13 yo and showers

[SKL]

7 hours ago, caedmyn said:

I am the wrong mom for girls’ days outs.  I haven’t worn makeup except a bit of concealer occasionally since my wedding 15 years ago.  I've had a manicure once, and didn’t particularly enjoy it.  I casually tweeze my brows and take 5 mins a day to fix my hair and that’s it.  I can show her basic hygenie stuff, but that's it.  I think she’s a little young for makeup anyway, and I don’t see her taking the time to apply it properly, or to wash it off at night.

I never wear make-up (never have) and rarely shave.  But I did some research for my kids, because they are different people from me.

I had thought I'd take them for a consultation where they could ask questions, but that never happened.  I do encourage them to ask questions when they get their hair done or on the rare birthday spa day.  But I also feel like I should know some of this stuff, because I am going to be the one buying stuff or approving their purchases.  I learned, for example, that most nail polish removers are kind of bad for you (especially used often), but I found some that are actually good for you, and I periodically order these.  Similar with various hair products, make-up, etc. 

I also allow my kids to watch YouTube videos about cosmetic use / hair styling etc.  I figure if they are going to use stuff, they may as well use it properly.  🙂

Edited April 12, 2019 by SKL

[PeterPan]

56 minutes ago, caedmyn said:

I am the wrong mom for girls’ days outs.  I haven’t worn makeup except a bit of concealer occasionally since my wedding 15 years ago.  I've had a manicure once, and didn’t particularly enjoy it.  I casually tweeze my brows and take 5 mins a day to fix my hair and that’s it.  I can show her basic hygenie stuff, but that's it.  I think she’s a little young for makeup anyway, and I don’t see her taking the time to apply it properly, or to wash it off at night.

The thing is, *she* is clearly asking for some help. So the point is, you can up the quality of where she gets her answers. 

[Pen]

1 hour ago, caedmyn said:

Not diagnosed, but yes.

 

I’d go for what can help make things easier, if she’d accept that—in any way you can think of.  

Shorter hair if possible.  

Probably not make up as it adds a layer of difficulty.  

Whatever deodorant or antiperspirant would be fast and easy.  

Maybe bar shampoo for when that is needed.  

I do think shower nozzles on flexible hose help with faster rinse offs.

And I do think possibly some actual practice and training with a swim suit on as to how to do a fast shower .  How to manage hair.  Maybe there are even you tube vids these days...  not to assume she has the abilities to do that...  

[mumto2]

1 hour ago, caedmyn said:

I am the wrong mom for girls’ days outs.  I haven’t worn makeup except a bit of concealer occasionally since my wedding 15 years ago.  I've had a manicure once, and didn’t particularly enjoy it.  I casually tweeze my brows and take 5 mins a day to fix my hair and that’s it.  I can show her basic hygenie stuff, but that's it.  I think she’s a little young for makeup anyway, and I don’t see her taking the time to apply it properly, or to wash it off at night.

When my Dd hit 13 I still used the same Clinique products I found thirty years before.  Dd is much more adventurous with makeup then I am and watches YouTube etc to learn how to use the products.  She also doesn’t have my product allergies........I have a good time picking out 4 or 5 items for her to try each birthday and Christmas.  She seems to really like Burt’s Bees and Neutrogena brands.   I have discovered I love Burt’s Bees lip gloss myself!

Since your Dd is the only girl she might really like to start having some girly stuff of her own.  Maybe a cute make up bag and some colored lip balm and tinted sun screen for her face.  Nothing major just a start since her friends are a bit older.

[caedmyn]

1 hour ago, prairiewindmomma said:

I think sometimes there's a misconception that beauty stores are only for learning makeup.  There is a reason that proper skin care is a (minimum) three step process. We first wash our face. We then use a toner to return the PH balance back to where it should be and to remove trace amounts of cleanser.  We then use a lotion to nourish our skin. Ideally, that lotion also contains SPF to protect our skin from UV damage.  There really is a purpose behind the products---and I think *that* would be helpful to convey regardless of whether she ever wants to add a touch of tinted lip balm or a dot of concealer. 

If you want some suggestions of products, I think all of us are happy to offer up. Currently my 10 year old uses Cetaphil face wash followed by micellar water followed by Oil of Olay sensitive skin lotion with SPF.  If we still lived closer to the equator I'd put her into a higher SPF lotion, but we don't anymore.  My teen boys use much the same process but sometimes use tea-tree oil infused wipes from Trader Joe's to deal with the occasional (but very rare) acne.

 

She’s not going to do all that.  My sister is much more of a fashionist than I am, and DD looks up to her and asks for fashion advice.  Sis also used to be an esthetician, and she suggested that DD wash her face daily, and she still only does it periodically.  DD has a bit of acne and complains about it, but rarely uses the acne product I gave her.  She may have some interest in those things, but she doesn’t have the maturity to use them regularly.

[Pen]

15 minutes ago, caedmyn said:

 

She’s not going to do all that.  My sister is much more of a fashionist than I am, and DD looks up to her and asks for fashion advice.  Sis also used to be an esthetician, and she suggested that DD wash her face daily, and she still only does it periodically.  DD has a bit of acne and complains about it, but rarely uses the acne product I gave her.  She may have some interest in those things, but she doesn’t have the maturity to use them regularly.

 

I think Atomic Habits book might help— both of you. And if you buy copy and go to author website there’s a code to get a pdf related to parenting.  You’re trying to start helping her to lay down habits bit by bit so that it will get easier for her to do basic daily hygiene routine. 

Regular face wash would be a good idea.  She’s young enough that you could probably do this for her now as part of a bedtime ritual.

a dab of calcium bentonite clay can be amazing for acne... and you could do that making a game of it before bed 

a morning wash followed by application of sunscreen lotion could help her if her skin would be prone to cancers in later life 

 

erase idea that she’s 13 and “should be “ doing her daily face wash herself    A quick 1 minute go over with a washcloth, even if you do it could help start the routine.  And could decrease dirt , oil and acne distress

[alisoncooks]

25 minutes ago, caedmyn said:

 She may have some interest in those things, but she doesn’t have the maturity to use them regularly.

This sounds like my younger DD (almost 11). She has some skin issues and is on Differin. Even though she knows she's supposed to use her cream, I literally must call her to my room each night and apply it in her face for her. 

[prairiewindmomma]

I'm with Pen on this one.

My 17 yo still forgets to brush his teeth some mornings.  His problem isn't lack of maturity. His problem is a lack of executive functioning skills, because he has ADD. I don't sit around at some point hoping he'll remember to brush and floss. I actively parent by asking and following up daily, by having him set his own alarm, and by coaching him along to develop those skills. And because of dh's blessed family genetics, I do this most of my kids.

She really needs to be washing her face daily. Really.  She should also be showering daily, especially if she stinks or has greasy hair.  This is in the realm of "get off your butt" parenting---you are getting up and going and doing it with your child, repeatedly, until all of those neurons start to fire together and it become automatic for her.  This is a good chunk of why we started to work on using timers. I just park a chair out in the hallway and keep the revolving door going through the bathroom.  In between kids showering I'm helping others get pajamas on, or tracking down gym shirts, or chatting or reading aloud a book.  If your kids don't have all of those neurons firing, then coming up with a printed checklist, laminating it (and keeping a copy for yourself handy) is going to be helpful.  Then you can just point at the list and ask them to report on each item. You want this to all eventually become automatic in their brains. For the non-ADD ones, this will happen fairly quickly. For the ADD ones, you're just beginning a marathon.  If you work on timing, you can do about 5 kids an hour with natural interruptions....so planning that from 7-8:30pm every night you're on bedtime routine duty, it will all eventually work out. Give everyone a timed slot....

[Tap]

Just throwing this out there as an alternative...

DD20 has POTS (Postural Orthostatic Tachycardia Syndrome). She was diagnosed in high school. Before she was diagnosed, she would take 45 minutes or more to shower and one day I asked her to hurry so we could leave the house faster. I thought she just lingered. She told me she couldn't go faster, because she had to take a break or two when she showered. 😟 I had no idea that is what she was doing. She she said can't hold her hands/arms over her heart for more than a few minutes or they start to ache.  It became one of the issues I would bring up with doctors to illustrate her fatigue level.  After her diagnosis, we found out that this is very common in people with POTS.  She has a shower stool now and it is much, much easier on her fatigue level, but she still only showers a couple of times per week.  It is a planned activity for her and takes her hours to recover from.  In early high school, she was high energy... a cheerleader and ran hurdles in track. I had no idea a simple thing like having her arms over her head for  a long period of time was debilitating for her.  By senior year, she was a part time student and even that was a struggle. 

[Katy]

19 hours ago, Storygirl said:

One of my kids has a history as a shower faker. Same teen also has been know to shower multiple times per day for the purpose of restyling hair.

Showering is discussed much more at my house than I ever would have predicted.

 

A lot of foster moms I know have a rule that every kid must soak in a bubble bath for at least 20 minutes every night until at least high school because they don't trust their kids to shower properly, and at least getting soapy water on their skin for 20 minutes can take care of some of the funk they refuse to take care of themselves.  Teaching a kid to actually bathe the way they should have been taught before the age of 5 is sometimes not the battle anyone wants to pick, but baths can make sure a minimum amount of cleansing will be done.

[Lawyer&Mom]

Autistic mom here:  I’m all for hygiene.  I like soap and deodorant to prevent body oder.  I brush my teeth.

But:  Face-washing, shaving, hair products, make-up?  All totally completely utterly optional.

Yes. Face washing.  Haven’t done it in years.  Face is totally fine.  I don’t use any product, I wear hats for sun protection.  Your skin can find a balance all on its own if you leave it alone.  (Go wild with skin care if that’s your thing, but you don’t *have* to do anything.)

Making these hygiene routines as simple as possible is key.  Daily bathing is absolutely the easiest to remember.  Accept that the bare minimum routine may be less than you would feel comfortable with for yourself.  I also recommend unscented products to reduce the sensory load.

 

 

 

[Pen]

If you’re homeschooling you could also do a block unit that focuses on health, hygiene, and perhaps also efficiency.  People in basic military training learn how to do 2-5 minute showers. And people in parts of world with water shortages are learning (even working out improved methods) to take short, water conserving showers at many ages and stages of life.  

[Kidlit]

17 hours ago, Tap said:

Just throwing this out there as an alternative...

DD20 has POTS (Postural Orthostatic Tachycardia Syndrome). She was diagnosed in high school. Before she was diagnosed, she would take 45 minutes or more to shower and one day I asked her to hurry so we could leave the house faster. I thought she just lingered. She told me she couldn't go faster, because she had to take a break or two when she showered. 😟 I had no idea that is what she was doing. She she said can't hold her hands/arms over her heart for more than a few minutes or they start to ache.  It became one of the issues I would bring up with doctors to illustrate her fatigue level.  After her diagnosis, we found out that this is very common in people with POTS.  She has a shower stool now and it is much, much easier on her fatigue level, but she still only showers a couple of times per week.  It is a planned activity for her and takes her hours to recover from.  In early high school, she was high energy... a cheerleader and ran hurdles in track. I had no idea a simple thing like having her arms over her head for  a long period of time was debilitating for her.  By senior year, she was a part time student and even that was a struggle. 

Thanks for sharing your story, @Tap. I am an adjunct CC instructor and just this semester I have a student with POTS.  Had I not read about that here on the forum, I wouldn’t have been as sympathetic with her plight.  

[Pen]

 

Quote

Yes. Face washing.  Haven’t done it in years.  Face is totally fine.  

 

That won’t be true for all people — similar  as some people get away with no teeth brushing and have perfect teeth.   Some people will have much reduced acne type problem if they wash face.  Others may have no acne regardless.  

Quote

I don’t use any product, I wear hats for sun protection.  

Hats work fine, but most people don’t wear them all the time these days.  No idea what caedmyn’s Dd skin type is.  Some people are not at particularly high risk from sun damage to skin.  For people who are, an early habit of protecting can be a good idea (speaking from POV of having had skin cancers, and having had a friend die from skin cancer). 

 

Quote

Making these hygiene routines as simple as possible is key.  

I agree. 

 

Quote

I also recommend unscented products to reduce the sensory load.

 

 

 

 

I don’t know a lot about sensory overload aspect, but that seems to make a lot of sense.

Additionally much scented product derives from toxic chemicals and can cause health issues... even brain fog where spacing out in a bathroom that has scented product could contribute to difficulty taking care of shower or other routines in an easy effective way.  Or even subtly feeling a little bit off from it could add to resistance to doing it.  

 

PS I totally agree with you that make up and shaving are totally optional.  

Edited April 12, 2019 by Pen

[Lawyer&Mom]

5 hours ago, Pen said:

 

 

That won’t be true for all people — similar  as some people get away with no teeth brushing and have perfect teeth.   Some people will have much reduced acne type problem if they wash face.  Others may have no acne regardless.  

Hats work fine, but most people don’t wear them all the time these days.  No idea what caedmyn’s Dd skin type is.  Some people are not at particularly high risk from sun damage to skin.  For people who are, an early habit of protecting can be a good idea (speaking from POV of having had skin cancers, and having had a friend die from skin cancer). 

 

I agree. 

 

 

I don’t know a lot about sensory overload aspect, but that seems to make a lot of sense.

Additionally much scented product derives from toxic chemicals and can cause health issues... even brain fog where spacing out in a bathroom that has scented product could contribute to difficulty taking care of shower or other routines in an easy effective way.  Or even subtly feeling a little bit off from it could add to resistance to doing it.  

 

PS I totally agree with you that make up and shaving are totally optional.  

 

You are right, I totally should wear sunscreen. Like I do wear hats, but not *all* the time.

But I’ve been struggling with just keeping my hair clean lately.  (Everything was easier before I had kids...)  The odds of me adding anything to my hygiene routine now are low.  

[Terabith]

My 13 year old is afraid of showering, but I accidentally discovered she loves shower bomb things that make scents.  I hate them, but it’s made her willing to shower.  

[EKS]

Bathing daily was and is non-negotiable here and has been since they were babies.

I would simply tell her that she must bathe every day and nothing else will happen until she does (as in no meals, rides, screen time, whatever).

[EKS]

On 4/11/2019 at 1:36 PM, caedmyn said:

Not diagnosed, but yes.

I didn't see this before responding, but if she has ADHD, then that is all the more reason to create a daily schedule (it's easier to do something every day and easier to enforce it) and stick to it.  She will need you to provide the executive function to help her turn it into a habit, but once it becomes a habit, things should get better.

[Pen]

 

12 hours ago, Lawyer&Mom said:

But I’ve been struggling with just keeping my hair clean lately.  (Everything was easier before I had kids...)  The odds of me adding anything to my hygiene routine now are low.  

 

I have trouble remembering even having had skin cancer and losing the close friend.  If it had been a habit established in childhood I think it might have been easier.  

The damaging rays can come through Glass, so I also am trying to shift to a morning daily routine sunscreen use, rather than a use before going outside in sun routine.  And new routines are hard.   Anyway instead of “slip, slap, slop”  (slip on shirt, slap on hat, slop on sunscreen) routine before going out in sun.  I’ve changed to brush teeth-> slop on sunscreen for face and hands each morning .  It’s not as catchy as “slip, slap, slop”. 

But both a slogan like slip, slap, slop  or a tied habit routine like brush teeth -> apply sunscreen 

can help with habit formation like @caedmyn ‘s daughter needs to achieve.

 

[Pen]

1 hour ago, EKS said:

I didn't see this before responding, but if she has ADHD, then that is all the more reason to create a daily schedule (it's easier to do something every day and easier to enforce it) and stick to it.  She will need you to provide the executive function to help her turn it into a habit, but once it becomes a habit, things should get better.

 

ITA

 

we used a checklist to help

Edited April 13, 2019 by Pen

[Pen]

20 minutes ago, HeighHo said:

I'll second or third or whatever the shower water pressure/ nozzle optimization.  

 

We have the type on a flexible hose and with end that adjusts from more of a shower to more of a hard stream.  It is way easier to get wet and rinsed with that.  I have long thick hair and the ability to move over my head from about an inch away with the hard stream going makes rinsing my hair so much easier.  Also, I only wash it some showers.   For my face or other sensitive areas I shift to the gentler shower adjustment on the nozzle.  Or between for areas like back where I want wider coverage for speed and don’t need either hardest stream, nor gentlest.  

And adding @caedmyn I often use a hair scrungy to keep most of my hair out of water rather than a shower cap.  It isn’t as effective, but it’s easier than sticking a lot of hair up into cap.  Good enough if a bit damp is fine.  

Edited April 13, 2019 by Pen

[Pen]

53 minutes ago, HeighHo said:

With washing face -- my teen boys took their advice from their gal friends -- effective economical product is Equate Oil Free Daily Face Wash with 2% salicylic acid (light blue tube on shelf) and it works better than cetaphil does for my dc with eczema.  Use a baby wash cloth, others are too rough and allow warm water.  Teen body chemistry is changing rapidly and they need help with keeping skin clean.  Something with benzoyl peroxide kills the acne bacteria.  

 

And @caedmyn

We use Dr. Bronner’s baby Unscented liquid soap (do not get in eyes, it’s not like tear free baby products).   Dr. Bronner’s Pure-Castile Liquid Soap – Baby Unscented - 8 Ounce https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000HJXQ9G/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_wrGSCb55TXTN7  Larger bottles and refilled up to gallon size available too.  I like: Foaming Soap Dispensers Pump-Bottles for Dr. Bronner's Castile Liquid Soap, 250ml (8.5 oz) - Pack of 3 https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01GJYE6AA/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_QsGSCbWQJV31Z

For showers, a deliberately fairly rough washcloth for scrubbing  dirty areas like underarms, neck, behind ears, as clean as possible.   

AmazonBasics Cotton Washcloths - 60-Pack https://www.amazon.com/dp/B010S5WEZA/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_aiGSCbJ955RER

Not terribly expensive per cloth, and easy to dry hanging out and then toss into wash .  We reuse bath towels, under assumption that they are used on clean bodies.  But go through stacks of wash cloths to have a clean one for each shower or non-shower wash up.  I also use them as hand drying towels.   Not fancy, but very easy.  

Dr, Bronners  liquid is easy to use , straight or from foaming pump dispenser, and it seems to work as well on acne and eczema type problems for us as specialized products.  My teen son also uses it to wash his hair.  So he’s using a single product from top down.  This helps speed things up and greatly simplifies things from EF POV.   (I use a bar shampoo or a conditioner because my hair gets too dry if I use the Dr. Bronners. ETA: also if used as shampoo, from time to time a conditioner rinse or apple cider vinegar type thing is needed to get rid of soap residue build up — more a problem on long thick hair, possibly actually a help for some hair types—doesn’t seem to be problem for Ds with his short hair) 

we had a major problem a few years ago, which was pretty much all solved by routines, simplification, and useful items.  

Edited April 13, 2019 by Pen

[Terabith]

1 hour ago, Pen said:

 

 

I have trouble remembering even having had skin cancer and losing the close friend.  If it had been a habit established in childhood I think it might have been easier.  

The damaging rays can come through Glass, so I also am trying to shift to a morning daily routine sunscreen use, rather than a use before going outside in sun routine.  And new routines are hard.   Anyway instead of “slip, slap, slop”  (slip on shirt, slap on hat, slop on sunscreen) routine before going out in sun.  I’ve changed to brush teeth-> slop on sunscreen for face and hands each morning .  It’s not as catchy as “slip, slap, slop”. 

But both a slogan like slip, slap, slop  or a tied habit routine like brush teeth -> apply sunscreen 

can help with habit formation like @caedmyn ‘s daughter needs to achieve.

 

I’ve wondered about it as a daily habit, but I hate the feeling of all products on my face.  I can manage doing it if I am going to be outside.  But I cannot imagine doing it every morning.  But...also, my understanding was that sunscreen became ineffective after a few hours, even if you didn’t get wet?

[Pen]

43 minutes ago, Terabith said:

I’ve wondered about it as a daily habit, but I hate the feeling of all products on my face.  I can manage doing it if I am going to be outside.  But I cannot imagine doing it every morning.  But...also, my understanding was that sunscreen became ineffective after a few hours, even if you didn’t get wet?

 

I’ve been using this in working on my daily use habit: Badger Balm Spf25 Sunscreen Lotion - Unscented 4oz, 4 Ounce https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01CPLLYKQ/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_skHSCb6H01CRY

It doesn’t seem to come off if it’s not being washed or sweated off.  And very important for me it doesn’t seem to have odor or cause me to react to it allergic or sensitive ways. My dermatologist gave me several higher spf supposedly fragrance free samples from other companies,  but I reacted to all of them.    It’s SPF is very low, so not good enough for significant out in sun use, but seems to make a difference in situations like driving or being at computer by a window or just a little outside like going get mail or walk dog.   I previously used a higher spf Badger cream, but it was very thick for daily use.  This goes on white , but mostly disappears after rubbing.  

They make a sport version that holds up to sweat better, and there are some that even hold up better to swimming, but would be unpleasant for all the time, I think.    

For more significant sun exposure I do try to remember a hat.   I am very fair complexion.  

[Pen]

@Terabith I may try this one nope wrong one (I’ve used the total block before— but it’s like a very strange foundation...)

 

The one I wanted to link is called Solbar 

 

Edited April 13, 2019 by Pen

[Pen]

The Solbar 50 , mid page: https://www.sunprecautions.com/shop/accessories-sunscreens/sunscreens

 

except it might have been one my dermatologist gave me a sample of and that didn’t agree with my skin

[Pen]

54 minutes ago, HeighHo said:

with Dr. Bronners pure castile baby soap one has to watch out if the dc has eczema, they may have an allergic reaction to the tocopherol. 

 

Good to know.  For us tocopherols and Vitamin e E seem helpful both in foods or oil.  I wonder if the citric acid that’s an ingredient could cause a reaction for some people too.  I have very sensitive skin and seem okay, but I think citric acid is a thing that I sometimes react to.  

[Storygirl]

I appreciate the recommendation for specific products. We have some acne issues here but not enough to consult a dermatologist yet.

Getting my teen boys to wash their faces regularly is an issue. As a first step, I bought them a pack of baby wipes (with a generic look on the outside, not a babyish design). I figured it was easier for kids with EF issues to have a one-step product, and the baby wipes are cheaper than those specifically made for faces. I may have to step it up to a product that will help more with the acne. So far they have been using the wipes and then applying a topical acne medicine. But I am still nearby as they do it and reminding them, or it doesn't happen.

I am going to make up a list soon for their bedtime routine. Even though DS15 won't read it on his own, I can remind him to read it, which is one step better than having to tell him everything verbally. DS15 has ADHD plus some other issues that make it harder for him to follow a list on his own, but it's worth working on. Although he is just turning 15 this month, he is younger developmentally, so is probably more like a 12 or 13 year old with hygiene.

With ADHD, it may take longer to develop good habits and supervision may be required longer. And then supervision can be stepped back and independence increased over time, as the teen is ready.

[SKL]

Funny thing, one of my 12yo girls insisted on taking not one but two showers today.  Not sure but I don't think I want the pendulum to swing back this far ....

[Ausmumof3]

On 4/13/2019 at 4:41 AM, Lawyer&Mom said:

Autistic mom here:  I’m all for hygiene.  I like soap and deodorant to prevent body oder.  I brush my teeth.

But:  Face-washing, shaving, hair products, make-up?  All totally completely utterly optional.

Yes. Face washing.  Haven’t done it in years.  Face is totally fine.  I don’t use any product, I wear hats for sun protection.  Your skin can find a balance all on its own if you leave it alone.  (Go wild with skin care if that’s your thing, but you don’t *have* to do anything.)

Making these hygiene routines as simple as possible is key.  Daily bathing is absolutely the easiest to remember.  Accept that the bare minimum routine may be less than you would feel comfortable with for yourself.  I also recommend unscented products to reduce the sensory load.

 

 

 

Yup!  As soon as you start with one product in the face you need another product to fix the problem caused by the first product.  I don’t think the obsession is healthy!

although now I’m starting to moisturise bevause I’m getting wrinkles and then that causes acne so I get to look like an old lady and teen at the same time.

[Wheres Toto]

17 hours ago, Storygirl said:

I appreciate the recommendation for specific products. We have some acne issues here but not enough to consult a dermatologist yet.

Getting my teen boys to wash their faces regularly is an issue. As a first step, I bought them a pack of baby wipes (with a generic look on the outside, not a babyish design). I figured it was easier for kids with EF issues to have a one-step product, and the baby wipes are cheaper than those specifically made for faces. I may have to step it up to a product that will help more with the acne. So far they have been using the wipes and then applying a topical acne medicine. But I am still nearby as they do it and reminding them, or it doesn't happen.

I am going to make up a list soon for their bedtime routine. Even though DS15 won't read it on his own, I can remind him to read it, which is one step better than having to tell him everything verbally. DS15 has ADHD plus some other issues that make it harder for him to follow a list on his own, but it's worth working on. Although he is just turning 15 this month, he is younger developmentally, so is probably more like a 12 or 13 year old with hygiene.

With ADHD, it may take longer to develop good habits and supervision may be required longer. And then supervision can be stepped back and independence increased over time, as the teen is ready.

I have a son with Aspergers and SPD, and baby wipes are the greatest thing.  He wouldn't wash his face because getting water anywhere near his eyes sets him off.  The unscented/sensitive baby wipes are perfect for washing faces without worrying about water in eyes.   He may follow up with benzoyl-peroxide wipes as needed.

We do showers almost every day.  I don't push if they won't be leaving the house.

My dd is 11 1/2 and actively does NOT want to shave, wear makeup, etc.   She kind of takes pride in not being a "girly girl".   Those are things I consider personal choice.  She knows I'll help if she does want to start shaving, etc. but if she's comfortable not doing them, I'm good with that too.

[Wheres Toto]

Interestingly, this article came up on my Facebook feed today.

https://www.iflscience.com/editors-blog/youre-probably-showering-way-too-often/?fbclid=IwAR1ev0KJ0afsyWSedJVBsESNquhFGN_T2ccrzcCoyOeyv3jXcVtU0MMM7rs