historical fiction suggestion for staying in that century.

I totally agree that doing a few of the The Canterbury Tales is a high school standard and is worthwhile (it was on our "must read" list 😄 ). But it was written in the Late Middle Ages (as was Imitation of Christ). If OP needs a work that fits in with the History time period listed in the original post -- Fall of Rome to Early Middle Ages -- roughly 500-1000AD -- then Beowulf or a King Arthur work, or even possibly Macbeth (even though it was written in 1606), is going to give a closer "feel" for early Middle Ages.

I think it may come down to whether the original poster is looking for classic lit. written in that broad time frame, or is looking for historical fiction of a more specific time frame to match up with the history period being studied... 😉 

Edited October 14, 2019 by Lori D.

[shburks]

3 hours ago, Lori D. said:

If trying to match publishing date of publishing dates, then the first 2 of the following classics are closest in publishing date:
approx. 1380s-1390s = Sir Gawain and the Green Knight
1392 = The Canterbury Tales
1418-1427 = Imitation of Christ

I can't think of another widely-read classic written in the rest of the 1400s -- it would have to be something like Farrar's historical fiction suggestion for staying in that century.

I totally agree that doing a few of the The Canterbury Tales is a high school standard and is worthwhile (it was on our "must read" list 😄 ). But it was written in the Late Middle Ages (as was Imitation of Christ). If OP needs a work that fits in with the History time period listed in the original post -- Fall of Rome to Early Middle Ages -- roughly 500-1000AD -- then Beowulf or a King Arthur work, or even possibly Macbeth (even though it was written in 1606), is going to give a closer "feel" for early Middle Ages.

I think it may come down to whether the original poster is looking for classic lit. written in that broad time frame, or is looking for historical fiction of a more specific time frame to match up with the history period being studied... 😉 

 

I'm looking for something set in the history period being studied rather than when it's written. Thanks, Lori D for the thoughts. Sounds like Beowulf may be the best option.

5 hours ago, Farrar said:

I'd do Beowulf if you want to do the traditional choice. It's shortish, meaty, very useful for cultural literacy in general.

I second doing Once and Future King if you just want some meaty but interesting literature. There is a bit of sex - nothing too explicit though. It's the best of the Arthurian books out there.

If you wanted a literature tie in but didn't care if it was only loosely connected, you could do The Hobbit. Tolkien was inspired by this period, obviously. There are other fantasy books that might also fit the bill. You could even do a YA fantasy.

If you wanted something that's more historically focused and weren't worried about the literary aspects as much, I'd do Pillars of the Earth. It's long, but a light read. Very historically accurate. Not high literature, but well written. There are other options in this vein. It would just depend.

 

Thanks, Farrar! He read Once and Future King this summer, so I definitely need something different. Looks like Beowulf it is!

15 hours ago, Lori D. said:

- Beowulf would be the only one on your list that is at a high school level, and that is classic literature for digging into with literature analysis and learning about lit. topics.
- Beowulf, Dragon Slayer (Sutcliff) -- gr. 4-6 reading level; her historical fiction is great, but a 9th grader who loves to read can handle a full translation of Beowulf. 😉
- Merry Adventures of Robin Hood is most typically a middle school work.
- GA Henty's historical fiction has little to no depth for literary analysis, AND, some of his works contain historical inaccuracies and imperialistic views.
_______________________

Side note: I really dislike Notgrass' literature selections for World History and American History:
- way too weird and scattered with no unifying "thread" running throughout
- too much nonfiction (which cannot be analyzed in the way fiction/poetry/plays can be, and is better used as supplemental reading in support of the actual History)
- too much historical fiction
- not enough actual classics of literature
- and not much in the way of actual instruction, background and helps for literary analysis and learning about literature topics

Whew... with THAT off my chest... (LOL!) ... Ideas for substitutes that are classics done in high school and that will get you the biggest "bang for your buck" as far as works that are well-known and alluded to:

ancients (B.C. to 500AD) -- although, it looks like you're already past this time period, these are still very worthwhile to read in high school:
- The Odyssey -- and the Garlic Press Discovering Literature guide -- meaty!
- Greek myths

medieval (500AD - 1500AD)
- Beowulf -- Seamus Heaney or Burton Raffel translation -- here's the free Glencoe Lit. Library guide to go along
- a few Canterbury Tales (Chaucer) -- MacCaughrean's abridged retelling is frequently used; Tenggren's edition is also abridged/retelling, with language not too far from the original
- Sir Gawain and the Green Knight -- Tolkien, Burton, or Amitage translations are most frequently used 
- possibly a King Arthur work (perhaps The Once and Future King by T.H. White?)

 

So... I THINK you don't like the literature for Exploring World History! ha ha ha! I don't disagree with you for some works. I like some but we are definitely replacing some others--either he's already read it or I just don't care to have him read it. This is not our only literature, so I don't mind him reading some biographies or non-fiction as that really appeals to him as well. However, I agree with you that I'd like more classic literature.

Between Beowulf and Canterbury Tales, which would you choose? I I mentioned above, but he's already read Once and Future King, so I think one of these two might be the better choice. I personally hated Sir Gawain and the Green Knight and I'm not sure I can make him read it!

[Lori D.]

8 minutes ago, shburks said:

Between Beowulf and Canterbury Tales, which would you choose? I I mentioned above, but he's already read Once and Future King, so I think one of these two might be the better choice. I personally hated Sir Gawain and the Green Knight and I'm not sure I can make him read it!

Beowulf. BUT... since it's short, I'd also suggest reading 2-3 of the Canterbury Tales, too. Perhaps The Pardoner's Tale, The Nun's Priest Tale, and The Wife of Bath's Tale.

[shburks]

1 minute ago, Lori D. said:

Beowulf. BUT... since it's short, I'd also suggest reading 2-3 of the Canterbury Tales, too. Perhaps The Pardoner's Tale, The Nun's Priest Tale, and The Wife of Bath's Tale.

 

That's actually what I was thinking, too, since it is short! I appreciate the suggestions for the Canterbury Tales stories, too, as I would not know where to start. I know we read a few in our AP English class, but I have very little recollection of them! Would I need any sort of a guide for the Canterbury Tales?

[Farrar]

On 10/14/2019 at 3:45 PM, shburks said:

 

That's actually what I was thinking, too, since it is short! I appreciate the suggestions for the Canterbury Tales stories, too, as I would not know where to start. I know we read a few in our AP English class, but I have very little recollection of them! Would I need any sort of a guide for the Canterbury Tales?

You can find tons of questions for them all online. There are also a few videos. I've gotten into the habit of looking for videos to introduce big novels - Crash Course Literature has a bunch and there's a TED-Ed series called "Why should you read..." and I'm pretty sure there's one about the Canterbury Tales.

[shburks]

On 10/15/2019 at 2:05 PM, Farrar said:

You can find tons of questions for them all online. There are also a few videos. I've gotten into the habit of looking for videos to introduce big novels - Crash Course Literature has a bunch and there's a TED-Ed series called "Why should you read..." and I'm pretty sure there's one about the Canterbury Tales.

 

Thanks so much!

[Lori D.]

Beowulf -- free Penguin publishers teacher guide

Canterbury Tales -- free helps:
Sparknotes and Cliff Notes -- summaries, analysis, key quotations, etc.
Glencoe Literature Library guide -- background on author/times, graphic organizers, discussion questions, vocabulary