WDYT- Diet and health in America

[Reefgazer]

On ‎6‎/‎9‎/‎2019 at 8:08 AM, soror said:

After letting myself get a little jaded with the false promises of AIP for my thyroid disease I'm trying to find balance again in healthy eating. I am trying to focus on whole foods now and hitting somewhere between eating well but not letting it be my whole life. I'm annoyed at how complicated food is in America. I'm annoyed at the diet wars trying to vie for their place in the spotlight and even more annoyed with the faction that says it just doesn't matter. 

Is there any way to turn around eating in America? I  worry with the obesity rates other health problems keep growing, I worry about the world my children will be raising their children in. I worry that we are normalizing things that aren't normal (like my husband being told his recently diagnosed fatty liver is NBD). I'm p*ssed that we mock people trying to better food choices like it is some kind of joke.

 

For myself, I know that I grab unhealthy fast food when I am tired, rushed, or both.  I think our fast-paced lifestyle contributes to grabbing unhealthy food for many reasons, and to fix this, we will need to dial back our lives and slow down.  I think dialing back our lives, slowing down, spending real time with our families, making time for leisure, etc...would actually help us eat better.  I do not see this happening on a large scale, but certainly, individual families can re-set their lives to do this.

[Soror]

5 hours ago, Donna said:

I agree. For real change to occur, children need to be taught healthy eating habits. Children need to be offered healthy foods in order to develop a taste for them rather than fried foods and sugar. 

While visiting nursery schools in the slums of Bangkok, I was amazed at the lunches the children were offered...seasoned rice or noodles served with steamed vegetables and some sort of protein and a piece of fruit. The food was delicious, freshly prepared, and whole/not processed. I wondered how these schools in poverty stricken areas were able to get children's lunches so right while American schools with much more resources do it so wrong. 

 

3 hours ago, Laura Corin said:

The lunches when I taught at a (public) high school in France were amazing.  Starter, main, fruit, wine for the staff...  I remember dishes like lamb cutlets on a bed of lentils with a green veg.

Yes! I never did baby food or kids food, they joined in eating what we ate. Now they have some junk food but mostly it is simple food mostly from scratch. School lunches are just so terrible. I remember Jamie Oliver came over and worked on changing lunches but he was mocked and they just went back to what they served before, they said the kids wouldn't eat it anyway. I think it has to start at home though and that is a hard sell.

 

 

 

3 minutes ago, Reefgazer said:

For myself, I know that I grab unhealthy fast food when I am tired, rushed, or both.  I think our fast-paced lifestyle contributes to grabbing unhealthy food for many reasons, and to fix this, we will need to dial back our lives and slow down.  I think dialing back our lives, slowing down, spending real time with our families, making time for leisure, etc...would actually help us eat better.  I do not see this happening on a large scale, but certainly, individual families can re-set their lives to do this.

I completely agree there, our lives are too busy for sure. I've pulled our schedule back a couple of times in this world you have to fight to keep downtime. 

fwiw I generally am a fast worker too, my dh is slow and methodical in everything even if he had my experience cooking he'd never be as fast. I take advantage of shortcuts sometimes now that I didn't before, mostly homemade is good enough and when I have more time and energy I do more. Yesterday we had a potluck, I spent 6 hrs on ribs, homemade rub, storebought sauce. steamer bag corn w/ a bit of butter added and then samplings from the potluck. Tonight will be tacos- homemade seasoning for the beef and beans (dried cooked in the Instant pot a huge time save), homemade guac- store bought salsa and shells. Good enough. Some nights if I'm in a real rush it is ff canned refried beans. I almost always buy spaghetti sauce, I can make a quick sauce but a jar is even quicker

[Laura Corin]

22 minutes ago, soror said:

 

I remember Jamie Oliver came over and worked on changing lunches but he was mocked and they just went back to what they served before, they said the kids wouldn't eat it anyway. I think it has to start at home though and that is a hard sell.

Jamie Oliver had a hard time trying to do the same in the UK.  At least here his not-very-posh background (his parents ran a pub, but that probably doesn't mean they owned it) made it a bit easier for people not to feel preached at.  It's a whole different thing when someone comes from overseas to tell you what to do.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jamie's_School_Dinners

[Liz CA]

On 6/10/2019 at 2:36 PM, Jean in Newcastle said:

I don't think that things have gone from bad to worse.  As others have mentioned, there is so much available out there now in healthy choices and choices that fit different dietary needs.  A lot has changed when I was wheat free 25 years ago and people would tell me that a slice of bread was ok to eat because "it was white bread, not wheat."  🙄  Though I still do have people who try to tell me that I shouldn't eat eggs because they aren't dairy free. . .  

All I have to do to find special recipes is to type in "keto dinners" or "paleo dinners" or "gluten free, dairy free ________" and I get recipes popping up on my computer.  I can use apps to find gluten free choices at various restaurants, including fast food if I really needed to for financial reasons or because I'm in an area with very few choices.  My grocery store has chopped up fruits and vegetables in the produce section if I want them for extra ease and convenience, even if they are more expensive.  There are frozen food companies like Amy's which have gluten free, vegan choices which might not be my tastiest choice but can help out if I need something very quick.  I can get fresh salads from the deli as well as rotisserie chicken.  One grocery store I shop at has a full salad bar. 

I have noticed that if I bring more healthy options to a potluck or to church, there are always takers.  I don't care if people also take a donut or slice of cake too even if I can't. 

 

Agree that generally we have more options and convenience. I am still concerned though about eating habits of some of the younger generation. We live near universities and also countless healthy food choices but for young people convenience and price seems to be a factor. A student or someone in their first or even second job may not be able to afford the local co-op or even the organic produce at Raleys or may not have the skills or the time to prepare homemade food. I know this is totally silly but if we imagined - for just a moment - no fast food available (by this I mean McDonalds type fare) and everyone had to do some minimal preparing, I wonder if we would see a change. On the other hand is a lot of the less expensive, commercially grown food, inferior in nutrition or even harmful (endocrine toxins) that may only be marginally better than fast food. I suppose education about quality of food at a young age and continuous education about food preparation may counteract some of the tendency to run by Burger King for a quick dinner.

Then there are other issues that affect digestion / metabolism that have little to do with food choice like Jean said but appear to be rooted in the complex mechanism that is the human body. I think those cases are in a different category than "general eating habits in the U.S" as they relate to medical conditions.

[Jean in Newcastle]

11 minutes ago, Liz CA said:

 

Agree that generally we have more options and convenience. I am still concerned though about eating habits of some of the younger generation. We live near universities and also countless healthy food choices but for young people convenience and price seems to be a factor. A student or someone in their first or even second job may not be able to afford the local co-op or even the organic produce at Raleys or may not have the skills or the time to prepare homemade food. I know this is totally silly but if we imagined - for just a moment - no fast food available (by this I mean McDonalds type fare) and everyone had to do some minimal preparing, I wonder if we would see a change. On the other hand is a lot of the less expensive, commercially grown food, inferior in nutrition or even harmful (endocrine toxins) that may only be marginally better than fast food. I suppose education about quality of food at a young age and continuous education about food preparation may counteract some of the tendency to run by Burger King for a quick dinner.

Then there are other issues that affect digestion / metabolism that have little to do with food choice like Jean said but appear to be rooted in the complex mechanism that is the human body. I think those cases are in a different category than "general eating habits in the U.S" as they relate to medical conditions.

Hasn't this been true for countless generations of young people?  Ok - maybe not countless but even in the 70's and 80's college students existed on Cup-0-noodle soup, ramen and McDonald's (or an equivalent).  I know that I did.  Maybe that contributed to my weight problems but I would kill to be as slim as I was back then! 

Note:  I'm not touting this as a healthy thing.  My own college student has made bulk batches of taco meat or spaghetti and lived off of it for a week.  Or has gotten frozen meals to pop into the college microwave - which I realize is still not as healthy as homemade but still better than fast food, I think.  Which I think is a step up from Cup-o-noodle soup! 

And we can't afford the expensive college meal plans but a lot of the food offered now at colleges is gourmet in comparison to back when I went to school. 

[Liz CA]

1 hour ago, Jean in Newcastle said:

Hasn't this been true for countless generations of young people?  Ok - maybe not countless but even in the 70's and 80's college students existed on Cup-0-noodle soup, ramen and McDonald's (or an equivalent).  I know that I did.  Maybe that contributed to my weight problems but I would kill to be as slim as I was back then! 

Note:  I'm not touting this as a healthy thing.  My own college student has made bulk batches of taco meat or spaghetti and lived off of it for a week.  Or has gotten frozen meals to pop into the college microwave - which I realize is still not as healthy as homemade but still better than fast food, I think.  Which I think is a step up from Cup-o-noodle soup! 

And we can't afford the expensive college meal plans but a lot of the food offered now at colleges is gourmet in comparison to back when I went to school. 

 

Yes, it's absolutely been like that for some decades - starting with "fast food" in the post WWII era. This probably goes beyond the scope but I have read some interesting articles on how generational DNA has changed due to deteriorating quality of food. So if someone started to subsist on fast food in the fifties, this person may present with some of the effects from poor food but evidently there are some indications that subsequent generations are affected as well. If this is even only partially true then it could well be that  some people can eat the healthiest of diets but are somehow predisposed to metabolic issues. And I want to make clear that I am not a medical researcher but have only read articles on this relating to some aspect of my work.

What would be a solution? It's a bit of a mess. Local farmers who want to offer good quality food have a difficult time making a living without setting a certain price point which is often prohibitively high for young people or even older people on a lower income.  (We could not have afforded going exclusively organic 10-15 years ago) .Then there is the mindset of prioritizing. If young people can afford $100+ cell phone plans, would they choose to have a less expensive gadget so they could afford better nutrition if quality of food was emphasized along with a focus on long-term health?  Some people have neither - the expensive cell phone nor the ability to afford better quality food. 

Dh and I are now at an age where we value our health more than we did 20-30 years ago. Fortunately, we can prioritize and spend more on food but I realize this is not everyone's option. And I don't know if we can "erase" effects of most of the poor food choices we made in the past. We are just doing the best we can with what we have.

Edited June 13, 2019 by Liz CA

[Joker]

The older I get the more I believe our health has much more to do with genes than anything else. I also think worrying so much about food isn't good for any of us. 

Most of my family is obese yet they are all super healthy and live long lives (while eating mostly fried and fast foods). One of my grandfathers was morbidly obese but lived well into his 90s and was never sick. He was only hospitalized once for the flu at age 85. He wasn't on any medications either for blood sugar, blood pressure, or cholesterol (he took no meds at all). His doctor would always comment on how healthy he was but his house was the one with all the sodas, cookies, candy, and ice cream. He ate fried food and fast food every single day I was around for so at least his last 35 years. I know all of his siblings died young during the Depression so it wasn't like he had a great start either. So much of my family is overweight but they don't worry about food and aren't trying to diet all the time. They just eat what they like and don't seem to care about the weight. They are all healthy too. 

I spent years nagging my own ds about his diet and lack of wanting to eat but this past year he was on his own at college and it was his healthiest year ever - but he ate nothing but junk! Seriously, he would only eat one actual meal a day and it was usually fast food delivery or pizza from the dorm yet he didn't have so much as the sniffles while students all around him were battling the flu, mumps, and all other kinds of colds/respiratory bugs. And he also ended with a 4.0 so he's now not going to listen to me at all about his eating habits. I think he's too skinny and needs to add weight but he is healthy so he's not listening to us. 

I'm uncomfortable being overweight so I am trying to lose for that reason but health wise I am healthy. Always have great blood sugar/pressure and cholesterol readings. Even though I feel it's mostly genes, I feel personally better when I eat somewhat healthy so that's what I do in our home. Dh and I eat three meals a day together and breakfast is always over medium eggs, toast, avocado, and fruit. Lunch is a tuna sandwich or leftovers (usually tuna twice a week). Dinner varies but is usually a beef/chicken/fish with potatoes/rice/pasta and veggies of some sort. We eat a meal out a few times a week as well. I feel pretty confident in the kitchen but I don't love cooking. Meals, even easy ones, usually take around 45 minutes to an hour if I include washing and prepping. 

I don't think there should be any morality linked to food. That's just weird to me and probably doesn't contribute to much of a truly healthy lifestyle and diet. 

Edited June 13, 2019 by Joker

[moonflower]

1 hour ago, Joker said:

The older I get the more I believe our health has much more to do with genes than anything else. I also think worrying so much about food isn't good for any of us. 

Most of my family is obese yet they are all super healthy and live long lives (while eating mostly fried and fast foods). One of my grandfathers was morbidly obese but lived well into his 90s and was never sick. He was only hospitalized once for the flu at age 85. He wasn't on any medications either for blood sugar, blood pressure, or cholesterol (he took no meds at all). His doctor would always comment on how healthy he was but his house was the one with all the sodas, cookies, candy, and ice cream. He ate fried food and fast food every single day I was around for so at least his last 35 years. I know all of his siblings died young during the Depression so it wasn't like he had a great start either. So much of my family is overweight but they don't worry about food and aren't trying to diet all the time. They just eat what they like and don't seem to care about the weight. They are all healthy too. 

I spent years nagging my own ds about his diet and lack of wanting to eat but this past year he was on his own at college and it was his healthiest year ever - but he ate nothing but junk! Seriously, he would only eat one actual meal a day and it was usually fast food delivery or pizza from the dorm yet he didn't have so much as the sniffles while students all around him were battling the flu, mumps, and all other kinds of colds/respiratory bugs. And he also ended with a 4.0 so he's now not going to listen to me at all about his eating habits. I think he's too skinny and needs to add weight but he is healthy so he's not listening to us. 

I'm uncomfortable being overweight so I am trying to lose for that reason but health wise I am healthy. Always have great blood sugar/pressure and cholesterol readings. Even though I feel it's mostly genes, I feel personally better when I eat somewhat healthy so that's what I do in our home. Dh and I eat three meals a day together and breakfast is always over medium eggs, toast, avocado, and fruit. Lunch is a tuna sandwich or leftovers (usually tuna twice a week). Dinner varies but is usually a beef/chicken/fish with potatoes/rice/pasta and veggies of some sort. We eat a meal out a few times a week as well. I feel pretty confident in the kitchen but I don't love cooking. Meals, even easy ones, usually take around 45 minutes to an hour if I include washing and prepping. 

I don't think there should be any morality linked to food. That's just weird to me and probably doesn't contribute to much of a truly healthy lifestyle and diet. 

 

To the bolded; I don't see how you can separate morality and food.  To eat an animal product, you have to either kill the animal in the wild or raise it to be killed.  I can accept that it's not morally wrong to kill an animal in the wild or raise it to be killed (although it is a moral question to some people), but the way 95% of animal products in the US are raised is cruel and inhumane.  I haven't spoken to a single person who thinks factory farming is a morally acceptable way to treat animals, or a non-moral issue.  I also haven't spoken to anyone, other than DH and an aunt of his who died years ago, who thinks that the cruelty of factory farming has any implication for their food choices.

 

[Joker]

6 minutes ago, moonflower said:

 

To the bolded; I don't see how you can separate morality and food.  To eat an animal product, you have to either kill the animal in the wild or raise it to be killed.  I can accept that it's not morally wrong to kill an animal in the wild or raise it to be killed (although it is a moral question to some people), but the way 95% of animal products in the US are raised is cruel and inhumane.  I haven't spoken to a single person who thinks factory farming is a morally acceptable way to treat animals, or a non-moral issue.  I also haven't spoken to anyone, other than DH and an aunt of his who died years ago, who thinks that the cruelty of factory farming has any implication for their food choices.

 

While I was reading these posts, the morality issue seemed to be about choosing "junk" food over "real" food and had nothing to do with factory farmed meat. I didn't get the feeling that is what this thread was about and it definitely wasn't something I was getting into here. 

 

[marbel]

5 hours ago, Joker said:

The older I get the more I believe our health has much more to do with genes than anything else. I also think worrying so much about food isn't good for any of us. 

Most of my family is obese yet they are all super healthy and live long lives (while eating mostly fried and fast foods). One of my grandfathers was morbidly obese but lived well into his 90s and was never sick. He was only hospitalized once for the flu at age 85. 

<snip>

One of my aunties just turned 96.  She was always overweight, as was her mom, and growing up I recall eating a lot of heavy food - my grandparents were immigrants from Poland, so we ate a lot of sausage and other meat dishes, ham, lots of starchy things. Lots of desserts.  Her sisters are not overweight, but I remember comments that they always controlled their weight with lots of cigarettes and black coffee. They are about 87 and 88 or 89, I think.   Their parents were very long-lived too.  My dad (their brother) died at 75 after being a functional alcoholic for probably 30 years. He was sick enough to stay home from work only once in my memory, with some sort of bad flu in the '60s or '70s; that is, until his liver and kidney gave out from the booze.  

I eat pretty well though I lean too heavily on cheese and bread sometimes, but the way people talk about meat, eggs, butter and such, I should have high cholesterol, but my numbers are great - doctors are always amazed. I am overweight and not happy about that, but I am quite healthy.  It's got to be genetic. My dad  used to say we were good, hardy Eastern European peasant stock.  

[TechWife]

42 minutes ago, marbel said:

 I eat pretty well though I lean too heavily on cheese and bread sometimes, but the way people talk about meat, eggs, butter and such, I should have high cholesterol, but my numbers are great - doctors are always amazed. I am overweight and not happy about that, but I am quite healthy.  It's got to be genetic. My dad  used to say we were good, hardy Eastern European peasant stock.  

My husband is a fit, healthy marathon runner who has to take medication for high blood pressure. His mother did as well, although she was not as healthy overall as my husband is. His doctor has said it is definitely genetic in his case.

[HS Mom in NC]

11 hours ago, Scarlett said:

I used to watch Rachael Ray's 30 minute meals show.  I think I even bought the cookbook.  It helped me a lot.  

Many of our family's favorites came from her 30 Minute Meals book.