Menu
Jump to content

What's with the ads?

Arcadia

News: Christchurch mosque shooting sees armed police deployed and schools in lockdown (Update: semi-automatic and automatic weapons ban)

Recommended Posts

From abc Australia https://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2019-03-15/armed-police-respond-to-suspected-shooting-christchurch-mosque/10904306

“There are reports up to a dozen people have been shot at a mosque in Christchurch, New Zealand.

Armed police have been deployed after reports of shots being fired at a mosque in Christchurch.

Police have confirmed they are responding to a "critical incident".

Several schools are in lockdown and witnesses have reported multiple injuries. 

People in central Christchurch have been urged to stay indoors and report any suspicious behaviour immediately to authorities.

New Zealand's Prime Minister is expected to speak shortly. 

A witness interviewed on TVNZ said a man carrying a gun entered the mosque about 1:45pm (local time).”

ETA:

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12213039

“KEY POINTS:

• Dozens feared killed as at least two gunmen open fire at two central Christchurch mosques

• City in lockdown, with reports of a third shooting scene and a car bomb in Strickland St

• One gunman, believed to be Australian, filmed as he shot victims in the mosque - and wrote a 37-page manifesto declaring his intentions

...

Police Commissioner Mike Bush has confirmed "multiple fatalities".

He said there was one person in custody "but we are unsure if there are other people".

"Again we are unsure if there are any other locations outside of that area."

The multiple fatalities were at two locations - a mosque at Deans Ave and one at Linwood Ave.

There are reports of a third active shooting unfolding outside Christchurch Hospital.”

 

Edited by Arcadia
  • Sad 12

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bangladesh cricket team escaped from active shooters....bomb in a crashed car ?...shoeless people running from the mosque into surrounding streets. 

  • Sad 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This report says there were shootings at two separate mosques AND the main hospital in Christchurch. Eyewitnesses say at least one of the shooters was a white man with blond hair wearing a helmet and bullet proof vest and carrying an automatic rifle. Some sources are saying at least 50 people have been shot, including children. 😥

 

Edited by Corraleno
  • Like 1
  • Sad 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The hospital is apparently in lockdown because of the active shooter threat in the city, and is treating a number of victims.

Poor Christchurch 😞 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It is horrible.  They shot for 20 minutes....going room to room.   It was Jummah prayer (think Sunday worship).  

 

Guardian has good live coverage.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2019/mar/15/christchurch-shooting-injuries-reported-as-police-respond-to-critical-incident-live

 

What worries me more is that a guy at a big org in Florida is talking about how he and every Muslim should carry a gun for self protection.  Umm....no...that will just increase the likelihood of lethal DV incidents and suicide.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Apparently, they shot at worshipers in two different mosques.

 

For those who are curious, when a Muslim dies, the way to give condolences is to say "Inna Lillahi wa inna ilayhi raji'un" which means "From God we come and to God we return."  (Yes, you can say it in English.  People will be grateful either way.)

Edited by umsami
  • Like 8
  • Thanks 8

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, umsami said:

It is horrible.  They shot for 20 minutes....going room to room.   It was Jummah prayer (think Sunday worship).  

 

Guardian has good live coverage.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2019/mar/15/christchurch-shooting-injuries-reported-as-police-respond-to-critical-incident-live

 

What worries me more is that a guy at a big org in Florida is talking about how he and every Muslim should carry a gun for self protection.  Umm....no...that will just increase the likelihood of lethal DV incidents and suicide.

 

NZ hasn't had a mass shooting for close to 30 years, apparently. 

Honestly, I find it hard to understand such a thing happening in Christchurch.

When i saw the place name in the OP, I assumed another earthquake.

You are totally right, imo, re the guns.  Maybe mosques in this part of the word will have to start having armed guards though ? Idk. I think synagogues do, I don't think the mosque near me does. Not sure.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yep, multiple fatalities in two locations, one suspect in custody, active shooter situation ongoing.

 

  • Sad 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

OMG apparently the shooter livestreamed it — there is video of him walking up to people lying on the floor bleeding and just point-blank murdering the ones who weren't already dead. 

  • Sad 12

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Corraleno said:

OMG apparently the shooter livestreamed it — there is video of him walking up to people lying on the floor bleeding and just point-blank murdering the ones who weren't already dead. 

Going to add a request from the Muslim community.  Please do not watch the video/livestream.  Please do not share his name.  Please do not read his manifesto.  

Give him as little publicity as possible.  Mourn the victims.  Publicize their names and their stories.  Give the shooter zero publicity.  

No need to promote copycat crimes.  Going to Friday prayer tomorrow will be tough enough.

  • Like 14
  • Thanks 9

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Grover lives in Christchurch, but I haven't seen her on the board for a while.  Will be very interesting to see where the guns came from as they are illegal here. Even the police only have Tasers. 

In my experience, there is very little anti-muslim rhetoric here. Me personally, I've never heard anything anti-muslim *ever*. So it will also be interested to see who has trained them for hate. 

So sad. 😞

Ruth in NZ

  • Like 3
  • Sad 9

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I will say, however, that they will be caught.  There is no where to hide here. The country is too small and everyone knows everyone.

I remember once about 20 years ago that there was a hand gun spotted in Wellington when someone held up a convenience store. And it was all over the radio.  "he was last spotted heading down Courtnay Place. Call in if you see him. Oh, another call, he has now been spotted on Tory.....etc"  Took them 10 minutes. 

 

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

إنا لله وإنا إليه راجعون

This is such horrible news.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
37 minutes ago, lewelma said:

Grover lives in Christchurch, but I haven't seen her on the board for a while.  Will be very interesting to see where the guns came from as they are illegal here. Even the police only have Tasers. 

In my experience, there is very little anti-muslim rhetoric here. Me personally, I've never heard anything anti-muslim *ever*. So it will also be interested to see who has trained them for hate. 

So sad. 😞

Ruth in NZ

Really?  My dh always talks about how much looser Nz gun laws are than here.

i did a quick check on wiki and it looks like your lower level gun class allows for semi auto weapons.  Here you need to be in primary production or professional shooting to get that kind of weapon.

I’m so sorry!  Poor Christchurch has had a bad few years.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Reports are that the shooter is an Australian.  That would make a horrible kind of sense unfortunately.  

 

  • Sad 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Ausmumof3 said:

Reports are that the shooter is an Australian.  That would make a horrible kind of sense unfortunately.  

 

 

Ugh. But yes.

Apparently 4 people are in custody ? 

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, StellaM said:

 

Ugh. But yes.

Apparently 4 people are in custody ? 

 

Only 1 Australian I think or maybe he’s the only one they have an identity for or are sure of the involvement.  Given the level seems like there must be more than one.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Lots of sirens in Wellington tonight. Very disturbing.  They are not sure it is confined to Christchurch. 😞

ETA: now a police helicopter zipping by. 

Edited by lewelma
  • Sad 7

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Apparently, the defense force diffused multiple car bombs.  This was well planned. 

 

  • Sad 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Our news is saying 4 suspects are in custody.  They are saying between 9 and 27 deaths.  But these are not official reports.  It is fairly common for the news to be inaccurate shortly after an incident.

Prayers for the victims and the community.

  • Sad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
33 minutes ago, lewelma said:

Apparently, the defense force diffused multiple car bombs.  This was well planned. 

 

The main suspect posted an extreme right-wing, anti-muslim, anti-immigrant manifesto saying he had been planning the attack for two years. One of the witnesses said he first shot up the men's prayer room, then walked into the women's prayer room and started killing women and children.

Edited by Corraleno
  • Sad 6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Omg. Between this and the violence on the Haram/Temple Mount and Gaza, my heart is so sore. St. George's College here where we live on the Cathedral close is having an interfaith study tour this week, with Muslims, Jews and Christians all visiting sites and discussing different stories and interpretations of historical events here. They went to Hebron yesterday and were on the Haram the day  when the molotav cocktail and subsequent closing of the Damascus Gate occurred. It has been a respectful group, and their heartbreak at what is happening is palpable. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The news had pics of weapons etc and they were posted with names/dates of places and people from Christian/Muslim battles and more recently neo nazi clashes.  I don’t want to read the whole manifesto because that’s what the shooter would want it guess but seems like it’s a white extremist type thing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

40 people were killed. 30 at al-Noor mosque and ten at Linwood mosque.  Dozens more were shot.

 

 

  • Sad 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

google, youtube, and facebook are trying to take down the video.  NZ providers are blocking other websites with the video from being accessed inside NZ. I think this is good.  

  • Like 6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, lewelma said:

google, youtube, and facebook are trying to take down the video.  NZ providers are blocking other websites with the video from being accessed inside NZ. I think this is good.  

I'm also glad to see that although the guy's name and photo were available on one or two sites, most NZ/AUS/UK media are avoiding identifying him and are just referring to him as "the suspect" or "the shooter." I hope that continues. If this were in the US, the guy's name and face would be plastered all over every media outlet by now, and plenty of other sickos would be treating him like a hero. 

  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Found this interesting.  

Murders are rare in New Zealand, and gun homicides even rarer. There were 35 murders countrywide in 2017. Since 2007, gun homicides have been in the single digits each year except 2009, when there were 11.

But there are plenty of guns. There were 1.2 million registered firearms in a country of 4.6 million people in 2017, according to the Small Arms Survey, a Swiss nonprofit.

Edited by lewelma
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Of the 4 in custody it’s believed one just happened to be armed at the scene not involved and the other two police are unsure yet.   Only one person charged for now.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, umsami said:

Going to add a request from the Muslim community.  Please do not watch the video/livestream.  Please do not share his name.  Please do not read his manifesto.  

Give him as little publicity as possible.  Mourn the victims.  Publicize their names and their stories.  Give the shooter zero publicity.  

No need to promote copycat crimes.  Going to Friday prayer tomorrow will be tough enough.

And it allows hate to overshadow the kids who were out marching today for a better future.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, lewelma said:

Found this interesting.  

Murders are rare in New Zealand, and gun homicides even rarer. There were 35 murders countrywide in 2017. Since 2007, gun homicides have been in the single digits each year except 2009, when there were 11.

But there are plenty of guns. There were 1.2 million registered firearms in a country of 4.6 million people in 2017, according to the Small Arms Survey, a Swiss nonprofit.

Honestly if you distill out drug and gang violence from the statistics in this country the firearm homicide rates plummet pretty dramatically as well, especially in some states.  What remains are suicides, some random homicides, DV, hunting accidents, and the rare workplace/public shooting like this one.  Gang related crime really skews it upward.  What’s so unfortunate is the gangs don’t just shoot themselves, innocent bystanders are too-often caught in the crossfire.  

I know NZ has statistically low homicide rates, this sort of thing is jarring wherever it happens but it probably feels proportionally bigger in such a small country 😞 And to specific populations that blows up the effect even moreso.  Heartbreaking.

Edited by Arctic Mama
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

To massacre innocent people anywhere is horrible. To do it in a "House of God" when people are praying is worse.  Very sad.    

  • Like 3
  • Sad 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

From ChannelNewsAsia https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/world/christchurch-shootings-2-malaysians-injured-6-indonesians-were-11348318

“CHRISTCHURCH: Two Malaysians were injured in a deadly gun attack on two mosques in Christchurch on Friday (Mar 15), the Malaysian foreign ministry said. Indonesia also said six of its citizens were inside an affected mosque at the time of the shooting

...

Malaysia’s Ministry of Foreign Affairs said in a statement that there are no Malaysian fatalities and that the injured are being treated. 

“Malaysia condemns in the strongest terms, this senseless act of terror on innocent civilians and hopes that those responsible for this barbaric crime be brought to justice,” it said.

... 

Indonesia’s Foreign Minister Retno LP Marsudi said six Indonesians were praying at Al-Noor Mosque when the attack happened. While three of the men are confirmed to have escaped the shooting, Indonesian officials are still trying to reach the other three, the Jakarta Post reported.

“A team from the embassy has been dispatched to Christchurch to seek information on our people who happened to be in the mosque, particularly the three who still cannot be contacted,” the minister said.

She added that there are currently 330 Indonesians living in Christchurch, 130 of whom are students.”

  • Sad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

News is starting to report on the victims. From CNA https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/world/christchurch-shootings-injured-malaysian-hit-by-several-bullets-11349522

A Malaysian official in New Zealand told the family that Rahimi was among the wounded taken to hospital. They were first told that he had been hit in the hip, but his wife later telephoned to say Rahimi was in a critical condition, and doctors were trying to remove several bullets from his body.

“He will be undergoing another surgery to remove bullets from his spine tomorrow,” Rahmi's wife said during the phone call, as reported by the Malay Mail.

...

A member of a large Malaysian community living in the area, Rahimi was a regular at the mosque.

He worked as a technician at a milk factory while his wife Norazila Wahid, 39, studied medicine specialising in neurology.

Aside from his son, he also has a daughter aged nine.

The family have been living in New Zealand for four years. They were planning to return to Malaysia next year, once his wife finished her studies, Rokiah said.”

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Pawz4me said:

 

This is why the FBI definition of "mass shooting" is more specific than this list.  It's something like 3 or more strangers in a single location and it specifically excludes gang wars.  Which yields a drastically different figure than lists compiled by random people on wikipedia or reddit that include situations where someone murders his entire family, shoots bosses and coworkers he is angry at, pulls out a gun to end a drunken bar fight, or lives in a crime ridden neighborhood in between rival gangs.

What happened in NZ was clearly terrorism.  But your chances of randomly being in the midst of a mass murder by a stranger is much less than it has ever been, no matter what terrifying thing you see on wikipedia, reddit, or some news article based off a reddit thread.

I think this is an important distinction to make because false crime statistics cause a lot of people I know in real life crippling anxiety.  When the truth is that if you're in a safe relationship and live in a safe neighborhood you are safer than you have ever been.  It's terrifying that the fewer mass shootings seem to have higher body counts though.

 

I don't want to take away from how terrible this tragedy is, or that several boardies over the last few years have discussed fearing this very scenario.  But I hate using misleading statistics to terrorize people, and I don't care which side of the political aisle the person is standing on.  The ends don't justify the means.  People do not make rational or compassionate decisions when they are terrified.

  • Like 9

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Extreme right wing terrorist. He wrote of the leaders he hated, I’m sure we all know which ones, and he praised the world leaders he felt a kinship with. I’m guessing we all know those men’s names, also.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Do yourselves a favor and don't read any of the comments on any of the articles.  😭  The hate within our own country will make you want to become a hermit and never interact with people again.

  • Like 9

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What a monster. Thanks, Umsami, for passing on the request from the Muslim community. I sure won't be watching any video or reading this guy's evil rantings.

  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, umsami said:

Going to add a request from the Muslim community.  Please do not watch the video/livestream.  Please do not share his name.  Please do not read his manifesto.  

Give him as little publicity as possible.  Mourn the victims.  Publicize their names and their stories.  Give the shooter zero publicity.  

No need to promote copycat crimes.  Going to Friday prayer tomorrow will be tough enough.

1

Not just the Muslim community.  The criminology community agrees w/ the above 

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Katy said:

 

This is why the FBI definition of "mass shooting" is more specific than this list.  It's something like 3 or more strangers in a single location and it specifically excludes gang wars.  Which yields a drastically different figure than lists compiled by random people on wikipedia or reddit that include situations where someone murders his entire family, shoots bosses and coworkers he is angry at, pulls out a gun to end a drunken bar fight, or lives in a crime ridden neighborhood in between rival gangs.

What happened in NZ was clearly terrorism.  But your chances of randomly being in the midst of a mass murder by a stranger is much less than it has ever been, no matter what terrifying thing you see on wikipedia, reddit, or some news article based off a reddit thread.

I think this is an important distinction to make because false crime statistics cause a lot of people I know in real life crippling anxiety.  When the truth is that if you're in a safe relationship and live in a safe neighborhood you are safer than you have ever been.  It's terrifying that the fewer mass shootings seem to have higher body counts though.

 

I don't want to take away from how terrible this tragedy is, or that several boardies over the last few years have discussed fearing this very scenario.  But I hate using misleading statistics to terrorize people, and I don't care which side of the political aisle the person is standing on.  The ends don't justify the means.  People do not make rational or compassionate decisions when they are terrified.

 

Why in heaven’s name would you strip out incidents of family and workplace violence and even gang violence in counting mass shooting cases and victims? Are the people less dead? Were the guns less present? Are the body counts smaller? I agree with you that the definition of mass shootings is in dispute but it seems to me folks want to carve out exceptions to minimize the perception of risk. There are lots of people on this board with testimonies of good relationships gone bad, stable coworkers who lose their -ish, kids who develop mental health challenges, etc. you’ve got a lot of ifs in there as guarantors of safety that are unreliable at best. https://www.fbi.gov/about/partnerships/office-of-partner-engagement/active-shooter-incidents-graphics

Edited by Sneezyone
  • Like 9
  • Thanks 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
41 minutes ago, Sneezyone said:

 

Why in heaven’s name would you strip out incidents of family and workplace violence and even gang violence in counting mass shooting cases and victims? Are the people less dead? Were the guns less present? Are the body counts smaller? I agree with you that the definition of mass shootings is in dispute but it seems to me folks want to carve out exceptions to minimize the perception of risk. There are lots of people on this board with testimonies of good relationships gone bad, stable coworkers who lose their -ish, kids who develop mental health challenges, etc. you’ve got a lot of ifs in there as guarantors of safety that are unreliable at best. https://www.fbi.gov/about/partnerships/office-of-partner-engagement/active-shooter-incidents-graphics

 

Why did the FBI and people who specialize in criminology categorize it that way?  I'm no expert but as an educated guess... because of the ways people process fear and make choices. The risk of someone you know flipping out and murdering you is much higher than a stranger murdering you, despite people being much more paralyzed by fear of the stranger. Gang violence can largely be avoided by avoiding gang territories. Because people need to know it is much more important to escape domestic violence with your children than it is to avoid schools, shopping malls, concerts or places of worship. Because people generally know if a coworker is unhinged before they go postal, and they need to know there is nothing wrong with expressing a concern that someone is unwell and needs help before they get so sick they make a huge mistake.

Of course you're much more likely to die of anything other than murder.  But it's murder by strangers that paralyzes people with fear and fear of crime that think tanks and lobbying groups use to push for political changes on both sides.  Either you're afraid of anyone having a weapon or you're afraid to not have a weapon because "The bad guys have them."  Falsely inflating the types of crimes that people have NO control over is only done for the purposes of fear mongering click bait (money) and political propaganda (power). 

I hear it from both sides and I'm SO SICK of it. People don't share misleading information for no reason. I honestly don't know what the answer to weapons is. Like many hard problems it is complicated and there is no easy solution.  But I can guarantee you that people who are manipulating the facts are hiding an agenda, and the fears they stir up give extremists a platform. I don't trust extremists on either side. I trust the people in the middle who are dedicated to reason and using the truth so much more.

Edited by Katy
clarification
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...