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Farrar

AP Microecon at PA Homeschoolers

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Any feedback on AP Microeconomics at PA Homeschoolers? Good instructor? Engaging? Also, I'm fine with different viewpoints, but I definitely want to hear that it's balanced. I know it's not going to cover government issues as much as a Macro class, but still. Ds would do the full year, not the semester version.

EDITED:

We decided against PAH. So, new question below. Anyone have another secular with a teacher option for microeconomics? I can't seem to find anything?

Edited by Farrar

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My son took the semester version from Daniel Burns two years ago. It prepared him well for the AP exams, but we thought it was a rather ho-hum course.

 

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If anyone knows of any others, by the way, I'd love to hear it. I didn't find anything that wasn't Christian (TPS and HSLDA both have it) or was just a video based/self-graded course (like Thinkwell).

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Perhaps I shouldn’t admit this, lol, but my ds used this guy — 

 

He did both micro and macro in a couple of months and took both CLEP tests and got 6 credits for those at his college.  It is also supposed to cover the AP materials.

The only cost is a $10 packet of worksheets for each level.  My ds and I had fun watching it together.

ETA: My dd doesn’t have time for Econ with her current lineup, but if the college she decides to attend accepts CLEP credit, we’ll be doing these the summer before she goes off.  Quick, easy, cheap and memorable. But tasteless, lol.

Edited by Mom0012
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13 hours ago, Julie of KY said:

My son took the semester version from Daniel Burns two years ago. It prepared him well for the AP exams, but we thought it was a rather ho-hum course.

 

Same here. PAH Macro was much more engaging and exciting

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I don't really personally find economics interesting at all, but if I had to, then yeah, macro would be my choice. But this is his particular interest and it's definitely microeconomics that he finds more interesting. For various reasons, I want him to take a class. While I know it's not a super hard exam, he definitely needs real support for it as his first exam and not being a natural test taker.

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9 hours ago, Mom0012 said:

Perhaps I shouldn’t admit this, lol, but my ds used this guy — 

He did both micro and macro in a couple of months and took both CLEP tests and got 6 credits for those at his college.  It is also supposed to cover the AP materials.

The only cost is a $10 packet of worksheets for each level.  My ds and I had fun watching it together.

ETA: My dd doesn’t have time for Econ with her current lineup, but if the college she decides to attend accepts CLEP credit, we’ll be doing these the summer before she goes off.  Quick, easy, cheap and memorable. But tasteless, lol.

Thank you for this! We had been planning on using the Great Courses econ course, but to be honest I wasn't too excited about it. It seems dated and perhaps slightly biased. I showed my son the ACDC econ course, we watched a couple of videos, and DS likes the looks of it. So I think we're going to use this. I guess that makes us tasteless, LOL. ; )

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1 hour ago, TarynB said:

Thank you for this! We had been planning on using the Great Courses econ course, but to be honest I wasn't too excited about it. It seems dated and perhaps slightly biased. I showed my son the ACDC econ course, we watched a couple of videos, and DS likes the looks of it. So I think we're going to use this. I guess that makes us tasteless, LOL. ; )

We started with the Great Courses and quickly wound up bored to death.

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I guess I'm wondering - because I have no context not being an econ or business type at all - are what people is saying is boring the content of the course for Great Courses or PA Homeschoolers or is it the presentation? Like, this kid thinks The Profit is the best show ever made. He did his 8th grade internship at a local business and he thought sorting credit card receipts and watching the business owner schmooze with other business people and make deals was FASCINATING. He just thinks it's interesting. I think all of that would have been dull. So I guess I'm thinking that while he needs a good presentation, he doesn't need the content jazzed up. I think he'll like it on its own. But I know this is a "quickie" AP exam for a lot of students, so maybe it's not a real interest for them.

Edited by Farrar

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2 hours ago, TarynB said:

Thank you for this! We had been planning on using the Great Courses econ course, but to be honest I wasn't too excited about it. It seems dated and perhaps slightly biased. I showed my son the ACDC econ course, we watched a couple of videos, and DS likes the looks of it. So I think we're going to use this. I guess that makes us tasteless, LOL. ; )

I don't know if it is included or separate, but make sure to watch that guy's EconMovies on YouTube. I had DD#1 watch them to occasionally throw some humor/fun into her normal Econ class (which also used Crash Course Econ videos).

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1 hour ago, Farrar said:

I guess I'm wondering - because I have no context not being an econ or business type at all - are what people is saying is boring the content of the course for Great Courses or PA Homeschoolers or is it the presentation? Like, this kid thinks The Profit is the best show ever made. He did his 8th grade internship at a local business and he thought sorting credit card receipts and watching the business owner schmooze with other business people and make deals was FASCINATING. He just thinks it's interesting. I think all of that would have been dull. So I guess I'm thinking that while he needs a good presentation, he doesn't need the content jazzed up. I think he'll like it on its own. But I know this is a "quickie" AP exam for a lot of students, so maybe it's not a real interest for them.

My ds is actually interested in business and investment and I thought he would like economics.  I was a little reluctant to have him CLEP out of econ because I’m sure he would enjoy a class.  I had him do it anyway because I wanted him to have the luxury of taking 12 credits instead of 15 during his freshman year of college. My son does not have the level of interest it sounds like your son has, though.

I think the problem with the Great Courses material for us may have partly been that it was pretty long and there was no interaction with the material.  Also, it was my son’s senior year and he couldn’t believe I was asking him to do one more thing.  He was ready to be done.  So, we switched gears and the AC/DC guy was far more efficient and it was nice to have the worksheets.  His silliness brought some fun to our day.

I may still have my GC dvds.  If you would like them, PM me and I will look and see if I can find them in the morning and send them to you.

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AP Macro (PAH) was a HUGE hit! (So much so, he wants to major in Economics now)
My DS took the 1/2 year AP Micro (PAH) with Burns and like Julie of KY, it was more ho-hum.
And he watched the ACDC videos ahead of both AP exams and scored 5's on both. He LOVED those.

 

Edited by mirabillis
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1 hour ago, mirabillis said:

AP Macro (PAH) was a HUGE hit! (So much so, he wants to major in Economics now)
My DS took the 1/2 year AP Micro (PAH) with Burns and like Julie of KY, it was more ho-hum.
And he watched the ACDC videos ahead of both AP exams and scored 5's on both. He LOVED those.

 

How much work on average per week? I told myself we wouldn't do another AP until 11th grade, but if a course is engaging, I could be persuaded.

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Okay, I'm back. For our family, dh and I had a discussion and we just don't feel awesome about an instructor whose only experience and education seems to be from strongly conservative Christian institutions who specifically says he uses the course to tout his viewpoints. So... not PA Homeschoolers.

But I can't seem to find ANY other secular options for an AP Microeconomics class WITH AN ACTUAL TEACHER. The with a teacher part is key for this kid. He looked crestfallen when I talked about using video resources and things like Thinkwell. FLVS does have one, but aren't FLVS classes just basically glorified video learning with automatic grading? I don't consider someone checking your grades to be  "with a teacher." Seriously, does anyone have a lead on a secular class for this subject?

Honestly, I'd be open to a college class instead... but our local university/community college where he is eligible to take classes does not even have an economics department. All the community colleges in adjacent areas require that students be 16.

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DS took Macro & the 1/2 year version of Micro from Mr Burns last year.

Both he thought were good courses, though he enjoyed Macro more (enough that he's thinking about a college major in Econ). He was a bit mystified about what the full year micro course covers because he didn't think the 1/2 year version had an especially fast pace.  He got 5's in both and felt well prepared, FWIW.

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For anyone curious, it turns out Online G3 has a half year non-AP microecon class. All the other options we found (like CTY) weren't live.

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I'm just popping back in on these forums (because I have a rising senior and a rising freshman and having two high schoolers this year means I need to read lots of advice!), so I don't know the age of your child.

My oldest was interested in Economics and we had the same issue of REALLY wanting a secular, live class (he HATES asynchronous stuff and wants a teacher). The only thing I was able to find was dual enrollment at the local community college. DE in our area (nova) is usually junior and senior year. We sorta slipped in by making a transcript showing two years of completed high school course work (which was completely legitimate because he'd been working at a high school level in 8th grade) and taking the CC's specific placement testing prior to seeing a counselor (I think it was called the VPT). Even though we weren't the right age, they kinda assumed that he had skipped a grade (we didn't have to say one way or the other), and because he did the placement testing prior to the meeting and scored well, we ended up not needing to jump through any special hoops to do DE a year early. We were totally desperate to find a live, secular Chemistry class, which prompted the early DE process in the first place. He had a wonderful professor for Econ (he did macro first) and enjoyed the experience. This year we'll be doing DE for micro.

I have other homeschool friends who did something special to get permission for kids to start DE from 9th grade (I don't think there would be any "slipping by" more than a year early), so maybe that is an option also? Good luck in finding a live econ class to meet the current interest!

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Ds and I chatted a good deal about how to tackle this. Right now, the plan is for him to combine a number of experiences into a single credit and then take the AP exam as well. In the fall, he'll take a local class with a great teacher who does "fun" courses for high schoolers out of her home. My other son took her current events class where they read articles and play a simulation game of world events. This one deals with the stock market and current events around business, so I'm thinking it'll be light but enjoyable. He'll also read at least one popular nonfiction book about economics of his choosing, play some online simulation games for school use, and watch the exam prep videos. Then, in the spring, he'll take the G3 class and finish prepping for the exam at home. Hopefully this will all work out. I think it'll be a good year for him and he's happy with it. We talked about him taking the course at our local community college, but it's a 200-level course and they don't really have an econ department. It just didn't seem ideal for an average academic student for his first DE class.

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On 5/8/2019 at 8:53 PM, AEC said:

DS took Macro & the 1/2 year version of Micro from Mr Burns last year.

Both he thought were good courses, though he enjoyed Macro more (enough that he's thinking about a college major in Econ). He was a bit mystified about what the full year micro course covers because he didn't think the 1/2 year version had an especially fast pace.  He got 5's in both and felt well prepared, FWIW.

Did he take both in the spring, or did he do one in the spring and one if the fall? Curious about the timing of the classes and the tests.

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Yes, I saw the FLVS course. My understanding is that the FLVS courses are not live taught, but are recorded computer based lessons that are overseen by a teacher. That's how the CTY course works (they use Thinkwell) and several others I spotted. Definitely not the model we want.

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6 hours ago, DocMom said:

Did he take both in the spring, or did he do one in the spring and one if the fall? Curious about the timing of the classes and the tests.

Macro is with dr Richman in the fall and they coordinate it so micro w Mr Burns starts right after it completes, in the spring.  Both ap tests in May , ofc.

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21 hours ago, Farrar said:

Yes, I saw the FLVS course. My understanding is that the FLVS courses are not live taught, but are recorded computer based lessons that are overseen by a teacher. That's how the CTY course works (they use Thinkwell) and several others I spotted. Definitely not the model we want.

 

Just so difficult to find synchronous classes. We found 1 options for AP calculus next year that has live classes, but nothing for any of the other AP classes we are interested in.

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Sometimes asynchronous is fine. But when it’s a teacher overseeing grading done mostly through computer quizzes, I know that’s a wash for this kid.

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On 5/13/2019 at 10:38 PM, DocMom said:

 

Just so difficult to find synchronous classes. We found 1 options for AP calculus next year that has live classes, but nothing for any of the other AP classes we are interested in.

Had to jump in regarding AP Calc.  Mrs Regina London, Highschoolmathlive.com, was exceptional.  She ranks up there with Ms Jetta!   Live classes.  Meet 2 to 3 times a week.   Truly outstanding.  Now if only I can find an AP Bio teacher like Ms Regina and Ms Jetta! 

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We're on the fence with FLVS for AP.  We live in Florida so classes are free.  But so far we've not been impressed with the quality.   There is rarely a "lecture."  It's mainly slide presentations, animated videos and readings for each assignment.   The material is basic, generic, with very little substance.   A good teacher helps but can't make up for the lack of depth.  Even with responsive teachers, feedback and recommendations have been minimal.  DD has had to research topics on her own in order to complete assignments and gain a better grasp on the material.  With that said, these classes are easy As.  

DD has taken chem and bio (honors), anatomy and physiology (honors), english 2, HOPE and drivers education.  

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On 5/8/2019 at 11:29 PM, Farrar said:

For anyone curious, it turns out Online G3 has a half year non-AP microecon class. All the other options we found (like CTY) weren't live.

Farrar, if the Online G3 class says Advanced, I think it's taught with the AP materials.  I would definitely check with them on this, but the computer science principles class my son just took used the AP syllabus and he was able to take the exam after doing a little prep on his own.  

 Pros -- live secular teacher who is very engaging, very discussion based, and organized platform for accessing materials and assignments

Cons -- no grading.  Literally no feedback.  I am fine with that because I am always there when my kids are working on their assignments and they are in middle school right now, so I'm not too concerned yet about grades.  I wouldn't put them in Advanced US History though, for instance, without any type of feedback.  I did sign them up for British Lit with grading option on the papers, but have since decided against it (and am leaning towards a program I heard about called GPS:)) 

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