Skipping weeks in GWTM?

[Sherry in OH]

My children need to review language mechanics.  GWTM covers this topic in week 33.  We are currently part way through week 25.  If we complete weeks 25-28, could we skip to week 33 or are weeks 29-32 essential for completing the exercises in week 33?  Week 33 would be our last grammar unit for the school year.

I also have Editor in Chief.  Would finishing week 25 and then switching to this resource be a better option?  It would have to be one resource or the other.  While I would like to cover as much grammar as we can for the next two months,  we already spend 45 minutes to an hour per day on grammar and cannot devote more time than that to grammar.    Extending grammar study into the summer is not a realistic option.

[cintinative]

This is my opinion only, but it did not feel like GWTM covered mechanics very thoroughly.  Since we have completed book 1 and also have had some recent grammar "testing",  I can reflect on some of our weaknesses. Some of them are mechanics. Some are "rubber hitting the road" type applications of the learning from GWTM.  They learned that certain pronouns are object pronouns, but when we have a sentence and they have to choose using me or I, sometimes they choose the wrong pronoun.   If I say--look at the structure and tell me if that pronoun is in an object position they can probably do it, but the "fast" recall is not there. Also, although I know they understand dependent versus independent clauses, I don't think they are to the point of knowing by looking at a sentence if a comma is needed or not.  I just don't think enough time was spent on that in the curriculum. The focus is much less on mechanics than other issues.  I appreciated it taking the time to explain the "whys" of the comma placement, but we needed a LOT more review on those mechanics concepts, if that makes sense. 

The other weakness I can see is all of those homonyms that people tend to use improperly  (affect and effect, etc.). 

Just my two cents, but I am a little sad after all the time we spent that we have these gaps.  I am currently planning to work through the Blue Book of Grammar and Punctuation to shore up these weak areas. 

I don't know much about Editor in Chief.  What I would do is look at what you think your children's weaknesses might be with mechanics/usage and focus on those.  I hope this input helps.  😃

[blondeviolin]

I wouldn’t jump ahead. I’d just move to the other curriculum. 

My daughter is solid on object or subject pronouns, when to insert a comma between clauses, and homonyms. In all honesty, my 5th grader is decently strong there too. Might be partly attributed to their Latin program... but we have not found SWB to be lacking in her LA materials. 

[cintinative]

10 hours ago, blondeviolin said:

I wouldn’t jump ahead. I’d just move to the other curriculum. 

My daughter is solid on object or subject pronouns, when to insert a comma between clauses, and homonyms. In all honesty, my 5th grader is decently strong there too. Might be partly attributed to their Latin program... but we have not found SWB to be lacking in her LA materials. 

 

Respectfully, perhaps your daughter comes by it more naturally?  We have done FLL 1 through 4 and GWTM 1 and part of 2. Homonyms are not covered in GWTM.  Only a small part of one lesson covers object pronouns and it doesn't address misuse at all.  Commas between clauses are covered in one lesson (out of hundreds).  It was not enough for my kids.  

I highly respect SWB but if you are a child that needs a spiral sort of review for common grammatical errors like these, I don't think GWTM is a good fit.  

[serendipitous journey]

I would say that if doing the exercises in 33 would give a sense of completion/satisfaction, then tackle them and just review as needed to complete them.  If it would be a relief to drop it, then just drop it. 

Given that you're interested in mechanics, and given what I've seen of Editor-in-Chief (only samples) it does seem like that would be a better use of your grammar time. 

I can see that, depending on the child and on what else one is using, FLL and GWTM might not be enough mechanics/usage practice.  I have found that a great deal of our grammar "practice" happens inadvertently through the Writing With Ease/Writing With Skill programs, and also that my older one has picked up a lot of grammar from the grammar-heavy Memoria Press Form Latin series.   And my younger child tested poorly on mechanics in the second grade, with FLL as his grammar program, which worried me for a bit but I haven't stressed about it  ... I hope to have them takes tests again this year, and we'll see how we come out.  

[blondeviolin]

On 4/7/2019 at 9:33 AM, cintinative said:

 

Respectfully, perhaps your daughter comes by it more naturally?  We have done FLL 1 through 4 and GWTM 1 and part of 2. Homonyms are not covered in GWTM.  Only a small part of one lesson covers object pronouns and it doesn't address misuse at all.  Commas between clauses are covered in one lesson (out of hundreds).  It was not enough for my kids.  

I highly respect SWB but if you are a child that needs a spiral sort of review for common grammatical errors like these, I don't think GWTM is a good fit.  

 

She is naturally language strong, however my son is not. In fact, he’s dyslexic. While he hasn’t worked through GFTWTM, he has done all of FLL and is doing R&S 5 which isn’t as rigorous as I was expecting. He also has a strong grasp of when to punctuate commas, semicolons, apostrophes, etc. FLL 4 does have homophones, dictionary usage, etc in the optional lessons. 

I don’t think it’s just FLL, but also WWE and copywork and dictation from other sources. And, like I mentioned, my kids do Latin beginning in third grade. I also personally feel like almost nothing synthesizes for my kids until I start requiring longer-than-sentence writing...somewhere about 5th grade. I make them correct work/adjust written work with errors. 

 

[cintinative]

9 hours ago, blondeviolin said:

 

She is naturally language strong, however my son is not. In fact, he’s dyslexic. While he hasn’t worked through GFTWTM, he has done all of FLL and is doing R&S 5 which isn’t as rigorous as I was expecting. He also has a strong grasp of when to punctuate commas, semicolons, apostrophes, etc. FLL 4 does have homophones, dictionary usage, etc in the optional lessons. 

I don’t think it’s just FLL, but also WWE and copywork and dictation from other sources. And, like I mentioned, my kids do Latin beginning in third grade. I also personally feel like almost nothing synthesizes for my kids until I start requiring longer-than-sentence writing...somewhere about 5th grade. I make them correct work/adjust written work with errors. 

 

 

We didn't do WWE so maybe that is part of it? My kids have also had Latin (LFC) since 3rd. Other than that, we did have a 1 to 1.5 year gap between FLL and GWTM because of the publication date during which we did Fix-It and Jr. Analytical Grammar so maybe that harmed their memory of the material? Anyway, it just goes to show you that sometimes kids need a different approach (or more review), because mechanics is an ongoing issue for us that I have to correct in their writing and it sounds like our kids have had really similar exposure to grammar.  😃

[blondeviolin]

4 hours ago, cintinative said:

 

We didn't do WWE so maybe that is part of it? My kids have also had Latin (LFC) since 3rd. Other than that, we did have a 1 to 1.5 year gap between FLL and GWTM because of the publication date during which we did Fix-It and Jr. Analytical Grammar so maybe that harmed their memory of the material? Anyway, it just goes to show you that sometimes kids need a different approach (or more review), because mechanics is an ongoing issue for us that I have to correct in their writing and it sounds like our kids have had really similar exposure to grammar.  😃

 

I think a good writing program will incorporate what they’re learning grammar and reinforce it. If your student isn’t practicing the use of the grammar (WWE) and only evaluating the grammar (FLL), then they haven’t yet jumped to the synthesis portion. SWB advocates teaching all of these skills separately, but simultaneously, but when your child is ready, he or she should begin to use those skills practiced. In math, if you’ve taught your kid addition and he doesn’t use that when going to the store and purchasing something, he understands the parts/process of math but hasn’t reached application. It’s the same with grammar and mechanics skills. My kids aren’t required to produce original writing until upper elementary so they often aren’t practicing that application. Once I start requiring original writing, they start mastering those things very quickly. 

[serendipitous journey]

14 hours ago, cintinative said:

 

We didn't do WWE so maybe that is part of it? My kids have also had Latin (LFC) since 3rd. Other than that, we did have a 1 to 1.5 year gap between FLL and GWTM because of the publication date during which we did Fix-It and Jr. Analytical Grammar so maybe that harmed their memory of the material? Anyway, it just goes to show you that sometimes kids need a different approach (or more review), because mechanics is an ongoing issue for us that I have to correct in their writing and it sounds like our kids have had really similar exposure to grammar.  😃

I have one who is natural at grammar and one who is natural at spelling.  You just never know! 

ETA: "natural" is a relative thing!  They've each had instruction in both grammar & spelling, and they both tend to drop end-of-sentence periods.  But different stuff seems to "stick" for them. 

Edited April 13, 2019 by serendipitous journey

[Sherry in OH]

I am pleased with the amount of grammar my children have learned this year.  But, while they do fine when completing targeted exercises, they do not seem to be able to apply rules of capitalization to their own writing.  We are using both GWTM and WWS.   

[serendipitous journey]

How old are they? 

I think that --surprisingly to me -- it is really normal for the children to keep making these sorts of errors through middle school, where they know rules but don't apply them when they are in the midst of generating content.  My older one is doing better this year (he's about 13 1/2 right now) and is finally, for example, completing nearly all his sentences with periods.  For years he has had a tendency to leave the period off the very last sentence in any hand-written composition/answer to a question.

It seems to me that this fades out around 7th/8th, but I don't have a lot of experience.  Susan Wise Bauer does mention (in one of her lectures on writing -- either writing for elementary or writing for the logic stage) that children tend to have the "rules" tucked away in one part of their minds and it takes a lot of practice to both generate original content AND apply the rules as they go.  That fits my experience. 

ETA: I do have mine go over and correct his work.  I usually make a mark on the line that needs correction, or sometimes just have him check carefully for whatever I know is wrong -- ie, tell him to double-check capitalization or to find the 3 (or 4 or 10 or however many) words that need to be capitalized. 

Edited April 13, 2019 by serendipitous journey