WWYD (young adult, van damage, insurance)

[BakersDozen]

Our 18yos damaged the passenger side of our minivan back in December when he tried to back out of our driveway (the backing out was almost fine...he got a bit confident, gunned the gas, turned the wheel and his car right into our van...). We told him he had until the end of the holiday break to fix the van or my dh would take the van into a shop. That date came and went, life got in the way, and suddenly it is March. So over spring break we again told our ds to please get the van fixed. He did not and now he has moved out (long story). So my dh took the van into 3 shops for quotes which ranged from $1300-2900. We sent the information to our ds who said to just go through insurance.

Last night a $9600 deposit from our son's insurance was deposited into his account. This morning $9500 was taken out. Our son is desperate for money because he foolishly left without a plan, without anywhere to go, and without enough money to make it in this high cost of living town. So he made a claim on both our van and his car, got insurance money, and is planning to tackle the repairs himself with the help of our son-in-law. I guess this is legal (not sure it is right, though).

Here's my question: I told my dh to get something in writing that our ds/dsil will do the repairs to our satisfaction or the van will go to a shop and our ds will pay for it. We don't want some half-baked repair job. It's not a new van and it's not in perfect condition, but we don't feel that even with those factors that the repairs need to make our van look worse, if that makes sense.

On a side note, the amount he got from insurance was enough for us to outright buy a good used van. Yikes. The damage to both vehicles wasn't nearly that bad...maybe insurance overpays?

WWYD? Let him do the repairs himself? Just take the van in (insurance did, after all, base the deposit on a professional repair job)?

[Arcadia]

I don’t think it would be fair to include your son-in-law in the writing about getting repairs done. I am assuming your son-in-law is helping your son out of goodwill and not getting paid for his labor. 

I would be inclined to take the van in because a maternal cousin did something similar and promises were broken. He did finally “matured” in his 30s. 

[BakersDozen]

Yes, sorry...only our ds would be included in the written "contract" or whatever.

[Ailaena]

What are you going to do if you take the van in for repairs and he doesn’t pay you?  Will you take him to court?   How far are you willing to take this?  

it sounds like this is a rough time for him, so there’s no way I would trust him to pay for my repairs.  IF he gets around to repairing it himself, that’s probably fine, but do you actually think he will?  I’m saying this as somebody who went through a rough patch and whose dd kind of did, also.  

[Lori D.]

Just me, but I would say that the time of the original offer expired at the end of the holidays. You granted grace into January. Now he just needs to learn a hard life lesson of being responsible and taking the van to the shop so that it gets done RIGHT and gets done NOW (in a timely fashion). I can't imagine that anything but frustration on all sides will result in allowing him to drag this on and on for potentially weeks in trying to make repairs himself. He had his window to repair it himself; he chose not to. Now it is time for the natural consequences of that choice. I would express all of that lovingly, calmly, but clearly/firmly, and then you can all move on.

Again, JMO.

[fairfarmhand]

I have no clue what to do, but I’m sorry for this situation . I have an adult child making poor choices impulsively and it’s hard.

[BakersDozen]

I/we don't know what we would do if he does not pay for the repairs. His insurance is through the same company we have been with for years and years...could we contact our agent and let them know they paid for something our son is not getting done? With our son's arrogant attitude we would have no problem taking him to court if we thought it might get through to him. We just don't want him to start his own repairs, the work isn't done well, and we're left with a van that looks like crud while he walks away with thousands and thousands of dollars.

[busymama7]

Based on what you wrote here and what I know from my own difficult young adult, I wouldn't allow him to make the repairs himself. The insurance should have deposited the money in your account, not his and I would call them and get them involved, NOW. 

I might offer to pay him for the repairs once they are done to your satisfaction but only once the money for your repairs is in your control. 

[Annie G]

I would be uncomfortable with him having the money for the repairs to your car. I mean, if a stranger hit your car, they wouldn’t send them the check and have them handle the repair. 

‘At the minimum I would request that he hand over the money for the repair and IF he completes the fix in a timely manner he can have the money back. 

I would also ask to see the insurance paperwork. How he filed that claim without you seems suspicious. 

[BakersDozen]

2 minutes ago, Annie G said:

I would also ask to see the insurance paperwork. How he filed that claim without you seems suspicious.  

Apparently our ds took photos but I/we are still wondering the same as you. I swear I will take 8 teething babies or whiny toddlers over one young adult slogging through this time of life.

[Pen]

42 minutes ago, BakersDozen said:

I/we don't know what we would do if he does not pay for the repairs. His insurance is through the same company we have been with for years and years...could we contact our agent and let them know they paid for something our son is not getting done? With our son's arrogant attitude we would have no problem taking him to court if we thought it might get through to him. We just don't want him to start his own repairs, the work isn't done well, and we're left with a van that looks like crud while he walks away with thousands and thousands of dollars.

 

25 minutes ago, busymama7 said:

Based on what you wrote here and what I know from my own difficult young adult, I wouldn't allow him to make the repairs himself. The insurance should have deposited the money in your account, not his and I would call them and get them involved, NOW. 

I might offer to pay him for the repairs once they are done to your satisfaction but only once the money for your repairs is in your control. 

 

18 minutes ago, Annie G said:

I would be uncomfortable with him having the money for the repairs to your car. I mean, if a stranger hit your car, they wouldn’t send them the check and have them handle the repair. 

‘At the minimum I would request that he hand over the money for the repair...

 

I would also ask to see the insurance paperwork. How he filed that claim without you seems suspicious. 

 

These.

 

I wouldn’t let him do repairs at this stage.  Do contact your insurance company and agent both.  

I don’t think money for repairs to your vehicle should have gone to your son.  Makes no sense.

At minimum, I think $3000 of the money should be given to you by your son.  If it ends up less than that to fix your van you could consider giving the rest back to your son.

But something sounds fishy, and I think you need to learn from your insurance company what’s going on.

I’d be concerned that unless your sil is a professional in correct type of car repair that the job won’t be well done, and problem between you and son will ripple outward to include widening array of family.  

Edited March 21, 2019 by Pen

[Bootsie]

Do I understand correctly that your son has a separate insurance policy from your insurance policy?  Is his car titled in his name and your car titled in your name?  I am not seeing any way that the insurance company would give him $ for damage to your car.  

You could make a claim through your insurance policy for the damage, and your insurance company will then try to collect from his insurance policy; If he has committed any type of insurance fraud they will be able to determine that.  

Is there any chance that the check deposited into his account is for something else?  

[Valley Girl]

I'm still in the process of reading replies,  but I'm not understanding something. Why did the insurance company pay your son for YOUR van? If I hit another vehicle, the insurance company isn't going to give me the money and tell me to give it to the other driver. I would think that if your son reported the accident, he would have been paid for his damage (assuming he has collision coverage) and the insurance company would have contacted you to arrange payment for your damages. Then you could have had your vehicle repaired. Something seems off.

[Scarlett]

Yes I don’t understand this either.  I work for a collision center and something about this seems weird.  

[BakersDozen]

My husband will contact our insurance company tomorrow to determine how our son got the money. He has his own policy but it is through the same company which we also use. This is very weird and it is why I was awake a lot last night, turning this over in my mind. I appreciate everyone's input - you all always help me stay sane as each new older teen/young adult issue comes up. Please be around for my next 9 kids coming up the ranks, OK?

[Valley Girl]

1 minute ago, BakersDozen said:

My husband will contact our insurance company tomorrow to determine how our son got the money. He has his own policy but it is through the same company which we also use. This is very weird and it is why I was awake a lot last night, turning this over in my mind. I appreciate everyone's input - you all always help me stay sane as each new older teen/young adult issue comes up. Please be around for my next 9 kids coming up the ranks, OK?

It's good he's contacting the company. If the money was paid to your son in error, then getting it back should be their headache (and your son's), not yours. Hopefully they'll cut you a new check.

Young adult kids can be sooo hard.

[gardenmom5]

he hasn't' shown himself to be dependable.  life will teach him.  in the meantime -  I'd insist on a professional repair job.  It's not the son-in-law's job to do the repair work, and probably have to get him moving to do the repair work.  unless he has extensive experience, who knows what it would look like.

I'd want a lot more information on the claims he submitted.  insurance companies don't put out that kind of money for older cars unless they declare it totaled (and plan on taking possession) - and they will put that on the title as part of the contract for issuing the checks...  I'd want - a LOT more information on those checks...

[Chris in VA]

He could go to prison for insurance fraud, if he, for example, pretended to be the owner of the vehicle when he wasn't. 

I would talk to him and ask what the payment was on your van. Demand that money. Use it for the repair.  The other money for the damage on his car is rightly his. 

Get information today. 

[gardenmom5]

4 hours ago, BakersDozen said:

I/we don't know what we would do if he does not pay for the repairs. His insurance is through the same company we have been with for years and years...could we contact our agent and let them know they paid for something our son is not getting done? With our son's arrogant attitude we would have no problem taking him to court if we thought it might get through to him. We just don't want him to start his own repairs, the work isn't done well, and we're left with a van that looks like crud while he walks away with thousands and thousands of dollars.

I would absolutely contact your insurance company.  I would want to know *exactly* IF he actually submitted a claim, and for what he submitted for a claim.  IF they actually issued him a check for his car and your car - a car for which he doesn't hold the title or the policy.  I would want to know why they didn't send out an appraiser to check out the damage themselves before issuing a check?  why did they issue a check to him?  

I would also wonder if the money was from something else - and he's not telling the truth about where it came from. 

If he has committed insurance fraud - are you prepared for the fallout of that?

[BakersDozen]

Well...interesting way this story unfolded this evening. When my dh picked up our girls from a youth event one of the girls said that a peer came up to her and mentioned our son...and the fact that his car was t-boned over spring break. Huh. So that explains the insurance money...it was for his car, not our van. So that mystery is solved. We still have a damaged van, but the harder issue is that our ds, who once told me to "F*** off" when I asked how he was doing with the girl thing or how his classes are going at the CC, and who has pushed us away in every way (he blocked his cell phone number from us, etc.) was in an accident and apparently others know but not us. OK, then. We're not going to say one word that we know to anyone and just let this play out. He wants his independence and privacy, OK. But he's fixing our van regardless and at this point my dh says he is taking it into a shop, forget the son-in-law's attempt to fix it.

The worst thing is that at no point can I/we let our ds know how much it hurts us that he was in an accident and we didn't know. That would make him crow with triumph...knowing he hurt us.

 

[Ausmumof3]

44 minutes ago, BakersDozen said:

Well...interesting way this story unfolded this evening. When my dh picked up our girls from a youth event one of the girls said that a peer came up to her and mentioned our son...and the fact that his car was t-boned over spring break. Huh. So that explains the insurance money...it was for his car, not our van. So that mystery is solved. We still have a damaged van, but the harder issue is that our ds, who once told me to "F*** off" when I asked how he was doing with the girl thing or how his classes are going at the CC, and who has pushed us away in every way (he blocked his cell phone number from us, etc.) was in an accident and apparently others know but not us. OK, then. We're not going to say one word that we know to anyone and just let this play out. He wants his independence and privacy, OK. But he's fixing our van regardless and at this point my dh says he is taking it into a shop, forget the son-in-law's attempt to fix it.

The worst thing is that at no point can I/we let our ds know how much it hurts us that he was in an accident and we didn't know. That would make him crow with triumph...knowing he hurt us.

 

I hope you are going to put your repairs on your insurance and let them chase it up.  His insurance needs to pay you.  If you want to help your son help him another way but not by letting him hit your car and not deal with it.  He needs to know that’s not an acceptable way to treat anyone.

[gardenmom5]

I'm glad you found out what is going on - and I'm sorry he's being such an idiot.

if he wants to be a grown up and completely in charge of himself - let him.  that includes his insurance being notified he hit your car and you want it fixed.

[madteaparty]

2 hours ago, BakersDozen said:

Well...interesting way this story unfolded this evening. When my dh picked up our girls from a youth event one of the girls said that a peer came up to her and mentioned our son...and the fact that his car was t-boned over spring break. Huh. So that explains the insurance money...it was for his car, not our van. So that mystery is solved. We still have a damaged van, but the harder issue is that our ds, who once told me to "F*** off" when I asked how he was doing with the girl thing or how his classes are going at the CC, and who has pushed us away in every way (he blocked his cell phone number from us, etc.) was in an accident and apparently others know but not us. OK, then. We're not going to say one word that we know to anyone and just let this play out. He wants his independence and privacy, OK. But he's fixing our van regardless and at this point my dh says he is taking it into a shop, forget the son-in-law's attempt to fix it.

The worst thing is that at no point can I/we let our ds know how much it hurts us that he was in an accident and we didn't know. That would make him crow with triumph...knowing he hurt us.

 

Looking at the bright side. At least he didn’t commit insurance fraud. So sorry 😞

[Melissa in Australia]

hugs

[Chris in VA]

I'm sorry your son is acting this way. Some things to be thankful for--he wasn't hurt in his wreak, he has money to live on without you (he won't be homeless, like my son had to experience), and he has insurance to cover the repairs to your van. And, he didn't commit fraud.  As far as natural consequences,  his insurance will likely go up. Let his insurance cover your van. 

I suppose you could offer him one last chance to pay for your repair instead of reporting it to his insurance (but I would not give him the option of fixing it himself).  

[Scarlett]

I am still womdering how he got $9500 out of his car being hit?  Did they total it?  What is he driving?

who is your insurance and have you filed a claim?  I would call your insurance this morning and tell them you need to file a claim. He needs to file it on his insurance and not yours. But liability will have to be established which means they will have to talk to him.  If he won’t do that your insurance will pay and you will have to pay your deductible.  

[hjffkj]

Do you have anything in writing/text/email from D's about what he did to your van? Because if you go through your insurance, which at this point I suggest doing, he seems likely to deny it was him. That just seems to be the personality and relationship I'm picking up fr everything you have written.

If you don't have anything with him stating he caused the damage be prepared for his insurance not to pay out.

[QueenCat]

11 hours ago, BakersDozen said:

I/we don't know what we would do if he does not pay for the repairs. His insurance is through the same company we have been with for years and years...could we contact our agent and let them know they paid for something our son is not getting done? With our son's arrogant attitude we would have no problem taking him to court if we thought it might get through to him. We just don't want him to start his own repairs, the work isn't done well, and we're left with a van that looks like crud while he walks away with thousands and thousands of dollars.

 

NM just saw your update.

Edited March 21, 2019 by QueenCat

[Scarlett]

People file claims all of the time 3 months or more later.  I think there is a time limit but seems like one time a customer came in and told me their time was almost up and it had been almost 2 years!!!

So anyway, go ahead and file the claim on his policy.  

[gardenmom5]

definitely file the claim.  if the insurance wont' take it, file in small claims court.

if his car was totaled, has he replaced his car?  there's plenty in there for a car, and to fix yours.  but he seems to think he can put it towards bills.  

[Scarlett]

3 minutes ago, gardenmom5 said:

definitely file the claim.  if the insurance wont' take it, file in small claims court.

if his car was totaled, has he replaced his car?  there's plenty in there for a car, and to fix yours.  but he seems to think he can put it towards bills.  

I am scratching my head and wondering how he has a paid for car worth $10K.  If he had a loan on it the insurance payment would have went to the lien holder. 

But honestly that insurance pay out has nothing to do with the damage to the van.  

[gardenmom5]

1 minute ago, Scarlett said:

I am scratching my head and wondering how he has a paid for car worth $10K.  If he had a loan on it the insurance payment would have went to the lien holder. 

But honestly that insurance pay out has nothing to do with the damage to the van.  

maybe it was paid off, maybe not. maybe he has a paying job that he could afford a better car, maybe not.  the maybe or maybe not car loan from his totaled car - is his problem. the payout probably included more than "just" the car, there are license tabs, et. al.   there is gap insurance that will payoff a loan if a car is totaled - but that is extra. (though if there was a loan on the car - gap insurance may have been part of the terms of the loan as credit agencies want to make sure they get their money.

my dd's car was totaled two weeks ago. her insurance payout was much higher than we were expecting (much more than kdd or Edmunds said her car was worth, they did include her tabs as she had JUST renewed them) -  she owned her car free and clear.  they did break it down into minute detail about what everything was covered.  - she was so stressed about it, she did ask for help in finding a car.

- and that the insurance payout wasn't about the van is why they need to file a claim so they can get their van repaired by him. (even if it had been)  he's not going to pay for it willingly (I'm skeptical he'd actually do it with his bil helping him - with questionable results), he's made that clear - that ship has sailed.  his rates will go up, but this is part of living in the grown up world.

[gardenmom5]

9 minutes ago, Medicmom2.0 said:

.  My point is OP is still making a lot of assumptions.

I am so confused about all this “he should pay you from it” and “take him to court.”  Your DS has asked you to send it to his insurance.  They will take care of it.  He’ll probably have a higher insurance payment, but that’s what happens when you hit a car.   

the small claims court was if the insurance doesn't pay because of how long it has been since he damaged her car.

[Scarlett]

8 minutes ago, gardenmom5 said:

the small claims court was if the insurance doesn't pay because of how long it has been since he damaged her car.

As I mentioned above though, three months is not that long.  

[gardenmom5]

7 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

As I mentioned above though, three months is not that long.  

I'm one who prefers to have a backup plan, and to know what my options are. if the insurance pays - great.  if he disputes he's responsible, and ties it up fighting about it (his rates will go up) and they won't pay out - they have options.

 

[sassenach]

I would not agree to his plan (and I’m shocked that insurance sent the entire payout to him!). Your van needs to be professionally repaired. Period. 

[Scarlett]

2 minutes ago, sassenach said:

I would not agree to his plan (and I’m shocked that insurance sent the entire payout to him!). Your van needs to be professionally repaired. Period. 

Turns out that is probably not the insurance pay out for the van.  We really don't know for sure what it is for.  He is not speaking to his parents.

[gardenmom5]

6 minutes ago, Medicmom2.0 said:

 

Ah, I get it.

i still don’t know that I am willing to ruin a strained relationship over some car damage to be honest.  My parents pushed my barely adult sister in a similar situation; they were right and she was incredibly immature, but now she’s estranged from all of us and I have two nieces I won’t know.

I would just count the cost. This isn’t likely to make him grow up or mature faster.  

I'm not sure what I would do in this position either - as I try to look at the long road.

he has told them to file an insurance claim - they were trying to let him pay for it himself.

I've been in the position of having the hospital call me to notify me they had security standing by to throw my brother out on my say-so. (he was manipulating our mother IN FRONT of her dr.  they'd consulted with their attorneys first). I regret having said - tell him what he wants to hear and he'll leave.  in retrospect - he needed the reality bites lesson of having been thrown out on his pattootie.  I was trying to be kind - so he didn't get it.

sometimes - it is kinder to be "hard" if they'll eventually learn from it, that to provide a cushion for a softer landing.  even if that hard landing makes them mad.  but I grew up in a family of enablers - and I've seen the damage that does.

 

Edited March 21, 2019 by gardenmom5

[sassenach]

1 hour ago, Scarlett said:

Turns out that is probably not the insurance pay out for the van.  We really don't know for sure what it is for.  He is not speaking to his parents.

I should really read the whole thread first before posting but I get lazy!

 

[BakersDozen]

Most of this is in response to MedicMom:

We don't watch our kids' checking accounts. They are linked to ours as they are student accounts yet they (3 of them) know that we aren't looking to see where they are spending/earning money. I checked my dd's once because she was at work and there were high charges being made at the mall w/her card. And I only saw my ds's enormous deposit because I had gone on-line to look at my own account and saw that his balance was no longer in the $6 range (he really has no money). Given the van issue it was our first thought that he had somehow made a claim and received money - money which was out of his account the next morning. We were seriously confused and asked our ds via email if the claim he had made was done legally, which he assured us it was. That was all the information we received from him and it was in the context of emails about repairs for our van. So yes, we assumed that the funds in/out of his account were connected with the current van issue. His accident was completely unknown to us. We knew it couldn't be loan money or anything else (he has not graduated high school...was slated to do so in May but now that is off the table).

As far as him not telling us about the accident, we, too, have not shared many things with our parents so that isn't the issue so much as our ds's heart/attitude at this point. For those who have young adult/older teens like this, you know what I'm talking about and what we are going through with him.

As far as protecting the relationship vs. straining/damaging it...I grew up watching my mom get verbally abused by my brother. He could say/do anything and she would take it because she didn't want to "lose" him. It was disgusting. She enabled him, he was horrible to all of us, and we hated him. That is my son. He thrives on conflict and hurting others. We have shown him more than his share of grace and had told him to shape up or get out. He didn't take us seriously, so the decision was made for him to get out. He's also one of those who likes to throw around that he is 18 (as if that is some magical age) when it suits his purpose yet then says we somehow owe him something (like paying a bill) because he's only 18. Nice try, kid.

Back to the van issue...we told our ds that the van was going to a shop and he would pay. Our ds told us to use insurance, then suddenly he said he would be coming over this Sunday with his bil to try to fix the van. That is where things stood until the bank account/deposit thing happened. We're not trying to gouge our son out of money, but we want this van fixed and fixed correctly.

Our intention isn't to be "hard" on our son but to be real. He wanted real life...here it is.

[gardenmom5]

30 minutes ago, BakersDozen said:

Most of this is in response to MedicMom:

We don't watch our kids' checking accounts. They are linked to ours as they are student accounts yet they (3 of them) know that we aren't looking to see where they are spending/earning money. I checked my dd's once because she was at work and there were high charges being made at the mall w/her card. And I only saw my ds's enormous deposit because I had gone on-line to look at my own account and saw that his balance was no longer in the $6 range (he really has no money). Given the van issue it was our first thought that he had somehow made a claim and received money - money which was out of his account the next morning. We were seriously confused and asked our ds via email if the claim he had made was done legally, which he assured us it was. That was all the information we received from him and it was in the context of emails about repairs for our van. So yes, we assumed that the funds in/out of his account were connected with the current van issue. His accident was completely unknown to us. We knew it couldn't be loan money or anything else (he has not graduated high school...was slated to do so in May but now that is off the table).

As far as him not telling us about the accident, we, too, have not shared many things with our parents so that isn't the issue so much as our ds's heart/attitude at this point. For those who have young adult/older teens like this, you know what I'm talking about and what we are going through with him.

As far as protecting the relationship vs. straining/damaging it...I grew up watching my mom get verbally abused by my brother. He could say/do anything and she would take it because she didn't want to "lose" him. It was disgusting. She enabled him, he was horrible to all of us, and we hated him. That is my son. He thrives on conflict and hurting others. We have shown him more than his share of grace and had told him to shape up or get out. He didn't take us seriously, so the decision was made for him to get out. He's also one of those who likes to throw around that he is 18 (as if that is some magical age) when it suits his purpose yet then says we somehow owe him something (like paying a bill) because he's only 18. Nice try, kid.

Back to the van issue...we told our ds that the van was going to a shop and he would pay. Our ds told us to use insurance, then suddenly he said he would be coming over this Sunday with his bil to try to fix the van. That is where things stood until the bank account/deposit thing happened. We're not trying to gouge our son out of money, but we want this van fixed and fixed correctly.

Our intention isn't to be "hard" on our son but to be real. He wanted real life...here it is.

this.

I remember going on vacation without my sister when I was ten. it was glorious!  for the first time, we had a family vacation without her drama.

my brother was/is an @$$ - and my mother let him treat her like carp because she "didn't want to alienate him".  it does a heck of a lot of damage - not just to the parent, but to all the siblings as well.

[Bootsie]

I am sorry that you are going through all of this.  This partially grown up and independent stage can be difficult to navigate and emotionally draining.  On the bright side, it sounds as if he has his own car, is paying his own insurance, and is able to navigate an accident and insurance claim on his own at 18.  Although many of his actions are not mature and do not demonstrate the type of behavior you would like him to show, this does demonstrate some important life skills that many 18 year-olds would have difficulty with.  

If he does want to be independent at this point, I would be in favor of changing the banking situation so that his checking account is no longer linked to yours.  It has the potential of causing stress for you as you do see the balance when you log on and off to your own accounts, and the linking is probably not serving an positive purpose at this point if you are not planning to subsidize his life choices.  

 

[unsinkable]

If the relationship is so volatile that he has left home without a high school diploma, there is no way I'd continue to pursue having him repair the van. 

For various reasons, in no order, if it was me.

If he is talking to you in ways that upset you, I wouldn't put him in that position to do it.

The damage sounds cosmetic and it'd be worth my peace of mind to just deal with it on my own.

It he has such little money that he typically has $6 in his account, I wouldn't want to have him spend more money on something that isn't food, clothing and shelter for himself, even though he damaged the van.

I've raised a very difficult child thru the teen years so I'm not talking out my ear. 

[BakersDozen]

Quote

It he has such little money that he typically has $6 in his account, I wouldn't want to have him spend more money on something that isn't food, clothing and shelter for himself, even though he damaged the van.

My dh is now the one interacting with our ds so he doesn't have a chance to speak in an ugly manner to me (and he doesn't dare try it w/my dh...). The money, though...the only reason our ds doesn't have money is because he spends it on his girlfriend - gas to drive and go see her (she lives about 45 miles away) and gifts. So letting this kid off the hook for the van really goes against the grain. He could pay, but he wants to spend what he earns on himself and the girl.

It's such a stupid, useless situation, really. This kid has what it takes to be amazing, but he chooses otherwise. SMDH against a wall over and over and over...

[Valley Girl]

7 minutes ago, BakersDozen said:

My dh is now the one interacting with our ds so he doesn't have a chance to speak in an ugly manner to me (and he doesn't dare try it w/my dh...). The money, though...the only reason our ds doesn't have money is because he spends it on his girlfriend - gas to drive and go see her (she lives about 45 miles away) and gifts. So letting this kid off the hook for the van really goes against the grain. He could pay, but he wants to spend what he earns on himself and the girl.

It's such a stupid, useless situation, really. This kid has what it takes to be amazing, but he chooses otherwise. SMDH against a wall over and over and over...

Parenting ain't for the faint of heart.

[TechWife]

You get to decide who works on your car. I suggest you call the insurance, make a claim and take it to have it fixed. Tell your son "thanks, but no thanks" if he shows up to work on it. He missed his window of opportunity.

[lavender's green]

4 hours ago, BakersDozen said:

Most of this is in response to MedicMom:

We don't watch our kids' checking accounts. They are linked to ours as they are student accounts yet they (3 of them) know that we aren't looking to see where they are spending/earning money. I checked my dd's once because she was at work and there were high charges being made at the mall w/her card. And I only saw my ds's enormous deposit because I had gone on-line to look at my own account and saw that his balance was no longer in the $6 range (he really has no money). Given the van issue it was our first thought that he had somehow made a claim and received money - money which was out of his account the next morning. We were seriously confused and asked our ds via email if the claim he had made was done legally, which he assured us it was. That was all the information we received from him and it was in the context of emails about repairs for our van. So yes, we assumed that the funds in/out of his account were connected with the current van issue. His accident was completely unknown to us. We knew it couldn't be loan money or anything else (he has not graduated high school...was slated to do so in May but now that is off the table).

As far as him not telling us about the accident, we, too, have not shared many things with our parents so that isn't the issue so much as our ds's heart/attitude at this point. For those who have young adult/older teens like this, you know what I'm talking about and what we are going through with him.

As far as protecting the relationship vs. straining/damaging it...I grew up watching my mom get verbally abused by my brother. He could say/do anything and she would take it because she didn't want to "lose" him. It was disgusting. She enabled him, he was horrible to all of us, and we hated him. That is my son. He thrives on conflict and hurting others. We have shown him more than his share of grace and had told him to shape up or get out. He didn't take us seriously, so the decision was made for him to get out. He's also one of those who likes to throw around that he is 18 (as if that is some magical age) when it suits his purpose yet then says we somehow owe him something (like paying a bill) because he's only 18. Nice try, kid.

Back to the van issue...we told our ds that the van was going to a shop and he would pay. Our ds told us to use insurance, then suddenly he said he would be coming over this Sunday with his bil to try to fix the van. That is where things stood until the bank account/deposit thing happened. We're not trying to gouge our son out of money, but we want this van fixed and fixed correctly.

Our intention isn't to be "hard" on our son but to be real. He wanted real life...here it is.

I'm sorry. My sister was exactly like your brother. And my parents were exactly like your parents, with me left to fend for myself. My greatest fear is that my kids will turn out like that and I'll be like...what the heck do I do now? Actually my dad does hope that my kids will turn out like that. Nice, huh? Then he didn't speak to me for seven years, all because I wouldn't allow my abusive and violent sister around my kids. People who haven't been there may not understand how many relationships it can ruin. It is ugly, ugly, ugly.

With a different relationship, I might say to let it slide, let the young adult off easy as they figure out this whole adulting thing. But here I'd say to file an insurance claim (or whatever your situation is...maybe small claims court?) like you would if any other adult had accidentally damaged your car. That is the normal legal channel. You might skip the normal legal channel for friends or family, or if the damage is minor, but it's still the norm for a reason. And your son has asked you to. 

[Pen]

3 hours ago, BakersDozen said:

My dh is now the one interacting with our ds so he doesn't have a chance to speak in an ugly manner to me (and he doesn't dare try it w/my dh...). The money, though...the only reason our ds doesn't have money is because he spends it on his girlfriend - gas to drive and go see her (she lives about 45 miles away) and gifts. So letting this kid off the hook for the van really goes against the grain. He could pay, but he wants to spend what he earns on himself and the girl.

It's such a stupid, useless situation, really. This kid has what it takes to be amazing, but he chooses otherwise. SMDH against a wall over and over and over...

 

At least you know now that he didn’t do anything illegal with regard to the insurance money for your van.

To me, it makes sense to go ahead and turn in  a claim to insurance.  That’s presumably what you would do if a stranger in parking lot had hit your van. It may have real life consequences for his insurance rates, but he can learn from that. 

Remember that 18yo don’t have finished prefrontal cortex...and probably even worse function when under influence of hormones from a girlfriend