Curfews for young adults

[Mergath]

Look, I get what you're saying, but I hope you can try to accept that this really is something you have to deal with yourself instead of having your family accommodate you by never being out past your bedtime. The reality is that what you're asking isn't fair.

I have misophonia and half hearing music or tv noises through the wall gives me panic attacks. (Weird, I know.) But I don't tell dh and older dd that they can never listen to music or watch tv, because that isn't fair. It isn't right for me to impose that kind of restriction. So I deal. If it's annoying me, I go for a walk or find something to do to take my mind off it. If I'm having a really extra horrific day with my anxiety, they're sensitive to that and use headphones. But it isn't something I require because that's only going to breed resentment.

[Carrie12345]

7 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

It is a fact I don't sleep well if at all while waiting for someone to come in.  It isn't something I have 'convinced' myself of.  And again it isn't that I need him 'home'.  I sleep fine when he is away.  Which is rare.  But regardless, it is simply my sleep is affected very much waiting for someone to show up at my home.

Well, in some way, you *have convinced yourself if you’re also able to convince yourself to sleep just fine if you aren’t expecting him.

I have two (minor) teenagers who are often out late (or early) at structure fires, automobile accidents, gas leaks, etc...  And one has occasional ambulance shifts until midnight. (Dh picks her up from that; I’m dead to the world by then!) It definitely took me some time to learn how to shut my brain off and trust that they’ll get home safe when they get home safe.  But I did it, because that’s what was needed for us to co-exist in our home.

[Scarlett]

2 minutes ago, Catwoman said:

 

An 11:00 curfew for a 19yo?

That seems awfully strict!

Strict?  It isn't about restricting him.  It is about us having our home set up in a way that we can best function.

[SKL]

4 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

Right.  And this is were we are.  We have what we feel are reasonable expectations.  Be home at 11:-00-.  If you don't like that expectation you are free to live elsewhere.  As far as coming in and making noise....we realize humans make noise.  He isn't being loud and rude.  But our house is laid out in such a way it is impossible to not hear people coming in the house or using the bathroom. 

 

Could you change the layout, e.g., put the parents in the room farthest from the door?  Could you put some felt around the door frame so you don't hear when it shuts?  Is there another door that is quieter or farther away that he could use at night?

[Scarlett]

1 minute ago, Catwoman said:

 

You never mentioned that your dh had the same problem. You said that you couldn’t sleep if your son wasn’t home. 

And?  What does it matter if it does or does not bother my husband as well?  My needs are important enough on their own I think. 

 

[Catwoman]

Just now, Scarlett said:

And?  What does it matter if it does or does not bother my husband as well?  My needs are important enough on their own I think. 

 

 

I think you should have made this a JAWM thread.  🙂

[Scarlett]

3 minutes ago, Carrie12345 said:

Well, in some way, you *have convinced yourself if you’re also able to convince yourself to sleep just fine if you aren’t expecting him.

I have two (minor) teenagers who are often out late (or early) at structure fires, automobile accidents, gas leaks, etc...  And one has occasional ambulance shifts until midnight. (Dh picks her up from that; I’m dead to the world by then!) It definitely took me some time to learn how to shut my brain off and trust that they’ll get home safe when they get home safe.  But I did it, because that’s what was needed for us to co-exist in our home.

I don't convince myself to sleep when he isn't coming home.  There is no convincing.  I go to sleep knowing I won't be disturbed because he isn't coming in.

[Mergath]

Just now, Scarlett said:

I don't convince myself to sleep when he isn't coming home.  There is no convincing.  I go to sleep knowing I won't be disturbed because he isn't coming in.

 

If the problem is that you're waiting to be disturbed when he comes in, can you run a fan in your room or take other measures so that you can't hear him come in? I run a fan in my bedroom all the time, and you'd be amazed at how much sound a fan can drown out, and after a few nights you don't even really hear the fan anymore.

[Carrie12345]

2 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

I don't convince myself to sleep when he isn't coming home.  There is no convincing.  I go to sleep knowing I won't be disturbed because he isn't coming in.

 

1 hour ago, Carrie12345 said:

A curfew doesn’t make a person quiet or respectful, it just (maybe) shifts their rude noise into a preferable time frame. I’d focus on raising awareness of common courtesies over cutting freedoms. 

 

1 hour ago, Scarlett said:

It doesn’t matter how quiet he is.  If he isn’t home I can’t sleep.  If I do go to sleep I wake up and wonder if he is home or in a ditch.  I just don’t want to deal with that stress.  

 

Which way is up?

[Catwoman]

2 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

I don't convince myself to sleep when he isn't coming home.  There is no convincing.  I go to sleep knowing I won't be disturbed because he isn't coming in.

 

Can you wear earplugs or use a white noise machine so your son won’t wake you when he comes in?

[Scarlett]

Just now, Mergath said:

 

If the problem is that you're waiting to be disturbed when he comes in, can you run a fan in your room or take other measures so that you can't hear him come in? I run a fan in my bedroom all the time, and you'd be amazed at how much sound a fan can drown out, and after a few nights you don't even really hear the fan anymore.

We use a fan.  There is no way to not hear him come in.  It is just a horrible lay out.  We hear them use the bathroom and shower and we hear my son breathe!  

[Catwoman]

1 minute ago, Mergath said:

 

If the problem is that you're waiting to be disturbed when he comes in, can you run a fan in your room or take other measures so that you can't hear him come in? I run a fan in my bedroom all the time, and you'd be amazed at how much sound a fan can drown out, and after a few nights you don't even really hear the fan anymore.

 

You were posting while I was still typing! 😀

[Catwoman]

1 minute ago, Carrie12345 said:

 

 

 

Which way is up?

 

I cant figure it out, either. The story seems to have changed.

[Mergath]

4 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

We use a fan.  There is no way to not hear him come in.  It is just a horrible lay out.  We hear them use the bathroom and shower and we hear my son breathe!  

 

How are you guys dealing with the sound he makes when he IS home? You must be doing something to manage that because there's no way he's completely and totally silent every night after eleven. If he wakes you up can you go back to sleep again? If you're so sensitive to noise that the sound of him peeing or moving around in his bedroom wakes you up for the entire night, it might be best for him to just move out.

[Familia]

I think I get it.  The anticipation of his arrival causes you not to be able to fall asleep easily.  If you do fall asleep, you wake with a start, mind rushing immediately, wondering, "Is he home yet?"  

So, if he is not coming in at all, those issues are nonexistent, and you sleep just fine.  This is why I am glad (although my heart weeps) that our young adults have (mostly) gone away for college, it is so much easier to allow them to transition into the freedom of adulthood without either of us (YA or me) having to deal with MY adjustment issues.

It is your house/your rules, though, but this is what we have done:  'give me an idea of ETA, text if that changes, be quiet upon arrival'.  We consider that a courtesy of adults moving around in same house together, but we are only the recipient of the info from the absent/arriving adult, we do not mandate curfew or anything, ETA is their decision.  I consider the difficulties of dealing with the 'anticipation' my issue to handle.  

 

 

Edited April 2, 2019 by Familia

[Scarlett]

1 minute ago, Carrie12345 said:

 

 

 

Which way is up?

It is the waiting.  Not being sure when he is coming home.

[Scarlett]

1 minute ago, Familia said:

I think I get it.  The anticipation of his arrival causes you not to be able to fall asleep easily.  If you do fall asleep, you wake with a start, mind rushing immediately, wondering, "Is he home yet?"  

So, if he is not coming in at all, those issues are nonexistent, and you sleep just fine.  This is why I am glad (although my heart weeps) that our young adults have (mostly) gone away for college, it is so much easier to allow them to transition into the freedom of adulthood without either of us (YA or me) having to deal with MY adjustment issues.

It is your house/your rules, though, but this is what we have done:  'give me an idea of ETA, text if that changes, be quiet upon arrival'.  We consider that a courtesy of adults moving around in same house together, but we are only the recipient of the info from the absent/arriving adult, we do not mandate curfew or anything, ETA is their decision.

 

 

Thank you.  Yes this is it.  I do think we are approaching both of them moving out.  Which is normal I think.  

[Scarlett]

9 minutes ago, Mergath said:

 

How are you guys dealing with the sound he makes when he IS home? You must be doing something to manage that because there's no way he's completely and totally silent every night after eleven. If he wakes you up can you go back to sleep again? If you're so sensitive to noise that the sound of him peeing or moving around in his bedroom wakes you up for the entire night, it might be best for him to just move out.

Well, they are both fairly quiet after 11 which is what we have asked for.  We do sometimes hear them in the middle of then night, but people have to use the restroom....they don't have to stay out past 11 during the week.  

[Frances]

21 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

We use a fan.  There is no way to not hear him come in.  It is just a horrible lay out.  We hear them use the bathroom and shower and we hear my son breathe!  

Have you tried ear plugs? I know a family where the three children lived at home through college and for several years after. There were no curfews. But everyone in the family wore earplugs every single night.

[Valley Girl]

I know people tend to pick apart your posts, but honestly, I'm a little confused. I apologize if it sounds like I'm grilling you. And, of course, you're not obligated to answer.

Is the problem that ...

1. You (and DH) can't relax enough to sleep just knowing that DS will be entering the house after 11 p.m. The worry/anxiety/tension/anticipation of being disturbed drives sleep away.

2. DS makes an unusual amount of noise during the process of entering the house and getting settled for the night when he gets home late--noise that he does NOT make when he's home before everyone goes to bed? What is he doing beyond unlocking the door that creates a level of noise that can't be masked with a white noise machine or something?

I'm wondering, too, on the nights he doesn't go out, is he always in bed before 11? (I don't mean that in a snarky way.) If not, how to you handle the noise he makes as he moves about the house? How is that different from and more tolerable than the noise you mentioned upthread--shower, bathroom, breathing?

Honestly, if you really do need a completely quiet house (and I'm not judging that), and DS can't or won't accommodate your 11 p.m. cutoff, then it sounds like he may needs to find another place to live. Especially if things like a white noise machine, ear plugs, showering in the morning instead of a night, going straight to his room, etc. aren't a solution for whatever reason. But if the issue is really your own anxiety or worry, then, honestly, that's something you need to address separately. (I say that with sympathy. I get that as a mom, you worry more when they're living at home and out late. It's part of the package.)

I hope you can figure something out that works for all of you.

 

[Scarlett]

3 minutes ago, happysmileylady said:

If it's about not being sure when he will be coming home to wake you up....perhaps instead of a curfew, you make it a rule that he let you know when to expect him.  That, IMO is just common curtesy when you live with someone.  I ask DH pretty much every day what time he will be home.  Any time either of us goes anywhere, we are always letting the other know about how long we expect to be gone, and/or about what time we will be home.  

Yes I am thankful I have a husband who is considerate of me like that.  As far as 'when to expect him'....that would not work for ds19...he is constantly changing plans....it is better for me that he just have an agreed upon time to come home by.  And really if that doesn't suit his needs I could totally understand his desire to find his own place.  

[Scarlett]

1 minute ago, Valley Girl said:

I know people tend to pick apart your posts, but honestly, I'm a little confused. I apologize if it sounds like I'm grilling you. And, of course, you're not obligated to answer.

Is the problem that ...

1. You (and DH) can't relax enough to sleep just knowing that DS will be entering the house after 11 p.m. The worry/anxiety/tension/anticipation of being disturbed drives sleep away.

2. DS makes an unusual amount of noise during the process of entering the house and getting settled for the night when he gets home late--noise that he does NOT make when he's home before everyone goes to bed? What is he doing beyond unlocking the door that creates a level of noise that can't be masked with a white noise machine or something?

I'm wondering, too, on the nights he doesn't go out, is he always in bed before 11? (I don't mean that in a snarky way.) If not, how to you handle the noise he makes as he moves about the house? How is that different from and more tolerable than the noise you mentioned upthread--shower, bathroom, breathing?

Honestly, if you really do need a completely quiet house (and I'm not judging that), and DS can't or won't accommodate your 11 p.m. cutoff, then it sounds like he may needs to find another place to live. Especially if things like a white noise machine, ear plugs, showering in the morning instead of a night, going straight to his room, etc. aren't a solution for whatever reason. But if the issue is really your own anxiety or worry, then, honestly, that's something you need to address separately. (I say that with sympathy. I get that as a mom, you worry more when they're living at home and out late. It's part of the package.)

I hope you can figure something out that works for all of you.

 

The problem is mostly the anticipation of arrival. That is a problem that can be fixed.

The noise, although irritating, cannot be fixed.  They both are pretty quiet in their own rooms even if they are up really really late.  

And yes, if he can't live with our expectation of being home by 11 during the week then it is better he find his own place.  

[Bootsie]

We have never had curfews with our children.  We do request that they are quiet when someone in the house needs to sleep--even that is not the same hour all of the time.  If a sibling has to take the ACT test in the morning, she is going to bed earlier.  If dad has to be at work for a 7;30 am presentation in the morning, he is going to bed earlier.  Other times, our entire household will be up after midnight.  

If the presence of someone in the house does not keep you awake (going to the bathroom is no more noisier when someone wakes at 2:00am to go to the bathroom than when someone comes home at 11:30pm and goes to the bathroom), then I would think that it is the waiting for the noise that would keep you awake.  The only added noise from someone coming in would be the sound of a car, the front door opening, and the sound of the lock.  If it is the waiting that is the problem, I would try to approach it as "I wouldn't know where this adult was if he wasn't living at home, and I would be able to sleep, so let me just pretend he isn't coming home tonight."

[Frances]

2 minutes ago, Bootsie said:

We have never had curfews with our children.  We do request that they are quiet when someone in the house needs to sleep--even that is not the same hour all of the time.  If a sibling has to take the ACT test in the morning, she is going to bed earlier.  If dad has to be at work for a 7;30 am presentation in the morning, he is going to bed earlier.  Other times, our entire household will be up after midnight.  

If the presence of someone in the house does not keep you awake (going to the bathroom is no more noisier when someone wakes at 2:00am to go to the bathroom than when someone comes home at 11:30pm and goes to the bathroom), then I would think that it is the waiting for the noise that would keep you awake.  The only added noise from someone coming in would be the sound of a car, the front door opening, and the sound of the lock.  If it is the waiting that is the problem, I would try to approach it as "I wouldn't know where this adult was if he wasn't living at home, and I would be able to sleep, so let me just pretend he isn't coming home tonight."

I very much agree with your last sentence. It will take time, but it will eventually work. And not having a curfew would probably help it to work faster, since you won’t be so focused on a specific time.

[Scarlett]

Just now, happysmileylady said:

IMO, really, he shouldn't be changing his plans dramatically without letting you know in some way. It really shouldn't take much for him to send you a text that says "hey, we decided to see the 9pm showing of Avengers instead of the  8:30 Captain Marvel.  So I won't be home until midnight instead of 11 tonight."

How often is he out late?  How many of these nights is he changing up his plans and how many times on those nights?

 A week or so back ds19 and dss18 (almost) told us they were going to the city to eat dinner and see a movie.   We didn't quiz either of them on where, what movie, what showing....we just went to sleep at 11 or so and expected them home by midnight.  I wake up at 3 a.m. and find a text from my son's girlfriend's mom (sent at 2 a.m.)  asking if I had heard from them.  So I fly out of bed and go to the other room to hopefully avoid waking dh....I call them and my son answers and says they had already dropped the girlfriend home and they were 5 minutes from home.  Yes I was very very very upset.  They went to a midnight movie.  Which they knew they were doing by 9 or 10 because they missed the other showing.  But did they bother texting us that info?  No.

[Scarlett]

4 hours ago, fairfarmhand said:

Our family is different, somewhat because we live out in the sticks and don’t want our kids stranded late at night without close access to a gas station or something where’s they could get help if there’s a problem.

also, dh and I are up early and people coming in late mean that we don’t get enough sleep because our house layout disturbs is when folks come in. 

 

So we did have curfews when my oldest still lived at home.

She also was super loud and inconsiderate of others. She shared a room with a sibling and woke them up when she’d come in.

and she would be ugly and mean to people living normal life in the morning when she wanted to sleep in.

its your house. You can have whatever rules suit you. If young adults think it’s unreasonable they can do like my dd did and find their own place.

we weren’t trying to be horrible. But we couldn’t allow one persons prefences to disrupt the whole house. 

your house. Your rules. 

Thank you.  This is pretty much where we are.  I talked to him today and he apologized and said he will not be late again.  I don't think he really wants to move out.  But who knows.

[Scarlett]

6 minutes ago, OKBud said:

I need to know this information to sleep too, with DH. If he's gone: I sleep. If he's home: I sleep. If he says he'll be home around 1AM: I wake up around 1 (I can't help it, my body has a strong attachment to time) and check my phone to see if he texted that he's home, which is how we worked this out between us. If he texted, I go right back to sleep. If he didn't: my night is shot. If I have no idea whatsoever what time he'll be coming in: I absolutely can not sleep.

I have no teens much less adults, but I do totally relate to the basic issue at hand. I literally just need to know what time he'll be here. It's weird to some people, but I mean so what? It takes him four seconds to text me what time and four more seconds to text me he's home. 

ETA-- Now that I am thinking about it, my roomates and I always gave one another a general ETA too. Especially female roommates. In that case I think it's more a matter of not wanting to alarm anyone in the middle of the night, but still. It can be part of living with anyone, not just parents. The rub is parents have all these expectations from the kids and the peanut gallery about what they "should" need and want, while with roomates you just hammer out an arrangement and call it a day and no one could care less.

Yes me too.  I often wake up just before I expect ds home.  

[Pen]

It sounds like realistically you all need a plan for 

- moving toward their own separate from you housing.  

- in meantime some ways to cope with the stress and not sleeping problem 

- maybe if you knew it would be only 2 months more you could handle it better, and maybe if they knew it would only be 2 months till they’d be out on their own they could cope with early returns home for that long...

[EmseB]

I think there has to be some flexibility on your part. I had a midnight curfew when I was 17, it was earlier than any of my friends, and we were not hooligans. It was just the nature of teen social life.

I know my mom worried about us being out. I know she didn't sleep as well waiting for us to be home. But I'm thankful she let me have the social life and time with my friends, despite the inconvenience and worry. 

I think it is strange for a 19yo to have his parents tell to be home by 11, whatever the reason. As long as he is making an effort to come in quietly, I think it might be your hangup to deal with, or if he wants to live as roommates then charge him rent and treat him as a tenant (he pays but can come and go as he pleases and you are at least compensated for him using your space). Or tell him he needs to find another place to live if he can't deal with a strict curfew and you can't adjust to just letting him come and go as an adult.

[EmseB]

Triple posting?!

 

Edited April 2, 2019 by EmseB

[Scarlett]

2 hours ago, EmseB said:

I think there has to be some flexibility on your part. I had a midnight curfew when I was 17, it was earlier than any of my friends, and we were not hooligans. It was just the nature of teen social life.

I know my mom worried about us being out. I know she didn't sleep as well waiting for us to be home. But I'm thankful she let me have the social life and time with my friends, despite the inconvenience and worry. 

I think it is strange for a 19yo to have his parents tell to be home by 11, whatever the reason. As long as he is making an effort to come in quietly, I think it might be your hangup to deal with, or if he wants to live as roommates then charge him rent and treat him as a tenant (he pays but can come and go as he pleases and you are at least compensated for him using your space). Or tell him he needs to find another place to live if he can't deal with a strict curfew and you can't adjust to just letting him come and go as an adult.

Some people think it is weird that a 19 year old still lives at home.  Or that a 19 year living at home would expect to come in at any hour he chooses. Because some people think if you want to make your own rules you pay your own bills and live alone. 

So there is that. 

He gets a  TON of time with his friends 

Edited April 2, 2019 by Scarlett

[EmseB]

DP

 

Edited April 2, 2019 by EmseB

[EmseB]

2 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

Some people think it is weird that a 19 year old still lives at home.  Or that a 19 year living at home would expect to come in at any hour he chooses. Because some people think if you want to make your own rules you pay your own bills and live alone. 

So there is that. 

Ge gets a  TON of time with his friends 

It's not about how much time. It's about the nature of teen activities that go on late into the evening/early morning.

I guess you wanted a JAWM, but your response seems to address things I wasnt talking about.

[HS Mom in NC]

2 hours ago, Scarlett said:

 I am asking for him to be home at an agreed upon time so that MY sleep in MY home is not ruined.  Really that is all there is to this.  My sleep.  My husband's sleep.  It is very important to our overall health and well being.  

That's an unrealistic expectation of a young adult living in your home. You need professional counseling to learn how to respect boundaries and have realistic expectations.

[Pen]

 

[HS Mom in NC]

2 hours ago, Scarlett said:

I can't sleep if I am WAITING for him to come home.  If I don't expect him to come home,  I can sleep fine.  

That's a psychological/emotional problem on your part-you need to see a professional to get that fixed. You can simply understand that adults are home at all hours of the night because they're old enough to decide when they come and go, even if they live with a parent, and don't owe their parents a set time they'll be home.  That's how adult housemates operate.

[fairfarmhand]

3 hours ago, Mergath said:

 

I just want to point out that legally, that isn't actually true, that if you rented out a room and the person annoyed you, you could kick them out at your discretion. Tenants paying rent have certain rights under the law, and if they aren't in violation of a lease, there's no grounds for eviction. 

We didn’t magically say “you annoyed me last night so you gotta go.” 

It was more “here are the rules. This is what we need for our family to operate. You’re welcome to live here rent free but these are the rules.”

she preferred paying rent to someone and not having to deal with the rules.

im pretty sure that when you have a tenant, you can terminate the agreement if it’s not working. It may not be an immediate thing, but if I want the use of my extra bedroom back, I can get it eventually by just not renewing the lease. 

[Shoeless]

1 hour ago, Scarlett said:

Strict?  It isn't about restricting him.  It is about us having our home set up in a way that we can best function.

 

Then it's time for him to move out.  Congrats, you've just discovered that you two are no longer compatible living partners. 

He isn't unreasonable for wanting to stay out past 11 pm.  You aren't unreasonable for wanting your home run a certain way.  But you're both unreasonable in expecting the other to simply get over it and bend to the other's will. 

Time for him to move out.

[Valley Girl]

1 hour ago, Scarlett said:

 A week or so back ds19 and dss18 (almost) told us they were going to the city to eat dinner and see a movie.   We didn't quiz either of them on where, what movie, what showing....we just went to sleep at 11 or so and expected them home by midnight.  I wake up at 3 a.m. and find a text from my son's girlfriend's mom (sent at 2 a.m.)  asking if I had heard from them.  So I fly out of bed and go to the other room to hopefully avoid waking dh....I call them and my son answers and says they had already dropped the girlfriend home and they were 5 minutes from home.  Yes I was very very very upset.  They went to a midnight movie.  Which they knew they were doing by 9 or 10 because they missed the other showing.  But did they bother texting us that info?  No.

I'd be ticked off, too. That's worrying. If that's the crux of the issue, I'd deal with that. But it's a different issue (with a different solution) than someone coming home after 11 because it disturbs your sleep.

[Pen]

4 minutes ago, MissLemon said:

 

Then it's time for him to move out.  Congrats, you've just discovered that you two are no longer compatible living partners. 

He isn't unreasonable for wanting to stay out past 11 pm.  You aren't unreasonable for wanting your home run a certain way.  But you're both unreasonable in expecting the other to simply get over it and bend to the other's will. 

Time for him to move out.

 

I basically agree.  

And I think a plan of saving up first, last, and security deposit for Ds to move somewhere else is needed.  So it doesn’t blow up leaving permanent bad relations.  

 

[fairfarmhand]

11 minutes ago, MissLemon said:

 

Then it's time for him to move out.  Congrats, you've just discovered that you two are no longer compatible living partners. 

He isn't unreasonable for wanting to stay out past 11 pm.  You aren't unreasonable for wanting your home run a certain way.  But you're both unreasonable in expecting the other to simply get over it and bend to the other's will. 

Time for him to move out.

I think this nails it.

[EmseB]

15 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

Some people think it is weird that a 19 year old still lives at home.  Or that a 19 year living at home would expect to come in at any hour he chooses. Because some people think if you want to make your own rules you pay your own bills and live alone. 

So there is that. 

Ge gets a  TON of time with his friends 

One other thing is that I think it's not optimal or healthy for you or him or your relationship to *allow* him to live without paying bills or rent or whatever but then use that as leverage to continue to treat him as if he is still 17. Just my opinion, but I think that breeds resentment all around and sort of stunts his growth into being a full adult; not just the curfew but also not having adult responsibilities or privileges.

[regentrude]

2 hours ago, Scarlett said:

I can't sleep if I am WAITING for him to come home.  If I don't expect him to come home,  I can sleep fine.  

Then you have a psychological problem that you need to address.

The mindset "this is my house because I pay the bills, and if you do not arrange your life to cater to my anxieties it is better you move out" is completely alien to me. This is not how we live family life. There is no "my" house - this is *our* home. Irrespective of who has how much earning power. Would you expect a money earning husband to dictate how his SAH wife leads her life? (Well, I guess you actually might). This aspect of the discussion really boggles my mind. Coupling agency to economic ability, wow.

We are not talking about a person who uses drugs, is violent, is breaking the law. We are talking about an adult man who stays out later than mommy's bedtime. I find this expectation bizarre.

Edited April 2, 2019 by regentrude

[QueenCat]

No curfews, they are adults. Out of mutual respect, we all tell each other if we're going to be out late. And text each other if it's going to change significantly. They are just expected to come in quietly and not disturb those who are sleeping. We've never had to address a noise problem. 

[Scarlett]

4 minutes ago, regentrude said:

Then you have a psychological problem that you need to address.

The mindset "this is my house because I pay the bills, and if you do not arrange your life to cater to my anxieties it is better you move out" is completely alien to me. This is not how we live family life. There is no "my" house - this is *our* home. Irrespective of who has how much earning power. Would you expect a money earning husband to dictate how his SAH wife leads her life? (Well, I guess you actually might). This aspect of the discussion really boggles my mind. Coupling agency to economic ability, wow.

We are not talking about a person who uses drugs, is violent, is breaking the law. We are talking about an adult man who stays out later than mommy's bedtime. I find this expectation bizarre.

I find it bizarre that you think a person needs psychological help because they want to be able to sleep at night in their own home. 

A husband and wife have a partnership.  Vows. Agreements on how they conduct their shard lives. I do not and never will have that kind of relationship with my sons. And to compare adult children to other adults? Strange. I wouldn’t move a 19 year old man into my home. 

Our expectation for our kids is we raise them and they, as adults, go make their own life. And until they are able to do that we, as the adults who own the house are within our reasonable rights to have some house rules. You might not agree with our house rules but it doesn’t mean I am in need of mental help. 

Good grief. 

 

[TechWife]

4 hours ago, Scarlett said:

It feels like some of you are saying no curfew but then go on to say your kids aren’t coming in late and keeping you awake.  If ds19 wasn’t coming in late and waking us up he wouldn’t need a curfew either.  

Yes he is legal adult....which is why I am not managing where he goes and with whom etc.  The curfew is because without it he will come in even later.  And coming in late interrupt our sleep. 

My son does come in late, but he doesn’t wake us up. The issue isn’t a curfew for you, I don’t think, it’s that he isn’t courteous and is waking you up. That’s a different conversation. 

If the normal noise level of coming quietly into a house wakes you up, that isn’t his fault. If he’s slamming doors or slamming things around the kitchen, that’s rude, but it has nothing to do with curfew. If he’s coming in quietly or rummaging quietly in the kitchen, that sounds normal to me. 

If it’s kitchen noise that’s bothersome, try a “kitchen closed 12:30 - 5:30 am” and limit cooking during those hours. 

Make sure you define what the issue is, though. If you or dh are choosing to stay awake until ds gets home, that’s your choice, but he shouldn’t b restricted to a curfew just because you want to stay awake or can’t sleep unless he’s home. If that’s it, I think that’s something ,you’ll outgrow over time. 

 

[Scarlett]

30 minutes ago, Homeschool Mom in AZ said:

That's a psychological/emotional problem on your part-you need to see a professional to get that fixed. You can simply understand that adults are home at all hours of the night because they're old enough to decide when they come and go, even if they live with a parent, and don't owe their parents a set time they'll be home.  That's how adult housemates operate.

He isn’t an adult housemate. He is my son who lives here because he is my son. I would not have a housemate at all that came in at all hours. 

[Shoeless]

This isn't a moral-high-ground kind of issue.  You two want different things.

[Scarlett]

2 minutes ago, TechWife said:

My son does come in late, but he doesn’t wake us up. The issue isn’t a curfew for you, I don’t think, it’s that he isn’t courteous and is waking you up. That’s a different conversation. 

If the normal noise level of coming quietly into a house wakes you up, that isn’t his fault. If he’s slamming doors or slamming things around the kitchen, that’s rude, but it has nothing to do with curfew. If he’s coming in quietly or rummaging quietly in the kitchen, that sounds normal to me. 

If it’s kitchen noise that’s bothersome, try a “kitchen closed 12:30 - 5:30 am” and limit cooking during those hours. 

Make sure you define what the issue is, though. If you or dh are choosing to stay awake until ds gets home, that’s your choice, but he shouldn’t b restricted to a curfew just because you want to stay awake or can’t sleep unless he’s home. If that’s it, I think that’s something ,you’ll outgrow over time. 

 

It is not a choice I can assure you. I would love to just go to sleep. I accept normal noise even if it wakes me up because I don’t think it is reasonable to expect total silence. I do think it is reasonable to be home by 11 during the week when everyone has to be out of bed by 6 am

[Scarlett]

2 minutes ago, OKBud said:

 

Jah and this kind of friction is super normal. Super necessary, maybe even. Just on a biological level, most people start feeling the need for their own space. Their own timetable that is unaccountable to someone else. And...sadly, sniff.... the kids stop being our little ones and start being, as you say Scarlet, "some 19 year old man" lol. A friend of mine told me that your sons stop smelling like your kids at a certain age. It's an animal thing. I totally buy it. 

So true.!

i keep telling him this is normal to want to not answer to me at all...but that I have to have sleep 

He claims he has his phone set on military time and thought it was 10 when it was really 11.