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Enormous difficulty finding workers for small businesses


Shellydon
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I have helped three different smaller business look for employees this summer.   Business 1 needs someone 40 hours a week at $15 per hour. The pay could increase and there benefits like PTO and some health insurance. The work requires some physical labor like moving chairs and tables, painting, occasional mowing of grounds among other tasks. Not skilled labor, just basic work.  Has the potential for raises.   3 months in and they have had zero luck in finding someone.  Business 2 needs someone that can run a cash register and do basic math (convert inches into feet and feet into yards, know multiplication tables), also must show up on time and be friendly and helpful.  Also pays $15 per how and has potential for raises. This business has huge trouble finding someone that can do the basic math. They have hired 4 people over the course of the summer and all have been fired or quit. 2 would show up hours late or not at all and could not understand why that is an issue.  1 quit because 'working was too hard.'  One stated that he has to quit and stay home starting in August-February to watch football.  Business 3 can't find someone and owner is working 80 hours a week to keep up.

How do businesses find employs that are willing to put forth effort and/or can do basic skills like multiply?

 

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We didn't, so we ended up closing our business.  People are lazy.  I know there are good employees, we had some!  But there are TONS of terrible employees, and they make life stressful.  It's like you have to go through about 10 to find 1 person who will stay and do the job.  Psy and benefits didnt matter.  We had employees who wouldn't learn a new skill, even when told it would boost their hourly rate if we had them trained for 2 jobs.  They did not want to do anything but show up and get a paycheck.  Sad, but true.

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1 hour ago, BusyMom5 said:

We didn't, so we ended up closing our business.  People are lazy.  I know there are good employees, we had some!  But there are TONS of terrible employees, and they make life stressful.  It's like you have to go through about 10 to find 1 person who will stay and do the job.  Psy and benefits didnt matter.  We had employees who wouldn't learn a new skill, even when told it would boost their hourly rate if we had them trained for 2 jobs.  They did not want to do anything but show up and get a paycheck.  Sad, but true.

This is absolutely true. We have a core group of good employees, most of whom have been with us for years, but we have also gone through so many that are just like you describe. We pay very high wages for our industry, as well as provide health insurance and retirement.  The difficulty in finding good workers isn't due to the economy - this has been going on for years. We've decided that we'd rather stay smaller rather than expand, because it's just too tough to find employees. I know lots of other business owners who are in the same boat.

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With unemployment low, it is extra hard to find good workers. One of my sons is a hard worker and had a trade job he liked, but he got married and moved 1,000 miles away. His boss paid for a plane ticket for him to come back and work for two weeks because they were so busy! Now the boss is talking about training him on some computer office work that often doesn't get done so he can continue to work for the company while living in another state. I wouldn't want to be a small business owner in desperate need of workers right now.

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The job market works on supply and demand, right now supply is low (unemployment is very low right now) so demand can go up (workers can afford to be super particular). I’ve run a number of businesses and the the truth is that the job market sets the pay scale.  Small businesses are higher risk for employees and usually insurance and financial benefits (stock, retirement plans, etc). are not as robust as a larger company and you also loose benefits like FMLA leave that larger employers are required to offer.

If it’s been months and they can’t hire anyone then the problem is most likely that what their offering isn’t enough to attract employees (or good employees). It’s rough, and I’ve been there, but it’s the truth. If it’s taking this long to hire the only options are to restructure the business so you don’t need those positions, or come up with a better pay/benefits plan.

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I feel you. I've been trying for months to help my dad find employees for his small home improvement company. There is more work than they can handle even with a full cache of workers. But there aren't any decent employees to be had anywhere.

Thank goodness he is retiring next year. I am out of ideas to help him, and he is running himself ragged trying to keep up with demand. I'm honestly worried for his health.

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Do they post requirements that aren't really necessary for the job? 

Do they automatically exclude anyone from consideration if they have a felony criminal record? Removing any question about felonies from the initial application could be helpful. Just because someone has committed a felony in the past doesn't mean they're going to be a bad employee in the present.

How are they advertising? Maybe they need to broaden the search.

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Well hopefully this will work in my favor as I apply for jobs...

I concur with the sentiment, though. We have hardly ever been able to secure a good plumber’s helper for our company. People who have their act together do not remain plumber’s helpers, so the only people left to do that job (besides our own kids) are typically unmotivated, not terribly smart and/or are substance abusers. 

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That doesn't seem to be the case here. I'm a high school teacher and my students (good students who would be great employees) talk of applying for 40-50 jobs to get 1-2 interviews. And these are just regular retail cashier positions for 17-18yo kids. 

I was really hoping to get out of the classroom. I submitted more than 70 applications for jobs in instructional design, curriculum development, and training. I only got 5 interviews and two of those were bogus. They were through employment agencies so I couldn't see what the company was and although the job description was about training, they were actually straight up sales positions that were 100% commission. The other three were legitimate and I had phone interviews and got to the second stage of online webex interview with people in three different cities with one of them. Unfortunately, they wanted a current math teacher and while I am also certified in math, I've been teaching science for the past four years.

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I agree with KatieK and AngieW

Honestly? $15 is a low pay. 

I can’t get anyone to mow my yard for under $50 and my yard can be done in approx 1.25 hours. 

After benefits, gas to and from work, that’s barely a paycheck.

The math is not entirely their fault. Most young people don’t do math in their head well. And applied mathematics is something many seem to have zero experience with. 

I don’t know anyone of any age or qualification who is having a different job hunting experience than AngieW describes.  

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I know that my daughters would be thrilled to find a $15/hr job doing either manual labor or basic math, but there are some reasons it might not work for them. For one, they’re teens under child labor laws.  One loves her job and is unlikely to leave for more money. They both have limited transportation.  They’re better off in a flexible environment to be able to request off for educational and volunteer opportunities as well as family time before they head out to college or “adult work”.

My son, otoh, wants a job in a certain industry. It doesn’t pay quite as much, but it’s an environment he’s comfortable in, and that’s what he wants to do until he finishes his degree in the real area he wants to be in. He cannot perform manual labor and would hate a life of doing basic math. (He likes to ponder theoretical mathematics for fun.)

I have a relative looking for non-highly-skilled work, but her messy life and mental health have made her an unreliable employee.

I would like to make $15/hr, but a traditional 40 hour work week isn’t right for my lifestyle.

Most of my adult friends (even younger adults) are settled in to higher paying jobs/careers with seniority, using their skills/trades.

And my area has a big drug problem (like many if not most areas.). I think employing people in recovery is SUPER important, but recovery is a very precarious thing, and many people aren’t even there yet.

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That explains why my son was hired part time yet he’s ended up working 36 hours a week for months. They keep asking him to come in early or stay late. It’s summer and he has nothing else going on so he’s been taking the hours to save up for a new (to him) car. He’s learning it’s ok to say no; especially when they ask him to come in at 5am.  I told him all you have to do is show up on time, put your phone away, and be proactive and you’ll stand out. It turned out to be true. 

Same time last year he applied to a bunch of places and never got a response from any of them. I do think a lot of businesses were waiting to see how the minimum wage would affect them and now they may have burned a few potentially good employees. 

 

 

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We are a small business that has hired workers in the past (and employ two people part time now).  We live in the midwest, below average cost of living but not like super the cheapest.  

$15 is not enough.  For full time work you have to pay a living wage, and if you have no benefits (read: subsidized health care), which I totally understand not carrying and we don't, you need enough to cover that too.  We pay $20 minimum, for work that doesn't even require a high school degree but does require someone who will do it regularly, accurately, and without flaking out.  We had a decent part time worker who we were willing to take full time eventually but he preferred to keep his other full time job, which had benefits.  We were paying him more but health care is just too difficult to square for some people (most?) and they want the security, which I understand.

Anyway, all that is to say, $15 is just not enough.

We're conservatives who would prefer fewer government subsidies/programs and more good-paying jobs, so we have to put our money where our mouth is; I can't hire someone expecting them to make up in government programs or assistance what I'm unwilling to pay them in wages for honest work.  It just doesn't make sense.  

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51 minutes ago, Medicmom2.0 said:

It’s the same here. My partner at work owns a small restaurant and can’t find servers that will actually show up and work. He pays above the going rate plus tips, and it’s one of those places that attracts people with money who tip well. I walked out with $150 in tips the one time I waitressed for him for two hours.  Another friend owns a landscaping business. He can’t find people who want to do that type of work and will actually work, not hang out on their phone.  My own place of work can’t find people, but that’s more to do with the low rate of certified paramedics.  

I know unemployment is low, but I also think there’s a lot of people who are looking for the easiest job out there.  We also live in an area that has been hit hard with opiates, and I think the amount of drug addiction plays a part.

 

Yes, this means that the good workers, if there are fewer of them due to drug addiction issues, can demand a higher base rate.  There are still people who want and need jobs and will do a good job, but they're in demand and so have to be paid more to keep them.  

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15 hours ago, Shellydon said:

I have helped three different smaller business look for employees this summer.   Business 1 needs someone 40 hours a week at $15 per hour. The pay could increase and there benefits like PTO and some health insurance. The work requires some physical labor like moving chairs and tables, painting, occasional mowing of grounds among other tasks. Not skilled labor, just basic work.  Has the potential for raises.   3 months in and they have had zero luck in finding someone.  Business 2 needs someone that can run a cash register and do basic math (convert inches into feet and feet into yards, know multiplication tables), also must show up on time and be friendly and helpful.  Also pays $15 per how and has potential for raises. This business has huge trouble finding someone that can do the basic math. They have hired 4 people over the course of the summer and all have been fired or quit. 2 would show up hours late or not at all and could not understand why that is an issue.  1 quit because 'working was too hard.'  One stated that he has to quit and stay home starting in August-February to watch football.  Business 3 can't find someone and owner is working 80 hours a week to keep up.

How do businesses find employs that are willing to put forth effort and/or can do basic skills like multiply?

 

 

I work for a small-medium business (~100 employees). They have complained of the same thing. They just keep looking and hold onto the good ones when they find them.

 

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Businesses who want experienced, reliable workers need to pay more than $15 an hour for a 40 hour a week job.  There is too much competition for employees meeting those criteria.  

On the other hand, there are people looking for part-time work.  These include students, senior citizens, and stay at home parents looking to return to the workforce but who need to work around school schedules.  Businesses offering part-time positions with flexible scheduling are attractive to these job seekers.  

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16 hours ago, Shellydon said:

I have helped three different smaller business look for employees this summer.   Business 1 needs someone 40 hours a week at $15 per hour. The pay could increase and there benefits like PTO and some health insurance. The work requires some physical labor like moving chairs and tables, painting, occasional mowing of grounds among other tasks. Not skilled labor, just basic work.  Has the potential for raises.   3 months in and they have had zero luck in finding someone.  Business 2 needs someone that can run a cash register and do basic math (convert inches into feet and feet into yards, know multiplication tables), also must show up on time and be friendly and helpful.  Also pays $15 per how and has potential for raises. This business has huge trouble finding someone that can do the basic math. They have hired 4 people over the course of the summer and all have been fired or quit. 2 would show up hours late or not at all and could not understand why that is an issue.  1 quit because 'working was too hard.'  One stated that he has to quit and stay home starting in August-February to watch football.  Business 3 can't find someone and owner is working 80 hours a week to keep up.

How do businesses find employs that are willing to put forth effort and/or can do basic skills like multiply?

 

 

What do you mean by "some insurance"? Do the other two offer insurance? For someone who is an adult, insurance can be a big detail when making job choices. They might take the "without" for a while, but as soon as they find something that does offer it, they need to take it. On a different note, the football watcher and the one who thought it was too hard have unreasonable expectations of work. 

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The unemployment rate makes it tough.  I am always getting offered work and turning down work.  Everyone is desperate.  Also, most employers are struggling to keep up with wages.  I work part time for a man who wants to pay carpenters $9/hour when target's starting wage is like 13 or 14 now?  He can only hire convicts and they stay like three days.  I cannot for the life of me convince him to change his strategy.  

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Figure out how much that person is going to make after paying OOP for health insurance and day care and that's probably your answer.

People with kids, especially, will take lower pay for good health care. By the end of the year, we will have easily needed over $10k worth of medical, dental & orthodontic care this year... without getting sick. That's three people aged 10-45, theoretically very healthy years. That's about 17 weeks' work at $15/hour x 40 hours a week: you work four months out of the year just for health care.

Of course people who are good at math would rather work for a bigger company.

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6 minutes ago, QueenCat said:

 

What do you mean by "some insurance"? Do the other two offer insurance? For someone who is an adult, insurance can be a big detail when making job choices. They might take the "without" for a while, but as soon as they find something that does offer it, they need to take it. On a different note, the football watcher and the one who thought it was too hard have unreasonable expectations of work. 

 

Honestly “some” insurance can be way way worse than no insurance. In some states if you have any insurance at all, no one in their household may be able to get any assistance at all.  I know people who are paying 20% or more of their low income for healthcare that by law they have to accept but the OOP expenses are so nuts they can’t afford to use it. They would be better off with state insurance for their kids or whatever but they don’t qualify  for it. They also don’t qualify for help with pharmaceutical needs like diabetic medications.

Between the pay and “some” insurance - I’m not surprised they can’t find steady help. 

As for football or too hard. *shrug* If the pay doesn’t support them then I wouldn’t rearrange my life enjoyment around it either. And for many people what seems easy about a job can be difficult. Such as standing or sitting for long periods.

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I just finished helping a company hire a part time admin. At $15/hr, the candidates were not good. This is a part time, make your own hours, lots of room for creativity and fun stuff like growing social media presence, etc. With paid time off (3 weeks vacation to start plus whatever they needed for sick time). They didn't get any quality candidates until they went up to $17.50/hr. 

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I will say as someone who is toying with the idea of getting a full-time job,  I wouldn't even send in an application for a job that didn't have full benefits meaning good insurance, paid time off, maternity leave, some form of retirement matching, etc. that started at $15/hr.  Being told that there is possibility for raises wouldn't be enticing because I've seen enough small businesses not be able to give normal cost of living raises let along performances raises.  

I would consider a part time job at $15/hr and would send in an application.  But if they offered me a job I'd be negotiating that wage hard and would likely not actually accept most small business jobs at that wage.  

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I finished my first year as an Educational Assistant in a high school (low pay, benefits are there but I'm covered by dh so not helpful to me). Small sample size, but I see a big difference in work ethic and educational skills in EAs from my generation vs. EAs hired just out of college. There is a pattern that these younger workers take lots of breaks (beyond what we officially get), have phones out when they're "working", and I haven't seen one yet who knows Algebra 1 really well (compared to 3 of us older folk). They have at least AA degrees and many have college degrees too. The district really gets their money's worth from the older EAs; some of the young ones provide no added value in my opinion. Not worth having.

 

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The basic math skills issue isn't just confined to our current times or to folks who aren't college educated.

I used to train people with bachelor's degrees in biology right out of college for jobs in a biochemistry lab.  They had serious problems learning how to do the basic 8th grade level calculations necessary to perform the work of the lab.  And it wasn't just one or two of them--it was *all* of them (something like 15 people over the years).  This was 25-30 years ago.

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Many of you live in much higher cost of living areas than I do. $15 an hour is more than double minimum wage. $15 an hour is more than the state minimum requirement for school districts to pay teachers.  All of the jobs do not require any previous skills and provide on-the-job training. If people manage to show up on time for 6 months, then raises would definitely happen. I've helped do some interviews over the last couple of days and I am agreeing with the fact that  lots of people do not want to work.   It is absolutely stunning to me what I'm hearing people say. I have been told countless of times now that people would rather receive federally subsidized housing, food stamps etc than work.   I'll talk to the companies that contacting the local school districts and seeing if that helps him find some reliable employees. Good idea! 

 

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14 minutes ago, Shellydon said:

Many of you live in much higher cost of living areas than I do. $15 an hour is more than double minimum wage. $15 an hour is more than the state minimum requirement for school districts to pay teachers.  All of the jobs do not require any previous skills and provide on-the-job training. If people manage to show up on time for 6 months, then raises would definitely happen. I've helped do some interviews over the last couple of days and I am agreeing with the fact that  lots of people do not want to work.   It is absolutely stunning to me what I'm hearing people say. I have been told countless of times now that people would rather receive federally subsidized housing, food stamps etc than work.   I'll talk to the companies that contacting the local school districts and seeing if that helps him find some reliable employees. Good idea! 

 

 

This does not surprise me at all because there was a point in time where dh didn't seek a higher paying job which was guaranteed because if he did we would no longer qualify for Medicaid but the pay increase would result in a net lose because of the cost of paying for insurance out of pocket.  

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32 minutes ago, HeighHo said:

 

its not that they don't want to work, they want to have something left over when they pay their housing, transportation, health care, and food expenses.  And some of them will cause others in the household to lose benefits if they don't know to say 'we don't eat together'.   If you add up what they get in bennies, you'll find what you need to pay. At $15 an hour here, they are getting close to losing their housing voucher if single, and there is no way to make up for it if substantial overtime isn't available...theyll be out on the street or doubling up with another family as there isn't any housing they can get on their own at market rate.   It makes no sense for them to take any job that pays $1 more than what qualifies for housing voucher unless its enough for them to get a place to live on 40% or less of their gross.  Then add in losing medicaid or chip. 

 No, I have been told many times today " I don't want to work"  " I don't like to get up"  " I would rather play video games all day, so don't expect me to come back after lunch if I get this job"

Are there people who want to work, sure.  Are there just as many or more who don't.  Yes.  

If receiving benefits is causing people to sit at home, then we need to change something.

 

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I live in Oklahoma. By nearly all accounts a LCOL state. And $15 an hour is not enough to support themselves. My sons who live on “their own” each have 2 roommates.  They have 2 bedroom apts and the third roommate uses the sofa. Neither of them have car payments. One pays his own car insurance, the other can’t afford it while in college.

That other people are also crappily paid doesn’t make $15 spend any better.  Our schools here are awful and our police are ridiculously understaffed and medical here is not any better than the schools or the police depts.  Much of which is because all of them are not paid a decent wage. 

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22 hours ago, Where's Toto? said:

My daughter is the manager of a clothing store in our local mall.  She is going crazy trying to find employees.  She gets people who think the work is too hard (hanging up clothes?!?), don't want to come in on schedule, or have constant ongoing issues.

Retail can actually be quite physically demanding. In addition to hanging up clothes, you are: carrying those heavy stacks of clothes in order to hang them, standing for hours on end, lifting/moving/unpacking heavy boxes, setting up and taking down displays, cleaning uable messes in the changing room, dealing with irate and unreasonable customers, all kinds of things. It is indeed a hard job, and that schedule? Is usually unreasonable and frequently changed. 

I get so tired of the commentary on certain jobs - hanging up clothes?!? flipping burger?!? cashier at Walmart?!?  Like those jobs are easy and those employees aren't working hard and don't deserve decent wages. 

On 8/6/2019 at 4:54 PM, Shellydon said:

I have helped three different smaller business look for employees this summer.   Business 1 needs someone 40 hours a week at $15 per hour. The pay could increase and there benefits like PTO and some health insurance. The work requires some physical labor like moving chairs and tables, painting, occasional mowing of grounds among other tasks. Not skilled labor, just basic work.  Has the potential for raises.   3 months in and they have had zero luck in finding someone.  Business 2 needs someone that can run a cash register and do basic math (convert inches into feet and feet into yards, know multiplication tables), also must show up on time and be friendly and helpful.  Also pays $15 per how and has potential for raises. This business has huge trouble finding someone that can do the basic math. They have hired 4 people over the course of the summer and all have been fired or quit. 2 would show up hours late or not at all and could not understand why that is an issue.  1 quit because 'working was too hard.'  One stated that he has to quit and stay home starting in August-February to watch football.  Business 3 can't find someone and owner is working 80 hours a week to keep up.

How do businesses find employs that are willing to put forth effort and/or can do basic skills like multiply?

 

That's a supplementary income, not a living wage. I don't work for $15/hour unless there are other benefits: flexible schedule, work from home, picking up a new skill, that type of thing. These jobs basically sound like no benefits and no room for advancement - I get that there is maybe possibly a raise in the future, but it doesn't like there will be promotions and such. Basically, not jobs you can support yourself with. When they do find a good employee, they aren't likely to last long because they will move on to something better that pays the rent. They might try heavy part-time with flexible hours, perhaps working around the schedule of a parent who has kids in school. Basic skills can be taught. 

11 hours ago, moonflower said:

 Anyway, all that is to say, $15 is just not enough.

We're conservatives who would prefer fewer government subsidies/programs and more good-paying jobs, so we have to put our money where our mouth is; I can't hire someone expecting them to make up in government programs or assistance what I'm unwilling to pay them in wages for honest work.  It just doesn't make sense.  

Exactly, those pesky employees need food and shelter and whatnot, lol. 

10 hours ago, Margaret in CO said:

 She's willing to clock out at 5, but come back at 6:30 and do another 2 hour shift, dragging the arena for the barrel racers. They've not had an employee willing to do that. 

I understand not being willing to do that. When I worked fast food back in the stone age, the manager would sometimes ask (during a slow period), do you want to clock out? And I'd always answer, do you want me to be done for the day, lol?  

2 hours ago, Shellydon said:

Many of you live in much higher cost of living areas than I do. $15 an hour is more than double minimum wage. $15 an hour is more than the state minimum requirement for school districts to pay teachers.  All of the jobs do not require any previous skills and provide on-the-job training. If people manage to show up on time for 6 months, then raises would definitely happen. I've helped do some interviews over the last couple of days and I am agreeing with the fact that  lots of people do not want to work.   It is absolutely stunning to me what I'm hearing people say. I have been told countless of times now that people would rather receive federally subsidized housing, food stamps etc than work.   I'll talk to the companies that contacting the local school districts and seeing if that helps him find some reliable employees. Good idea!

More than double minimum wage doesn't go far, honestly. When you hear people say that they would prefer to get subsidized housing and other benefits rather than work, do keep in mind that it's often because the proposed wages won't keep them in housing and food, much less medical care. 

On-the-job training, yes, but not training that is going to lead to anything. The good employees they are searching for are looking for jobs that have room to advance. 

1 hour ago, Murphy101 said:

 That other people are also crappily paid doesn’t make $15 spend any better.   

Indeed. And I would add that the other jobs mentioned offer medical and other benefits that are worth quite a bit of money. 

2 hours ago, Shellydon said:

 If receiving benefits is causing people to sit at home, then we need to change something.

Yes, like wages, lol. 

2 hours ago, Shellydon said:

For reference, a nice apartment with granite counters, pool, covered parking is $500-$600 per month with 2 bedrooms.     

That is indeed insanely low for an apartment, where the heck are you? At any rate, they still need a car and food and that pesky medical care. Even a short hospital stay without insurance can devastate finances. 

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2 hours ago, Shellydon said:

 No, I have been told many times today " I don't want to work"  " I don't like to get up"  " I would rather play video games all day, so don't expect me to come back after lunch if I get this job"

Are there people who want to work, sure.  Are there just as many or more who don't.  Yes.  

If receiving benefits is causing people to sit at home, then we need to change something.

 

 

Then what these experiences should be teaching you is that the wage is not competitive enough to get people who want to work to apply.  You mention starting wages for teachers and police but what you aren't taking into account is those jobs get full benefits, something the small businesses your helping aren't doing.  

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1 hour ago, HeighHo said:

why are they coming to an interview for a job they don't want?  are they satisfying unemployment's reqt of looking for work as well as passing your phone interview?

Would going to an interview and explicitly saying that you don't want the job satisfy the requirement of looking for work? I realize they can't check every last detail, but it seems a risky business. 

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4 minutes ago, katilac said:

Retail can actually be quite physically demanding. In addition to hanging up clothes, you are: carrying those heavy stacks of clothes in order to hang them, standing for hours on end, lifting/moving/unpacking heavy boxes, setting up and taking down displays, cleaning uable messes in the changing room, dealing with irate and unreasonable customers, all kinds of things. It is indeed a hard job, and that schedule? Is usually unreasonable and frequently changed. 

 

I've done tons of retail, most of it a lot more flexible and a lot more physical than what dd's store deals with.   They've had physically disabled people working there and are able to accommodate.  They don't have to lift stacks at a time, don't have to stand for hours, don't have to lift heavy boxes, and they are willing to give a set schedule around classes or other jobs.    The majority of their employees are 18-25 years old, they promote very quickly if someone is willing to actually show up for work.   The one who complained it was too hard was checking tags on clothes hanging on the rack.  Nothing more strenuous than sliding hangers.

They do have to deal with customers and clean up dressing rooms, but the worst was people leaving food or drinks in there. 

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4 minutes ago, Where's Toto? said:

They don't have to lift stacks at a time, don't have to stand for hours, don't have to lift heavy boxes, and they are willing to give a set schedule around classes or other jobs.     

How do you work retail without standing for hours? That's great that they'll give a set schedule, that's rare ime. 

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4 hours ago, hjffkj said:

 

This does not surprise me at all because there was a point in time where dh didn't seek a higher paying job which was guaranteed because if he did we would no longer qualify for Medicaid but the pay increase would result in a net lose because of the cost of paying for insurance out of pocket.  

THIS is huge.  Our benefits system needs to be revamped.  My kids on SSI net under $1/hour at times working vs what they would get NOT working.  There is no great phase out for Medicaid.  If you are $1 over the limit you lose it all.  This is a serious consideration for me.  I need to weight the costs/benefits of getting a full time job with working part time and keeping my benefits.

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28 minutes ago, StellaM said:

Dd works retail in the summer (for more than $15/hour!)

Her major quibble re retail is flaky managers who do a poor job of managing, and rude customers.

She looks for employers with good, well trained managers, and competitive wages.  

 

I used to wonder about that when I worked retail. Those who would show up reliably, but do no work, were the ones who got promoted.

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1 hour ago, hjffkj said:

 

Then what these experiences should be teaching you is that the wage is not competitive enough to get people who want to work to apply.  You mention starting wages for teachers and police but what you aren't taking into account is those jobs get full benefits, something the small businesses your helping aren't doing.  

 

She also isn’t taking into account that teachers, nurses, social work jobs, and police are leaving those jobs in droves or never entering them to begin with because of those wages not being viewed as decent compensation for the work being done. 

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A small restaurant in my town just announced it is closing until after Labor Day because they couldn’t find enough workers for the amount of business they were getting. They are planing to reopen once the summer season is over (tourist town). Here though most jobs ek hat a only paying $9.00 per hour, and with school starting all the teens are going to have to stop working. 

 

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1 hour ago, Ottakee said:

THIS is huge.  Our benefits system needs to be revamped.  My kids on SSI net under $1/hour at times working vs what they would get NOT working.  There is no great phase out for Medicaid.  If you are $1 over the limit you lose it all.  This is a serious consideration for me.  I need to weight the costs/benefits of getting a full time job with working part time and keeping my benefits.

Totally agree! 

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5 hours ago, Shellydon said:

For reference, a nice apartment with granite counters, pool, covered parking is $500-$600 per month with 2 bedrooms.    Starting police offers make $18 an hour.

We paid more than that 20+ years ago in the Twin Cities and didn’t have granite countertops. In my state, the cost of living is high even in rural and generally less desirable areas due to housing shortages and the proliferation of vacation rentals in any remotely touristy area. It makes me sick to think that my mom will only get about $100k for her beautiful, impeccably maintained home on a large lot with garage and large shed in the rural Midwest. But on the other hand, it will be a wonderful home for some hard working middle income family.

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1 hour ago, Ottakee said:

THIS is huge.  Our benefits system needs to be revamped.  My kids on SSI net under $1/hour at times working vs what they would get NOT working.  There is no great phase out for Medicaid.  If you are $1 over the limit you lose it all.  This is a serious consideration for me.  I need to weight the costs/benefits of getting a full time job with working part time and keeping my benefits.

Yes, the benefits cliff is very real in the US. I think it’s one reason the earned income tax credit has so much bipartisan support. It actually rewards people for working. While it certainly could be improved (especially for those without children), it’s better in many ways to simply give money directly as it does. Some sort of universal healthcare would also go a long ways to allowing people to pursue jobs and businesses they really want, rather than chasing medical benefits.

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1 hour ago, Murphy101 said:

 

She also isn’t taking into account that teachers, nurses, social work jobs, and police are leaving those jobs in droves or never entering them to begin with because of those wages not being viewed as decent compensation for the work being done. 

 

Very true, I hadn't thought of that.

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1 hour ago, City Mouse said:

A small restaurant in my town just announced it is closing until after Labor Day because they couldn’t find enough workers for the amount of business they were getting. They are planing to reopen once the summer season is over (tourist town). 

Why not simply open to whatever capacity they can serve? 🤷‍♀️

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I am paid about USD15 an hour. I have a Master's but spent many years outside the workforce. My work offers guaranteed pay rises, lots of training to prepare me for better jobs, a pension, 30 days of paid holiday, tons of paid sick leave and lots of job security. My taxes provide the health care.  

Wage levels only mean something as part of an overall picture.

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