TheReader Posted May 24, 2019 Share Posted May 24, 2019 (edited) My car (2013 Toyota Sienna, 98K miles) is making a clunky/thunky noise. Only once I hit 70 mph, and stay there for ~10 mins or so, will it start, but once it starts, it won't go away unless you slow down (and then will probably, but not always, come back when you resume highway speeds). It has once or twice made the noise around 65 mph but mostly not until over 70. The noise is in the right front area, and sounds more like it's coming from the wheels/underneath than the engine, but who knows. The sound itself sounds exactly like if you lift up the windshield wiper and let it drop against the windshield (if you lift just the little corner that lifts easily). No lie. This led us, briefly, to consider whether a worn windshield wiper could be getting lifted by the air/wind while driving at high speeds and thunking against the windshield while driving, but that doesn't really make sense, right? The guy said it could be wheel bearings, but the sound wouldn't go away if that were the case (they are going to check anyway, just in case). They did find leaky suspension things, but I think they don't think that's got anything to do with the noise, so they're still trying to get the car to make the noise (I think they are not thrilled to have to drive it 70 mph to find the noise). So, any guesses? Gremlins? Trapped kitten? A left behind wrench that only dislodges at high speeds? It really *is* the windshield wiper and this is going to be the most expensive replacement windshield wiper ever? Harry Potter in an invisibility cloak thumping on the car trying to get my attention? I'm basically figuring they won't be able to duplicate it, even though I waited a month, until it was doing it daily, and I had confirmed exactly the conditions needed for it to make the noise......we shall see. DH is going to ask, at least, that if they get to the point in diagnostics where they have to take things apart to figure it out (and thus we incur a charge) that if they end up not finding it, we get a credit for that charge when we bring it back once it's happening all the time. Anyone care to guess? Real guesses or silly ones, your pick.... ETA: UPDATE!! The ride-along this morning (sat morning) let the guy hear the sound, and he traced it back to a loose panel up behind/under the front bumper, so he's fixing that, they're fixing the leaky suspension, and also a belt that "doesn't need to be replaced yet, but will soon" we said go ahead and do. More details in the update I posted at the bottom of the thread, but wanted to put this here so people know they can quit guessing 🙂 Thanks for playing along everyone! Edited May 25, 2019 by TheReader 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jyhwkmama Posted May 24, 2019 Share Posted May 24, 2019 You might try posting this here. These people know everything about Toyotas. (I just bought a Highlander and became a member of the forum)https://www.toyotanation.com/forum/ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKL Posted May 24, 2019 Share Posted May 24, 2019 Given all that you have said, I am thinking maybe there is something sort of loose somewhere behind your bumper (or maybe a part of your bumper) is moving toward the wheels because of "wind" when you go fast. Did anyone get down under there and look for things hanging awkwardly? A long time ago, I had a car that would start shaking at a certain speed, without fail. That speed happened to be the speed limit (55 in those days). It was great as it kept anyone from accidentally speeding. 😛 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laura Corin Posted May 24, 2019 Share Posted May 24, 2019 A friend had a mystery noise that turned out to be a plastic water bottle getting scrunched under her seat. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKL Posted May 24, 2019 Share Posted May 24, 2019 (edited) Speaking of mysteries, I had a friend whose garage would magically open whenever he drove up the driveway. It took him a while to realize his door opener had slipped behind/under his seat. I realize that has nothing to do with the noise in your car .... Edited May 24, 2019 by SKL 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheReader Posted May 24, 2019 Author Share Posted May 24, 2019 We did get down and look the first time it made the noise; cannot see anything underneath that is loose, and I had the whole front bumper "unit" (more than just the bumper, down to the area behind the radiator) replaced in....I think October-ish? November-ish?, when I had a wreck. So.....unless they did a very bad job (conceivable, I suppose), that would be odd, right? For something to be loose? But we did look underneath, because it did at first sound like something knocking against the underneath of the frame. We cannot see anything, and they cannot see anything that might be causing it. (we have it at the dealership....) Also, it just had the 90K mile tune up/check up within the last few months, so it's either something not on that checklist, or something that changed drastically since. Tire wear seems.....I don't know. DH didn't seem concerned; tires are exactly 1 yr old/18K miles old more or less. The guy today said "we will need to look at your tires, they are getting close...." but didn't seem to think they need replaced *today* or anything. And dealership "getting close" is different than normal person "getting close," in our experience. I have suggested to DH that if I stay on the feeder instead of the highway, &/or take the back way everywhere, and thus just don't drive 70mph, problem solved. He has suggested that perhaps the problem will still be there, we just won't hear it, so does not find that a viable option. Hmph. (I am actually not keen to have to avoid the highway; we live "down the highway" from everything, so this is not especially feasible w/o adding a LOT of time to our various drives places). No steering wheel shake, alignment is not off, no pulling, no excess vibrating, etc. Nothing strange except the noise. It took me a few weeks of it happening to connect the dots as to speed being a factor (and at that point I then noted down as many details as possible: running about 2K RPMs, about half-way on the temp gauge, and once it begins, if you slow down, it stops, if you speed up, it usually comes back, but the longer it does it, the slower you have to slow down in order for it to stop; it does not always come back, though, once you get it to stop). Read about wheel bearings and steering towards/away from the sound to see if that triggers it; it does not seem to trigger it. No idea what a tie rod is, LOL! I am so very not a car person. I'll put that on the list to ask the guy. The ass't manager called me back to ask if we can be available to come drive him around in it until it makes the noise, because a tech drove it, no luck; he drove it himself, for 20 miles, no luck. He wants us to come drive it in the morning and see if we can get it to happen and point it out to him when it does so they can get to the bottom of it. I am beyond impressed that he's willing to do that (I had joked to DH, "I really want to just tell them, get in the car, when it makes the noise, I'll let you know..." because I didn't want them saying they couldn't find it and giving up.....so I'm really pleased the guy asked that, himself, rather than give up). I think they maybe don't want the liability of driving a customer car at 70 mph on the highway, for 10+ minutes or so until it starts making noise. Works for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheReader Posted May 24, 2019 Author Share Posted May 24, 2019 Oh, also, no water bottles. If it hadn't done it both with & without kids in the car, I'd wonder if it wasn't random kid noise. It's not. I did also check if there was anything in the glove box, etc., that could be rolling around; nothing there, either, that I could find. If it does turn out to be the bumper or something, I wonder how that works.....all of that was paid by my insurance (the wreck was my fault; we paid the deductible) and the work was done at the dealership and it's less than 6 months ago......I really don't want to have to pay to fix something that should have been fixed correctly when they did all of that....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elegantlion Posted May 24, 2019 Share Posted May 24, 2019 Did they check the lug nuts on your tires? I had my tires changed and then a noise started that only happened on the highway. The lug nut must have flown off because the noise stopped and all the lug nuts had been intact when we started the trip. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J-rap Posted May 24, 2019 Share Posted May 24, 2019 Before I read your entire post, I was thinking wheel bearings. So, I'm glad you're having them checked. The one time we had a wheel bearing problem, the sound did go away when under a certain speed limit. I hadn't had my car checked yet though and didn't know how serious it was, and one day, the entire piece that holds both front tires -- axel? (sorry, I'm not good at naming car parts) separated and fell off. Fortunately, I was just in the public library parking lot. I'm so grateful I wasn't on the freeway. I had my two babies with me. Please have your wheel bearings checked, just in case! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happi duck Posted May 24, 2019 Share Posted May 24, 2019 Could a passenger record while it is making the sound? Is it loud enough to show up? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheReader Posted May 25, 2019 Author Share Posted May 25, 2019 1 hour ago, elegantlion said: Did they check the lug nuts on your tires? I had my tires changed and then a noise started that only happened on the highway. The lug nut must have flown off because the noise stopped and all the lug nuts had been intact when we started the trip. huh, I have no idea; I'll give it a look when we go tomorrow. That's a possibility. They did have the tires off when doing the brakes just a few months before this started, so it's possible it wasn't tightened correctly.....that's a good idea. 1 hour ago, J-rap said: Before I read your entire post, I was thinking wheel bearings. So, I'm glad you're having them checked. The one time we had a wheel bearing problem, the sound did go away when under a certain speed limit. I hadn't had my car checked yet though and didn't know how serious it was, and one day, the entire piece that holds both front tires -- axel? (sorry, I'm not good at naming car parts) separated and fell off. Fortunately, I was just in the public library parking lot. I'm so grateful I wasn't on the freeway. I had my two babies with me. Please have your wheel bearings checked, just in case! Definitely I will have them check it/them just in case; that's the kind of thing I'm afraid of. DH keeps saying "just keep driving like normal, so it gets worse enough that it shows up" (if they end up giving it back to us unfixed), and I keep saying "drive under the speed that makes the noise, in case whatever it is, is dangerous...." so it's good to hear your story so I know...yes, it could be dangerous! Thank you for telling me that; truly. 1 hour ago, happi duck said: Could a passenger record while it is making the sound? Is it loud enough to show up? I have debated that; if we can't get it to make the noise tomorrow while the mechanic/manager rides with us, and they end up sending us home, I'll have someone try. It's loud enough to hear well, as long as the radio is off, but not sure whether the recording ability of the iPhone will pick it up or not. My current plan is just not let the guy out of the car tomorrow until it makes the noise, though, LOL! DH says that may not be a viable option.....we'll see. I have a route planned out, that's my normal driving route by which time it normally does its thing, so I'm thinking if I loop him around that route (hopefully only one loop), it should do it, and he should hear it, and hopefully go, "Oh, *that* noise! That's the blah blah blah blah...we can fix that easily!" Ha! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katy Posted May 25, 2019 Share Posted May 25, 2019 DH says a couple of thoughts... around 2000 rpm is usually shifting into a higher gear, so it could be a transmission issue. He also says to check the alignment and tires somewhere else just in case. Sometimes one tire being off can cause something similar between 70-90mph and will disappear at closer to 100 mph. He also would like you to describe the sound. How loud is it? How long and fast and frequent is it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katy Posted May 25, 2019 Share Posted May 25, 2019 He also asks if it also makes the sound when you switch from drive into reverse, and if you've hit any deep pot holes or done anything weird like that recently? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katy Posted May 25, 2019 Share Posted May 25, 2019 He also says to check the rack and pinion. That is something to do with steering. http://www.carproblemzoo.com/toyota/sienna/steering-noise-problems.php Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheReader Posted May 25, 2019 Author Share Posted May 25, 2019 9 minutes ago, Katy said: DH says a couple of thoughts... around 2000 rpm is usually shifting into a higher gear, so it could be a transmission issue. He also says to check the alignment and tires somewhere else just in case. Sometimes one tire being off can cause something similar between 70-90mph and will disappear at closer to 100 mph. He also would like you to describe the sound. How loud is it? How long and fast and frequent is it? The sound is *exactly* the sound that if you go and lift the corner of the wipers away from the glass, then let it drop, it thunks when it hits the glass. That is exactly what it sounds like from inside the car -- so, a clunk/thunk, each clunk lasts about as long as it takes to say "clunk" and it's not perfectly rhythmic. So it kind of goes "k-thunk, k-thunk, k-thunkkk, kthunk/kthunk, k-thunk, kthunk/kthunk/kthunk....k-thunk...." (does that help? it's hard to type sound effects, LOL!) The pause between thunks is roughly the same length as the thunk itself. The rhythm of it is very similar/suggestive of something on the wheel hitting each rotation (or, well, maybe not because maybe the wheels/tires rotate faster than that, but it sounds like that kind of thing, if that makes sense) (only, there's nothing we could find that would be hitting, but that's the rhythm of it). It began very sporadically; we first noticed it Easter weekend, then it didn't do it again for a week or so, then a few days, then a few more days, then it did it on another long trip when I was on back roads w/high speed limits/flow of traffic, which is when I noticed that it started once I hit 70. I backed down and when I dropped below 65/70, it stopped. I stayed below 65 for a while (couple of minutes), went back up to 70/72-ish, it started up again. I slowed, it went away; sped back up, didn't come back, then did. Slowed to 65, didn't go away; slowed to 60, did go away. Sped back up, came back. Etc. After that, if I turned off the radio, I could hear it happen every time I was on the highway after that (but I would turn the radio back on and quit listening, so am not 100% sure if it does it for the duration of while I'm at 70+ or not....). It's loud enough you can *just barely* detect it, in a "did you hear that??" kind of way over the radio, but the radio is loud to be able to be heard over the noise of the road, so......if you turn off the radio, it's loud enough to hear, but still not a lot louder than the noise of the road. 8 minutes ago, Katy said: He also asks if it also makes the sound when you switch from drive into reverse, and if you've hit any deep pot holes or done anything weird like that recently? It does not make the sound when switching gears. (the brakes do squeal when wet when I reverse in the morning) I did run over a curb when turning recently, but that was after the sound had already started. Prior to the sound, in October-ish I had a wreck, and they replaced the front bumper and everything underneath, down to/including the radiator (and I guess the bar and stuff too...? A lot of stuff). Prior to the sound, in Jan/Feb-ish, I think, we had the brakes replaced (whole thing, rotors, etc.), and the 90K checklist (minus the stuff that didn't need doing b/c of replacing the radiator). The sound started in April. It did, the other day (once the sound had been happening daily) kind of stutter when I was stopping, like it took my brakes a while to engage, and then they kind of rumbled. DH said that could have been from running over/hitting a patch of rocks (we have a ton of construction around us, so that is a likely thing). It's not doing anything else weird, though. 3 minutes ago, Katy said: He also says to check the rack and pinion. That is something to do with steering. http://www.carproblemzoo.com/toyota/sienna/steering-noise-problems.php I'll ask about that; it's not steering weird or hard to control or anything, though. (I haven't looked at the link yet, so if that's irrelevant, just ignore me) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheReader Posted May 25, 2019 Author Share Posted May 25, 2019 18 minutes ago, Katy said: He also says to check the rack and pinion. That is something to do with steering. http://www.carproblemzoo.com/toyota/sienna/steering-noise-problems.php Ah, no, the noise is when I'm going straight, and turning curves doesn't make it any worse or better that I can tell. I don't think it's related to steering. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katy Posted May 25, 2019 Share Posted May 25, 2019 He's walking around slapping his knee and trying to remember which car he had made a similar noise. He says it was annoying as (expletive). He says in his case it was the hub bearings, but it would be odd to have that happen unless they put in used ones. It could also have to do with the steering pinion. Note: he's an engineer not a mechanic, but he LOVED to drive old crappy cars until we had kids and I objected to waking them up to go get him when one broke down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheReader Posted May 25, 2019 Author Share Posted May 25, 2019 4 minutes ago, Katy said: He's walking around slapping his knee and trying to remember which car he had made a similar noise. He says it was annoying as (expletive). He says in his case it was the hub bearings, but it would be odd to have that happen unless they put in used ones. It could also have to do with the steering pinion. Note: he's an engineer not a mechanic, but he LOVED to drive old crappy cars until we had kids and I objected to waking them up to go get him when one broke down. tell him thanks! LOL! It is annoying as (expletive) so I agree with his assessment. I seriously do plan to just hold the mechanic hostage, errr, convince the mechanic to ride along with me for however long it takes for the car to make the noise tomorrow. I'm beyond shocked he's willing to do that, and plan to take full advantage. It doesn't do it immediately; you have to be at 70 for at least a good 10-ish minutes first, almost like it has to warm up to it. It's crazy-weird, and not at all encouraging when you describe it and just watch the mechanic get a perplexed look on his face. If we figure anything out tomorrow, I'll update everyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dicentra Posted May 25, 2019 Share Posted May 25, 2019 Some ideas to look into: https://www.yourmechanic.com/question/it-makes-a-thumping-sound-when-driving-straight-and-it-gets-worse-when-you-go-faster-by-tony 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katy Posted May 25, 2019 Share Posted May 25, 2019 He says he'd just ask them to replace the hub bearings. They do need to warm up before you hear that noise. He says it's a safety issue and the tire could seize up, which can be catastrophic at 75 mph. The bearings are overheating. And you should do both fronts at the same time because the other side will be next. https://www.ebay.com/gds/How-to-Spot-a-Bad-Wheel-Hub-Bearing-/10000000178258760/g.html He's guessing it will cost $300-500, it would have been cheaper to do simultaneously with the brakes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheReader Posted May 25, 2019 Author Share Posted May 25, 2019 4 minutes ago, Katy said: He says he'd just ask them to replace the hub bearings. They do need to warm up before you hear that noise. He says it's a safety issue and the tire could seize up, which can be catastrophic at 75 mph. The bearings are overheating. And you should do both fronts at the same time because the other side will be next. https://www.ebay.com/gds/How-to-Spot-a-Bad-Wheel-Hub-Bearing-/10000000178258760/g.html He's guessing it will cost $300-500, it would have been cheaper to do simultaneously with the brakes. I'll ask them about it; that's highly annoying that they should have/could have done it with the brakes.....grrr. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matrips Posted May 25, 2019 Share Posted May 25, 2019 Our Odyssey once had an annoying noise at highway speeds. Ours was the left driver side. Took the mechanic ages but he finally found it. The mud flap (or something like it) by/behind the front tire was torn or loose. Crazy to think it made so much noise. I think he finally ran out of options of what else it could be. He fixed it and all was good. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheReader Posted May 25, 2019 Author Share Posted May 25, 2019 Saturday Morning Update: Problem diagnosed and they are fixing it. Yay!! We did a ride-along this morning, me driving, mechanic in the front seat listening, and I'd point at the sound every time it happened. He'd been listening out for a steady, rhythmic, continuous clunking, which it really isn't. Once he heard what I was meaning, he could hear it when it happened, too, and asked me to pull over when possible. Pulled into a parking lot for him and he got out and looked at the mud guards, the bumper, the panels in there, everything just kind of in the front that could possibly be loose and catching the wind. Found a loose panel, wiggled it a bunch, had me get in the car while he wiggled it to see if, inside the car, it sounded like the sound. It did (although, interestingly, the panel was on the left, and the sound really sounds like it's from the right when you're driving, so.....fingers crossed that's really it). He checked some more stuff, determined to start there at least and see if that stops it. He said it's definitely absolutely not the wheel bearings or anything like that, so that's good. They are also fixing the leaking rear suspension, and some belt that doesn't need replaced yet, but will soon, we said go ahead and fix it please before it becomes a problem. Should get the car back late today or possibly Monday, which is fine. Hopefully the sound will be gone, and they did say they'd discount the work, I guess due to all that front stuff having been replaced by them (well, collision side of things, not service, but still, was just replaced in October, all of that, so it should not be loose now). Or just being kind, maybe, who knows. Either way, works for me. Thanks all for playing along! 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scholastica Posted May 25, 2019 Share Posted May 25, 2019 Hope that fixes it! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanny Posted May 25, 2019 Share Posted May 25, 2019 Awesome update OP. Cool that the mechanic not only heard it, but that he was able to figure out what was causing the noise. At about 100K miles, things begin to happen. IMO, the things that matter most (for Safety reasons) are the Brakes, the Suspension and the Steering. Tires... Everything else is secondary. Enjoy your quiet car now! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.